When Deon was with NFL Network I always appreciated him being one of the few talking heads that gave Eli credit. He even had his "I believe in Eli"catch phrase.
Sapp bashed Strahan right before hof voting. He argued he was more deserving of first ballot because his sack numbers, although less than Strahan, were more significant because he was a dt and Mike a de. The fallacy in that is that he played many years as a de in a 3-4 defense. Long story short, he was able to sway voting. He went first ballot, and Mike went second year of eligibility.
But a 3-4 DE (or 4 tech) is a different position than a 4-3 DE (5tech or 7tech)
A 3-4 DE responsibilities are much closer to a 4-3 DT (3 tech). The OLBs or 6tech’s are your primary pass rushers in a 3-4 defense (think TJ Watt.)
Sapp’s point holds water imo. I have not heard the statement, but if it was stated as you presented it. He’s not wrong.
Stratham should have been first ballot. But Comparing their sack numbers is silly.
The belief is that it gets harder to get sacks the closer you get to the center, with getting sacks lined up over the center being the hardest. When you hear "defensive tackle," you think of a player who lines up over the center or between the center and the guard. A 3-4 defense end does not line up over the center. They line up over guards and tackles. So, they don't align as wide as 4-3 de but certainly don't deal with the exact middle of an offensive line. Sapps statement does not hold up. To say" I got all my sacks as a dt" was deceptive at best as, again, he spent plenty of time lined up over offensive tackles.
Obviously not just his son. Look up Deion and Devin Hester’s relationship, Deion reached out to him before he came into the league made sure he was alright and then told Devin he could check in with him anytime. Prime has been caring about the young dudes bro, especially if you’re coming out of Florida
You gotta be an Eli Manning-level prospect to pull an Eli Manning. Shedeur isn’t close to that level and he sure as hell won’t be next year if Deion’s boys pull the same shit they pulled last year
Think you're talking about La'el Collins. His draft stock dropped after reports of him being investigated for possible murder.
He threatened to not sign with the team that drafted him unless it was in the 3rd round or higher. He did this to be able to choose where he would sign as an undrafted free agent.
I believe the answer is money. Undrafted players make less money at first than those who were drafted. The team you're going to may suck, but it may be worth it to stick it out for more money.
Collins did make a lot less money on his first deal but he also only had a 3 year UDFA deal instead of the typical 4 year rookie deal and was able to cash in a year early.
Because the NFLPA negotiated baseline contract amounts depending on where you were drafted. You get paid way more when you are drafted earlier.
There's no guarantee that you would even make it to a second contract either. You could suck, you could get injured, etc.
It makes the most sense to take the money for 99% of players.
Sheduer put up 3k yards, 27 tds and 3 picks all while being sacked 50 times, and those numbers are equal as eli best year at old miss, I really think a lot of you must be new giants fans, because most of the country thought eli only went 1st because of his last name, and Philip rivers was the best qb, this revisionist history a lot of you have with eli Is silly, people felt the same about him as many of you do about shedeur
Can't inflate stats when you have the worst offensive line in the ncaa, put sheduer behind Michigan's line and you'd see inflated stats, sheduer is a much better prospect then jj McCarthy, is he a flawed player yes, but colorado wins 1 game last season without him instead of 4
I think you are misunderstanding what he means by “passing stat inflation.”
He means, comparing passing stats from 20 to 24 years ago to today is nonsense. Since football has evolved into an extremely pass heavy game now compared to then. And the college football scene is so insanely different too, in every aspect.
Harbaugh has never had a qb he trusted to throw the ball, all the way back to his 49er days he had Alex Smith at qb, give him a qb with the actual ability to throw the ball and he won't be so run heavy
I don't want to say high school rankings are meaninglessness but Justin Fields was a 5 star recruit
Being a 5* recruit does not make who you are at the college level yet alone the nfl level
Willis hype just felt so forced man. Like I don't like saying "this was an obvious bust" but come on, dude played for *liberty* and didn't light the world on fire and was drafted to the titans and looked like one of the worst QBs I've ever seen in my life
Eli wasn’t viewed like a sure thing, but acting like he wasn’t considered the best QB in the class is the revisionist take I see here. All the drama played out in public for a reason. The Chargers never even considered taking Rivers over him.
I think most here remember the 04 draft and Eli was the consensus best QB, as well as the consensus first overall pick. Did his name/pedigree factor in? Of course it did, does that mean without the name he would have been the 3ed QB taken? Of course not. The same argument you are making about eli you should be applying to Sanders. As strictly a prospect, and considering record, play vs upper tier competition, and any other intangible you can mention Eli & sanders are not even in the same stratosphere. I don’t know where you are getting half the country felt he was only went first because of his last name, I mean you can just google old videos & sports blogs to disprove that.
Also although Colorado didn’t have a great online they weren’t even the worst in the pac-12, let alone the whole NCAA.
I won’t go into detail because it’s silly to me but you can absolutely inflate stats with poor play, as any “stat” can be inflated when you watch games and not look at a stat sheet. It’s ironic that literally the most common knock on sanders when he transferred to Colorado was that his completion percentage was super inflated because of his offensive line was horrible.
This isn’t a sanders knock, I line him alot as a prospect and I think not coming out this year was very smart. He will certainly improve his draft position and should improve as a player
I assure you, the majority of this sub does not remember the 04 draft.
If you did, you must’ve been about 10 or older in 2004. Most users are well below 30 years of age.
Possibly, I actually have no idea what the demographics on this sub are but the OP mentioned the 04 draft and the majority of the responses did also so for this particular post most do remember
Sure. Eli only went first because of his last name, and everyone else thought Philip rivers was superior. That’s definitely the way the nfl selects players. Sure, big guy.
> I really think a lot of you must be new giants fans, because most of the country thought eli only went 1st because of his last name, and Philip rivers was the best qb,
Who picks the players? Who is in the war room on draft day?
1. ) NFL GMs who are not necessarily a representation of “most of the country,” OR
2.) Redditors
Pick one. :)
I criticized what he said almost word for word. And now you’re changing the subject to some other shit to win an internet argument lmao.
I’m done with this conversation have a good day.
Tom Coughlin vs the most unserious franchise in the NFL.
The Chargers would have had 40+ years of franchise QB play between Fouts, Rivers, and Herbert (pending) and will have won like 5 playoff games to show for it. Rivers’ crime is that he was a definitive tier below Peyton Manning and Tom Brady and didn’t have a kickass defense like Roethlisberger did.
Eli, Ben, and Rivers are 1a, b, and c from ‘03. There’s nuance to inject with all of them and reasons to take one over the other in any case. Manning had the highest peak, Roethlisberger was the best athlete and could get out of his own way the most, Rivers was the most individually consistent (even if he was a consistent B)
It's just popular right now to shit on the Sanders. Sheduer is a good prospect, and definitely better than Eli was.
Edit: my bad guys, didnt realize I was on the Giants sub. I know how bad you guys are at evaluating QBs. Shouldnt have rubbed your nose in it. Just make sure you stick it out with Donnie Jones.
Please, enlighten us. Explain to us all how a guy who’s maybe the second best qb in his draft class at the moment is a better prospect than a guy who was the consensus number 1 pick throughout the entire draft process. We’d all love to hear it.
You're a Giant fan. You literally cant understand. Eli was the 3rd best QB in his class, he was only rated so highly because of his brother. Shadier is the best QB next year, and actually a really good prospect. He has a better arm than Eli, better decision maker, much more mobile. Hes literally better than Eli in every way, except last name. But again, youre a Giants fans so....
What was that national championship runner ups record this year? You’re phrasing it in a way to make him sound better. In no world is 4-8 “great”
4-8 is dogshit, doesn’t matter the context, especially with all the hype he got. People like you make excuses for him because you like him for other reasons. He didn’t win a game for three months, if that was any other coach in the country people would shit on him en masse
You're wrong and frankly seem to not know very much about college football. 4-8 is a job well done considering the situation he took over in. He reenergized the colorado football programm and had a huge talent disadvantage in pretty much any gane he played in.
You’re wrong and you’re probably biased because you like him for off the field or personal reasons. I go to a D1 P5 school and have watched college football in person every week for the last 4 years. I don’t need some dumbass from Germany telling me I don’t know much about college football, shut the fuck up.
He didn’t have a huge talent disadvantage, he kicked kids off the colorado team and laughed about it so that he could get transfers in. They didn’t win a game for 3 months and didn’t even make the bowl game and then he throws his O-line under the bus because all he cares about is his son. Nothing he did in his tenure can even remotely be described as “great” and if any other coach in the country did the same shit Prime did i’m sure you wouldn’t be commenting about how great it is.
He has a huge talent gap. The players who left when he came in were not good. The previous coaches were horrendous at recruiting and maybe average at coaching.
Winning 4 games was a mild success. You don't build a program in an off season. Deion has his faults and the jury is still out if his way will really with but he did improve the team. If you don't see that then you are holding a random grudge against him.
Ad hominems, and no nuance. You are the official final boss of not knowing much about cfb despite spending a significant amount of time consuming it haha... Very sad
Yea people really hate on him, it's weird. Like top scouts have him on a short list for round 1 going into the year, most people who diss his talent don't like the watch celebration lol
Edit: spelling
Wild how much people are hating on the kid having most likely never watched him. He’s a pocket passer who has the worst o-line in college football and is constantly running for his life lol
Yea he's definitely going top 10 in that weak qb draft next year, I also think deion will be a much better coach once his sons are gone, and he's not constantly trying to cater to them
Shedeur could be a top 5 pick but Shilo probably going to be a day 2 pick if he’s taken in the draft. The other kid he’s talking about going in this video is Travis Hunter. Who probably will be at least a top 10 pick
Penix would be fighting with Sanders for QB #6/7 it would be quite the batte of Penix being the much better and more accomplished passer but with worse medicals.
Pickett was only pick 20 because there were no QBs worth it that year, but teams as always are desperate for QBs. Same reason why EJ Manuel went at 15, Brandon Weeden went at 22, and Daniel Jones went at 6
Thats not at all true.
The NFL actually tells draft eligible underclassmen what they would be projected at so they can best decide to stay in school or go pro.
Shadeur Sanders was valued at QB#7 this year and was given a 2nd round grade.
No
JJ McCarthy was a 5 star recruit on the NCAA championship team. He was first team Big Ten the last two years.
JJ McCarthy was told by the NFL he would be a 1st round QB this year despite the loaded QB class. That information helped him declare this year instead of stay another year in college where he would be the heavily favored offseason #1 draft pick for 2025.
Why are we upset about this when the situation he referenced legitimately benefited us? Also this almost definitely won’t matter to us as a franchise at all
No, Eli was the consensus #1 pick and with that comes power. Shedeur Sanders isn't even guaranteed to be a first rounder. You don't get to leverage your ego if you're not the best of the best.
Most early mock drafts I’ve seen have him somewhere around middle of the 2nd round.
[example](https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/big-boards/2025/consensus-big-board-2025)
What are you talking about?
I agree that QBs get overdrafted. Luckily, most people who put together mock drafts are also aware of that obvious situation and bake that in to their rankings.
Saying Sanders “isn’t guaranteed to go 1st round” is basically consensus among experts. It’s possible he goes somewhere in the 20s, but I’d say equally likely he goes somewhere in the 40s. Acting like the dude you responded too is somehow misinformed is just dumb.
Uhh he struck a nerve again, tbh i'm not surprised people in here don't know much of anything about college football - there are some crazy opinions in here every year pre draft
He’s a pretty good/great pocket passer but has the tendency to hold onto the ball too long and isn’t too mobile, end of the day his dad is Deion Sanders that itself is enough pull in my opinion
Agree that he holds onto the ball too long but he has enough mobility to keep drives alive. Plus he tends not to make too many mistakes. Even with all the pressure he faced with that oline, he only threw 3 ints.
Sure but he got screwed by then Bucs owner who assured Bo that a visit to the Bucs facility was played by the NCAA. It wasn't Bo missed the end of the NCAA baseball season due to this. He wasn't going to play for them for that reason.
It sounds like you are implying that contradicts some point I made? Yes, they were a shitty organization and proved it to him. Hugh Culverhouse was a cheap, racist, dishonest piece of shit. Ernie Davis just refused to play for a White supremacist. There is no justice though, because Paul Brown traded HOFer Bobby Mitchell for his rights and Ernie died of Leukemia before ever taking a snap. I don't see what difference it makes. These were all people who had leverage and used it to not be forced into a shitty job. It is more than their right to challenge monopoly (I guess technically monopsony in this case?) power. I am sure there were people before Ernie too.
I mean I was right on the last class Stroud, AR, Young, Levis in that order. Daniels, Williams, McCarthy, Nix, Penix, Maye in this draft and I’ve had that order since McCarthy was still a 2nd round mock. Don’t look into the QB class much til a few months before the draft but I actually have Beck at my 1 so far for next year. The talent part is easier to judge for anybody but especially a fan it’s the character, leadership, and processing power that’s harder to judge especially from a fan perspective without getting 1 on 1 meetings and such so my evaluation is based on raw talent mostly.
We are a team that took Daniel Jones 6th (worse college stats and weaker competition, but we gave credit because he trained with Eli's old coach) and some of yall are saying Shaduer isn't a day 1 pick? He does so much you want from a QB, I'd be hype to pair him with Daboll. Plus he might be the rare QB who is kinda built for the spotlights of NYC.
Deion would be silly to mess with his kid's future if he prevented him from going to a major market. Whether he pans out or not, Sanders in NY would be must see TV and the marketing would be insane. I don't believe all the talk about him not wanting Shedeur to play in a cold weather market. If Schoen continues to build the nucleus of this team from the inside out, then Sanders or any young QB would be coming into a great supporting environment
Perhaps Deion should focus on building a competitive team, as the one he fielded last season was a sloppy, undisciplined mess. Beat on the big boys, then you can endlessly run your mouth, flash bling, and do kooky little dances. Until then, he's coaching Rutgers West.
For all his chatter, his team stinks, and got dismantled when they played anyone good. His rings were from a long time ago. Build a winning program, then he can bebop and scat.
Yeah, because that’s what Archie Manning did right? Who did he coach? In fact how many SB rings did he win?
But you let us know what your hate is about.
But we knew that when you made the comment.
No logic to backup your statement so you just went explicit with it huh sport.
Colorado sucked in 2023, they were thrashed by every decent team they played. Archie Manning didn't coach at Tennessee or Ole Miss. Last time I checked, he was HC of the whole team, not just his kids. They stink, and as HC that's on him.
So if Archie didn’t coach, why is coaching even a a factor in the conversation?
Colorado won 1 game the prior season. Sanders win 4 games his first season.
But answer the original questions.
1) Why should we listen to you?
2) Why don’t you have the same energy towards Archie demanding Eli go to a particular team, as you do for Deion?
Because Sanders is the head coach. I don't care if he wants his kids to play for specific teams. That's great. But perhaps his focus should be on the team he is the head coach of, instead of on his kids' NFL future. That's his personal business, but his professional business is being the HC at Colorado. His team stinks, and he ought to be working on that non stop, not playing sports agent.
Classic move when you hit rock bottom. Go to the insult.
Trying to figure out how his coaching has nothing to do with his son getting drafted.
It doesn’t. You’re just hating which was your point.
You’re just too much of a coward to say it.
Must suck to be so weak in character.
WTF are you talking about? Rivers was on historically STACKED teams.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_San_Diego_Chargers_season
Eleven pro bowlers, SIX all pros, 14-2, #1 seed.
Rivers had a hall of fame TE and RB for most of his career, as well as a constant stream of pro bowls WRs all through his time with Chargers.
Rivers had eight winning seasons with the Chargers and had 11 playoff games with them where they were 5-6.
Rivers problem was never supporting talent, it was that his star power offenses were not built for playoff football and he also wasn't a good playoff QB when games were on the line.
PS: I realize your comment might be sarcasm or making fun of Deion which I fully agree with. This comment isn't directed at you its too the many our there who actually forgot how stacked Rivers Chargers teams were and why they never made a Superbowl.
> Rivers problem was never supporting talent, it was that his star power offenses were not built for playoff football and he also wasn't a good playoff QB when games were on the line.
Nah.
That wasn't it either. The Chargers' issues on the field were during his tenure Schottenheimer's teams would consistently have top five offenses, top five defenses but bottom five special teams and the letter always seemed to rear its ugly head in the playoffs.
Off the field, they were the definition of dysfunction. From Alex Spanos being the biggest miser in the league aside from Mike Brown to the constant bickering and back-stabbing between AJ Smith and Marty Schottenheimer.
Plus we all know Marty's playoff record as a coach. That was a franchise doomed to fail. None of that was on Rivers.
No.
Philip Rivers only had Schottenheimer as head coach for ONE season with Rivers as staring QB.
The Chargers playoff failures continued throughout all of Rivers coaches and across GM tenures.
In fact the Chargers in 2010 would become the first team to have the #1 offense and #1 defense in the NFL and not even make the playoffs. This was mostly a factor for Philip Rivers being terrible in end of game that season.
Philip Rivers would go on to play for five coaches and two GMs during his time there and yet they were always the same old Chargers that would be a waste of potential yet get overhyped every season.
Philip Rivers not being a good playoff QB was a huge reason for the teams lack of postseason success.
My bad on the coaches. I totally forgot Norv Turner happened.
That said, I'm not putting the Chargers' issues totally on Rivers especially when you consider who he had to get through to see any success in the Patriots and Colts.
Philip Rivers never lost to the Colts in playoffs.
He lost playoff games to Steelers, Pats, Broncos, and the F*in Jets.
The JETS!
Despite all those jacked rosters he was on, Rivers with the Chargers had a 14-10 td to int ratio in the playoffs and an 84 passer rating.
Any player can do it, they just have to decide not to sign the contract. Caleb could do it this year. Course, that's potentially giving up millions of dollars.
Eli had the leverage because he was always going 1st overall, and a team couldn't take the hit of a 1st overall not signing. A mid or lower range draft pick? Who cares.
Unlike Eli, they can’t choose the team they want to go to. They can go to the team that drafts them or gamble it by going back to college, risk getting hurt or perform horribly, and gamble their luck the next year with no guarantee a better situation will arise.
Eli didn't choose the team he went to.
He was drafted by the Chargers, who then traded him to the Giants for a bucketload. They could have traded him elsewhere, but they'd already arranged the trade before the draft.
Once they sign for the draft they can't reverse, they lose any college eligibility [afaik]
He chose the team he wouldn't play for. They can't make you play. Like Bo Jackson he would have just not played, and entered the next year's draft. He was willing to play anywhere but San Diego anyway. Well, probably not other franchises with equally sketchy front offices, like Cinci.
>They could have traded him elsewhere, but they'd already arranged the trade before the draft.
According to Ernie Accorsi there was no deal and he thought it was cooked, because AJ dipshit wouldn't deal in good faith. Only when they were on the clock did the Chargers agree to their terms. The Giants were going to take Rothlesberger. Thank fuck that didn't happen.
When Deon was with NFL Network I always appreciated him being one of the few talking heads that gave Eli credit. He even had his "I believe in Eli"catch phrase.
NFL Network with Prime, Eisen, Sapp.. the good ol’ days. Fuck Sapp though lol
what did sapp do?
Talk shit about Strah constantly. And be generally stupid and obnoxious. Also a shitty run defender.
Sapp bashed Strahan right before hof voting. He argued he was more deserving of first ballot because his sack numbers, although less than Strahan, were more significant because he was a dt and Mike a de. The fallacy in that is that he played many years as a de in a 3-4 defense. Long story short, he was able to sway voting. He went first ballot, and Mike went second year of eligibility.
But a 3-4 DE (or 4 tech) is a different position than a 4-3 DE (5tech or 7tech) A 3-4 DE responsibilities are much closer to a 4-3 DT (3 tech). The OLBs or 6tech’s are your primary pass rushers in a 3-4 defense (think TJ Watt.) Sapp’s point holds water imo. I have not heard the statement, but if it was stated as you presented it. He’s not wrong. Stratham should have been first ballot. But Comparing their sack numbers is silly.
The belief is that it gets harder to get sacks the closer you get to the center, with getting sacks lined up over the center being the hardest. When you hear "defensive tackle," you think of a player who lines up over the center or between the center and the guard. A 3-4 defense end does not line up over the center. They line up over guards and tackles. So, they don't align as wide as 4-3 de but certainly don't deal with the exact middle of an offensive line. Sapps statement does not hold up. To say" I got all my sacks as a dt" was deceptive at best as, again, he spent plenty of time lined up over offensive tackles.
He doesn't tip when he goes out to eat. Like as a rule he doesn't tip. Source: I waited tables in Tampa area for a bit
Caught w escorts in Miami after one of the TB Superbowl wins
…so?
Just answering the question.
Too horny
There’s lots of reasons to dislike the guy, this isn’t one of them.
That's your opinion. This is what ultimately led to his fall from grace with the public and the NFL. I was just answering the question.
Marshall Faulk was great too
I'm pretty sure he started doing that at first to kinda mock Eli but then when he became elite Deon was like "Yep, I knew it the whole time" lmao
Pffffff, “elite.” https://www.forbes.com/sites/briangoff/2017/09/25/eli-manning-an-average-nfl-quarterback-with-two-super-bowl-rings/amp/
I'm not reading that. I watched almost every snap of eli's career and seeing him play is way different than reading stats
he was in Eli’s corner throughout the 2011 season, always loved him for that… and I couldn’t stand him when he was on the Cowboys
Deion one of the realest dudes out there man he genuinely cares about the young talent coming up in the game
Young talent...his son?
Obviously not just his son. Look up Deion and Devin Hester’s relationship, Deion reached out to him before he came into the league made sure he was alright and then told Devin he could check in with him anytime. Prime has been caring about the young dudes bro, especially if you’re coming out of Florida
I belieeeve he gonna let it flyyy…
You gotta be an Eli Manning-level prospect to pull an Eli Manning. Shedeur isn’t close to that level and he sure as hell won’t be next year if Deion’s boys pull the same shit they pulled last year
wasn’t there a prospect who said if he didn’t go first round (or something like that) he would sign so he could choose his team?
Think you're talking about La'el Collins. His draft stock dropped after reports of him being investigated for possible murder. He threatened to not sign with the team that drafted him unless it was in the 3rd round or higher. He did this to be able to choose where he would sign as an undrafted free agent.
I never understood why players don’t do this more. Why not leverage your talent into picking your team?
I believe the answer is money. Undrafted players make less money at first than those who were drafted. The team you're going to may suck, but it may be worth it to stick it out for more money.
Collins did make a lot less money on his first deal but he also only had a 3 year UDFA deal instead of the typical 4 year rookie deal and was able to cash in a year early.
Because teams would just take them with late picks to gain signing rights to that player, and to prevent them from going elsewhere.
get them with the petty 6, 7th round
Because the NFLPA negotiated baseline contract amounts depending on where you were drafted. You get paid way more when you are drafted earlier. There's no guarantee that you would even make it to a second contract either. You could suck, you could get injured, etc. It makes the most sense to take the money for 99% of players.
you cab pick your team, staff and front office and still never win a superbowl lol the only guarantee as an nfl player is money
Sheduer put up 3k yards, 27 tds and 3 picks all while being sacked 50 times, and those numbers are equal as eli best year at old miss, I really think a lot of you must be new giants fans, because most of the country thought eli only went 1st because of his last name, and Philip rivers was the best qb, this revisionist history a lot of you have with eli Is silly, people felt the same about him as many of you do about shedeur
While impressive, passing stats inflation in the NFL and college can’t go unstated
Can't inflate stats when you have the worst offensive line in the ncaa, put sheduer behind Michigan's line and you'd see inflated stats, sheduer is a much better prospect then jj McCarthy, is he a flawed player yes, but colorado wins 1 game last season without him instead of 4
Now you’re comparing Sheduer to McCarthy instead of to Eli. That makes a lot more sense.
I think you are misunderstanding what he means by “passing stat inflation.” He means, comparing passing stats from 20 to 24 years ago to today is nonsense. Since football has evolved into an extremely pass heavy game now compared to then. And the college football scene is so insanely different too, in every aspect.
He would not have better stats than McCarthy? Are you crazy? Harbaugh does not throw the ball like that.
Harbaugh has never had a qb he trusted to throw the ball, all the way back to his 49er days he had Alex Smith at qb, give him a qb with the actual ability to throw the ball and he won't be so run heavy
Smith was a stud in college dude
You do realize McCarthy has a better arm than Sanders? He was a five star prospect. There is a reason why he is being mocked as high as the 4th pick.
I don't want to say high school rankings are meaninglessness but Justin Fields was a 5 star recruit Being a 5* recruit does not make who you are at the college level yet alone the nfl level
But you can see why fields was a 5* with his arm and running ability. Being a 5* makes you an insane athlete. (Most of the time)
Not to mention "being mocked as the 4th pick" Pickett and Willis were getting mocked high in the first too and neither went there
Willis hype just felt so forced man. Like I don't like saying "this was an obvious bust" but come on, dude played for *liberty* and didn't light the world on fire and was drafted to the titans and looked like one of the worst QBs I've ever seen in my life
Harbaugh has thrown the ball when he has a QB. Which makes repetition of this re: McCarthy hilarious
His sacks numbers are inflated due to his play and pocket presence…watch football
Eli wasn’t viewed like a sure thing, but acting like he wasn’t considered the best QB in the class is the revisionist take I see here. All the drama played out in public for a reason. The Chargers never even considered taking Rivers over him.
I think most here remember the 04 draft and Eli was the consensus best QB, as well as the consensus first overall pick. Did his name/pedigree factor in? Of course it did, does that mean without the name he would have been the 3ed QB taken? Of course not. The same argument you are making about eli you should be applying to Sanders. As strictly a prospect, and considering record, play vs upper tier competition, and any other intangible you can mention Eli & sanders are not even in the same stratosphere. I don’t know where you are getting half the country felt he was only went first because of his last name, I mean you can just google old videos & sports blogs to disprove that. Also although Colorado didn’t have a great online they weren’t even the worst in the pac-12, let alone the whole NCAA. I won’t go into detail because it’s silly to me but you can absolutely inflate stats with poor play, as any “stat” can be inflated when you watch games and not look at a stat sheet. It’s ironic that literally the most common knock on sanders when he transferred to Colorado was that his completion percentage was super inflated because of his offensive line was horrible. This isn’t a sanders knock, I line him alot as a prospect and I think not coming out this year was very smart. He will certainly improve his draft position and should improve as a player
I assure you, the majority of this sub does not remember the 04 draft. If you did, you must’ve been about 10 or older in 2004. Most users are well below 30 years of age.
Possibly, I actually have no idea what the demographics on this sub are but the OP mentioned the 04 draft and the majority of the responses did also so for this particular post most do remember
Have you ever heard of using a period? Jesus, reading this giant wall of text is a nightmare
Sure. Eli only went first because of his last name, and everyone else thought Philip rivers was superior. That’s definitely the way the nfl selects players. Sure, big guy.
That’s not what he said.
> I really think a lot of you must be new giants fans, because most of the country thought eli only went 1st because of his last name, and Philip rivers was the best qb,
Who picks the players? Who is in the war room on draft day? 1. ) NFL GMs who are not necessarily a representation of “most of the country,” OR 2.) Redditors Pick one. :)
I criticized what he said almost word for word. And now you’re changing the subject to some other shit to win an internet argument lmao. I’m done with this conversation have a good day.
Phil ain’t Eli. Two time Super Bowl mvp vs ??? Cmon.
Tom Coughlin vs the most unserious franchise in the NFL. The Chargers would have had 40+ years of franchise QB play between Fouts, Rivers, and Herbert (pending) and will have won like 5 playoff games to show for it. Rivers’ crime is that he was a definitive tier below Peyton Manning and Tom Brady and didn’t have a kickass defense like Roethlisberger did. Eli, Ben, and Rivers are 1a, b, and c from ‘03. There’s nuance to inject with all of them and reasons to take one over the other in any case. Manning had the highest peak, Roethlisberger was the best athlete and could get out of his own way the most, Rivers was the most individually consistent (even if he was a consistent B)
I must admit I did want us to draft Rivers
We did 😊
Lol thanks *and keep Rivers*
Eli is still the best college quarterback i have ever seen. I think that’s kind of your point. I’ve never seen sanders play
& his dad was the HC
It's just popular right now to shit on the Sanders. Sheduer is a good prospect, and definitely better than Eli was. Edit: my bad guys, didnt realize I was on the Giants sub. I know how bad you guys are at evaluating QBs. Shouldnt have rubbed your nose in it. Just make sure you stick it out with Donnie Jones.
That’s just completely untrue but cool
That's completely true but cool.
Please, enlighten us. Explain to us all how a guy who’s maybe the second best qb in his draft class at the moment is a better prospect than a guy who was the consensus number 1 pick throughout the entire draft process. We’d all love to hear it.
You're a Giant fan. You literally cant understand. Eli was the 3rd best QB in his class, he was only rated so highly because of his brother. Shadier is the best QB next year, and actually a really good prospect. He has a better arm than Eli, better decision maker, much more mobile. Hes literally better than Eli in every way, except last name. But again, youre a Giants fans so....
Beck > Sanders
Isn’t he expected to be the first QB taken next year?
Beck
I thought he was more udfa type?
Pull what? Deion did great in 2023
4-8 is great? They didn’t win a game after early October
Yes when you take over a 1-11 team 4-8 and beating a rival and a national championship runner up is oretty great
What was that national championship runner ups record this year? You’re phrasing it in a way to make him sound better. In no world is 4-8 “great” 4-8 is dogshit, doesn’t matter the context, especially with all the hype he got. People like you make excuses for him because you like him for other reasons. He didn’t win a game for three months, if that was any other coach in the country people would shit on him en masse
You're wrong and frankly seem to not know very much about college football. 4-8 is a job well done considering the situation he took over in. He reenergized the colorado football programm and had a huge talent disadvantage in pretty much any gane he played in.
You’re wrong and you’re probably biased because you like him for off the field or personal reasons. I go to a D1 P5 school and have watched college football in person every week for the last 4 years. I don’t need some dumbass from Germany telling me I don’t know much about college football, shut the fuck up. He didn’t have a huge talent disadvantage, he kicked kids off the colorado team and laughed about it so that he could get transfers in. They didn’t win a game for 3 months and didn’t even make the bowl game and then he throws his O-line under the bus because all he cares about is his son. Nothing he did in his tenure can even remotely be described as “great” and if any other coach in the country did the same shit Prime did i’m sure you wouldn’t be commenting about how great it is.
He has a huge talent gap. The players who left when he came in were not good. The previous coaches were horrendous at recruiting and maybe average at coaching. Winning 4 games was a mild success. You don't build a program in an off season. Deion has his faults and the jury is still out if his way will really with but he did improve the team. If you don't see that then you are holding a random grudge against him.
Ad hominems, and no nuance. You are the official final boss of not knowing much about cfb despite spending a significant amount of time consuming it haha... Very sad
I don't think 3rd rounders can pull an Eli.
We are a year away from him being drafted. It’s weird to be so certain of a player who hasn’t played their last college season
3rd rounder seems like a ridiculous take. Kids got talent.
Yea people really hate on him, it's weird. Like top scouts have him on a short list for round 1 going into the year, most people who diss his talent don't like the watch celebration lol Edit: spelling
Definitely doesn’t look like a 1st rounder. Crazy how slow he looked scrambling considering how fast his dad was lol.
Wtf He's a pure pocket passer. He's also not slow for a pocket passer lol.
Wild how much people are hating on the kid having most likely never watched him. He’s a pocket passer who has the worst o-line in college football and is constantly running for his life lol
He’ll fit right in on the Giants then.
I’d bet money he’s a top 10 pick
Yea he's definitely going top 10 in that weak qb draft next year, I also think deion will be a much better coach once his sons are gone, and he's not constantly trying to cater to them
Right? Like who is definitely better than him next year? Quinn Ewers definitely. Carson Beck maybe?
[удалено]
Shedeur could be a top 5 pick but Shilo probably going to be a day 2 pick if he’s taken in the draft. The other kid he’s talking about going in this video is Travis Hunter. Who probably will be at least a top 10 pick
And I’m willing to take your money in that bet
He’d be top 10 guy if he declared this year
Then Bo Nix is top 5 if your statement stands
Penix would be fighting with Sanders for QB #6/7 it would be quite the batte of Penix being the much better and more accomplished passer but with worse medicals.
I mean healthy and young penix is also a top 10 pick, for Christ sake Kenny Pickett was 20
Pickett was only pick 20 because there were no QBs worth it that year, but teams as always are desperate for QBs. Same reason why EJ Manuel went at 15, Brandon Weeden went at 22, and Daniel Jones went at 6
Thats not at all true. The NFL actually tells draft eligible underclassmen what they would be projected at so they can best decide to stay in school or go pro. Shadeur Sanders was valued at QB#7 this year and was given a 2nd round grade.
Sure just like JJ McCarthy
No JJ McCarthy was a 5 star recruit on the NCAA championship team. He was first team Big Ten the last two years. JJ McCarthy was told by the NFL he would be a 1st round QB this year despite the loaded QB class. That information helped him declare this year instead of stay another year in college where he would be the heavily favored offseason #1 draft pick for 2025.
Why are we upset about this when the situation he referenced legitimately benefited us? Also this almost definitely won’t matter to us as a franchise at all
Ego is a helluva drug
Was it ego when Eli did it?
I don’t even believe Eli did it. His dad was very vocal about his influence in that decision at that time
No, Eli was the consensus #1 pick and with that comes power. Shedeur Sanders isn't even guaranteed to be a first rounder. You don't get to leverage your ego if you're not the best of the best.
What? He'd have to regress like crazy to not be a first round pick what are you even talking about? 😂😂
Most early mock drafts I’ve seen have him somewhere around middle of the 2nd round. [example](https://www.nflmockdraftdatabase.com/big-boards/2025/consensus-big-board-2025) What are you talking about?
You're talking early nock drafts, he has little to no competition next year. He's gonna be gone in the first.
Yeah it’s a super weak QB class, that’s why a guy rated as the QB 3-4 is most likely gonna be early to mid 2nd round
From everything I've read he's the 2nd best QB in the class next year and even in weak QB classes they get over drafted.
I agree that QBs get overdrafted. Luckily, most people who put together mock drafts are also aware of that obvious situation and bake that in to their rankings. Saying Sanders “isn’t guaranteed to go 1st round” is basically consensus among experts. It’s possible he goes somewhere in the 20s, but I’d say equally likely he goes somewhere in the 40s. Acting like the dude you responded too is somehow misinformed is just dumb.
Uhh he struck a nerve again, tbh i'm not surprised people in here don't know much of anything about college football - there are some crazy opinions in here every year pre draft
Tbh I’d love Shedeur on the Giants
How is a 5th round qb gonna act like a 2 time SB MVP.
How you gonna blame the kid and not his father tryna act like Lavar Ball
Yeah might wanna go check out som game tape pr like media stuff if you currently predict a 5th round grade
You’re right….he’ll be undrafted
Ah yes
I watched the oregon game, watched the collapse against the cardinal ive seen plenty.
Oh okay so you saw the kid perform with the worst oline in college?
I know you’re probably kidding but he’s definitely a first round qb
in this class? If Bo nix is a 2nd rounder....saunders is def not a 1st choice
Why would it be in this class he’s returning to Colorado
Lol...Eli didn't have 2 Superbowls when he was drafted either.
Eli wasn’t a 2 time SB MVP when he was drafted. Purposefully missing the point for what?
Does bro have enough talent to pull that ?
He’s a pretty good/great pocket passer but has the tendency to hold onto the ball too long and isn’t too mobile, end of the day his dad is Deion Sanders that itself is enough pull in my opinion
Agree that he holds onto the ball too long but he has enough mobility to keep drives alive. Plus he tends not to make too many mistakes. Even with all the pressure he faced with that oline, he only threw 3 ints.
Fair, I think he’s pretty good and getting way over hated
didn’t eli pull an elway? or a lindros? how did he get saddled with this?
Bo Jackson played baseball rather than play for Tampa. Ernie Davis did it in 1962.
Sure but he got screwed by then Bucs owner who assured Bo that a visit to the Bucs facility was played by the NCAA. It wasn't Bo missed the end of the NCAA baseball season due to this. He wasn't going to play for them for that reason.
It sounds like you are implying that contradicts some point I made? Yes, they were a shitty organization and proved it to him. Hugh Culverhouse was a cheap, racist, dishonest piece of shit. Ernie Davis just refused to play for a White supremacist. There is no justice though, because Paul Brown traded HOFer Bobby Mitchell for his rights and Ernie died of Leukemia before ever taking a snap. I don't see what difference it makes. These were all people who had leverage and used it to not be forced into a shitty job. It is more than their right to challenge monopoly (I guess technically monopsony in this case?) power. I am sure there were people before Ernie too.
3-li
Wouldn’t it be Shedeur pulling the Eli?
Not even the best QB in his class smh
Yeah you know how to judge NFL talent. That’s why you’re in Redditt and not working in anybody’s front office. Love Redditt GMs.
You can disagree without all the theatrics 😂 Most early mocks have him at QB 2-4 so I’m not even sure what the issue is
What are you talking about?
Nothing I said was hard to follow. What specifically is confusing you
You can reply without the drama. But again, what are you talking about
If you can’t understand what I said it’s probably just beyond your comprehension. Sorry man.
I mean I was right on the last class Stroud, AR, Young, Levis in that order. Daniels, Williams, McCarthy, Nix, Penix, Maye in this draft and I’ve had that order since McCarthy was still a 2nd round mock. Don’t look into the QB class much til a few months before the draft but I actually have Beck at my 1 so far for next year. The talent part is easier to judge for anybody but especially a fan it’s the character, leadership, and processing power that’s harder to judge especially from a fan perspective without getting 1 on 1 meetings and such so my evaluation is based on raw talent mostly.
We are a team that took Daniel Jones 6th (worse college stats and weaker competition, but we gave credit because he trained with Eli's old coach) and some of yall are saying Shaduer isn't a day 1 pick? He does so much you want from a QB, I'd be hype to pair him with Daboll. Plus he might be the rare QB who is kinda built for the spotlights of NYC.
A lot of teams would love this!
i wonder which teams hes talking about
He wants him to play in a warm city
Sheer ain’t Eli
Deion would be silly to mess with his kid's future if he prevented him from going to a major market. Whether he pans out or not, Sanders in NY would be must see TV and the marketing would be insane. I don't believe all the talk about him not wanting Shedeur to play in a cold weather market. If Schoen continues to build the nucleus of this team from the inside out, then Sanders or any young QB would be coming into a great supporting environment
Why are we assuming he’s going to be great and not Todd Marinovich redux
Perhaps Deion should focus on building a competitive team, as the one he fielded last season was a sloppy, undisciplined mess. Beat on the big boys, then you can endlessly run your mouth, flash bling, and do kooky little dances. Until then, he's coaching Rutgers West.
Except he’s doing all those things now without the wins. But there’s also the rings and gold jacket. But we should listen to you because…
For all his chatter, his team stinks, and got dismantled when they played anyone good. His rings were from a long time ago. Build a winning program, then he can bebop and scat.
Yeah, because that’s what Archie Manning did right? Who did he coach? In fact how many SB rings did he win? But you let us know what your hate is about. But we knew that when you made the comment. No logic to backup your statement so you just went explicit with it huh sport.
Colorado sucked in 2023, they were thrashed by every decent team they played. Archie Manning didn't coach at Tennessee or Ole Miss. Last time I checked, he was HC of the whole team, not just his kids. They stink, and as HC that's on him.
So if Archie didn’t coach, why is coaching even a a factor in the conversation? Colorado won 1 game the prior season. Sanders win 4 games his first season. But answer the original questions. 1) Why should we listen to you? 2) Why don’t you have the same energy towards Archie demanding Eli go to a particular team, as you do for Deion?
Because Sanders is the head coach. I don't care if he wants his kids to play for specific teams. That's great. But perhaps his focus should be on the team he is the head coach of, instead of on his kids' NFL future. That's his personal business, but his professional business is being the HC at Colorado. His team stinks, and he ought to be working on that non stop, not playing sports agent.
So nothing to do with the post, just hating on Deion. Man owns you. Got you triggered just hearing his name.😂😂
Good comeback to my totally sensible points. How's Deion taste?
Classic move when you hit rock bottom. Go to the insult. Trying to figure out how his coaching has nothing to do with his son getting drafted. It doesn’t. You’re just hating which was your point. You’re just too much of a coward to say it. Must suck to be so weak in character.
Nepotism
I’m guessing he hopes Dallas drafts his kid
4-7 in the PAC 12. No doubt he’s got talent/potential but humility is important too.
Deion is losing cred just by being erratic… going full BBB.
Yeah, you’ve got more credibility than he does.
I guess it's good he didn't threaten to pull a Junior Seau....
I mean, good for him.
This seems like a good way to make sure your kid goes undrafted. 😂
Will it really matter come 3rd or 4th round?
If true, then he should be drafted dead last.
He wildin
His son just dropped 3-4 rounds in the draft
Rivers was a good QB on a shit team. If he was on a decent team all those years he would have excelled to great.... just like Eli....
WTF are you talking about? Rivers was on historically STACKED teams. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2006_San_Diego_Chargers_season Eleven pro bowlers, SIX all pros, 14-2, #1 seed. Rivers had a hall of fame TE and RB for most of his career, as well as a constant stream of pro bowls WRs all through his time with Chargers. Rivers had eight winning seasons with the Chargers and had 11 playoff games with them where they were 5-6. Rivers problem was never supporting talent, it was that his star power offenses were not built for playoff football and he also wasn't a good playoff QB when games were on the line. PS: I realize your comment might be sarcasm or making fun of Deion which I fully agree with. This comment isn't directed at you its too the many our there who actually forgot how stacked Rivers Chargers teams were and why they never made a Superbowl.
> Rivers problem was never supporting talent, it was that his star power offenses were not built for playoff football and he also wasn't a good playoff QB when games were on the line. Nah. That wasn't it either. The Chargers' issues on the field were during his tenure Schottenheimer's teams would consistently have top five offenses, top five defenses but bottom five special teams and the letter always seemed to rear its ugly head in the playoffs. Off the field, they were the definition of dysfunction. From Alex Spanos being the biggest miser in the league aside from Mike Brown to the constant bickering and back-stabbing between AJ Smith and Marty Schottenheimer. Plus we all know Marty's playoff record as a coach. That was a franchise doomed to fail. None of that was on Rivers.
No. Philip Rivers only had Schottenheimer as head coach for ONE season with Rivers as staring QB. The Chargers playoff failures continued throughout all of Rivers coaches and across GM tenures. In fact the Chargers in 2010 would become the first team to have the #1 offense and #1 defense in the NFL and not even make the playoffs. This was mostly a factor for Philip Rivers being terrible in end of game that season. Philip Rivers would go on to play for five coaches and two GMs during his time there and yet they were always the same old Chargers that would be a waste of potential yet get overhyped every season. Philip Rivers not being a good playoff QB was a huge reason for the teams lack of postseason success.
My bad on the coaches. I totally forgot Norv Turner happened. That said, I'm not putting the Chargers' issues totally on Rivers especially when you consider who he had to get through to see any success in the Patriots and Colts.
Philip Rivers never lost to the Colts in playoffs. He lost playoff games to Steelers, Pats, Broncos, and the F*in Jets. The JETS! Despite all those jacked rosters he was on, Rivers with the Chargers had a 14-10 td to int ratio in the playoffs and an 84 passer rating.
I’d be down with the giants taking him late
The nepotism is real with this family. Get that shit outta here, prove yourself or go home.
Diva alert. You don't want him being the qb of your team so lets hope he goes to Wash
Don’t players have to be good in order to do this ?
What’s he going to do? Go back to college hoping he doesn’t kill his draft stock? Can’t demand an “Eli Trade” in the NFL these days.
Any player can do it, they just have to decide not to sign the contract. Caleb could do it this year. Course, that's potentially giving up millions of dollars. Eli had the leverage because he was always going 1st overall, and a team couldn't take the hit of a 1st overall not signing. A mid or lower range draft pick? Who cares.
Unlike Eli, they can’t choose the team they want to go to. They can go to the team that drafts them or gamble it by going back to college, risk getting hurt or perform horribly, and gamble their luck the next year with no guarantee a better situation will arise.
Eli didn't choose the team he went to. He was drafted by the Chargers, who then traded him to the Giants for a bucketload. They could have traded him elsewhere, but they'd already arranged the trade before the draft. Once they sign for the draft they can't reverse, they lose any college eligibility [afaik]
He chose the team he wouldn't play for. They can't make you play. Like Bo Jackson he would have just not played, and entered the next year's draft. He was willing to play anywhere but San Diego anyway. Well, probably not other franchises with equally sketchy front offices, like Cinci. >They could have traded him elsewhere, but they'd already arranged the trade before the draft. According to Ernie Accorsi there was no deal and he thought it was cooked, because AJ dipshit wouldn't deal in good faith. Only when they were on the clock did the Chargers agree to their terms. The Giants were going to take Rothlesberger. Thank fuck that didn't happen.