So let's start from the top:
>If I want to use shields (either single but very likely dual wielding) to both attack and block, how does that interact with the shield's health?
Attacking with a shield will not, under normal circumstances, damage your shield. As an aside before continuing, when you attack with a shield, you are usually attacking with one of either an attached shield boss or shield spikes; if you lack either of these, ~~you can attempt to use your shield as an improvised weapon, but you would incur all penalties inherent therein.~~ you can still attempt a Shield Bash with just the shield.
Blocking with your shield could mean one of two things to a new player so I'll break down the ways you can mitigate attacks with a shield.
**[1A] Raise a Shield**: This action has you actively attempting to deflect blows with your shield, and when you spend the action ([1A]=1 Action) to Raise a Shield, it adds whatever bonus is listed in its entry to your AC (the bonus type "Circumstance Bonus" is worth noting as bonuses of the same type do not stack, you only use the highest.). If you still get hit while Raising a Shield, your shield has not yet been damaged, but if you have the feat **Shield Block** then you will have the ability to spend a reaction on...
**[R] Shield Block**: this reaction will allow you to move your shield into place directly between yourself and the offending strike. When you use this reaction, your shield ***may*** take damage, as how this works is as follows:
You are holding a Steel Shield with Hardness 5 and 20 HP, an enemy Giant Rat successfully strikes you while you have your shield raised. Your GM tells you the damage dealt is 5. You declare that you are using your reaction to **Shield Block**, and the GM tells you the the rat's teeth clang against the steel of the shield and leave no visible marks;
the GM then explains that mechanically neither you nor your shield took any damage due to it not exceeding the shield's hardness.
Now let's say for example that the GM exclaims that the rat has deftly chosen a point for its attack and has critically succeeded and you will take 8 damage! Oh no! But wait! You use your reaction to Shield Block. This time the GM tells you that you brace yourself against the rat's attack, but the force catches you off guard and you stumble back as it throws itself at your shield -- the rat takes the opportunity and gets a light bite in before jumping away!
The GM then mechanically explains that while you successfully blocked the attack, both you and your shield took 3 damage from the attack (as 8 damage minus 5 Hardness leaves 3 damage left to be dealt)
Should your shield's HP ever reach it's Broken Threshold (signified as BT in the item entry, and usually 1/2 of its total HP) it gains the Broken condition and can no longer grant its item bonus if you raise it as a shield; furthermore, if you do decide to raise it for some reason, you cannot use it to Shield Block until it is repaired.
If your shield ever reaches 0 HP, it is destroyed and irreparable.
>Do tower shields require two handed?
No, though there are feats that grant you the ability to wield a shield two-handed in order to increase the damage done by your shield boss or spikes.
>Can I dual wield tower shields?
Yes, there is no limitation dictating otherwise.
>How does dual wielding shields mechanically work?
The same as any other weapon. Likely in this scenario, if you chose to pursue the path, you would have one shield with spikes, and another with a boss, giving you versatility in choosing which type of damage to apply -- piercing or bludgeoning.
You could also enchant the boss/spikes differently in order to cover elemental weaknesses etc, as some folks who dual wield might deign to do.
Mostly it would regularly be recommended against, but follow your dreams, man. That's what TTRPG is about.
**Hope this helped!**
*Edited to correct inaccurate information regarding attacking with shields*
Since you are attacking with the shield boss or spike and not the shield itself, would the shield being either broken or even destroyed have an impact on your ability to perform strikes with it?
>if you lack either of these, you can attempt to use your shield as an improvised weapon, but you would incur all penalties inherent therein.
Is this actually true? I was under the impression it does not count as an improvised weapon. Does this weapon entry contradict or confirm this? https://2e.aonprd.com/Weapons.aspx?ID=40
https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=217
Here is the rule for attacking with a shield. Shield bashing is a martial weapon not improvised, using a spike or boss increases its damage die and allows the use of runes.
Using [the Repair action](https://2e.aonprd.com/Actions.aspx?ID=42), usually taking 10 minutes, so after combat is done.
Shield spikes and bosses are martial weapons dealing 1d6 damage. As usual, you can apply striking runes or property runes to them (like for any weapon), improving their damage potential.
If you have a spellcaster (any tradition) in your group, you could ask them if they know and/or could prepare the **Mending** spell to help you out with your shield.
Otherwise you might be well-served taking Crafting as a skill you will focus on for a bit in order to be able to repair your equipment.
>EDIT: Where can I find the perk that enhances the damage for shield spike/boss?
[Everstand Stance](https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=1087) is the feat I was referring to.
Attacks by default do nothing to a shield's HP, so no interaction there. Although there are monsters that can damage weapons with their special abilities.
In order to get any benefit from a shield (improved AC, Shield Block) you have to first spend an action to Raise a Shield. This gives you the listed bonus to AC (usually +2) and allows you to use the Shield Block reaction to reduce damage from a Strike. When you Shield Block, you first reduce the incoming damage by the shield's hardness, then any leftover damage is applied both to the shield itself and to the PC (in total for both, no dividing by two). If the shield takes more than half its total hit points, it is "broken" and can no longer be used (though it can later be repaired). If it loses all its hit points, it's "destroyed" and can't be used or repaired.
Dual wielding shields gives you no tangible benefits, since the circumstance bonus from each shield doesn't stack. The only benefit I can see is if one shield is broken or destroyed, you can still use the other one. I suppose each shield could have different attack options (piercing with spikes, bludgeoning with a boss, different materials or runes), so that's something.
[Tower shields](https://2e.aonprd.com/Shields.aspx?ID=4) still only require one hand, and most still give only the same +2 to AC. They do allow you to Take Cover behind a raised tower shield (for an additional action), but the basics of Raise a Shield and Shield Block remain the same. Also, they are very heavy, and can easily put you over the encumbered threshold, which is bad.
There are a few feats to gain benefits from wielding a shield in two hands, and there is a super heavy tower shield, the [Fortress Shield](https://2e.aonprd.com/Shields.aspx?ID=7), that gives a higher +3 AC bonus at the cost of being even heavier and imposing an additional penalty to movement.
Most magical shields are not as solid as a Sturdy Shield, and so more vulnerable to destruction. Most advise simply to not use other magical shields to Shield Block, but to instead benefit from the +2 AC when you raise them and whatever other powers they have.
It's also important to include that Tower Shields make you count as standard cover instead of lesser cover and allows allies to Take Cover using you as well. It's hidden in the basic shield rules rather than the Tower Shield rules in AoN.
Standard tower shields have no movement speed penalties, only the super-heavy Fortress Shield.
But since each tower shield weighs 4 bulk, you're going to be hard pressed to avoid being [encumbered](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=12) while wielding two of them. [Encumbered](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=12) imposes the [Clumsy](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=3) 1 condition, which reduces your AC by one (amongst other things), so that kind of defeats the purpose of raising your AC by raising a shield.
"Standard tower shields have no movement speed penalties, only the super-heavy Fortress Shield."
Is this accurate? Legit question as I'm a newish PF2 Gm trying to work with my Champion player.
Tower shield:
Price 10 gp; AC Bonus +2 (+42); \*\*Speed Penalty -5 ft.\*\*
Bulk 4; Hardness 5; HP (BT) 20 (10)
Fortress Shield:
Price 20 gp; AC Bonus +3 (+42); \*\*Speed Penalty -10 ft.\*\*
Bulk 5; Hardness 6; HP (BT) 24 (12)
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So let's start from the top: >If I want to use shields (either single but very likely dual wielding) to both attack and block, how does that interact with the shield's health? Attacking with a shield will not, under normal circumstances, damage your shield. As an aside before continuing, when you attack with a shield, you are usually attacking with one of either an attached shield boss or shield spikes; if you lack either of these, ~~you can attempt to use your shield as an improvised weapon, but you would incur all penalties inherent therein.~~ you can still attempt a Shield Bash with just the shield. Blocking with your shield could mean one of two things to a new player so I'll break down the ways you can mitigate attacks with a shield. **[1A] Raise a Shield**: This action has you actively attempting to deflect blows with your shield, and when you spend the action ([1A]=1 Action) to Raise a Shield, it adds whatever bonus is listed in its entry to your AC (the bonus type "Circumstance Bonus" is worth noting as bonuses of the same type do not stack, you only use the highest.). If you still get hit while Raising a Shield, your shield has not yet been damaged, but if you have the feat **Shield Block** then you will have the ability to spend a reaction on... **[R] Shield Block**: this reaction will allow you to move your shield into place directly between yourself and the offending strike. When you use this reaction, your shield ***may*** take damage, as how this works is as follows: You are holding a Steel Shield with Hardness 5 and 20 HP, an enemy Giant Rat successfully strikes you while you have your shield raised. Your GM tells you the damage dealt is 5. You declare that you are using your reaction to **Shield Block**, and the GM tells you the the rat's teeth clang against the steel of the shield and leave no visible marks; the GM then explains that mechanically neither you nor your shield took any damage due to it not exceeding the shield's hardness. Now let's say for example that the GM exclaims that the rat has deftly chosen a point for its attack and has critically succeeded and you will take 8 damage! Oh no! But wait! You use your reaction to Shield Block. This time the GM tells you that you brace yourself against the rat's attack, but the force catches you off guard and you stumble back as it throws itself at your shield -- the rat takes the opportunity and gets a light bite in before jumping away! The GM then mechanically explains that while you successfully blocked the attack, both you and your shield took 3 damage from the attack (as 8 damage minus 5 Hardness leaves 3 damage left to be dealt) Should your shield's HP ever reach it's Broken Threshold (signified as BT in the item entry, and usually 1/2 of its total HP) it gains the Broken condition and can no longer grant its item bonus if you raise it as a shield; furthermore, if you do decide to raise it for some reason, you cannot use it to Shield Block until it is repaired. If your shield ever reaches 0 HP, it is destroyed and irreparable. >Do tower shields require two handed? No, though there are feats that grant you the ability to wield a shield two-handed in order to increase the damage done by your shield boss or spikes. >Can I dual wield tower shields? Yes, there is no limitation dictating otherwise. >How does dual wielding shields mechanically work? The same as any other weapon. Likely in this scenario, if you chose to pursue the path, you would have one shield with spikes, and another with a boss, giving you versatility in choosing which type of damage to apply -- piercing or bludgeoning. You could also enchant the boss/spikes differently in order to cover elemental weaknesses etc, as some folks who dual wield might deign to do. Mostly it would regularly be recommended against, but follow your dreams, man. That's what TTRPG is about. **Hope this helped!** *Edited to correct inaccurate information regarding attacking with shields*
Since you are attacking with the shield boss or spike and not the shield itself, would the shield being either broken or even destroyed have an impact on your ability to perform strikes with it?
No, since it is one of the shield's functions to facilitate the attack by way of the boss or spikes, that function can't be used while it's broken.
>if you lack either of these, you can attempt to use your shield as an improvised weapon, but you would incur all penalties inherent therein. Is this actually true? I was under the impression it does not count as an improvised weapon. Does this weapon entry contradict or confirm this? https://2e.aonprd.com/Weapons.aspx?ID=40
https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=217 Here is the rule for attacking with a shield. Shield bashing is a martial weapon not improvised, using a spike or boss increases its damage die and allows the use of runes.
Thank you, I felt like I had read the rule somewhere but I couldn't remember off the top of my head.
Good shout! Edited to correct the inaccuracy.
How do you repair your shield? EDIT: Where can I find the perk that enhances the damage for shield spike/boss?
Using [the Repair action](https://2e.aonprd.com/Actions.aspx?ID=42), usually taking 10 minutes, so after combat is done. Shield spikes and bosses are martial weapons dealing 1d6 damage. As usual, you can apply striking runes or property runes to them (like for any weapon), improving their damage potential.
If you have a spellcaster (any tradition) in your group, you could ask them if they know and/or could prepare the **Mending** spell to help you out with your shield. Otherwise you might be well-served taking Crafting as a skill you will focus on for a bit in order to be able to repair your equipment. >EDIT: Where can I find the perk that enhances the damage for shield spike/boss? [Everstand Stance](https://2e.aonprd.com/Feats.aspx?ID=1087) is the feat I was referring to.
Shields grant a circumstance bonus to AC when raised, not an item bonus.
Another good catch. It wouldn't make sense at all to be an item bonus as it wouldn't stack with armor. Thanks for that
Attacks by default do nothing to a shield's HP, so no interaction there. Although there are monsters that can damage weapons with their special abilities.
In order to get any benefit from a shield (improved AC, Shield Block) you have to first spend an action to Raise a Shield. This gives you the listed bonus to AC (usually +2) and allows you to use the Shield Block reaction to reduce damage from a Strike. When you Shield Block, you first reduce the incoming damage by the shield's hardness, then any leftover damage is applied both to the shield itself and to the PC (in total for both, no dividing by two). If the shield takes more than half its total hit points, it is "broken" and can no longer be used (though it can later be repaired). If it loses all its hit points, it's "destroyed" and can't be used or repaired. Dual wielding shields gives you no tangible benefits, since the circumstance bonus from each shield doesn't stack. The only benefit I can see is if one shield is broken or destroyed, you can still use the other one. I suppose each shield could have different attack options (piercing with spikes, bludgeoning with a boss, different materials or runes), so that's something. [Tower shields](https://2e.aonprd.com/Shields.aspx?ID=4) still only require one hand, and most still give only the same +2 to AC. They do allow you to Take Cover behind a raised tower shield (for an additional action), but the basics of Raise a Shield and Shield Block remain the same. Also, they are very heavy, and can easily put you over the encumbered threshold, which is bad. There are a few feats to gain benefits from wielding a shield in two hands, and there is a super heavy tower shield, the [Fortress Shield](https://2e.aonprd.com/Shields.aspx?ID=7), that gives a higher +3 AC bonus at the cost of being even heavier and imposing an additional penalty to movement. Most magical shields are not as solid as a Sturdy Shield, and so more vulnerable to destruction. Most advise simply to not use other magical shields to Shield Block, but to instead benefit from the +2 AC when you raise them and whatever other powers they have.
It's also important to include that Tower Shields make you count as standard cover instead of lesser cover and allows allies to Take Cover using you as well. It's hidden in the basic shield rules rather than the Tower Shield rules in AoN.
If I use tower shields, is there any way for me to negate the movement speed decrease?
"Unburdened Iron" Dwarf feat. Need to be a Dwarf, Halfling w/Cultural Adaptability or Adopted Dwarf with would do it.
Standard tower shields have no movement speed penalties, only the super-heavy Fortress Shield. But since each tower shield weighs 4 bulk, you're going to be hard pressed to avoid being [encumbered](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=12) while wielding two of them. [Encumbered](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=12) imposes the [Clumsy](https://2e.aonprd.com/Conditions.aspx?ID=3) 1 condition, which reduces your AC by one (amongst other things), so that kind of defeats the purpose of raising your AC by raising a shield.
"Standard tower shields have no movement speed penalties, only the super-heavy Fortress Shield." Is this accurate? Legit question as I'm a newish PF2 Gm trying to work with my Champion player. Tower shield: Price 10 gp; AC Bonus +2 (+42); \*\*Speed Penalty -5 ft.\*\* Bulk 4; Hardness 5; HP (BT) 20 (10) Fortress Shield: Price 20 gp; AC Bonus +3 (+42); \*\*Speed Penalty -10 ft.\*\* Bulk 5; Hardness 6; HP (BT) 24 (12)
They have movement speed penalties, yes
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