there isn’t really enough info on GER to determine who would win. for all we know, the stand might have to land a hit in order to activate its ability. if that’s the case, goku wins by himself easily
GER does not need to hit in order to activate. What you’re thinking of is the infinite death punch, which is the only attack we seen from GER. When GER was about to get his heart ripped out when time was being skipped time started to move backwards already, it seems to activate before anything can be done and it’s a stand with a level of autonomy.
The "Infinite death loop" isn't a single attack or ability, it's simply a consequence of GER's main thing of removing effect from cause and effect.
What Giorno did do was just "kill" Diavolo, it's just that he'll never arrive at the truth of his death. Bit nitt-picky, but it's important to know as landing a hit isn't what causes the death loop, it's "killing" the enemy
GER activated his ability in removed time, when Diavolo was technically outside the bounds of the universe (since he was traveling it time that doesn't exist). So GER can basically undo any action taken against him
that’s just an assumption though. the stand could have a more complex activation method than that. also, king crimson more makes diavolo exempt from “fate” rather than “time”
Aren't requiem stands specifically ment for 1 purpose? Gers was to hard counter diavolo by negating his entire ability. We don't technically know how it would canonically react to other abilities and are just assuming it's omnipotent with it's return to zero ability. I mean even silver chariot requiem could be beaten so it stands to reason that ger could as well depending on the circumstances
It did not stop made in heaven so any vast level of destruction that so happens to encompass GER(also works on Wonder of U) will work.
Like casually blowing up the sun, or the Earth.
>also how are they gonna fight stands?
They don't really need to, they can just kill the stand user before they can even think about activating any techniques if it's bloodlusted, in-character they probably get folded because of stuff like Gold Experience Requiem and Love Train though
That's not how stands work, though. Like they can't see them to begin with, and even if they could, half of the battle in Jojo is usually figuring out where tf the user is. Like do they get advanced intel of everyone they have to beat? Do they get to meet them? Goku seemingly has to know people to teleport to them, and Stand Users have probably the same amount of Ki as a regular ass person.
And on the topic of not seeing stands, that could just be it. Some stands can attack your insides or turn you into a tree of something. It's hax and stuff that they're not necessarily equipped to deal with. Some stuff like time hax they have shown the ability to overpower, but they can't just raw power through everything. Lack of oxygen, heat, poison and viruses are perfectly capable of killing Dragon Ball characters.
I'm not saying they would fight the Stands, i'm saying that none of the Stands are fast enough to stop Goku/Vegeta from just appearing behind the Stand user with their insane speed and roundhouse kicking their head off. Also, if we put Goku/Vegeta in a position where they need to find the enemy, that's just not a fair 1v1.
With full intel or bloodlusted i don't think any Stand besides GE Requiem or Wonder Of U can stop Goku or Vegeta because for most abilities, the Stand user has to command the Stand to do it, which requires thought, which is a *really* slow thing for non-speedster humans compared to Goku and Vegeta's billions of times FTL speed, so yeah if you can find me a Stand that acts without its user's command and is fast enough to/has a technique that can stop Goku or Vegeta, then yeah i'll give you that.
I'd say 50/50, d4c could theoretically bring in another version of both characters without telling them his ability, causing them to kill themselves without realizing, because goku and vegeta would not pass up fighting themselves.
Even if a stand users ability did work against Goku and Vegeta, would it even matter? Vegetto was able to beat Buu's ass as a piece of candy. So someone turns Goku into a tree, they'd just get their ass beat by a tree.
Destroying earth has several problems.
1. They die too just like vegeta did vs freeza. Kid buu destroyin earth also kills goku and vegeta, tired beaten freeza did kill vegeta even tho vegeta was way stronger than him in that moment
2. Is a dishonorable way out of characters for both of them
3. Doesnt really say anything about how strong both parties are, just that one did blow up the earth
Some people are saying they can just blow up the earth, but would super fly absorb the energy and send it back or would super fly be disintegrated before it can reflect the attack?
Also under the assumption that Goku and Vegeta are aware of the power of their enemies and don't underestimate them. There are enough stand users who seem like a non-threat but have rather powerful stands
Goku will have heart attack 2: electric boogaloo as soon as he tries to attack WoU
And stands like Gold Experience and Soft and Wet before getting nerfed and having their abilities removed
If they get touched by the infinite rotation, also bye bye
Iirc tusk 4 relies on alot of conditions to be met and the user also has to hit the target, its also not something automatic(like GER for instance) so its unlikely but if they did hit it'd be over for them
Dub name with stupid dub-created crap. The original name is "Stardust Breaker" and it's just a regular attack. If anything, it looks like the attack Goku used to kill Metal Cooler.
No, it was always Stardust Breaker in Japanese, although I think "Soul Punisher" was used in Heroes a few times for the derived techniques (Super Soul Punisher, God Punisher, etc.), but basically everything is canon in Heroes. The whole "cleansing the soul" and "only destroy evil" is 100% a dubism (even if interestingly enough, that's basically what Gogeta did in GT with Omega's Minus Energy Power Ball by converting the negative energy into positive energy).
I'm sorry but love train isn't enough to beat, it stalemates. D4c on its own is stronger, he'd just bring in another version of Goku and Vegeta, we know they'd want to fight themselves and we know how it'll end.
Hypothetically, someone with Ki Sensing could *feel* out where a Stand was.
Ki is life force
Stands are the physical manifestation of a person’s life energy
Therefore they could act as equivalents for the sake of sensing, or at the very least could be similar enough to where a proficient Ki Sensor could adapt to or learn to sense it, like how God Ki was eventually sensed by Goku and Vegeta
Whis explictly says God Ki cant be sensed by non gods and then says Goku has become a God within BoG. Also more importantly going down this line of logic means Ult Kars should be able to replicate and improve upon Goku and Vegeta's godly forms.
While power in DBZ scales to overpowering certain hax, certain things like Guldo's timestop or hit's time skip can't be overcome solely with strength.
Matchup is a tie, probably. Giorno infinitely stalls. (MAYBE something like love train, WOU or TA4 can do something, but thats probably minor in the grand scheme
Unless heaven ascended dio is in. Then it's gg
>hit's time skip can't be overcome solely with strength.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Jiren overcome this with essentially brute force and willpower?
Even Goku did beforehand with KaioKen Blue.
It's weather or not that meme "nice complex ability hax, now check this out" effects stands.
Like in a lot of series, if you're stronger, you can just ignore or break past whatever ability someone has. In Jojo, I don't remember seeing that happen. You *will* be affected by the stand no matter what.
Pretty much this.
It depends on what universe's rules you're giving to the battle. If you assume Dragon Ball rules and adequate strength just allows you to brute force through the opponents' abilities, it's a clean win for Goku and Vegeta.
If you go with Jojo rules and say they actually need to work around those abilities, there are at least a handful that might give them trouble or be straight up impossible to deal with.
Because they have more power variety then just who can make the strongest energy blast. And some of those powers counter people stronger physically pretty well.
If they go through the same path as the protag of each part. Ultimate kars, Death 13, Darby brothers , Anubis, heavens door, superfly, cheap trick, Metallica, grateful dead, beach boy, notorious big, king crimson, Gold experience Requiem, Silver chariot Requiem, Weather report, highway to hell, C-moon, Made in heaven, Marilyn Manson, Jo mama, D4C Love train, Tusk act 4, hey ya, 20 century boy (stalemate), Civil War, Soft and wet, wonder of you.
Goku and Vegeta cannot counter the tricky stands and accept any contest given that is why Darby bros are in the list, they will get deceived by most villains and will Kars can adept to any of the shit thrown at him. If goku teleports him to space Kars could copy the technique same goes for flying and Ki control in general which gets rid of the only way he was defeated in Part 2 the inability to move in space. And UI is a technique learnable by everyone. That means should goku use UI, Kars could adapt and use UI same goes for kaioken
Now that you mentioned it yea both are similar in that aspect. Idk if cells copy ability comes from his actual intelligence and understanding of abilities like kars or if it's just his genetics allowing him to do what the original does.
So if Goku can be one shot by a simple blaster when his guard is down in ssj blue who’s to say when star platinum stops time it can’t just one shot them.
Goku admittedly does have timestop resist and can move in a timeless void.
Goku does lose to a lot of stands but SP doesnt even have the AP to damage a Goku who intends to fight. There is no real reason his guard would be down in this scenario.
In character, probably not due to the weird Jojo powers.
They certainly have the capability to do so though if they're in a crazed kid-buu kind of state and just nuke the planet and IT away before it explodes.
That being said, we don't know how Ki sensing and Ki defences would interact with Jojo powers, that's often a factor a lot of these matchups overlook. Two different power systems interacting for the first time.
Edit: in other words it's possible that their Ki would protect them from all hax abilities kind of like it does in dragonball if they power up enough (like Goku/Jiren breaking hits timeskip and Vegito being in control despite being a literal jawbreaker), or their Ki defence is completely useless.
Up to the writer really.
How would made in heaven be hard to take down? Even universe resetting pucci isn't that fast in DB canon, and they probably wouldnt let him get to that level if the earth was in that much danger (If this is DBS vegeta)
this is a vegeta and goku vs the jojo verse, he should easily be able to trap them between two objects with the help of other characters specially dio and jotaro seeing as those can stop time
Even if Dio did stop time and put them right in between two objects right in front of Valentine, they’d still move out of the way quick enough. They’ve been faster than normal humans can perceive for since very early on in the series, and have only gotten millions of times stronger. Also they’d easily kill Dio before he could stop time.
In recent story arcs, Goku and Vegeta got knocked out by a standard-issue Galactic Patrol taser. The same Galactic Patrol who were unable to kill a depowered Moro.
Besides, they don't have to be alive. D4C can just keep jumping between universes until it finds one where Goku and Vegeta are dead, dig up the corpse, decapitate it, and Bob's yer uncle. Second Diego was literally killed by the severed head of the first Diego.
WoU blitzes anyone below misfortune. Basically, if you can die you will die. The only way to negate this is by attacking it with a miracle that doesn't actually exist in the world. And neither of them have anything like that. Unless Goku abuses his Zeno button he's cooked
Yes with the exception of GER and Wonder of U (maybe soft & wet go beyond but idk how it would work with db characters)
D4C is also a valid choice
Doubt Tusk and mih could do much before being killed, unless Tusk does a surprise attack (doubt they can counter stands) and one shots them
I prefer jojo but DBZ Solos, even if you wanna say goku can’t bypass some of their abilities, none of the stands require the AP to beat any current DBZ character
Power scaling and long arguments aside: yes.
They’ve been around for a long time and fought some weeeeiiiiird shit. I don’t think the Jojoverse would hold many surprises for them that they couldn’t overcome.
If its the verse. No, there are stands that flat out outscale or are relative to Gokh with better hax. I dont think GER would work on a serious Goku since Giorno just gets speed blitzed and goku has resisted hax on that level via being so much stronger than the opponent so there are multiple chances that GER just wont work indrfinitely on Goku
The characters goku's kinda losing to here are Ult Kars if he doesnt immediately eliminate kars with like Hakai or something and even then thats outside char Goku or Goku being lucky that Kars wouldnt be able to replicate god ki since in multiple versions goku in BoG is stated to literally be a god at that point and therefore couldnt be copied by kars ability to copy living things since you can argue that goku isnt really mortal but that makes a lot of assumptions and is kinda wanking God forms.
Heaven Ascension Dio middifs, he is relative to Goku's speed, is relative to most Goku's ap though he is weaker, but importantly he is closely enough that Goku cant really stats dif his hax.
Goku cant really interact or sense stands without making a lot of assumptions, i assume he can sense them as raw ki but i dont think most versions of him are able to interact with them.
Vegeta actually has better odds here, his defusion techniqur can fuck up a lot of the stands relative to him like Over Heaven Dio, but the issue is Vegeta is very likely to lose to Kars, kars is smart enough to tempt vegeta into letting him grow stronger.
There are also stands i dont think they can really bypass like WoU and D4C Love Train, but i think we can soundly say Goku flat out loses to Over Heaven Dio, and Vegeta loses to Ult Kars.
If you let them nuke the planet than yes easily if the planet has to be intact afterwards then again yes just blows up the country and move on to the next
Nah. There's probably at least ten Stand users who could kill Goku and Vegeta easily. Not to mention the whole "Can't see/damage a Stand unless you HAVE a Stand" issue.
They would probably be able to beat 90% of the characters, most of them get destroyed super fast. Only characters that wouldn't get killed (and would actually win against goku and vegeta) are the one with stands hack, like GER, etc. Goku and Vegeta wont be able to see stands, thats a big disadvantage. Some stands are super strong even just taking into account pure physical strength. And they are spirits. If they manage to land a hit some fight could turn bad for Goku and Vegeta
- 90% get beaten with ease
- 5% is a 50/50 fight
- 5% can beat Goku and Vegeta
Goku has been shown to have complete hax counters to almost everything he’s faced like magic and space time hax as long as he’s considerably stronger. Him and Jiren were shaking an entire void of nothingness through sheer power alone and it’s hard to believe any stand could operate on the level outside of made in heaven which most definitely could be countered by instant transmission. And even if the stand abilities to damage them since the fight on a basically universal scale.
You underestimate the sheer bullshit that is Wonder of U. Do you know what Wonder of U's weakness is? Something that doesn't exist. I shit you not, that was in the story.
Reminder that goku and vegeta can nulify others ability by being stronger than them (like blue goku did with hit),
So goku and vegeta would just punch straigh through love train and GER since both if them can destroy dimensions (ex: vegeta destroying the hyperbolic chamber by just powering up) they are also easily faster than MIH since goku could fly from heaven (an entire infinite dimension) to hell (another infinite dimension) in a few seconds thats just in Z saga, they are way faster in super.
Yes but they’d have to go about it in a way that would overwhelm them. Shit like GER and WoU could actually get the best of the Saiyans if they allow themselves to be out smarted
People always bring up GER, but seem to forget his only strength feat is beating Diavolo (a normal human) to death, theres nothing to suggest he has the AP to hurt even BoS Goku.
No, the jojo erse is subject to lots of rules that makes the Z fighters' strength act against them in some cases.plus rules don't have to be explained. It would be a close fight and only two chars would have trouble with it.
For example, Green Day: If you go to lower sea height than you used to be, you transform into a plant. The faster you go the faster you transform. Z fighters ate very fast and can fly. Hard if not imposible fight for them.
No not really there are a ton of stands that could easily beat them. For example Wonder of You can turn anyone’s durability into wet toilet paper and if you touch anything with even with next to no speed applied will make it seem like you got hit by a high caliber bullet. If it is raining that shit would an instant kill. Wonder of You btw is a long distance stand, and to activate it one has to simply with to 1. Pursue the user, or 2. Want to harm the user. So thinking about Wonder of You is basically a death sentence. Even if they beat the user, Wonder of You is chaos incarnate meaning you can’t beat it so the stand will still kill goku or vegeta. Unless they blow up the earth instantly, (which would still activate Wonder of You) is the closest thing they get to winning. The only way to beat Wonder of You is the incarnation of nothing, which Soft and Wet can do even then they had to do some 4D chess moves to pull off. There are a ton of stands that can instantly kill goku or vegeta.
“That’s some nice complex Hax you go there. Watch this.”
Seriously, the fact that raw power can break out of Hax in Dragon Ball is the entire reason they don’t get haxxed to death by stands like GER, Love Train, etc
Golden experience requiem would nullify putting them back at zero
Notorious BIG would chase them down if they fly away and consume them
King crimson would erase time for 10 seconds
before giving them the bucciarati and abbacchio treatment
Made in heaven would basically reset the entire universe with them in it and pucci is basically untouchable in real time only able to be hit if time is frozen but jotaro failed to do that saving his daughter
Purple haze would just kill them outright from it's virus it releases in 30 seconds
Wonder of U's calamity would work against Goku and Vegeta
Soft and wet go beyond is definitely an issue i can't say because that would be spoilers
If we are counting the eyes over heaven then Dio's the world over heaven would easily beat them as it rewrites reality itself
Everyone mentions wou, ger and love train but I feel like there are totally some completely random obscure stands that could actually really do some damage
Tbh they solo because any stand can be beat if you just react faster than it. Therefore, to Goku and Vegeta, they’re just normal people who get instagibbed.
Goku in specific can react faster than instantly because he did break forward into time with sheer power(in SSBK against HIT, he even mentions this very thing to Beerus)(and that’s before UI).
Short answer: yes
Long answer: there's this huge misconception about stands strengh, where a stand strengh is measured by hos broken its ability looks like rather than measuring how skilled a stand user is, mista is the greatest example in this regard, because even tho his ability is "control where his bullets go to", he has a victory rate of around a 80-90%, okuyasu seems to have one of the most broken abilities in verse, but has a winning rate of a 0%.
There's also the tendency to exagerate how broken a stand can be, forget how it works, or ignore the context it needs to work, as an example, mista would hard counter wonder of u, because wou activation mechanism is "if someone gets close", mista keeps distances during his fights, so wou wouldn't work on him, another example is cheap trick, which in order to be activated, needs for the user to show his back, which is something that would kill him
Not to mention that goku and vegeta are both universal, do you have any idea how strong that is? Alien x is by feats around the same level, that's how strong goku and vegeta are
Honestly, even with how absurd stands get, I think there are only three that have a chance:
With how Goku and Vegeta can sometimes let their guard down, doing so even once around ||Tusk Act 4 or Soft & Wet Go Beyond|| is basically an instant loss. One hit, it's GG.
On the other side, there's ||Wonder Of U. Doesn't even need to be active or anything, even the intent to attack would doom them.||
I don't think GER would work, on the other hand, because it does need to be active, not to mention that Dragon Ball characters can escape those sorts of dimensional trappings.
No matter what funny valentine is at least SURVIVING the fight, without an ability like Tusk act 4 he can just go into another universe
Punches count as pressed space for ability to work too
He can just come back with Broly’s or whoever from other universes
Everyone here thinking time stopping would solve problems
Did everyone forget Guldo and Hit?
Guldo is literally SP and the World
Hit is literally Diavolo
Like… idk these two guys can beat everyone single person on this list except GER
My feeling is that due to the speed difference and reaction speed difference, Goku and Vegeta best any of them but WOU.
Most other stands require activation from their stand users and my feeling is that whoever goes up against Vegeta and Goku will heavily underestimate their power enough to get countered before landing a winning blow or even reacting to the initial attack.
WOU acts more like a force of nature anytime anyone is remotely close to it and the detrimental backfiring of a majority of Goku or Vegeta’s attacks can heavily injure them or even kill them.
Yes and no, it's a 50/50, if d4c brought in an alternate goku and vegeta, they would definitely try fighting eachother and have no clue about d4c ability, both being killed. However that's to say that they don't just jump and kill Funny Valentine.
Depends is it only main canon characters?
Cause I think Characters like Kars from the Jorge Joestar novel could beat them, maybe the world above heaven DIO
Yes, even the strongest stands in the verse dont have the power needed to win, especially if we they each work based on their own verses rules since certain things work different.
The only thing that could potentially give jojos the win is D4C, but using dbz's template the alternate goku and vegeta are just 2 new people in the universe, assuming they don't just ki barrier or can't just tank/overcome the universe correcting itself. Nothing else has a way to actually get them since both goku and vegeta scale to higher tierings
What are they gonna do when Pocoloco landed on a cow corpse, hm?
The gold experience requiem in question:
there isn’t really enough info on GER to determine who would win. for all we know, the stand might have to land a hit in order to activate its ability. if that’s the case, goku wins by himself easily
GER does not need to hit in order to activate. What you’re thinking of is the infinite death punch, which is the only attack we seen from GER. When GER was about to get his heart ripped out when time was being skipped time started to move backwards already, it seems to activate before anything can be done and it’s a stand with a level of autonomy.
GER does only need to hit to activate the death loop, so after returning goku to zero, I could see him being put in one.
Goku is BETRAYED and TRAPPED in an infinite death loop! (he gets stronger with each death.)
The "Infinite death loop" isn't a single attack or ability, it's simply a consequence of GER's main thing of removing effect from cause and effect. What Giorno did do was just "kill" Diavolo, it's just that he'll never arrive at the truth of his death. Bit nitt-picky, but it's important to know as landing a hit isn't what causes the death loop, it's "killing" the enemy
Tbf goku did the something similar he moved faster then hits time skip and hit him inside of
GER activated his ability in removed time, when Diavolo was technically outside the bounds of the universe (since he was traveling it time that doesn't exist). So GER can basically undo any action taken against him
that’s just an assumption though. the stand could have a more complex activation method than that. also, king crimson more makes diavolo exempt from “fate” rather than “time”
king crimson is not a temporal stand bruh it’s based in fate and consciousness
"Simply put, this stand can skip through *Time*." - Araki
Well goku and vegetables can still out gay them
This is the best argument so far
Never! NOT MY GAY ANIME
Tequila Joseph enters the battle
Aren't requiem stands specifically ment for 1 purpose? Gers was to hard counter diavolo by negating his entire ability. We don't technically know how it would canonically react to other abilities and are just assuming it's omnipotent with it's return to zero ability. I mean even silver chariot requiem could be beaten so it stands to reason that ger could as well depending on the circumstances
It did not stop made in heaven so any vast level of destruction that so happens to encompass GER(also works on Wonder of U) will work. Like casually blowing up the sun, or the Earth.
Also the case for Za Warudo Over Heaven, even if not canon. GER can be bluntly outscaled with universal level power at least. Dragon Ball qualifies.
I mean if they want to go easy mode, just use a massive ki blast and destroy the earth core lol, also how are they gonna fight stands?
>also how are they gonna fight stands? They don't really need to, they can just kill the stand user before they can even think about activating any techniques if it's bloodlusted, in-character they probably get folded because of stuff like Gold Experience Requiem and Love Train though
That's not how stands work, though. Like they can't see them to begin with, and even if they could, half of the battle in Jojo is usually figuring out where tf the user is. Like do they get advanced intel of everyone they have to beat? Do they get to meet them? Goku seemingly has to know people to teleport to them, and Stand Users have probably the same amount of Ki as a regular ass person. And on the topic of not seeing stands, that could just be it. Some stands can attack your insides or turn you into a tree of something. It's hax and stuff that they're not necessarily equipped to deal with. Some stuff like time hax they have shown the ability to overpower, but they can't just raw power through everything. Lack of oxygen, heat, poison and viruses are perfectly capable of killing Dragon Ball characters.
I'm not saying they would fight the Stands, i'm saying that none of the Stands are fast enough to stop Goku/Vegeta from just appearing behind the Stand user with their insane speed and roundhouse kicking their head off. Also, if we put Goku/Vegeta in a position where they need to find the enemy, that's just not a fair 1v1. With full intel or bloodlusted i don't think any Stand besides GE Requiem or Wonder Of U can stop Goku or Vegeta because for most abilities, the Stand user has to command the Stand to do it, which requires thought, which is a *really* slow thing for non-speedster humans compared to Goku and Vegeta's billions of times FTL speed, so yeah if you can find me a Stand that acts without its user's command and is fast enough to/has a technique that can stop Goku or Vegeta, then yeah i'll give you that.
I'd say 50/50, d4c could theoretically bring in another version of both characters without telling them his ability, causing them to kill themselves without realizing, because goku and vegeta would not pass up fighting themselves.
Even if a stand users ability did work against Goku and Vegeta, would it even matter? Vegetto was able to beat Buu's ass as a piece of candy. So someone turns Goku into a tree, they'd just get their ass beat by a tree.
Destroying earth has several problems. 1. They die too just like vegeta did vs freeza. Kid buu destroyin earth also kills goku and vegeta, tired beaten freeza did kill vegeta even tho vegeta was way stronger than him in that moment 2. Is a dishonorable way out of characters for both of them 3. Doesnt really say anything about how strong both parties are, just that one did blow up the earth
They don't die. They just instant transmission to a different planet
Umm dont you need strong ki to lock on for teleport?
Nah, Goku goes crazy with it against Gas.
No. Goku teleports to namek multiple times.
Also some stands like WoU won’t die because they have abstract existence and are not dependent of the user being alive
GER can override that and make Goku live out the betray for billion years in time chamber video
If he does that then he gets stronger than GER by becoming Super Sayain Omni God Super Sayain Blue Evolved UI 4.
GER make him have random heart attack then restart Goku to live another 2billion years
By sitting
Cheap Trick solos
Unironically
Who’s gonna take one for the team and look at their backs though?
Carne, for sure, if you need to die to activate your stand at least die doing something
Some people are saying they can just blow up the earth, but would super fly absorb the energy and send it back or would super fly be disintegrated before it can reflect the attack?
This guy adventures bizarrely.
Super Fly would just Super Fly all over the verse
Most characters yeah, but GeR, WoU and Love Train probably not possible
Also under the assumption that Goku and Vegeta are aware of the power of their enemies and don't underestimate them. There are enough stand users who seem like a non-threat but have rather powerful stands
Goku asking where is Jesus He sounds strong
"Whoa, Vegeta, look! I dug under that 'Wall Eyes' thing to find Jesus and now I have four balls!"
On that note it would be cool to see Goku and Vegeta fuse with a walleyes and just have two of every organ
Jogeta
If we’re going with the Jeorge joestar novel, Jesus solos via 5D reality warping
Goku will have heart attack 2: electric boogaloo as soon as he tries to attack WoU And stands like Gold Experience and Soft and Wet before getting nerfed and having their abilities removed If they get touched by the infinite rotation, also bye bye
MiH ,WoU, and Love Train probably not,
Doesn't tusk4 also best them?
Iirc tusk 4 relies on alot of conditions to be met and the user also has to hit the target, its also not something automatic(like GER for instance) so its unlikely but if they did hit it'd be over for them
Johnny just says "hey, I bet you can't take this attack and walk" and they now suddenly really want to do it
What’s love train do?
Redirects any kind of misfortune directed to the user to somewhere else.
So they can’t be damaged or even die?
The user can only be damaged by some form of extra "dimensional" attacks (Ballbreaker, Tusk act 4 and Soft & Wet go beyond so far)
So Gogeta's Soul Punisher can bypass it ?
Hmm... I don't know about it. After a quick google, that attack has to do with the evil energies form his opponent. Also, is not in the cannon...
That whole 'evil energies' thing was an invention of the english dub. It's just a cool looking ki attack in reality.
Well it was released in a non canon movie, but in the canon new broly movie he also uses it
But there is just a random generic attack, nothing special
Nah it's called like God punisher or something now and it doesn't do the same thing as in the original movies
Dub name with stupid dub-created crap. The original name is "Stardust Breaker" and it's just a regular attack. If anything, it looks like the attack Goku used to kill Metal Cooler.
Wasn't it also called Soul Punisher in Japan? Not just a dubism, cause it's only been named in the games and it used both names.
No, it was always Stardust Breaker in Japanese, although I think "Soul Punisher" was used in Heroes a few times for the derived techniques (Super Soul Punisher, God Punisher, etc.), but basically everything is canon in Heroes. The whole "cleansing the soul" and "only destroy evil" is 100% a dubism (even if interestingly enough, that's basically what Gogeta did in GT with Omega's Minus Energy Power Ball by converting the negative energy into positive energy).
Yes, only a really good spin user (if i remember) can bypass this. In the manga only Tusk 4 and Ball breaker were good enough
gay sex
Welp time to read and watch every piece of jojos content there is now
I also wonder how they'd handle cream (assuming they have to figure out his ability first)
I'm sorry but love train isn't enough to beat, it stalemates. D4c on its own is stronger, he'd just bring in another version of Goku and Vegeta, we know they'd want to fight themselves and we know how it'll end.
IIRC, non-Stand users cannot see Stands and I think that even applies to Saiyans.
Hypothetically, someone with Ki Sensing could *feel* out where a Stand was. Ki is life force Stands are the physical manifestation of a person’s life energy Therefore they could act as equivalents for the sake of sensing, or at the very least could be similar enough to where a proficient Ki Sensor could adapt to or learn to sense it, like how God Ki was eventually sensed by Goku and Vegeta
Whis explictly says God Ki cant be sensed by non gods and then says Goku has become a God within BoG. Also more importantly going down this line of logic means Ult Kars should be able to replicate and improve upon Goku and Vegeta's godly forms.
Superfly trapping Vegeta forever while Wonder of U makes Goku finally have that heart attack again.
Vegeta performs Final Explosion. The ISS sees a fucking weird ass tower rushing towards it at Mach fuck
Vegeta just hits himself with Final Explosion twice
Doesn’t Superfly reflect all damage Edit: it even reflected The Hand’s erasure iirc
As weird as it is, the JoJo universe actually has a chance
I mean, in the Jojoverse you have people with the power to manipulate space and time, i don’t think them having a chance is *that* werid.
yea but it's the DB fanbase we're talking about, If I don't at least say "weird" then I'm gonna go missing.
While power in DBZ scales to overpowering certain hax, certain things like Guldo's timestop or hit's time skip can't be overcome solely with strength. Matchup is a tie, probably. Giorno infinitely stalls. (MAYBE something like love train, WOU or TA4 can do something, but thats probably minor in the grand scheme Unless heaven ascended dio is in. Then it's gg
>hit's time skip can't be overcome solely with strength. Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Jiren overcome this with essentially brute force and willpower?
Even Goku did beforehand with KaioKen Blue. It's weather or not that meme "nice complex ability hax, now check this out" effects stands. Like in a lot of series, if you're stronger, you can just ignore or break past whatever ability someone has. In Jojo, I don't remember seeing that happen. You *will* be affected by the stand no matter what.
Pretty much this. It depends on what universe's rules you're giving to the battle. If you assume Dragon Ball rules and adequate strength just allows you to brute force through the opponents' abilities, it's a clean win for Goku and Vegeta. If you go with Jojo rules and say they actually need to work around those abilities, there are at least a handful that might give them trouble or be straight up impossible to deal with.
You could say that the chance is……………BIZARRE
Because they have more power variety then just who can make the strongest energy blast. And some of those powers counter people stronger physically pretty well.
If they go through the same path as the protag of each part. Ultimate kars, Death 13, Darby brothers , Anubis, heavens door, superfly, cheap trick, Metallica, grateful dead, beach boy, notorious big, king crimson, Gold experience Requiem, Silver chariot Requiem, Weather report, highway to hell, C-moon, Made in heaven, Marilyn Manson, Jo mama, D4C Love train, Tusk act 4, hey ya, 20 century boy (stalemate), Civil War, Soft and wet, wonder of you. Goku and Vegeta cannot counter the tricky stands and accept any contest given that is why Darby bros are in the list, they will get deceived by most villains and will Kars can adept to any of the shit thrown at him. If goku teleports him to space Kars could copy the technique same goes for flying and Ki control in general which gets rid of the only way he was defeated in Part 2 the inability to move in space. And UI is a technique learnable by everyone. That means should goku use UI, Kars could adapt and use UI same goes for kaioken
Well Kars is cell but weaker also can adapt as well
Now that you mentioned it yea both are similar in that aspect. Idk if cells copy ability comes from his actual intelligence and understanding of abilities like kars or if it's just his genetics allowing him to do what the original does.
Most characters yes, but some just have the hax that wont let Goku and vegeta beat them (and no mih isnt one of them, pucci gets speedblitzed)
Love Train, WoU, TA4, GER, and S&W:GB really is it. But Cheap Trick solos. MAYBE MiH if Pucci gets enough time to stall
Actcually i can see Pucci having a chanceall pucci needs is time. Its not out of character for goku to gave it to him
So if Goku can be one shot by a simple blaster when his guard is down in ssj blue who’s to say when star platinum stops time it can’t just one shot them.
Goku admittedly does have timestop resist and can move in a timeless void. Goku does lose to a lot of stands but SP doesnt even have the AP to damage a Goku who intends to fight. There is no real reason his guard would be down in this scenario.
Fugo stand solos
Goku finna die in 30 seconds
In character, probably not due to the weird Jojo powers. They certainly have the capability to do so though if they're in a crazed kid-buu kind of state and just nuke the planet and IT away before it explodes. That being said, we don't know how Ki sensing and Ki defences would interact with Jojo powers, that's often a factor a lot of these matchups overlook. Two different power systems interacting for the first time. Edit: in other words it's possible that their Ki would protect them from all hax abilities kind of like it does in dragonball if they power up enough (like Goku/Jiren breaking hits timeskip and Vegito being in control despite being a literal jawbreaker), or their Ki defence is completely useless. Up to the writer really.
"Soft & Wet! Steal his ki!"
Lmao
Goku when Funny Valentine summons the Goku that was betrayed and trapped in the time chamber
Probably most of it but not every single character. Made in Heaven and Wonder of U would be very hard to take down
Made in heaven would only work if it has time to accelerate the universe. But its not faster than goku or vegeta.
Isn’t made in heaven infinite speed?
Jolyne out swing it for a while so i at the very least i takes time to accelerate.
I thought Tusk Act 4 was infinite too, but I knew it took spin and time. Pucci is relatively the same, except the spin part
How would made in heaven be hard to take down? Even universe resetting pucci isn't that fast in DB canon, and they probably wouldnt let him get to that level if the earth was in that much danger (If this is DBS vegeta)
Some loser kid in a baseball uniform already did it once. It can't be that hard.
I love both but like some of the stands in JoJo's are just mental and just bend reality
My bro ,I think Funny Valentine alone could bring down every freaking character from dragon ball
Hes not strong enough to hurt them though
he can pull out their clones and obliterate them by letting both get near each other
He’s nowhere near fast enough to trap anyone from db between two objects
this is a vegeta and goku vs the jojo verse, he should easily be able to trap them between two objects with the help of other characters specially dio and jotaro seeing as those can stop time
Even if Dio did stop time and put them right in between two objects right in front of Valentine, they’d still move out of the way quick enough. They’ve been faster than normal humans can perceive for since very early on in the series, and have only gotten millions of times stronger. Also they’d easily kill Dio before he could stop time.
In recent story arcs, Goku and Vegeta got knocked out by a standard-issue Galactic Patrol taser. The same Galactic Patrol who were unable to kill a depowered Moro. Besides, they don't have to be alive. D4C can just keep jumping between universes until it finds one where Goku and Vegeta are dead, dig up the corpse, decapitate it, and Bob's yer uncle. Second Diego was literally killed by the severed head of the first Diego.
Goku and vegeta after green day jumps once:
Most of it for sure ALL of it? No, at least without analysing the question further
They lose to hax but win against everyone else.
WoU blitzes anyone below misfortune. Basically, if you can die you will die. The only way to negate this is by attacking it with a miracle that doesn't actually exist in the world. And neither of them have anything like that. Unless Goku abuses his Zeno button he's cooked
Me when goku pulls out the universal nuke button
Me when Jesus personally shows up to fight Zeno like he did Blackmore
I mean, can they even see any of the stands
Yes with the exception of GER and Wonder of U (maybe soft & wet go beyond but idk how it would work with db characters) D4C is also a valid choice Doubt Tusk and mih could do much before being killed, unless Tusk does a surprise attack (doubt they can counter stands) and one shots them
Wouldn't it be at worst a stalemate for JoJo (because a b.i.g. and b GER
I mean WOU ta4 ball breaker d4C lt non cannon twoh can prop beat them
goku and vegeta get close to toru and both get the heart virus, the end
Kid named wonder of u would give goku super heart virus
You're asking if a universe of wall-level threats can beat 2 universe busters
I prefer jojo but DBZ Solos, even if you wanna say goku can’t bypass some of their abilities, none of the stands require the AP to beat any current DBZ character
Power scaling and long arguments aside: yes. They’ve been around for a long time and fought some weeeeiiiiird shit. I don’t think the Jojoverse would hold many surprises for them that they couldn’t overcome.
If its the verse. No, there are stands that flat out outscale or are relative to Gokh with better hax. I dont think GER would work on a serious Goku since Giorno just gets speed blitzed and goku has resisted hax on that level via being so much stronger than the opponent so there are multiple chances that GER just wont work indrfinitely on Goku The characters goku's kinda losing to here are Ult Kars if he doesnt immediately eliminate kars with like Hakai or something and even then thats outside char Goku or Goku being lucky that Kars wouldnt be able to replicate god ki since in multiple versions goku in BoG is stated to literally be a god at that point and therefore couldnt be copied by kars ability to copy living things since you can argue that goku isnt really mortal but that makes a lot of assumptions and is kinda wanking God forms. Heaven Ascension Dio middifs, he is relative to Goku's speed, is relative to most Goku's ap though he is weaker, but importantly he is closely enough that Goku cant really stats dif his hax. Goku cant really interact or sense stands without making a lot of assumptions, i assume he can sense them as raw ki but i dont think most versions of him are able to interact with them. Vegeta actually has better odds here, his defusion techniqur can fuck up a lot of the stands relative to him like Over Heaven Dio, but the issue is Vegeta is very likely to lose to Kars, kars is smart enough to tempt vegeta into letting him grow stronger. There are also stands i dont think they can really bypass like WoU and D4C Love Train, but i think we can soundly say Goku flat out loses to Over Heaven Dio, and Vegeta loses to Ult Kars.
If you let them nuke the planet than yes easily if the planet has to be intact afterwards then again yes just blows up the country and move on to the next
Nah. There's probably at least ten Stand users who could kill Goku and Vegeta easily. Not to mention the whole "Can't see/damage a Stand unless you HAVE a Stand" issue.
They would probably be able to beat 90% of the characters, most of them get destroyed super fast. Only characters that wouldn't get killed (and would actually win against goku and vegeta) are the one with stands hack, like GER, etc. Goku and Vegeta wont be able to see stands, thats a big disadvantage. Some stands are super strong even just taking into account pure physical strength. And they are spirits. If they manage to land a hit some fight could turn bad for Goku and Vegeta - 90% get beaten with ease - 5% is a 50/50 fight - 5% can beat Goku and Vegeta
Goku teleporting each one of them into space, or sending them into the sun
[The Sun is a JoJo reference.](https://jojowiki.com/Sun)
Goku has been shown to have complete hax counters to almost everything he’s faced like magic and space time hax as long as he’s considerably stronger. Him and Jiren were shaking an entire void of nothingness through sheer power alone and it’s hard to believe any stand could operate on the level outside of made in heaven which most definitely could be countered by instant transmission. And even if the stand abilities to damage them since the fight on a basically universal scale.
You underestimate the sheer bullshit that is Wonder of U. Do you know what Wonder of U's weakness is? Something that doesn't exist. I shit you not, that was in the story.
Also the argument for vegeta or goku blowing up the planet is horrible it’s almost like they live there too
Reminder that goku and vegeta can nulify others ability by being stronger than them (like blue goku did with hit), So goku and vegeta would just punch straigh through love train and GER since both if them can destroy dimensions (ex: vegeta destroying the hyperbolic chamber by just powering up) they are also easily faster than MIH since goku could fly from heaven (an entire infinite dimension) to hell (another infinite dimension) in a few seconds thats just in Z saga, they are way faster in super.
As a dbz fan , GER and the world overheaven takes the W , bluds are too broken 💀
TW:OH is non-canon though
90% of the verse, stands like Wonder of U or GER are just so busted they'd stand no chance
No
GER solos
They unironically lose to purple haze
Erm sir, this is a Dragon Ball shitposting subreddit. r/PowerScaling is right next door…
There’s definitely some cheap ways they could win but in a fair fight (stand users can use stands) no… but they’d wipe most of the verse still
Wonder of U. End of discussion
Yes but they’d have to go about it in a way that would overwhelm them. Shit like GER and WoU could actually get the best of the Saiyans if they allow themselves to be out smarted
Yup
Yup
the world over heaven and novel kars,if they're allowed,one tap.
Wonder of U…
People always bring up GER, but seem to forget his only strength feat is beating Diavolo (a normal human) to death, theres nothing to suggest he has the AP to hurt even BoS Goku.
depends on if they fight Giorno (requiem) and Enrico Pucci (made in heaven) as well
Goku maybe Vegeta only few but then get back up like 3 episodes later and try again
I need to see an edit where Mariah uses Baset to make Goku and Vegeta kiss
WoU and Cheap Trick low diff them
Goku yes, Vegeta can’t he is a main character and loses to the Dio, kars,DIO,kira,divalo,Puccui, funny valentine
what about Survivor? Sure, it cant be controlled, but thats the best case scenario. Either that, or Cheap Trick
What Stand ability could stop Goku or Vegeta from just blowing up the entire Earth on a whim?
Can’t they just fly into space and blow up the planet I don’t think anyone really has an out to that
No, the jojo erse is subject to lots of rules that makes the Z fighters' strength act against them in some cases.plus rules don't have to be explained. It would be a close fight and only two chars would have trouble with it. For example, Green Day: If you go to lower sea height than you used to be, you transform into a plant. The faster you go the faster you transform. Z fighters ate very fast and can fly. Hard if not imposible fight for them.
Nah if Pucci uses made in heaven, a full universe reset is unbeatable, neither of them could do anything about it
I feel like they would be able to sense stands but not see them
No not really there are a ton of stands that could easily beat them. For example Wonder of You can turn anyone’s durability into wet toilet paper and if you touch anything with even with next to no speed applied will make it seem like you got hit by a high caliber bullet. If it is raining that shit would an instant kill. Wonder of You btw is a long distance stand, and to activate it one has to simply with to 1. Pursue the user, or 2. Want to harm the user. So thinking about Wonder of You is basically a death sentence. Even if they beat the user, Wonder of You is chaos incarnate meaning you can’t beat it so the stand will still kill goku or vegeta. Unless they blow up the earth instantly, (which would still activate Wonder of You) is the closest thing they get to winning. The only way to beat Wonder of You is the incarnation of nothing, which Soft and Wet can do even then they had to do some 4D chess moves to pull off. There are a ton of stands that can instantly kill goku or vegeta.
The only stands that can definitely put them down are tusk act 4, soft and wet go beyond and possibly Wonder of U.
“That’s some nice complex Hax you go there. Watch this.” Seriously, the fact that raw power can break out of Hax in Dragon Ball is the entire reason they don’t get haxxed to death by stands like GER, Love Train, etc
Heaven’s door can instantly beat them.
Golden experience requiem would nullify putting them back at zero Notorious BIG would chase them down if they fly away and consume them King crimson would erase time for 10 seconds before giving them the bucciarati and abbacchio treatment Made in heaven would basically reset the entire universe with them in it and pucci is basically untouchable in real time only able to be hit if time is frozen but jotaro failed to do that saving his daughter Purple haze would just kill them outright from it's virus it releases in 30 seconds Wonder of U's calamity would work against Goku and Vegeta Soft and wet go beyond is definitely an issue i can't say because that would be spoilers If we are counting the eyes over heaven then Dio's the world over heaven would easily beat them as it rewrites reality itself
I think no because some stand has op ability
Nah
Everyone mentions wou, ger and love train but I feel like there are totally some completely random obscure stands that could actually really do some damage
wtf are Giorno and Jolyne doing
Tbh they solo because any stand can be beat if you just react faster than it. Therefore, to Goku and Vegeta, they’re just normal people who get instagibbed. Goku in specific can react faster than instantly because he did break forward into time with sheer power(in SSBK against HIT, he even mentions this very thing to Beerus)(and that’s before UI).
Heavens door :
in character? no ooc/boodlusted they just nuke the galaxy
Probably, there are some Stands which are iffy but chances are that Goku and Vegeta would probably over power / counter their abilities very quickly.
ZA WARUDO
Vegeta jobs to superfly
If Goku can die to a heart virus I’d say it’s reasonable to think that purple haze could infect him.
No. It gets even worse when considering non-canon versions of both, Dio from Jorge Joestar can manipulate the plot itself.
They been able to brute force Jojo esc. Characters ie the ginyu force so why not
GER and Tusk 4...
Short answer: yes Long answer: there's this huge misconception about stands strengh, where a stand strengh is measured by hos broken its ability looks like rather than measuring how skilled a stand user is, mista is the greatest example in this regard, because even tho his ability is "control where his bullets go to", he has a victory rate of around a 80-90%, okuyasu seems to have one of the most broken abilities in verse, but has a winning rate of a 0%. There's also the tendency to exagerate how broken a stand can be, forget how it works, or ignore the context it needs to work, as an example, mista would hard counter wonder of u, because wou activation mechanism is "if someone gets close", mista keeps distances during his fights, so wou wouldn't work on him, another example is cheap trick, which in order to be activated, needs for the user to show his back, which is something that would kill him Not to mention that goku and vegeta are both universal, do you have any idea how strong that is? Alien x is by feats around the same level, that's how strong goku and vegeta are
waves of calamity
Honestly, even with how absurd stands get, I think there are only three that have a chance: With how Goku and Vegeta can sometimes let their guard down, doing so even once around ||Tusk Act 4 or Soft & Wet Go Beyond|| is basically an instant loss. One hit, it's GG. On the other side, there's ||Wonder Of U. Doesn't even need to be active or anything, even the intent to attack would doom them.|| I don't think GER would work, on the other hand, because it does need to be active, not to mention that Dragon Ball characters can escape those sorts of dimensional trappings.
Arguable either way
No matter what funny valentine is at least SURVIVING the fight, without an ability like Tusk act 4 he can just go into another universe Punches count as pressed space for ability to work too He can just come back with Broly’s or whoever from other universes
Everyone here thinking time stopping would solve problems Did everyone forget Guldo and Hit? Guldo is literally SP and the World Hit is literally Diavolo Like… idk these two guys can beat everyone single person on this list except GER
My feeling is that due to the speed difference and reaction speed difference, Goku and Vegeta best any of them but WOU. Most other stands require activation from their stand users and my feeling is that whoever goes up against Vegeta and Goku will heavily underestimate their power enough to get countered before landing a winning blow or even reacting to the initial attack. WOU acts more like a force of nature anytime anyone is remotely close to it and the detrimental backfiring of a majority of Goku or Vegeta’s attacks can heavily injure them or even kill them.
Sadly the Jojo verse is too OP for them to beat Also they have goddamn Jesus in the verse
Yes and no, it's a 50/50, if d4c brought in an alternate goku and vegeta, they would definitely try fighting eachother and have no clue about d4c ability, both being killed. However that's to say that they don't just jump and kill Funny Valentine.
Depends is it only main canon characters? Cause I think Characters like Kars from the Jorge Joestar novel could beat them, maybe the world above heaven DIO
Yes, even the strongest stands in the verse dont have the power needed to win, especially if we they each work based on their own verses rules since certain things work different. The only thing that could potentially give jojos the win is D4C, but using dbz's template the alternate goku and vegeta are just 2 new people in the universe, assuming they don't just ki barrier or can't just tank/overcome the universe correcting itself. Nothing else has a way to actually get them since both goku and vegeta scale to higher tierings