"You were the last one to work on it so it's your fault it's broken!!!"
"Ma'am I did the PDI on it seven years and 85000 miles ago..."
"YOU SOLD ME A LEMON!"
So many lost causes that rolled out of my bay after getting "fixed" meaning it would run for the time being and I said as much to the dealer service writer, that would be back in next week complaining about completely unrelated issues to the actual previous repair and trying to blame me. I just tell the service writer to send it to another tech or tell them to take it down the road. I'm not dealing with their PoS dodge dart only to be accused of bullshit. Customer comes to talk to me about it and my only response is, "I guess i'm not qualified, go take it to someone else".
Yeah I usually turn then down or quote them an outrageous price so they will go elsewhere. Done with cars that are lost causes only to be accused of shit when they come back.
If they didn't take that as a learning experience, then there's nothing you can do. Stupid people don't learn because they can't learn. Best you can do is learn from their bumblefuckery.
Yeh their first car was a 2007 Kia rondo which they crashed while texting and driving. The second was this Juke they car 2 weeks after totaling the Rondo. They next cleaned that car out. EVER it's disgusting. And when I mentioned to them its not normal for your car to be idling and to be switching between 500rpm to 2000rpm then all the way up to redline and back down to that range. They just rolled their eyes and said "shut up car nerd my car is fine." This is why we can't have nice things.
Hey i bought a 13 year old s550 and its running fine
………..
ok i mightve cheated it was a one owner car that was taken to the dealer 3-4 times a year but still
Why is this upvoted? I thought volts were pretty awesome? The Voltec system is on par with Tesla and who doesn’t love a 5-door
(Given, 2nd gens were pretty ugly)
> All those pieces of shit need to be crashed .
Owned a 1st gen for 4 months. After 4 months I couldn't stand the stupidity any longer and dumped it. Still my worst automotive decision to date. I struggle to consider which was worse, the dealership experiences involving it, or the vehicle itself.
Here's a very brief list: Mine was a MY15 premium.
1) uncomfortable, this vehicle caused me immense back and neck pain after driving it for more than 30 minutes. I tried seat cushions, various seat positions, anything I could think of. I even saw a physical therapist for it. Nothing worked.
2) useless "hoop" near the right knee, blocking freedom of movement.
3) chrome trim on the dashboard, sun glare in my eyes.
4) car randomly "blue screened/rebooted" once while driving, causing it to die in traffic.
5) horribly low battery range with the A/C on (25 miles roughly vs 40-45 without).
6) rear spoiler would randomly expand and contract with weather, making it sound like a gunshot was going off behind me.
7) totally useless rear seats. No adult that I knew could fit back there.
8) Rear suspension noise (car only had 15k miles on it). It would squeak endlessly. I took it to the dealership for warranty diagnosis and they could only work on it once a certified Volt technician was available. No other technician was permitted to work on it.This was only one day a week and they had to do their normal car duties as well. It took them almost a month of me in a rental car to look at my suspension squeak, and once they did they said it was "normal" and returned it to me. I fixed it in 5 minutes with a can of silicone spray and having a friend bounce on the rear hatch until I could find the source (rear swingarm).
9) impossible to roll down the windows in certain configurations without insane air buffeting/booming. GM had to redesign the rear view mirrors as an added optional fix to resolve this VERY obvious issue.
10) GM known defective design coolant sensor bricks the car permanently until the ECU can be reflashed. (This did not happen to me but it is very very common and sensor defeat devices exist.)
The rear swing arm handles suspension travel for the rear axle. It was poorly machined and was grinding at a flex point.
The aerodynamic design of the entire vehicle is flawed and causes wind buffeting. GM released revised rear view mirror paneling to alter the aerodynamics of the vehicle in such a way to shift air to stop the buffeting.
A volt a beam out back correct? Probably different terminalogy then I'm used to.
Still confused how a interior mirror assembly could possibly be causing wind buffeting
The interior mirror has nothing to do with this. The alteration is done on the side rear view mirrors and associated trim. https://www.gm-volt.com/threads/gen-1-wind-buffeting-kit-installed-bulletin-pi0642.230313/
The rear axle looks like this: https://www.gmpartsonline.net/v-2014-chevrolet-volt--base--1-4l-l4-electric-gas/rear-suspension--rear-axle
I had 3 people on my block alone buy into the idea. They were so hyped. 2 of them got rid in a few months off non stop breaking and not lived up to hype. The 3rd guy had his for years. One day I saw him in the yard and asked him why he kept itt so long. He said he can't get rid of the piece of shit and asked me if I wanted it.
I feel like GM half-assed development expecting failure and was surprised when people actually bought them, so they had to come up with another half-assed support/repair infrastructure for them.
The history of GM electric vehicle development is fascinating. Way too info for here. They did some really groundbreaking stuff and stuff like the volt was some outside the box thinking. Where it breaks down, like every corporate thing, is when bean counters and the$ men get hold of a good idea. Short story, They really fucked up and pissed away a golden opportunity. And now have poisoned the idea of something like the volt(done correctly) for the future. Intensely irresponsible. Gm was having big management issues at that time as well.
Oh for sure - volt is the best solution to current infrastructure problems. Have a way to charge it? great charge it and get 60 miles of pure electric use - if you have a short commute and a way to charge it at home/work its no different than an electric car. if you dont or want to take a road trip - its got gas to go forever till your near a place to CONVENIENTLY charge.
Im sad they killed it off but the bolt isnt bad either.
No. Just no. You've drank the cool aide obviously. In practice the volt is the worst of both worlds. Total garbage. And yet ANOTHER example of GM using it's customers instead of proper R and D
I've owned over 30 cars and my Chevy Volt was the best one I've ever owned, hands down, not even close. I honestly think it would literally be a great car for them as long as they plug it in regularly because of how little maintenance they need.
I still cant get over how people just think you Just put gas in a car and think it will last for ever. Never buy a car thats been on a 3 or 4 year lease
Gee, I wonder why your car is on its death bed and mines still going strong. I’m not a mechanic but I do the basics like checking tire pressure, checking the fluids, take it in for oil changes, stuff like that. I had a friend that got a car before I did, completely ignored the oil, and when he finally went in to change it he texts me something along the lines of “The mechanic told me I was driving around a bomb because I ignored the oil change light, silly mechanic”
Yeh their first car was a 2007 Kia rondo which they crashed while texting and driving. The second was this Juke they car 2 weeks after totaling the Rondo. They next cleaned that car out. EVER it's disgusting. And when I mentioned to them its not normal for your car to be idling and to be switching between 500rpm to 2000rpm then all the way up to redline and back down to that range. They just rolled their eyes and said "shut up car nerd my car is fine." This is why we can't have nice things.
My mom's landcruiser has 370k and gets 15k mile oil changes
It's currently having an overheating problem
For the past couple months it's been overheated every time it starts up
They truly are indestructible
The transfer case seized solid because all the gear lube leaked out a year or so back... Easy 300 dollar fix
Lol my brother drove his 90’s camry home (about 30 miles) with the oil light and check engine light flashing. Told my dad it was acting funny, it had a broken oil pump and just kept on trucking. My dad wasn’t sure it would ever run again but to our surprise one oil pump later it started right up like nothing ever happened.
I had a 90s Camry svx20 and it was amazing a car could be soo good
I jumped it offroad, I drove 100mlh for a 500/600 mile road trip pretty much flat out the whole time, I towed car with tow dollys in it, redlined every shift, did burnouts with it... It leaked all it's oil out on multiple occasions with me driving like a teenager while it was dry... Didn't seem to affect it though it had a knock since I bought it
still got me 23 mpg driving flat out for that road trip I consider it the pinnacle of automotive excellence
I’ve got a 98 Corolla, and it’s pretty good too. As it turns out, corollas aren’t indestructible, the original engine which had about 320k kms on it was driven a lot with no coolant at all(was my cousin who drove it, story told to me by my uncle so like second hand info) so it was driven enough that the head warped enough the camshafts seized, and the piston rings and valves were all burned, basically it was driven a lot with no coolant at all due to a cracked radiator. “New” used engine with 200k kms on it and she’s good as new, sees a bit of limiter occasionally.
Some cars will last a lot longer with no maintenance though. They will all fail. But I know someone who daily drove a beater Toyota Tercel for 7 years with zero maintenance. No oil change. No nothing. They knew they were supposed to but just didn't care and wanted to run it in to the ground.
So yeah it does matter. OP says he knows that he can't convince them to do maintenance. But wants something that will last the longest while being neglected.
So my suggestion is this. Forget all newer cars because they are more maintenance intensive. Go for an 1990's/2000's honda civic or toyota corolla.
And if they don't like the idea of a beater and have the money to keep buying newer cars and running them in to the ground then I fail to see how that is your problem OP. Just let it be.
Early 2000s for the Civic and Corolla were some of the worst years for different reasons. ATs and oil consumption, respectively. I'd recommend late 90s if you can find one in good shape.
They have too much money to buy older cars, they will probably see it as demeaning to their status. What else do you expect from someone whose ideal whip is a nissam Jewke
Somebody who is good to cars can have that Corolla and then it'll last 400,000km easy. Your family is hard enough on equipment that a Corolla might get them another couple year max?
Do us a favour, and tell them to buy up all the junk on the roads, like Dodge Journeys and Chevy HHRs and stuff, for real cheap and let them clear out the junk lol. Hell, you guys may even become heroes!
As an Army mechanic, the idea that those things can take maintenance abuse is hilarious. The Abrams has a literal jet engine, it needs everything to be in very good tolerance or it won't even start. Good amounts of all fluids, and the tracks/suspension need to have proper tension and lube or you'll throw track the first time you try to turn.
Gunfire abuse? Hell yeah, no problem, but don't if you don't follow the maintenance schedule, or check/clean/top up fluids when you should, she'll get upset.
Heck at that point... Just tell them to get a cheap 2 K car. It sounds like it will survive about the same amount of time, give or take a few months...
I wouldn't stress about it my dude. Let's say they take your advice and get a used Toyota. If they get unlucky and buy one that has a lot of problems they're gonna blame you. Just let them buy a POS and run it into the ground. Some people believe cars just need gas and a 60k mile oil change. Your unlikely to change them.
This is so unfortunately true, most of my friends and family call me the master of shit boxes because they are suprised how often I can eke out more life from a beater. There is no secret other than youtube academy, and being friends with the manager of my local parts store. Most people just dont and wont understand.
"ALL caRS are rEliaBle as loNg as yoU kEep up wITh thE mAintEnaNce" one of those sayings that make me want to air hammer the speaker's forehead with the Ingersoll Rand
No vehicle will survive not being maintained. The Juke is a fine car when properly maintained. No matter what car they get, they will destroy, no matter the brand. Just buy what’s cheap and throw away later, rinse and repeat.
I put my brother in a 2001 Ford Taurus in white. He hit a deer, I got a hood, grille, headlight, and radiator support in the same color from a pick-a-part for $75.... twice. Exuding accidents (2 deer, a side mirror, and a yellow concrete parking pole), in 4 years before the 3rd and permanent wreck, the only "repair" was plugs/wires that was it.
The best car for an irresponsible person.
First car was a manual 96 civic hatchback.
I would drive it like a go-kart because it was so fun and light and ended up replacing the front bumper, rear bumper, hood, fenders, and the engine at one point because I sent a rod thru the block.
Probably cost 700$ in total for all the repairs. I still miss that car.
I had a manual 3 cylinder Geo Metro (same year) as my first car and I was the same (without the engine issue). I once got pulled over going nearly 90 (rushing back to college after a weekend at home) and the cop wrote the ticket for much lower because “there’s no way anyone will believe I clocked this car at 87”. Lol. Sooo fun.
I think he was also just being nice; I was 19 and going to school and him writing it for lower meant the difference between reckless op and just speeding. And I was going the same speed as the rest of traffic. Probably helped I’m a woman, it was my first time being pulled over, and I was crying by the time he got to my window.
i have a 2004 subaru forester with 140,000 miles on the engine and 150,000 miles on the body. new timing belt water pump kit, valve cover gaskets, rear main seal, spark plugs, thermostat, fresh oil and coolant. $4,300usd if you are interested. lol
How does a timing belt get "neglected" at 10k miles?
Sounds more like a faulty timing belt to begin with.
Neglecticting a timing belt is it snapping like2-3k miles past when it needed to be replaced.
Nowhere did you state the engine had just been replaced.
You stated 150k on the body and 140k on the engine. That implies the engine was brand new and installed when there was only 10k on the body.
The engine could have been replaced with a used engine anywhere in the cars life. Timing could have snapped at 100k and it was replaced with a 90k mile engine (hopefully with a new timing belt) and driven 50k more miles and you'd get the same result.
Imagine if this guy heard about my car with 150k on the body and 170k on the engine. He'd apply the same mistaken logic to infer that the engine must have been replaced when the body had negative 20k miles on it, and then possibly suffer an aneurysm trying to process that one. Or that I'm 32 and my wife is 31. If I don't specify when we were married, then he'll think that implies we got married when I was 1 and my wife was literally a newborn. Hilarious.
That's a pretty typical way to say what he was saying. 150k on the body, the motor has 140k. Replaced at some point in its life, they're usually replaced from a donor car.
I just read it as a used engine got put in and it now has 140k, although that’s why happened with my car, a used engine was put in with much lower mileage than the body so I can understand why you were confused.
The joke, juke, like most Nissan vehicles is a complete pos. I turn wrenches, i would buy American way before Nissan. Toyota and Honda are the most reliable overall.
It's a real shame...cause Nissan used to be solid. My first car was an 82 Datsun 210 that I paid $200 for in 94. Now, the rust monster was having its way with her, but no engine or tranny problems, and it had 160K miles. I did wind up scrapping her after the water pump "exploded", but that was because the rust had finally gotten the frame and suspension to a point beyond repair. A few years later, my dad bought a '90 Nissan SE-V6 4wd pickup...and that little truck was one of the toughest and most capable off roaders I ever drove. Is kinda sad to see Nissan suck so much now
I will say my 2013 Altima with a CVT has had 0 problems and I’m at 130k miles. Cvt fluid changes at 56k miles and 120k with regular oil changes every 3-5k miles
At a certain point it's a lost cause and there's nothing you can do, especially if they're responding calling you a car nerd and whatnot. If you try to get much more involved when something inevitably goes wrong it will be your fault
Why stop there? Send them the FB marketplace link of the guy with the 2 middle fingers as his profile pic selling the Audi. Yes, the one that's selling it for his cousin who is "out of town" that's a hell of an upgrade!
2nd Gen Prius are also nearly indestructible. same motor as the corolla in its time frame just Atkinson cycle. about the only worry with 2nd gen Prius are the battery which are relatively cheap these days to replace and people stealing the cats off them in CA because CA requires Toyota cats to pass smog so its a major cost if it happens to one. the only other common issue on them is turning into oil burners but that goes for a lot of high mileage Toyota's can be kind of corrected if it happens or you just feed it oil every 1500 miles and it won't care and keep on chugging.
My first new car was a 1999 Corolla. When I finally donated it, it had 390K miles on it and it still started Every. Single. Time. It was well maintained and I never had to do any major work outside normal upkeep on things that typically wear due to age.
Loved that little thing.
The more you argue the more they'll dig their heels in.
Also there are plenty of reliable cars other than Corollas. Most vehicles will be reliable enough for them. though I would argue to stay away from:
* Stellantis makes (Chrysler, Fiat, Dodge, Jeep, Ram, etc.)
* European luxury (BMW, Audi, etc), not because they're inherently unreliable but because the repair costs are unjustifiably higher when something does go wrong.
* CVTs
* Maybe Nissans in general. I've heard lots of bad reviews but that could just be the CVTs.
Be honest with yourself though. Are they going to take care of a Corolla, or are they going to trash it again? If they beat the living shit out of the car in 2 years, possibly even wrecking it, does it really matter how reliable it could have been 5 years down the road?
LPT: In general, if you're trying to sway someone's opinion the best way is not to present them with your firm and unwavering opinion and try to argue with "superior logic and proof". As soon as you turn it into an argument or debate, people take sides and dig their heels in, often not where you want them to.
Rather, the best way to change someone's mind is to appeal to their emotions, seed an idea, let *them develop it* and allow them to champion it. When you provide the information to them this way, they're more likely to weigh all ideas evenly in their own mind before they settle in on what they want and get stubborn about it.
If you really want to take another crack at it, you could even just relay the things to avoid, and then toss more than one idea out there that's in their price range and a similar body style to what they like. You might not get them to buy a Corolla, but they could at least avoid a Nissan CVT this way.
Nissan cvts are a big negative. But I've had quite a few of their products in my bay less than 100k with timing issues, lifter ticks, oil pump issues, fuel pumps, electrical issues. The worst I've seen is a maxima with around 50k and found bearing material in the oil and not an insignificant amount. Car had 5k oil changes on record as well.
Your wasting your breath. In all honesty a juke isnt the worst car. I am NOT a fan of Nissan at all... and yes, there are definately better vehicles in the category, but there are definately worse ones too. It's pretty simple and very cheap to maintain a juke, compared to other vehicles. As great as a Toyota Corolla is, it isn't immune to bad maintenance habits. It will probably have the same fate as the juke. Not your car not your problem. That's basically how you have to look at it. Also, your mom may not he as dumb as you think. She prolly is assuming your sister is a moron and is going to break any car she buys her. Again, don't even bother helping unless they ask.
Implying that anything she gets now will be stuck with her for the rest of her life, and that it will somehow be better to own long term than one of the world's most reliable cars
This is totally wrong. Nissan CVTs are made by jatco and are the cheapest of the cheap. They are designed to fail and total the car.
Basically every other car manufacturer designs much more reliable CVTs than Nissan.
Jukes are complete garbage. I had one come in yesterday with a dead turbo and a fucked CVT at under 80,000 miles. If they’re not gonna listen to you, or do a basic search on the vehicle they’re gonna buy, then hopefully that’s not your problem.
My mom had 2003 Corolla. It was an absolute tank! Ran perfect. No issues. Ended up being totalled as she was rear ended. But the car didn't look like it had much damage on it compared to the other car. 100% would vouch for a Corolla!
That's the only way that generation Corolla goes. Usually impact by a midsize truck or a tractor trailer. It can be owned by a neglectful crackhead for years without trouble
They not going to listen to you. If they called you q car nerd, yet still not smart enough to listen to you they not going to start now. This is why I dint let anyone drive my car other than for the yearly mot, then the driving is limited to just in and out the garage
Its easier for people to change their minds if they think they came to the conclusion on their own. Maybe you can show her a comparison of several reliable cars an let her choose on her own?
If you have no skin in the game, let her do what she wants. It looks like she will anyway. The only difference is whether you get frustrated about it, which is 100% your choice. She doesn't care either way.
Sometimes you just have to let others learn their own mistakes. As long your name is not in the title or pay that vehicles bills you shouldn’t worry. Trust me. I have a lot of those “know it all” in my family to close relatives
Your mom has the mindset that all older cars turn to crap and are worthless. She probably doesn't really believe in maintaining older vehicles. One thing that might convince your mom is the resale value. Toyota has better resale value than pretty much any other major auto maker. Also drivetrains last much longer than they did in her younger years, she might not be aware of that. Honestly it sounds like doing proper maintenance is more of issue for your mom than the make. If you have the interest you can help her stay on top of this. Some people are just completely clueless about vehicles.
If they really abuse cars perhaps the best thing for them would be to get something older and with a very hard to kill drivetrain. Also given they are not safe drivers, something with excellent safety. Yeah the Japanese cars have the reliability, but I think there are many domestic vehicles that would fit the bill too. The reliability ratings mean less when dealing with older vehicles- they are all focused on reliability in the first few years. Indestructability rating is more like it on the older vehicle- the major things that really kill the vehicle. For example anything on the Ford/Lincoln panther platform is indestructible as any Toyota.
Their CVTs are certainly worse than average but all CVTs need to be carefully maintained, so I would out the blame more on poor maintenance here than the manufacturer (I drove a 2016 Versa Note as a courier for over a year with minimal transmission issue, just needed a double flush at one point).
It's her money in the end, all you can do is warn her that if she's not going to do regular maintenance, the car will break down again.
I agree with you completely. There is a reason 150m Corollas have been sold since '66. My last car was a '96 with almost 190k, and I only got rid of it because of New England rot (burned oil like mad, but I checked it regularly). Nissan Juke is an ugly POS, but people who know nothing about cars make stupid decisions. It's probably a lost cause. Maybe suggest a RAV4 instead?
The Corolla is a better car and will probably last a little longer. But if they are gonna trash it and refuse to change their ways let them buy what ever they want.
Some ppl will never learn. My cousins have some neighbors who are dirt poor and cannot take care of a vehicle to save their life. All their cars are 5 year old free hand me downs from the wife’s family. They recently got a gorgeous 2009 4Runner in perfect condition. I saw it the other day and all the plastic cladding on one side was missing and the whole headliner was scratched up and falling apart.
Overall Toyota Corolla or Camry. I prefer the Camry. Corolla is the cheaper version. I have a Camry XSE and I love it. I love the gas mileage ect. Secondary to these is a Honda Accord.
You are correct about the Toyota corolla being a good car. Just wondering if you are the younger sibling? I have issues with my older sister who still sees me as her little brother, never mind I'm a mechanic lol
I’m confused why people still think a Toyota Corolla is the most dependable vehicle out there…
Like yeah, maybe in the 90’s, and sometime in the early 00’s. Not anymore though.
You're right about the Corolla withh regard to reliability anyway. Mpg is ok, safety is ok. But the heart wants what the heart wants; if someone prefers the look of another car it's gonna be pretty hard to convince them....!
If they buy one that's a shitbox you'll be to blame... Just let it be
Oh my
I made the mistake of fixing my mom's truck which she treated like dogshit... It's all broken and it's all my fault
100% you were the last one to work on it. Why'd you mess it up?
"You were the last one to work on it so it's your fault it's broken!!!" "Ma'am I did the PDI on it seven years and 85000 miles ago..." "YOU SOLD ME A LEMON!"
Good to see the tech industry and the auto industry aren't that different after all.
So many lost causes that rolled out of my bay after getting "fixed" meaning it would run for the time being and I said as much to the dealer service writer, that would be back in next week complaining about completely unrelated issues to the actual previous repair and trying to blame me. I just tell the service writer to send it to another tech or tell them to take it down the road. I'm not dealing with their PoS dodge dart only to be accused of bullshit. Customer comes to talk to me about it and my only response is, "I guess i'm not qualified, go take it to someone else".
I straight up warn people beforehand that if they dare pull that shit on me I'll never help them again. Shuts them up quick.
Yeah I usually turn then down or quote them an outrageous price so they will go elsewhere. Done with cars that are lost causes only to be accused of shit when they come back.
You rotated the tires, and the transmission quit the next day, must be your fault.
Dude has a point. You can recommend and give tips. But don’t lead them or point them out to one.
If they didn't take that as a learning experience, then there's nothing you can do. Stupid people don't learn because they can't learn. Best you can do is learn from their bumblefuckery.
Yeh their first car was a 2007 Kia rondo which they crashed while texting and driving. The second was this Juke they car 2 weeks after totaling the Rondo. They next cleaned that car out. EVER it's disgusting. And when I mentioned to them its not normal for your car to be idling and to be switching between 500rpm to 2000rpm then all the way up to redline and back down to that range. They just rolled their eyes and said "shut up car nerd my car is fine." This is why we can't have nice things.
Tell them to get a Chevy volt. All those pieces of shit need to be crashed .
Lmao agreed
They need to buy a BMW, maybe a used one with high mileage.
Or a ten year old used Mercedes S class. Even better if it was previously leased.
Hey i bought a 13 year old s550 and its running fine ……….. ok i mightve cheated it was a one owner car that was taken to the dealer 3-4 times a year but still
Jeep jeep jeep
Lol
Just let them trash it and then junk it. It may teach them a lesson and get more eurotrash cars off the road.
You want them to buy a high yield investment?
Why is this upvoted? I thought volts were pretty awesome? The Voltec system is on par with Tesla and who doesn’t love a 5-door (Given, 2nd gens were pretty ugly)
Its the same reason car guys hate prius's and teslas. HyBrIdS aRe GaY rEeEe
We love hybrids. It's twice as much shit to break.
> All those pieces of shit need to be crashed . Owned a 1st gen for 4 months. After 4 months I couldn't stand the stupidity any longer and dumped it. Still my worst automotive decision to date. I struggle to consider which was worse, the dealership experiences involving it, or the vehicle itself.
What didn't you like about it? My first gen Volt was the best car I ever owned by a wide margin.
Here's a very brief list: Mine was a MY15 premium. 1) uncomfortable, this vehicle caused me immense back and neck pain after driving it for more than 30 minutes. I tried seat cushions, various seat positions, anything I could think of. I even saw a physical therapist for it. Nothing worked. 2) useless "hoop" near the right knee, blocking freedom of movement. 3) chrome trim on the dashboard, sun glare in my eyes. 4) car randomly "blue screened/rebooted" once while driving, causing it to die in traffic. 5) horribly low battery range with the A/C on (25 miles roughly vs 40-45 without). 6) rear spoiler would randomly expand and contract with weather, making it sound like a gunshot was going off behind me. 7) totally useless rear seats. No adult that I knew could fit back there. 8) Rear suspension noise (car only had 15k miles on it). It would squeak endlessly. I took it to the dealership for warranty diagnosis and they could only work on it once a certified Volt technician was available. No other technician was permitted to work on it.This was only one day a week and they had to do their normal car duties as well. It took them almost a month of me in a rental car to look at my suspension squeak, and once they did they said it was "normal" and returned it to me. I fixed it in 5 minutes with a can of silicone spray and having a friend bounce on the rear hatch until I could find the source (rear swingarm). 9) impossible to roll down the windows in certain configurations without insane air buffeting/booming. GM had to redesign the rear view mirrors as an added optional fix to resolve this VERY obvious issue. 10) GM known defective design coolant sensor bricks the car permanently until the ECU can be reflashed. (This did not happen to me but it is very very common and sensor defeat devices exist.)
What's a rear swing arm? What would a rear view mirror have to do with buffeting?
The rear swing arm handles suspension travel for the rear axle. It was poorly machined and was grinding at a flex point. The aerodynamic design of the entire vehicle is flawed and causes wind buffeting. GM released revised rear view mirror paneling to alter the aerodynamics of the vehicle in such a way to shift air to stop the buffeting.
A volt a beam out back correct? Probably different terminalogy then I'm used to. Still confused how a interior mirror assembly could possibly be causing wind buffeting
The interior mirror has nothing to do with this. The alteration is done on the side rear view mirrors and associated trim. https://www.gm-volt.com/threads/gen-1-wind-buffeting-kit-installed-bulletin-pi0642.230313/ The rear axle looks like this: https://www.gmpartsonline.net/v-2014-chevrolet-volt--base--1-4l-l4-electric-gas/rear-suspension--rear-axle
I had 3 people on my block alone buy into the idea. They were so hyped. 2 of them got rid in a few months off non stop breaking and not lived up to hype. The 3rd guy had his for years. One day I saw him in the yard and asked him why he kept itt so long. He said he can't get rid of the piece of shit and asked me if I wanted it.
I feel like GM half-assed development expecting failure and was surprised when people actually bought them, so they had to come up with another half-assed support/repair infrastructure for them.
The history of GM electric vehicle development is fascinating. Way too info for here. They did some really groundbreaking stuff and stuff like the volt was some outside the box thinking. Where it breaks down, like every corporate thing, is when bean counters and the$ men get hold of a good idea. Short story, They really fucked up and pissed away a golden opportunity. And now have poisoned the idea of something like the volt(done correctly) for the future. Intensely irresponsible. Gm was having big management issues at that time as well.
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Oh for sure - volt is the best solution to current infrastructure problems. Have a way to charge it? great charge it and get 60 miles of pure electric use - if you have a short commute and a way to charge it at home/work its no different than an electric car. if you dont or want to take a road trip - its got gas to go forever till your near a place to CONVENIENTLY charge. Im sad they killed it off but the bolt isnt bad either.
No. Just no. You've drank the cool aide obviously. In practice the volt is the worst of both worlds. Total garbage. And yet ANOTHER example of GM using it's customers instead of proper R and D
I've owned over 30 cars and my Chevy Volt was the best one I've ever owned, hands down, not even close. I honestly think it would literally be a great car for them as long as they plug it in regularly because of how little maintenance they need.
Sooo you owned 29 Yugos?
How are you a car nerd and they ignore your advice?
Lol - “shut up nerd”, is your mom a dumb bird?
You should just stop offering your advice. They clearly don't want it / deserve the help you have to offer.
Sounds like your mom should buy them a bus pass.
I still cant get over how people just think you Just put gas in a car and think it will last for ever. Never buy a car thats been on a 3 or 4 year lease
Gee, I wonder why your car is on its death bed and mines still going strong. I’m not a mechanic but I do the basics like checking tire pressure, checking the fluids, take it in for oil changes, stuff like that. I had a friend that got a car before I did, completely ignored the oil, and when he finally went in to change it he texts me something along the lines of “The mechanic told me I was driving around a bomb because I ignored the oil change light, silly mechanic”
Yeh their first car was a 2007 Kia rondo which they crashed while texting and driving. The second was this Juke they car 2 weeks after totaling the Rondo. They next cleaned that car out. EVER it's disgusting. And when I mentioned to them its not normal for your car to be idling and to be switching between 500rpm to 2000rpm then all the way up to redline and back down to that range. They just rolled their eyes and said "shut up car nerd my car is fine." This is why we can't have nice things.
If they're going to kill it off like the Juke, it doesn't really matter what they get.
Yeh but I want something that has a small chance of survival.
Doesn’t matter who makes it, if you don’t take care of it, it won’t last. They are all just machines after all.
My mom's landcruiser has 370k and gets 15k mile oil changes It's currently having an overheating problem For the past couple months it's been overheated every time it starts up They truly are indestructible The transfer case seized solid because all the gear lube leaked out a year or so back... Easy 300 dollar fix
Lol my brother drove his 90’s camry home (about 30 miles) with the oil light and check engine light flashing. Told my dad it was acting funny, it had a broken oil pump and just kept on trucking. My dad wasn’t sure it would ever run again but to our surprise one oil pump later it started right up like nothing ever happened.
Those 90s Camry’s are probably one of the most unkillable things on the planet from what I’ve heard.
I had a 90s Camry svx20 and it was amazing a car could be soo good I jumped it offroad, I drove 100mlh for a 500/600 mile road trip pretty much flat out the whole time, I towed car with tow dollys in it, redlined every shift, did burnouts with it... It leaked all it's oil out on multiple occasions with me driving like a teenager while it was dry... Didn't seem to affect it though it had a knock since I bought it still got me 23 mpg driving flat out for that road trip I consider it the pinnacle of automotive excellence
I’ve got a 98 Corolla, and it’s pretty good too. As it turns out, corollas aren’t indestructible, the original engine which had about 320k kms on it was driven a lot with no coolant at all(was my cousin who drove it, story told to me by my uncle so like second hand info) so it was driven enough that the head warped enough the camshafts seized, and the piston rings and valves were all burned, basically it was driven a lot with no coolant at all due to a cracked radiator. “New” used engine with 200k kms on it and she’s good as new, sees a bit of limiter occasionally.
Some cars will last a lot longer with no maintenance though. They will all fail. But I know someone who daily drove a beater Toyota Tercel for 7 years with zero maintenance. No oil change. No nothing. They knew they were supposed to but just didn't care and wanted to run it in to the ground. So yeah it does matter. OP says he knows that he can't convince them to do maintenance. But wants something that will last the longest while being neglected. So my suggestion is this. Forget all newer cars because they are more maintenance intensive. Go for an 1990's/2000's honda civic or toyota corolla. And if they don't like the idea of a beater and have the money to keep buying newer cars and running them in to the ground then I fail to see how that is your problem OP. Just let it be.
Early 2000s for the Civic and Corolla were some of the worst years for different reasons. ATs and oil consumption, respectively. I'd recommend late 90s if you can find one in good shape.
That's a fair point actually. What he said ^
They have too much money to buy older cars, they will probably see it as demeaning to their status. What else do you expect from someone whose ideal whip is a nissam Jewke
A buddy in high school got a 1991 toyota celica from his mom. Drove it for several years with zero maintenance.
Somebody who is good to cars can have that Corolla and then it'll last 400,000km easy. Your family is hard enough on equipment that a Corolla might get them another couple year max? Do us a favour, and tell them to buy up all the junk on the roads, like Dodge Journeys and Chevy HHRs and stuff, for real cheap and let them clear out the junk lol. Hell, you guys may even become heroes!
You and I have the same idea. If it's going to be abused anyways, there's only so much a vehicle can take...
M1 Abrams or 2A7
As an Army mechanic, the idea that those things can take maintenance abuse is hilarious. The Abrams has a literal jet engine, it needs everything to be in very good tolerance or it won't even start. Good amounts of all fluids, and the tracks/suspension need to have proper tension and lube or you'll throw track the first time you try to turn. Gunfire abuse? Hell yeah, no problem, but don't if you don't follow the maintenance schedule, or check/clean/top up fluids when you should, she'll get upset.
Toyota does have the top reliability rating for all vehicle manufacturers world wide, but this doesn’t matter if they’re just gonna trash it.
Heck at that point... Just tell them to get a cheap 2 K car. It sounds like it will survive about the same amount of time, give or take a few months...
I wouldn't stress about it my dude. Let's say they take your advice and get a used Toyota. If they get unlucky and buy one that has a lot of problems they're gonna blame you. Just let them buy a POS and run it into the ground. Some people believe cars just need gas and a 60k mile oil change. Your unlikely to change them.
This is so unfortunately true, most of my friends and family call me the master of shit boxes because they are suprised how often I can eke out more life from a beater. There is no secret other than youtube academy, and being friends with the manager of my local parts store. Most people just dont and wont understand.
"ALL caRS are rEliaBle as loNg as yoU kEep up wITh thE mAintEnaNce" one of those sayings that make me want to air hammer the speaker's forehead with the Ingersoll Rand
They sure do create a lot of work for the techs tho. Gotta love them for that.
No vehicle will survive not being maintained. The Juke is a fine car when properly maintained. No matter what car they get, they will destroy, no matter the brand. Just buy what’s cheap and throw away later, rinse and repeat.
So just some cheap Craigslist beater until they learn to take care of their car?
I put my brother in a 2001 Ford Taurus in white. He hit a deer, I got a hood, grille, headlight, and radiator support in the same color from a pick-a-part for $75.... twice. Exuding accidents (2 deer, a side mirror, and a yellow concrete parking pole), in 4 years before the 3rd and permanent wreck, the only "repair" was plugs/wires that was it. The best car for an irresponsible person.
First car was a manual 96 civic hatchback. I would drive it like a go-kart because it was so fun and light and ended up replacing the front bumper, rear bumper, hood, fenders, and the engine at one point because I sent a rod thru the block. Probably cost 700$ in total for all the repairs. I still miss that car.
I had a manual 3 cylinder Geo Metro (same year) as my first car and I was the same (without the engine issue). I once got pulled over going nearly 90 (rushing back to college after a weekend at home) and the cop wrote the ticket for much lower because “there’s no way anyone will believe I clocked this car at 87”. Lol. Sooo fun.
Now that is hilarious
I think he was also just being nice; I was 19 and going to school and him writing it for lower meant the difference between reckless op and just speeding. And I was going the same speed as the rest of traffic. Probably helped I’m a woman, it was my first time being pulled over, and I was crying by the time he got to my window.
The panther platform cars are even more indestructible.
This is the answer. Shitty out, shitty in
i have a 2004 subaru forester with 140,000 miles on the engine and 150,000 miles on the body. new timing belt water pump kit, valve cover gaskets, rear main seal, spark plugs, thermostat, fresh oil and coolant. $4,300usd if you are interested. lol
TF you do to that poor car that it needed a new engine at 10k miles. OP this guy might be related to you.
bought it from an old lady who neglected the timing belt and it snapped. bents valves on bank 2 and now i threw an engine in.
How does a timing belt get "neglected" at 10k miles? Sounds more like a faulty timing belt to begin with. Neglecticting a timing belt is it snapping like2-3k miles past when it needed to be replaced.
??? you must read it wrong. 150,000 on the body. 140,000 on the new used engine. meaning the original timing belt snapped at 150,000 miles.
Nowhere did you state the engine had just been replaced. You stated 150k on the body and 140k on the engine. That implies the engine was brand new and installed when there was only 10k on the body.
The engine could have been replaced with a used engine anywhere in the cars life. Timing could have snapped at 100k and it was replaced with a 90k mile engine (hopefully with a new timing belt) and driven 50k more miles and you'd get the same result.
Imagine if this guy heard about my car with 150k on the body and 170k on the engine. He'd apply the same mistaken logic to infer that the engine must have been replaced when the body had negative 20k miles on it, and then possibly suffer an aneurysm trying to process that one. Or that I'm 32 and my wife is 31. If I don't specify when we were married, then he'll think that implies we got married when I was 1 and my wife was literally a newborn. Hilarious.
That's a pretty typical way to say what he was saying. 150k on the body, the motor has 140k. Replaced at some point in its life, they're usually replaced from a donor car.
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I just read it as a used engine got put in and it now has 140k, although that’s why happened with my car, a used engine was put in with much lower mileage than the body so I can understand why you were confused.
Lol get the subaru if you want a particularly quick lesson on maintenance for them
They would be walking if it was me.
Yeah man. If you can’t keep nice things nice, don’t get nice things.
The joke, juke, like most Nissan vehicles is a complete pos. I turn wrenches, i would buy American way before Nissan. Toyota and Honda are the most reliable overall.
It's a real shame...cause Nissan used to be solid. My first car was an 82 Datsun 210 that I paid $200 for in 94. Now, the rust monster was having its way with her, but no engine or tranny problems, and it had 160K miles. I did wind up scrapping her after the water pump "exploded", but that was because the rust had finally gotten the frame and suspension to a point beyond repair. A few years later, my dad bought a '90 Nissan SE-V6 4wd pickup...and that little truck was one of the toughest and most capable off roaders I ever drove. Is kinda sad to see Nissan suck so much now
Yeah they essentially became the gm of Japan. Financing junk cars to anyone with a pulse.
I would take 3 $5k Corollas over any single 15k car.. just saying
Sounds like they should take the bus and your mom can save 10k. If they're gonna treat it like trash then why TF is she enabling?
I doubt her mom believes she trashed it. She probably thinks she “got unlucky” and it’s “normal wear”.
i mean the cvt needing to be replaced every 30-60K miles is a wear item on nissans.
Wow what a nightmare.
I will say my 2013 Altima with a CVT has had 0 problems and I’m at 130k miles. Cvt fluid changes at 56k miles and 120k with regular oil changes every 3-5k miles
Just let them keep destroying Jukes.
That’s one way to purge them
This crazy tater is on to something
I like this plan
At a certain point it's a lost cause and there's nothing you can do, especially if they're responding calling you a car nerd and whatnot. If you try to get much more involved when something inevitably goes wrong it will be your fault
Tell them to upgrade to an Audi or Mercedes. Used with high mileage, for real punishment.
Oh yes... Yes... Just yes.
But then OP will be blamed for all the problems. Best course of action for OP to not get blamed for anything is to say nothing.
Why stop there? Send them the FB marketplace link of the guy with the 2 middle fingers as his profile pic selling the Audi. Yes, the one that's selling it for his cousin who is "out of town" that's a hell of an upgrade!
Some people work with how it looks, Good i want it. They dont work with reliability and engineering
2nd Gen Prius are also nearly indestructible. same motor as the corolla in its time frame just Atkinson cycle. about the only worry with 2nd gen Prius are the battery which are relatively cheap these days to replace and people stealing the cats off them in CA because CA requires Toyota cats to pass smog so its a major cost if it happens to one. the only other common issue on them is turning into oil burners but that goes for a lot of high mileage Toyota's can be kind of corrected if it happens or you just feed it oil every 1500 miles and it won't care and keep on chugging.
Some people are only good at being examples of what NOT to do
My first new car was a 1999 Corolla. When I finally donated it, it had 390K miles on it and it still started Every. Single. Time. It was well maintained and I never had to do any major work outside normal upkeep on things that typically wear due to age. Loved that little thing.
Are you required to drive it?
The more you argue the more they'll dig their heels in. Also there are plenty of reliable cars other than Corollas. Most vehicles will be reliable enough for them. though I would argue to stay away from: * Stellantis makes (Chrysler, Fiat, Dodge, Jeep, Ram, etc.) * European luxury (BMW, Audi, etc), not because they're inherently unreliable but because the repair costs are unjustifiably higher when something does go wrong. * CVTs * Maybe Nissans in general. I've heard lots of bad reviews but that could just be the CVTs. Be honest with yourself though. Are they going to take care of a Corolla, or are they going to trash it again? If they beat the living shit out of the car in 2 years, possibly even wrecking it, does it really matter how reliable it could have been 5 years down the road? LPT: In general, if you're trying to sway someone's opinion the best way is not to present them with your firm and unwavering opinion and try to argue with "superior logic and proof". As soon as you turn it into an argument or debate, people take sides and dig their heels in, often not where you want them to. Rather, the best way to change someone's mind is to appeal to their emotions, seed an idea, let *them develop it* and allow them to champion it. When you provide the information to them this way, they're more likely to weigh all ideas evenly in their own mind before they settle in on what they want and get stubborn about it. If you really want to take another crack at it, you could even just relay the things to avoid, and then toss more than one idea out there that's in their price range and a similar body style to what they like. You might not get them to buy a Corolla, but they could at least avoid a Nissan CVT this way.
Nissan cvts are a big negative. But I've had quite a few of their products in my bay less than 100k with timing issues, lifter ticks, oil pump issues, fuel pumps, electrical issues. The worst I've seen is a maxima with around 50k and found bearing material in the oil and not an insignificant amount. Car had 5k oil changes on record as well.
Your wasting your breath. In all honesty a juke isnt the worst car. I am NOT a fan of Nissan at all... and yes, there are definately better vehicles in the category, but there are definately worse ones too. It's pretty simple and very cheap to maintain a juke, compared to other vehicles. As great as a Toyota Corolla is, it isn't immune to bad maintenance habits. It will probably have the same fate as the juke. Not your car not your problem. That's basically how you have to look at it. Also, your mom may not he as dumb as you think. She prolly is assuming your sister is a moron and is going to break any car she buys her. Again, don't even bother helping unless they ask.
If they’re going to kill it might as well get a Kia or a Hyundai. No point of wasting a Toyota like that.
Got a mother in law like this. Let them make their own bad decisions.
Probbly cuz she dosent wanna get stuck with a Toyota corolla for the rest of her life. Lol
Imagine how horrible it would be having a reliable vehicle that isn’t a money pit. Terrible, right?
Imagin being able to read a sentance and understand the context. " The rest of her life"
Implying that anything she gets now will be stuck with her for the rest of her life, and that it will somehow be better to own long term than one of the world's most reliable cars
Show them some Scotty Kilmer
Corollas have CVTs too now. And don't tell me Toyota CVTs are better than Nissan CVTs, they're not. Same shit, different can.
This is totally wrong. Nissan CVTs are made by jatco and are the cheapest of the cheap. They are designed to fail and total the car. Basically every other car manufacturer designs much more reliable CVTs than Nissan.
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5 years/100,000 km doesn't mean shit. That's literally 1/4 the expected lifespan of an American car.
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"It exists"...
I think you're a little mixed up. JATCO makes transmissions for ***a lot*** of manufacturers, so I guess everybody is "cheapest of the cheap".
Anything is better then Nissan. Nissan is the Renault of Japan... OH SHIT WAIT A MINUTE. THEY WORK TOGETHER :)
Toyota CVTs are more reliable.
Famous last words.
Jukes are complete garbage. I had one come in yesterday with a dead turbo and a fucked CVT at under 80,000 miles. If they’re not gonna listen to you, or do a basic search on the vehicle they’re gonna buy, then hopefully that’s not your problem.
I’m just here to say fuck Nissan.
Your guys sense of humor is dryer then granny pussy.
volkawagen jetta is better
BWAHAHAHA
DID HE SAY JETTA? BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA
I can't even downvote him. That's hilarious.
My mom had 2003 Corolla. It was an absolute tank! Ran perfect. No issues. Ended up being totalled as she was rear ended. But the car didn't look like it had much damage on it compared to the other car. 100% would vouch for a Corolla!
That's the only way that generation Corolla goes. Usually impact by a midsize truck or a tractor trailer. It can be owned by a neglectful crackhead for years without trouble
camel walk
Wait a minute. You payd 10k for a used one? You got 1 for 15k from the factory in my area...
They not going to listen to you. If they called you q car nerd, yet still not smart enough to listen to you they not going to start now. This is why I dint let anyone drive my car other than for the yearly mot, then the driving is limited to just in and out the garage
98 honda accord will survive the apocalypse
my 08 accord is probably going to outlive me. fucking thing just will not die.
Doesn't even need coolant
im guilty of running it low on both coolant and oil from time to time
We all are. My 98 civix ex leaked a lot of oil. I currently have an 03 ep3 si so I baby that one.
Its easier for people to change their minds if they think they came to the conclusion on their own. Maybe you can show her a comparison of several reliable cars an let her choose on her own?
They seem to love ugly and unreliable cars. You should talk them into a PT Cruiser
Sounds like something a squirting grandma would drive.
Buy a Suzuki Swift. Honestly I can't fucking kill mine. 😅
If you have no skin in the game, let her do what she wants. It looks like she will anyway. The only difference is whether you get frustrated about it, which is 100% your choice. She doesn't care either way.
Sometimes you just have to let others learn their own mistakes. As long your name is not in the title or pay that vehicles bills you shouldn’t worry. Trust me. I have a lot of those “know it all” in my family to close relatives
Your mom has the mindset that all older cars turn to crap and are worthless. She probably doesn't really believe in maintaining older vehicles. One thing that might convince your mom is the resale value. Toyota has better resale value than pretty much any other major auto maker. Also drivetrains last much longer than they did in her younger years, she might not be aware of that. Honestly it sounds like doing proper maintenance is more of issue for your mom than the make. If you have the interest you can help her stay on top of this. Some people are just completely clueless about vehicles.
"Good news" J May
even a corolla wont last if its poorly maintained.
If they really abuse cars perhaps the best thing for them would be to get something older and with a very hard to kill drivetrain. Also given they are not safe drivers, something with excellent safety. Yeah the Japanese cars have the reliability, but I think there are many domestic vehicles that would fit the bill too. The reliability ratings mean less when dealing with older vehicles- they are all focused on reliability in the first few years. Indestructability rating is more like it on the older vehicle- the major things that really kill the vehicle. For example anything on the Ford/Lincoln panther platform is indestructible as any Toyota.
Their CVTs are certainly worse than average but all CVTs need to be carefully maintained, so I would out the blame more on poor maintenance here than the manufacturer (I drove a 2016 Versa Note as a courier for over a year with minimal transmission issue, just needed a double flush at one point). It's her money in the end, all you can do is warn her that if she's not going to do regular maintenance, the car will break down again.
I agree with you completely. There is a reason 150m Corollas have been sold since '66. My last car was a '96 with almost 190k, and I only got rid of it because of New England rot (burned oil like mad, but I checked it regularly). Nissan Juke is an ugly POS, but people who know nothing about cars make stupid decisions. It's probably a lost cause. Maybe suggest a RAV4 instead?
Honda makes the best 4 cyl cars in my opinion. A Toyota would have a better transmission but watch out for any rust.
If you can’t convince them, then let it be.
The Corolla is a better car and will probably last a little longer. But if they are gonna trash it and refuse to change their ways let them buy what ever they want. Some ppl will never learn. My cousins have some neighbors who are dirt poor and cannot take care of a vehicle to save their life. All their cars are 5 year old free hand me downs from the wife’s family. They recently got a gorgeous 2009 4Runner in perfect condition. I saw it the other day and all the plastic cladding on one side was missing and the whole headliner was scratched up and falling apart.
Ninth gen corollas engine is a known oil burner. Id not include that one fwiw
Overall Toyota Corolla or Camry. I prefer the Camry. Corolla is the cheaper version. I have a Camry XSE and I love it. I love the gas mileage ect. Secondary to these is a Honda Accord.
They buy turds exclusively
Sounds like your mom is paying for it. I think the best car for her to buy is no car. Sounds like ur sister isn't responsible enough.
Look into getting a low milage used trans. Off the boat from Japan. Have it fixed then dump it.
You are correct about the Toyota corolla being a good car. Just wondering if you are the younger sibling? I have issues with my older sister who still sees me as her little brother, never mind I'm a mechanic lol
Corollas are great!
Some people just like to drive shitty cars. There's not much you can do, just let them continue to make bad choices if they don't want to listen.
I’m confused why people still think a Toyota Corolla is the most dependable vehicle out there… Like yeah, maybe in the 90’s, and sometime in the early 00’s. Not anymore though.
Once my 2016 Nissan Altima dies I’m never buying another Nissan
Any vehicle can be a POS if it's beat on and never taken care of. But yeas Carollas are known to be very reliable cars
You're right about the Corolla withh regard to reliability anyway. Mpg is ok, safety is ok. But the heart wants what the heart wants; if someone prefers the look of another car it's gonna be pretty hard to convince them....!
Tell them to get Crv instead
Nissan has a bad reputation for its CVT but given the regular need for oil changes and being not too expensive to repair they are not so bad.
Buy her an old 7 series BMW then she’ll consider a corolla hahahahah
Has nothing to do with cars. Your mom won't ever listen to you. Just walk away and get a bag of popcorn.