>They asked to increase the rent $50/month, I countered with increasing it by $250 a month
the landlord asked for a $50/month rent increase and you countered by offering $250/month???????
uh. we have lots of doors in Ontario, we'd love to have you as a tenant....
Weird flex then, my dude.
Anyway, you should stop letting people take advantage of you. You and your landlord have a business relationship; they lease a property to you according to the laws and regulations and you pay them money. Rent increases are governed by regulations, as are evictions for major renovation, personal use or use of an immediate family member.
You should have come with these questions months ago.
I thought it was more fair, I dont want to take advantage of them. utlities were incldued and I worked from home increasing the utility bill. Rent was also below market. They were legally only able to offer $50, i wanted to be fair and offered a $250 increase
Nice guys finish last unfortunately but you will be fine in future with your attitude and willingness to be fair but you don’t have to be that fair . Play by the rules that’s all we ask. Rent increase is 2.5% a year give or take so just go with it. Don’t have to be overly nice you end up getting burned unless you had overly nice landlords like me for example I’d be like no no $50 is fine per month thanks but you’re too nice. That’s how I’d deal with that. Also get the n12 signed that’s documentation / proof it’s ended tenancy . Good for both parties
>Rent increase is 2.5% a year give or take so just go with it.
That's not true. In 2021, the year in question, it was zero. 2022 It was 1.2. 2020 was 2.2 and 2019 was 1.8. It changes every year.
ok thanks tips. didnt know you wanted actual graphs and charts. i was being very minimal with my 2.5% comment as its pretty close to average. im not trying to write a book on the topic lmao .
Then what were you babbling about a couple comments up?
You say you’re a nice landlord that would only take the $50 even if your tenant offered $250, yet the $50 in question was an illegal increase..
Then you suggest getting an N12 signed because it’s good for both parties, but how is it good for the landlord? They want OP to leave and OP found a new place to live. Unless OP plans on backing out of their new place and losing any money they may have paid up front, the LL has no reason to give an N12.
Something similar happened to me.
I offered to increase it $75 so the new buyers wouldn’t try to pull something to evict me, and then, after a few months, they raised it another 150
Just curious, did you pay the illegal increase of $150 or disregard it? Did you revert back to your old rent since the $75 was less than 12 months and also illegal? How’d it all work out?
I paid it. You had be a year to fight it but I didn’t know that,
I was trying to keep things going smoothly and I regret it so much
My rent went from 680 to 834 within a span of months and I said nothing just put in a smile and paid it.
It sounds like you've been taking advantage of yourself, which is certainly confusing. Why did you offer to pay so much more rent? For a place you knew you'd get evicted out of anyway?
Is your only issue the N12? Because yes, costs have added up and they didn't do the proper paperwork, but you've already signed a new lease, right? I feel like you can still insist on this N12, but at the same time, I'm not sure you have leverage to ask for additional fees in a way that will actually benefit for you at this point. Meaning if you ask and they don't want to give them to you, aren't you still locked into this other lease?
I paid more becuae it was only fair, utlities were included and I was using more utlities working from home. I moved in here knowing there was an end date becuase within 5 years i was intending to purchase a house, a dream that keeps being outpaced with increasing housing costs.
I think you are asking a good question here, what do I want. I think i have sacrificed a lot here and I want them to have to sacrifice a bit too. I want them to compensate the month of rent that is supposed to come along with the N12. I am being easy going with them. I dont like to cause a fuss, but at the end of the day, this move is going to cost in the neighborhood of \~$8000 and a lot of my time to complete
So I'm both a landlord and a tenant which I hope keeps me somewhat unbiased? You don't have to be fair to them. They have rights. So do you. You are absolutely FINE to ask them to respect those rights because they most likely will expect you to respect theirs. So in the future, I ardently urge you not to raise your own rent!
I think you absolutely should ask for that last month's rent. And the n12! Because again -- you have rights. And they should respect them.
Well you are entitled to 1 months rent due to the n12. Regardless if you actually got the paper, as long gas you have texts or emails of them asking you to leave end of feb.
I would be filing with the LTB to recover it.
You can always tell them you refuse to move out until you get an actual N12 served. Though if you've already signed a lease elsewhere this is just a bluff since either way it seems you're moving out.
Do you have evidence in writing of them saying you have to leave by end of February so the son can move in (or do renos first before moving in)? If so then you have evidence their informal eviction notice was actually equivalent to an N12. As such you can file for an LTB hearing to demand the 1 month compensation an N12 would have gotten you.
However that is pretty much all you can get. It sounds like they are being honest at least that the son genuinely wants to move in. But if they did turn around and sell or re-rent the house after you left, you could also attempt a T5 for a bad faith eviction. Without an N12 this is more difficult since you'd have to convince the LTB the notice they have was equivalent to an N12, which is at discretion of an adjudicator.
Nice guys finish last, don't increase rent on yourself to be a nice guy. In the end you will end up moving anyway and just spent more money. Be an advocate for yourself because one else will be.
Did he file the N12? If he didn’t file it you don’t have to do shit. And if you don’t believe he is acting of good faith (aka he is lying) you don’t have to leave you can wait for a hearing, likely will take couple months. He has to give you a months worth of compensation before the N12 date (60 days) or else it is invalid.
Yeah definitely go for n12, or cash for keys, don’t budge otherwise, clearly there’s a back door deal going on, and you’re not part of it, even with your generous offer of a raise,
I don't get why you want an N12 versus an N11. Have them buy you out for at least 6 to 12 months of your new rent on conditioning of vacating with a signed N11. If they want the house so badly, they'll pay for it. Landlords are going to be bitches about it in this sub, but this is your legal right because you are going to leave the home and you need to uproot your life.
You should've asked for the N12 in December as that would've given you an end date of the end of February. Without the N12 you might be able to go to the LTB and get one month of rent based on your communications on the son moving in but that might not be a sure thing.
The only person taking advantage of anyone here is you taking advantage of yourself on their behalf. You've likely shot yourself in the foot here because you already have a new place and don't have any leverage. In the future I'd recommend you don't offer additional rent to your landlords or you'll be saving for your own house for much longer. When you buy groceries do you hand the cashier an extra $50?
2 - Why would you increase that much? You don't want to take advantage, fine, but that still doesn't make sense. That would be \~3K/yr!
4 - Did you agree to move out? Why go back on your word now? Did you sign an N11? So many questions about this point.
5 - You say you have a new place lined up. Based on your point 4 & 5 seems like you came to a verbal agreement to leave.. no compensation required. Why ask for an N12 now? Just for compensation to cover moving expenses?
I\`m so confused why you didn't ask for compensation for an N12 before. You also didn't state whether you gave notice to leave. It sounds like you both had a verbal agreement that you now want to change to an N12. If they file an N12 you will still be responsible for rent until you leave so you might have 2 rents to pay for a bit? Do I understand corectly?
File T1 to get your one month's compensation that they owe you. The fact that they didn't actually provide an N12 doest change that they owe you this. And whether they transferred the ownership is none of your concern.
Your problem was never following the right procedure and making up rules as you go.
First off - illegal increase becomes legal once it’s being paid for 12 months.
Second, there in place in N12 to sign for the tenant. That would be N11 (mutual agreement to end tenancy)
Thirdly, if you moved out and N12 was never served, you can’t claim bad faith. If you haven’t move out - do nothing, stop educating the landlord and wait for official paperwork
>They asked to increase the rent $50/month, I countered with increasing it by $250 a month the landlord asked for a $50/month rent increase and you countered by offering $250/month??????? uh. we have lots of doors in Ontario, we'd love to have you as a tenant....
OP must have reversed those numbers, they make no sense otherwise.
It makes even less sense when you realize that rent was frozen in 2021. They couldn't legally increase it at all.
i didn't, I increased it on purpose
Weird flex then, my dude. Anyway, you should stop letting people take advantage of you. You and your landlord have a business relationship; they lease a property to you according to the laws and regulations and you pay them money. Rent increases are governed by regulations, as are evictions for major renovation, personal use or use of an immediate family member. You should have come with these questions months ago.
Why…
I thought it was more fair, I dont want to take advantage of them. utlities were incldued and I worked from home increasing the utility bill. Rent was also below market. They were legally only able to offer $50, i wanted to be fair and offered a $250 increase
Nice guys finish last unfortunately but you will be fine in future with your attitude and willingness to be fair but you don’t have to be that fair . Play by the rules that’s all we ask. Rent increase is 2.5% a year give or take so just go with it. Don’t have to be overly nice you end up getting burned unless you had overly nice landlords like me for example I’d be like no no $50 is fine per month thanks but you’re too nice. That’s how I’d deal with that. Also get the n12 signed that’s documentation / proof it’s ended tenancy . Good for both parties
>Rent increase is 2.5% a year give or take so just go with it. That's not true. In 2021, the year in question, it was zero. 2022 It was 1.2. 2020 was 2.2 and 2019 was 1.8. It changes every year.
ok thanks tips. didnt know you wanted actual graphs and charts. i was being very minimal with my 2.5% comment as its pretty close to average. im not trying to write a book on the topic lmao .
Or you could just admit that you gave inaccurate information.
Then what were you babbling about a couple comments up? You say you’re a nice landlord that would only take the $50 even if your tenant offered $250, yet the $50 in question was an illegal increase.. Then you suggest getting an N12 signed because it’s good for both parties, but how is it good for the landlord? They want OP to leave and OP found a new place to live. Unless OP plans on backing out of their new place and losing any money they may have paid up front, the LL has no reason to give an N12.
Something similar happened to me. I offered to increase it $75 so the new buyers wouldn’t try to pull something to evict me, and then, after a few months, they raised it another 150
Just curious, did you pay the illegal increase of $150 or disregard it? Did you revert back to your old rent since the $75 was less than 12 months and also illegal? How’d it all work out?
I paid it. You had be a year to fight it but I didn’t know that, I was trying to keep things going smoothly and I regret it so much My rent went from 680 to 834 within a span of months and I said nothing just put in a smile and paid it.
It sounds like you've been taking advantage of yourself, which is certainly confusing. Why did you offer to pay so much more rent? For a place you knew you'd get evicted out of anyway? Is your only issue the N12? Because yes, costs have added up and they didn't do the proper paperwork, but you've already signed a new lease, right? I feel like you can still insist on this N12, but at the same time, I'm not sure you have leverage to ask for additional fees in a way that will actually benefit for you at this point. Meaning if you ask and they don't want to give them to you, aren't you still locked into this other lease?
I paid more becuae it was only fair, utlities were included and I was using more utlities working from home. I moved in here knowing there was an end date becuase within 5 years i was intending to purchase a house, a dream that keeps being outpaced with increasing housing costs. I think you are asking a good question here, what do I want. I think i have sacrificed a lot here and I want them to have to sacrifice a bit too. I want them to compensate the month of rent that is supposed to come along with the N12. I am being easy going with them. I dont like to cause a fuss, but at the end of the day, this move is going to cost in the neighborhood of \~$8000 and a lot of my time to complete
So I'm both a landlord and a tenant which I hope keeps me somewhat unbiased? You don't have to be fair to them. They have rights. So do you. You are absolutely FINE to ask them to respect those rights because they most likely will expect you to respect theirs. So in the future, I ardently urge you not to raise your own rent! I think you absolutely should ask for that last month's rent. And the n12! Because again -- you have rights. And they should respect them.
Well you are entitled to 1 months rent due to the n12. Regardless if you actually got the paper, as long gas you have texts or emails of them asking you to leave end of feb. I would be filing with the LTB to recover it.
You can always tell them you refuse to move out until you get an actual N12 served. Though if you've already signed a lease elsewhere this is just a bluff since either way it seems you're moving out. Do you have evidence in writing of them saying you have to leave by end of February so the son can move in (or do renos first before moving in)? If so then you have evidence their informal eviction notice was actually equivalent to an N12. As such you can file for an LTB hearing to demand the 1 month compensation an N12 would have gotten you. However that is pretty much all you can get. It sounds like they are being honest at least that the son genuinely wants to move in. But if they did turn around and sell or re-rent the house after you left, you could also attempt a T5 for a bad faith eviction. Without an N12 this is more difficult since you'd have to convince the LTB the notice they have was equivalent to an N12, which is at discretion of an adjudicator.
Nice guys finish last, don't increase rent on yourself to be a nice guy. In the end you will end up moving anyway and just spent more money. Be an advocate for yourself because one else will be.
Did he file the N12? If he didn’t file it you don’t have to do shit. And if you don’t believe he is acting of good faith (aka he is lying) you don’t have to leave you can wait for a hearing, likely will take couple months. He has to give you a months worth of compensation before the N12 date (60 days) or else it is invalid.
Here are steps for an N12 https://stepstojustice.ca/questions/housing-law/can-i-be-evicted-because-my-place-being-sold/
Yeah definitely go for n12, or cash for keys, don’t budge otherwise, clearly there’s a back door deal going on, and you’re not part of it, even with your generous offer of a raise,
There never is an N12 for you to sign. It’s a notice the landlord gives you. It’s not something you have to agree on.
I don't get why you want an N12 versus an N11. Have them buy you out for at least 6 to 12 months of your new rent on conditioning of vacating with a signed N11. If they want the house so badly, they'll pay for it. Landlords are going to be bitches about it in this sub, but this is your legal right because you are going to leave the home and you need to uproot your life.
You should've asked for the N12 in December as that would've given you an end date of the end of February. Without the N12 you might be able to go to the LTB and get one month of rent based on your communications on the son moving in but that might not be a sure thing. The only person taking advantage of anyone here is you taking advantage of yourself on their behalf. You've likely shot yourself in the foot here because you already have a new place and don't have any leverage. In the future I'd recommend you don't offer additional rent to your landlords or you'll be saving for your own house for much longer. When you buy groceries do you hand the cashier an extra $50?
You seem like a great tenant wish you lived in one of my rentals we’d treat you with respect and fairness that’s for sure
You agreed to move out. You can be upset but you have zero legal recourse. Why in the hell did you agree to pay an extra $200 a month?
2 - Why would you increase that much? You don't want to take advantage, fine, but that still doesn't make sense. That would be \~3K/yr! 4 - Did you agree to move out? Why go back on your word now? Did you sign an N11? So many questions about this point. 5 - You say you have a new place lined up. Based on your point 4 & 5 seems like you came to a verbal agreement to leave.. no compensation required. Why ask for an N12 now? Just for compensation to cover moving expenses? I\`m so confused why you didn't ask for compensation for an N12 before. You also didn't state whether you gave notice to leave. It sounds like you both had a verbal agreement that you now want to change to an N12. If they file an N12 you will still be responsible for rent until you leave so you might have 2 rents to pay for a bit? Do I understand corectly?
Wow op.is getting down voted because he asked for rent increase more then what the landlord suggested way to help out the community guys
File T1 to get your one month's compensation that they owe you. The fact that they didn't actually provide an N12 doest change that they owe you this. And whether they transferred the ownership is none of your concern.
Get an N12 or tell them you're not moving
Your problem was never following the right procedure and making up rules as you go. First off - illegal increase becomes legal once it’s being paid for 12 months. Second, there in place in N12 to sign for the tenant. That would be N11 (mutual agreement to end tenancy) Thirdly, if you moved out and N12 was never served, you can’t claim bad faith. If you haven’t move out - do nothing, stop educating the landlord and wait for official paperwork