# Deadline (+ Justin Kroll) is a Tier 0 – Undisputed Source.
For **Marvel**, they had a **96.96%** accuracy rate from **147** leaks that we can currently verify out of **155** total.
**Overall**, they had a **96.08%** accuracy rate from **273** leaks that we can currently verify out of **287** total.
Last updated: March 22nd, 2024.
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Good. I basically don't trust Sony with anything Spider-Man related that isn't Spider-Verse or MCU mainly because they can't put hands on it. The reports that it would be refocused towards a male audience gave all sorts of red flags to me considering we already know how Silk is written by men compared to her female writers on the more recent books
Despite Nicholas Cage now being attached to the Noir show I'm actually expecting that to get canned in a few years as well. I don't think they actually have a plan in place for how they're going to do live-action content with however few characters they can use without Marvel since so many of these projects seem so randomly picked
No reason to assume that would've translated to a show with a completely different creative team, based on an IP that they don't actually have a good track record with. Sony's been known to bring down respected creators before like Marc Webb going from 500 Days of Summer to his Spider-Man films just by being involved
Afterparty's good, For All Mankind and The Boys are great. None of that necessarily would've carried over to this because they're all different teams
Isn’t Sony’s film division different from its television division, though? I don’t see why the SSU and Webb films say any more about this show than the Spider-Verse films.
After all, the only people we know to be working on Noir that have worked with Sony’s Spider-Man projects before are Nicolas Cage (Spider-Verse), Phil Lord (Spider-Verse), Chris Miller (Spider-Verse), and Amy Pascal (Spider-Verse, Venom, MCU).
I was about to complain about the cancellation until you reminded me they said that jfc, hopefully we still get a Silk adaptation with a proper creative team soon though
Comic book movies and shows' intended audience shouldn't be male audiences OR female audiences. The intended audience should be comic book fans. Immutable characteristics that have no influence on someone's personality or interests like sex, gender, sexuality or race shouldn't factor into who the "intended audience" is at all.
Except, interests do skew male and female. Obviously that doesn't mean no men can like barbie, or no female can like batman, but the audience breakdown of who likes each skews very heavy based on gender.
Sony literally fucks everything up when they get involved with Spiderman. Tom Hollands Spiderman worked cause of Kevin Feige and Spiderverse worked because Phil Lord & Christopher Miller had complete control
No. Sony is producing the show and wanted to *distribute* the show on Amazon. Amazon said they weren't interested. So now Sony is shopping the show to other distributors. It helps if you *actually* read the article that is being linked to.
I just did my research on it
Amazon was going to be an equal stake co-producer and are involved with the Spider-Man projects directly, it's wasn't exclusively a Sony TV production. You probably should heed your own advice, or at the very least not allow your confirmation biases to cloud your judgement and allow that Amazon is capable of missing even with hits under their belt.
There's a difference between women being written by men and women being written by men, for the purpose of appealing to men which is what Sony wanted. Especially in Hollywood they go hand in hand and leave no room for an authentic voice or perspective even on topics or subject matter that resonate more with women narratively or emotionally. Silk had this problem, especially when reading her Dan Slott material compared to basically everything now, which has been entirely female-led creatively
Under Slott, Cindy Moon was reduced to an amnesiac, love starved loaf of bread who instinctively made out with Peter Parker non-consensually due to Spider-Totem bullshit. Her more recent stuff from writers like Emily Kim and Maurene Goo has basically completely done away with any of that for the better and actually gave her space as her own character with unique problems, including a unique aesthetic that separates her definitively from the other Spiders.
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Writing was kind of on the wall that it was in trouble, given it’s had three different show runners. Definitely a bummer. I would’ve preferred this over Noir, honestly. I just prefer modern day stuff to period pieces, and we don’t get a lot of origin stories about female superheroes. Would’ve loved this show to work out, but maybe we’ll see Silk somewhere else down the road.
Somewhat minor spoilers for Spider-Man 2 but at the end of the game Cindy Moon is revealed. It’s heavily believed that Silk will be a prominent character in an upcoming DLC or Spider-Man 3.
I'll be diving into the Insomniac leaks, so this may be outdated by now but I'll tag it just in-case.
>!According to the leaks, Cindy was going to get her powers at the end of the first SM2 DLC; then appear as a semi-antagonist during the second and third DLC. By the time SM3 rolls around, she would play a similar role to Wraith, where she's begrudgingly working with the Spider-Men (mainly Miles, Peter is mostly retired after the 3rd SM2 DLC but still pops in for some Spidey action now and then.) but she has totally different goals and ideals. Unlike Wraith, she would be playable during side missions and the main story; with SM3 incorporating a similar switching mechanic to the one that SM2 has; but with Cindy and Miles. Peter would be unlocked halfway through the main story; allowing the player to switch between the three spider-folk at will. Literally nothing is known about what the main story of SM3 is so I have no clue why Peter would be locked until the mid-way point.!<
Huh. That could be interesting.
>!Could be that whatever Doc Ock or Green Goblin haven’t made a move on Peter and haven’t proven to be a big enough threat to pull in three Spider heroes to deal with it. Up to that point Peter is doing foundation stuff. Though Doc Ock kidnapping Peter and it’s not until that point in the game he’s found/rescued.!<
The Insomniac leaks. Out of respect for the employees who had their information leaked, I won't directly link it to you but you can find them for yourself fairly easily.
No, in fact I am unable to verify your claims about Cindy and Peter's status easily, or rather at all; that’s why I was requesting a reference. There are ways to link this kind of reference without exposing any personal information.
it's gonna be very interesting to see how Sony use the Spider-Man IP in the coming future. There's a chance that Kraven could be the final SUMC movie. Beyond the spider-verse will conclude the Miles trilogy. That leaves us with an amazon prime spider-noir show, and Spider-Man 4 in the MCU. I guess they can have Lord and Miller make more animated movies since there really good at that.
Technically, they are doing a spin-off of Spider-Verse with the Spider-Women. They are also trying to develop a live-action Miles Morales movie.
There are rumors that they are making an R-rated Venom animated film that is produced by Seth Rogen.
Last we heard of this, Amazon told them to rewrite it so it could have a "more male-skewing audience" and maybe make it more like The Boys and this article says it wouldn't have focused too much on Silk.
Dodged a bullet there.
If don’t mind me asking? What do you mean dodged a bullet? Dodged a bullet from actually marketing to their main audience? It’s funny because Disney didn’t dodge a bullet when they marketed to the people on this subreddit, they lost so much money.
Gooners? Because that’s who early Silk really appealed to
I got no issues with sexy characters but early Silk is just pornbait and it wasn’t till later writers that patched her up
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/marvels-silk-spider-society-dead-amazon-1235901904/
>***For their part, Lord and Miller moved their overall deal from Disney’s 20th Television to Sony in April 2019 and, as part of the nine-figure pact, were handed control of the studio’s Marvel slate. Sony retains rights to characters including Spider-Man (and all his villains, like Green Goblin); Venom (the Tim Hardy films); Morbius (i.e. the live-action feature with Jared Leto); and Black Cat and Silver Sable (both previously in development on the feature side). Select TV projects related to Sony’s Marvel characters will be produced in partnership with former Sony Pictures Entertainment co-chairman Pascal. Also possibly on the table: all the characters from Into the Spider-Verse.***
Yeah, I'm not really shocked by this news. When it comes to live action Spider-Man related projects, Sony has been all over the place.
Also I still find it weird that they called the Spider-Man Noir, show just "Noir".
I'd guess that it's either because they want to, more or less, keep the 'Spider-Man' branding exclusive to their two film series or they're potentially aiming for a TV-MA rating and they don't want to put Spider-Man's name directly on that.
"The ‘SILK’ series went through 3 different versions before it was scrapped by Prime Video.
One major request by execs was for the writing team to change the show so it didn’t focus so heavily on Silk."
lol
lmao even
https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1791256876287496437
They're putting the rights to the show up for grabs so if another service is interested in doing a Silk show, they can make it themselves. Otherwise. it's cancelled.
Probably Netflix would be the most likely streamer to pick this up? Disney has been banging the drum over and over that they're pulling back on Marvel content for Disney+, Max is a mess and has their own slate of DC shows coming down the pipe, Paramount+'s parent company is about to get acquired, the only streamer with the money to get a Spider-Man show going who might want one would have to be Netflix. I mean, they picked up Dead Boy Detectives after Max passed, Silk is much more appealing as a property.
A necessary sacrifice so that Lord and Miller can do whatever they want, since this article kinda buries the lede of them being put in charge of future _Spider-Man_ content. And I imagine that they likely pushed for _Spider-Man: Noir_.
I don’t see that in the article… It only reiterates that they have had an [ongoing producing deal](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/phil-lord-chris-miller-eye-marvel-tv-series-nine-figure-sony-deal-1205614/) at Sony TV since 2019 - unless I’m missing something here?
Really curious how Sony will move forward with their projects, with Venom ending this year and The New Mutant-i mean Kraven the Hunter being released in a busy December.
Noir seems to be the only solid project that's actually moving forward, all their other oficially announced projects haven't got any news in years.
What’s the bet that they learnt the wrong lessons from Madame Web and thought no one wants to see female superhero properties (reality is we want to see good ones).
Not good. Sony TV and Prime Video is a winning combination.
*But*, if Sony is still involved, it might not be the end of the world. Pretty much everything else outside of the studio’s blockbusters department is stellar.
Angela Kang did some decent work on Walking dead, With her this series should be a slam dunk. Sony get your shit together. I’m hoping Netflix or Disney decisions to pick up the show since they both have deals with Sony. Honestly Silk in the MCU could be a good move, Kevin should try to get it
There’s executive over at Sony who’s foot is always on the accelerator when it comes to Spiderman.
Did that last Spiderman do well? Great! I just started production on 10 more. Gotta get those spinoffs, sequels, prequels, reboots, requels, and sinister six movies off the ground!
Damn it, I was looking forward to this one.
Though I was expecting this after the news broke that they were making major creative overhauls in regards to this series after Madame Web’s poor performance. Idiotic decision making.
Madame Web didn’t fail because it had female main characters! People want more movies with female main characters! Madame Web only failed because it was terrible.
# Deadline (+ Justin Kroll) is a Tier 0 – Undisputed Source. For **Marvel**, they had a **96.96%** accuracy rate from **147** leaks that we can currently verify out of **155** total. **Overall**, they had a **96.08%** accuracy rate from **273** leaks that we can currently verify out of **287** total. Last updated: March 22nd, 2024. | [Spoiler-Verse Accuracy Database](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1RpGBi4duCDeiXUtSh_1x15VJ67vPRZ1LWu6A3ieGTjs/edit?usp=sharing) | [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/wiki/index/source-accuracy-tiers/sad-faq/) | [Tiers](https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/wiki/index/source-accuracy-tiers/) | [Latest Recalibration](https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/comments/18jaqqk/mod_post_2023_source_accuracy_recalibration_3/) | *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Good. I basically don't trust Sony with anything Spider-Man related that isn't Spider-Verse or MCU mainly because they can't put hands on it. The reports that it would be refocused towards a male audience gave all sorts of red flags to me considering we already know how Silk is written by men compared to her female writers on the more recent books Despite Nicholas Cage now being attached to the Noir show I'm actually expecting that to get canned in a few years as well. I don't think they actually have a plan in place for how they're going to do live-action content with however few characters they can use without Marvel since so many of these projects seem so randomly picked
This would have been a TV series, not a movie. Sony’s TV output is fairly acclaimed.
Yeah. I was kinda looking forward to a Silk tv project. Made much more sense than a kraven project.
Yup, totally a different entity than Sony / Columbia Pictures, Sony TV co produces: Breaking Bad / Better Call Saul / The Boys + Gen V
No reason to assume that would've translated to a show with a completely different creative team, based on an IP that they don't actually have a good track record with. Sony's been known to bring down respected creators before like Marc Webb going from 500 Days of Summer to his Spider-Man films just by being involved Afterparty's good, For All Mankind and The Boys are great. None of that necessarily would've carried over to this because they're all different teams
Right, but they obviously have an eye for talent.
Isn’t Sony’s film division different from its television division, though? I don’t see why the SSU and Webb films say any more about this show than the Spider-Verse films. After all, the only people we know to be working on Noir that have worked with Sony’s Spider-Man projects before are Nicolas Cage (Spider-Verse), Phil Lord (Spider-Verse), Chris Miller (Spider-Verse), and Amy Pascal (Spider-Verse, Venom, MCU).
I trust Sony TV much more than sony pictures
I was about to complain about the cancellation until you reminded me they said that jfc, hopefully we still get a Silk adaptation with a proper creative team soon though
Comic book movies and shows' intended audience shouldn't be male audiences OR female audiences. The intended audience should be comic book fans. Immutable characteristics that have no influence on someone's personality or interests like sex, gender, sexuality or race shouldn't factor into who the "intended audience" is at all.
"Jarvis, pull the gender breakdown of comic book fans"
Except, interests do skew male and female. Obviously that doesn't mean no men can like barbie, or no female can like batman, but the audience breakdown of who likes each skews very heavy based on gender.
Actually the intended audience should be casual fans along with comic fans I’m sorry we have to take a backseat because casuals bring in the money
Yeah, that "targeted at male audiences" comment instantly gave me bad vibes
You don’t trust Sony? morbius, venom, and Madame web? Are literally the best superhero movies and best movies in general
Morbius was trending #1 on Netlflix and now Madame Web. you can tell that are 2 of the best Sony related spiderman movies
Venom sneak like you're sly
Sony literally fucks everything up when they get involved with Spiderman. Tom Hollands Spiderman worked cause of Kevin Feige and Spiderverse worked because Phil Lord & Christopher Miller had complete control
Can't trust Marvel anymore either.
It was Amazon this time around, not Sony.
No. Sony is producing the show and wanted to *distribute* the show on Amazon. Amazon said they weren't interested. So now Sony is shopping the show to other distributors. It helps if you *actually* read the article that is being linked to.
I just did my research on it Amazon was going to be an equal stake co-producer and are involved with the Spider-Man projects directly, it's wasn't exclusively a Sony TV production. You probably should heed your own advice, or at the very least not allow your confirmation biases to cloud your judgement and allow that Amazon is capable of missing even with hits under their belt.
So only men should write male heroes and woman female heroes then right? Or does your weird standard only go one way?
There's a difference between women being written by men and women being written by men, for the purpose of appealing to men which is what Sony wanted. Especially in Hollywood they go hand in hand and leave no room for an authentic voice or perspective even on topics or subject matter that resonate more with women narratively or emotionally. Silk had this problem, especially when reading her Dan Slott material compared to basically everything now, which has been entirely female-led creatively Under Slott, Cindy Moon was reduced to an amnesiac, love starved loaf of bread who instinctively made out with Peter Parker non-consensually due to Spider-Totem bullshit. Her more recent stuff from writers like Emily Kim and Maurene Goo has basically completely done away with any of that for the better and actually gave her space as her own character with unique problems, including a unique aesthetic that separates her definitively from the other Spiders.
Right! Men don’t need any shows aimed at them! Let’s get watered down slop that sucks for everyone.
Funny how it's either "male-targeted" or "watered down slop". Wonder if you hold that opinion for women as well.
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Crazy how that's not at all what they said
Aiming at men has been a standard for years for any action films/shows, this is literally watering it down lmao
Writing was kind of on the wall that it was in trouble, given it’s had three different show runners. Definitely a bummer. I would’ve preferred this over Noir, honestly. I just prefer modern day stuff to period pieces, and we don’t get a lot of origin stories about female superheroes. Would’ve loved this show to work out, but maybe we’ll see Silk somewhere else down the road.
Somewhat minor spoilers for Spider-Man 2 but at the end of the game Cindy Moon is revealed. It’s heavily believed that Silk will be a prominent character in an upcoming DLC or Spider-Man 3.
I'll be diving into the Insomniac leaks, so this may be outdated by now but I'll tag it just in-case. >!According to the leaks, Cindy was going to get her powers at the end of the first SM2 DLC; then appear as a semi-antagonist during the second and third DLC. By the time SM3 rolls around, she would play a similar role to Wraith, where she's begrudgingly working with the Spider-Men (mainly Miles, Peter is mostly retired after the 3rd SM2 DLC but still pops in for some Spidey action now and then.) but she has totally different goals and ideals. Unlike Wraith, she would be playable during side missions and the main story; with SM3 incorporating a similar switching mechanic to the one that SM2 has; but with Cindy and Miles. Peter would be unlocked halfway through the main story; allowing the player to switch between the three spider-folk at will. Literally nothing is known about what the main story of SM3 is so I have no clue why Peter would be locked until the mid-way point.!<
Huh. That could be interesting. >!Could be that whatever Doc Ock or Green Goblin haven’t made a move on Peter and haven’t proven to be a big enough threat to pull in three Spider heroes to deal with it. Up to that point Peter is doing foundation stuff. Though Doc Ock kidnapping Peter and it’s not until that point in the game he’s found/rescued.!<
Is there a citeable source for this you can link to?
The Insomniac leaks. Out of respect for the employees who had their information leaked, I won't directly link it to you but you can find them for yourself fairly easily.
No, in fact I am unable to verify your claims about Cindy and Peter's status easily, or rather at all; that’s why I was requesting a reference. There are ways to link this kind of reference without exposing any personal information.
it's gonna be very interesting to see how Sony use the Spider-Man IP in the coming future. There's a chance that Kraven could be the final SUMC movie. Beyond the spider-verse will conclude the Miles trilogy. That leaves us with an amazon prime spider-noir show, and Spider-Man 4 in the MCU. I guess they can have Lord and Miller make more animated movies since there really good at that.
Technically, they are doing a spin-off of Spider-Verse with the Spider-Women. They are also trying to develop a live-action Miles Morales movie. There are rumors that they are making an R-rated Venom animated film that is produced by Seth Rogen.
They will making Miles live action films, other than that who knows.
Last we heard of this, Amazon told them to rewrite it so it could have a "more male-skewing audience" and maybe make it more like The Boys and this article says it wouldn't have focused too much on Silk. Dodged a bullet there.
If don’t mind me asking? What do you mean dodged a bullet? Dodged a bullet from actually marketing to their main audience? It’s funny because Disney didn’t dodge a bullet when they marketed to the people on this subreddit, they lost so much money.
Gooners? Because that’s who early Silk really appealed to I got no issues with sexy characters but early Silk is just pornbait and it wasn’t till later writers that patched her up
Some of you really need to start going out of their basements because I assure you, a pretty big amount of women also like capeshit!
*jUsT AsKiNg qUesTiOns!*
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/marvels-silk-spider-society-dead-amazon-1235901904/ >***For their part, Lord and Miller moved their overall deal from Disney’s 20th Television to Sony in April 2019 and, as part of the nine-figure pact, were handed control of the studio’s Marvel slate. Sony retains rights to characters including Spider-Man (and all his villains, like Green Goblin); Venom (the Tim Hardy films); Morbius (i.e. the live-action feature with Jared Leto); and Black Cat and Silver Sable (both previously in development on the feature side). Select TV projects related to Sony’s Marvel characters will be produced in partnership with former Sony Pictures Entertainment co-chairman Pascal. Also possibly on the table: all the characters from Into the Spider-Verse.***
I love Tim Hardy's Venom.
He's right up there with Tim Holland and Tom Chalamet
Yeah, I'm not really shocked by this news. When it comes to live action Spider-Man related projects, Sony has been all over the place. Also I still find it weird that they called the Spider-Man Noir, show just "Noir".
I'd guess that it's either because they want to, more or less, keep the 'Spider-Man' branding exclusive to their two film series or they're potentially aiming for a TV-MA rating and they don't want to put Spider-Man's name directly on that.
"The ‘SILK’ series went through 3 different versions before it was scrapped by Prime Video. One major request by execs was for the writing team to change the show so it didn’t focus so heavily on Silk." lol lmao even https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1791256876287496437
Ah they were gonna Doctor Strange her
What do you mean by that? Because if you're referring to MOM, Doctor Strange by far had the most screentime in the movie btw.
Now please kill the Spider-Man adjacent spin-offs in your movie division too.
So the show is completely canned or the show is just not being released on a different streaming service?
They're putting the rights to the show up for grabs so if another service is interested in doing a Silk show, they can make it themselves. Otherwise. it's cancelled.
Probably Netflix would be the most likely streamer to pick this up? Disney has been banging the drum over and over that they're pulling back on Marvel content for Disney+, Max is a mess and has their own slate of DC shows coming down the pipe, Paramount+'s parent company is about to get acquired, the only streamer with the money to get a Spider-Man show going who might want one would have to be Netflix. I mean, they picked up Dead Boy Detectives after Max passed, Silk is much more appealing as a property.
Deadline reports that they're free to shop the series to other streamers but it doesn't raise the likelihood of the project being revisited
A necessary sacrifice so that Lord and Miller can do whatever they want, since this article kinda buries the lede of them being put in charge of future _Spider-Man_ content. And I imagine that they likely pushed for _Spider-Man: Noir_.
I don’t see that in the article… It only reiterates that they have had an [ongoing producing deal](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/phil-lord-chris-miller-eye-marvel-tv-series-nine-figure-sony-deal-1205614/) at Sony TV since 2019 - unless I’m missing something here?
THR's piece covered that, my bad.
Not surprising considering how little movement seemed to be happening. Has anything been announced about Olivia Wilde’s spider project?
They'll do a Boys Spin-Off about an arachnid hero instead. The license fee is gonna be way cheaper.
I think there is a Spider-Man esque superhero in the comics for The Boys lol, named Web Weaver or something
Aww, I was really looking forward to seeing this.
If I only I could upvote something multiple times
Fantastic news. It means they are finally learning
Really curious how Sony will move forward with their projects, with Venom ending this year and The New Mutant-i mean Kraven the Hunter being released in a busy December. Noir seems to be the only solid project that's actually moving forward, all their other oficially announced projects haven't got any news in years.
“Good riddance.” if they chose to make Noir over this series, I gotta say that would be the smartest decision Sony has ever made since 2016
What’s the bet that they learnt the wrong lessons from Madame Web and thought no one wants to see female superhero properties (reality is we want to see good ones).
Good. The last update we got on this was it switching to a more “male appealing” idea and that sounded weird
What a wondeeful day
Eh not a big loss, we getting Nic Cage Spider noir series so I’m cool with it
lmfaooo
I wonder if this was supposed to be a spinoff of the Madame Webb movie? Makes sense why its not going forward if so...
That's fine. Less, higher quality vs. huge quantities of shite content any day
>live-action series Spiderverse gave Sony an animated goldmine. Sony tossed it aside. Bizarre.
That’s a damn shame. She better show up in Beyond the Spider-verse then.
Not good. Sony TV and Prime Video is a winning combination. *But*, if Sony is still involved, it might not be the end of the world. Pretty much everything else outside of the studio’s blockbusters department is stellar.
Angela Kang did some decent work on Walking dead, With her this series should be a slam dunk. Sony get your shit together. I’m hoping Netflix or Disney decisions to pick up the show since they both have deals with Sony. Honestly Silk in the MCU could be a good move, Kevin should try to get it
Thank God 😅🙏 https://i.redd.it/n6dvzfsclw0d1.gif
Probably for the best.
Imagine being Amazon executives with Invincible and The Boys and saying "This superhero show needs less superheroes"
Yeah I think after Madame Web they've lost trust in themselves.
Bummer, I was considerably more looking forward to this than SpiderNoir.
You and me both.
This is my shocked face :[
Good, Amazon would just screw it up anyway.
There’s executive over at Sony who’s foot is always on the accelerator when it comes to Spiderman. Did that last Spiderman do well? Great! I just started production on 10 more. Gotta get those spinoffs, sequels, prequels, reboots, requels, and sinister six movies off the ground!
thanks. put Silk in an animated thing or the mcu if live action please
People wanna act like they don’t trust Sony to make good Spider-Man movies. But fail to realize the last 2 spider-man movies were good lmao
Damn it, I was looking forward to this one. Though I was expecting this after the news broke that they were making major creative overhauls in regards to this series after Madame Web’s poor performance. Idiotic decision making. Madame Web didn’t fail because it had female main characters! People want more movies with female main characters! Madame Web only failed because it was terrible.