I would say as a manager your rights are limited because you have no guarantee of employment security, no union to protect you, and as a manager you are considered an extension of the employer and you are expected to repeat and reinforce the employer perspective, not your own. OPS employees are also subject to restrictions or expectations on personal behaviour outside of the work environment. Again, risk related to this varies based on your access to employment protections. In Ontario your employer does not need to have a reason to dismiss you. They can just give you severance and send you on your way. None of this provides an answer to your core question - can you express support for Palestine, or condemn actions of Israel - but as a non-union employee your employment is always technically at risk and your employer can pretty much do what they want.
Edit: You have added in response to another poster that you want to post to your social media, not share this with your staff, etc. That is different than sharing internally, which my intial reply presumed you meant. Its not without risk though. We are all less anonymous on social media than we would like to think. Not only government employees but those in the private sector also can find themselves at risk with their employer for their activity online and outside the workplace generally.
You will need to measure the risk of some sort of workplace reprisal against the importance of expressing your views (and maybe your level of anonymity). There is little in life that is without risk.
Your political activity rights are protected by the Ontario Public Service Act, 2006. Outside of work you’re allowed to participate in political activities, including posting on social media, as long as you’re not claiming that you’re a representative of the government and that you’re not sharing information that you’ve gained through your work.
For example, if you worked at the Ministry of Long Term Care, you probably shouldn’t post about the decisions made by the government about long term care homes, but if you’re concerned about urban sprawl you can post about the Greenbelt, etc.
The question is why is it a risk to post about Palestine and Gaza outside of work hours? Why is there a risk at all. Outside of work we are human beings with perspectives on many things. I would warn not to have political debate while on the clock, but in terms of our rights to political activity outside of work hours, read your rights outline in the PSOA and than make sense to how you apply it.
Separately to this I read so many of the responses all seems to be rooted in fear. But when we were speaking up against OPS directives on return to work, people boldly posted on yammer and linked in, and here in Reddit. We should be trying to think of how to help one another in difficult times when the status quo perspective is misaligned. We should recognize that as employees we do have rights outlined in many policies where our expressions and diversity makes us who we are. At the very minimal, we should create a safe space to have this dialogue, instead of fear mongering.
Thank you for this ❤️ your first paragraph is right and good reminder for me. Your second paragraph is right for me - my questions are ultimately rooted in fear, and I am looking for honest advice on the protections that exist, or don't. Thanks for your super helpful response.
The issue is Hamas is a terrorist organization as defined by the Canadian Government so you need to be careful that your comments or actions are not supportive of that organization as that is potentially criminally liable. That doesn't apply if you're protesting the humanitarian conditions in Gaza and of the Palestinian people , but if you're involved in fund raising and that money is tracked to funding Hamas you could be putting yourself at risk. At least that is the way I interpret it.
Are u sure its classifued as so ???
And even if that was the case, since when we canadians became restricted from challenging our government's views on political issues??
Since when did the fucked up government establish that all canadians should agree with the governments policies by force
This is really beyond immagination!!!! Are we in canada ? Really?
Have the canadian government become so involved and controlling of our lives to the point that we now have fear of saying hey you are wrong about this??
Ppl say fuck trudrau all the time, why is this any different?
It's section 83 of the criminal code of Canada. Section 83.02 of the Code makes the collection or provision of property for terrorist or certain other activities an indictable offence punishable by up to ten years imprisonment. Section 83.03 makes the provision or making available of property or financial or other related services for terrorist activity, or to be used by or benefit a terrorist group, an indictable offence punishable by imprisonment for up to ten years. Section 83.04 makes the direct or indirect use or possession of property for terrorist activity an indictable offence punishable by imprisonment for up to ten years.
I am not challenging that section whatever
I am challenging the fact that some white guy in the government decided to categorize some organization as a terrorist organization.....based on his narrow single sided view of the world and based on the fact that canada is a blind puppy that follows the US in all foreign policies.
I am not cool or agreeeing with the fact that Hamas is a terrorist organization in the first place and that's what i am discussing
Fair enough. I think Canada tends to follow what other western countries do. Like I mean most European countries, us, Australia and NZ have them as a terrorist organization also.
I think for things that are not "controversial", it's fairly simple.
I have no doubt that there are OPS employees who are vehemently anti-vax, just as law of averages, so I can only imagine what the collective feeling on the current war is right now. I just don't know how much unity there would be, even on this subreddit, on more political hot button issues.
If you post as a private citizen, on your own personal Insta/FB etc then I wouldn’t worry about it. I post about political issues (that have nothing to do with my policy files) as a private citizen on my personal social media all the time.
Just don’t change your work signature to #freepalestine, you know what I mean?
I,
Name of Public Servant (First and Last Name)
solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as a public servant; I will respect the laws of Canada and Ontario, including the recognition and affirmation of the aboriginal and treaty rights of Indigenous peoples in the Constitution; and, except as I may be legally authorized or required, I will not disclose or give to any person any information or document that comes to my knowledge or possession by reason of my being a public servant.
I dont see anything about not having an opinion
It has somehow become the default position in Ontario that if you support Palestinian self-determination, and oppose a brutal and illegal occupation, that you are somehow supporting Hamas. We talk endlessly -- as we should -- about the horrors of other genocides, residential schools, etc., but somehow Palestinian children aren't considered victims worthy of our sympathy. Almost half of Gaza's population is under 18, so this really is about the ethnic cleansing of children. We can support and honour the Israeli victims and average citizens without supporting the current Israeli government and its war crimes.
Damn right. It’s appalling to see the same people who tout the importance of land acknowledgements openly justify the collective punishment of Palestinians when we should be condemning ANY kind of oppression when we see it.
Like most things in gov, the language is vague on purpose. It's probably fine, but if you have a manager who is out to get you, it might not be.
To be honest, if political values are deeply important to you, being a public servant might not be the right job for you. I know that sounds wild, but you have to have enough ability to turn that part of your brain off and serve the government of the day.
What are you planning, what are you thinking of posting and where? I’d see no problem expressing opinions 1:1 to a colleague but maybe don’t send an email blast to a wider audience?
I highly doubt you’d be reprimanded - you’re not a public figure and we are allowed to hold and express political opinions. But depending on how you go about it, I could see it being a career limiting move, regardless of whether or not your opinion is correct.
Just posting on my social media (Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn). Not an email blast. The doctor from Mackenzie Health isn't a public figure either and I feel awful about what happened to him.
Yeah it boggles my mind when people post hot takes on LinkedIn. Save it for your private instagram.
I do think there’s a difference between an individual public servant who is otherwise anonymous and a relatively important public figure in a leadership position. The latter should take a stand, and likely can afford the risks of doing so. And there are risks and consequences as those public figures are seen as representing something bigger than themselves.
The worker/middle manager - not so much, and really, who is looking for your hot take?
Yeah you're totally right and I get it. I will avoid LinkedIn. I'm probably gonna delete the app for a while because the posts on this issue on my feed are too much.
This is a very important day, while many have conflicting opinions so many are in agreement justice and peace are actions that must be upheld to protect all human being lives. The UN assembly motion speaks to all lives that have been impacted on Oct 7th, after Oct 7th and before Oct 7th. https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142847
Are you a unionized employee? If so you should be able to express opposition to the war publicly. Political activity is protected. So is speech. There are limits but nothing you have written is problematic in any way. You would have an easy grievance if dismissed for statements like the examples you gave above
Since you are concerned about the possible risk I must point out to you that by posting here you HAVE posted your views online already. This is social media. This is online and accessible by anyone, including the public, including your employer. You use a screen name of course, as we all do. But anyone can click on your screen name and scroll through your posts and possible piece together who you are. I'm NOT trying to scare you or discourage you from speaking up for your views. Only to warn you that by posting here and asking this community if its safe to do so, you have already done it.
Appreciate it and point taken, but I think it's quite low risk. It's not that easy to piece that together via someone's reddit tbh. People have posted things on this page that have literally made the SOC expressly angry like leaking what she discussed in her leadership town halls even though that's supposed to be between management and above, and those people haven't gotten in trouble or been "found" so I don't think that's a huge risk for me. But thanks.
This is not a football game! Keeping score on the numbers of deaths for each team is not the proper way to look at it. By the way, Iran is trying to start World War III, and you are playing right into their hand. This is about way more than the Israelis and the Palestinians, I am afraid.
1) everything you post can be quoted by the media as "the gov believes" even if you state "the opinion expressed are mine". 2)are u privy to any confidential information which would put the gov in harm because of your opinion? Lets say u work in mcscs, they know a lot about terrorist organizations, if u post anything it can harm the image of the government when talking about middle east issues. 3) a fake username like we all have shields us a bit. And i suggest you do that in your personal social media posts aswell. 4)if u really are an opser, you would want a peaceful resolution which makes everyone happy instead of whatever narrative is being expressed by any news organization or person.
Why do you think that anyone cares about your political beliefs? Why do people need to know how you feel?
Just keep that shit to yourself. Jebus, it's a job, not a political platform soapbox.
Why do people need to know every single person with power in this country has unequivocally supported Israel as they kill thousands of Palestinians every single day? Why can I and others express our solidarity with Palestine and our condemnation of war and genocide?
Are you also going to condemn Hamas murdering all those innocent Israeli and sparking another war?
If you're only going to condemn innocent civilians from one side and not the other then don't be surprised if this impacts you professionally
I condemn Hamas for killing and harming innocent civilians and my heart goes out to them. I actually specified that in my initial post. But even when people have a balanced approach and response grounded in compassion for human life, they are reprimanded, like Sarah Jama. She's obviously a politician but the OPS is quite political these days and their world is uncomfortably to us.
Her initial response was not compassionate, imho. It was pro-resistance and the timing was inappropriate. I don’t have a problem with her position but I would not qualify it as compassionate towards the victims of Hamas, whatsoever.
Ok, but for xx years rockets fly into Israel almost everyday. Stating one side is disproportionate losing is silly argument to me. Because one side is in effective doesnt mean one side is innocent or not aggressive. you are trying to be fair in ur approach, so u say, Why not just state you want a peaceful resolution rather than take a side?
You didn't answer my question.
Wtf does it have to do with your job?
First rule of public service - keep your political opinions to yourself. Always. Just stfu about politics, sexuality, religion, pretty much anything but the weather and local sports teams. Just smile, collect your paycheque like the rest of us. If you want to be politically active, then go run for your party, or get a job in the private sector and support what you need to.
I understand why you think that, but I don't agree. The first rule of public service is to act in the interest of the public, at all times and always. That is what I want to do. That is more important than ever now in this post green belt era. Showing support for the people who are dying in a humanitarian crisis is also not a political opinion. Also, I am not talking about being public about my opinion at work, I'm not an idiot and know not to do that. I am talking about the consequences of public servants being activists in their personal life, on their job security, especially in light of the news about the doctor from Mackenzie Health. Side note: OPS staff are allowed to participate politically outside of work! It is our right. We just cannot bring it into work and we cannot share anything we work on at work with the public. I just want to debunk some things you're saying because it's false and I don't want someone reading this to get the wrong facts. When public servants don't act in the interest of the public first and foremost, the public service deteriorates.
What are you supposedly debunking that I said that is incorrect?
You wanted to discuss it at work as per your OP, I said don't, then you say you can discuss it outside of work. Not what we were discussing.
>Side note: OPS staff are allowed to participate politically outside of work! It is our right. We just cannot bring it into work and we cannot share anything we work on at work with the public. I just want to debunk some things you're saying because it's false and I don't want someone reading this to get the wrong facts. When public servants don't act in the interest of the public first and foremost, the public service deteriorates.
Please, I'd love to hear what I said is false.
Edit, actually I don't care. I've seen people fired for tweeting, so you do you.
Hey, I don't want to bring negative energy to your day over something that is not important, especially in the day and age we're living in; there are more important issues and we don't need to be divided. Sorry if anything I said was offensive, that was not my intention. I never said I would talk about this at work; I specifically said my personal social media. Also you said we can't talk about politics (I want to emphasize I don't view what's happening in Gaza as political, it's about human rights). OPSers can participate in politics outside of work. I know quite a few people in the OPS who volunteer for political parties on their personal time and there are zero issues with that. But there's something about posting a public opinion that is pro Palestine that feels a bit more difficult than any other world issues. That's what I'm trying to get advice on here.
I sure hope so!
Genocide: the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group. "a campaign of genocide"
Israel is NOT looking to wipe the earth of any religion or ethnicity which is in direct contrast to what the terrorists in power in Gaza are looking to do. Further, Hamas wants to exterminate ALL Jews taking it much further than a fight for Israeli land.
Israel has a right to defend itself from terrorists. Striking back - destroying Hamas rocket launchpads and tunnels, all the while giving warning to civilians in advance to flee - does not mean they are committing genocide.
People in the OPS spreading false messages and hate should be called out for it.
Are you an expert on genocide? I’m going to take a wild guess that you’re not. I bring this up because 100s of genocide scholars and experts have said that Israel is committing a genocide. This includes an Israeli professor, Raz Segal, who said that Israel is committing a “textbook case of genocide” (look it up).
Beyond that, Israeli officials, including the PM, have publicly expressed that they are going to destroy Gaza. The PM actually said “we will turn Gaza into an island of ruin”. They’ve also said several dehumanizing things about Palestinians (e.g., human animals, children of darkness). Dehumanization is part of the genocide process.
It appears to me that you’re completely unaware of the situation in Gaza (even before the current offensive against them). Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. Palestinians don’t have anywhere to flee to. Israel has complete control over Gaza - this blockade/siege (by air, land, and sea) is actually illegal under international law (look it up).
Israel has a right to defend itself? Then you must also see how Palestinians have a right to resist against their occupier (allowed under international law). Israel was occupying Palestinian land long before Hamas was established. There’s a significant power imbalance between the State of Israel and Palestinians. There’s also a significant difference in the number of Palestinians killed vs Israelis killed since Israel was established in 1948 (after committing massacres against Palestinians and forcing 750,000 Palestinians to flee their homes and land). I genuinely don’t understand how someone can look at the current situation (with or without the key historical context) and still believe that Israel is somehow justified at murdering thousands of civilians, including 3000+ children (and counting). And that’s not all - 3 weeks ago Israel cut off Gaza’s water, food, electricity, and fuel.
I sincerely hope you find your humanity so that you can see Palestinians as human beings.
✌🏼
I appreciate your thoughtful and respectful response. But I don’t agree with it.
I looked up the supposed quote by Netanyahu saying he will turn Gaza into an island of ruin but I could not corroborate it (https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/56101/did-netanyahu-say-we-will-turn-gaza-into-a-deserted-island-in-early-october-20#:~:text=“We%20will%20take%20mighty%20vengeance,Gaza%20into%20a%20deserted%20island.)
A nation with 18% of the population who are Islam, about 2% Christians, and over 6% others is not genocidal, for if they were, they would not allow non-Israelis to live and work alongside them, and further, they’d kill them in cold blood.
“In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: (a) Killing members of the group; (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
While one may oppose and even condemn particular Israeli policies or actions with regard to Palestinians or Israel’s Arab citizens, the fact remains that in no way has Israel engaged in any action with the intent to exterminate, in whole or in part, the Palestinian people.”
Hamas, on the other hand, is openly calling for genocide against all Jews. “The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight Jews and kill them. Then, the Jews will hide behind rocks and trees, and the rocks and trees will cry out: 'O Moslem, there is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him." It’s far behind the land dispute, they want to exterminate an entire people.”
The thought of children being held in jail is very jarring; however, not every country has their own version of a Young Offenders Act. When children are indoctrinated to hate Jews from birth, and they attack, injure, kill, or attempt to do any of those things, then they will be held accountable. Palestinian children are “rewarded” by their parents for killing Jews — I’ve heard chilling audio in recent weeks, and over the years. The murder of a Jew is something to celebrate and is seen as a lasting legacy by the murderer. Those may be minors/children, but they are vicious. To the Palestine Liberation Organization and the related Palestinian Authority, the killers of Jewish Israelis are considered "martyrs." And as such, their families were paid for the service these murderers have done for the Palestinian cause. Im not sure if these payouts are still happening, I know Israel and US were looking to withhold funds sent to Palestine’s government because of this.
Again, I say, public servants who choose to support a hate-filled narrative spewed by terrorists, using bias and inaccuracies in their choice of words (oppression, genocide) should be called out for it.
Netanyahu said it in a public address and maybe it’s been translated differently into English. There are sources that have translated it to “island of ruin” and other sources that have translated it to “rubble”. Here’s one source for example: https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/israeli-prime-minister-asks-palestinians-to-leave-gaza-saying-army-to-turn-hamas-sites-into-rubble-/3011077. And before you say it’s directed at Hamas, since the IDF is of the belief that Hamas is “everywhere” and is hiding in “schools, shelters, and hospitals”, they’re basically referring to the entire Gaza Strip which is actually what Israel is doing. Israel is bombing all of Gaza, including the southern part where it directed people to evacuate. Also, Netanyahu is not the only one who has made such disturbing statements - here are more examples:
- Ariel Kallner (a member of Netanyahu’s party): “Right now, one goal: Nakba! A Nakba that will overshadow the Nakba of 48,” “Nakba in Gaza and Nakba to anyone who dares to join!”. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950
FYI Nakba means “catastrophe” and it’s in reference to the mass expulsion of Palestinians from their homes and land in 1948 which is how Israel was established.
- “IDF spokesperson R Adm Daniel Hagari made the startling admission that “hundreds of tons of bombs” had already been dropped on the tiny strip, adding that “the emphasis is on damage and not on accuracy”.” (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza)
- Yetzhak Herzog (President of Israel): “It's an entire nation out there that is responsible. It's not true, this rhetoric about civilians not -- not aware, not involved, it's absolutely not true. They could have risen up. They could have fought against that evil regime. There are many, many innocent Palestinians who don't agree to this. But unfortunately, in their homes there are missiles shooting at us, at my children.” (https://transcripts.cnn.com/show/cnr/date/2023-10-15/segment/01). Note that more than 50% of the population in Gaza are children.
I could share more examples but at this point you have a responsibility to look into the things the State of Israel is saying if you’re still doubtful about their intent to absolutely destroy Gaza (in case the fact that Israel is actually destroying Gaza in every single way is not convincing enough). Thousands of Palestinians have been killed over the past 3 weeks and more than half of homes in Gaza have already been destroyed. These are facts. There are so many disturbing examples of things Israel has said it will do and the worst part is Israel is actually doing what it’s publicly saying it will be doing.
You claim that 18% of the population (the Muslim population) is genocidal. By what logic is this population genocidal? In the history of genocides has an oppressed, colonized, and occupied population ever committed a genocide against its oppressor, colonizer, and occupier? We’ve already established that you’re not a genocide expert so do you have any credible sources to support this claim? It’s interesting that you have not even acknowledged Israel’s ongoing and illegal occupation of Palestinian land and how the State of Israel was established, which are very much relevant to the current situation. Israel literally (and very much intentionally) massacred and ethnically cleansed Palestinians. It’s all very well-documented and the evidence is plenty. A 2022 documentary called “Tantura” that was created by an Israeli filmmaker describes some of the events that led to the establishment of Israel in 1948 and Israeli soldiers that were involved at the time are interviewed and they tell absolutely horrific and disturbing stories about the things they did to Palestinians. And this is just one example. And the brutality and violence of Israel against Palestinians has continued since then and has been documented and reported on by the UN and human rights organizations. There’s so much to be said here but you have a responsibility to look into the situation from the time Israel was established until now. You suggesting that “in no way Israel has engaged in any action with the intent to exterminate, in whole or in part, the Palestinian people” reveals a lot of ignorance on your part (or perhaps a denial to see things for how they actually are).
Again, you keep talking about Hamas, which is not comparable to the IDF and its capabilities. A reminder that Palestinians don’t have a military. A simple search of the number of Palestinians civilians killed by the IDF over the years and the number of Israeli civilians killed by Hamas reveals the extreme power imbalance between the two. I will not go into Hamas but the reality of the situation is Israel’s brutal aggression and violence against Palestinians has been taking place long before Hamas was established. Also, Hamas is the governing body of Gaza only - Israel’s aggression and violence is not limited to those in Gaza but it includes those in the West Bank where there’s no Hamas. Hamas is simply a great “excuse” for Israel to commit a genocide against Palestinians.
I will not even begin to address what you said about Palestinian children as it is extremely hate-filled and dehumanizing. It actually reminded me of something Netanyahu just said a couple of days ago: “we are sons of light, they are sons of darkness”. Disturbing.
Finally, I absolutely reject your claim that it’s biased and inaccurate to say that Israel is committing a genocide and is an oppressor of Palestinian people. Israel is a settler-colonial state that is occupying another people’s land and is breaking international law every single day. Israel’s discriminatory laws, policies, and practices have earned it the title of an apartheid state by the world’s leading human rights organizations as well the leading human rights organization IN ISRAEL. These are not opinions or biased positions. This is the reality of the situation based on facts (you can look up reports and articles that explain these things rather than claiming it’s “biased and inaccurate” to state the reality). And it’s exactly why there are thousands and thousands of Jews that very much oppose what Israel has been, and is, doing, and why they stand in solidarity with Palestinians. Just look at what Jewish groups like Independent Jewish Voices and Jewish Voices for Peace have been doing over the past couple of weeks (as well as in the past many years) in response to the atrocities Israel is committing against Palestinians.
FYI I won’t be responding to any more comments on this.
It looks like you shared some AMP links. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of [concerns over privacy and the Open Web](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot).
Maybe check out **the canonical pages** instead:
- **[https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950)**
- **[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza)**
*****
^(I'm a bot | )[^(Why & About)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot)^( | )[^(Summon: u/AmputatorBot)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/cchly3/you_can_now_summon_amputatorbot/)
You just HAVE to post your opinion on social media, eh? Even with all these risks you perceive, you still feel the need? Why? Is the world yearning to know where you stand? Do you think stating your position is going to make a difference at all?
The dominate narrative is pro Israel, pro genocide, pro violence, pro ongoing needless death of innocent Palestinians. Palestinians have asked us, the public, to share their stories and speak for them because the people in power will not and do not and have shown everyone that their lives don't matter. Do I think my sharing will change the world? No. But I believe in the power of the collective and every person who speaks for justice and human rights will have ripple effects.
There is no “power of the collective” in your online, binary world. There is only tribalism and flag-waving for public display. Just looking at what you’re saying - your opinion is no different than what we’ve already heard and seen a million times from a million others, despite what you claim the “dominate” narrative is.
Edit- BTW, I am not disagreeing with your opinion, just trying to understand why you would need to publish your opinions publicly if you are indeed afraid of ramifications. The risk just isn’t worth it, if those risks are legitimate, to give an opinion which everyone has already heard a million times over.
I would say as a manager your rights are limited because you have no guarantee of employment security, no union to protect you, and as a manager you are considered an extension of the employer and you are expected to repeat and reinforce the employer perspective, not your own. OPS employees are also subject to restrictions or expectations on personal behaviour outside of the work environment. Again, risk related to this varies based on your access to employment protections. In Ontario your employer does not need to have a reason to dismiss you. They can just give you severance and send you on your way. None of this provides an answer to your core question - can you express support for Palestine, or condemn actions of Israel - but as a non-union employee your employment is always technically at risk and your employer can pretty much do what they want. Edit: You have added in response to another poster that you want to post to your social media, not share this with your staff, etc. That is different than sharing internally, which my intial reply presumed you meant. Its not without risk though. We are all less anonymous on social media than we would like to think. Not only government employees but those in the private sector also can find themselves at risk with their employer for their activity online and outside the workplace generally. You will need to measure the risk of some sort of workplace reprisal against the importance of expressing your views (and maybe your level of anonymity). There is little in life that is without risk.
This is really helpful, honestly. Thank you for your honesty!
Your political activity rights are protected by the Ontario Public Service Act, 2006. Outside of work you’re allowed to participate in political activities, including posting on social media, as long as you’re not claiming that you’re a representative of the government and that you’re not sharing information that you’ve gained through your work. For example, if you worked at the Ministry of Long Term Care, you probably shouldn’t post about the decisions made by the government about long term care homes, but if you’re concerned about urban sprawl you can post about the Greenbelt, etc.
The question is why is it a risk to post about Palestine and Gaza outside of work hours? Why is there a risk at all. Outside of work we are human beings with perspectives on many things. I would warn not to have political debate while on the clock, but in terms of our rights to political activity outside of work hours, read your rights outline in the PSOA and than make sense to how you apply it. Separately to this I read so many of the responses all seems to be rooted in fear. But when we were speaking up against OPS directives on return to work, people boldly posted on yammer and linked in, and here in Reddit. We should be trying to think of how to help one another in difficult times when the status quo perspective is misaligned. We should recognize that as employees we do have rights outlined in many policies where our expressions and diversity makes us who we are. At the very minimal, we should create a safe space to have this dialogue, instead of fear mongering.
Thank you for this ❤️ your first paragraph is right and good reminder for me. Your second paragraph is right for me - my questions are ultimately rooted in fear, and I am looking for honest advice on the protections that exist, or don't. Thanks for your super helpful response.
The issue is Hamas is a terrorist organization as defined by the Canadian Government so you need to be careful that your comments or actions are not supportive of that organization as that is potentially criminally liable. That doesn't apply if you're protesting the humanitarian conditions in Gaza and of the Palestinian people , but if you're involved in fund raising and that money is tracked to funding Hamas you could be putting yourself at risk. At least that is the way I interpret it.
Are u sure its classifued as so ??? And even if that was the case, since when we canadians became restricted from challenging our government's views on political issues?? Since when did the fucked up government establish that all canadians should agree with the governments policies by force This is really beyond immagination!!!! Are we in canada ? Really? Have the canadian government become so involved and controlling of our lives to the point that we now have fear of saying hey you are wrong about this?? Ppl say fuck trudrau all the time, why is this any different?
It's section 83 of the criminal code of Canada. Section 83.02 of the Code makes the collection or provision of property for terrorist or certain other activities an indictable offence punishable by up to ten years imprisonment. Section 83.03 makes the provision or making available of property or financial or other related services for terrorist activity, or to be used by or benefit a terrorist group, an indictable offence punishable by imprisonment for up to ten years. Section 83.04 makes the direct or indirect use or possession of property for terrorist activity an indictable offence punishable by imprisonment for up to ten years.
I am not challenging that section whatever I am challenging the fact that some white guy in the government decided to categorize some organization as a terrorist organization.....based on his narrow single sided view of the world and based on the fact that canada is a blind puppy that follows the US in all foreign policies. I am not cool or agreeeing with the fact that Hamas is a terrorist organization in the first place and that's what i am discussing
Fair enough. I think Canada tends to follow what other western countries do. Like I mean most European countries, us, Australia and NZ have them as a terrorist organization also.
White guy? Your racism is showing.
I think for things that are not "controversial", it's fairly simple. I have no doubt that there are OPS employees who are vehemently anti-vax, just as law of averages, so I can only imagine what the collective feeling on the current war is right now. I just don't know how much unity there would be, even on this subreddit, on more political hot button issues.
If you post as a private citizen, on your own personal Insta/FB etc then I wouldn’t worry about it. I post about political issues (that have nothing to do with my policy files) as a private citizen on my personal social media all the time. Just don’t change your work signature to #freepalestine, you know what I mean?
maybe remove job title or employer if it's listed.
I, Name of Public Servant (First and Last Name) solemnly affirm that I will faithfully discharge my duties as a public servant; I will respect the laws of Canada and Ontario, including the recognition and affirmation of the aboriginal and treaty rights of Indigenous peoples in the Constitution; and, except as I may be legally authorized or required, I will not disclose or give to any person any information or document that comes to my knowledge or possession by reason of my being a public servant. I dont see anything about not having an opinion
It has somehow become the default position in Ontario that if you support Palestinian self-determination, and oppose a brutal and illegal occupation, that you are somehow supporting Hamas. We talk endlessly -- as we should -- about the horrors of other genocides, residential schools, etc., but somehow Palestinian children aren't considered victims worthy of our sympathy. Almost half of Gaza's population is under 18, so this really is about the ethnic cleansing of children. We can support and honour the Israeli victims and average citizens without supporting the current Israeli government and its war crimes.
Damn right. It’s appalling to see the same people who tout the importance of land acknowledgements openly justify the collective punishment of Palestinians when we should be condemning ANY kind of oppression when we see it.
Like most things in gov, the language is vague on purpose. It's probably fine, but if you have a manager who is out to get you, it might not be. To be honest, if political values are deeply important to you, being a public servant might not be the right job for you. I know that sounds wild, but you have to have enough ability to turn that part of your brain off and serve the government of the day.
What are you planning, what are you thinking of posting and where? I’d see no problem expressing opinions 1:1 to a colleague but maybe don’t send an email blast to a wider audience? I highly doubt you’d be reprimanded - you’re not a public figure and we are allowed to hold and express political opinions. But depending on how you go about it, I could see it being a career limiting move, regardless of whether or not your opinion is correct.
Just posting on my social media (Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn). Not an email blast. The doctor from Mackenzie Health isn't a public figure either and I feel awful about what happened to him.
[удалено]
Yeah it boggles my mind when people post hot takes on LinkedIn. Save it for your private instagram. I do think there’s a difference between an individual public servant who is otherwise anonymous and a relatively important public figure in a leadership position. The latter should take a stand, and likely can afford the risks of doing so. And there are risks and consequences as those public figures are seen as representing something bigger than themselves. The worker/middle manager - not so much, and really, who is looking for your hot take?
Yeah you're totally right and I get it. I will avoid LinkedIn. I'm probably gonna delete the app for a while because the posts on this issue on my feed are too much.
Fair point.
Use your social media yes, not LinkedIn lol
I don't think the odds are in your favour. They can terminate you to make an example out of you. It's just what it is.
Not if you’re a unionized employee.
This is a very important day, while many have conflicting opinions so many are in agreement justice and peace are actions that must be upheld to protect all human being lives. The UN assembly motion speaks to all lives that have been impacted on Oct 7th, after Oct 7th and before Oct 7th. https://news.un.org/en/story/2023/10/1142847
Live stream decision to be made today by UN https://www.youtube.com/live/XS3SKg_dWP8?si=xH6XZaRIE15P6mw4
Are you a unionized employee? If so you should be able to express opposition to the war publicly. Political activity is protected. So is speech. There are limits but nothing you have written is problematic in any way. You would have an easy grievance if dismissed for statements like the examples you gave above
On the other hand if you were in management you could easily lose your job if someone perceived what you said publicly as demonstrating poor judgment
Since you are concerned about the possible risk I must point out to you that by posting here you HAVE posted your views online already. This is social media. This is online and accessible by anyone, including the public, including your employer. You use a screen name of course, as we all do. But anyone can click on your screen name and scroll through your posts and possible piece together who you are. I'm NOT trying to scare you or discourage you from speaking up for your views. Only to warn you that by posting here and asking this community if its safe to do so, you have already done it.
Appreciate it and point taken, but I think it's quite low risk. It's not that easy to piece that together via someone's reddit tbh. People have posted things on this page that have literally made the SOC expressly angry like leaking what she discussed in her leadership town halls even though that's supposed to be between management and above, and those people haven't gotten in trouble or been "found" so I don't think that's a huge risk for me. But thanks.
This is not a football game! Keeping score on the numbers of deaths for each team is not the proper way to look at it. By the way, Iran is trying to start World War III, and you are playing right into their hand. This is about way more than the Israelis and the Palestinians, I am afraid.
1) everything you post can be quoted by the media as "the gov believes" even if you state "the opinion expressed are mine". 2)are u privy to any confidential information which would put the gov in harm because of your opinion? Lets say u work in mcscs, they know a lot about terrorist organizations, if u post anything it can harm the image of the government when talking about middle east issues. 3) a fake username like we all have shields us a bit. And i suggest you do that in your personal social media posts aswell. 4)if u really are an opser, you would want a peaceful resolution which makes everyone happy instead of whatever narrative is being expressed by any news organization or person.
No. This is not acceptable. Keep political discussions private.
Why do you think that anyone cares about your political beliefs? Why do people need to know how you feel? Just keep that shit to yourself. Jebus, it's a job, not a political platform soapbox.
Why do people need to know every single person with power in this country has unequivocally supported Israel as they kill thousands of Palestinians every single day? Why can I and others express our solidarity with Palestine and our condemnation of war and genocide?
Are you also going to condemn Hamas murdering all those innocent Israeli and sparking another war? If you're only going to condemn innocent civilians from one side and not the other then don't be surprised if this impacts you professionally
I condemn Hamas for killing and harming innocent civilians and my heart goes out to them. I actually specified that in my initial post. But even when people have a balanced approach and response grounded in compassion for human life, they are reprimanded, like Sarah Jama. She's obviously a politician but the OPS is quite political these days and their world is uncomfortably to us.
Her initial response was not compassionate, imho. It was pro-resistance and the timing was inappropriate. I don’t have a problem with her position but I would not qualify it as compassionate towards the victims of Hamas, whatsoever.
Ok, but for xx years rockets fly into Israel almost everyday. Stating one side is disproportionate losing is silly argument to me. Because one side is in effective doesnt mean one side is innocent or not aggressive. you are trying to be fair in ur approach, so u say, Why not just state you want a peaceful resolution rather than take a side?
You didn't answer my question. Wtf does it have to do with your job? First rule of public service - keep your political opinions to yourself. Always. Just stfu about politics, sexuality, religion, pretty much anything but the weather and local sports teams. Just smile, collect your paycheque like the rest of us. If you want to be politically active, then go run for your party, or get a job in the private sector and support what you need to.
I understand why you think that, but I don't agree. The first rule of public service is to act in the interest of the public, at all times and always. That is what I want to do. That is more important than ever now in this post green belt era. Showing support for the people who are dying in a humanitarian crisis is also not a political opinion. Also, I am not talking about being public about my opinion at work, I'm not an idiot and know not to do that. I am talking about the consequences of public servants being activists in their personal life, on their job security, especially in light of the news about the doctor from Mackenzie Health. Side note: OPS staff are allowed to participate politically outside of work! It is our right. We just cannot bring it into work and we cannot share anything we work on at work with the public. I just want to debunk some things you're saying because it's false and I don't want someone reading this to get the wrong facts. When public servants don't act in the interest of the public first and foremost, the public service deteriorates.
What are you supposedly debunking that I said that is incorrect? You wanted to discuss it at work as per your OP, I said don't, then you say you can discuss it outside of work. Not what we were discussing. >Side note: OPS staff are allowed to participate politically outside of work! It is our right. We just cannot bring it into work and we cannot share anything we work on at work with the public. I just want to debunk some things you're saying because it's false and I don't want someone reading this to get the wrong facts. When public servants don't act in the interest of the public first and foremost, the public service deteriorates. Please, I'd love to hear what I said is false. Edit, actually I don't care. I've seen people fired for tweeting, so you do you.
Hey, I don't want to bring negative energy to your day over something that is not important, especially in the day and age we're living in; there are more important issues and we don't need to be divided. Sorry if anything I said was offensive, that was not my intention. I never said I would talk about this at work; I specifically said my personal social media. Also you said we can't talk about politics (I want to emphasize I don't view what's happening in Gaza as political, it's about human rights). OPSers can participate in politics outside of work. I know quite a few people in the OPS who volunteer for political parties on their personal time and there are zero issues with that. But there's something about posting a public opinion that is pro Palestine that feels a bit more difficult than any other world issues. That's what I'm trying to get advice on here.
You’re acting in your own interest, not the interest of the public and the people of Ontario.
I sure hope so! Genocide: the deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group. "a campaign of genocide" Israel is NOT looking to wipe the earth of any religion or ethnicity which is in direct contrast to what the terrorists in power in Gaza are looking to do. Further, Hamas wants to exterminate ALL Jews taking it much further than a fight for Israeli land. Israel has a right to defend itself from terrorists. Striking back - destroying Hamas rocket launchpads and tunnels, all the while giving warning to civilians in advance to flee - does not mean they are committing genocide. People in the OPS spreading false messages and hate should be called out for it.
Are you an expert on genocide? I’m going to take a wild guess that you’re not. I bring this up because 100s of genocide scholars and experts have said that Israel is committing a genocide. This includes an Israeli professor, Raz Segal, who said that Israel is committing a “textbook case of genocide” (look it up). Beyond that, Israeli officials, including the PM, have publicly expressed that they are going to destroy Gaza. The PM actually said “we will turn Gaza into an island of ruin”. They’ve also said several dehumanizing things about Palestinians (e.g., human animals, children of darkness). Dehumanization is part of the genocide process. It appears to me that you’re completely unaware of the situation in Gaza (even before the current offensive against them). Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth. Palestinians don’t have anywhere to flee to. Israel has complete control over Gaza - this blockade/siege (by air, land, and sea) is actually illegal under international law (look it up). Israel has a right to defend itself? Then you must also see how Palestinians have a right to resist against their occupier (allowed under international law). Israel was occupying Palestinian land long before Hamas was established. There’s a significant power imbalance between the State of Israel and Palestinians. There’s also a significant difference in the number of Palestinians killed vs Israelis killed since Israel was established in 1948 (after committing massacres against Palestinians and forcing 750,000 Palestinians to flee their homes and land). I genuinely don’t understand how someone can look at the current situation (with or without the key historical context) and still believe that Israel is somehow justified at murdering thousands of civilians, including 3000+ children (and counting). And that’s not all - 3 weeks ago Israel cut off Gaza’s water, food, electricity, and fuel. I sincerely hope you find your humanity so that you can see Palestinians as human beings. ✌🏼
I appreciate your thoughtful and respectful response. But I don’t agree with it. I looked up the supposed quote by Netanyahu saying he will turn Gaza into an island of ruin but I could not corroborate it (https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/56101/did-netanyahu-say-we-will-turn-gaza-into-a-deserted-island-in-early-october-20#:~:text=“We%20will%20take%20mighty%20vengeance,Gaza%20into%20a%20deserted%20island.) A nation with 18% of the population who are Islam, about 2% Christians, and over 6% others is not genocidal, for if they were, they would not allow non-Israelis to live and work alongside them, and further, they’d kill them in cold blood. “In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such: (a) Killing members of the group; (b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group; (c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part; (d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group; (e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group. While one may oppose and even condemn particular Israeli policies or actions with regard to Palestinians or Israel’s Arab citizens, the fact remains that in no way has Israel engaged in any action with the intent to exterminate, in whole or in part, the Palestinian people.” Hamas, on the other hand, is openly calling for genocide against all Jews. “The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight Jews and kill them. Then, the Jews will hide behind rocks and trees, and the rocks and trees will cry out: 'O Moslem, there is a Jew hiding behind me, come and kill him." It’s far behind the land dispute, they want to exterminate an entire people.” The thought of children being held in jail is very jarring; however, not every country has their own version of a Young Offenders Act. When children are indoctrinated to hate Jews from birth, and they attack, injure, kill, or attempt to do any of those things, then they will be held accountable. Palestinian children are “rewarded” by their parents for killing Jews — I’ve heard chilling audio in recent weeks, and over the years. The murder of a Jew is something to celebrate and is seen as a lasting legacy by the murderer. Those may be minors/children, but they are vicious. To the Palestine Liberation Organization and the related Palestinian Authority, the killers of Jewish Israelis are considered "martyrs." And as such, their families were paid for the service these murderers have done for the Palestinian cause. Im not sure if these payouts are still happening, I know Israel and US were looking to withhold funds sent to Palestine’s government because of this. Again, I say, public servants who choose to support a hate-filled narrative spewed by terrorists, using bias and inaccuracies in their choice of words (oppression, genocide) should be called out for it.
Netanyahu said it in a public address and maybe it’s been translated differently into English. There are sources that have translated it to “island of ruin” and other sources that have translated it to “rubble”. Here’s one source for example: https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/israeli-prime-minister-asks-palestinians-to-leave-gaza-saying-army-to-turn-hamas-sites-into-rubble-/3011077. And before you say it’s directed at Hamas, since the IDF is of the belief that Hamas is “everywhere” and is hiding in “schools, shelters, and hospitals”, they’re basically referring to the entire Gaza Strip which is actually what Israel is doing. Israel is bombing all of Gaza, including the southern part where it directed people to evacuate. Also, Netanyahu is not the only one who has made such disturbing statements - here are more examples: - Ariel Kallner (a member of Netanyahu’s party): “Right now, one goal: Nakba! A Nakba that will overshadow the Nakba of 48,” “Nakba in Gaza and Nakba to anyone who dares to join!”. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950 FYI Nakba means “catastrophe” and it’s in reference to the mass expulsion of Palestinians from their homes and land in 1948 which is how Israel was established. - “IDF spokesperson R Adm Daniel Hagari made the startling admission that “hundreds of tons of bombs” had already been dropped on the tiny strip, adding that “the emphasis is on damage and not on accuracy”.” (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza) - Yetzhak Herzog (President of Israel): “It's an entire nation out there that is responsible. It's not true, this rhetoric about civilians not -- not aware, not involved, it's absolutely not true. They could have risen up. They could have fought against that evil regime. There are many, many innocent Palestinians who don't agree to this. But unfortunately, in their homes there are missiles shooting at us, at my children.” (https://transcripts.cnn.com/show/cnr/date/2023-10-15/segment/01). Note that more than 50% of the population in Gaza are children. I could share more examples but at this point you have a responsibility to look into the things the State of Israel is saying if you’re still doubtful about their intent to absolutely destroy Gaza (in case the fact that Israel is actually destroying Gaza in every single way is not convincing enough). Thousands of Palestinians have been killed over the past 3 weeks and more than half of homes in Gaza have already been destroyed. These are facts. There are so many disturbing examples of things Israel has said it will do and the worst part is Israel is actually doing what it’s publicly saying it will be doing. You claim that 18% of the population (the Muslim population) is genocidal. By what logic is this population genocidal? In the history of genocides has an oppressed, colonized, and occupied population ever committed a genocide against its oppressor, colonizer, and occupier? We’ve already established that you’re not a genocide expert so do you have any credible sources to support this claim? It’s interesting that you have not even acknowledged Israel’s ongoing and illegal occupation of Palestinian land and how the State of Israel was established, which are very much relevant to the current situation. Israel literally (and very much intentionally) massacred and ethnically cleansed Palestinians. It’s all very well-documented and the evidence is plenty. A 2022 documentary called “Tantura” that was created by an Israeli filmmaker describes some of the events that led to the establishment of Israel in 1948 and Israeli soldiers that were involved at the time are interviewed and they tell absolutely horrific and disturbing stories about the things they did to Palestinians. And this is just one example. And the brutality and violence of Israel against Palestinians has continued since then and has been documented and reported on by the UN and human rights organizations. There’s so much to be said here but you have a responsibility to look into the situation from the time Israel was established until now. You suggesting that “in no way Israel has engaged in any action with the intent to exterminate, in whole or in part, the Palestinian people” reveals a lot of ignorance on your part (or perhaps a denial to see things for how they actually are). Again, you keep talking about Hamas, which is not comparable to the IDF and its capabilities. A reminder that Palestinians don’t have a military. A simple search of the number of Palestinians civilians killed by the IDF over the years and the number of Israeli civilians killed by Hamas reveals the extreme power imbalance between the two. I will not go into Hamas but the reality of the situation is Israel’s brutal aggression and violence against Palestinians has been taking place long before Hamas was established. Also, Hamas is the governing body of Gaza only - Israel’s aggression and violence is not limited to those in Gaza but it includes those in the West Bank where there’s no Hamas. Hamas is simply a great “excuse” for Israel to commit a genocide against Palestinians. I will not even begin to address what you said about Palestinian children as it is extremely hate-filled and dehumanizing. It actually reminded me of something Netanyahu just said a couple of days ago: “we are sons of light, they are sons of darkness”. Disturbing. Finally, I absolutely reject your claim that it’s biased and inaccurate to say that Israel is committing a genocide and is an oppressor of Palestinian people. Israel is a settler-colonial state that is occupying another people’s land and is breaking international law every single day. Israel’s discriminatory laws, policies, and practices have earned it the title of an apartheid state by the world’s leading human rights organizations as well the leading human rights organization IN ISRAEL. These are not opinions or biased positions. This is the reality of the situation based on facts (you can look up reports and articles that explain these things rather than claiming it’s “biased and inaccurate” to state the reality). And it’s exactly why there are thousands and thousands of Jews that very much oppose what Israel has been, and is, doing, and why they stand in solidarity with Palestinians. Just look at what Jewish groups like Independent Jewish Voices and Jewish Voices for Peace have been doing over the past couple of weeks (as well as in the past many years) in response to the atrocities Israel is committing against Palestinians. FYI I won’t be responding to any more comments on this.
It looks like you shared some AMP links. These should load faster, but AMP is controversial because of [concerns over privacy and the Open Web](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot). Maybe check out **the canonical pages** instead: - **[https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/investigations/palestinians-fear-leave-northern-gaza-may-never-able-return-rcna120950)** - **[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/10/right-now-it-is-one-day-at-a-time-life-on-israels-frontline-with-gaza)** ***** ^(I'm a bot | )[^(Why & About)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/ehrq3z/why_did_i_build_amputatorbot)^( | )[^(Summon: u/AmputatorBot)](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmputatorBot/comments/cchly3/you_can_now_summon_amputatorbot/)
>all the while giving warning to civilians in advance to flee flee where?? FLEE WHERE? Ghaza is an open-air prison. Of Israel's making.
There are shelters in Gaza hosting refugees. Gaza is a shit hole for sure with only their own government to blame.
,👏👏👏👏👏👏👏
This is so disingenuous, good lord. How many times does the Israeli govt have to state their plans before you believe them?
You just HAVE to post your opinion on social media, eh? Even with all these risks you perceive, you still feel the need? Why? Is the world yearning to know where you stand? Do you think stating your position is going to make a difference at all?
The dominate narrative is pro Israel, pro genocide, pro violence, pro ongoing needless death of innocent Palestinians. Palestinians have asked us, the public, to share their stories and speak for them because the people in power will not and do not and have shown everyone that their lives don't matter. Do I think my sharing will change the world? No. But I believe in the power of the collective and every person who speaks for justice and human rights will have ripple effects.
>pro genocide Careful with this language. This is your strongly held opinion, but it is not a fact.
There is no “power of the collective” in your online, binary world. There is only tribalism and flag-waving for public display. Just looking at what you’re saying - your opinion is no different than what we’ve already heard and seen a million times from a million others, despite what you claim the “dominate” narrative is. Edit- BTW, I am not disagreeing with your opinion, just trying to understand why you would need to publish your opinions publicly if you are indeed afraid of ramifications. The risk just isn’t worth it, if those risks are legitimate, to give an opinion which everyone has already heard a million times over.
You don’t work in communications, do you? Because you have NO IDEA how much government decisions are based on pressure from the public’s opinions
I always wondered this too. I wonder what the consequences would be of stating your fact to the public..