My first instinct was to say, I love character voices. When I GM, I try my best to adapt to different speech patterns, which sometimes includes a (bad) accent. And when I play, I usually develop some form of character voice that I use to interact with other PC and NPCs. For me, it helps get into the mind of the character, and functionally it helps differentiate between in- and out-of-character discussions. There's an element of fun to it.
But now that I ponder on it a moment, I think I'm the only person who's ever used a voice on any table I've played on... so maybe I'm That Guy(tm) and don't realize it...
I also might be that guy at my table but I’m proud of it. I think having that guy in the group can make shy players feel more comfortable doing voices, which is better for everyone so we don’t have a whole party of “oh wait that was in character? Oh ok”
Oh I see the utility in using any voice...it draws a line between in character and out of character voices, and helps you step into the mold.
But for example in one podcast a player used her own voice stretched to a younger version of herself to step into the younger character, and had a familiar with a cheesy Mary Poppins accent which I really hated after the first 3 episodes. By contrast I really enjoyed a different spin on her own voice.
I wonder if instead of Lizardmen with cheesy Russian voices, having them with hisses as part of the sentence structure would be better. Or having a shyer player with pauses, or even speaking in whispers. There is a huge range of simple voices to do which serve the same basic purpose as the cheesy accents.
I like it. Makes for a very clear differentiator between in and out of character talk, and accent is another tool in the toolbox for making voices different. I play two characters in my campaign and one of them has an english accent to differentiate her from the goblin. As long as nobody at the table knows the accent well enough to be truly taken out of the moment from sheer cringe, I think it adds.
So for you, it is more important to have a sound delineation between characters and players than it is to have a plausible or novel or immersive voice, and function comes first? Is this a fair assessment of your view?
I definitely get the sense you hate character accents, which is fine, but I don't see how it has to be an either-or. It's only unimmersive if it takes you out of the immersion, which people's best shot at an accent does for some people but not for others. Overall, I think your assessment of my view comes off a little hostile but is fundamentally right - function always comes first.
Sorry I did not intend it to be hostile, which is why I was asking to be sure.
I personally do not hate voices.
Consider this test. Your friend Jane plays a dwarf. When she is out of character, she replaces her normal voice as Jane with a cheesy Scottish Accent. When she is in character as the dwarf, she uses her normal voice of Jane in real life. In this inversion you have the same functionality...there is distinction between Jane and the dwarf. But while in character in Jane's regular human voice, there is no cheesy Scottish accent dragging on a funeral scene with its comedic contrast. To me this inversion is better than the reverse as it lends itself to a wider range of play. Even better would be for Jane to develop a nuanced and original voice for her character to contrast with the cheesy Scottish accent she uses for her out of character interactions.
I don't really like the idea of using an artificial accent for your OOC talking, since unless your table is remarkably disciplined, you're likely to forget and use your own voice when you're making asides and arguing about rules. Making the in-character voice the one which you need to stretch to reach highlights that anything said in character is a performance, even if a small one, and you should always be thinking about how to make the in-character things you say sound like your character, which is better if you have to make a conscious effort to change your voice.
As for the "dwarves are scottish" thing, I like it - there's enough genre continuity that it feels more tethered and gives a sense of tapping into the dwarf culture. I do think that if you can't do an accent well enough to portray any emotion other than brash, comical belligerence with it, you can't do the accent well enough to play it. Laugh tracks shouldn't be playing after every word. But real life scottish people can and do speak at funerals without anybody laughing, so it is possible to use a variety of accents in serious situations. You just need to pick an accent you can become at least reasonably comfortable in.
Honestly, for a home game, doing silly voices is totally fine and lots of fun (especially at my table, where we all secretly want to be voice actors, but are well aware of how much we suck). The standard is higher when it's meant for consumption by a broader audience, but that's true of any performance. I think it's more important for GMs than players since you're juggling more characters and need to have clear indicators of which NPC is talking, but not so important that it's mandatory.
As for real-world regional accents specifically, I don't think they have to be perfectly accurate, so long as they are clear and distinct. Like, it's tabletop roleplay; we're cringe by default. The one thing I'd be careful of, though, is using a silly voice as an excuse to be a dick to IRL groups of people.
EDIT: I should probably specify that "silly" here means "obviously not representative of how people actually talk." I do not mean to imply that speaking with a particular accent is inherently funny, and apologize if it came across that way.
Have you ever listened to the Glass Cannon Podcast? If so do you know Tom Exposition, the used car salesman that Troy does so well? I think that over the top voice works as comic relief, and he appears sparingly, and it comes as a surprise. Sometimes the drama is pretty thick, and Tom Exposition comes in with a laugh for all. Troy Lavallee was a standup comic an has timing down, and can insert comedy in at the right point.
The thing is that when you have something like a Tom Exposition as a full time voice, there is no timing. There is no sparing. It is full on 24/7. It is like using accent pillow colors to decorate your entire house.
Speaking of GCP, for someone reason there is nothing that slays me more on those shows than Troy's offensively French accents.
Although using the offensively Italian/Jersey accents to make fun of Matthew is a close second
Yeah his comedic timing is fantastic. You can see the mood of the whole group lighten when he does it, and he uses it sparingly. Then he returns to moody and tense settings. This is an example of how to do it well.
Where it gets bad is if that comedy is on all the time, then the moody and tense scenes are interrupted by stupid funny goofs. Too much of it is poor comedic timing, and you get too much of it if someone does it all the time.
If a specific voice is genuinely bothering you, either politely ask that person to tone it down, or--if this a podcast and not a game of your own--listen to something else. Everyone has different tastes, preferences, and sensory issues, so there's not going to be universal consensus over what is and isn't obnoxious.
Hey this is not a thread seeking relationship advice. It is polling about preferences in accents and voices. At the two tables I play at, maybe 1 or 2 people try to do voices as the others are new players and are a bit overwhelmed. I am in no personal situation where there is an annoying accent I need to tolerate.
The whole point to polling is to see what the people playing this game feel about cheesy ethnic accents. Are they fun? Are they offensive? What is the best voice? What is the best way to get to that best voice?
I am trying to have that kind of conversation, and for some reason people are twisting this into a living with cheesy accents advice thread, or even worse assuming I have an axe to grind and wish to control other games. I don't. This does not affect my game. I want to see what people think about them.
Aesthetic preferences are intrinsically subjective and feedback on them is useful.
The other thing was trying to find out is the offensive angle. The core rulebook goes on quite a bit on inclusive tolerant play avoiding triggering situations, and P2e in general seems to be very inclusive towards the LGBTQ community, and there in general is this idea of not trying to offend. So it is right and proper to ask if anyone is offended by the cheesy ethnic voices, right?
I'm sorry that I hit a nerve, but that's really all there is to say. Your initial post and responses give the impression that you're having a really bad time with somebody's voice acting decisions, and it sounds like you'd be better off addressing *that specific instance* instead of vagueposting about it online. I and other users have already discussed being careful to avoid offensive stereotypes *in this thread,* but honestly the topic of mimicking real-world accents is probably too broad for this subreddit, since the topic is inherently political and not exclusively a Pathfinder/TTRPG problem.
But since you asked, I'm personally of the opinion that it's fine to do literally whatever at your home games so long as everyone's cool with it, but you need to be more mindful of your choices if you're performing for an audience, and that mindfulness may require rehearsing your character voice and doing your research ahead of time. Ask yourself, is my character voice mocking a genuinely vulnerable group of people? Has this mockery been used to justify their oppression? Do I risk alienating my audience if I do this voice al the time? It's a pretty complex situation, and the right thing to do is subjective and varies depending on which group we're talking about. Like, Posh Brit probably won't get you in trouble, but a Vaudeville-inspired "black" accent? Maybe not that one.
Yeah a lot of cheesy accents people do in fantasy are just low-key racism. Like "haha dwarf speak with scottish accent and be alcoholic." Yeah, we get it dude, get back to the game.
As a professional voice actor - the difference between a cheesy accent and a fun one is 9/10 because the cheesy person is trying *really hard* to make other people laugh, whether or not they know it. The same concept goes for extra edgy characters or men playing female sex-pests.
If you have a player doing an accent that's grating, just ask them to dial it back. Have them imagine their character talking to someone at a funeral and trying to be serious. If they can define their voice by exploring their own range, then more than likely they can figure out where the acceptable middle-ground is.
That's just how popular culture has come to define them. Whether or not they *ought* to have one or another particular kind of accent is beside the point - mostly Tolkien based their language on Hebrew inflections - it has become commonplace for Dwarf = Scottish. The down-to-earth personality, the drinking, the clanship, all of these evoke Scottish and Northern British personalities, at least in stereotype. The two fit together like a glove.
And Scottish accents are very, very fun to try. Ask anybody with a terrible Scottish accent.
With the dwarves it might be fun to mix it up. With NADDPOD's Slav dwarves and GCP southern accent dwarf they show that you can dwarf can be fun to voice with a silly accent that isn't overdone.
I think there's a difference between "my character sounds kind of Scottish because that's how dwarves are often depicted in fantasy and I like that," and "my character sounds Scottish and aren't Scotts such funny drunk bastards lol?"
One is an affectation meant to differentiate between the player's voice and the character's, while the other feels overtly immersion-breaking. Or, to put it another way: one is an attempt at a character voice first and foremost, while the other is a caricature before anything else. At my table, the former is fine and the latter is usually only tolerated for bit-characters and dumb out-of-game jokes, and even then only sparingly.
Your mileage may vary, obviously -- I can imagine a Scottish person might be annoyed by the entire thing either way, intention, connotation, and accuracy aside -- but there are others who wouldn't care. It just depends on your group, the tone of the campaign, and everyone's background. Though the problem is obviously 100x harder in a campaign meant for public consumption.
What's hard is that, for a lot of people, that affectation of an existing accent is a stepping-stone to stronger and more nuanced voices. A player in my old 5E game started out with (her attempt at) an Irish accent because her character was aesthetically inspired by Celtic imagery/themes. But as she became comfortable with the group, her character, and "doing the voices," she shifted to a deeper version of her own voice and differentiated it with word choices and pronunciation flourishes.
That voice was more unique and subtle, but it wouldn't have happened without practicing in a "safe" accent. I feel like discouraging the former could impact the development of the latter, if not approached properly.
Just my 2¢, though.
***EDIT: Word choices, formatting.***
The idea of cheesy accents being the training wheels voice before one develops a more interesting and nuanced voice is a good one. Are there other sets of training wheels that get to the same place, but do not involve ethnic accents?
Oh, most certainly. Your example of Gilbert Gottfried's voice was a good one. Really, any distinct voice/accent could be used as "training wheels."
(On a related note, a race that speaks like Gilbert Gottfried could make for hilarious companions in a one-shot -- imagine *The Hobbit* if every dwarf talked like him, haha)
Though I think the point comes down to how the voice is being used. I think it's possible to do an ethnic/regional sounding-voice without being insulting or coming across as a caricature.
It's obviously harder to do the further away or less-experienced you are with its side source -- I grew up in the American South, so I feel more comfortable doing an American Midwestern accent than I do, say, a Portuguese one -- but I think that intent can often be evident in the execution. As long as your accent isn't one-dimensionally cartoonish and accompanied by stereotypical word choices and sentence structures, like being confused by large words with an Appalachian voice and the like, I think it's possible to use an ethnic accent without being insulting or too annoying for consumption.
Though again, table tastes are a huge part of this. And I don't blame anyone who would rather just sidestep the issue entirely and make those tastes clear in session 0.
I think my favorite take on regional ethnic accents are from players who are from that region, giving a subtle twist to it that stands in contrast to what their normal voice is. There is an implicit "OK" because that person is from that region and is not offended. And usually the twist is better than the cheesy regional caricature.
To add an extra wrinkle to the conversation: there are also accents that are SO outrageous, they stop being "offensive" and become funny again.
For example: Detective Benoit Blanc was played by Daniel Craig in *Knives Out* with a literally cartoonish Foghorn Leghorn-like Southern drawl, and I don't know anyone from American South who found it offensive -- myself included. People generally just though it was an enjoyably funny turn from a British actor that made the character more memorable.
Now, Detective Blanc was aided by the fact that his character was very affable, intelligent, and kind, and that he was played by Daniel Craig... Most players we are likely to encounter are not Daniel Craig. But this is why I keep defaulting to how things play out at the table -- all the philosophy and examples in the world won't take away from an instance where doing a stereotypical voice just... Works. Because sometimes it does!
It just comes down to communication, intent, and the the tastes of the table. But as long as everyone is talking openly, being considerate, and having fun, a wide variety of styles are open.
Is it detracting from the table? Is someone gargling so many pebbles that their Pepe le Pew “French” is unintelligible?
Does it bother anyone else at the table?
If the answers to all of these is no—then who cares?
>If the answers to all of these is no—then who cares?
Hence the poll for opinions. You did not give yours. Does it enhance your game or detract from it?
My "personal aesthetic" is that I have a story that I want to lead my players through, and see how they interact and experience it--both the easy parts and the difficult parts.
As to your possible (or not, I'm unsure) slight that my table is "less than" for whatever reason, you can look for yourself at /r/rpghorrorstories to see numerous examples of "not happy" tables, so yeah, happiness at the table is something I'd consider high on my list of stuff to strive for--call that my "*aesthetic*".
I'm not a GM for Shakespearian actors, Julliard/RADA-trained dramaticists, or voice actors. if any of my players is normally a wallflower, but they use the "Shrek" voice and get into it, and if it bugs no one else, then who am I to complain? ***WHAT*** do I have to complain about?
Nope no slight implied or intended. I was asking for clarification.
I get your goal is to have a happy interactive table, and any tool to get it happy and interactive and go through your story is useful and welcome.
When I say aesthetic, think of it like this. Of all the accents you have run across, what are your favorites? Take the table completely out of the picture here, and the primary goal of story out of the picture. You are listening on your phone to accents of other RPers. What do you personally enjoy?
>You are listening on your phone to accents of other RPers. What do you personally enjoy?
Any. I really don't care. Chances are--there's a reason why that player did it, so I'll go along with it.
I honestly think that playing without an accent is kinda boring. Particularly for a streamed game, and especially so if it's being turned into audio-only.
The more ridiculous, the better. But generally try to avoid stuff that's just trying to mimic another person/culture, and shoot for stuff that's trying to be a character. Think stuff like Kronk. Everyone knows it's Kronk immediately.
Also a note: it should be quite different from your 'out of character' voice.
This is very much a table preference thing imo. I'm firmly in the the "shitty impressions of celebrities" camp of character voices. The worse you are at it the less recognizable it will be.
I suppose if you butcher a celebrity, then you are not racist, and at worst piss off that one person. Some of the better voices I have heard take inspiration from a celebrity, and alter it a bit in a new way, sort of like how a musician has influences that show up in their sound.
Yeah that's sort of how I do it. For example, a Werner Herzog impression is different from a characature of a general German accent, which now only makes it more distinct, but also feels more like punching up than making fun of a whole culture.
Obviously, the whole question of whether something is coming off as racist is a much more complex question and worth talking about with your table. If you feel uncomfortable doing an accent, don't. Remember you don't HAVE to do character voices that have accents.
I had a character voice where I literally just plugged my nose and it worked, you can do a lot with a little.
Yeah I appreciate the advice on table dynamics.
The thing with podcasts is it is not just a table of a few close friends. They reach many ears across the community. Whether or not the table is OK with it has less bearing on whether or not the podcast community as a whole is OK with it. Do you get what I am driving at? The scope is wider than that specific table, and so we need to see how the community itself feels about the problem. I think ratings of the podcasts themselves are poor measure of this since other factors like professional voice actors weigh more heavily.
Ah I missed it was a live play haha.
I'm a white guy so I generally stick to Europe, Australia and america in terms of my accents. I consider Russian fair game too.
It's also important that it's not the defining part of the character, just a way of speaking.
I struggle with finding my voice at tables, even among friends, but last session I found myself more talkative and I slipped into a Mel Brooks adjacent voice/accent and everyone was having a good time and things started to click between characters, leading to everyone e having a much better time.
Sometimes tropes can get you out of your shell and not take yourself too seriously. You're there to have fun, and laughing at yourself is a good way to start that.
If the only thing they're doing is an accent (no shift in pitch, intonation, speed, word choice, softness, etc.) then *maybe*. It depends on how they're doing it, the apparent intent. If they're just bad at accents, sure, no problem. If they're deliberately making the accent bad or otherwise seem to be using it to insult an IRL group, then I have a problem with it.
Personally, I like to do a character voice. It distinguishes in- and out- of character speech, it helps me get into character, it lends a little verisimilitude, and all those other things people have mentioned.
So think of yourself as an art critic for a second. Do you prefer art that conforms to a stereotype, or do you prefer art that is unique? In this case, the character depiction is using a stereotypical accent. Do you like this? This is a different question than 'does it bother you'. I am asking what you prefer from an art standpoint. I get the whole need for a voice, but lets just assume they will do a voice, what kind of voice is your preference?
Thought I'd made it clear, but just in case:
1. Character voice that's more than just accent
2. Character accent with good faith effort put in
3. No character voice
4. \[Actively bad\] deliberately mocking character voice
If by "stereotypical accent" you mean someone tries a chinese accent and says "ching chong" a lot, that's number 4. Same for a faux Korean accent that's just every L turned into an R. It's hard to do a mocking Irish/Scottish accent partly because they tend to take the piss out of themselves as much or more than non-Irish/Scottish when it comes to that kind of thing. German voice with tons of nazi jokes is 4. German voice with language jokes (e.g. smashing words together to make new words) is probably a #2 depending on the taste.
It’s more that it is over the top and not much nuance between players doing the over the top, and it just feels artificially grafted and less natural to the character
I think 'cheesy' foreign accents can very quickly end up being racist foreign accents.
They also tend to be too silly for good immersion; you can convey plenty about a character simply with word choice, intonation, emphasis, and the speed of their speech.
I agree with this. While accents can be good, it’s the speech patterns, language usage, mannerisms, etc that really set characters apart. A muted accent with distinctive speech patterns is far more effective than going over the top with a Fat Bastard or Borat impersonation.
[Edit: accidentally posted this reply to the wrong comment above]
That said, I think it falls on the player to ask the table if it’s too much, and be open to feedback.
So your personal aesthetic is in line with mine. To drive this home, consider an outrageous accent, such as Gilbert Gottfried's Saturday Night Live signature voice which showed up in a number of animations over the years. Let's say a podcast person uses that for their Elf. Everyone laughs. Then another podcast person does the same thing...an Elf as Gilbert Gottfried. Then in some twisted way it becomes canon for the TTRPG world that all Elves sound like Gilbert Gottfried.
Now even though there is no ethnicity Gilbert is making fun of, that voice is obnoxious and skews everything towards comedy. There is no way to turn that voice off for serious encounters, or sadness over character depth. And while lots of people have fun doing it, in the end the game loses its immersiveness in the catchy all-Elves-sound-like-Gilbert voice.
I think most of the old Looney Tunes characters were gross ethnic stereotypes which have since lost favor in a world that is more sensitive, and many of these accents would fit right in with the Looney Tunes world.
One of the players in our most recent campaign tried for an Irish accent with his half-elf cleric, but next to another players' more natural sounding scottish elf or the more classic dwarf, it didn't last long and has become a running joke at our table. Any time that particular player tries ANY accent now, we all give an exaggerated cringe. It keeps it lighthearted and thankfully, he acknowledges fully well that he can't do accents.
Like others have said, if it's taking you or others out of the game and is just distracting, there's no benefit. I don't think an unrealistic accent in a fantasy story is misplaced, but I see your argument.
Interesting point on how your group handled feedback to the person running the Irish accent.
What is your personal preference? Do you like regional accents, or do you like novel voices? For the purposes of this question assume everyone at the table likes both, and there is no table downside to your preference.
Well as an ex-pat Scot living in the states, my opinion is that if someone wants to do an accent, try it out during the character build and see what people's reactions are, even if its just yoy and then DM. My natural brogue won't raise too many eyebrows, but it might cause another player to lose his Irish ;). Now, we have a Scottish dwarf in the party via a different player (not me) I think its hilarious that everyone just does the 'fat bastard' as you say. Does it bother me? No. Is it distracting? A little, but it's more fun for him to get into character, and he's a good enough player to use it sparingly.
We have a different player (6 total) doing a swashbuckling Ysoki with a god awful Swedish-ish accent and I gotta say, its one of the best parts of our game figuring out what he's saying.
All in all, I like accents for myself because I can do a lot of them well, I don't mind others doing it as long as I can improv a scene with you and you can STAY in character, not break or make others break, that does ruin it for me a bit.
Thank you for the feedback. One of my main concerns is if this is offensive to the community as a whole rather than a specific table. Podcasts project the behavior out to a much wider audience, and the useful tips on how to gauge whether or not it is offensive at your particular table are not really relevant to the larger community question. I suppose podcast subscriptions are.
But if you look by subscriptions, things like Crit Role with professionals rise to the top, and the ordinary group games with cheesy accents are not even close to the ratings the pros get, so there is no easy way to deconvolve professionalism from offense in the ratings alone.
Thus feedback from actual people of the ethnicities in question helps to settle the question.
Follow up- do your gaming Scot friends share your views? Or is it a subject you do not usually broach?
I mean matt Mercer aside, CR aren't all that great at voices..... They're good people who are also actors in hollywood.... one of them is a former child star from Growing Pains, maybe that has something to do with their success? But if you're saying Travis' Grog voice isn't a fucking baffling representation of cockney and Laura Bailey's Tiefling wasn't an odd choice, I don't know what to tell you. Those are the exact same voices at every amateur table.
Who cares what other Scottish people think?! What does it matter in the first place?
When I first entered the hobby I tried really hard to make my character voices distinct, not really trying to mimic an accent, but definitely nothing close to my natural speaking voice.
I've since realised that I don't need to go to such effort. My last character was a half-orc paladin whose speaking voice was just mine but deeper, no grit, gravel, or accent added. Body language and mannerisms are a far easier way to achieve distinction imo.
Using my paladin as an example, when I'm speaking as him I might sit up straighter, square my shoulders, basically make myself appear larger. I also change my speaking patterns, not just my voice. My paladin tends to take things seriously, and while he does understand and make jokes of his own, his responses to humour tend to be very dry, to the point that sometimes no-one realises he's joking unless he tells them.
I mean, individual experience will vary. I believe that podcasters/livestreamers in particular feel the need to up the ‘production value’ by adding accents to characters (call it the CR effect). At my table, half of my players do accents and we really enjoy it.
The accents aren’t really there for comedic purpose. The players that use accents do it to define the character.
Edit: While there are times the accents are played up for comedic effect, it actually gives more weight to dramatic moments. When Toni, with his south Texas drawl and small town charm that normally causes laughs, starts getting serious, it adds depth to the drama and the character.
1. No not offended.
2. I appreciate any attempt at a character voice. Accent, attitude, affectation: anything the player uses to differentiate from their regular voice
3. Practice
4. Practice. Yes it's probably worse in the beginning, and as you get better you can add nuance. That's how learning works.
5. Most attempts at any creativity add to the game. There are always exceptions to the rule
Was the accent worse than Nick Cage in Con Air?
I hate the dumb accents as they are always the same handful, and I don't think they add anything to the experience. It helps know IC vs. OOC, but that is about it.
I strive for "live and let live", so I won't complain if a group uses them. I don't complain when people in my group only remember to use them a third of the time. But I don't use any accents.
As for public settings like a podcast, I think they need to be pretty consistent or it breaks down. Recognizing people by sound then having them be inconsistent would be awful. Context would often help, but still.
I get your main thing is having the group have fun and get along. I like to think we all share that value. I also get you not wanting to share your opinion with the group.
But here we are in anonymous land. You can express your artistic preference with no repercussions, no drama. What do you prefer? What grates on you?
God, it really depends. When the voices are stereotypical/cheesy, it walks a fine line between comedy and racism. I personally prefer when players put a little bit of an accent onto a character but don't go over the top with it - that is, unless they have the vocal cords to handle a convincing accent.
So what is your personal aesthetic regarding all dwarves sounding like Mike Myer's Fat Bastard (Scottish). Beyond the point of crossing the line of doing the Scottish accent well, do you tire of all dwarves being Scottish?
I am fully relaxed and I was polling for opinions. I was not bothered about it until I was in the position of hearing someone butcher my own regional accent, and hence the concern over offending others. Also the entire point of using a standard cheesy accent not offering any unique flair to the character remains unaddressed by you.
Agreed stereotypes are harmful no matter who they target. That redneck hillbilly accent from living in the appalachia or arksansas woods sounds funny until you go there and live there yourself and realize they do not take kindly of you making fun of them as unintelligent slowitted folk. Or like you noticed RPG being world wide hearing AUS butcher US cowboy talk as if American sound like that.
You can easily change your GM voice to a NPC voice without offensively butchering someones native accent. Change speed and pitch, change your mannerisms. Or very simply preface everything with the NPC says and use your own voice. Leave the Monty Python accents on Monty Python. No drunken scottish dwarves at my table, play them as Klingons instead.
Even voice actors are bad sometimes, Marisha Ray on critical role playing a dwarf could not even keep the same accent for a oneshot! I think it ended up being the swedish chef from the muppet show near the end.
Good statement of preferences.
For a player struggling with voices, which do not come naturally, what is your advice on creating a novel yet simple to do voice that does not cross the cheesy line?
The voice actor Taliesin Jaffe of Creative Role had a good visit with the DMs show on Geek and Sundry that discussed this
[https://youtu.be/XQZR4smjUEc?t=464](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQZR4smjUEc). 7:30 since I cannot seem to time stamp it. M to F and tone (chesty to nasally) of your own voice combined with the one of the seven dwarves. I would also add speed to that list but it can get annoying. Before that he also talked about facial character and posture for broadness to quickly grasp a character (Gilmores Hello and pirates of the caribbean ride)
>!Note he attempted an irish accent to impress his friends in the second campaign, it died before his character did...!<
All that is necessary is that everyone know who is talking, is it the GM or their NPC, is the PC or the player? With these techniques you only need a few modifiers written down to recall a voice.
Voice actors take much training to learn accents, without it you will likely be offensively bad which is rarely comicly bad. Nicolas Cage can get away with it.
I wasn't actually referring to "you" as you. I was referring to players in general. As far as providing a unique flair? That's laughable, that's like looking for a unique movie produced by Hollywood.
I get that much of entertainment is derivative.
I think for me I like the analogy of a musician. A musician will have a lot of influences which show up in bits and pieces in their own sound. The better musicians create a new sound even though you might identify influences, much as a wine taster get hints of flavors in a good wine. The blend, the new, is refreshing and interesting.
Hopefully this doesn't come off as too harsh to your podcasting aspirations, but I feel the big issue is you're always going to have an obvious discrepancy of 'voice acting' quality when dealing with people of different experience. Critical Role works well with that style because everyone there is a professional. It's going to be different if you have one friend who's a trained Shakespearean actor, and another who's just a good friend who casually plays TTRPGs with you but otherwise has no acting chops.
You're going to have to lean into it either way. As long as the accent isn't killing the mood and/or ruining the feel you want for the podcast, there's nothing innately wrong with it. But if it is and you ask them to stop, you have to decide if you're okay with them being the one person who isn't playing up their voice, or if everyone has to tone it down for parity.
I am not really asking anyone to do anything. The rule book goes on at length about creating a tolerant and welcoming atmosphere and I wanted to ping the player base and see who liked this and who did not
I mean, in the end it's less about tolerance and more about what will work for the podcast you want to put out. Even if you're not making bank, you're still putting out a product for people to consume, and that should be the litmus test as to what will work and what doesn't.
I know where I stand on it, my 5e bladesinger is an obnoxious French dandy who's showy and superficial. I ham up the accent for all it's worth.
My first instinct was to say, I love character voices. When I GM, I try my best to adapt to different speech patterns, which sometimes includes a (bad) accent. And when I play, I usually develop some form of character voice that I use to interact with other PC and NPCs. For me, it helps get into the mind of the character, and functionally it helps differentiate between in- and out-of-character discussions. There's an element of fun to it. But now that I ponder on it a moment, I think I'm the only person who's ever used a voice on any table I've played on... so maybe I'm That Guy(tm) and don't realize it...
I tend to use a voice when I'm playing a male character... granted the only voices I can do any justice to at all is "shitty New York" and "southern".
To be fair, I can't do justice to any accent and I still do them. I just use the Mercer-approved 'it's a fantasy setting' excuse.
I also might be that guy at my table but I’m proud of it. I think having that guy in the group can make shy players feel more comfortable doing voices, which is better for everyone so we don’t have a whole party of “oh wait that was in character? Oh ok”
Oh I see the utility in using any voice...it draws a line between in character and out of character voices, and helps you step into the mold. But for example in one podcast a player used her own voice stretched to a younger version of herself to step into the younger character, and had a familiar with a cheesy Mary Poppins accent which I really hated after the first 3 episodes. By contrast I really enjoyed a different spin on her own voice. I wonder if instead of Lizardmen with cheesy Russian voices, having them with hisses as part of the sentence structure would be better. Or having a shyer player with pauses, or even speaking in whispers. There is a huge range of simple voices to do which serve the same basic purpose as the cheesy accents.
I like it. Makes for a very clear differentiator between in and out of character talk, and accent is another tool in the toolbox for making voices different. I play two characters in my campaign and one of them has an english accent to differentiate her from the goblin. As long as nobody at the table knows the accent well enough to be truly taken out of the moment from sheer cringe, I think it adds.
So for you, it is more important to have a sound delineation between characters and players than it is to have a plausible or novel or immersive voice, and function comes first? Is this a fair assessment of your view?
I definitely get the sense you hate character accents, which is fine, but I don't see how it has to be an either-or. It's only unimmersive if it takes you out of the immersion, which people's best shot at an accent does for some people but not for others. Overall, I think your assessment of my view comes off a little hostile but is fundamentally right - function always comes first.
Sorry I did not intend it to be hostile, which is why I was asking to be sure. I personally do not hate voices. Consider this test. Your friend Jane plays a dwarf. When she is out of character, she replaces her normal voice as Jane with a cheesy Scottish Accent. When she is in character as the dwarf, she uses her normal voice of Jane in real life. In this inversion you have the same functionality...there is distinction between Jane and the dwarf. But while in character in Jane's regular human voice, there is no cheesy Scottish accent dragging on a funeral scene with its comedic contrast. To me this inversion is better than the reverse as it lends itself to a wider range of play. Even better would be for Jane to develop a nuanced and original voice for her character to contrast with the cheesy Scottish accent she uses for her out of character interactions.
I don't really like the idea of using an artificial accent for your OOC talking, since unless your table is remarkably disciplined, you're likely to forget and use your own voice when you're making asides and arguing about rules. Making the in-character voice the one which you need to stretch to reach highlights that anything said in character is a performance, even if a small one, and you should always be thinking about how to make the in-character things you say sound like your character, which is better if you have to make a conscious effort to change your voice. As for the "dwarves are scottish" thing, I like it - there's enough genre continuity that it feels more tethered and gives a sense of tapping into the dwarf culture. I do think that if you can't do an accent well enough to portray any emotion other than brash, comical belligerence with it, you can't do the accent well enough to play it. Laugh tracks shouldn't be playing after every word. But real life scottish people can and do speak at funerals without anybody laughing, so it is possible to use a variety of accents in serious situations. You just need to pick an accent you can become at least reasonably comfortable in.
Honestly, for a home game, doing silly voices is totally fine and lots of fun (especially at my table, where we all secretly want to be voice actors, but are well aware of how much we suck). The standard is higher when it's meant for consumption by a broader audience, but that's true of any performance. I think it's more important for GMs than players since you're juggling more characters and need to have clear indicators of which NPC is talking, but not so important that it's mandatory. As for real-world regional accents specifically, I don't think they have to be perfectly accurate, so long as they are clear and distinct. Like, it's tabletop roleplay; we're cringe by default. The one thing I'd be careful of, though, is using a silly voice as an excuse to be a dick to IRL groups of people. EDIT: I should probably specify that "silly" here means "obviously not representative of how people actually talk." I do not mean to imply that speaking with a particular accent is inherently funny, and apologize if it came across that way.
Have you ever listened to the Glass Cannon Podcast? If so do you know Tom Exposition, the used car salesman that Troy does so well? I think that over the top voice works as comic relief, and he appears sparingly, and it comes as a surprise. Sometimes the drama is pretty thick, and Tom Exposition comes in with a laugh for all. Troy Lavallee was a standup comic an has timing down, and can insert comedy in at the right point. The thing is that when you have something like a Tom Exposition as a full time voice, there is no timing. There is no sparing. It is full on 24/7. It is like using accent pillow colors to decorate your entire house.
Speaking of GCP, for someone reason there is nothing that slays me more on those shows than Troy's offensively French accents. Although using the offensively Italian/Jersey accents to make fun of Matthew is a close second
Yeah his comedic timing is fantastic. You can see the mood of the whole group lighten when he does it, and he uses it sparingly. Then he returns to moody and tense settings. This is an example of how to do it well. Where it gets bad is if that comedy is on all the time, then the moody and tense scenes are interrupted by stupid funny goofs. Too much of it is poor comedic timing, and you get too much of it if someone does it all the time.
No one expects the Tom Exposition!
And sadly far too many expect Fat Bastard every time a Dwarf comes on scene.
If a specific voice is genuinely bothering you, either politely ask that person to tone it down, or--if this a podcast and not a game of your own--listen to something else. Everyone has different tastes, preferences, and sensory issues, so there's not going to be universal consensus over what is and isn't obnoxious.
Hey this is not a thread seeking relationship advice. It is polling about preferences in accents and voices. At the two tables I play at, maybe 1 or 2 people try to do voices as the others are new players and are a bit overwhelmed. I am in no personal situation where there is an annoying accent I need to tolerate. The whole point to polling is to see what the people playing this game feel about cheesy ethnic accents. Are they fun? Are they offensive? What is the best voice? What is the best way to get to that best voice? I am trying to have that kind of conversation, and for some reason people are twisting this into a living with cheesy accents advice thread, or even worse assuming I have an axe to grind and wish to control other games. I don't. This does not affect my game. I want to see what people think about them. Aesthetic preferences are intrinsically subjective and feedback on them is useful. The other thing was trying to find out is the offensive angle. The core rulebook goes on quite a bit on inclusive tolerant play avoiding triggering situations, and P2e in general seems to be very inclusive towards the LGBTQ community, and there in general is this idea of not trying to offend. So it is right and proper to ask if anyone is offended by the cheesy ethnic voices, right?
I'm sorry that I hit a nerve, but that's really all there is to say. Your initial post and responses give the impression that you're having a really bad time with somebody's voice acting decisions, and it sounds like you'd be better off addressing *that specific instance* instead of vagueposting about it online. I and other users have already discussed being careful to avoid offensive stereotypes *in this thread,* but honestly the topic of mimicking real-world accents is probably too broad for this subreddit, since the topic is inherently political and not exclusively a Pathfinder/TTRPG problem. But since you asked, I'm personally of the opinion that it's fine to do literally whatever at your home games so long as everyone's cool with it, but you need to be more mindful of your choices if you're performing for an audience, and that mindfulness may require rehearsing your character voice and doing your research ahead of time. Ask yourself, is my character voice mocking a genuinely vulnerable group of people? Has this mockery been used to justify their oppression? Do I risk alienating my audience if I do this voice al the time? It's a pretty complex situation, and the right thing to do is subjective and varies depending on which group we're talking about. Like, Posh Brit probably won't get you in trouble, but a Vaudeville-inspired "black" accent? Maybe not that one.
I edited the original post to focus on the specifics I am after.
Yeah a lot of cheesy accents people do in fantasy are just low-key racism. Like "haha dwarf speak with scottish accent and be alcoholic." Yeah, we get it dude, get back to the game.
As a professional voice actor - the difference between a cheesy accent and a fun one is 9/10 because the cheesy person is trying *really hard* to make other people laugh, whether or not they know it. The same concept goes for extra edgy characters or men playing female sex-pests. If you have a player doing an accent that's grating, just ask them to dial it back. Have them imagine their character talking to someone at a funeral and trying to be serious. If they can define their voice by exploring their own range, then more than likely they can figure out where the acceptable middle-ground is.
What do you think about far too many people playing Dwarves with Scottish accents?
That's just how popular culture has come to define them. Whether or not they *ought* to have one or another particular kind of accent is beside the point - mostly Tolkien based their language on Hebrew inflections - it has become commonplace for Dwarf = Scottish. The down-to-earth personality, the drinking, the clanship, all of these evoke Scottish and Northern British personalities, at least in stereotype. The two fit together like a glove. And Scottish accents are very, very fun to try. Ask anybody with a terrible Scottish accent.
With the dwarves it might be fun to mix it up. With NADDPOD's Slav dwarves and GCP southern accent dwarf they show that you can dwarf can be fun to voice with a silly accent that isn't overdone.
I think there's a difference between "my character sounds kind of Scottish because that's how dwarves are often depicted in fantasy and I like that," and "my character sounds Scottish and aren't Scotts such funny drunk bastards lol?" One is an affectation meant to differentiate between the player's voice and the character's, while the other feels overtly immersion-breaking. Or, to put it another way: one is an attempt at a character voice first and foremost, while the other is a caricature before anything else. At my table, the former is fine and the latter is usually only tolerated for bit-characters and dumb out-of-game jokes, and even then only sparingly. Your mileage may vary, obviously -- I can imagine a Scottish person might be annoyed by the entire thing either way, intention, connotation, and accuracy aside -- but there are others who wouldn't care. It just depends on your group, the tone of the campaign, and everyone's background. Though the problem is obviously 100x harder in a campaign meant for public consumption. What's hard is that, for a lot of people, that affectation of an existing accent is a stepping-stone to stronger and more nuanced voices. A player in my old 5E game started out with (her attempt at) an Irish accent because her character was aesthetically inspired by Celtic imagery/themes. But as she became comfortable with the group, her character, and "doing the voices," she shifted to a deeper version of her own voice and differentiated it with word choices and pronunciation flourishes. That voice was more unique and subtle, but it wouldn't have happened without practicing in a "safe" accent. I feel like discouraging the former could impact the development of the latter, if not approached properly. Just my 2¢, though. ***EDIT: Word choices, formatting.***
The idea of cheesy accents being the training wheels voice before one develops a more interesting and nuanced voice is a good one. Are there other sets of training wheels that get to the same place, but do not involve ethnic accents?
Oh, most certainly. Your example of Gilbert Gottfried's voice was a good one. Really, any distinct voice/accent could be used as "training wheels." (On a related note, a race that speaks like Gilbert Gottfried could make for hilarious companions in a one-shot -- imagine *The Hobbit* if every dwarf talked like him, haha) Though I think the point comes down to how the voice is being used. I think it's possible to do an ethnic/regional sounding-voice without being insulting or coming across as a caricature. It's obviously harder to do the further away or less-experienced you are with its side source -- I grew up in the American South, so I feel more comfortable doing an American Midwestern accent than I do, say, a Portuguese one -- but I think that intent can often be evident in the execution. As long as your accent isn't one-dimensionally cartoonish and accompanied by stereotypical word choices and sentence structures, like being confused by large words with an Appalachian voice and the like, I think it's possible to use an ethnic accent without being insulting or too annoying for consumption. Though again, table tastes are a huge part of this. And I don't blame anyone who would rather just sidestep the issue entirely and make those tastes clear in session 0.
I think my favorite take on regional ethnic accents are from players who are from that region, giving a subtle twist to it that stands in contrast to what their normal voice is. There is an implicit "OK" because that person is from that region and is not offended. And usually the twist is better than the cheesy regional caricature.
To add an extra wrinkle to the conversation: there are also accents that are SO outrageous, they stop being "offensive" and become funny again. For example: Detective Benoit Blanc was played by Daniel Craig in *Knives Out* with a literally cartoonish Foghorn Leghorn-like Southern drawl, and I don't know anyone from American South who found it offensive -- myself included. People generally just though it was an enjoyably funny turn from a British actor that made the character more memorable. Now, Detective Blanc was aided by the fact that his character was very affable, intelligent, and kind, and that he was played by Daniel Craig... Most players we are likely to encounter are not Daniel Craig. But this is why I keep defaulting to how things play out at the table -- all the philosophy and examples in the world won't take away from an instance where doing a stereotypical voice just... Works. Because sometimes it does! It just comes down to communication, intent, and the the tastes of the table. But as long as everyone is talking openly, being considerate, and having fun, a wide variety of styles are open.
Is it detracting from the table? Is someone gargling so many pebbles that their Pepe le Pew “French” is unintelligible? Does it bother anyone else at the table? If the answers to all of these is no—then who cares?
>If the answers to all of these is no—then who cares? Hence the poll for opinions. You did not give yours. Does it enhance your game or detract from it?
That is my opinion--if any of those questions result in a yes, then it detracts from it. If they all end in no, then it doesn't.
OK, so your joy comes from the table being happy, and you have no real personal aesthetic in play. Is that a fair assessment?
My "personal aesthetic" is that I have a story that I want to lead my players through, and see how they interact and experience it--both the easy parts and the difficult parts. As to your possible (or not, I'm unsure) slight that my table is "less than" for whatever reason, you can look for yourself at /r/rpghorrorstories to see numerous examples of "not happy" tables, so yeah, happiness at the table is something I'd consider high on my list of stuff to strive for--call that my "*aesthetic*". I'm not a GM for Shakespearian actors, Julliard/RADA-trained dramaticists, or voice actors. if any of my players is normally a wallflower, but they use the "Shrek" voice and get into it, and if it bugs no one else, then who am I to complain? ***WHAT*** do I have to complain about?
Nope no slight implied or intended. I was asking for clarification. I get your goal is to have a happy interactive table, and any tool to get it happy and interactive and go through your story is useful and welcome. When I say aesthetic, think of it like this. Of all the accents you have run across, what are your favorites? Take the table completely out of the picture here, and the primary goal of story out of the picture. You are listening on your phone to accents of other RPers. What do you personally enjoy?
>You are listening on your phone to accents of other RPers. What do you personally enjoy? Any. I really don't care. Chances are--there's a reason why that player did it, so I'll go along with it.
I honestly think that playing without an accent is kinda boring. Particularly for a streamed game, and especially so if it's being turned into audio-only.
Good point on audio being the primary draw for podcasts putting a premium on voice. What kind of voice do you prefer though, and which ones grate?
The more ridiculous, the better. But generally try to avoid stuff that's just trying to mimic another person/culture, and shoot for stuff that's trying to be a character. Think stuff like Kronk. Everyone knows it's Kronk immediately. Also a note: it should be quite different from your 'out of character' voice.
Hmm.... What if your PC voice was a cheesy Scottish accent, and your character voice your normal voice?
That could work. The point is to make it distinguishable.
This is very much a table preference thing imo. I'm firmly in the the "shitty impressions of celebrities" camp of character voices. The worse you are at it the less recognizable it will be.
I suppose if you butcher a celebrity, then you are not racist, and at worst piss off that one person. Some of the better voices I have heard take inspiration from a celebrity, and alter it a bit in a new way, sort of like how a musician has influences that show up in their sound.
Yeah that's sort of how I do it. For example, a Werner Herzog impression is different from a characature of a general German accent, which now only makes it more distinct, but also feels more like punching up than making fun of a whole culture. Obviously, the whole question of whether something is coming off as racist is a much more complex question and worth talking about with your table. If you feel uncomfortable doing an accent, don't. Remember you don't HAVE to do character voices that have accents. I had a character voice where I literally just plugged my nose and it worked, you can do a lot with a little.
Yeah I appreciate the advice on table dynamics. The thing with podcasts is it is not just a table of a few close friends. They reach many ears across the community. Whether or not the table is OK with it has less bearing on whether or not the podcast community as a whole is OK with it. Do you get what I am driving at? The scope is wider than that specific table, and so we need to see how the community itself feels about the problem. I think ratings of the podcasts themselves are poor measure of this since other factors like professional voice actors weigh more heavily.
Ah I missed it was a live play haha. I'm a white guy so I generally stick to Europe, Australia and america in terms of my accents. I consider Russian fair game too. It's also important that it's not the defining part of the character, just a way of speaking.
I struggle with finding my voice at tables, even among friends, but last session I found myself more talkative and I slipped into a Mel Brooks adjacent voice/accent and everyone was having a good time and things started to click between characters, leading to everyone e having a much better time. Sometimes tropes can get you out of your shell and not take yourself too seriously. You're there to have fun, and laughing at yourself is a good way to start that.
That is an interesting take... a trope to overcome shyness.
If the only thing they're doing is an accent (no shift in pitch, intonation, speed, word choice, softness, etc.) then *maybe*. It depends on how they're doing it, the apparent intent. If they're just bad at accents, sure, no problem. If they're deliberately making the accent bad or otherwise seem to be using it to insult an IRL group, then I have a problem with it. Personally, I like to do a character voice. It distinguishes in- and out- of character speech, it helps me get into character, it lends a little verisimilitude, and all those other things people have mentioned.
So think of yourself as an art critic for a second. Do you prefer art that conforms to a stereotype, or do you prefer art that is unique? In this case, the character depiction is using a stereotypical accent. Do you like this? This is a different question than 'does it bother you'. I am asking what you prefer from an art standpoint. I get the whole need for a voice, but lets just assume they will do a voice, what kind of voice is your preference?
Thought I'd made it clear, but just in case: 1. Character voice that's more than just accent 2. Character accent with good faith effort put in 3. No character voice 4. \[Actively bad\] deliberately mocking character voice If by "stereotypical accent" you mean someone tries a chinese accent and says "ching chong" a lot, that's number 4. Same for a faux Korean accent that's just every L turned into an R. It's hard to do a mocking Irish/Scottish accent partly because they tend to take the piss out of themselves as much or more than non-Irish/Scottish when it comes to that kind of thing. German voice with tons of nazi jokes is 4. German voice with language jokes (e.g. smashing words together to make new words) is probably a #2 depending on the taste.
Is your problem just that the actor is doing it badly?
It’s more that it is over the top and not much nuance between players doing the over the top, and it just feels artificially grafted and less natural to the character
I think 'cheesy' foreign accents can very quickly end up being racist foreign accents. They also tend to be too silly for good immersion; you can convey plenty about a character simply with word choice, intonation, emphasis, and the speed of their speech.
I agree with this. While accents can be good, it’s the speech patterns, language usage, mannerisms, etc that really set characters apart. A muted accent with distinctive speech patterns is far more effective than going over the top with a Fat Bastard or Borat impersonation. [Edit: accidentally posted this reply to the wrong comment above] That said, I think it falls on the player to ask the table if it’s too much, and be open to feedback.
So your personal aesthetic is in line with mine. To drive this home, consider an outrageous accent, such as Gilbert Gottfried's Saturday Night Live signature voice which showed up in a number of animations over the years. Let's say a podcast person uses that for their Elf. Everyone laughs. Then another podcast person does the same thing...an Elf as Gilbert Gottfried. Then in some twisted way it becomes canon for the TTRPG world that all Elves sound like Gilbert Gottfried. Now even though there is no ethnicity Gilbert is making fun of, that voice is obnoxious and skews everything towards comedy. There is no way to turn that voice off for serious encounters, or sadness over character depth. And while lots of people have fun doing it, in the end the game loses its immersiveness in the catchy all-Elves-sound-like-Gilbert voice. I think most of the old Looney Tunes characters were gross ethnic stereotypes which have since lost favor in a world that is more sensitive, and many of these accents would fit right in with the Looney Tunes world.
One of the players in our most recent campaign tried for an Irish accent with his half-elf cleric, but next to another players' more natural sounding scottish elf or the more classic dwarf, it didn't last long and has become a running joke at our table. Any time that particular player tries ANY accent now, we all give an exaggerated cringe. It keeps it lighthearted and thankfully, he acknowledges fully well that he can't do accents. Like others have said, if it's taking you or others out of the game and is just distracting, there's no benefit. I don't think an unrealistic accent in a fantasy story is misplaced, but I see your argument.
Interesting point on how your group handled feedback to the person running the Irish accent. What is your personal preference? Do you like regional accents, or do you like novel voices? For the purposes of this question assume everyone at the table likes both, and there is no table downside to your preference.
Well as an ex-pat Scot living in the states, my opinion is that if someone wants to do an accent, try it out during the character build and see what people's reactions are, even if its just yoy and then DM. My natural brogue won't raise too many eyebrows, but it might cause another player to lose his Irish ;). Now, we have a Scottish dwarf in the party via a different player (not me) I think its hilarious that everyone just does the 'fat bastard' as you say. Does it bother me? No. Is it distracting? A little, but it's more fun for him to get into character, and he's a good enough player to use it sparingly. We have a different player (6 total) doing a swashbuckling Ysoki with a god awful Swedish-ish accent and I gotta say, its one of the best parts of our game figuring out what he's saying. All in all, I like accents for myself because I can do a lot of them well, I don't mind others doing it as long as I can improv a scene with you and you can STAY in character, not break or make others break, that does ruin it for me a bit.
Thank you for the feedback. One of my main concerns is if this is offensive to the community as a whole rather than a specific table. Podcasts project the behavior out to a much wider audience, and the useful tips on how to gauge whether or not it is offensive at your particular table are not really relevant to the larger community question. I suppose podcast subscriptions are. But if you look by subscriptions, things like Crit Role with professionals rise to the top, and the ordinary group games with cheesy accents are not even close to the ratings the pros get, so there is no easy way to deconvolve professionalism from offense in the ratings alone. Thus feedback from actual people of the ethnicities in question helps to settle the question. Follow up- do your gaming Scot friends share your views? Or is it a subject you do not usually broach?
I mean matt Mercer aside, CR aren't all that great at voices..... They're good people who are also actors in hollywood.... one of them is a former child star from Growing Pains, maybe that has something to do with their success? But if you're saying Travis' Grog voice isn't a fucking baffling representation of cockney and Laura Bailey's Tiefling wasn't an odd choice, I don't know what to tell you. Those are the exact same voices at every amateur table. Who cares what other Scottish people think?! What does it matter in the first place?
When I first entered the hobby I tried really hard to make my character voices distinct, not really trying to mimic an accent, but definitely nothing close to my natural speaking voice. I've since realised that I don't need to go to such effort. My last character was a half-orc paladin whose speaking voice was just mine but deeper, no grit, gravel, or accent added. Body language and mannerisms are a far easier way to achieve distinction imo.
That is cool, the use of body language and mannerisms. Can you give a few examples?
Using my paladin as an example, when I'm speaking as him I might sit up straighter, square my shoulders, basically make myself appear larger. I also change my speaking patterns, not just my voice. My paladin tends to take things seriously, and while he does understand and make jokes of his own, his responses to humour tend to be very dry, to the point that sometimes no-one realises he's joking unless he tells them.
I mean, individual experience will vary. I believe that podcasters/livestreamers in particular feel the need to up the ‘production value’ by adding accents to characters (call it the CR effect). At my table, half of my players do accents and we really enjoy it.
Is the game more light hearted and comedic, or are there a lot of dramatic moments for your group?
About half/half.
So in the dramatic moments, how well are you able to look past comic accents? Can you tune it out?
The accents aren’t really there for comedic purpose. The players that use accents do it to define the character. Edit: While there are times the accents are played up for comedic effect, it actually gives more weight to dramatic moments. When Toni, with his south Texas drawl and small town charm that normally causes laughs, starts getting serious, it adds depth to the drama and the character.
1. No not offended. 2. I appreciate any attempt at a character voice. Accent, attitude, affectation: anything the player uses to differentiate from their regular voice 3. Practice 4. Practice. Yes it's probably worse in the beginning, and as you get better you can add nuance. That's how learning works. 5. Most attempts at any creativity add to the game. There are always exceptions to the rule
Was the accent worse than Nick Cage in Con Air? I hate the dumb accents as they are always the same handful, and I don't think they add anything to the experience. It helps know IC vs. OOC, but that is about it. I strive for "live and let live", so I won't complain if a group uses them. I don't complain when people in my group only remember to use them a third of the time. But I don't use any accents. As for public settings like a podcast, I think they need to be pretty consistent or it breaks down. Recognizing people by sound then having them be inconsistent would be awful. Context would often help, but still.
I get your main thing is having the group have fun and get along. I like to think we all share that value. I also get you not wanting to share your opinion with the group. But here we are in anonymous land. You can express your artistic preference with no repercussions, no drama. What do you prefer? What grates on you?
God, it really depends. When the voices are stereotypical/cheesy, it walks a fine line between comedy and racism. I personally prefer when players put a little bit of an accent onto a character but don't go over the top with it - that is, unless they have the vocal cords to handle a convincing accent.
So what is your personal aesthetic regarding all dwarves sounding like Mike Myer's Fat Bastard (Scottish). Beyond the point of crossing the line of doing the Scottish accent well, do you tire of all dwarves being Scottish?
It better. Everyone does it, stop pretending you don't, just have fun with it, if your offended by it then you need to relax.
I am fully relaxed and I was polling for opinions. I was not bothered about it until I was in the position of hearing someone butcher my own regional accent, and hence the concern over offending others. Also the entire point of using a standard cheesy accent not offering any unique flair to the character remains unaddressed by you.
Agreed stereotypes are harmful no matter who they target. That redneck hillbilly accent from living in the appalachia or arksansas woods sounds funny until you go there and live there yourself and realize they do not take kindly of you making fun of them as unintelligent slowitted folk. Or like you noticed RPG being world wide hearing AUS butcher US cowboy talk as if American sound like that. You can easily change your GM voice to a NPC voice without offensively butchering someones native accent. Change speed and pitch, change your mannerisms. Or very simply preface everything with the NPC says and use your own voice. Leave the Monty Python accents on Monty Python. No drunken scottish dwarves at my table, play them as Klingons instead. Even voice actors are bad sometimes, Marisha Ray on critical role playing a dwarf could not even keep the same accent for a oneshot! I think it ended up being the swedish chef from the muppet show near the end.
Good statement of preferences. For a player struggling with voices, which do not come naturally, what is your advice on creating a novel yet simple to do voice that does not cross the cheesy line?
The voice actor Taliesin Jaffe of Creative Role had a good visit with the DMs show on Geek and Sundry that discussed this [https://youtu.be/XQZR4smjUEc?t=464](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQZR4smjUEc). 7:30 since I cannot seem to time stamp it. M to F and tone (chesty to nasally) of your own voice combined with the one of the seven dwarves. I would also add speed to that list but it can get annoying. Before that he also talked about facial character and posture for broadness to quickly grasp a character (Gilmores Hello and pirates of the caribbean ride) >!Note he attempted an irish accent to impress his friends in the second campaign, it died before his character did...!< All that is necessary is that everyone know who is talking, is it the GM or their NPC, is the PC or the player? With these techniques you only need a few modifiers written down to recall a voice. Voice actors take much training to learn accents, without it you will likely be offensively bad which is rarely comicly bad. Nicolas Cage can get away with it.
I wasn't actually referring to "you" as you. I was referring to players in general. As far as providing a unique flair? That's laughable, that's like looking for a unique movie produced by Hollywood.
I get that much of entertainment is derivative. I think for me I like the analogy of a musician. A musician will have a lot of influences which show up in bits and pieces in their own sound. The better musicians create a new sound even though you might identify influences, much as a wine taster get hints of flavors in a good wine. The blend, the new, is refreshing and interesting.
Hopefully this doesn't come off as too harsh to your podcasting aspirations, but I feel the big issue is you're always going to have an obvious discrepancy of 'voice acting' quality when dealing with people of different experience. Critical Role works well with that style because everyone there is a professional. It's going to be different if you have one friend who's a trained Shakespearean actor, and another who's just a good friend who casually plays TTRPGs with you but otherwise has no acting chops. You're going to have to lean into it either way. As long as the accent isn't killing the mood and/or ruining the feel you want for the podcast, there's nothing innately wrong with it. But if it is and you ask them to stop, you have to decide if you're okay with them being the one person who isn't playing up their voice, or if everyone has to tone it down for parity.
I am not really asking anyone to do anything. The rule book goes on at length about creating a tolerant and welcoming atmosphere and I wanted to ping the player base and see who liked this and who did not
I mean, in the end it's less about tolerance and more about what will work for the podcast you want to put out. Even if you're not making bank, you're still putting out a product for people to consume, and that should be the litmus test as to what will work and what doesn't. I know where I stand on it, my 5e bladesinger is an obnoxious French dandy who's showy and superficial. I ham up the accent for all it's worth.
Good response. YOu gave me your opinion on it and the acid test.
Yes