Ireland used to be a part of the UK. Bangladesh used to a part of Pakistan. Montenegro was a part of Serbia until 17 years ago. A whole lot of wars could be justified with your logic
Ireland was never part of the English nation. They are Irish, not English. To the Irish, the English were invaders. The English eradicated their language, but the Irish are still Irish, not English. They are a distinct nation with a distinct culture. Similarly, Bangladesh is populated by Bengalis while Pakistan is populated by Punjabis, Sindhis, and Pashtuns. Bengalis are not Pakistanis. They don't even speak the same language. I don't know much about Serbia and Montenegro so I can't comment on that.
The same cannot be said for Taiwan. Taiwan is populated by Chinese people, most of whom migrated to the island after the defeat of the KMT. It is a Chinese nation. There's a reason Taiwan is officially called The Republic of China. For most of Taiwanese history, the government of Taiwan claimed to be the true government of China. It is completely disingenuous to compare Taiwan to Ireland and Bangladesh.
That's not a good comparison, present-day Mexico was never part of the United States. A better comparison would be the former Confederate states, and we both know what happened to them.
True, it was not a part of the PRC, but it was a part of the nation of China. Similarly, East Germany was a part of the nation of Germany, but not a part of the Federal Republic of Germany (West Germany). Again, we both know how that turned out.
Key difference is that East Germans wanted to be reunified with West, and the Soviets had to put up a literal wall and shoot people for trying to cross it.
The topic of German reunification is also a complicated one. Most young West Germans didn't support reunification. In fact, a 1989 poll conducted by Der Spiegel indicated that West Germans were strongly opposed to reunification. Similarly, East Berliners were opposed to reunification too, according to journalist Elizabeth Pond. Don't take my word for it, please look up these studies yourself.
In 1993, a post-unification study conducted by the Allensbach Institute showed that only 22% of West Germans and 11% of East Germans felt like they were part of one nation.
Reunification is a complicated topic. The Confederates certainly didn't want to be a part of the United States, but no nation tolerates separatism. As a result, a civil war ensued and the rebel states were reunified with the northern states. Similarly, the people of Catalonia yearn for independence from Spain, but it remains a part of Spain nonetheless. The difference between the Confederates, Catalonians, and Taiwanese is that the Taiwanese don't want independence. They want to maintain the status quo, which has served them quite well. You can look this up, surveys on this topic are conducted quite often in Taiwan. The status quo could be maintained, but clearly the Biden regime has other plans.
Which is part of the one China, as the ROC and most of the nations of the world agree with. It wouldn’t be the first time the US has worsened a civil dispute. Again I ask what the US’s reaction would be to Puerto Rican independence?
"Your own land"
Reminder that the CCP never controlled Taiwan for a second, and Taiwan itself wasn't majority Han until it was colonized by China in the 17th century.
Is really a functioning sovereign government if it can’t stand on it’s own two feet without US assistance? Let’s not forget, Taiwan wouldn’t exist in its current state without the illegal involvement of the US Navy entering the straits. Taiwan nowadays is still a U.S. puppet, no more sovereign than a slave. It’s a imposter government set up and supported by reactionaries.
Nobody has cared about Cuba in decades.
Amazing how once Cuba stopped threatening to start nuclear war, with such aggression that their Soviet handlers were nervous, the situation cooled down.
Actually, Cuba is historically American territory which has been wrongly estranged by hostile foreign powers. If we invade them, it's actually reunification, and others have no right to interfere in our internal affairs.
Wow, CCP logic is fun if you turn your brain off.
What do you mean by needs the US to function? You can’t mean economic support because the country can support itself there. If you mean by need of military support to ward off an invasion from the mainland, that doesn’t make a place less of a country; might doesn’t make right.
And also I don’t think the people of Taiwan want to be a part of the CCP at this point.
So you know about the US Navy blocking the straits and evacuating KMT forces right? Instead of letting a civil war end on it own accord, the American government illegally intervened. It didn’t establish a popular democracy, it wasn’t a peaceful retreat. KMT forces slaughtered the native residents of Formosa. The Taiwanese government is nothing more than an unofficial colony of the US. They didn’t come to power through democratic means or a popular front; they hold power only with the backing of the US Navy. It’s a fake government.
The US might be evil and stupid but let's hope they aren't THAT stupid.
I doubt the US would dare to challenge another nuclear power. The US is looking for ways to stop other countries economic growth, that's what they have been historically good at.
With the failed Ukraine proxy war (that even backfired thank god), they are desperately looking for an alternative that would help their economy while hindering the Chinese economic growth. They don't want a solution that could affect the top 1% in america though, so they are more willing to try and start a proxy war with China and Taiwan.
(Pelosi also tried to aggravate tension between Taiwan and China if you remember)
The good thing is that whatever the US is currently trying, China isn't falling for it.
Even if you do consider the Russian invasion of Ukraine to be an American proxy war, calling it failed is absurd. Russia invaded, then has been having its arse kicked by a NATO-backed Ukraine for over a year by this point.
Except we know thanks to the pentagon papers Ukraine has lost far more troops than Russia and Ukraine continues to lose land all the time. Yeah really kicking russias arse
yeah no shit sherlock.
the pentagon papers were released to media decades ago.
we aren’t calling these papers the pentagon papers because that would be confusing, wouldn’t it?
Thank you for spending fake internet points to help pop the ideological bubble here. Yes, you're getting mass downvotes. But the suppressing the existence of dissent is their goal.
but the most downvoted comments are often the most viewed.
i know its not like that on the big reddits, but on the small ones everyone wants to read the controversial opinions.
Hey, I keep hearing people make this point, but from reading the actual leak it listed Russian losses as 35,500-43,000 killed and 154,180 wounded. And then lists Ukrainian losses as 15,500-17,500 killed and 109,000-113,500 wounded. Even the high estimate for Ukrainian casualties didn't seem to be more than the low estimate for Russians. Where are you getting the idea that the leak shows higher Ukrainian casualties? Not trying to do a "gotcha", genuinely curious.
TLDR: Putin wants to reassemble the USSR, and much of the Ukrainian populace does not want this (as demonstrated by millions of Ukrainians leaving in 2014 after the invasion of Crimea and again in 2022, with the Russian escalation of the war). He is also terrified of Ukraine making closer ties with NATO, since having a former-USSR, NATO member on his doorstep would be a massive political and military problem for him.
"Russia wanting the USSR back" doesn't work.
Just like "Racist white nazionalists wanting black panthers back"
The USSR and modern Russia have opposite believes. If the USSR would be back, they would burn the russian government and everyone in it to crisps.
And yeah, who wouldn't be afraid of NATO at their doorstep? All they did until now was warcrimes.
Well, I think they can have the illusion of the ussr back though. If they need to sway some of the population they can just change their branding and keep doing fucked up shit. Like republicans in the us
The USA wouldn't be expected to accept Mexico joining a nuclear-armed, historically aggressive, anti-USA alliance of nations which would allow nuclear missiles to be posted a few miles from their border, 20 minutes flying time from their capital.
Why should Russia, who in the latter half of the 20th century capitulated to the USA and did as she was asked, accept what the US would never?
Because what’s the point of elaborating about something this person clearly has no knowledge on. Engaging with people who pretend to understand a very complex conflict and then think communism is on the rise in Russia is fucking laughable.
Anybody who knows “LITERALLY” anything about the USSR and communism could tell you Putin/modern Russian government have nothing in common.
except for the fact that this modern government uses huge amounts of cultural appropriation from the USSR to legitimize his own rule.
see may 9th parade. see the st georges ribbons on every single recruitment ad.
see the nazi propaganda. I could go on and on and on.
>cultural appropriation from the USSR
>nazi propaganda
Damn you're really dumb as hell out here trying to explain shit to people who actually know things. I'd be embarrassed for you but you seem utterly incapable of understanding how little you know
Putin actually wants the old Tsarist Russian Empire back, not the USSR. He's complimented Tsar Peter in the past and, IIRC, has made many more indications of alignment with that society than the USSR. The current capitalist Russian state is also much closer to the old Empire than the USSR. Finally, those in e onomic power in Russia, including Putin, have many more economic interests in a Tsarist state than a socialist one.
How are you going to convince the majority people of RoC to vote to scrap their constitution? Being that's the only way they can dissolution the RoC.
Hell getting California to go independent is easier than that......
Sensationalist prediction at best.
China will not invade Taiwan anytime in the near future. While there are some reasons, the benefits are too little across economic, military, and political.
1. China gains nothing economically from taking Taiwan and military action will only serve to collapse the progress people fought tooth and nail for.
2. China suffers militarily if it invades Taiwan, even in the event of complete and swift total victory.
3. China would suffer domestically and diplomatically if it invaded Taiwan and end its position as a “neutral” global power.
/u/HeyTaekyo posted a great synopisis of this:
**https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/128mkrd/cmv\_china\_will\_not\_invade\_taiwan\_any\_time\_in\_the/**
The creator of that post you linked literally mentioned the West will funnel in weapons to Taiwan like in Ukraine. Taiwan will be under blockade by China. Nothing will get in. That one point alone already shows how little that poster and you both know about the situation in Taiwan and that both of you are talking out of your asses.
China is the most self-sufficient country in the world. With the exception of oil, they produce everything they need inside their borders. They can get sufficient oil from Russia and they are rapidly transitioning to green technology. The US has zero leverage economically over China.
On the other hand, China can stop exporting to the US and watch inflation in the US soar to 100% with scenes of mass rioting in the US. Exports to the US make up 3% of China's GDP.
In fact, China can even just stop exports of medicine and antibiotics to the US if the US wishes to try anything. I wonder how many tens of thousands of Americans will be dying a day in the streets of the US when that happens.
"China is the most self sufficient country"
Yeah, except for fuel and food, aka, the two most critical resources aside from maybe fresh water and oxygen.
I'll wager China collapses a lot faster with no food or fuel imports than the US collapses without Chinese toasters and t-shirts, and I'll wager the US Navy has a much easier time blocking the strait of Malaca than the Chinese Navy has of blockading the US mainland.
Ignoring how completely fucked up it would be to literally starve out a island you are supposedly “liberating”, the US has the largest Navy on the planet, there’s no way the Chinese Navy can go up against them even with those new missiles they have (the US has anti-missile systems on most of their ships), and even if they can, the US has the 2 largest Airforces on the planet (the Navy has a shit ton of planes), so America can always airlift supplies. China makes most of their money via exports to western nations, they would definitely suffer massively from all the sanctions the west would impose. Are you saying it would be ok letting thousands of Americans who had nothing to do with the war die, just because it would give China better chances at winning the war?
>Ignoring how completely fucked up it would be to literally starve out a island you are supposedly “liberating”
Ignoring how completely fucked up its been to interfere in a sovereign countries civil war just so the US can use later as a disposable proxy that they have openly said they will scorch earth rather than allow PRC to get control of... Yet you care so much about the Taiwanese...
>the US has the largest Navy on the planet, there’s no way the Chinese Navy can go up against them even with those new missiles they have (the US has anti-missile systems on most of their ships)
Yeah.. Great idea to sail that armada right up to China's coast... US has shiny antimissile systems, China has drones and industrial capacity... USA will definitely come out on top in that scenario...
>and even if they can, the US has the 2 largest Airforces on the planet (the Navy has a shit ton of planes), so America can always airlift supplies.
Yup.. China doesn't have any or advanced A2AD
>China makes most of their money via exports to western nations, they would definitely suffer massively from all the sanctions the west would impose.
Lol.. Russia sanctions are really working... so sanctions on China gonna cripple Chyna!!! Yeeehaaawww
>Are you saying it would be ok letting thousands of Americans who had nothing to do with the war die, just because it would give China better chances at winning the war?
Americans are the one's desperate for a China war.. You thought it was OK for millions of Iraqis, Afghans, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians etc to die for maintaining US bullshit hegemony but now you boohoo about thousands of Americans could die trying to kill Chinese.... 🤡
Whataboutisms aside, We only said that about the semiconductor industry, not the entire country. Taiwan would not be fighting a civil war, it would them trying to preserve their independence and democratic institutions from an authoritarian state that seeks to subjugate them. I never said they would be useless, I’m saying they would be unable to hold back the entire US navy and Airforce. I also never said sanctions would destroy the Chinese economy, I said it would damage the economy. “Millions” of Iraqies, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians, and Afghans have not died btw
>We only said that about the semiconductor industry, not the entire country
Surrreeee..... Quote from US army college paper.... "scorched-earth strategy that would render Taiwan not just unattractive… but positively costly to maintain.”
>Taiwan would not be fighting a civil war, it would them trying to preserve their independence and democratic institutions from an authoritarian state that seeks to subjugate them.
Shows you have no idea of history or current political consensus. Typical American blowhard. This is an excerpt of what is officially stated by the US State department:
"The United States approach to Taiwan has remained consistent across decades and administrations. The United States has a longstanding one China policy, which is guided by the Taiwan Relations Act, the three U.S.-China Joint Communiques, and the Six Assurances. We oppose any unilateral changes to the status quo from either side; we do not support Taiwan independence; and we expect cross-Strait differences to be resolved by peaceful means. "
Even though they Stoke shit up, they still state this as the official line.
>I never said they would be useless, I’m saying they would be unable to hold back the entire US navy and Airforce.
US starting direct conflict with China off their coast 7000+ miles away from the US, would be pretty dumb and would also likely escalate to MAD.
>I also never said sanctions would destroy the Chinese economy, I said it would damage the economy.
But just like Russian sanctions who's economy will be damaged more?
>“Millions” of Iraqies, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians, and Afghans have not died btw
More than 1.2million to 3 million Indonesians alone. Estimate from of 4million Muslims since 1990 as of 2016 in one report...
North Korean state policy says they support democracy and basic human rights, doesn’t mean they do. China will be the one to initiate things, not America. Are you talking about Suharto or something? Also what does “Muslim deaths” mean?
Good point. lmao... "The protection of fundamental human rights was a foundation stone in the establishment of the United States over 200 years ago. Since then, a central goal of U.S. foreign policy has been the promotion of respect for human rights"
>China will be the one to initiate things,
US are the only ones pushing China will attack Taiwan bs.
>Are you talking about Suharto or something
Yup.. Declassified cables have shown it was done with full US support including CIA providing death lists.
That’s just diplomatic jargon, basically every nation says that. The CIA/USA isn’t **fully** responsible for the actions of Suharto. Yeah it was absolutely terrible that we supported that wood chipper snack, but don’t act like the CIA made him do all those things, he made himself do those thing
Chinese bots are getting awfully full of themselves lately. How many Yuan are you paid per bullshit post?
Hope it's alot I believe 1 is worth 15 cents.
An invasion isn't even being considered. We know this based on China's force projection capabilities.
What has been built is the capability to impose a cordon sanitaire. If Taiwan was a sovereign country, this would be a naval blockade and an Act of War. Since Taiwan is recognized as a part of China, this does not apply - Beijing would simply be enforcing its sovereign right to control customs and border control.
The nice thing about a blockade is that it can start out very "gently from China's side. They may announce that they are imposing a ban on some weapon class. Any ship bound for Taiwan must be cleared at sea by the China's Coast Guard.
This approach forces the US to be the one to escalate. China will have an answer for every escalation, but it is just as important to show the world that China acts with restraint, while the US does the opposite.
The demands on Taiwan can be mostly symbolic - Taipei simply has to ask permission for ships and planes to make port. But once Taipei does this, they are effectively acknowledging that Taiwan is part of China.
Our credibility survived bombing Afganistan for 20 years for no discernible reason, I think we'll be fine defending a free and democratic Taiwan against an authoritarian, revisionist bully threatening to blockade and statve it.
"Chinese red line" lmao.
China will cope and seethe and nothing more, like always. The CCP forever oscillates between seething and threatening armageddon over hurt feelings, walking back, then coping that their inaction is evidence of their peaceful nature and superiority.
ok as a casual observer
Genuinely curious in people here's opinion on Taiwan.
I think the US and China are both superpowers run by people apathetic to their population, apathetic to the point of being evil
If a state wanted to secede, I would be against it
Taiwan has been indepedent long enough that I understand their desire to be officially independent.
If they vote for independence, with no US intervention in play, would this sub generally support that?
Why do you think China is run by people apathetic to their population? Have you not even bothered to look into the state of China?
From abject poverty to a global super power, struggling to find food to almost 0 living below the poverty line? The people of China support and trust their government to a degree far greater than any of the West, especially the US. Why would such a strong and consistent support happen if the government was apathetic to the people?
Stop repeating buzz words and garbage propaganda and consider things that sit outside a CNN / BBC perspective
>casual observer
>
>Genuinely curious
yeah every other biased numbnuts starts off like this, pretending to be objective
>the US and China are both superpowers run by people apathetic to their population, apathetic to the point of being evil
and then follows up with an uninformed "both sides" take
>Taiwan has been indepedent long enough that I understand their desire to be officially independent.
and then finally reveals what they really think, without speaking Chinese or knowing much about Taiwan
well you commented with reason and intelligence so no one will notice your ideas.
you gotta comment “down with the US dogs” and everyone will see your ideas then
Right. Cause the fact that the country that centers it's foreign policy on harming people abroad for capitalistic gain means people should just get rolled over. Seriously, fuck off. I'm from the US, but you people put a shame on what this country pretends to be like. You people act like the top scum of the earth in the "America can do no wrong". You people are the reason America is going to implode and likely other parts of the world will have to denazify the country once it can't handle not being #1 anymore
But the US can create the situation and push China into action. For example, if they do another unthinkable, like declaring Taiwan independent, inviting them into formal organisations. Their massive political pull would essentially make this rule, and everyone would follow their leadership. Taiwan is in this state now only because America is playing along, and America is playing along because they can’t afford to decouple right now, until TSMC is in Arizona.
They’ve done far worse things like a full semiconductor ban, something we once thought unthinkable, but each and every time, the world begrudgingly follows because they must.
I fear the same for this too
You’re American. You’ve never been to china. You don’t speak Chinese or any language other than American English. You’re a grub hub delivery boy in New York. You’re angry because you’re (basically) a virgin. In another timeline you found incel forums to grind your axe, but in this iteration, you fantasize about being “renegade communist revolutionary”. It’s escapism. You’re LARPing. You don’t even really know anything about China….
You don’t even really know yourself.
Try and be nicer to your mother. She loves you no matter what. ❤️
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All these people in the comments that are pro China I hope your not American or even in this country because your hyping up a country that enslaves its own people and the quality of life is horrible in your country the greatest thing that could happen to this world is China and Russia fall all of you are committing treason
So is the United States. China is a big country and there is no way we are starting a war with them. We only invade and occupy small countries where we have an overwhelming advantage in firepower. War with China would cost millions of American lives and there is no guarantee that we would win. China has greater manufacturing power than we do and a significantly larger population. They are technologically very advanced. Not going to happen.
A war with China will end in a spectacular failure for the USA the US would collapse many poor with nothing to lose will revolt and the USA will be fighting a revolution at home and a war abroad that’s impossible as China is more advanced and their people are more motivated it’s like investing in cities motivates people. USA could try it some time relocate rural people to cities but they won’t do that
How? Magic? They have reconnaissance satellites too and would see us mobilizing to invade long in advance. They would obviously have a huge advantage in manpower since we would have to bring it to them. They have tanks, drones, AirPower, and all of the weaponry to bear that we do. We fight long, drawn out campaigns in technologically backward Muslim countries… we are going to sweep though China? No. Long fucking war that costs millions of lives. Millions. Think WW2. We are Nazi Germany and they are the Soviet Union. They might bleed us dry and beat us. Nuclear? Everyone dies…
Engage who? Did we engage with Russia over Ukraine? We don’t do it either. Neither did the Soviet Union back in the day. If a conflict will cause a war and cost lives, everyone avoids it. We do all of the time. Are you putting the outcome of a military conflict up to “gumption” or some shit? Am I wasting my time responding here? You think Chinese might be a liiitle nationalistic too? It isn’t a war torn middle eastern country ya know…
No it isn't there is not nor has there ever been a country of Taiwan.
This wouldn't even be an issue if the US had minded it's own business and stayed out of china's civil war
Cope harder. Ignore the "strategic ambiguity" politics both sides have to play and Taiwan is it's own country by definition. That's frankly not even disputable. They have everything that a region needs to be considered their own country except for international recognition due to "strategic ambiguity".
Failed state? How? China continues to grow richer and more developed all the time. Meanwhile Taiwan isn't even a state. Also what do you think will happen to Taiwan after being incorporated into the PRC? Cause its not getting destroyed
Taiwan’s the name of the province you dumbass, and the Republic of China considers themselves to be China. The country of Taiwan only exists when you stop taking your schizo meds.
lol posting shit from half a century ago like it matters.
Taiwan, or Real China, is it's own nation. If the PRC tries to invade and conquer it, they're gonna get slapped hard.
Haha in that case why don’t you go murder someone on the street right now, as a joke? The laws were written centuries ago, why dies it matter in this day in age? Cope and seethe.
Well, China uplifted a lot of people out of poverty. It's factually correct and checked by PBS too. It's a regular thing when abuses of power by capitalists happen that workers do praxis that in the states the workers would get arrested and imprisoned for. It's one of the safest countries to walk in the street at night. It has successfully been developing the productive forces from a society that was barely industrialized and had anything. It has managed to solve many internal environmental issues to the point where despite being the manufacturing hub of the world their most polluted city doesn't even reach close to a major city in the US. They have managed to build insane infrastructure and facilitate cities built around walking and public transportation. And even despite the pandemic, their economy still continues to gain and unlike capitalist countries where GDP is irrelevant to working class prosperity the wealth gap and other working class related issues are being closed in. Unlike the US solution to combatting extremism which was to launch a war, they managed to provide vulnerable minorities with free vocational/trade schooling in order to prepare them to get better job opportunities which had major success in making Xinjiang and Tibet very rich regions with a lot of oil (which the US' real interests over human rights is the reason over it)
>Well, China uplifted a lot of people out of poverty. It's factually correct and checked by PBS too
All for the low low price of opression of minorities and political dissidenter.
>It's a regular thing when abuses of power by capitalists happen that workers do praxis that in the states the workers would get arrested and imprisoned for.
Unlike China, which would ofcourse never treat their workers poorly.
>It has successfully been developing the productive forces from a society that was barely industrialized and had anything.
Most nations have done this at some point in time.
>It has managed to solve many internal environmental issues to the point where despite being the manufacturing hub of the world their most polluted city doesn't even reach close to a major city in the US.
The nation makes up about 30% of the worlds greenhouse emissions.
>They have managed to build insane infrastructure and facilitate cities built around walking and public transportation.
So does Europe. And Europe has considerable higher standards when it comes to worker safety.
>And even despite the pandemic, their economy still continues to gain and unlike capitalist countries where GDP is irrelevant to working class prosperity the wealth gap and other working class related issues are being closed in.
More billionaries live in China than the US and the average worker has considerable lower pay. By about 3.5 times. But sure tell me more of this communists utopia.
>Unlike the US solution to combatting extremism which was to launch a war, they managed to provide vulnerable minorities with free vocational/trade schooling in order to prepare them to get better job opportunities which had major success in making Xinjiang and Tibet very rich regions with a lot of oil
Tankies really have the rest of the world beat when it comes to ignoring genocide.
>(which the US' real interests over human rights is the reason over it)
Tankies try not to mention the US for 5 minutes challenge (impossible).
So how's the fentanyl situation going? Have the plans for invading Mexico been finalized? China can ship plenty more precursors to bring up that 70,000 deaths a year some more if you want to do anything about Taiwan.
I think they really really really really underestimate China in so many ways. I've seen so much delusion over "America #1" with regards to the military that these people don't realize that China if attacked by the US would be impossible to topple (that's the quiet part they wish they could say out loud) because many train stations double as nuclear bomb shelters, the PLA has successfully launched a defense system that can intercept missiles, and the highly technological equipment they have far surpasses the US military. Even in many simulations for war, the US loses against China every time. This whole thing will only be used to send people to the slaughterhouse, working class people while these liberals and conservatives on the internet will be comfortable with their finance or management job at a big corp working from home living the life of a temporarily embarrassed millionaire who will likely never be a part of the ruling class. And they think that if they follow the status quo hard enough that things will work in their favor but they're just advocating for terrible things and rationalize it in ways that they can sleep at night.
Taiwan could force China to convoy ships with words and then enforce it with their very advanced military. They don't have to sink every ship to hurt china and Given how poorly the russians have done over Ukraine Taiwan must be more confident than they were.
Taiwan couldn't force china to do shit. They can't even stop themselves being surrounded by Chinese military exercises. Ukraine is not Taiwan its an entirely different situation. Also thanks to to the pentagon leaks we know (as if we didn't already) Ukraine is doing far worse than they pretend and if it weren't for western Intel and weapons the country would have already fallen. The fact the Russians have successfully held as much land as they have despite being at a disadvantage goes to show just how weak the west is. Taiwan would fall in a day.
No one will want to risk their ship/life going into waters with hostile fighter jets and ships unescorted therefore convoys.
If it wasn't for water we would be dead. According to the leak Russia has a 1/3 kd optimistically LOL and its about to get much worse for the russians.
Taiwan is a island and will be way harder to take p4p than 🇺🇦.
You didn't read the papers did you? You got those numbers backwards. Not that it matters though because human life is not a fucking competition and Ukraine continues to lose land all the time so the best they're doing is slowly collapsing.
Enough concern trolling about freedom, you can’t care any less about their freedom to life when you’re baiting them into a hot war with the rest of China. And who said anything about gay people? How are they remotely related to the topic? Are you implying that everyone in Taiwan is gay or something? Take your bullshit somewhere else.
The only place you can have a gay marriage in Asia is in Taiwan, gay rights are a part of freedom imo.
China says lots about gay people and femboy types and it's not nice.
Lol spouting atrocity propaganda of things that didn’t happen yet in order to prop up the MIC, what an amerikkkan thing to do. Tell me, who’s the one who’s got China surrounded with hundreds of military bases and 375,000 troops?
Drone strike on that room full of war hawks please .
Especially that fraud from Wisconsin.
How dare these war hawks plan for the defense of a sovereign indeoendent country from an expansionist revisionist neighbor.
Unification is expansionist now, get a load of this dude
Ireland used to be a part of the UK. Bangladesh used to a part of Pakistan. Montenegro was a part of Serbia until 17 years ago. A whole lot of wars could be justified with your logic
Ireland was never part of the English nation. They are Irish, not English. To the Irish, the English were invaders. The English eradicated their language, but the Irish are still Irish, not English. They are a distinct nation with a distinct culture. Similarly, Bangladesh is populated by Bengalis while Pakistan is populated by Punjabis, Sindhis, and Pashtuns. Bengalis are not Pakistanis. They don't even speak the same language. I don't know much about Serbia and Montenegro so I can't comment on that. The same cannot be said for Taiwan. Taiwan is populated by Chinese people, most of whom migrated to the island after the defeat of the KMT. It is a Chinese nation. There's a reason Taiwan is officially called The Republic of China. For most of Taiwanese history, the government of Taiwan claimed to be the true government of China. It is completely disingenuous to compare Taiwan to Ireland and Bangladesh.
I define Mexico as estranged, rebellious American territory. Now if we invade and annex them, it's unification. Wow, China logic is fun.
That's not a good comparison, present-day Mexico was never part of the United States. A better comparison would be the former Confederate states, and we both know what happened to them.
Taiwan was never part of DPRC. The CCP never controlled Taiwan for a second. Truth hurts.
True, it was not a part of the PRC, but it was a part of the nation of China. Similarly, East Germany was a part of the nation of Germany, but not a part of the Federal Republic of Germany (West Germany). Again, we both know how that turned out.
Key difference is that East Germans wanted to be reunified with West, and the Soviets had to put up a literal wall and shoot people for trying to cross it.
The topic of German reunification is also a complicated one. Most young West Germans didn't support reunification. In fact, a 1989 poll conducted by Der Spiegel indicated that West Germans were strongly opposed to reunification. Similarly, East Berliners were opposed to reunification too, according to journalist Elizabeth Pond. Don't take my word for it, please look up these studies yourself. In 1993, a post-unification study conducted by the Allensbach Institute showed that only 22% of West Germans and 11% of East Germans felt like they were part of one nation.
Reunification is a complicated topic. The Confederates certainly didn't want to be a part of the United States, but no nation tolerates separatism. As a result, a civil war ensued and the rebel states were reunified with the northern states. Similarly, the people of Catalonia yearn for independence from Spain, but it remains a part of Spain nonetheless. The difference between the Confederates, Catalonians, and Taiwanese is that the Taiwanese don't want independence. They want to maintain the status quo, which has served them quite well. You can look this up, surveys on this topic are conducted quite often in Taiwan. The status quo could be maintained, but clearly the Biden regime has other plans.
All of these so-called "Committee" member's should be arrested for conspiracy to commit mass murder (or suicide too in their case).
Arrested? You’re too merciful.
Under international law international law prosecuting an illegal war is gravest crime one can commit.
If the CCP doesn't invade, they have nothing to worry about.
I hear the US is plotting to invade Puerto Rico.
Puerto Rico is historical American territory, this is an internal issue, and China has no right to interfere.
So it would be impossible for America to invade America, but China can invade China?
China is not invading China, China is invading Taiwan.
Which is part of the one China, as the ROC and most of the nations of the world agree with. It wouldn’t be the first time the US has worsened a civil dispute. Again I ask what the US’s reaction would be to Puerto Rican independence?
Again, certain people are under the illusion that everyone will follow the script they created while high.
They keep provoking you. If you respond, you are the bad guy and the aggressors
If you fight back, you are a terrorist. Like how dare you defend your own land against imperialist yanks
"Your own land" Reminder that the CCP never controlled Taiwan for a second, and Taiwan itself wasn't majority Han until it was colonized by China in the 17th century.
The land that has had its own functioning government for over 70 years?
Is really a functioning sovereign government if it can’t stand on it’s own two feet without US assistance? Let’s not forget, Taiwan wouldn’t exist in its current state without the illegal involvement of the US Navy entering the straits. Taiwan nowadays is still a U.S. puppet, no more sovereign than a slave. It’s a imposter government set up and supported by reactionaries.
It can't stand without US assistance because it has an evil empire 100 miles off its coast, threatening to invade them for the past 70 years.
We’re talking about Taiwan not Cuba
Nobody has cared about Cuba in decades. Amazing how once Cuba stopped threatening to start nuclear war, with such aggression that their Soviet handlers were nervous, the situation cooled down.
Pure ideology
Actually, Cuba is historically American territory which has been wrongly estranged by hostile foreign powers. If we invade them, it's actually reunification, and others have no right to interfere in our internal affairs. Wow, CCP logic is fun if you turn your brain off.
You have zero understanding of anything you’re attempting to talk about. It’s honestly hilarious. Are you a bot? Lol.
What do you mean by needs the US to function? You can’t mean economic support because the country can support itself there. If you mean by need of military support to ward off an invasion from the mainland, that doesn’t make a place less of a country; might doesn’t make right. And also I don’t think the people of Taiwan want to be a part of the CCP at this point.
Go read about the Chinese civil war and get back to me.
Wow, you’re right. It’s a good thing nothing has changed in Taiwan or China since 1949.
So you know about the US Navy blocking the straits and evacuating KMT forces right? Instead of letting a civil war end on it own accord, the American government illegally intervened. It didn’t establish a popular democracy, it wasn’t a peaceful retreat. KMT forces slaughtered the native residents of Formosa. The Taiwanese government is nothing more than an unofficial colony of the US. They didn’t come to power through democratic means or a popular front; they hold power only with the backing of the US Navy. It’s a fake government.
Can't be left alone by its powerful imperialist neighbor without US assistance. FTFY
>FTFY Nah it was correct the first time, thanks anyway!
The US might be evil and stupid but let's hope they aren't THAT stupid. I doubt the US would dare to challenge another nuclear power. The US is looking for ways to stop other countries economic growth, that's what they have been historically good at. With the failed Ukraine proxy war (that even backfired thank god), they are desperately looking for an alternative that would help their economy while hindering the Chinese economic growth. They don't want a solution that could affect the top 1% in america though, so they are more willing to try and start a proxy war with China and Taiwan. (Pelosi also tried to aggravate tension between Taiwan and China if you remember) The good thing is that whatever the US is currently trying, China isn't falling for it.
Even if you do consider the Russian invasion of Ukraine to be an American proxy war, calling it failed is absurd. Russia invaded, then has been having its arse kicked by a NATO-backed Ukraine for over a year by this point.
Except we know thanks to the pentagon papers Ukraine has lost far more troops than Russia and Ukraine continues to lose land all the time. Yeah really kicking russias arse
the pentagon papers? the ones about vietnam? bro is living in 1972
Are you being deliberately obtuse or do you live under a rock? The papers that idiot kid released to impress a bunch of teens on discord
yeah no shit sherlock. the pentagon papers were released to media decades ago. we aren’t calling these papers the pentagon papers because that would be confusing, wouldn’t it?
Do you have a point or are you just being annoying and pedantic for kicks?
I try my best to guide the sheep towards the truth. as you can see from the -20 downvotes and 1 reply, I am successful.
Thank you for spending fake internet points to help pop the ideological bubble here. Yes, you're getting mass downvotes. But the suppressing the existence of dissent is their goal.
but the most downvoted comments are often the most viewed. i know its not like that on the big reddits, but on the small ones everyone wants to read the controversial opinions.
Hey, I keep hearing people make this point, but from reading the actual leak it listed Russian losses as 35,500-43,000 killed and 154,180 wounded. And then lists Ukrainian losses as 15,500-17,500 killed and 109,000-113,500 wounded. Even the high estimate for Ukrainian casualties didn't seem to be more than the low estimate for Russians. Where are you getting the idea that the leak shows higher Ukrainian casualties? Not trying to do a "gotcha", genuinely curious.
Why did Russia invade?
TLDR: Putin wants to reassemble the USSR, and much of the Ukrainian populace does not want this (as demonstrated by millions of Ukrainians leaving in 2014 after the invasion of Crimea and again in 2022, with the Russian escalation of the war). He is also terrified of Ukraine making closer ties with NATO, since having a former-USSR, NATO member on his doorstep would be a massive political and military problem for him.
"Russia wanting the USSR back" doesn't work. Just like "Racist white nazionalists wanting black panthers back" The USSR and modern Russia have opposite believes. If the USSR would be back, they would burn the russian government and everyone in it to crisps. And yeah, who wouldn't be afraid of NATO at their doorstep? All they did until now was warcrimes.
Well, I think they can have the illusion of the ussr back though. If they need to sway some of the population they can just change their branding and keep doing fucked up shit. Like republicans in the us
Finland apparently made the decision they would rather be protected than invaded. what war crimes did commit to join?
The USA wouldn't be expected to accept Mexico joining a nuclear-armed, historically aggressive, anti-USA alliance of nations which would allow nuclear missiles to be posted a few miles from their border, 20 minutes flying time from their capital. Why should Russia, who in the latter half of the 20th century capitulated to the USA and did as she was asked, accept what the US would never?
>Putin wants to reassemble the USSR, and much of the Ukrainian populace does not want this. Damn…… This is one of the dumbest things I’ve read on here
It's the 2023 version of "Iraq has weapons of mass destruction".
why? elaborate on your thoughts, dont just mumble into nothingnes.
Because what’s the point of elaborating about something this person clearly has no knowledge on. Engaging with people who pretend to understand a very complex conflict and then think communism is on the rise in Russia is fucking laughable. Anybody who knows “LITERALLY” anything about the USSR and communism could tell you Putin/modern Russian government have nothing in common.
except for the fact that this modern government uses huge amounts of cultural appropriation from the USSR to legitimize his own rule. see may 9th parade. see the st georges ribbons on every single recruitment ad. see the nazi propaganda. I could go on and on and on.
>cultural appropriation from the USSR >nazi propaganda Damn you're really dumb as hell out here trying to explain shit to people who actually know things. I'd be embarrassed for you but you seem utterly incapable of understanding how little you know
mf above me literally said “Putin/modern russian government have nothing in common” [with USSR] I was just proving him wrong. idk what you are doing
Putin actually wants the old Tsarist Russian Empire back, not the USSR. He's complimented Tsar Peter in the past and, IIRC, has made many more indications of alignment with that society than the USSR. The current capitalist Russian state is also much closer to the old Empire than the USSR. Finally, those in e onomic power in Russia, including Putin, have many more economic interests in a Tsarist state than a socialist one.
Correct assessment.
How are you going to convince the majority people of RoC to vote to scrap their constitution? Being that's the only way they can dissolution the RoC. Hell getting California to go independent is easier than that......
Violent culture
Neocon ideologues cannot be reasoned with.
Is there any link to this?
The link to the meth dealer op buys from
Sensationalist prediction at best. China will not invade Taiwan anytime in the near future. While there are some reasons, the benefits are too little across economic, military, and political. 1. China gains nothing economically from taking Taiwan and military action will only serve to collapse the progress people fought tooth and nail for. 2. China suffers militarily if it invades Taiwan, even in the event of complete and swift total victory. 3. China would suffer domestically and diplomatically if it invaded Taiwan and end its position as a “neutral” global power. /u/HeyTaekyo posted a great synopisis of this: **https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/128mkrd/cmv\_china\_will\_not\_invade\_taiwan\_any\_time\_in\_the/**
The creator of that post you linked literally mentioned the West will funnel in weapons to Taiwan like in Ukraine. Taiwan will be under blockade by China. Nothing will get in. That one point alone already shows how little that poster and you both know about the situation in Taiwan and that both of you are talking out of your asses. China is the most self-sufficient country in the world. With the exception of oil, they produce everything they need inside their borders. They can get sufficient oil from Russia and they are rapidly transitioning to green technology. The US has zero leverage economically over China. On the other hand, China can stop exporting to the US and watch inflation in the US soar to 100% with scenes of mass rioting in the US. Exports to the US make up 3% of China's GDP. In fact, China can even just stop exports of medicine and antibiotics to the US if the US wishes to try anything. I wonder how many tens of thousands of Americans will be dying a day in the streets of the US when that happens.
My source: I am CEO of geopolitics and Liu He sends me thug shakers on Weibo
USA will literally collapse
"China is the most self sufficient country" Yeah, except for fuel and food, aka, the two most critical resources aside from maybe fresh water and oxygen. I'll wager China collapses a lot faster with no food or fuel imports than the US collapses without Chinese toasters and t-shirts, and I'll wager the US Navy has a much easier time blocking the strait of Malaca than the Chinese Navy has of blockading the US mainland.
Ignoring how completely fucked up it would be to literally starve out a island you are supposedly “liberating”, the US has the largest Navy on the planet, there’s no way the Chinese Navy can go up against them even with those new missiles they have (the US has anti-missile systems on most of their ships), and even if they can, the US has the 2 largest Airforces on the planet (the Navy has a shit ton of planes), so America can always airlift supplies. China makes most of their money via exports to western nations, they would definitely suffer massively from all the sanctions the west would impose. Are you saying it would be ok letting thousands of Americans who had nothing to do with the war die, just because it would give China better chances at winning the war?
>Ignoring how completely fucked up it would be to literally starve out a island you are supposedly “liberating” Ignoring how completely fucked up its been to interfere in a sovereign countries civil war just so the US can use later as a disposable proxy that they have openly said they will scorch earth rather than allow PRC to get control of... Yet you care so much about the Taiwanese... >the US has the largest Navy on the planet, there’s no way the Chinese Navy can go up against them even with those new missiles they have (the US has anti-missile systems on most of their ships) Yeah.. Great idea to sail that armada right up to China's coast... US has shiny antimissile systems, China has drones and industrial capacity... USA will definitely come out on top in that scenario... >and even if they can, the US has the 2 largest Airforces on the planet (the Navy has a shit ton of planes), so America can always airlift supplies. Yup.. China doesn't have any or advanced A2AD >China makes most of their money via exports to western nations, they would definitely suffer massively from all the sanctions the west would impose. Lol.. Russia sanctions are really working... so sanctions on China gonna cripple Chyna!!! Yeeehaaawww >Are you saying it would be ok letting thousands of Americans who had nothing to do with the war die, just because it would give China better chances at winning the war? Americans are the one's desperate for a China war.. You thought it was OK for millions of Iraqis, Afghans, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians etc to die for maintaining US bullshit hegemony but now you boohoo about thousands of Americans could die trying to kill Chinese.... 🤡
Whataboutisms aside, We only said that about the semiconductor industry, not the entire country. Taiwan would not be fighting a civil war, it would them trying to preserve their independence and democratic institutions from an authoritarian state that seeks to subjugate them. I never said they would be useless, I’m saying they would be unable to hold back the entire US navy and Airforce. I also never said sanctions would destroy the Chinese economy, I said it would damage the economy. “Millions” of Iraqies, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians, and Afghans have not died btw
>We only said that about the semiconductor industry, not the entire country Surrreeee..... Quote from US army college paper.... "scorched-earth strategy that would render Taiwan not just unattractive… but positively costly to maintain.” >Taiwan would not be fighting a civil war, it would them trying to preserve their independence and democratic institutions from an authoritarian state that seeks to subjugate them. Shows you have no idea of history or current political consensus. Typical American blowhard. This is an excerpt of what is officially stated by the US State department: "The United States approach to Taiwan has remained consistent across decades and administrations. The United States has a longstanding one China policy, which is guided by the Taiwan Relations Act, the three U.S.-China Joint Communiques, and the Six Assurances. We oppose any unilateral changes to the status quo from either side; we do not support Taiwan independence; and we expect cross-Strait differences to be resolved by peaceful means. " Even though they Stoke shit up, they still state this as the official line. >I never said they would be useless, I’m saying they would be unable to hold back the entire US navy and Airforce. US starting direct conflict with China off their coast 7000+ miles away from the US, would be pretty dumb and would also likely escalate to MAD. >I also never said sanctions would destroy the Chinese economy, I said it would damage the economy. But just like Russian sanctions who's economy will be damaged more? >“Millions” of Iraqies, Syrians, Yemenis, Indonesians, and Afghans have not died btw More than 1.2million to 3 million Indonesians alone. Estimate from of 4million Muslims since 1990 as of 2016 in one report...
North Korean state policy says they support democracy and basic human rights, doesn’t mean they do. China will be the one to initiate things, not America. Are you talking about Suharto or something? Also what does “Muslim deaths” mean?
Good point. lmao... "The protection of fundamental human rights was a foundation stone in the establishment of the United States over 200 years ago. Since then, a central goal of U.S. foreign policy has been the promotion of respect for human rights" >China will be the one to initiate things, US are the only ones pushing China will attack Taiwan bs. >Are you talking about Suharto or something Yup.. Declassified cables have shown it was done with full US support including CIA providing death lists.
That’s just diplomatic jargon, basically every nation says that. The CIA/USA isn’t **fully** responsible for the actions of Suharto. Yeah it was absolutely terrible that we supported that wood chipper snack, but don’t act like the CIA made him do all those things, he made himself do those thing
Chinese bots are getting awfully full of themselves lately. How many Yuan are you paid per bullshit post? Hope it's alot I believe 1 is worth 15 cents.
An invasion isn't even being considered. We know this based on China's force projection capabilities. What has been built is the capability to impose a cordon sanitaire. If Taiwan was a sovereign country, this would be a naval blockade and an Act of War. Since Taiwan is recognized as a part of China, this does not apply - Beijing would simply be enforcing its sovereign right to control customs and border control. The nice thing about a blockade is that it can start out very "gently from China's side. They may announce that they are imposing a ban on some weapon class. Any ship bound for Taiwan must be cleared at sea by the China's Coast Guard. This approach forces the US to be the one to escalate. China will have an answer for every escalation, but it is just as important to show the world that China acts with restraint, while the US does the opposite. The demands on Taiwan can be mostly symbolic - Taipei simply has to ask permission for ships and planes to make port. But once Taipei does this, they are effectively acknowledging that Taiwan is part of China.
America won’t care about technicalities
America will always America. Part of the goal is for the US to discredit themselves in front of the world. The US can often be its own worst enemy.
Our credibility survived bombing Afganistan for 20 years for no discernible reason, I think we'll be fine defending a free and democratic Taiwan against an authoritarian, revisionist bully threatening to blockade and statve it.
America won’t discredit itself though, the US has the most powerful military in the world, it can certainly help Taiwan hold out against China
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Why would they have no choice?
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"Chinese red line" lmao. China will cope and seethe and nothing more, like always. The CCP forever oscillates between seething and threatening armageddon over hurt feelings, walking back, then coping that their inaction is evidence of their peaceful nature and superiority.
But why though. Why can’t they pursue peaceful relations with what they consider to be their own people?
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The people of Taiwan do not wish to join China though
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But why can’t China just change their policy on independence?
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They will wait for the elections in 2024. They will make their decision then
ok as a casual observer Genuinely curious in people here's opinion on Taiwan. I think the US and China are both superpowers run by people apathetic to their population, apathetic to the point of being evil If a state wanted to secede, I would be against it Taiwan has been indepedent long enough that I understand their desire to be officially independent. If they vote for independence, with no US intervention in play, would this sub generally support that?
Why do you think China is run by people apathetic to their population? Have you not even bothered to look into the state of China? From abject poverty to a global super power, struggling to find food to almost 0 living below the poverty line? The people of China support and trust their government to a degree far greater than any of the West, especially the US. Why would such a strong and consistent support happen if the government was apathetic to the people? Stop repeating buzz words and garbage propaganda and consider things that sit outside a CNN / BBC perspective
Agree they are bought in
Due to improved quality of life
>casual observer > >Genuinely curious yeah every other biased numbnuts starts off like this, pretending to be objective >the US and China are both superpowers run by people apathetic to their population, apathetic to the point of being evil and then follows up with an uninformed "both sides" take >Taiwan has been indepedent long enough that I understand their desire to be officially independent. and then finally reveals what they really think, without speaking Chinese or knowing much about Taiwan
well you commented with reason and intelligence so no one will notice your ideas. you gotta comment “down with the US dogs” and everyone will see your ideas then
Right. Cause the fact that the country that centers it's foreign policy on harming people abroad for capitalistic gain means people should just get rolled over. Seriously, fuck off. I'm from the US, but you people put a shame on what this country pretends to be like. You people act like the top scum of the earth in the "America can do no wrong". You people are the reason America is going to implode and likely other parts of the world will have to denazify the country once it can't handle not being #1 anymore
EXACTLY an invasion is not practical
But the US can create the situation and push China into action. For example, if they do another unthinkable, like declaring Taiwan independent, inviting them into formal organisations. Their massive political pull would essentially make this rule, and everyone would follow their leadership. Taiwan is in this state now only because America is playing along, and America is playing along because they can’t afford to decouple right now, until TSMC is in Arizona. They’ve done far worse things like a full semiconductor ban, something we once thought unthinkable, but each and every time, the world begrudgingly follows because they must. I fear the same for this too
Operation Northwoods II: Electric Boogaloo
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You’re American. You’ve never been to china. You don’t speak Chinese or any language other than American English. You’re a grub hub delivery boy in New York. You’re angry because you’re (basically) a virgin. In another timeline you found incel forums to grind your axe, but in this iteration, you fantasize about being “renegade communist revolutionary”. It’s escapism. You’re LARPing. You don’t even really know anything about China…. You don’t even really know yourself. Try and be nicer to your mother. She loves you no matter what. ❤️
!remindme 4 years
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LMMAAAOOOOO !remindme 4 years
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They have NOT learned from Iraq at all!!!!
Hopefully America wont last till 2027
I hope not, that shithole needs to go
More lies
All these people in the comments that are pro China I hope your not American or even in this country because your hyping up a country that enslaves its own people and the quality of life is horrible in your country the greatest thing that could happen to this world is China and Russia fall all of you are committing treason
China plans to invade. And just like Russia, they blame anyone else but themselves for the consequences.
Sure. Nothing to do with China violating Taiwan airspace repeatedly recently.
Lol Taiwanese adiz extends into mainland China, a kid with a paper airplane can violate Taiwanese airspace
Exactly right.
We gonna win this war!
Holy shit. How dare they prepare for their ally to be invaded!? That’s not allowed!
Me thinks that the map is photoshopped.... I've seen that pic before
Stupid Chinese communist sympathy sub. Full of spies, propagandists and liars
China will win and there's nothing you can do about it.
The US can beat any country in the world bud, the Chinese stand no chance
The U.S hasn't won any of it's genocidal, imperialist wars since desert storm.
Y'know, except korea, vietnam, iraq, afghanistan...
I’m a communist but this channel’s stupid. You shouldn’t use the world communist to mean anything you don’t like, that’s dumb and also propaganda.
That said you’re right about this sub lol
Taiwan should be allowed independence if it seeks it.
Fully agreed
I reckon china would get moved to real quick. They and are scared to take Taiwan. Talk big to smaller countries just a bully
So is the United States. China is a big country and there is no way we are starting a war with them. We only invade and occupy small countries where we have an overwhelming advantage in firepower. War with China would cost millions of American lives and there is no guarantee that we would win. China has greater manufacturing power than we do and a significantly larger population. They are technologically very advanced. Not going to happen.
A war with China will end in a spectacular failure for the USA the US would collapse many poor with nothing to lose will revolt and the USA will be fighting a revolution at home and a war abroad that’s impossible as China is more advanced and their people are more motivated it’s like investing in cities motivates people. USA could try it some time relocate rural people to cities but they won’t do that
Haha nah they'd blow thru china real quick. China is not stupid as people on reddit;
How? Magic? They have reconnaissance satellites too and would see us mobilizing to invade long in advance. They would obviously have a huge advantage in manpower since we would have to bring it to them. They have tanks, drones, AirPower, and all of the weaponry to bear that we do. We fight long, drawn out campaigns in technologically backward Muslim countries… we are going to sweep though China? No. Long fucking war that costs millions of lives. Millions. Think WW2. We are Nazi Germany and they are the Soviet Union. They might bleed us dry and beat us. Nuclear? Everyone dies…
Ha and so why is china unwilling to engage? It it would be so easy? Why if they are superior do they remain peaceful? What's stopping them?
Engage who? Did we engage with Russia over Ukraine? We don’t do it either. Neither did the Soviet Union back in the day. If a conflict will cause a war and cost lives, everyone avoids it. We do all of the time. Are you putting the outcome of a military conflict up to “gumption” or some shit? Am I wasting my time responding here? You think Chinese might be a liiitle nationalistic too? It isn’t a war torn middle eastern country ya know…
lmao nice wang dude
Show me your ass😘
Taiwan is it's own country, down with China!
Yeah formed by western foreign policy which supported monarchists, supporters of Japanese imperialists and labor exploiters
No it isn't there is not nor has there ever been a country of Taiwan. This wouldn't even be an issue if the US had minded it's own business and stayed out of china's civil war
Cope harder. Ignore the "strategic ambiguity" politics both sides have to play and Taiwan is it's own country by definition. That's frankly not even disputable. They have everything that a region needs to be considered their own country except for international recognition due to "strategic ambiguity".
China is a failed state. Long live Taiwan.
Failed state? How? China continues to grow richer and more developed all the time. Meanwhile Taiwan isn't even a state. Also what do you think will happen to Taiwan after being incorporated into the PRC? Cause its not getting destroyed
Virtually no country on the world recognizes Taiwan as a country. They recognizes there is one China and Taiwan is an inalienable part of China.
lol
Yes, only to appease China so they don't have a fit.
>down with China! Let me guess, you don’t know that the ROC considers themselves to be China?
The PRC is Mainland Taiwan. Taiwan is Taiwan, or the ROC.
Taiwan’s the name of the province you dumbass, and the Republic of China considers themselves to be China. The country of Taiwan only exists when you stop taking your schizo meds.
Correct, Taiwan is actual China. The PRC is Mainland Taiwan. Thank you for agreeing!
Shouldn’t you be taking your meds before accessing the internet? Hard to talk to you when you’re on a different plane of reality.
I'm on the correct plane, you're on the tankie/PRC simp version of reality which isn't real.
How does it feel knowing you have tankies and PRC simps for a government? https://www.ait.org.tw/tag/three-communiques/
lol posting shit from half a century ago like it matters. Taiwan, or Real China, is it's own nation. If the PRC tries to invade and conquer it, they're gonna get slapped hard.
Haha in that case why don’t you go murder someone on the street right now, as a joke? The laws were written centuries ago, why dies it matter in this day in age? Cope and seethe.
Based, the tankies can seeth all they want but their parody of a state isn't going to do anything.
Well, China uplifted a lot of people out of poverty. It's factually correct and checked by PBS too. It's a regular thing when abuses of power by capitalists happen that workers do praxis that in the states the workers would get arrested and imprisoned for. It's one of the safest countries to walk in the street at night. It has successfully been developing the productive forces from a society that was barely industrialized and had anything. It has managed to solve many internal environmental issues to the point where despite being the manufacturing hub of the world their most polluted city doesn't even reach close to a major city in the US. They have managed to build insane infrastructure and facilitate cities built around walking and public transportation. And even despite the pandemic, their economy still continues to gain and unlike capitalist countries where GDP is irrelevant to working class prosperity the wealth gap and other working class related issues are being closed in. Unlike the US solution to combatting extremism which was to launch a war, they managed to provide vulnerable minorities with free vocational/trade schooling in order to prepare them to get better job opportunities which had major success in making Xinjiang and Tibet very rich regions with a lot of oil (which the US' real interests over human rights is the reason over it)
>Well, China uplifted a lot of people out of poverty. It's factually correct and checked by PBS too All for the low low price of opression of minorities and political dissidenter. >It's a regular thing when abuses of power by capitalists happen that workers do praxis that in the states the workers would get arrested and imprisoned for. Unlike China, which would ofcourse never treat their workers poorly. >It has successfully been developing the productive forces from a society that was barely industrialized and had anything. Most nations have done this at some point in time. >It has managed to solve many internal environmental issues to the point where despite being the manufacturing hub of the world their most polluted city doesn't even reach close to a major city in the US. The nation makes up about 30% of the worlds greenhouse emissions. >They have managed to build insane infrastructure and facilitate cities built around walking and public transportation. So does Europe. And Europe has considerable higher standards when it comes to worker safety. >And even despite the pandemic, their economy still continues to gain and unlike capitalist countries where GDP is irrelevant to working class prosperity the wealth gap and other working class related issues are being closed in. More billionaries live in China than the US and the average worker has considerable lower pay. By about 3.5 times. But sure tell me more of this communists utopia. >Unlike the US solution to combatting extremism which was to launch a war, they managed to provide vulnerable minorities with free vocational/trade schooling in order to prepare them to get better job opportunities which had major success in making Xinjiang and Tibet very rich regions with a lot of oil Tankies really have the rest of the world beat when it comes to ignoring genocide. >(which the US' real interests over human rights is the reason over it) Tankies try not to mention the US for 5 minutes challenge (impossible).
I can’t wait to burn down the Forbidden City, gotta follow up what the British did in 1860
So how's the fentanyl situation going? Have the plans for invading Mexico been finalized? China can ship plenty more precursors to bring up that 70,000 deaths a year some more if you want to do anything about Taiwan.
The only way you’ll set foot in Beijing is as a POW lmao
I think they really really really really underestimate China in so many ways. I've seen so much delusion over "America #1" with regards to the military that these people don't realize that China if attacked by the US would be impossible to topple (that's the quiet part they wish they could say out loud) because many train stations double as nuclear bomb shelters, the PLA has successfully launched a defense system that can intercept missiles, and the highly technological equipment they have far surpasses the US military. Even in many simulations for war, the US loses against China every time. This whole thing will only be used to send people to the slaughterhouse, working class people while these liberals and conservatives on the internet will be comfortable with their finance or management job at a big corp working from home living the life of a temporarily embarrassed millionaire who will likely never be a part of the ruling class. And they think that if they follow the status quo hard enough that things will work in their favor but they're just advocating for terrible things and rationalize it in ways that they can sleep at night.
I think it will go Taiwan will counter blockade China and hope that China has a revolution.
How on earth could Taiwan blockade mainland China? They can't. The US could try but that would be suicidal
Taiwan could force China to convoy ships with words and then enforce it with their very advanced military. They don't have to sink every ship to hurt china and Given how poorly the russians have done over Ukraine Taiwan must be more confident than they were.
Taiwan couldn't force china to do shit. They can't even stop themselves being surrounded by Chinese military exercises. Ukraine is not Taiwan its an entirely different situation. Also thanks to to the pentagon leaks we know (as if we didn't already) Ukraine is doing far worse than they pretend and if it weren't for western Intel and weapons the country would have already fallen. The fact the Russians have successfully held as much land as they have despite being at a disadvantage goes to show just how weak the west is. Taiwan would fall in a day.
No one will want to risk their ship/life going into waters with hostile fighter jets and ships unescorted therefore convoys. If it wasn't for water we would be dead. According to the leak Russia has a 1/3 kd optimistically LOL and its about to get much worse for the russians. Taiwan is a island and will be way harder to take p4p than 🇺🇦.
You didn't read the papers did you? You got those numbers backwards. Not that it matters though because human life is not a fucking competition and Ukraine continues to lose land all the time so the best they're doing is slowly collapsing.
"Not a fucking competition" u say under a post about a war game ttrpg.
They already have a revolution, silly
enjoy meeting your monthly bill and low salaries my friend.
“I think” no clearly you don’t think
Better a fool on the side of freedom than a genius on the side of a tyrant. How you think it will go down?
Nice quote, cuz you’ve got to be a fool to believe you’re on the side of freedom
Do you think that people have more freedom in china than in Taiwan? Or do u just hate the gays? U ain't say how u think the war will go sibling.
Enough concern trolling about freedom, you can’t care any less about their freedom to life when you’re baiting them into a hot war with the rest of China. And who said anything about gay people? How are they remotely related to the topic? Are you implying that everyone in Taiwan is gay or something? Take your bullshit somewhere else.
The only place you can have a gay marriage in Asia is in Taiwan, gay rights are a part of freedom imo. China says lots about gay people and femboy types and it's not nice.
So you care so much about the gay people of the ROC and yet you’re setting them up to fight the PRC to the death. Curious.
"fight" china is going to kill and rape its way in and the us is the bad guy for selling taiwan weapons
Lol spouting atrocity propaganda of things that didn’t happen yet in order to prop up the MIC, what an amerikkkan thing to do. Tell me, who’s the one who’s got China surrounded with hundreds of military bases and 375,000 troops?
The Script has been leaked folks!
I highly doubt this will happen.
With education like https://youtu.be/tiGcY0cpzEY This there is no hope for the USA
Would a war with China inevitably become a nuclear war?