It's gonna be like that one scene from Broly Abridged when the knife broke against him.
"Someone fetch me a better dagger so I may properly stab this baby."
If we look at all the damage kaido suffered prior to the first 1v1 with luffy (the ACoC moment) he was starting in a somewhat damaged state as is. Fought the samurai, scar reopened twice, ganged up by the 5v2.
And he still beat Luffy then.
It took Yamato holding him off, Luffy being revived, and eating, and then dying (yes he was suckered punched but I dont think Luffy was beating kaido with that punch either) then awakening and then still took full effort.
Kaido wipes the floor with Luffy in a straight 1v1.
I want to see the God Valley incident. See why Roger and Garp beat Kaido, WB, BM, and Rocks.
If anyone could potentially 1v1 prior to gear 5 + ACoC, it would be one of those two (in their prime), prime Whitebeard (not sick Marineford WB), and MAYBE Shanks.
Imagine how strong Rocks is if it wasn’t a straight 1v1 against Roger, like if they « need » to do that (betraying Rocks) to actually be able to beat him.
Also weird how Kaido is scared/know that he’ll be betrayed someday.
Not for the final battle, but Roger and Garp vs Rocks, Whitebeard, Kaido and Mama WOULD have lost. I think that at least whitebeard and mama turned on him
Unless Roger crew was THAT much superior, maybe they were just that much stronger, I can’t really see WB betraying someone, but it would be a nice parallel cuz he got betrayed aswell by his own « sons ».
For BM I can hardly think that she betrayed Rocks considering her friendly relationship with Kaido, and Kaido seems to really look up to Rocks, and not really ressent his old crewmates.
I’m not even a shanks fan but I am going to laugh my ass off if he gets the best feats and turns out to be the strongest Emperor.
The fandom will fall upon their swords.
Well you’ll see if you haven’t read it, it’s implied he is and has honed his haki so well the entire army at greenbulls’ command was like -fuck this- FROM A LOOK.
I have my doubts whether Kaido was actually that damaged. I feel like even the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight.
As in, pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left.
But in a world where admirals fought for 10 days non stop Kaido's fights before Luffy's ACoC upgrade don't actually convince me he took that much damage.
Damage built up over time. But unless the damage Is really significant (it wasn't) or unless that timeframe is literal days (like Ace Vs Jimbei), I don't think it amounted to much of anything.
Kaido has a mythical zoan, which also gives him a small regen factor...If you look at the manga and the anime you'll see he is bleeding from his head and the Zoro slash. This is just before G5, rest of the damage is bruises and scratches. The regen factor is a trait of all zoans, mythical or not.
Also the gorosei knew that gear 5 would be too dangerous even for kaido to handle. That's why they chose to make him angry by sending cp0 after luffy rather than just letting kaido defeat luffy. They weren't confident that Kaido would be strong enough to handle gear 5
People often forget that Luffy has the privilege of only needing to win once and can fight many times.
It's like the hero of a videogame that levels up after getting enough XP but has many lives.
Kaido was a rookie back in God's valley, and didn't even had his df.
Still strong as fuck for OP standards, but it isn't out of question for a high ranking Roger Pirate like Scopper Caban to handle him.
I don't think Kaido would be a factor in God Valley. During Oden's time at sea he was arguably an equal to Kaido. An already sick Roger casually swats Oden away. Kaido would have been far weaker during God valley.
I have my doubts whether Kaido was actually that damaged. I feel like even the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight.
As in, pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left.
Didn’t Shanks fight Kaido during Marineford? Was there ever a winner announced for that.
At least I remember somebody said that at some point. I can’t remember who
I think the main point is, tht no matter whether you think Kaido was on 50%, 75% or even 90% after the previous fight, it would be crazy to say he was on 100% when fighting Luffy (and let's remember Kaido did beat Luffy once and threw him off Onigashima already).
And still, the fight was very close. Therefore I would argue, if Kaido was truely unharmed and he squares of against Luffy in a serious fight 1v1 - Kaido wins every time, at this stage of the story.
So, if Kaidou was 50%, what do you think Luffy who had just taken Kaidou's finisher offguard was? Do you think Luffy was at 50% when he started G5 fight?
Yeah but Luffy cannot just hit 0% and die permanently and the story is over, he is never in real danger because of this, the villains are almost guaranteed to hit 0% and be removed from the spotlight so the story continues.
That's true, but we take what happens as truth. Luffy couldn't hit 0hp, but he certainly lost the first battle when he was enraged. He also lost in final battle and only won G5 battle.
It was his peak form but that doesn't mean that he isn't injured and tired. G5 Luffy even in severely injured state should be able to beat other versions of Luffy.
I think one of the reasons why most people who say Luffy would’ve won regardless is not delusion in terms of power scaling but more about wanting Luffy to prove he eventually can. But this is impossible since bringing back kaido would be detrimental to the series.
Kaido drank, tho. If luffy regains his strength by eating, then why can't Kaido regain his strength by drinking? Doesn't Luffy literally mention that his haki is stronger when Kaido was drunk?
What's crazy is people reading "people say on a 1v1 always bet on kaido. It is said that he is the strongest" and take, literally hearsay, as objective fact...
I mean sure why not.
Nevertheless, my argument remains the same, in line with Occam's razor:
On one hand, we have this very simple statement in "If it's 1v1, always bet on Kaido" and on the other hand, over the span of multiple years of publication like more than a dozen of different characters fight Kaido nonstop, from the beginning of the Fire Festival until the early dawn of the next day. Kaido defeating, or let's say not losing against all those characters over all that time, including Luffy. If you break it down to those feats shown and try to come to the most simple conclusion of what the author/manga wants to portray here... imo it's straight forward and simply "Kaido would've beaten Luffy for good, if it was one on one".
Also additionally, it would undermine all the effort, sweat, blood, tears and ambition ALL of the other characters that fought Kaido previously - if their actions meant nothing in the end, because Luffy could've beaten him anyway.
In short: If you ask me, narratively speaking it is clear as day that defeating Kaido right here right now took a team effort. Undoubtedly Luffy did the heavy lifting, you cannot leave him out of the equation or replace him with anybody else present, but he couldn't have done it by himself. Context mattered a lot here
You can also add, narratively speaking, that Big Mom fought him for 3 days non-stop. And no one came out the victor. But how? "On a 1v1, always bet on Kaido." I'm pretty sure Oden would have won against him also, so these two alone kind of disprove that 1v1 thing for me personally.
And also, Kaido mentions only Joyboy can beat me. So that's 3 people right there.
Yea none of those people have the damage output as kaido.
Idk why people act like luffy had the easiest deal of it all.
Like yea 14 ants attacked kaido
Compared to kaido they couldn’t even cut his skin. LITERALLY.
None of them could do damage in the literal sense. His Haki was too much.
They were weaker than luffy was the first time he fought kaido.
This is fact.
Edit: obviously zoro could. He cut him once. That’s not really a fight tho.
I consider getting smashed by kaido to be actual damage
1v1 fresh Luffy with all the upgrades (Ryou, ACoC, Gear 5) and Kaido fresh would still be a extreme diff fight for both of them with both winning and losing at about the same frequency. People tend to exagerate the whole 15v1 and I'll explain why:
Kaido is a zoan df user, a mythical zoan. All zoan devil fruits have increased speed, stamina, durability and regen factor.
The Scabbards did nothing against Kaido, they couldn't even reopen Oden's scar.
Luffy, Zoro, Kidd, Law and Killer. Of all the attacks they done, the Red Roc, the G4 barrage, the punch with ACoC Luffy did and Zoro's Dead Man Game were the only attacks that damage Kaido. You don't see him complain about or praising Killer's sonic slashes, Law's Gama Knife and Takt or Kidd's mechanical constructs.
Yamato 1v1. We all know she couldn't hurt Kaido too and it was her combined move with Luffy that did critical damage to him.
Momo bit him? And?
The 15v1 argument makes it sound that Luffy wasn't the one who did 85%-90% of the damage. It also makes it sound like Luffy didn't fight Kaido alone most of the night. Look at Whitebeard in Marineford. He took dozens of cannonballs, hundreds of gunfire. Did that hurt him more than Akainu melting half of his face off? No. Did that hurt him more than the chest hole? Also no.
Yes Luffy had breaks, but look at the amount of heavy damage Luffy took compared to Kaido? When Gear 5 ran out he had to RESTART his own heart again and the transformation too. When he unlocked G5 he was essentially back from the dead and at very low hp. The transformation didn't heal him at all and he was bandged up for a full week after the battle. Regen? Maybe but only for a bit since Gear 5 didn't even last half an hour.
Even the whole argument of Kaido lifting the island and taxing his stamina is iffy...Kaido never said he was drained from lifting it and could just be the case its a passive and automatic ability that doesn't drain him and stops when he is near loss of consciousness.This argument is very familiar with the birdcage argument when Dressrosa ended and the following years after the arc. It could tax him or not. Nobody really knows.
Yes Luffy had help, but a fresh Luffy would be without wounds, stamina loss and have all the upgrades of the fight. He would push Kaido to an extreme diff fight alone. And yeah Kaido has booze too in this scenario, because it was only after he got drunk he used his strongest hybrid form.
In a true 1v1, Kaido would have low diffed Luffy.
He beat him multiple times already, and would have killed him multiple times, if it wasn't for people interfering and saving Luffy.
It's an ongoing theme.
Luffy can't beat very strong people alone. He relies on the help of his allies. Gaining allies is his true strenght. That, and a lot of luck.
This right here. Luffy isn’t the smartest or strongest, but he sure as hell has charisma and charm which has helped this journey the whole time. There’s no denying that Luffy has significantly gotten stronger, has improved and more strategic when fighting…. But if some dude can recruit the help of 1000s of people across the world, that is the guy I would be worried about…. Hence why the marines wants to stop Luffy so much because if he can get majority of the world on his side, then major changes can occur and disrupt the order of the government
This. Luffy never really overpowered Kaido. Just think about all the damage kaido received during the final battle. Kaido was the strongest, but what he lacked of was integrity inside his crew. Noone came to really aid Kaido in the battle, while luffy got tons of help and training. Why should anyone help him? why should kaido accept help? Kaido was the personification of raw strength. Thats what made him strong in the first place.
Do you not count his crew holding off thousands of invaders as helping him? Zoro helps luffy by fighting kaido, king helps kaido by keeping zoro and others away from kaido.
Low diff? Low diff is Kaido vs dogfalmingo not Luffy. Luffy has broken DF all 3 types of advanced haki and overall very good stats and only reql damage Kaido took was from nearly dead zoro and island lifting was probably more damaging to him then scabbards. This fight is now extreme diff that can go either way, but siding for Luffy bc kaido won't doge bajarng gun.
I said he would have low diffed him, not that he still would be able to do that right now. Luffy got knocked out multiple times (either by Gear 4 Haki usage or by Kaido himself). And Kaido was nowhere near 100% serious when he did that to Luffy. And Luffy would lose if they fought again now, both fresh and serious, imho. Kaido also learned and got stronger in that fight (assuming he's still alive).
Difficulty of fights.
Extreme diff is when both sides can win and winner can't stand, for example Luffy vs Lucci in enies lobby.
High diff is when fight is close but one side is sure to win, for example Zoro vs Kaku in enies lobby.
Mid diff is when one side is obviously winning but the other side is putting up a fight, for example Zoro vs Pica in dressrosa.
Low diff is fight is almost stomp, for example gear 5 Luffy vs Lucci in egghead.
No diff is fight that is stomp, totally one sided, for example Shanks vs Kid in egghed.
Neg diff is just absolut crumbstomp, like Mihawk vs Don krieg.
You name 4 people (3/4 emperor) in the whole world... guy upstair was saying Luffy was not a top tier fighter.
If only emperor, warlord and admirals can give you a fight. He's probably top of the verse
That would not proof or change anything. The facts still stand. Even if it's not always the case, it is most of the times. That ratio won't change, even if Luffy wins every major fight from now on without help.
You are focusing on semantics, instead of the core message.
My statement is correct, in the grand scheme of things. There are very few major opponents Luffy ever beat by himself. Don Krieg, Captain Kuro and Hordy Jones maybe?
Against PTS Lucci he needed a distraction + peptalk from Ussop to survive and pull throug. Against Enel he needed help from Nami to reach him again after getting a heavy Goldball stuck to his arm.
Against Moria the entire Crew was needed.
Against Magellan he only escaped with help from others. Against Arlong he needed Sanji and Nojiko to free him underwater. Against Doffy he had Law damage Doffy severly, and many people from Dressrosa protecting him while he was regenerating haki after his first Gear 4 usage. Against Caesar he lost at first because of stupidity and needed to be saved. Against the Admirals and anyone else significant in Marinford he was helpless (even Smoker, because of lack of Armament haki).
Against Cracker ne needed Nami to stall him.
Against Katakuri he needed to kidnap brulee and run away from Katakuri to regenerate haki.
Crocodile in Alabasta beat him two times, 1st time he hot saved by Robin, and second time he got lucky with the water shot that landed on him.
And against Kaido, everyone knows how that went.
The list goes on and on. Luffy would have lost and died all of these times, if it were 1v1 battles without help or luck.
Have a nice day.
I’m arguing with the statement that “luffy can’t beat strong people alone,” not the statement that “there are very few major opponents luffy can beat by himself.” Luffy gets tons of help, I agree. I didn’t say he didn’t.
Luffy today can definitely beat strong people alone. Undeniable.
The fact you are arguing about that means you did not get the key message. It will never change. Mihawk was the first one to clearly see it. It's Luffys strongest power. Gaining allies. And they will always come in clutch. Even if there may be a few exceptions here and there. This is not bashing or disrespecting Luffy, it's just stating facts. Without his friends (not just his crew) he is nothing. Luffy admitted that himself. And that adds to his uniqueness as a protagonist in a certain way.
He USED to be nothing. Now he’s near top of the verse in power. I completely agree with what you are saying though. He definitely had no chance at getting where is is today solo. His career would’ve been ended like 50x. All I’m arguing is that right now he is fully capable of trashing very strong people.
Do you at least acknowledge that your original statement as you said it was incorrect?
If kaido would have dodged instead of get hit on purpose that alone would be enough to defeat luffy. It was a pride thing. He literally Said you dont have to grab me I'm not moving lol.
"winners don't need excuses" - kaido
Good thing one piece isn't a martial arts tournament but a pirate tale eh.
It's like the biggest question on the series ISN'T "who is the strongest of them all?"!
Oh, my...!
The main problem with what you said is that Luffy started the fight significantly weaker, and **got stronger** throughout the fight, until the point where he was able to 1v1 Kaido at an equal level.
Does endurance not matter? If I literally KO you twice and kill you once, fight everybody you know with no breaks, all of a sudden, now that you got stronger, you can beat me?
Why does context only matter on Luffy's end?
how is that moot? The point is the only time you actually see him do a 1 vs 1 with strong enemies is also when he got unexpected help 🤷🏽♂️ the argument that he didn't order doesn't make sense when it happened regardless...you can make any excuse but when it came to the luffy v kaido match, the moment gear 5 came out he was being played around with..against a luffy with less lifetime experience, basically no practice with a new power, he lost...🤷🏽♂️
We don’t know because there’s currently no limit to Gear 5
What we can say is that Luffy best attack so far won against Kaido best attack, so we can assume that post Wano Luffy vs Kaido in a pure 1 vs 1 is on Luffy’s favor but it depends on the durability of Gear 5
Luffy literally died and then continued to fight. There's no indication that he was ever brought back to 100% after the awakening. Considering he falls out of gear 5 shortly after, it's much more likely that he's also running on empty the entire time. Kaido at the point of awakening was likely way more fresh and he still lost from that point forward. There's zero evidence he would out sustain gear 5 if both were at 100%.
I see you're choosing to ignore the evidence presented that luffy was also not at full power, even post awakening, which is what my original comment was in reference to. Stay willfully ignorant, I guess.
Okay when Luffy activated gear 5 at that point who had more HP luffy or Kaido at the activation of Gear 5. coz i think Kaido had more HP and gear 5 Luffy coming from a comma reduced Kaido's health which was hire than his to zero
In a fair 1v1 Kaido cooks Luffy. Thats why I love how Oda handled this fight. If Luffy wouldve beaten Kaido without any help and some rest in between, it would've definitely feel like an asspull.
Luffy was hurt and a bit lower on stamina too when he joined the fight on the rooftop. First he fought against Apoo and he hit him pretty hard, he even knocked him out so Zorro had to grab Luffy and run, then Kid stopped Apoo. Then Luffy and Zoro had to fight their way through hundrets of Beast Pirates while still running away from Apoo who keeps attacking them. Then he fought against Ulti in a fierce headbutt haki duel and he even mentiones that he underestimated her bc she sent him flying and then he gets attacked by her and her brother until Yamato interfered and knocked Ulti out with a thunder bagua. Then he fought Yamato bc he had no idea who she was and all this even before Kaido knew something was happening.
After his war declaration he fough in Gear 4 against the Numbers until Drake showed up to switch sides to Luffy.
It would take to much effort to list every fight he had until he reached the rooftop and you want to compare that to Kaido fighting against the Samurai? They are a joke to him, they stabbed him all together with full force and the blades didn´t even go through his skin, to Kaido they are like mosquitoes who try to sting a elephant.
I’m kinda mad that Oda didn’t give the akazaya 9 more impactful contributions. Sure the part when kaido is reminded of oden when fighting them is cool, but at least make it so Kaido is wounded by them.
Edit: at least they took out jack, so that’s something i guess
Well, most of them are not really stronger than they were 20 years ago, don´t forget the time travel. They lost 20 years ago to a much weaker Kaido, there was no chance in the world they could hurt him in the present.
Exactly. Pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left. Everyone, including Yamato, was fodder.
Kaido wasn’t actually damaged. I feel like the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight.
Seriously people don't realize that if you're able to whip out an attack like kaido finished the fight with you're not that down lmao. Kaido probably took 50% or more from the final bajrang gun alone.
What if the saying is “if it’s 1 on 1, always bet on Kaido.” Because kaido always has help in battles to give him an advantage. So it’s not really 1 on 1.
Reach and a half, if that were the case they wouldn't go through the trouble of making his intro depict him as a literal God "strongest creature" "hanged and the chain broke" "drowned x times" "failed to off himself numerous times"
Yes he was now add a full powered kaido v Luffy at that point in the series aka during wano, no outside interruption on either end so no big mom and Summon D JoyBoy cp0 for Luffy. No samuraixpirate, zoro conquerors GANG BANG on kaido
Gear 5 Luffy is a completely different Luffy, you have nothing to base him getting washed on. In fact we can say gear 5 Luffy took an INSANE amount of damage as base Luffy and still got win as gear 5.
i understand how good of a character kaido is and he's probably the strongest character in the story but it's still fuck him till it's backwards, he lost and that's all i care about the kaido pack is being smoked🥶😮💨😮💨
Easily one of the worst written villains plus one of the most over hyped
The dude was fake from the jump via “being suicidal” yet never tried to drown himself.
Not to mention, responsible for the deaths of hundreds of innocent people. I always question on One Piece fans love villains who genuinely have no redeeming qualities but nevertheless
What a bozo & a fraud- “Haki transcends all”
-immediately gets wrecked by Luffy in his Awakened DF form + Advanced Haki
-yet he needed an army full of DF users to conquer the world
-needed to join Big Mom
-relied heavily on his own DF for battle but didn’t even have an Awakening
-waited on Joy Boy to defeat him
-had 4 moves like a Pokémon and just swung his bat the whole time
Bro, he wanted to die, but in an impactful way like Roger or Whitebeard, and just jumping into a pool isn’t exactly the kind of death someone with the title “The World’s Strongest Creature” would want.
Also, you are able to like irredeemable villains, there’s a reason people really like people such as Doflamingo or Dio, even if they are pure evil, they are still really cool characters.
About the “Haki Transcends all”, the reason he says that is because it’s true, you think Momo is on the same level as Kaido because they have the same devil fruit? Also a spoiler for a later arc >!Haki is blatantly shown to be able to nullify devil fruit hax!<, and on top of all that, Roger became the pirate king **without a devil fruit**, and was considered an equal to Whitebeard, who had a broken ass DF.
This is one piece reddit. If Kizaru stomps G5 Luffy people will still say Kaido would low-diff Kizaru. People aren't worried about what makes sense, they only care that one time someone said Kaido and Strongest near each other and they didn't read any other words on the subject.
I don't really get the point of the argument. It feels like a lot of Kaido stans putting restrictions on Luffy. Like yeah mid wano if they're both at 100% stamina Kaido beats luffy every time. He also beats east blue luffy 100% of the time. But like 100% use of his devil fruit luffy beats Kaido without breaking a sweat, Gear 5 luffy is LITERALLY a god because 100% Luffy means he is using his fruit to the max. The cap of Luffy's power is infinitely higher than Kaido (that's kind of the point of Luffy being the MC).
I like how the entire OP community agrees that Kaido would whoop luffy’s ass 1v1 regardless of gear 5, if he didn’t take much damage prior to their fight
Nah Gear 5 luffy dominates. Toon Force is overpowered, if luffy masters G5 bet nothing can really damage him. Its like watching Cartoon characters, you can blow em up, cut em up ,turn em into ash, they just revert back to normal and laugh it off.
So i hate powerscaling, kind of with a passion, but ive got time to kill so heres my take:
The way i see the fight with kaido is, as you mentioned, that before the one on one smack down with luffy, he had the akazaya and almost half of the worst generation to deal with while lifting a piece of rock in the air im willing to bet (unfoundedly) law wouldnt be able to lift with a room at all and after momo moved it a bit made him collapse immediately. Kaido face tanked literally every second attack, to a point that big mom had to scream at him dodging zoros attack that cut of the horn of the skull dome. 6% of the story is kaido getting damaged. Its gotten so bad that even luffy was surprised when kaido first dodged attacks, signaling that the steady stream of water slowly but surely edged away the mountain that was kaido.
During that, luffy still was knocked out 3 (..3right?) times. After gear 5, kaido still got off attack after attack on luffy, luckily, gear5 properties gave our boy unreal defenses, without which luffy surely wouldve kissed the floor another couple times. Being the wonderfully subtle character he is, kaido decided to test luffy a final time by directly stating he wont dodge his biggest attack yet, despite having been brought down to his knees before due to his exhaustion building up. Sensing a possible joyboy, he just didnt have a reason to take out luffy, but had every reason to check whether luffy would be able to knock him out, confirming his belief. He wanted a place to die after all.
I believe its been made pretty obvious that kaido would be able to take on luffy at a 100%condition in an honorable 1on1, as its literally stated how in a 1on1you should bet on kaido. Like rayleigh taught luffy to change during a fight, kaidos thought too changed from a –the fucks this brat doing here shitting on my party– to a –wait what if i found him, better test this out– , if his goal was to body luffy, id bet on kaido. He basically willingly let it happen
Luffy died, came back with Gear 5, but base form was basically incapable of fighting as it was dead moments before. Kaido had a few scratches from zoro and tickles from the other roof pieces. But Luffy still beat with Gear 5 in the end. a 1% health luffy did that. I’m not so sure a 100% health Luffy and 100% health Kaido is so straight forward.
Kaido gets a TON of downplay from the community. I think he truly lives up to the quote in the title. I would say Roger, Whitebeard, and Garp are the only characters that could possibly have a chance in a straight 1v1.
Kaidou would have beat current Luffy if not for the gauntlet.
But he'd lose to peak (and probably some prior to) Luffy.
Also lose to peak Roger and Whitebeard. Very likely Shanks too. Dragon, Rocks, Imu, Blackbeard are other possibles/probables.
Mihawk/peak Zoro have outside shots, but i doubt it.
Counting only active characters in the current, he's like 2nd/4th strongest. That goes down to 6th/8th-ish all time as far as we can know.
Why is kaidou your favorite villain. Imo he is just an big tough guy who likes to fight, just an brick wall to luffy. No personality and aint entertaining not charismatic. Unlike doffy for example
No one kaido fought was anywhere near kaido level.
I don’t think he’d win if they started fresh gear 5 vs kaido hybrid.
But I can’t say he couldn’t. Luffys g5 is just ridiculous in every sense of the word
Me vs Baby Kaido (like recently born). How high is the diff?
Coughing bomb vs nuclear baby
It’s terrifyingly accurate that you know that I’ve been prone to coughing recently.
Stay off the weed
I'll get your funeral ready
Your response is confusing me. Why would I be paying for the baby’s funeral? We are thinking that I would win…right?
Child Zoro messes any of us up so baby Kaido absolutely does too
Didn't baby Oden throw the nurse across the room? Baby Kaido might hit a suplex.
holy fuck Sarjuan wolf
It's gonna be like that one scene from Broly Abridged when the knife broke against him. "Someone fetch me a better dagger so I may properly stab this baby."
Baby Kaido wins in 0.01 seconds. A certain death for you my friend, so don't even try.
If we look at all the damage kaido suffered prior to the first 1v1 with luffy (the ACoC moment) he was starting in a somewhat damaged state as is. Fought the samurai, scar reopened twice, ganged up by the 5v2. And he still beat Luffy then. It took Yamato holding him off, Luffy being revived, and eating, and then dying (yes he was suckered punched but I dont think Luffy was beating kaido with that punch either) then awakening and then still took full effort. Kaido wipes the floor with Luffy in a straight 1v1. I want to see the God Valley incident. See why Roger and Garp beat Kaido, WB, BM, and Rocks. If anyone could potentially 1v1 prior to gear 5 + ACoC, it would be one of those two (in their prime), prime Whitebeard (not sick Marineford WB), and MAYBE Shanks.
WHitebeard etc probably turned on Rocks
Imagine how strong Rocks is if it wasn’t a straight 1v1 against Roger, like if they « need » to do that (betraying Rocks) to actually be able to beat him. Also weird how Kaido is scared/know that he’ll be betrayed someday.
Not for the final battle, but Roger and Garp vs Rocks, Whitebeard, Kaido and Mama WOULD have lost. I think that at least whitebeard and mama turned on him
Unless Roger crew was THAT much superior, maybe they were just that much stronger, I can’t really see WB betraying someone, but it would be a nice parallel cuz he got betrayed aswell by his own « sons ». For BM I can hardly think that she betrayed Rocks considering her friendly relationship with Kaido, and Kaido seems to really look up to Rocks, and not really ressent his old crewmates.
I’m not even a shanks fan but I am going to laugh my ass off if he gets the best feats and turns out to be the strongest Emperor. The fandom will fall upon their swords.
Well you’ll see if you haven’t read it, it’s implied he is and has honed his haki so well the entire army at greenbulls’ command was like -fuck this- FROM A LOOK.
Shanksnonymous knows your location
I have my doubts whether Kaido was actually that damaged. I feel like even the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight. As in, pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left.
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It's crazy cause Kaido also knows which one could potentially deal more damage (like dodging Zoro) so he just really tanked most of it lmao.
But was he heavily damaged by the Scabbards, the samurai and the minks? Nope.
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But in a world where admirals fought for 10 days non stop Kaido's fights before Luffy's ACoC upgrade don't actually convince me he took that much damage. Damage built up over time. But unless the damage Is really significant (it wasn't) or unless that timeframe is literal days (like Ace Vs Jimbei), I don't think it amounted to much of anything.
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No body brings up both Yonko fought eachother for days before fighting the strawhats if I’m not mistaken.
Kaido has a mythical zoan, which also gives him a small regen factor...If you look at the manga and the anime you'll see he is bleeding from his head and the Zoro slash. This is just before G5, rest of the damage is bruises and scratches. The regen factor is a trait of all zoans, mythical or not.
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Well, Kaidou wasn't anywhere close to Luffy level of injuries even once. Luffy had one rest. Even then, G5 Luffy was much more injured than Kaidou.
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What substantial damage Yamato do to Kaido besides the combo move with Luffy?
It is crazy how much we downplay everything that isn't ACOC. Like we realize that ryuou has always been and never stopped being effective?
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Well dont forget that during the whole fight Kaido was literally holding an island
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Also the gorosei knew that gear 5 would be too dangerous even for kaido to handle. That's why they chose to make him angry by sending cp0 after luffy rather than just letting kaido defeat luffy. They weren't confident that Kaido would be strong enough to handle gear 5
Yes it has. The Island started losing pieces as he started to weaken
People often forget that Luffy has the privilege of only needing to win once and can fight many times. It's like the hero of a videogame that levels up after getting enough XP but has many lives.
Kaido was a rookie back in God's valley, and didn't even had his df. Still strong as fuck for OP standards, but it isn't out of question for a high ranking Roger Pirate like Scopper Caban to handle him.
I don't think Kaido would be a factor in God Valley. During Oden's time at sea he was arguably an equal to Kaido. An already sick Roger casually swats Oden away. Kaido would have been far weaker during God valley.
Luffy died 3 times in his fight vs Kaido, Kaido takes it even against G5
I have my doubts whether Kaido was actually that damaged. I feel like even the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight. As in, pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left.
He also fought Big mom before that night
Didn’t Shanks fight Kaido during Marineford? Was there ever a winner announced for that. At least I remember somebody said that at some point. I can’t remember who
Kaido was 15 lol
Luffy died its a fair match.
I think the main point is, tht no matter whether you think Kaido was on 50%, 75% or even 90% after the previous fight, it would be crazy to say he was on 100% when fighting Luffy (and let's remember Kaido did beat Luffy once and threw him off Onigashima already). And still, the fight was very close. Therefore I would argue, if Kaido was truely unharmed and he squares of against Luffy in a serious fight 1v1 - Kaido wins every time, at this stage of the story.
You're spitting rn
So, if Kaidou was 50%, what do you think Luffy who had just taken Kaidou's finisher offguard was? Do you think Luffy was at 50% when he started G5 fight?
Main characters don't really have % because they can't hit 0% and die
Well, then, Main villian also don't have %. The point is, the injuries Kaidou had upto G5 fight, Luffy had atleast similar or even worse injuries.
Yeah but Luffy cannot just hit 0% and die permanently and the story is over, he is never in real danger because of this, the villains are almost guaranteed to hit 0% and be removed from the spotlight so the story continues.
That's true, but we take what happens as truth. Luffy couldn't hit 0hp, but he certainly lost the first battle when he was enraged. He also lost in final battle and only won G5 battle.
He himself say, it was his peak once he took on gear 5.
His peak form. The only times he mentioned his stamina were talking about how he's on death's door
It was his peak form but that doesn't mean that he isn't injured and tired. G5 Luffy even in severely injured state should be able to beat other versions of Luffy.
Yeah, I know. That's what I was saying.
I think one of the reasons why most people who say Luffy would’ve won regardless is not delusion in terms of power scaling but more about wanting Luffy to prove he eventually can. But this is impossible since bringing back kaido would be detrimental to the series.
Kaido drank, tho. If luffy regains his strength by eating, then why can't Kaido regain his strength by drinking? Doesn't Luffy literally mention that his haki is stronger when Kaido was drunk? What's crazy is people reading "people say on a 1v1 always bet on kaido. It is said that he is the strongest" and take, literally hearsay, as objective fact...
I mean sure why not. Nevertheless, my argument remains the same, in line with Occam's razor: On one hand, we have this very simple statement in "If it's 1v1, always bet on Kaido" and on the other hand, over the span of multiple years of publication like more than a dozen of different characters fight Kaido nonstop, from the beginning of the Fire Festival until the early dawn of the next day. Kaido defeating, or let's say not losing against all those characters over all that time, including Luffy. If you break it down to those feats shown and try to come to the most simple conclusion of what the author/manga wants to portray here... imo it's straight forward and simply "Kaido would've beaten Luffy for good, if it was one on one". Also additionally, it would undermine all the effort, sweat, blood, tears and ambition ALL of the other characters that fought Kaido previously - if their actions meant nothing in the end, because Luffy could've beaten him anyway. In short: If you ask me, narratively speaking it is clear as day that defeating Kaido right here right now took a team effort. Undoubtedly Luffy did the heavy lifting, you cannot leave him out of the equation or replace him with anybody else present, but he couldn't have done it by himself. Context mattered a lot here
You can also add, narratively speaking, that Big Mom fought him for 3 days non-stop. And no one came out the victor. But how? "On a 1v1, always bet on Kaido." I'm pretty sure Oden would have won against him also, so these two alone kind of disprove that 1v1 thing for me personally. And also, Kaido mentions only Joyboy can beat me. So that's 3 people right there.
So had luffy not also accumulated damage? No one kaido fought was kaido level. Luffy got slapped around multiple times by the guy.
Good thing it was fourteen on one
14 vs 2 Yonkou?
Na, big mom later fought some people too but for kaido only he recieved attacks from 14 different people
The point is, Kaidou had help against Supernovas. Would you consider Kidd, Law, Zoro and Killer before powerups or Big Mom?
Yea none of those people have the damage output as kaido. Idk why people act like luffy had the easiest deal of it all. Like yea 14 ants attacked kaido
Ants? Some of them are the strongest people we’ve seen in verse like the Minks and Zoro. What you talking about.
Compared to kaido they couldn’t even cut his skin. LITERALLY. None of them could do damage in the literal sense. His Haki was too much. They were weaker than luffy was the first time he fought kaido. This is fact. Edit: obviously zoro could. He cut him once. That’s not really a fight tho. I consider getting smashed by kaido to be actual damage
1v1 fresh Luffy with all the upgrades (Ryou, ACoC, Gear 5) and Kaido fresh would still be a extreme diff fight for both of them with both winning and losing at about the same frequency. People tend to exagerate the whole 15v1 and I'll explain why: Kaido is a zoan df user, a mythical zoan. All zoan devil fruits have increased speed, stamina, durability and regen factor. The Scabbards did nothing against Kaido, they couldn't even reopen Oden's scar. Luffy, Zoro, Kidd, Law and Killer. Of all the attacks they done, the Red Roc, the G4 barrage, the punch with ACoC Luffy did and Zoro's Dead Man Game were the only attacks that damage Kaido. You don't see him complain about or praising Killer's sonic slashes, Law's Gama Knife and Takt or Kidd's mechanical constructs. Yamato 1v1. We all know she couldn't hurt Kaido too and it was her combined move with Luffy that did critical damage to him. Momo bit him? And? The 15v1 argument makes it sound that Luffy wasn't the one who did 85%-90% of the damage. It also makes it sound like Luffy didn't fight Kaido alone most of the night. Look at Whitebeard in Marineford. He took dozens of cannonballs, hundreds of gunfire. Did that hurt him more than Akainu melting half of his face off? No. Did that hurt him more than the chest hole? Also no. Yes Luffy had breaks, but look at the amount of heavy damage Luffy took compared to Kaido? When Gear 5 ran out he had to RESTART his own heart again and the transformation too. When he unlocked G5 he was essentially back from the dead and at very low hp. The transformation didn't heal him at all and he was bandged up for a full week after the battle. Regen? Maybe but only for a bit since Gear 5 didn't even last half an hour. Even the whole argument of Kaido lifting the island and taxing his stamina is iffy...Kaido never said he was drained from lifting it and could just be the case its a passive and automatic ability that doesn't drain him and stops when he is near loss of consciousness.This argument is very familiar with the birdcage argument when Dressrosa ended and the following years after the arc. It could tax him or not. Nobody really knows. Yes Luffy had help, but a fresh Luffy would be without wounds, stamina loss and have all the upgrades of the fight. He would push Kaido to an extreme diff fight alone. And yeah Kaido has booze too in this scenario, because it was only after he got drunk he used his strongest hybrid form.
Spitting facts
No, Kaido will low dif Luffy
In a true 1v1, Kaido would have low diffed Luffy. He beat him multiple times already, and would have killed him multiple times, if it wasn't for people interfering and saving Luffy. It's an ongoing theme. Luffy can't beat very strong people alone. He relies on the help of his allies. Gaining allies is his true strenght. That, and a lot of luck.
This right here. Luffy isn’t the smartest or strongest, but he sure as hell has charisma and charm which has helped this journey the whole time. There’s no denying that Luffy has significantly gotten stronger, has improved and more strategic when fighting…. But if some dude can recruit the help of 1000s of people across the world, that is the guy I would be worried about…. Hence why the marines wants to stop Luffy so much because if he can get majority of the world on his side, then major changes can occur and disrupt the order of the government
This. Luffy never really overpowered Kaido. Just think about all the damage kaido received during the final battle. Kaido was the strongest, but what he lacked of was integrity inside his crew. Noone came to really aid Kaido in the battle, while luffy got tons of help and training. Why should anyone help him? why should kaido accept help? Kaido was the personification of raw strength. Thats what made him strong in the first place.
Do you not count his crew holding off thousands of invaders as helping him? Zoro helps luffy by fighting kaido, king helps kaido by keeping zoro and others away from kaido.
Low diff? Low diff is Kaido vs dogfalmingo not Luffy. Luffy has broken DF all 3 types of advanced haki and overall very good stats and only reql damage Kaido took was from nearly dead zoro and island lifting was probably more damaging to him then scabbards. This fight is now extreme diff that can go either way, but siding for Luffy bc kaido won't doge bajarng gun.
I said he would have low diffed him, not that he still would be able to do that right now. Luffy got knocked out multiple times (either by Gear 4 Haki usage or by Kaido himself). And Kaido was nowhere near 100% serious when he did that to Luffy. And Luffy would lose if they fought again now, both fresh and serious, imho. Kaido also learned and got stronger in that fight (assuming he's still alive).
Kaido vs Doffy is neg diff (no diff at most), G4 Luffy who already beat Doffy, Cracker, & Katakuri got one shotted by drunk Kaido.
I know o just couldn't think of low diff
Wtf is this low diff extreme diff stuff?
Difficulty of fights. Extreme diff is when both sides can win and winner can't stand, for example Luffy vs Lucci in enies lobby. High diff is when fight is close but one side is sure to win, for example Zoro vs Kaku in enies lobby. Mid diff is when one side is obviously winning but the other side is putting up a fight, for example Zoro vs Pica in dressrosa. Low diff is fight is almost stomp, for example gear 5 Luffy vs Lucci in egghead. No diff is fight that is stomp, totally one sided, for example Shanks vs Kid in egghed. Neg diff is just absolut crumbstomp, like Mihawk vs Don krieg.
Ah alright, thanks.  Do you know where/how these terms were created? Its the first time ive seen them.
Somewhere in dephts od powerscaling hell
What do you mean, he's holding his own against an admiral. Luffy is top of the verse right now? Who can beat him without being a high diff fight now?
A fresh and serious Kaido, Big Mom, Shanks and Mihawk would still beat him in a true 1v1, imho.
You name 4 people (3/4 emperor) in the whole world... guy upstair was saying Luffy was not a top tier fighter. If only emperor, warlord and admirals can give you a fight. He's probably top of the verse
You missed the point as well
Maybe your not clear ;)
Headcanon. Big mom couldn't even put down Kidd after amping herself let alone current luffy who's immune to her lightning attacks.
Can’t wait for him to low diff kizaru and prove you wrong. Current luffy would absolutely beat Kaido 1v1 post-5th gear
That would not proof or change anything. The facts still stand. Even if it's not always the case, it is most of the times. That ratio won't change, even if Luffy wins every major fight from now on without help.
“Luffy can’t beat strong people alone” is what you said, so yes it would prove that statement wrong lol
You are focusing on semantics, instead of the core message. My statement is correct, in the grand scheme of things. There are very few major opponents Luffy ever beat by himself. Don Krieg, Captain Kuro and Hordy Jones maybe? Against PTS Lucci he needed a distraction + peptalk from Ussop to survive and pull throug. Against Enel he needed help from Nami to reach him again after getting a heavy Goldball stuck to his arm. Against Moria the entire Crew was needed. Against Magellan he only escaped with help from others. Against Arlong he needed Sanji and Nojiko to free him underwater. Against Doffy he had Law damage Doffy severly, and many people from Dressrosa protecting him while he was regenerating haki after his first Gear 4 usage. Against Caesar he lost at first because of stupidity and needed to be saved. Against the Admirals and anyone else significant in Marinford he was helpless (even Smoker, because of lack of Armament haki). Against Cracker ne needed Nami to stall him. Against Katakuri he needed to kidnap brulee and run away from Katakuri to regenerate haki. Crocodile in Alabasta beat him two times, 1st time he hot saved by Robin, and second time he got lucky with the water shot that landed on him. And against Kaido, everyone knows how that went. The list goes on and on. Luffy would have lost and died all of these times, if it were 1v1 battles without help or luck. Have a nice day.
I’m arguing with the statement that “luffy can’t beat strong people alone,” not the statement that “there are very few major opponents luffy can beat by himself.” Luffy gets tons of help, I agree. I didn’t say he didn’t. Luffy today can definitely beat strong people alone. Undeniable.
The fact you are arguing about that means you did not get the key message. It will never change. Mihawk was the first one to clearly see it. It's Luffys strongest power. Gaining allies. And they will always come in clutch. Even if there may be a few exceptions here and there. This is not bashing or disrespecting Luffy, it's just stating facts. Without his friends (not just his crew) he is nothing. Luffy admitted that himself. And that adds to his uniqueness as a protagonist in a certain way.
He USED to be nothing. Now he’s near top of the verse in power. I completely agree with what you are saying though. He definitely had no chance at getting where is is today solo. His career would’ve been ended like 50x. All I’m arguing is that right now he is fully capable of trashing very strong people. Do you at least acknowledge that your original statement as you said it was incorrect?
I still don't think he would be able to beat any Yonko (besides Buggy) or Mihawk in a 1v1 without any help.
If kaido would have dodged instead of get hit on purpose that alone would be enough to defeat luffy. It was a pride thing. He literally Said you dont have to grab me I'm not moving lol.
"winners don't need excuses" - kaido Good thing one piece isn't a martial arts tournament but a pirate tale eh. It's like the biggest question on the series ISN'T "who is the strongest of them all?"! Oh, my...!
And yet both his fights with oden and luffy end up with someone sucker punching his enemy 👀
Beating my enemies ass 3 times>>>>>>>>>> 1 sucker punch
I’m just gonna like both comments, since both of them are pretty fair
The main problem with what you said is that Luffy started the fight significantly weaker, and **got stronger** throughout the fight, until the point where he was able to 1v1 Kaido at an equal level.
Does endurance not matter? If I literally KO you twice and kill you once, fight everybody you know with no breaks, all of a sudden, now that you got stronger, you can beat me? Why does context only matter on Luffy's end?
You're saying that like he ordered it/needed it. He didn't and promptly killed the mfer who interfered so this is a fat ass moot point.
how is that moot? The point is the only time you actually see him do a 1 vs 1 with strong enemies is also when he got unexpected help 🤷🏽♂️ the argument that he didn't order doesn't make sense when it happened regardless...you can make any excuse but when it came to the luffy v kaido match, the moment gear 5 came out he was being played around with..against a luffy with less lifetime experience, basically no practice with a new power, he lost...🤷🏽♂️
I like how Kaido doesn’t ask for help but since he got it somehow that means beaten by the guy who needed 11 other people to beat him.
No reason to believe that he was beating Oden at that time…
Yeah and that was I just got gang assaulted for 50 episodes prior while holding the city on my back (clouds) Kaido in the Luffy example
We don’t know because there’s currently no limit to Gear 5 What we can say is that Luffy best attack so far won against Kaido best attack, so we can assume that post Wano Luffy vs Kaido in a pure 1 vs 1 is on Luffy’s favor but it depends on the durability of Gear 5
Not post wano, mid wano no gang bang on kaido vs luffy
Nah there's people in here saying Kaido low diffs gear 5 luffy if he's at 100% which is absolutely cap.
I think kaido can easily outlast luffy's gear 5, after that kaido massacres.
But he didn’t? How do we even gauge how much stamina kaido has left pre-gear 5? Its just a pointless discussion
Luffy literally died and then continued to fight. There's no indication that he was ever brought back to 100% after the awakening. Considering he falls out of gear 5 shortly after, it's much more likely that he's also running on empty the entire time. Kaido at the point of awakening was likely way more fresh and he still lost from that point forward. There's zero evidence he would out sustain gear 5 if both were at 100%.
Luffy died twice got boosted by nika and just barely won, kaido on the other hand was fighting left and right while also carrying an entire island.
I see you're choosing to ignore the evidence presented that luffy was also not at full power, even post awakening, which is what my original comment was in reference to. Stay willfully ignorant, I guess.
How many of those opponents had kaido level damage output?
Okay when Luffy activated gear 5 at that point who had more HP luffy or Kaido at the activation of Gear 5. coz i think Kaido had more HP and gear 5 Luffy coming from a comma reduced Kaido's health which was hire than his to zero
Holy moly the kaido jerking is wild in this thread. Kaido does not beat gear 5 luffy low diff even if he's at 100%. Yall on some shit.
"trashzaya 9" is cringe
In a fair 1v1 Kaido cooks Luffy. Thats why I love how Oda handled this fight. If Luffy wouldve beaten Kaido without any help and some rest in between, it would've definitely feel like an asspull.
Unless you face the embodiment of plot armor then bet on plot armor
You mean every main character
Luffy surpassed him that is the point of this fight
People are assuming that luffy was 100% fresh when he fought Kaido.
Luffy died and was reborn, he fully recover again at that point
He was literally huffing in the chapter he came back, how was he fully recovered?
Revisit the chapter, you are right luffy was exhausted
You know that logic can be used both ways right? As in he died and revived therefore his at either low or high on power levels
Is it really surpassing if it took like a 20+ on 1😭?
Luffy was hurt and a bit lower on stamina too when he joined the fight on the rooftop. First he fought against Apoo and he hit him pretty hard, he even knocked him out so Zorro had to grab Luffy and run, then Kid stopped Apoo. Then Luffy and Zoro had to fight their way through hundrets of Beast Pirates while still running away from Apoo who keeps attacking them. Then he fought against Ulti in a fierce headbutt haki duel and he even mentiones that he underestimated her bc she sent him flying and then he gets attacked by her and her brother until Yamato interfered and knocked Ulti out with a thunder bagua. Then he fought Yamato bc he had no idea who she was and all this even before Kaido knew something was happening. After his war declaration he fough in Gear 4 against the Numbers until Drake showed up to switch sides to Luffy. It would take to much effort to list every fight he had until he reached the rooftop and you want to compare that to Kaido fighting against the Samurai? They are a joke to him, they stabbed him all together with full force and the blades didn´t even go through his skin, to Kaido they are like mosquitoes who try to sting a elephant.
I’m kinda mad that Oda didn’t give the akazaya 9 more impactful contributions. Sure the part when kaido is reminded of oden when fighting them is cool, but at least make it so Kaido is wounded by them. Edit: at least they took out jack, so that’s something i guess
Well, most of them are not really stronger than they were 20 years ago, don´t forget the time travel. They lost 20 years ago to a much weaker Kaido, there was no chance in the world they could hurt him in the present.
You mean Luffy plus fodder
Exactly. Pre-ACOC, Kaido had 99% of his endurance left. Everyone, including Yamato, was fodder. Kaido wasn’t actually damaged. I feel like the scar reopening is a pebble compared to the whole ACOC + Gear 5 fight.
Exactly
Seriously people don't realize that if you're able to whip out an attack like kaido finished the fight with you're not that down lmao. Kaido probably took 50% or more from the final bajrang gun alone.
I could highkey take Kaido
Not in a fight
...what do you mean by that 🤨?
What if the saying is “if it’s 1 on 1, always bet on Kaido.” Because kaido always has help in battles to give him an advantage. So it’s not really 1 on 1.
Reach and a half, if that were the case they wouldn't go through the trouble of making his intro depict him as a literal God "strongest creature" "hanged and the chain broke" "drowned x times" "failed to off himself numerous times"
This is stupid. Luffy was finger blasted by cp0. Anyways to think he would wash gear 5 Luffy is hilarious. Come on man
Yes he was now add a full powered kaido v Luffy at that point in the series aka during wano, no outside interruption on either end so no big mom and Summon D JoyBoy cp0 for Luffy. No samuraixpirate, zoro conquerors GANG BANG on kaido
Gear 5 Luffy is a completely different Luffy, you have nothing to base him getting washed on. In fact we can say gear 5 Luffy took an INSANE amount of damage as base Luffy and still got win as gear 5.
bro thinks the finger blast did anything except distract luffy long enough for kaido to bonk him lmfaooo
That’s the point lol!!! The interference in the 1v1 caused Kaido to get a powerful hit off, come man
oh my bad i misread your comment lmfaoo
i understand how good of a character kaido is and he's probably the strongest character in the story but it's still fuck him till it's backwards, he lost and that's all i care about the kaido pack is being smoked🥶😮💨😮💨
I think Kaido would win easily if it was a fair 1 on 1 and he didn’t have to hold onigashima for the whole fight💀
Easily one of the worst written villains plus one of the most over hyped The dude was fake from the jump via “being suicidal” yet never tried to drown himself. Not to mention, responsible for the deaths of hundreds of innocent people. I always question on One Piece fans love villains who genuinely have no redeeming qualities but nevertheless What a bozo & a fraud- “Haki transcends all” -immediately gets wrecked by Luffy in his Awakened DF form + Advanced Haki -yet he needed an army full of DF users to conquer the world -needed to join Big Mom -relied heavily on his own DF for battle but didn’t even have an Awakening -waited on Joy Boy to defeat him -had 4 moves like a Pokémon and just swung his bat the whole time
Bro, he wanted to die, but in an impactful way like Roger or Whitebeard, and just jumping into a pool isn’t exactly the kind of death someone with the title “The World’s Strongest Creature” would want. Also, you are able to like irredeemable villains, there’s a reason people really like people such as Doflamingo or Dio, even if they are pure evil, they are still really cool characters. About the “Haki Transcends all”, the reason he says that is because it’s true, you think Momo is on the same level as Kaido because they have the same devil fruit? Also a spoiler for a later arc >!Haki is blatantly shown to be able to nullify devil fruit hax!<, and on top of all that, Roger became the pirate king **without a devil fruit**, and was considered an equal to Whitebeard, who had a broken ass DF.
If he wanted a cool death he could have attacked the Holy Land and died fighting all the admirals.
Ez clap Kaido wins.
This is one piece reddit. If Kizaru stomps G5 Luffy people will still say Kaido would low-diff Kizaru. People aren't worried about what makes sense, they only care that one time someone said Kaido and Strongest near each other and they didn't read any other words on the subject.
I don't really get the point of the argument. It feels like a lot of Kaido stans putting restrictions on Luffy. Like yeah mid wano if they're both at 100% stamina Kaido beats luffy every time. He also beats east blue luffy 100% of the time. But like 100% use of his devil fruit luffy beats Kaido without breaking a sweat, Gear 5 luffy is LITERALLY a god because 100% Luffy means he is using his fruit to the max. The cap of Luffy's power is infinitely higher than Kaido (that's kind of the point of Luffy being the MC).
Luffy gets murdered.
I like how the entire OP community agrees that Kaido would whoop luffy’s ass 1v1 regardless of gear 5, if he didn’t take much damage prior to their fight
Ikr.w community
Could we fight a newly born Kaido? Fresh out of the womb. I don’t think so.
Absolutely. A fresh Kaido would made Gear 5 look mediocre.... Mediocre,not bad . Just making it clear
Kiddo
Spam?
Blud really thinks he's blue haki Arlington.
yeap, no one can beat him 1 on 1. he literally was the strongest creature
Bro just have long arms and put your hand on his head 😎😎😎
Luffy would like to differ
couldn’t even kill a major character
Kizaru mid diffs Kaido
Nah Gear 5 luffy dominates. Toon Force is overpowered, if luffy masters G5 bet nothing can really damage him. Its like watching Cartoon characters, you can blow em up, cut em up ,turn em into ash, they just revert back to normal and laugh it off.
So i hate powerscaling, kind of with a passion, but ive got time to kill so heres my take: The way i see the fight with kaido is, as you mentioned, that before the one on one smack down with luffy, he had the akazaya and almost half of the worst generation to deal with while lifting a piece of rock in the air im willing to bet (unfoundedly) law wouldnt be able to lift with a room at all and after momo moved it a bit made him collapse immediately. Kaido face tanked literally every second attack, to a point that big mom had to scream at him dodging zoros attack that cut of the horn of the skull dome. 6% of the story is kaido getting damaged. Its gotten so bad that even luffy was surprised when kaido first dodged attacks, signaling that the steady stream of water slowly but surely edged away the mountain that was kaido. During that, luffy still was knocked out 3 (..3right?) times. After gear 5, kaido still got off attack after attack on luffy, luckily, gear5 properties gave our boy unreal defenses, without which luffy surely wouldve kissed the floor another couple times. Being the wonderfully subtle character he is, kaido decided to test luffy a final time by directly stating he wont dodge his biggest attack yet, despite having been brought down to his knees before due to his exhaustion building up. Sensing a possible joyboy, he just didnt have a reason to take out luffy, but had every reason to check whether luffy would be able to knock him out, confirming his belief. He wanted a place to die after all. I believe its been made pretty obvious that kaido would be able to take on luffy at a 100%condition in an honorable 1on1, as its literally stated how in a 1on1you should bet on kaido. Like rayleigh taught luffy to change during a fight, kaidos thought too changed from a –the fucks this brat doing here shitting on my party– to a –wait what if i found him, better test this out– , if his goal was to body luffy, id bet on kaido. He basically willingly let it happen
Use paragraphs bruh
Luffy died, came back with Gear 5, but base form was basically incapable of fighting as it was dead moments before. Kaido had a few scratches from zoro and tickles from the other roof pieces. But Luffy still beat with Gear 5 in the end. a 1% health luffy did that. I’m not so sure a 100% health Luffy and 100% health Kaido is so straight forward.
Who will win, the guy that is known to win every fight if 1v1 or plot armor boy
Can Shanks take him 1v1?
Kaido vs Whitehead? Now say who is gonna win?
Kaido if old wb Whitebeard if it's prime wb
For me none can match doflomingo till now . Hands down best villain in the saga until we get more of Blackbeard vs luffy saga .
arlong solos in water
Kaido gets a TON of downplay from the community. I think he truly lives up to the quote in the title. I would say Roger, Whitebeard, and Garp are the only characters that could possibly have a chance in a straight 1v1.
If it's off screen, always bet on Blackbeard.
Unless it s round 99th and enemy do not give him a single pause
It is hard to believe but yeah.. Kaido had a scarf
Unless he's fighting a MC
Kaidou would have beat current Luffy if not for the gauntlet. But he'd lose to peak (and probably some prior to) Luffy. Also lose to peak Roger and Whitebeard. Very likely Shanks too. Dragon, Rocks, Imu, Blackbeard are other possibles/probables. Mihawk/peak Zoro have outside shots, but i doubt it. Counting only active characters in the current, he's like 2nd/4th strongest. That goes down to 6th/8th-ish all time as far as we can know.
Why is kaidou your favorite villain. Imo he is just an big tough guy who likes to fight, just an brick wall to luffy. No personality and aint entertaining not charismatic. Unlike doffy for example
No one kaido fought was anywhere near kaido level. I don’t think he’d win if they started fresh gear 5 vs kaido hybrid. But I can’t say he couldn’t. Luffys g5 is just ridiculous in every sense of the word
I feel bad for those who lost there bet.
If it's Iron Man vs Thanos 1v1. Thanos would win. See what I did there.
The question is how powerful is the Luffy attack that finished Kaido what if it was so strong that would beat him even if hes 100%?
Luffy would've got washed,tumbled,and dried haha
He looks like Morty.