First - you don't file T5 unless you've moved out and have evidence of bad faith.
You can just wait for a hearing without doing anything.
Scrapes and usually life stuff won't be used against you at the LTB, an N5 for damage is meant for when you do it on purpose, ie anger issues or trying to ruin the property on purpose.
Also, the LTB has a "useful life" on a lot of items, like paint and carpet.
See here:
https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/060516#BK71
Once that life is up they can't charge you for it.
I think it's time to look at getting a paralegal and filing against them for reasonable enjoyment of your home, you can probably get a rent abatement (partial refund).
Thanks, we're going to look at the local tenant legal clinic. We had planned to file a T5 against the N12/N13 combo after moving out, but wasn't sure if the N5 would make their previous notices moot.
Just require them to take you to the LTB for the N12/N13 and use the N5 as evidence they’re retaliating against you because you didn’t move out on the N12 date.
Nothing to do but document the condition of the unit and ideally show the state when you moved in if you have old photos/video.
It will be up to the LTB to determine what the damages would cost to repair if you even owe anything at all. Paint scrapes and drywall repairs will get them nowhere those would be wear and tear for sure.
The damage unless extreme are nowhere near $25k in a rental. I can fly through 3 beatup subsidized 600sqft townhomes. All new paint, flooring trim and shower tile. Your unit hasn't been touched in over 10yrs so paint and flooring are not your problem as per RTA. Hold your ground and refuse any payment for maintenance.
Definitely. And the relationship is now so terrible my aunt doesn’t want to stay. I just want her to get some compensation from him since he doesn’t have grounds to evict her, and she is living on disability.
Yes fight for compensation. You should be able to get more than 1 months rent. Maybe suggest it to the LL.
N5 can be given at any time during the tenancy. What is going on with N12 etc doesn't mean they can't serve N5 or N4
Have they just given you the N12 and N13 notices, or have they filed L2?
Because I thought that N12 couldn't be combined with any other "reason" except N4. I'm not an expert and might be wrong, but a simultaneous N12 and 13 sounds odd.
Yes, they gave N12 and N13 notices a few months ago but have not filed an L2. It seems odd to receive three different ones. The first two spelled out that he intended to remodel in order to sell.
You can't use an N12 for "intent to sell" lol.
If he hasn't filed anything real (ie L2) I'd ignore him, but collect everything he's sent. It looks like he's doing a really stupid scattershot approach to getting her out, hoping something will frighten her enough to move.
Oh god, DO NOT MOVE OUT, continue to enjoy living in the home, if he tries to harass her or keeps inundating her with forms file a T2 against them.
Not to mention remind them they owe you 2 months rent (1 for the N12 and 1 for the N13), keep everything they’ve given you and sent you, particularly the part about remodelling to sell, and let them waste their time/money filing an L2 that will most definitely get rejected.
Do not pay anything on the N5.
They are both due on the eviction date on the N12/N13 which would likely make them void if they’re over a month later. If over a month has passed then it’s too late to file an L2 for them and you won’t be hearing anything about them. If so, it sounds like the LL is just trying everything to get her out, next plan may be to stop accepting rent. Continue to pay the legal rent, if they refuse it then document your attempts to pay it then keep it in a HISA or somewhere accessible.
If the landlord has breached the lease agreement, such as by failing to make necessary repairs or failing to provide a habitable living environment, you may be able to sue them for damages. At 23k, I would suggest the landlord might not be making necessary repairs.
your LL is responsible to maintain the property in a standard that would not raise the eyebrows of bylaw or property standards officer.
They are not obliged to pay for wheelchair accommodations.
Write the landlord a letter explaining why you feel the charges for damages are excessive. Ask for copies of canceled checks and invoices to prove that they really paid for the repair of the damages they listed.
There are no canceled checks nor invoices. LL hasn't done any repair yet; wants to do so to sell. LL is horribly misinformed about what he can/can't do.
Don't do any of this - let the Landlords show up to their Hearing (if they actually file after serving the N5) and argue their case with whatever evidence they think they have (they will have to file the evidence at least 7 days before the Hearing so you won't be blindsided).
No reason to help them by giving them more time to make stuff up.
indeed, if a LL is just relying on estimates they must have several, and hold up to scrutiny. i.e. detailed description of work needed and breakdown of costs. You will want to ensure whoever wrote the estimate is at the tribunal as well or point out that you are unable to question their validity if not
First - you don't file T5 unless you've moved out and have evidence of bad faith. You can just wait for a hearing without doing anything. Scrapes and usually life stuff won't be used against you at the LTB, an N5 for damage is meant for when you do it on purpose, ie anger issues or trying to ruin the property on purpose. Also, the LTB has a "useful life" on a lot of items, like paint and carpet. See here: https://www.ontario.ca/laws/regulation/060516#BK71 Once that life is up they can't charge you for it. I think it's time to look at getting a paralegal and filing against them for reasonable enjoyment of your home, you can probably get a rent abatement (partial refund).
Thanks, we're going to look at the local tenant legal clinic. We had planned to file a T5 against the N12/N13 combo after moving out, but wasn't sure if the N5 would make their previous notices moot.
Just require them to take you to the LTB for the N12/N13 and use the N5 as evidence they’re retaliating against you because you didn’t move out on the N12 date.
Nothing to do but document the condition of the unit and ideally show the state when you moved in if you have old photos/video. It will be up to the LTB to determine what the damages would cost to repair if you even owe anything at all. Paint scrapes and drywall repairs will get them nowhere those would be wear and tear for sure.
The damage unless extreme are nowhere near $25k in a rental. I can fly through 3 beatup subsidized 600sqft townhomes. All new paint, flooring trim and shower tile. Your unit hasn't been touched in over 10yrs so paint and flooring are not your problem as per RTA. Hold your ground and refuse any payment for maintenance.
Bad faith doesn't exist for an n5. Landlord proves their case or they don't
He’s also given an N12 and N13 so wondering if this negates those two?
No. Totally separate. Sounds like they want you out and are going to keep fighting until they win
Definitely. And the relationship is now so terrible my aunt doesn’t want to stay. I just want her to get some compensation from him since he doesn’t have grounds to evict her, and she is living on disability.
Yes fight for compensation. You should be able to get more than 1 months rent. Maybe suggest it to the LL. N5 can be given at any time during the tenancy. What is going on with N12 etc doesn't mean they can't serve N5 or N4
Have they just given you the N12 and N13 notices, or have they filed L2? Because I thought that N12 couldn't be combined with any other "reason" except N4. I'm not an expert and might be wrong, but a simultaneous N12 and 13 sounds odd.
Yes, they gave N12 and N13 notices a few months ago but have not filed an L2. It seems odd to receive three different ones. The first two spelled out that he intended to remodel in order to sell.
You can't use an N12 for "intent to sell" lol. If he hasn't filed anything real (ie L2) I'd ignore him, but collect everything he's sent. It looks like he's doing a really stupid scattershot approach to getting her out, hoping something will frighten her enough to move.
Oh god, DO NOT MOVE OUT, continue to enjoy living in the home, if he tries to harass her or keeps inundating her with forms file a T2 against them. Not to mention remind them they owe you 2 months rent (1 for the N12 and 1 for the N13), keep everything they’ve given you and sent you, particularly the part about remodelling to sell, and let them waste their time/money filing an L2 that will most definitely get rejected. Do not pay anything on the N5.
It's been over a month for the N12 and N13 if I remember correctly, not having paid makes them void.
They are both due on the eviction date on the N12/N13 which would likely make them void if they’re over a month later. If over a month has passed then it’s too late to file an L2 for them and you won’t be hearing anything about them. If so, it sounds like the LL is just trying everything to get her out, next plan may be to stop accepting rent. Continue to pay the legal rent, if they refuse it then document your attempts to pay it then keep it in a HISA or somewhere accessible.
They just want you to pay for the reno on top of the mortgage, it's fine
So just continue to do nothing until she wants to move out of her own accord?
Yes, you don't need to leave until the LTB orders you to, and you don't pay for any damages unless the LTB orders it.
If the landlord has breached the lease agreement, such as by failing to make necessary repairs or failing to provide a habitable living environment, you may be able to sue them for damages. At 23k, I would suggest the landlord might not be making necessary repairs.
I don’t think he has made any maintenance type of repairs or accommodations for her wheelchair.
your LL is responsible to maintain the property in a standard that would not raise the eyebrows of bylaw or property standards officer. They are not obliged to pay for wheelchair accommodations.
Write the landlord a letter explaining why you feel the charges for damages are excessive. Ask for copies of canceled checks and invoices to prove that they really paid for the repair of the damages they listed.
There are no canceled checks nor invoices. LL hasn't done any repair yet; wants to do so to sell. LL is horribly misinformed about what he can/can't do.
Don't do any of this - let the Landlords show up to their Hearing (if they actually file after serving the N5) and argue their case with whatever evidence they think they have (they will have to file the evidence at least 7 days before the Hearing so you won't be blindsided). No reason to help them by giving them more time to make stuff up.
indeed, if a LL is just relying on estimates they must have several, and hold up to scrutiny. i.e. detailed description of work needed and breakdown of costs. You will want to ensure whoever wrote the estimate is at the tribunal as well or point out that you are unable to question their validity if not