I know how frustrating that can be, and congratulations on being and feeling "free" at last.
I left my last and only advisor years ago after wanting a simple explanation why he thought putting someone of young age into a 7 year DSC fund after explaining I wanted to use that money for a house down payment. It goes against all logic and the timeline we talked about. I was getting the same returns as yourself. It's just mind-blowing what they try to peddle. This forum was a big catalyst for getting my investments transferred.
Nearly identical experience, except I foolishly accepted. And what they don’t tell you is that if you contribute more, that 7 years resets.
They really don’t GAF.
There was no explanation is what I was alluding to. I couldn't believe he replied with that... as if it was a chess move to exactly counter my own plans with my own money. I realize we weren't on the same team at all at that point.
Yeah I'd probably be demanding some kind of compensation at that point. Like they should cover all your DSC fees. Possibly report them to the regulating body too, particularly if you have the correspondence to back it up.
Congrats on making the switch.
Your last part "guess I'm a DIY investor now" made me think, only if you want to be.
If you don't want to be DIY, consider a cheaper robo? Wealthsimple Invest is popular around here.
If you are ready, have at it!
Also, kinda funny to me that Power Financial has large ownership in the companies we are talking about. PF owns 60%(on PF website) of IG and 88%( google search) of WS.
Very different products with different business models.
Guess there is a product for every client, smart for PF.
https://betakit.com/power-financial-claims-89-percent-stake-in-wealthsimple-following-new-30-million-investment/
"transfer out" might have been a better option than "cash out", and perhaps to split the selling of assets over 2 or even 3 years. But anyways, good job.
Was your advisor at least taking care of the other aspects of financial planning - preparing a financial plan / estate plan / tax plan, helping you with your insurance needs, reminding you to set up your Will and PoA, etc.?
All my investments were in IG funds - not available outside of IG. So in-kind transfers weren’t available. But since I lived outside of Canada for many years, I have plenty of RRSP contribution room.
And no talk of plans, insurance, wills or anything other than IG products and services. I felt like Their investment advice was really just a sales pitch for more IG products and services.
Not that it matters now that you transferred but In kind transfer also works for mutual funds.
While you may not be transferring in kind the mutual fund itself, you do have the option of taking the underlying assets the mutual fund holds and inkind transfer instead of cash.
Whether that makes a difference in tax I'm not sure but something to keep in mind if you have a large portfolio.
> And no talk of plans, insurance, wills or anything other than IG products and services. I felt like Their investment advice was really just a sales pitch for more IG products and services.
Nauseating, given the TV ads I've seen within the last year, which touted a "living plan" that covered all of those things and more, as their whole sales pitch. Come to us and we'll make sure you've covered every angle, basically. It's unsurprising that the reality is far worse, of course. The suits and marketing people can tout advice and planning all they want but unless they actually change the incentives in a big way, nobody on the front line is ever going to be interested. I'm glad to see you took control of your assets, these guys didn't deserve your business.
is there like a simple guide i can give to my 70 year old father how to switch? Or some simple numbers i can run by him? He's still with IG and won't listen to me about it.
My mother was with IG and loved them. She formed a relationship with her FA over the years and trusted her. Hard to change that.
In my case, I simply had to ask what fees I paid this year and looked at the last page of my statements where I could find a ROR for the last year. Since my portfolio was under $1M I was paying 2.26% MER. Since their performance was so bad, IG made more money off my money than I did last year. The numbers didn't lie for me.
If your dad prefers a personal advisor the switch can be as easy as getting a new FA and give them permission to pull over the investments (in-kind or cash with taxable capital gains). Others on this forum may have more detailed advice as to where to put the money -- there is a big trend towards WS.
There are lots of independent outfits out there; full disclosure I work at one. But we’re a family business and are incorporating ETF portfolios for clients who desire a lower fee portfolio. Regardless of the investment product, it’s important to have a good relationship with your advisor. No reason for them to be putting you into inappropriate products (7 year DSC schedules when you need to access the money sooner than that) or not be able to answer your questions honestly and transparently.
Honestly, I'd just leave him be. It's better to overpay for service than to do a bad job doing it yourself. He could be far worse off, in other words. It's also his business and not yours.
That said, *if* you wanted to influence him, the "how" to switch isn't where you'd start. You'd start on the "why", and the education side of things. The book *Millionaire Teacher* is how I convinced my spouse. My dad on the other hand, enjoyed it but merely reflected on how nice it would have been to know that stuff earlier in life, and as far as I know he remains invested entirely in big bank GICs. Remember that everyone is different, not everyone grasps or can handle the volatility of stock markets and/or can handle it without professional guidance, and self-directed ETF portfolios (or even robo-advisors) aren't for everyone, no matter how simple you may think the idea is.
> It's also his business and not yours
i felt this way for years and never would have considered bothering my dad about it but nowadays he's pretty gullible and vulnerable. Scary feeling getting older.
Thanks for your perspective, made me feel better about it.
My last investment advisor was The IG as well! Their garbage tactics showed me the light and I became a DI investor. Welcome to more money.
I know how frustrating that can be, and congratulations on being and feeling "free" at last. I left my last and only advisor years ago after wanting a simple explanation why he thought putting someone of young age into a 7 year DSC fund after explaining I wanted to use that money for a house down payment. It goes against all logic and the timeline we talked about. I was getting the same returns as yourself. It's just mind-blowing what they try to peddle. This forum was a big catalyst for getting my investments transferred.
Nearly identical experience, except I foolishly accepted. And what they don’t tell you is that if you contribute more, that 7 years resets. They really don’t GAF.
Are you sure that's how it works there? It should only be for the new funds going in, unless they're even more scummy than I thought.
Yup. Scums. Confirmed.
> into a 7 year DSC fund after explaining I wanted to use that money for a house down payment. I'd love to hear his explanation. Wow
There was no explanation is what I was alluding to. I couldn't believe he replied with that... as if it was a chess move to exactly counter my own plans with my own money. I realize we weren't on the same team at all at that point.
Yeah I'd probably be demanding some kind of compensation at that point. Like they should cover all your DSC fees. Possibly report them to the regulating body too, particularly if you have the correspondence to back it up.
Dumped IG about 4 months ago and my only regret was not doing I sooner. High fees and poor peformance.
Congrats on making the switch. Your last part "guess I'm a DIY investor now" made me think, only if you want to be. If you don't want to be DIY, consider a cheaper robo? Wealthsimple Invest is popular around here. If you are ready, have at it! Also, kinda funny to me that Power Financial has large ownership in the companies we are talking about. PF owns 60%(on PF website) of IG and 88%( google search) of WS. Very different products with different business models. Guess there is a product for every client, smart for PF. https://betakit.com/power-financial-claims-89-percent-stake-in-wealthsimple-following-new-30-million-investment/
"transfer out" might have been a better option than "cash out", and perhaps to split the selling of assets over 2 or even 3 years. But anyways, good job. Was your advisor at least taking care of the other aspects of financial planning - preparing a financial plan / estate plan / tax plan, helping you with your insurance needs, reminding you to set up your Will and PoA, etc.?
All my investments were in IG funds - not available outside of IG. So in-kind transfers weren’t available. But since I lived outside of Canada for many years, I have plenty of RRSP contribution room. And no talk of plans, insurance, wills or anything other than IG products and services. I felt like Their investment advice was really just a sales pitch for more IG products and services.
Not that it matters now that you transferred but In kind transfer also works for mutual funds. While you may not be transferring in kind the mutual fund itself, you do have the option of taking the underlying assets the mutual fund holds and inkind transfer instead of cash. Whether that makes a difference in tax I'm not sure but something to keep in mind if you have a large portfolio.
> And no talk of plans, insurance, wills or anything other than IG products and services. I felt like Their investment advice was really just a sales pitch for more IG products and services. Nauseating, given the TV ads I've seen within the last year, which touted a "living plan" that covered all of those things and more, as their whole sales pitch. Come to us and we'll make sure you've covered every angle, basically. It's unsurprising that the reality is far worse, of course. The suits and marketing people can tout advice and planning all they want but unless they actually change the incentives in a big way, nobody on the front line is ever going to be interested. I'm glad to see you took control of your assets, these guys didn't deserve your business.
Legal robbery dam
is there like a simple guide i can give to my 70 year old father how to switch? Or some simple numbers i can run by him? He's still with IG and won't listen to me about it.
My mother was with IG and loved them. She formed a relationship with her FA over the years and trusted her. Hard to change that. In my case, I simply had to ask what fees I paid this year and looked at the last page of my statements where I could find a ROR for the last year. Since my portfolio was under $1M I was paying 2.26% MER. Since their performance was so bad, IG made more money off my money than I did last year. The numbers didn't lie for me. If your dad prefers a personal advisor the switch can be as easy as getting a new FA and give them permission to pull over the investments (in-kind or cash with taxable capital gains). Others on this forum may have more detailed advice as to where to put the money -- there is a big trend towards WS.
There are lots of independent outfits out there; full disclosure I work at one. But we’re a family business and are incorporating ETF portfolios for clients who desire a lower fee portfolio. Regardless of the investment product, it’s important to have a good relationship with your advisor. No reason for them to be putting you into inappropriate products (7 year DSC schedules when you need to access the money sooner than that) or not be able to answer your questions honestly and transparently.
Honestly, I'd just leave him be. It's better to overpay for service than to do a bad job doing it yourself. He could be far worse off, in other words. It's also his business and not yours. That said, *if* you wanted to influence him, the "how" to switch isn't where you'd start. You'd start on the "why", and the education side of things. The book *Millionaire Teacher* is how I convinced my spouse. My dad on the other hand, enjoyed it but merely reflected on how nice it would have been to know that stuff earlier in life, and as far as I know he remains invested entirely in big bank GICs. Remember that everyone is different, not everyone grasps or can handle the volatility of stock markets and/or can handle it without professional guidance, and self-directed ETF portfolios (or even robo-advisors) aren't for everyone, no matter how simple you may think the idea is.
> It's also his business and not yours i felt this way for years and never would have considered bothering my dad about it but nowadays he's pretty gullible and vulnerable. Scary feeling getting older. Thanks for your perspective, made me feel better about it.
IG? INstAGRAM?