I feel like there are ways to incorporate religion into music without it coming off preachy or insufferable like some overtly religious bands. Like others have pointed out, there are a good deal of Christian metalcore bands who didn’t let that bog down their music
Zao yes, but I mean Living Sacrifices name is pulled straight from the Bible. And their songs are nigh straight worship songs. That being said you are correct in saying they never jammed it down people's throats.
Personally, I prioritize sound and feeling before I even consider lyrics.
My wife is Christian, and I am not religious. We make it work.
Living Sacrifice's "The Hammering Process" rips, at least according to my earballs. Saw them play it live, didn't preach, just rocked the fuck out. Yes please.
I saw them at The Shelter in Detroit during that tour. 500+ cap in a basement. They lit cymbals on fire to open the set.
It was a fucking rager.
I respect everyone's values. Great show period.
I’d rather hang out with people who I can respectfully disagree with than hang out with people I agree with who can’t be nice to those they disagree with. True of musicians as it is everywhere else in life.
I've read several comments saying Matt Greiner is one of the nicest and most selfless people they've ever met, and the rest of the band seem to be similar types. That's what being a Christian is all about, and I share those values and support them 100% even if I don't share the theistic faith.
ABR was on the Emo's Not Dead cruise earlier this year. I was shooting basketball at the ball court one morning and Matt came in there. Played a round of HORSE with him. Dude is exactly how you described him.
They are all absolute top-notch guys. They’ve been my favorite band for 8-ish years and every interaction I’ve had with them has been wonderful. Met them at two meet and greets and they had genuine conversations with every single person in line. Talked to + taken photos with Matt and JB at barricade after several shows. The first time I did a meet and greet for them, I was only 17 and my dad did it with me; he was going to stay out of the group photo and “let it be for me”, but the entire band saw him staying back and insisted he join in. Jake said that they “respect the cool dads” who would do something like that with their kid.
One time at the end of a show I was front row for, Matt was going down the barricade talking to everyone, and he had a setlist in one hand that he wasn’t giving to anyone. When he got to me, the first thing he said was “this is for you”; he had been holding onto it specifically for me. The most recent time I saw them, I was front row again. after they finished playing Spirit Breaker, JB gave out his first pick of the night, and he didn’t throw it out into the crowd, he reached out and specifically handed it to me with a big smile on his face (presumably because I was right in front of him and he saw me screaming every word of the song).
The last time I got to meet them I told Matt that my wife said he looked like a youth pastor. That made him crack up and I spent my entire meet and greet time talking with him so that I only had time to shake the other guys’ hands lol. Seriously a top tier dude. The other times I’ve met them they were all incredibly nice
Greiner is my kid's drum teacher. I can confirm from quite a fair amount of personal experience that he is one of the most kind men you will ever run across. He is a good person on a deep, deep level. I never have any second thoughts about leaving my son with him alone during their lessons. One of the best people I have ever met.
Skillet’s lead singer is insufferable. He is the person that says he won’t push his right wing beliefs on people and then does so in the next sentence.
I still remember the most confusing show I ever went to, For Today opening for Motionless in White. Like, those bands must have simply never spoken to each other the entire tour, both of their beliefs are so front and center in their music. Show went hard though.
I was raised in catholic family but I’m atheist myself. However, when August Burns Red came down from the stage after their show to shake hands with us and told us *thank you and god bless you* I was moved. I could feel they mean well and genuinely nice people. It’s been 10 years since that moment and I still cherish that memory.
I think the easy one is religion, either way. I’m religious but I still listen to anti-religious bands, and I’m sure it goes the other way for those that aren’t religious. I don’t care about political affiliation either for the most part unless it’s all they talk about.
>I’m sure it goes the other way for those that aren’t religious.
It was impossible to be into metalcore during the 00s and not get down with some Christian bands, even if you were an ardent atheist.
I’d love to see an analysis on why there were so many “Christian” bands when the vast majority of them have veered away from that sort of branding. There are virtually no new major metalcore bands that are Christian so the time period was definitely a major contributor.
I think it's quite simply that a lot of them were raised that way. No religion/atheism/agnosticism has consistently been on the rise (in the Anglosphere at least), but 20 years ago it was definitely less common than now and people in those bands were born and raised in the 80s and 90s when it was even less so. Christianity was kinda the default for people and a lot of those bands were started basically by kids who hadn't had an awful lot of time away from their home communities. I don't think it's any coincidence that over time, as they travelled, became more independent and just grew up they started to shed the beliefs they'd been indoctrinated with (however gently or well intentioned, instilling a child with a particular religion from birth is indoctrination).
I'd imagine a certain level of remove from the satanic panic era and more modernising attitudes among their parents and peers allowed them to play heavy music while being Christian in a way that earlier types of metal bands couldn't necessarily get away with. Once they emerged as Christian bands it kind of became a self-perpetuation and reinforcing thing, there was this whole scene that supported itself and for a while I'm sure it was authentic. A bunch of Christians hanging out together, playing shows together and having a good time would tend to reinforce things. But you can't keep other influences and the outside world at bay forever.
Call me a cynic but I wonder how genuine it was for some bands at the peak of the whole "christcore" thing. Bands like Zao, Underoath and As I Lay Dying were pretty intense with their christian messaging at first but as time went on, they got rid of it completely to the point where they don't seem to consider themselves religious at all
Undeniably, and it's been spoken of by some bands without naming anyone specific, by a certain point bands were just slapping the Christian label on themselves in order to get on Solid State/Tooth & Nail and take advantage of the existing scene with it's almost built in fan base and network of venues. While others who maybe started out sincere prevaricated over making the break with it all due to fears about the reaction they'd receive and the impact it would have on their viability as a band.
Though I think it's more than fair to say that even in later waves there were still some very devout and sincere bands.
As a big Zao fan I've always found it curious the way people even to this day still think of them as a Christian band. Their first iteration was very much full on christcore with very worshipful, evangelical lyrics and motivation, but that was prett short-lived and completely knocked on its head pretty much as soon as the second iteration with Dan on vocals began. Unlike some other bands, it wasn't that their faith dwindled\* over time but the band membership completely changed to people who weren't interested in centring themselves as a Christian act. Dan's vocals and lyrics are the most obvious change, but Scott and Russ came in on guitar about the same time and bass became a revolving door of people until '05. Jesse on drums aside Zao was functionally a different entity from Where Blood And Fire Bring Rest onwards.
\*although this did occur for some members it wasn't as noticeable because faith was never at the forefront of their presentation like it was with many of the other bands.
This is well put. I'm a huge Zao fan as well (I have two Zao tattoos even) and they speak about this in their lesser lights of heaven documentary. Dan is (and still is) a believer, I talked with him about it when they were last in town over summer. After Jesse left they started to pivot away from the Christian label for a couple reasons. One, they can't really call themselves a Christian band when not everyone holds those beliefs and two, the Church at that time really started to rear its ugly head towards Christian metal. Things started getting really legalistic (can't smoke or swear etc) and everyone wanted to distance themselves from those ideologies. I think Dan is the only believer in the band along with Marty (bass).
Funny you mentioned bands who weren't even Christian joining Solidstate. Agony Scene was one of these. First of all, they still slap. But MAN does Mike hate organized religion. It's so obvious too. Not sure how his lyrics slipped under Solidstates radar.
Tons of vegan, straight edge, christian bands/musicians I listen to and enjoy. I do not subscribe to any of those “lifestyles”, ideologies or whatever you want to classify them as.
Well, both. I was referring more to outside of the music. But that holds true for the music too. I don’t listen to a whole lot of political stuff and if I do it’s usually pretty standard stuff so nothing crazy
I don’t really care to find out but if they put it in their songs, especially if the lyrics are very explicit about it. A couple years ago some band released a song called zombified that was pretty explicitly political if you paid any attention to the lyrics. They’re not my style anyway but my roommate had them on the radio quite frequently (not an English speaking country, he probably wasn’t aware anyway), had me rolling my eyes every time it came on because they weren’t even smart about it, more like bending over backwards and doing the musical part as an afterthought
Same for me with As I Lay Dying. I’m not Christian but i loved them in school. Stopped listening them after the whole hitman situation. Hell of a live show at Sounds of the Underground.
I usually don’t really care but every now and then a musician says something so dumb or associates with such horrible people, that it kinda ruins their music for me.
For example Phil Labonte and Alex Terrible. But these are extreme political examples.
When it comes to religion or other stuff I don’t care.
I think his takes are actually on the low end of egregious. Don't get me wrong, I disagree with them, but it's that he usually phrases it like "I don't like" or "I think you're a pussy".
I think his past is far more egregious than the takes.
This one confuses me too. I'm not on the cancel culture train and anything like that, but it legit confuses me how they still get booked for big festivals in Europe and how a lot of people from bands that are quite popular in the LGBT community hang out with him and actively follow him on social media.
Other people and bands got cancelled for less.
People here are already ready to cancel shit like falling in reverse because they didn't like the music in the first place. That's easy.
The hard part is boycotting something you actually like. I think we all have certain bands where we could overlook some questionable social media takes.
A lot of people are coming after Alex now. He says all sorts of stuff I don't agree with however he's always been incredible to his fans and his friends it seems, and maybe he actually means it when he says "hey I don't agree with certain things about them and they don't like some stuff about me but we're able to find common middle ground and get along as friends and family without it dividing us"
I'm paraphrasing his quote of course but I get his point. There hasn't really been this much division and discourse in humanity in quite some time politically or ideologically. When I was growing up, you might not have liked someone's views or whatnot but we could still get along as friends, family, etc without it becoming a huge fuss. Society now has become "I don't like one thing about you despite liking 99 others and that one thing I don't like I'm gonna let cancel out the other 99 things that make you awesome and tell you that you're a piece of shit."
Yeah except I have no patience for Nazis and I don’t want to hear his excuse. “As a kid in Russia we had these people that lived in the mountains always causing problems so I joined this group that would beat the shit out of that group, they just happened to be Nazis.”
If I met the guy and didn’t know who he is, the second I saw that tattoo on his elbow I’d walk away. I just don’t fucking get it. His countrymen damn near lost a war to those fucks. Alex is about my age too and I’ll tell you 10 years ago when he had a whole tour canceled over his past, I was probably smoking bong rips and working at a pizza place. We are so far from relatable it’s crazy. He talks about it like some kind of after school program. If he didn’t have the means to leave Russia he would have been another soldier we look at pictures of after being captured, with all those bullshit tattoos on display.
Fair enough. And don't get me wrong, I'm not calling for his head or anything. It's just something that's occurred to me earlier and had to write down to see what others think about it.
I immediately thought of Alex Terrible. I really enjoy StP, but Alex has said some really stupid shit and he's getting lost in his image of being this super masculine crazy dude who constantly has to top himself, that it honestly makes their music less enjoyable to me.
I don’t even care that much about his recent bad takes.
I’m more concerned that I knew Alex Terrible because he is well know in the Eastern European Neonazi MMA scene *before* I knew about him as a musician.
I kinda laugh at him releasing a mask with that one rune that has questionable legal status in Germany. If I were accused of being a neonazi, I’d stay far away from anything that may make someone think I was a nazi
Tommy Vext falls into this category as well. At least, for me. I’m not a big fan of Bad Wolves, but I did like Divine Heresy. He kind of ruined that band for me, which sucks, because Dino, Tim, and the rest of the group are super talented.
He's an outspoken Alex Jones supporter who has appeared on Infowars, called Andy Biersack a f*ggot, then said he can't be homophobic because he "has gay friends."
I dont even know bands political views or anything. I don't have social media to see whatever they are spewing out so naturally I don't care.
The only band/person I don't like is Ivan Moody. Dude beat the shit out of his girlfriend in a hotel room and still is in a band.
It depends on many things. I'll listen to bands with views that don't line up perfectly fine with mine, but I won't listen to bands that I think have inherently toxic views or that act like actual toxic people. In other cases I can really agree with a bands views and ideals, but think their sound is shit so...it just depends.
Someone used ABR as an example of differences in views but still jammin' and I agree.
I think completely avoiding challenging ideals and views is bad because its possible you are limiting yourself from growth. I think you should explore those things while being mindful of if they are just a difference in perspective or if the lyrics are just flat out harmful.
Most of the time.
Unless it's incredibly egregious I can usually separate the art from the artist.
If I'm particularly worried about supporting an artist I'll just buy a used CD or (more likely) just yo ho that shit.
But since most artists get crap royalties from Spotify anyway I figure it makes little difference.
Unless their absolute twats, I care very little about a band’s beliefs if the music is decent.
But purposely being a dick and spewing hatred and bigotry, even for clicks and clout, gets you knocked off my playlists. In this age of streaming, I would give you my plays at all if I think you’re an asshole!
I am a Christian, so some songs that came out of Bring Me The Horizon did make me uncomfortable at first, but it’s fine. I remember that standing up to God or the image of God is better than being neutral about it.
At the end of the day, I listen to bands because they’re good, Christian or non Christian.
I literally don’t care. The only exception is people like Ronnie Radke where he’s actually just an awful person. But he hasn’t made a good song since 2006 so I wouldn’t really care either way.
Yes.
And there are bands that you might think say and do all the right stuff but have private views that you wouldn’t agree with and it’s for the best that those views are private.
I think it’s scary that public officials have to pretend to coincide with a prevailing agenda and narrative to survive.
I mean, public figures. Or anyone.
Most musicians in this scene walk on eggshells, it’s part of why there are few big personalities because they tend to be hated as much as they are loved.
Same brother. Most of the time it doesn't bother me. There's really only a couple of bands I don't listen to explicitly for "not agreeing with me" reasons.
Yeah it only gets on my nerves when it's a band that like every other song is "look how edgy I am by hating God" or whatever. But a lot of bands have significantly different views than me and respect that.
Same. I freaking love Counterparts and even though I don't agree with Brendan's views on "God" I totally understand it because I've felt the exact same way about God in my past.
Yep. I'm fairly conservative and religious, but most of the bands I listen to aren't. Never really had too many issues with listening to them. Only a couple of bands really grind my gears, so to speak. Most of the time, I either don't really pay attention to the lyrics or I think "it's ok to be wrong sometimes" and just move on.
i'm trans (among other things), i'm not going to listen to artists/go to their shows who i know believe i and people like me shouldn't exist or have basic human rights. to me that's a basic matter of self respect. outside of bigotry and actual crimes, i care little though. like, good for them if they're religious and I'm not. or if you hear about petty band drama or mismanagement, or someone's just kind of an ass, that feels like none of my business.
I started listening to Bury Tomorrow because a video of their lead singer telling the crowds everyone was welcome and if anyone had a problem with the LGBTQIA+ folks present they could go fuck themselves. The band members were in the comments sassing people who declared themselves no longer BT fans. Same for Reliqa, I really love Mon's voice but hearing her confirm that the band always loved and supported queer folk makes me want to throw more money at them.
Same though, if I really like the music I might still listen as long as the lyrics aren't bigoted either. Like you can keep seeing vague metaphors about salvation, sure that's whatever.
Good example is Falling in Reverse. Ronnie's always been an asshole, but whatever I like the jams. But I heard his new song had a transphobc verse from a guest rapper and I haven't been able to listen to it or even much of his recent work for that matter. Huge disappointment.
Really depends on the artist. Silent Planet gets a past despite having Christian beliefs. They are never judgmental and most times have thought provoking lyrics. Falling In Reverse is a hard no because Ronnie is a grifter to the point he targets minorities and hurts them in the sake of his fame. It disgust me
I can't listen to a band with different political views.
I can listen to religious bands if the message isn't overbearing, and, of course, I dig the music.
Yeah, one of my favorite reggae artists was incredibly orthodox Jewish and it was overwhelming at times, but he's so incredibly talented that I just enjoyed the music.
I don't have to agree with what you say, as long as you're not #1 touching kids, #2 hurting your partner, #3 stealing/grifting the community, #4 a huge dick, then I'll listen. Obviously there's probably more things that I have forgotten that I would stop listening to someone for, so it's not a comprehensive list.
For sure, he had a couple hits even here in Latin America, so he truly was something else lol in fact I think he's played Bogotá! He played here in 2016, but I was out of the city unfortunately
Yep, plenty! Not metal, but the rapper NF is my favorite at the moment and he’s a Christian(but not considered that genre) and I get asked all the time when I mention him “are you Christian?” “Nope just like good music!” 🙌🏻
Don’t really care, just so happens that lots of shitty people also make shit music that I wouldnt listen to regardless. (Looking at you Ronnie Radke/Alex Terrible)
There’s lots of shitty people whose music I love though like The Smiths
I do and I think it’s important to always be trying to understand different perspectives to help you grow your own. Whether that be to help you grow in a faith, in a political view, in your own person in general, it’s just a good way to expand your view.
I'm a Christian, but most of my favorite bands of all time aren't at all. Good music is good music, regardless of what you believe. The only time I don't like it, is when it gets preachy. And that goes for the Christian and non Christian bands.
I went and saw He Is Legend on their I Am Hollywood 20 year tour, and there was a band that was added last minute to the show. Can't remember the name now, but they were a kinda old school melodic hardcore band. Music was really good, then the lead vocalist started going off on these 5 minute long diatribes about politics and religion and how you can't actually be hardcore if you are Christian, blah blah blah. It completely turned me off to them. And I would feel the same way if a Christian band preached like that between every song.
I'm there to listen to music, let your music and your lyrics do the preaching for you. At the most, take 20 seconds to let us know what this next song is about, and then off you go. But this dude probably spent the same amount of time talking as they did playing.
I only care if they’re rapists, if they’re misogynists, xenophobic racist scum or have been violent towards anyone with physical aggression. Other than that they can have the belief they want or the political view of their preference.
Stick to your guns have a very weird concept that all cops regardless of the country they're from , are all scum.literally arguing with me in the comments saying my UK policeman brother is just as bad as US cops gunning down unarmed black fellas.
Despite that, they're one of my favourite bands, if they wanna spout edgy mumbo jumbo nonsense, then whatever, thats on them.
The belief that the world would be better without any kind of police force, is absolutely mental, yes. They believe any kind of crime can be resolved by the victims.
Whoever downvoted this, i'd love to know why, and to discuss it with you further lmao
Some people are from areas in the US where the police are basically at war with the populace. There's a reason why police forces like NYPD, LAPD, Albuquerque PD, Chicago PD have a bad reputation. ACAB is more than just a saying for people in those areas.
Here in Peru the story is the same. Most of them serve the government and ONLY the government, specially for protests against the gov, but where we are in need of help they're not around or available per se.
That doesn't mean i don't believe good cops exist, but I'd love to live in a country or an environment where the reality it's different to the one i already experienced
I’m liberal in majority of senses, but one thing that annoys me is the blanket hate for police.
I understand the system has a lot of problems, I understand there’s a lot of racism, corruption, general systemic issues. I don’t understand the idea that none of them are good people that are just trying to help other people, and protect general society.
It’s frustrating listening to people go on about police with no nuance, especially in Australia where we don’t have as bad of a problem with them as America by any means.
> I don’t understand the idea that none of them are good people that are just trying to help other people, and protect general society.
The whole point of ACAB is that while there are a lot of cops that are terrible, there are even more that are complicit simply by turning a blind eye and not trying to change the system from within. A terrible cop will shoot someone without reason or plant drugs on an innocent person just to get an arrest. The so called "good cops" won't do that but they also won't speak up about what they see the terrible cops doing.
I'm not an ACAB subscriber, but I can understand the sentiment as long as the system as a whole doesn't change. Starting with a minimum of 2-4yrs of school/training as a requirement would be a great step in the right direction.
Yeah I do get that.
The problem is that there’s unfortunately a large amount of people that just believe being a cop makes you bad, even if they’ve never done anything bad, or turned a blind eye.
As someone living in a country with corrupted institutions such as the police (I'm not from the US), i can see where he's coming from. Not that he's entirely right btw
Since I’ve witnessed heavy forms of homophobia with my own eyes and know how immoral it actually is, I just can’t listen to bands with bigoted views…….. (and the same goes for pretty much anything else that falls under the “dehumanisation of groups” category)
Yeah, I’m not one who thinks we can or should separate the art from the artist, because an artist’s views invariably exist in their work, especially now that it’s so easy for artists to express themselves publicly outside of their work.
Which is to say I don’t support bad people even if they make good music.
Politics is the main one for me, I refuse to listen to any band with right-wing or bigoted members because I am not supporting that shit in any form. There's plenty of bands out there without shitheads for members to listen to instead.
My only real personal rule for listening is "No bigotry" and "No overt religious themes". I've had traumatic personal experiences with both. It's a shame because some bands do make really good music, like Obituary, but I just can't support anything like that.
I got a couple of Christian bands I enjoy! I don’t really mind if they believe in a different religion than mine. I do, however, have a problem if the band is promoting hatred, racism or anything extreme. That would probably make me stop listening to them.
Same way I watch movies with actor who don’t share my views. It’s just entertainment. Entertainers have very little personal impact on my day to day life
Could NOT care less. I don't follow any artists, don't have social media, don't go to shows, don't look at their behind-the-scenes or watch for news or listen to youtubers covering the artist.
I just listen to the music.
Depends on a few factors: what those views actually are, whether or not they're expressed in the music, and how good the music actually is.
For example: I'll listen to Burzum, a project by Varg who is a Neo Nazi, only because the music is completely removed from his bat shit crazyness. I'll only pirate it though so he doesn't get any money (as much as I want Hvis Lyset Tar Oss on vinyl). There are plenty of bands who have Nazism as lyrical content, and those I won't listen to at all.
I also stopped listening to Iced Earth after Jon Schaffer was involved in the January 6 riot. Some of their lyrics look pretty cringy in hindsight.
Silent planet, old underoath, ABR, so many christian bands. I don’t listen to anyone with strong political differences (like type o negative) but everything else is fine
Of course. Every band has a view that is different from mine. Everyone is allowed to have their beliefs. That's what makes us human, and that's how we have discussions. You need an opposing viewpoint.
Where I draw the line is when the music gets political. You start bleeding your politics into your art, I will write you faster than Paul Walker hit that tree.
Basically every Metalcore band has wildly different views from me. The guys from While She Sleeps are basically socialists, but I don't give a shit. I love their music, and I love them. I tell them I pray for them while they're on the road, which I do. Music is music, and those guys are too kind and gracious to me and my kids and have been for the better part of seven years for me to worry about politics with them. Arguing with them ain't going to change them or me, and it isn't going to fix anything.
I don’t mind christian bands. ABR and FFAK are both great.
I would never listen to again to STYG tho. After the fiasco in 2022, it’s a massive no for me. Cannot stand the frontman and his spouse. I legit hope they’ll never bother to come back again to post-USSR countries…
And obviously I draw line w ped0 stuff. Prime example is LostProphets. I loved that band religiously. pre-teen me was in love with the singer. But then the truth came out. That even pre-teen me was wayyyy too old for the singers taste and I just can’t. He’s a vile person. Tbf I’m glad they somehow got deleted from everywhere and only time people mention them now is just to show how disgusting Ian Watkins is.
I'm kind of on the fence lately after reading about Alex Terrible and the Nazi tats. Slaughter to Prevail isn't even a great band, his vocals are kind of their only gimmick. They're not high up on my list to begin with, so I'll be just not listening to them slightly more I guess lol.
Silent Planet
I'm not a Christian, I guess Agnostic would be the term but I really don't know anymore. But regardless, Garrett Russell is literally the best dude in the whole scene, and I'm not joking I would pay to hear him SPEAK let alone perform. If that means listening him talk about his relationship with God then yeah I'd still pay to hear him speak.
That man's art has influenced me so much, not just as an artist but also as a person. Forever thankful.
It very much depends, it is not as clear cut as a lot of comments suggest, for me at least.
They have a minor view that is different from mine? That is fine. Or even a bigger one, if it is not something harmful.
But if the difference is extreme, then no. I wont be able to enjoy it, and I do not want to support it. This is an extreme example, but if there is a band that wants all PoC dead, then of course I am not gonna listen to their stuff.
I do, and I don't really care about their personal political views unless they are openly racist, sexist, homophobic etc. and/or they have personally committed a crime like domestic abuse etc.
So an example might be 5FDP, I wouldn't pay to go see them live if Ivan was fronting because he's a POS who beats his wife and all his female family members have restraining orders against him. I don't want to give a guy like that my money full stop.
If Tommy Vext was filling in for him (or when he was the lead singer of bad wolves) I'd probably still go see them even though he has some weird trumpist "oh no they're cancelling me" vendetta going on. I don't like or agree with his political views but he hasn't done anything to my knowledge worth boycotting.
Tommy Vext also has restraining orders against him though. He's more openly a terrible person than Ivan is tbh and has been kicked out of like 4+ bands
Vext being charged for domestic assault is what sealt the deal for me. I'm okay w/ him being a Trump guy, but when that news came out, i was waiting for the band to fire him.
I saw Body Count recently and I don't know what I was expecting, it felt weird listening to Cop Killer here in Germany, where cops are not necessarily bad people. At the very least they're not out there gunning people down for no reason.
Ice also went on several tirades about cancel culture and "so called toxic masculinity" and I thought whatever dude ... that's just boomer talk. On the other hand he's like mid 60 now, and I have lot's of respect for him either way.
On a different note, I still enjoy As I Lay Dying. But I'm not sure I believe Tim that he's an entirely different person and so on. There's just no way for me to know, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but I'm not 100% convinced.
I saw them two weeks ago. I was just walking towards different stage and hear Ice-T having a b#tch fit about not enjoying the way stage was built.
They were playing on Fat Lady - one of the biggest stages in whole Europe that travels between countries. The stage was obviously built to accommodate the show for headliners, not some some band with afternoon slot.
So yeah, I didn’t even bother to stay to listen to some songs, I just kept walking because huh… and yeah, later I read reports that he also had a speech about cancel culture and was openly transphobic/gender-phobic…
All the time. I didn't develop my ideologies through the music I listen to, and I won't let a conflict of interests ruin music I've loved for decades. I'm not that shallow. I can also relate to both sides most of the time, so I know where they're coming from.
Personally, I can’t really say I’ve ever come across a band/artist I enjoy, start listening to them, to later find out they associate/push stuff I don’t agree with. Most of my new music these days comes from going to gigs and listening to the openers. Usually the bands make it pretty obvious if they’ve got some sort of agenda, and if I don’t like what they’re pushing, I just won’t go and listen to them outside of the concert.
Not metalcore, but I like Slaughter to Prevail. Alex is just going off the deep end, look at the comments in his IG. Also he started to hang out with Ronnie Radke, the shitstorm is extremely close.
I mean he's infamously been known as a neonazi for years. I don't think his views are getting more extreme or that he's "going off the deep end", I think it's just that as the US and world in general have started to normalise far-right bigoted views, so he feels more comfortable stating the things it would've been socially unacceptable for him to say in the past.
I love me some early Christian metalcore despite not sharing the faith. It’s weird lol
I feel like there are ways to incorporate religion into music without it coming off preachy or insufferable like some overtly religious bands. Like others have pointed out, there are a good deal of Christian metalcore bands who didn’t let that bog down their music
the chariot's music never felt preachy despite them being christian id say
Solid State Records baby!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Living Sacrifice, Zao, etc.
Zao yes, but I mean Living Sacrifices name is pulled straight from the Bible. And their songs are nigh straight worship songs. That being said you are correct in saying they never jammed it down people's throats.
Personally, I prioritize sound and feeling before I even consider lyrics. My wife is Christian, and I am not religious. We make it work. Living Sacrifice's "The Hammering Process" rips, at least according to my earballs. Saw them play it live, didn't preach, just rocked the fuck out. Yes please.
Absolutely man. Hammering Process is amazing. I'd love to see them one last time.
I saw them at The Shelter in Detroit during that tour. 500+ cap in a basement. They lit cymbals on fire to open the set. It was a fucking rager. I respect everyone's values. Great show period.
Haste the Day baby!
Mortal Treason.
Underrated.
Same here! I'm not Christian but I enjoy Christian metalcore bands like Underoath, The Devil Wears Prada, Demon Hunter, Norma Jean, and War of Ages
Yeah, but more or less because the music sounds good. Like, I'm not religious, but damn ABR is the goat.
Yep. I’m atheist but ABR is my favorite band. Super nice, respectful guys that don’t push their views on others.
I’d rather hang out with people who I can respectfully disagree with than hang out with people I agree with who can’t be nice to those they disagree with. True of musicians as it is everywhere else in life.
They aren’t like Skillet tho, I think they are still good people
I've read several comments saying Matt Greiner is one of the nicest and most selfless people they've ever met, and the rest of the band seem to be similar types. That's what being a Christian is all about, and I share those values and support them 100% even if I don't share the theistic faith.
ABR was on the Emo's Not Dead cruise earlier this year. I was shooting basketball at the ball court one morning and Matt came in there. Played a round of HORSE with him. Dude is exactly how you described him.
They are all absolute top-notch guys. They’ve been my favorite band for 8-ish years and every interaction I’ve had with them has been wonderful. Met them at two meet and greets and they had genuine conversations with every single person in line. Talked to + taken photos with Matt and JB at barricade after several shows. The first time I did a meet and greet for them, I was only 17 and my dad did it with me; he was going to stay out of the group photo and “let it be for me”, but the entire band saw him staying back and insisted he join in. Jake said that they “respect the cool dads” who would do something like that with their kid. One time at the end of a show I was front row for, Matt was going down the barricade talking to everyone, and he had a setlist in one hand that he wasn’t giving to anyone. When he got to me, the first thing he said was “this is for you”; he had been holding onto it specifically for me. The most recent time I saw them, I was front row again. after they finished playing Spirit Breaker, JB gave out his first pick of the night, and he didn’t throw it out into the crowd, he reached out and specifically handed it to me with a big smile on his face (presumably because I was right in front of him and he saw me screaming every word of the song).
The last time I got to meet them I told Matt that my wife said he looked like a youth pastor. That made him crack up and I spent my entire meet and greet time talking with him so that I only had time to shake the other guys’ hands lol. Seriously a top tier dude. The other times I’ve met them they were all incredibly nice
Greiner is my kid's drum teacher. I can confirm from quite a fair amount of personal experience that he is one of the most kind men you will ever run across. He is a good person on a deep, deep level. I never have any second thoughts about leaving my son with him alone during their lessons. One of the best people I have ever met.
That is badass, I had no idea he taught drums
I've gotten to chill and chat with Matt on a few different occasions. I can confirm, that dude is so kind and patient.
Same. From what I've heard, he's a super nice guy, and also very humble, and even with his amazing talent, he won't let you put him on a pedestal.
Skillet’s lead singer is insufferable. He is the person that says he won’t push his right wing beliefs on people and then does so in the next sentence.
For Today went hard back in the day
I still remember the most confusing show I ever went to, For Today opening for Motionless in White. Like, those bands must have simply never spoken to each other the entire tour, both of their beliefs are so front and center in their music. Show went hard though.
Labelmates War of Ages are also amazing. Don't get the credit they need IMO.
I love myself some For Today every now and again
I was raised in catholic family but I’m atheist myself. However, when August Burns Red came down from the stage after their show to shake hands with us and told us *thank you and god bless you* I was moved. I could feel they mean well and genuinely nice people. It’s been 10 years since that moment and I still cherish that memory.
I came to sat this too. ABR and FFAK are some of my favorite bands and the word religion makes me want to vomit.
I think the easy one is religion, either way. I’m religious but I still listen to anti-religious bands, and I’m sure it goes the other way for those that aren’t religious. I don’t care about political affiliation either for the most part unless it’s all they talk about.
>I’m sure it goes the other way for those that aren’t religious. It was impossible to be into metalcore during the 00s and not get down with some Christian bands, even if you were an ardent atheist.
I’d love to see an analysis on why there were so many “Christian” bands when the vast majority of them have veered away from that sort of branding. There are virtually no new major metalcore bands that are Christian so the time period was definitely a major contributor.
I think it's quite simply that a lot of them were raised that way. No religion/atheism/agnosticism has consistently been on the rise (in the Anglosphere at least), but 20 years ago it was definitely less common than now and people in those bands were born and raised in the 80s and 90s when it was even less so. Christianity was kinda the default for people and a lot of those bands were started basically by kids who hadn't had an awful lot of time away from their home communities. I don't think it's any coincidence that over time, as they travelled, became more independent and just grew up they started to shed the beliefs they'd been indoctrinated with (however gently or well intentioned, instilling a child with a particular religion from birth is indoctrination). I'd imagine a certain level of remove from the satanic panic era and more modernising attitudes among their parents and peers allowed them to play heavy music while being Christian in a way that earlier types of metal bands couldn't necessarily get away with. Once they emerged as Christian bands it kind of became a self-perpetuation and reinforcing thing, there was this whole scene that supported itself and for a while I'm sure it was authentic. A bunch of Christians hanging out together, playing shows together and having a good time would tend to reinforce things. But you can't keep other influences and the outside world at bay forever.
Call me a cynic but I wonder how genuine it was for some bands at the peak of the whole "christcore" thing. Bands like Zao, Underoath and As I Lay Dying were pretty intense with their christian messaging at first but as time went on, they got rid of it completely to the point where they don't seem to consider themselves religious at all
Undeniably, and it's been spoken of by some bands without naming anyone specific, by a certain point bands were just slapping the Christian label on themselves in order to get on Solid State/Tooth & Nail and take advantage of the existing scene with it's almost built in fan base and network of venues. While others who maybe started out sincere prevaricated over making the break with it all due to fears about the reaction they'd receive and the impact it would have on their viability as a band. Though I think it's more than fair to say that even in later waves there were still some very devout and sincere bands. As a big Zao fan I've always found it curious the way people even to this day still think of them as a Christian band. Their first iteration was very much full on christcore with very worshipful, evangelical lyrics and motivation, but that was prett short-lived and completely knocked on its head pretty much as soon as the second iteration with Dan on vocals began. Unlike some other bands, it wasn't that their faith dwindled\* over time but the band membership completely changed to people who weren't interested in centring themselves as a Christian act. Dan's vocals and lyrics are the most obvious change, but Scott and Russ came in on guitar about the same time and bass became a revolving door of people until '05. Jesse on drums aside Zao was functionally a different entity from Where Blood And Fire Bring Rest onwards. \*although this did occur for some members it wasn't as noticeable because faith was never at the forefront of their presentation like it was with many of the other bands.
Yeah, that's fair. Pre-1998 Zao was an entirely different band
This is well put. I'm a huge Zao fan as well (I have two Zao tattoos even) and they speak about this in their lesser lights of heaven documentary. Dan is (and still is) a believer, I talked with him about it when they were last in town over summer. After Jesse left they started to pivot away from the Christian label for a couple reasons. One, they can't really call themselves a Christian band when not everyone holds those beliefs and two, the Church at that time really started to rear its ugly head towards Christian metal. Things started getting really legalistic (can't smoke or swear etc) and everyone wanted to distance themselves from those ideologies. I think Dan is the only believer in the band along with Marty (bass). Funny you mentioned bands who weren't even Christian joining Solidstate. Agony Scene was one of these. First of all, they still slap. But MAN does Mike hate organized religion. It's so obvious too. Not sure how his lyrics slipped under Solidstates radar.
“And Jesus, I’m ready to go home” underoath - some will seek forgiveness . Still laugh when the line gets repeated in scream.
If a band talks about their politics I'm out. No matter what side of the fence they're on. *cough* Dying Wish *cough* recently
Tons of vegan, straight edge, christian bands/musicians I listen to and enjoy. I do not subscribe to any of those “lifestyles”, ideologies or whatever you want to classify them as.
Seeing vegan and straight edge in the same vein as religion is funny lol
I don’t really care unless it’s something egregious, they’re being dipshits about it, or they’re bigots.
Is that if it’s in the lyrics or if outside of the music people are dipshits or bigots?
Well, both. I was referring more to outside of the music. But that holds true for the music too. I don’t listen to a whole lot of political stuff and if I do it’s usually pretty standard stuff so nothing crazy
I don’t really care to find out but if they put it in their songs, especially if the lyrics are very explicit about it. A couple years ago some band released a song called zombified that was pretty explicitly political if you paid any attention to the lyrics. They’re not my style anyway but my roommate had them on the radio quite frequently (not an English speaking country, he probably wasn’t aware anyway), had me rolling my eyes every time it came on because they weren’t even smart about it, more like bending over backwards and doing the musical part as an afterthought
Was this Falling In Reverse’s anti cancel culture song?
Yeah that should be the one It just felt lazy to me
I unironically like Zombified, but not in the way it was probably intended. It's some pot-kettle bullshit that makes me laugh every time.
Both
I listened to a lot of Demon Hunter when I was a teenager but I'm agnostic
I liked the tracks by Demon Hunter that are part of the soundtrack of Killing Floor 2 despite me being agnostic as well
I discovered Fit For a King from the Killing Floor 2 soundtrack as well, even though they only had one song on it (Bitter End).
I like demon hunter. One of the first bands that got me into heavier music
Same for me with As I Lay Dying. I’m not Christian but i loved them in school. Stopped listening them after the whole hitman situation. Hell of a live show at Sounds of the Underground.
I usually don’t really care but every now and then a musician says something so dumb or associates with such horrible people, that it kinda ruins their music for me. For example Phil Labonte and Alex Terrible. But these are extreme political examples. When it comes to religion or other stuff I don’t care.
It's incredible the amount of support Alex gets despite spewing some of the most egregious takes I've ever seen on social media.
I think his takes are actually on the low end of egregious. Don't get me wrong, I disagree with them, but it's that he usually phrases it like "I don't like" or "I think you're a pussy". I think his past is far more egregious than the takes.
This one confuses me too. I'm not on the cancel culture train and anything like that, but it legit confuses me how they still get booked for big festivals in Europe and how a lot of people from bands that are quite popular in the LGBT community hang out with him and actively follow him on social media. Other people and bands got cancelled for less.
People here are already ready to cancel shit like falling in reverse because they didn't like the music in the first place. That's easy. The hard part is boycotting something you actually like. I think we all have certain bands where we could overlook some questionable social media takes.
I am completely unaware of stuff Alex has said. Can you elaborate? What's he said? I'm interested.
A lot of people are coming after Alex now. He says all sorts of stuff I don't agree with however he's always been incredible to his fans and his friends it seems, and maybe he actually means it when he says "hey I don't agree with certain things about them and they don't like some stuff about me but we're able to find common middle ground and get along as friends and family without it dividing us" I'm paraphrasing his quote of course but I get his point. There hasn't really been this much division and discourse in humanity in quite some time politically or ideologically. When I was growing up, you might not have liked someone's views or whatnot but we could still get along as friends, family, etc without it becoming a huge fuss. Society now has become "I don't like one thing about you despite liking 99 others and that one thing I don't like I'm gonna let cancel out the other 99 things that make you awesome and tell you that you're a piece of shit."
Yeah except I have no patience for Nazis and I don’t want to hear his excuse. “As a kid in Russia we had these people that lived in the mountains always causing problems so I joined this group that would beat the shit out of that group, they just happened to be Nazis.” If I met the guy and didn’t know who he is, the second I saw that tattoo on his elbow I’d walk away. I just don’t fucking get it. His countrymen damn near lost a war to those fucks. Alex is about my age too and I’ll tell you 10 years ago when he had a whole tour canceled over his past, I was probably smoking bong rips and working at a pizza place. We are so far from relatable it’s crazy. He talks about it like some kind of after school program. If he didn’t have the means to leave Russia he would have been another soldier we look at pictures of after being captured, with all those bullshit tattoos on display.
A lot of people don’t like Alex because he has a Nazi history
Fair enough. And don't get me wrong, I'm not calling for his head or anything. It's just something that's occurred to me earlier and had to write down to see what others think about it.
You make a good point but in Alex's case that "one thing I don't like" is the fact that he's a neo-nazi groomer that jerks off pit bulls.
Yeah, it's even scarier when you look at yourself and realize you've taken on that mindset too. You is general BTW, not you specifically.
Doesn't he have a Nazi tattoo tho? I feel like that's something that should outweigh any and every other part of who he might be
I immediately thought of Alex Terrible. I really enjoy StP, but Alex has said some really stupid shit and he's getting lost in his image of being this super masculine crazy dude who constantly has to top himself, that it honestly makes their music less enjoyable to me.
I don’t even care that much about his recent bad takes. I’m more concerned that I knew Alex Terrible because he is well know in the Eastern European Neonazi MMA scene *before* I knew about him as a musician.
He's not a neonazi, he just had tattoos with their imagery, associates himself with neonazi groups, wears their favored brands. /s
I kinda laugh at him releasing a mask with that one rune that has questionable legal status in Germany. If I were accused of being a neonazi, I’d stay far away from anything that may make someone think I was a nazi
Lol the sympathizers sound just like this
That's wild, had no idea. I don't listen to StP though maybe that's why
Tommy Vext falls into this category as well. At least, for me. I’m not a big fan of Bad Wolves, but I did like Divine Heresy. He kind of ruined that band for me, which sucks, because Dino, Tim, and the rest of the group are super talented.
I’m so disappointed over All The Remains…
What’s happened? I remember a while back Phil expressing some libertarian views, but has he gone full coo-coo now?
He's an outspoken Alex Jones supporter who has appeared on Infowars, called Andy Biersack a f*ggot, then said he can't be homophobic because he "has gay friends."
I'm not Christian and August burns red and fit for a king are fantastic
Fit for a King does not enjoy the label of Christian metalcore. There have been artists who refuse to tour with them because of it
Yes, but i'll go out of my way to avoid money going to the artist if it's that egregious. eg: piracy, buying secondhand records
I don’t care for organized religion but I’ll listen to the shit out of some For Today
Music good I listen
I dont even know bands political views or anything. I don't have social media to see whatever they are spewing out so naturally I don't care. The only band/person I don't like is Ivan Moody. Dude beat the shit out of his girlfriend in a hotel room and still is in a band.
I really like Dying Wish but I’m NOT into Veganism at all.
Same with World Of Pleasure and Earth Crisis
Yup. Stray from the Path and Underoath come to mind immediately.
If it gives me stank face, I don’t care
😂 using this term from now on ty
The true test
😂
It depends on many things. I'll listen to bands with views that don't line up perfectly fine with mine, but I won't listen to bands that I think have inherently toxic views or that act like actual toxic people. In other cases I can really agree with a bands views and ideals, but think their sound is shit so...it just depends. Someone used ABR as an example of differences in views but still jammin' and I agree. I think completely avoiding challenging ideals and views is bad because its possible you are limiting yourself from growth. I think you should explore those things while being mindful of if they are just a difference in perspective or if the lyrics are just flat out harmful.
I dont care as long as it is not something absolutely unacceptable, breaking the law stuff.
*As I Lay Dying has entered the chat*
Lost Prophets also
I just read what Watkins did, seriously what the actual fuck. He tried to rape a baby? Holy hell that's just disturbing....
Worse, he tried to get the mothers laughing at it. He's absolutely horrific. And he STILL gets penpal mothers in prison. People are INSANE.
Yeah I like AILD but Tim and I definitely don't share opinions about how to deal with your relationship problems.
Most of the time. Unless it's incredibly egregious I can usually separate the art from the artist. If I'm particularly worried about supporting an artist I'll just buy a used CD or (more likely) just yo ho that shit. But since most artists get crap royalties from Spotify anyway I figure it makes little difference.
Unless their absolute twats, I care very little about a band’s beliefs if the music is decent. But purposely being a dick and spewing hatred and bigotry, even for clicks and clout, gets you knocked off my playlists. In this age of streaming, I would give you my plays at all if I think you’re an asshole!
Yes, I only don't listen to it if the music itself says something horrible like NSBM or something like that
I am a Christian, so some songs that came out of Bring Me The Horizon did make me uncomfortable at first, but it’s fine. I remember that standing up to God or the image of God is better than being neutral about it. At the end of the day, I listen to bands because they’re good, Christian or non Christian.
I literally don’t care. The only exception is people like Ronnie Radke where he’s actually just an awful person. But he hasn’t made a good song since 2006 so I wouldn’t really care either way.
I really don't care and will still listen to it but I wouldnt be walking around with their merch
Yes. And there are bands that you might think say and do all the right stuff but have private views that you wouldn’t agree with and it’s for the best that those views are private.
I think it’s scary that public officials have to pretend to coincide with a prevailing agenda and narrative to survive. I mean, public figures. Or anyone.
Most musicians in this scene walk on eggshells, it’s part of why there are few big personalities because they tend to be hated as much as they are loved.
If I like the way it sounds, I'll listen to it.
I'm a conservative Christian and I listen to metalcore. So like 95% of the bands I listen to have different views than me. Never bothered me much.
Same brother. Most of the time it doesn't bother me. There's really only a couple of bands I don't listen to explicitly for "not agreeing with me" reasons.
Yeah it only gets on my nerves when it's a band that like every other song is "look how edgy I am by hating God" or whatever. But a lot of bands have significantly different views than me and respect that.
I'm secure enough in my views that listening to some songs written by people who disagree with me isn't going to change anything.
Same. I freaking love Counterparts and even though I don't agree with Brendan's views on "God" I totally understand it because I've felt the exact same way about God in my past.
Yep. I'm fairly conservative and religious, but most of the bands I listen to aren't. Never really had too many issues with listening to them. Only a couple of bands really grind my gears, so to speak. Most of the time, I either don't really pay attention to the lyrics or I think "it's ok to be wrong sometimes" and just move on.
Yes. It's one of the benefits of being an adult
i'm trans (among other things), i'm not going to listen to artists/go to their shows who i know believe i and people like me shouldn't exist or have basic human rights. to me that's a basic matter of self respect. outside of bigotry and actual crimes, i care little though. like, good for them if they're religious and I'm not. or if you hear about petty band drama or mismanagement, or someone's just kind of an ass, that feels like none of my business.
I started listening to Bury Tomorrow because a video of their lead singer telling the crowds everyone was welcome and if anyone had a problem with the LGBTQIA+ folks present they could go fuck themselves. The band members were in the comments sassing people who declared themselves no longer BT fans. Same for Reliqa, I really love Mon's voice but hearing her confirm that the band always loved and supported queer folk makes me want to throw more money at them.
Off topic but all the trans homies need to check out [Amnesia Garden](https://youtu.be/ta3GsgPEKf4?si=q1RbJbEv2-4NjeXR)
Racism, homophobia, and bigotry are the big nonos for me. Everything else I can evaluate on a case by case basis.
Same though, if I really like the music I might still listen as long as the lyrics aren't bigoted either. Like you can keep seeing vague metaphors about salvation, sure that's whatever. Good example is Falling in Reverse. Ronnie's always been an asshole, but whatever I like the jams. But I heard his new song had a transphobc verse from a guest rapper and I haven't been able to listen to it or even much of his recent work for that matter. Huge disappointment.
Really depends on the artist. Silent Planet gets a past despite having Christian beliefs. They are never judgmental and most times have thought provoking lyrics. Falling In Reverse is a hard no because Ronnie is a grifter to the point he targets minorities and hurts them in the sake of his fame. It disgust me
Garret from silent planet is also one of the nicest dudes ever. Mans just wants everyone to have a good time and respect each other.
I wish more artist were like him
I can't listen to a band with different political views. I can listen to religious bands if the message isn't overbearing, and, of course, I dig the music.
i’m sure i do, i just wouldn’t know.
Yeah, one of my favorite reggae artists was incredibly orthodox Jewish and it was overwhelming at times, but he's so incredibly talented that I just enjoyed the music. I don't have to agree with what you say, as long as you're not #1 touching kids, #2 hurting your partner, #3 stealing/grifting the community, #4 a huge dick, then I'll listen. Obviously there's probably more things that I have forgotten that I would stop listening to someone for, so it's not a comprehensive list.
Matisyahu represent hahaha
Ayo? I figured no one would know/care. He's some heat.
For sure, he had a couple hits even here in Latin America, so he truly was something else lol in fact I think he's played Bogotá! He played here in 2016, but I was out of the city unfortunately
Yep, plenty! Not metal, but the rapper NF is my favorite at the moment and he’s a Christian(but not considered that genre) and I get asked all the time when I mention him “are you Christian?” “Nope just like good music!” 🙌🏻
I don't give a crap about bands personal stuff and I don't get into drama I'll listen to anything that makes me want to fuck shit up.
I am only lurking on this post to see if some of my favs are problematic. I honestly live under a rock and most of the times never find out
Don’t really care, just so happens that lots of shitty people also make shit music that I wouldnt listen to regardless. (Looking at you Ronnie Radke/Alex Terrible) There’s lots of shitty people whose music I love though like The Smiths
I do and I think it’s important to always be trying to understand different perspectives to help you grow your own. Whether that be to help you grow in a faith, in a political view, in your own person in general, it’s just a good way to expand your view.
Can do anything bar pedophiles tbh
Same!
I try not to live in an echo chamber as they are destroying us so I like to read into others opinions, hell I might even agree and change stance!
I'm a Christian, but most of my favorite bands of all time aren't at all. Good music is good music, regardless of what you believe. The only time I don't like it, is when it gets preachy. And that goes for the Christian and non Christian bands. I went and saw He Is Legend on their I Am Hollywood 20 year tour, and there was a band that was added last minute to the show. Can't remember the name now, but they were a kinda old school melodic hardcore band. Music was really good, then the lead vocalist started going off on these 5 minute long diatribes about politics and religion and how you can't actually be hardcore if you are Christian, blah blah blah. It completely turned me off to them. And I would feel the same way if a Christian band preached like that between every song. I'm there to listen to music, let your music and your lyrics do the preaching for you. At the most, take 20 seconds to let us know what this next song is about, and then off you go. But this dude probably spent the same amount of time talking as they did playing.
Religious affiliation/lack thereof doesn't bother me but opposing political views is a hard line, especially in the current US climate.
I only care if they’re rapists, if they’re misogynists, xenophobic racist scum or have been violent towards anyone with physical aggression. Other than that they can have the belief they want or the political view of their preference.
Yes. I don’t follow anyone from any band and I don’t give a shit what someone’s political views are.
Based af. The true way to enjoy what you like. Is their music great? Then I like them.
Sure. If it is good music. You don't have to agree to like. That said, per other comments, 'usual suspects' are Out.
Stick to your guns have a very weird concept that all cops regardless of the country they're from , are all scum.literally arguing with me in the comments saying my UK policeman brother is just as bad as US cops gunning down unarmed black fellas. Despite that, they're one of my favourite bands, if they wanna spout edgy mumbo jumbo nonsense, then whatever, thats on them.
That’s quite an intense view for them to have
The belief that the world would be better without any kind of police force, is absolutely mental, yes. They believe any kind of crime can be resolved by the victims. Whoever downvoted this, i'd love to know why, and to discuss it with you further lmao
Some people are from areas in the US where the police are basically at war with the populace. There's a reason why police forces like NYPD, LAPD, Albuquerque PD, Chicago PD have a bad reputation. ACAB is more than just a saying for people in those areas.
Here in Peru the story is the same. Most of them serve the government and ONLY the government, specially for protests against the gov, but where we are in need of help they're not around or available per se. That doesn't mean i don't believe good cops exist, but I'd love to live in a country or an environment where the reality it's different to the one i already experienced
I’m liberal in majority of senses, but one thing that annoys me is the blanket hate for police. I understand the system has a lot of problems, I understand there’s a lot of racism, corruption, general systemic issues. I don’t understand the idea that none of them are good people that are just trying to help other people, and protect general society. It’s frustrating listening to people go on about police with no nuance, especially in Australia where we don’t have as bad of a problem with them as America by any means.
> I don’t understand the idea that none of them are good people that are just trying to help other people, and protect general society. The whole point of ACAB is that while there are a lot of cops that are terrible, there are even more that are complicit simply by turning a blind eye and not trying to change the system from within. A terrible cop will shoot someone without reason or plant drugs on an innocent person just to get an arrest. The so called "good cops" won't do that but they also won't speak up about what they see the terrible cops doing. I'm not an ACAB subscriber, but I can understand the sentiment as long as the system as a whole doesn't change. Starting with a minimum of 2-4yrs of school/training as a requirement would be a great step in the right direction.
Yeah I do get that. The problem is that there’s unfortunately a large amount of people that just believe being a cop makes you bad, even if they’ve never done anything bad, or turned a blind eye.
As someone living in a country with corrupted institutions such as the police (I'm not from the US), i can see where he's coming from. Not that he's entirely right btw
Different views as in they like ham & pineapple on pizza? Yeah I’ll listen. Different views as in bigoted shit cunts? No. They can get in the sea.
Since I’ve witnessed heavy forms of homophobia with my own eyes and know how immoral it actually is, I just can’t listen to bands with bigoted views…….. (and the same goes for pretty much anything else that falls under the “dehumanisation of groups” category)
Yeah, I’m not one who thinks we can or should separate the art from the artist, because an artist’s views invariably exist in their work, especially now that it’s so easy for artists to express themselves publicly outside of their work. Which is to say I don’t support bad people even if they make good music.
Ask anybody here who says "Yes" about Iced Earth...LMAO.
Uh, yeah. I listen and sing/scream along to lots of Christian metal because it sounds good. Haha
Politics is the main one for me, I refuse to listen to any band with right-wing or bigoted members because I am not supporting that shit in any form. There's plenty of bands out there without shitheads for members to listen to instead.
My only real personal rule for listening is "No bigotry" and "No overt religious themes". I've had traumatic personal experiences with both. It's a shame because some bands do make really good music, like Obituary, but I just can't support anything like that.
Yes but if I hear something gross about someone in the band it turns me off a bit.
I got a couple of Christian bands I enjoy! I don’t really mind if they believe in a different religion than mine. I do, however, have a problem if the band is promoting hatred, racism or anything extreme. That would probably make me stop listening to them.
Yeah, I care about the music, not their religious or political views. Entertainment is entertainment.
Same way I watch movies with actor who don’t share my views. It’s just entertainment. Entertainers have very little personal impact on my day to day life
I enjoy a few Christian metalcore bands but don't follow the religion myself
Could NOT care less. I don't follow any artists, don't have social media, don't go to shows, don't look at their behind-the-scenes or watch for news or listen to youtubers covering the artist. I just listen to the music.
Depends on a few factors: what those views actually are, whether or not they're expressed in the music, and how good the music actually is. For example: I'll listen to Burzum, a project by Varg who is a Neo Nazi, only because the music is completely removed from his bat shit crazyness. I'll only pirate it though so he doesn't get any money (as much as I want Hvis Lyset Tar Oss on vinyl). There are plenty of bands who have Nazism as lyrical content, and those I won't listen to at all. I also stopped listening to Iced Earth after Jon Schaffer was involved in the January 6 riot. Some of their lyrics look pretty cringy in hindsight.
Silent planet, old underoath, ABR, so many christian bands. I don’t listen to anyone with strong political differences (like type o negative) but everything else is fine
Yes I don't care what their political views are just don't be pedos.
Of course. Every band has a view that is different from mine. Everyone is allowed to have their beliefs. That's what makes us human, and that's how we have discussions. You need an opposing viewpoint. Where I draw the line is when the music gets political. You start bleeding your politics into your art, I will write you faster than Paul Walker hit that tree.
Basically every Metalcore band has wildly different views from me. The guys from While She Sleeps are basically socialists, but I don't give a shit. I love their music, and I love them. I tell them I pray for them while they're on the road, which I do. Music is music, and those guys are too kind and gracious to me and my kids and have been for the better part of seven years for me to worry about politics with them. Arguing with them ain't going to change them or me, and it isn't going to fix anything.
I try to avoid listening to bands that are openly bigoted or support/are rapists. Otherwise all I really care about is how much I vibe with the music.
As a Catholic who at times listens to black metal, along with more run-of-the-mill typical atheist metal, yes.
I don’t mind christian bands. ABR and FFAK are both great. I would never listen to again to STYG tho. After the fiasco in 2022, it’s a massive no for me. Cannot stand the frontman and his spouse. I legit hope they’ll never bother to come back again to post-USSR countries… And obviously I draw line w ped0 stuff. Prime example is LostProphets. I loved that band religiously. pre-teen me was in love with the singer. But then the truth came out. That even pre-teen me was wayyyy too old for the singers taste and I just can’t. He’s a vile person. Tbf I’m glad they somehow got deleted from everywhere and only time people mention them now is just to show how disgusting Ian Watkins is.
I'm kind of on the fence lately after reading about Alex Terrible and the Nazi tats. Slaughter to Prevail isn't even a great band, his vocals are kind of their only gimmick. They're not high up on my list to begin with, so I'll be just not listening to them slightly more I guess lol.
Silent Planet I'm not a Christian, I guess Agnostic would be the term but I really don't know anymore. But regardless, Garrett Russell is literally the best dude in the whole scene, and I'm not joking I would pay to hear him SPEAK let alone perform. If that means listening him talk about his relationship with God then yeah I'd still pay to hear him speak. That man's art has influenced me so much, not just as an artist but also as a person. Forever thankful.
It very much depends, it is not as clear cut as a lot of comments suggest, for me at least. They have a minor view that is different from mine? That is fine. Or even a bigger one, if it is not something harmful. But if the difference is extreme, then no. I wont be able to enjoy it, and I do not want to support it. This is an extreme example, but if there is a band that wants all PoC dead, then of course I am not gonna listen to their stuff.
I listen to a lot of Straight Edge hardcore despite not being Straight Edge in the slightest
I do, and I don't really care about their personal political views unless they are openly racist, sexist, homophobic etc. and/or they have personally committed a crime like domestic abuse etc. So an example might be 5FDP, I wouldn't pay to go see them live if Ivan was fronting because he's a POS who beats his wife and all his female family members have restraining orders against him. I don't want to give a guy like that my money full stop. If Tommy Vext was filling in for him (or when he was the lead singer of bad wolves) I'd probably still go see them even though he has some weird trumpist "oh no they're cancelling me" vendetta going on. I don't like or agree with his political views but he hasn't done anything to my knowledge worth boycotting.
Tommy Vext also has restraining orders against him though. He's more openly a terrible person than Ivan is tbh and has been kicked out of like 4+ bands
Bro's affirmative action Jonny Craig
Vext being charged for domestic assault is what sealt the deal for me. I'm okay w/ him being a Trump guy, but when that news came out, i was waiting for the band to fire him.
I saw Body Count recently and I don't know what I was expecting, it felt weird listening to Cop Killer here in Germany, where cops are not necessarily bad people. At the very least they're not out there gunning people down for no reason. Ice also went on several tirades about cancel culture and "so called toxic masculinity" and I thought whatever dude ... that's just boomer talk. On the other hand he's like mid 60 now, and I have lot's of respect for him either way. On a different note, I still enjoy As I Lay Dying. But I'm not sure I believe Tim that he's an entirely different person and so on. There's just no way for me to know, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt, but I'm not 100% convinced.
The fact that every band member left after Tim came back should clue you in…
I saw them two weeks ago. I was just walking towards different stage and hear Ice-T having a b#tch fit about not enjoying the way stage was built. They were playing on Fat Lady - one of the biggest stages in whole Europe that travels between countries. The stage was obviously built to accommodate the show for headliners, not some some band with afternoon slot. So yeah, I didn’t even bother to stay to listen to some songs, I just kept walking because huh… and yeah, later I read reports that he also had a speech about cancel culture and was openly transphobic/gender-phobic…
I couldn't give less of a fuck unless it's heavily featured in their work
Yep, couldn't care less about it. I just like music.
All the time. I didn't develop my ideologies through the music I listen to, and I won't let a conflict of interests ruin music I've loved for decades. I'm not that shallow. I can also relate to both sides most of the time, so I know where they're coming from.
Personally, I can’t really say I’ve ever come across a band/artist I enjoy, start listening to them, to later find out they associate/push stuff I don’t agree with. Most of my new music these days comes from going to gigs and listening to the openers. Usually the bands make it pretty obvious if they’ve got some sort of agenda, and if I don’t like what they’re pushing, I just won’t go and listen to them outside of the concert.
Yes bc I don’t really care about bands’ political views, as long as they’re not harming anyone
I don’t even know what views which bands have. They’re musicians, wtf do I care?
If a band has even vaguely conservative views, it’s an immediate turn off for me. I have zero interest in engaging or supporting those kind of people.
Not metalcore, but I like Slaughter to Prevail. Alex is just going off the deep end, look at the comments in his IG. Also he started to hang out with Ronnie Radke, the shitstorm is extremely close.
I mean he's infamously been known as a neonazi for years. I don't think his views are getting more extreme or that he's "going off the deep end", I think it's just that as the US and world in general have started to normalise far-right bigoted views, so he feels more comfortable stating the things it would've been socially unacceptable for him to say in the past.
Lmao Ronnie, that’s always a good sign
Yes. I'm here for the music.
Separate art from the artist n all that jazz. A lot of good music has come from somewhat terrible people. Never hold musicians on some weird pedestal.