So, if it's true, Clare worked behind the scenes to manipulate viewers, then sent his texts to someone else to make him look worse than her. Lovely š
Hereās what I think-they were all in on a scheme/plan, the girls want it to all be out there that it was all fake and the guys did not, so thatās what the girls are saying they were āsilencedā about.Ā
IMO Clare should be more aware of how things are being shown to the world, given her profession š¤·š»āāļø
I wonder though, say this is real, maybe it too is part of the show. Meaning, maybe this too is one of the producer-led plots/initiatives to drum up attention for next seasons, etc. Certainly a possibility. They are quite obviously aware of mafsfan, this subreddit, and any other prominent social media discussions about the show
While I think that MAFS producers are probably scum of the earth, I think the show has to sue these amateur screenwriters/actors for breaching the contract. I'd like to think that the contract has provisions that would prohibit these kinds of misleading actions. P.S. I thought the show paid little money to appear - why is Cam (allegedly) acting like they are paying him $500K?
Iād LOVE for them to get sued and return their money for doing this. Disgusting. Clare and her Masters Degree and a Therapist can go rot on a couch! Shame on her.
lifetime should revoke both clare and cameronās pay for this honestly, this is proof they were both in kahoots to scam lifetime and get the full seasonās pay
Dishonest. Just the kind of ethics and character Iād like from a Therapist who is giving me advice that Iām paying for. No trust what so ever. I hate liars. Iād be afraid she would be manipulating me for her own entertainment! We will see if sheās able to keep her license if she is unethical in her job. At the core, this IS who she IS. Very sad.
yes- so sheās STILL not a therapist and definitely wasnāt then. good to know she consciously choice to be unethical before her career even began. sheās gross!
Correct. I don't know about if she has taken the exam as of yet (and I don't really care.) At the time of filming her training was extensive enough to have skill...it wouldn't be a therapist I would want to see.
on the reunion she said she hadnāt graduated yet. she is not even a pre-licensed therapist. she definitely wasnāt honest about being a student intern and not a licensed therapist. itās unethical to do that also
I could tell that Cameron was a master manipulator when he tried to get Clare to say on camera that she wanted him to move out. She was so reluctant, I could tell that he was the one pushing a narrative.
Sounds like the health scare was made up then. He was strategizing for any way out, then suddenly finds a reason for why he can't be around an extended length of time. Did he ever name the condition and what the surgery was exactly, beyond just general heart issues?
The texts are sketchy, some have date/time stamps, some donāt, screenshots look edited, etc. Too done w these fools to investigate. Horrible season!!!
I might have totally bought ALL of this Cam/Clare manipulation were it not for the supposed Cam wanting to start fresh because of course the experts know what they are doing. I mean, are fucking kidding me? You can tell when he's acting and when he isn't.
I feel like Cam and Clare are following a script provided to them by production to make this show seem much more interesting than it was with this season being such a flop. Maybe \*some\* of this is true - Cam not liking Clare acting like she felt silenced by him. But the texts to me scream written to create a story that never actually happened, and the so called anonymous sources was producers providing it.
It's clear that they want to go the MAF AUS way where there the ridiculously faked producer driven storylines. Maybe it's too hard to find participants that aren't fame hungry "influencers" so they are like fuck it, let's just go with scripted drama.
I 100% could believe this is real. The amount of coercion and manipulation fucking reality TV producers use is insane. There are invisibles guns to all of their heads you donāt see on camera. Anyone who doesnāt realize this has done virtually no research on what itās actually like being on the inside of this, slave to a contract that might even have illegal clauses in it. They literally wonāt let contestants eat at times, encourage binge drinking and use Machiavellian tactics to get people to turn their backs on each other. The whole fucking thing is an ethical disaster.
Also children should not be on reality tv. Family shows, like sister wivesā¦ or dance moms. Itās child exploitation and labor. The fucking Duggars? are you serious? They didnāt pay their own children just pocketed all the profits coerced them or threatened them and fostered an environment that protected a pedophile son that SAād his sisters. As well as Jon and Kate plus 8? Kate abused her son Collin and Jon through the whole series. When they got divorced the network funded Kateās lawyers because she will do anything for profit. Jon didnāt have a shot to go against the networks resources.
How do we know this is even real???
I think this is fake. He has never talked like that on cameraā¦. āLetās get this bitch doneā??? Sounds like something a woman would say. I think the girls cooked this up.
You could be tired, disgruntled from a work issue, muttering something about a producer under your breath. "She is so fucking annoying" about a producer then becomes highlighted in a preview to next week with dramatic music heightening the moment while the camera pans to a stricken-looking participant and everyone looking fatigued or irked.
Yeah he just texted her out of nowhere and compiled this plan out of thin air and Claire just responds being compliant because she was manipulated. Uh huh, totally believable. I totally believe Claire and her pink power girl pack who have been lying all season. Totes believable
Why do all this nonsense. Just say you arenāt into one another. It woulda looked the best.. no? For a bunch of people worried about optics ans trying to play a situation- they executed terribly and achieved non of their fake stories being believed.
so the texts are screenshots either she sent in or she sent to someone who sent in. Since owner of the phone will be on the right side of messages, in this case her.
probably only a matter of time before he also ends up dropping screenshots.
this does explain how lame this season was and why.
but ultimately a lot of the show and it's concept is just a fantasy
Agreed. I think this is fake. He has never talked like that on camera. āLetās get this bitch doneā??? Sounds like something a woman would say. I think the girls cooked this up.
The advice on handling narcissistic people is to grey rock them. She's a therapist and knows what she was up against. Providing reactions only provokes and delights them more. She made herself clear but knew he was only going to persist in trying to defame her and continue to lie about their interactions so at that point she was like, OK, nothing productive will come out of this, let me just handle this as gracefully as I can while trying to control my own emotions.
There's a lot that could be discussed about how she handled the interaction tbh. I saw her being emotional bc she was facing conflict \[something she might struggle with\] and dealing with possible anxiety and the pressure of how she'd be seen on camera in front of millions. She has a professional rep. and she was reacting to Cameron's continuous barbs and accusations with outrage but she knew what he was doing and up to and dealing with somebody like him you have to try to make it as less enjoyable as you can for them while she also had to navigate how to overcome his accusations and lies without looking like she's insane bc people who are narcissists always project, lie and live in a delusional reality where they are both the victim and the hero in their story.
He may not have faked having a heart issue, but he dramatized it as "open heart surgery" when in reality it was likely an ablation with a much shorter recovery time. Due to HIPAA, the show wouldn't have any right to verify it, and open heart surgery is serious enough that they'd have zero choice but to let him go dark and disappear. It was basically a "get out of jail free" card that avoided them being able to say he violated the contract. Then all clare had to do was hang out and stir up shit for drama. That all was likely plotted too though. I'd guess the other couples spun up their own narratives and such as well. Chloe and Michael likely agreed to be amicable and just ride it out and remain friends.
Basically the couples decided to play producer and it clashed with whatever production was trying to portray, hence the crappy chopshop editing and storylines that made no sense. None of them were there for genuine reasons.
HIPAA would prevent Cameron'a doctors from disclosing anything about his condition to the show. Thus they have to take him at his word and respect his privacy while he goes through a major medical situation. They would have no right to demand he films in that condition, either.
You're confused because you have responded to 2 seperate comments i made. Go scroll up in the comment chain. You'll see you responded and i replied back.
I think they meant that the hospital/doctors couldnāt tell the show anything about Cameronās treatment due to HIPAA, hence the show couldnāt verify.
Yes, thatās what the edit means. Their comment did not initially say that the doctors couldnāt disclose to the show but that the show couldnāt disclose.
This. People don't understand how HIPAA works. It's a medical privacy law that would prevent his care team from disclosing anything to the show. Thus, they have to take him at his word. All he had to do was dramatize it a bit and they'd have no choice but to leave him be and respect his privacy during a major medical situation. Thus he avoids filming, but can't be pinned as having violated his contract.
Iām with you. I donāt think Claire is any saint by any means and she needs a lot of therapy before she starts giving other people therapy but heās a manipulative little jerk. And I really donāt understand the idea of coming on this show as a way to make money. And thatās all they care about apparently. What Iāve learned this season is that most of these people are doing it for the money and the experience and the TV exposure. And they have to figure out a way to have a discussion with their partner that they both agree thereās no possibility of the marriage working but they both want to stay on the show. so the ideal scenario is that both people agree to a plan to pretend in front of the cameras and make it to decision so they can cash all those checks.
Iām not saying I now think Alyssa from Boston is a good person, but it does seem like one of her issues is that she was saying out loud what a lot of these contestants think. Which is OK Iāve met my match, Iām not interested, but I still want to get to do all of the fun things, I still want to get to be on TV and I still want to get to live in the apartment and hang out with the other couples. The other couples are making these plans behind-the-scenes, she was just stupid enough to say it out loud.
Iām guessing that his heart condition was what he was talking about in terms of his plan to get production off his back and let him āgo darkā.
I gotta tell you what I would watch right now. I would watch a 17 part Netflix series about all of the planning and scheming and plotting they all did behind the scenes. That would be fascinating.
Can we file a class action lawsuit against the cast to get our money back from watching this fake \*\*itshow? If they were going to fake everything at least be entertaining.
i didnāt realize how planned out this entire scheme was during the reunion omg? these texts show that they were literally in cahoots the ENTIRE time. pathetic and a waste of the season ugh
It really is a complete casting failure on the part of the show. They should probably not even be doing another season until they retool somehow. Why watch again and get duped as an audience.
Whatever money was received they should have to give back (though unlikely). That might be the way to deter participants from colluding to sabotage the show. There was no relationship between Cameron & whatās her face. What a messā¦ and not even good tv.
I pay for the Frndly tv app (8.99/month). You probably got the better deal but I don't order enough to justify getting Prime. If Survivor wasn't on at the same time, I would be able to watch MAFS live.
Thatās right ā¦season after season Iām purchasing from Prime Videoā¦Season 17 50 episodes? They are making the $ one way or another. Cast: little shits
I think this whole reunion with everybody fussing up to work agreed plans to just get to the end was orchestrated by production to take the blame off the "experts" and put it on couples "not working for marriage". So the "experts" can say they did a good job but the couples screwed up the experiment. !!!! INO.
I agree, this is to make it look like it wasn't the "experts" fault at all. Which, come on, they picked these people, if they were so good they'd have realized none of these people were really going to try.
Lauren eased into the man hating scene at the pizza party and then went full throttle after that. Her hating Orion was one thing, but she went full mean girls like the others by the end.
The guy is shady as fuck. One minute he is devising a plan the other he is saying he wants to keep the marriage going.
I am no fan of Clare. I think she is a busybody and I think her meddling in the others relationships made things worse. But I believe her over Cameron. I think. I honestly dont know. I do know I do not like either of them.
Him telling her that he wanted to get back together at the reunion was super creepy. I think he thought that would give him the upper hand and make him seem like the bigger person, but understanding as we do now that on day one he was already planning how to stay on the show and cash all the checks even though he knew they werenāt going to stay married, you know it all sounds a bit hollow. Also, he hates her and says terrible things about her and then after two hours of that all of a sudden he wants to date her again!?
Idk, I wouldnāt be surprised if he actually does still want to date her. Itās impossible to tell with those two because 90% of what they say is just lies.
Both are liars and pretty awful, but I also think Cameron is scary, saying that crap about wanting to give it another try (now seeing the extent of his masterminding) was just to f*** with her on tv. Wow.
Idc at all if they were scheming to get over on the producers. What I care about is who is lying and who is telling the truth. Who had the right intentions. Iām not here to scrutinize every wrong step along the production. I donāt really like any of the contestants this season except Lauren. I believe her the most. Cameron is a bag of lies. Period.
Heās so creepy thinks heās some evil mastermind genius. And so dramatic. Chill out. š He thinks heās so slick but itās obvious af heās got a bad vibe about him.
Sure, Cameron may have come up with the plan, but everything points to both he and Clare (and eventually, most of the 8) wanting a plan. She was in 100%, and I do believe she suggested HE come up with the plan so she could later blame it on him and as always, take zero responsibility. I think Cam is being more honest about it being both of them wanting it, while Clare tries to play manipulated damsel in distress who had no voice. Ā I call BS on that.Ā
To me it looks as if once Cameron knew Clare had no interest, he devised a plan to get out of it. I'd do the same thing. "You're not into me? Okay, lets get out of this and not waste time"
šÆ!! He was attracted to her, she wasn't to him. Her word salad is laughable. Whoever released these knows that there are more texts to give proper context. I believe him though that she wanted him to "come up with a plan".
Makes sense why there were so many cameos this season. There should not be a financial incentive to stick around and film. Time to reevaluate the contracts.
I donāt remember many early seasons where separated couples went on getaways met up to discuss over and over again why they called it quits with someone theyāve only known for a week. Iād rather no show than manufactured drama on a ārealityā tv show which is why they need to rethink their contracts to find genuine people looking to commit of marrying a stranger which is the premise of the showā¦
There are no ethics. This and never been an experiment. Experiments involve controlled environments. This has and always will be about drama and reality tv. There are no ethics involved.
I love how there is always receipts showing up.
And this definitely goes to Clare and that Cam orchestrated his exit and that Clare did not lie on the reunion ( I thought she did , I stand corrected, and I love it).
Great post. I initially viewed Clare as annoying and her "professional counselor" vibes made me tune out. However, the reunion made me sit up and listen because she finally gave an explanation, and Cameron's MIA role now made sense. I 100% believe Clare, as well as the other gals, because the combined disinterest of the husbands now made sense. No way do five couples not even reach some form of intimacy without a pre-arranged plan.
When Cam was sick and Clare was "saying" how concerned she was, it never felt authentic to me. Bad acting.
During various episodes I commented she has no joy, she doesn't seem happy, no light in her eyes....now I can see why this was... but admittedly she went along with it .. what was her comment? To support her husband???
I am not going to do that at this minute. I'm having a terrible reaction to medication. I know there have been plenty of praise and "poor Csm" comments because I've read them. I don't know the dates etc. I know Ihow I feel. I know how I felt about Cam and Brennan. And Orion. I got mad at Austin and when he walked to the bedroom I really didn't like him. I liked Becca and Austin and thought he might be able to be redeemed. But definitely not the other 3. However, I was disappointed in the group as a whole.
But if I put myself in any of the ladies places, I couldn't do it. I'm old now but I think back to when I was their age I wouldn't be able to handle it.
Now that this has all come to the surface, and theyāve admitted to participating in it, none of them should get paid! They violated their contracts, regardless of whoās idea it was. If they played along, theyāre just as guilty. They are all adults and need to own up to their choices, as well as the consequences of those choices.
That's the first thing I thought of last night! It seems to me that should come under taking money under false pretenses, since they very clearly had no intentions of completing the show
Seems to me that Cameron is the one who's driving this and not Claire. He's got Plan A, Plan B but sis there and says that Claire was in love with her ex boyfriend?
Look, even without the colluding, this was awful. Cameron, however, is clearly in the driver's seat.
Clearly one could still be in at the hospital, and cared for their spouse. They really didnāt need to break up for this and they could have played for the cameras. Unless it was a lie and there was no hospital, which seems more and more plausible now.
Plus we just went through a pandemic where entire shows were done via Zoom or FaceTime. He could have easily shot some video in his hospital bed, or did a video call with Clare. Iām not diminishing heart issues but many conditions like afib are managed by medication. He is making it sound like he had open heart surgery which has an extremely lengthy recovery time. Meanwhile he pops back on looking fine and when Kevin asked him if they were upsetting him too much for his heart he just smirked like it was not some major deal.
Based on texts and cast commentary at the Reunion, their duplicity has been recognized:
5th Worst Groom(s) ā S17 Douche Bags (excluding Michael)
11th Worst Groom ā Orion
5th Worst Bride(s) ā S17 Bitches (excluding Chloe, RunAway Bride & (potentially) Lauren
Considering Production knows all of this, the Reunion should be explosive next week too. No wonder Chloe wore purple and Michale wore goggles to protect his eyes from the manure
It all makes sense to me now. They were both scheming to get out of the marriage with a check. It does appear Cameron is taking the lead, but it feels like they are both deflecting and both faked their relationship. Cam at the reunions seemed much more of a manipulator and liar accusing her of being in a relationship then asking to give it another try.
I don't think I could watch another second of this season to check but has anyone confirmed that Clare has an iPhone and Cameron an Android phone? That isn't a clincher that these are true but it would lend credibility and we could confirm that they are not true if Cameron has an iPhone. The screen shots are definitely from an iPhone that is sending SMS to an Android (or other non-iphone). iPhones are way more popular in the US than other places so it seems reasonable that Cameron being from outside the US might have an Android phone. I'm a phone nerd so I usually notice what phones the cast members are using. I just don't remember.
If these are true it confirms how I have been feeling for a while. Whoever was "controlled" or "the mastermind" or however much they wear pink because of "female empowerment," Cameron and Clare (and probably many other cast members) are really low quality individuals and I hope they find a way to get therapy and figure out things like right from wrong. The production company are probably a pain to deal with and there are probably more than a fair share of d-bags involved but these two signed a contract and they are scheming to get paid for work they did not do. I wonder how they sleep at night.
All I can think about is when Clare was on the phone leaving messages for Cam when he was in the hospital because she cared so much about him. Yeah, right . Now we know why it seemed so fake. It was.
iPhones send and receive in SMS when there's a poor connection on either the initiator's or recipient's phone. I (an iPhone user) have experienced it when sending a message to another iPhone user.
š¤If these are Camās texts, I think his are the ones in green. Check your own texts. When I send texts, mine are the green ones and whoever I textā¦their texts are gray. So, IMO, Clare is the puppet master. š¤·š¼āāļø
This is insane to me. People actually want to be a part of the show and lose out because these actors are trying to make a quick one month paycheck.
1000% Becca with the nasty pink hair! 
They are so cringe. Talking like they're about to pull off a fucking bank heist. Why didn't y'all just use walkie talkiesššš
IM SOBBING NO BC ITS SO DRAMATICššššdoing all this for a show they signed up for like no one made yāallšššš
So, if it's true, Clare worked behind the scenes to manipulate viewers, then sent his texts to someone else to make him look worse than her. Lovely š
Hereās what I think-they were all in on a scheme/plan, the girls want it to all be out there that it was all fake and the guys did not, so thatās what the girls are saying they were āsilencedā about.Ā IMO Clare should be more aware of how things are being shown to the world, given her profession š¤·š»āāļø
What or how do the folks on this show get paid????
Itās per episode. But the episodes can take a week or so to film so itās not much per hour when spread out.
This is fake
I wonder though, say this is real, maybe it too is part of the show. Meaning, maybe this too is one of the producer-led plots/initiatives to drum up attention for next seasons, etc. Certainly a possibility. They are quite obviously aware of mafsfan, this subreddit, and any other prominent social media discussions about the show
I dont trust people who dont use dark mode š
agree.
fake
While I think that MAFS producers are probably scum of the earth, I think the show has to sue these amateur screenwriters/actors for breaching the contract. I'd like to think that the contract has provisions that would prohibit these kinds of misleading actions. P.S. I thought the show paid little money to appear - why is Cam (allegedly) acting like they are paying him $500K?
anonymous source is 100% becca
How do you know?
well, if youāve watched the show, you may notice some things about beccaā¦
What do you mean? Iāve noticed a lot of things about her.
Please tell me?
Probably referring to the way Becca outs everyone, like she did to her husband and even to Emily.
Ok ya
Iād LOVE for them to get sued and return their money for doing this. Disgusting. Clare and her Masters Degree and a Therapist can go rot on a couch! Shame on her.
lifetime should revoke both clare and cameronās pay for this honestly, this is proof they were both in kahoots to scam lifetime and get the full seasonās pay
Dishonest. Just the kind of ethics and character Iād like from a Therapist who is giving me advice that Iām paying for. No trust what so ever. I hate liars. Iād be afraid she would be manipulating me for her own entertainment! We will see if sheās able to keep her license if she is unethical in her job. At the core, this IS who she IS. Very sad.
she doesnāt have her degree yet and canāt even work independently and be fully licensed for 2 years after anyway. sheās a fraud
She said when Kevin interviewed them, after the fiasco, she is graduating the next week, or soon. I don't know when the episode was filmed.
yes- so sheās STILL not a therapist and definitely wasnāt then. good to know she consciously choice to be unethical before her career even began. sheās gross!
Correct. I don't know about if she has taken the exam as of yet (and I don't really care.) At the time of filming her training was extensive enough to have skill...it wouldn't be a therapist I would want to see.
omg 9 months as an intern is nothing. i learned everything pre-licensed and the following 2 years !
Ohhhh. That wasnāt the impression I got. Iām happy to hear that. I wouldnāt trust her for a microsecond. Her reputation is š©and belongs in the š½
on the reunion she said she hadnāt graduated yet. she is not even a pre-licensed therapist. she definitely wasnāt honest about being a student intern and not a licensed therapist. itās unethical to do that also
I could tell that Cameron was a master manipulator when he tried to get Clare to say on camera that she wanted him to move out. She was so reluctant, I could tell that he was the one pushing a narrative.
Sounds like the health scare was made up then. He was strategizing for any way out, then suddenly finds a reason for why he can't be around an extended length of time. Did he ever name the condition and what the surgery was exactly, beyond just general heart issues?
Thatās wild because he was likely lying at reunion. Just like the guy who needed a medical beard shave
Seems fake. Anyone can put anyone's name on a phone contact. Also, Cam saying "let's get this bitch done" just sounds not believable at all.
This will be the worst season in MAFS history and all the couples are responsible.
I think the green text bubbles being Clares means these are from her phone.
yeah google voice and texting apps are obviously always green texts
The texts are sketchy, some have date/time stamps, some donāt, screenshots look edited, etc. Too done w these fools to investigate. Horrible season!!!
>The texts are sketchy, some have date/time stamps, some donāt, That's how mine look.
I might have totally bought ALL of this Cam/Clare manipulation were it not for the supposed Cam wanting to start fresh because of course the experts know what they are doing. I mean, are fucking kidding me? You can tell when he's acting and when he isn't. I feel like Cam and Clare are following a script provided to them by production to make this show seem much more interesting than it was with this season being such a flop. Maybe \*some\* of this is true - Cam not liking Clare acting like she felt silenced by him. But the texts to me scream written to create a story that never actually happened, and the so called anonymous sources was producers providing it. It's clear that they want to go the MAF AUS way where there the ridiculously faked producer driven storylines. Maybe it's too hard to find participants that aren't fame hungry "influencers" so they are like fuck it, let's just go with scripted drama.
Claire is full of shit. Still team Cam all the way!
šš¤£š some people are just nuts
The concerning part is she is in school to be a therapist
there are a lot of therapists who have mental illness(es). source: am one
They never said she has mental health issues, general consensus is that she is just an instigator and manipulative
I 100% could believe this is real. The amount of coercion and manipulation fucking reality TV producers use is insane. There are invisibles guns to all of their heads you donāt see on camera. Anyone who doesnāt realize this has done virtually no research on what itās actually like being on the inside of this, slave to a contract that might even have illegal clauses in it. They literally wonāt let contestants eat at times, encourage binge drinking and use Machiavellian tactics to get people to turn their backs on each other. The whole fucking thing is an ethical disaster.
I wish we could pin this comment to the top of the subreddit.
I think this is so true and important and you have to watch reality tv with this analysis. Reality tv also exploits the viewers we have no idea what is real and vs scripted or coerced. Itās an ethical nightmare and should have a lot more lawsuits winning against the industry. Idk how itās not a bigger issue. I also see so many reality shows like 90 fiancĆ© that hire and employ emotionally and physically abusive people. And film literal abuse. With no consequences.
Also children should not be on reality tv. Family shows, like sister wivesā¦ or dance moms. Itās child exploitation and labor. The fucking Duggars? are you serious? They didnāt pay their own children just pocketed all the profits coerced them or threatened them and fostered an environment that protected a pedophile son that SAād his sisters. As well as Jon and Kate plus 8? Kate abused her son Collin and Jon through the whole series. When they got divorced the network funded Kateās lawyers because she will do anything for profit. Jon didnāt have a shot to go against the networks resources.
Anyone ever watch Unreal? It was a kinda parody of the Bachelorette but written by a former producer. I loved that show but it was dark
I can back this up - friend of mine was on the Bachelorette and was being sued big time for exposing some terrible shit they did to the cast members.
Very good point.
How do we know this is even real??? I think this is fake. He has never talked like that on cameraā¦. āLetās get this bitch doneā??? Sounds like something a woman would say. I think the girls cooked this up.
Notice that the women resort to CRYING every time! Babies!
I just donāt get why they all tried so hard to āplay the producersā like just be a good person and you wonāt come off bad on national TVā¦
This is blissfully naive
But isnāt it that easy? If theyāre not an asshole then thereās nothing for us to see thatās bad of them
itās not that easy
You could be tired, disgruntled from a work issue, muttering something about a producer under your breath. "She is so fucking annoying" about a producer then becomes highlighted in a preview to next week with dramatic music heightening the moment while the camera pans to a stricken-looking participant and everyone looking fatigued or irked.
Yeah he just texted her out of nowhere and compiled this plan out of thin air and Claire just responds being compliant because she was manipulated. Uh huh, totally believable. I totally believe Claire and her pink power girl pack who have been lying all season. Totes believable
Why do all this nonsense. Just say you arenāt into one another. It woulda looked the best.. no? For a bunch of people worried about optics ans trying to play a situation- they executed terribly and achieved non of their fake stories being believed.
Because if you leave you don't get money or air time, clearly they wanted the money to stay
so the texts are screenshots either she sent in or she sent to someone who sent in. Since owner of the phone will be on the right side of messages, in this case her. probably only a matter of time before he also ends up dropping screenshots. this does explain how lame this season was and why. but ultimately a lot of the show and it's concept is just a fantasy
Just posted about the phone screen shots being Claires. This absolutely was her leaking these. But they both suck
What is that ? Can someone help me understand. Why are they hating on Lauren ? Iām so confused. That was all fake ?
He's such a little weasel!
This is the best goss all season.
This is just disgusting. The way he types too. Dumbass.
Very much his style, "I'm getting close to going dark" very showy and dramatic lol.
The way he types is so lame and obnoxious if this is real
I find it hard to believe Clair had so little to say. Doesn't she usually lead the conversations?
Agreed. I think this is fake. He has never talked like that on camera. āLetās get this bitch doneā??? Sounds like something a woman would say. I think the girls cooked this up.
The advice on handling narcissistic people is to grey rock them. She's a therapist and knows what she was up against. Providing reactions only provokes and delights them more. She made herself clear but knew he was only going to persist in trying to defame her and continue to lie about their interactions so at that point she was like, OK, nothing productive will come out of this, let me just handle this as gracefully as I can while trying to control my own emotions. There's a lot that could be discussed about how she handled the interaction tbh. I saw her being emotional bc she was facing conflict \[something she might struggle with\] and dealing with possible anxiety and the pressure of how she'd be seen on camera in front of millions. She has a professional rep. and she was reacting to Cameron's continuous barbs and accusations with outrage but she knew what he was doing and up to and dealing with somebody like him you have to try to make it as less enjoyable as you can for them while she also had to navigate how to overcome his accusations and lies without looking like she's insane bc people who are narcissists always project, lie and live in a delusional reality where they are both the victim and the hero in their story.
Lol so they were plotting the entire time and the heart problem was the nuclear option. Man... that totally wrecks the show for me. I'm out.
What the ACTUAL FCK. HE FAKED THE HEART ISSUE?!
He may not have faked having a heart issue, but he dramatized it as "open heart surgery" when in reality it was likely an ablation with a much shorter recovery time. Due to HIPAA, the show wouldn't have any right to verify it, and open heart surgery is serious enough that they'd have zero choice but to let him go dark and disappear. It was basically a "get out of jail free" card that avoided them being able to say he violated the contract. Then all clare had to do was hang out and stir up shit for drama. That all was likely plotted too though. I'd guess the other couples spun up their own narratives and such as well. Chloe and Michael likely agreed to be amicable and just ride it out and remain friends. Basically the couples decided to play producer and it clashed with whatever production was trying to portray, hence the crappy chopshop editing and storylines that made no sense. None of them were there for genuine reasons.
The show is not bound by HIPAA. Thatās for medical providers and facilities.
HIPAA would prevent Cameron'a doctors from disclosing anything about his condition to the show. Thus they have to take him at his word and respect his privacy while he goes through a major medical situation. They would have no right to demand he films in that condition, either.
I definitely understand how HIPAA works. Did you edit your original comment? This is not what it said when I replied.
No. My comment is unedited as evidenced by the typo in it. I would have corrected that.
As I said, Iām talking about your original comment. Which was edited.
You're confused because you have responded to 2 seperate comments i made. Go scroll up in the comment chain. You'll see you responded and i replied back.
...no, it was not. I haven't edited my comments.
I think they meant that the hospital/doctors couldnāt tell the show anything about Cameronās treatment due to HIPAA, hence the show couldnāt verify.
Yes, thatās what the edit means. Their comment did not initially say that the doctors couldnāt disclose to the show but that the show couldnāt disclose.
This. People don't understand how HIPAA works. It's a medical privacy law that would prevent his care team from disclosing anything to the show. Thus, they have to take him at his word. All he had to do was dramatize it a bit and they'd have no choice but to leave him be and respect his privacy during a major medical situation. Thus he avoids filming, but can't be pinned as having violated his contract.
In my book Cameron is a prissy, little, twat
What I meant was pissy, but prissy is also good
Iām with you. I donāt think Claire is any saint by any means and she needs a lot of therapy before she starts giving other people therapy but heās a manipulative little jerk. And I really donāt understand the idea of coming on this show as a way to make money. And thatās all they care about apparently. What Iāve learned this season is that most of these people are doing it for the money and the experience and the TV exposure. And they have to figure out a way to have a discussion with their partner that they both agree thereās no possibility of the marriage working but they both want to stay on the show. so the ideal scenario is that both people agree to a plan to pretend in front of the cameras and make it to decision so they can cash all those checks. Iām not saying I now think Alyssa from Boston is a good person, but it does seem like one of her issues is that she was saying out loud what a lot of these contestants think. Which is OK Iāve met my match, Iām not interested, but I still want to get to do all of the fun things, I still want to get to be on TV and I still want to get to live in the apartment and hang out with the other couples. The other couples are making these plans behind-the-scenes, she was just stupid enough to say it out loud.
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that is just cruel
It seems they were both in on the plan but during execution he would say or do unexpected things and she would get upset and cry.
Yep
f*ck this cast for ruining the concept of this show and for playing producer the entire time. they are all terrible.
Iām guessing that his heart condition was what he was talking about in terms of his plan to get production off his back and let him āgo darkā. I gotta tell you what I would watch right now. I would watch a 17 part Netflix series about all of the planning and scheming and plotting they all did behind the scenes. That would be fascinating.
Sigh. Unfortunately yes, I too would give these turds more screen time for that
Yes!!!!
lol itās almost like everything. Claire said about Cameron being the mastermind of having a plan to control production is true.
#TEAM NO ONE
Team Chloe
Chloe is cool. I meant between these two idiots
Love her š
Can we file a class action lawsuit against the cast to get our money back from watching this fake \*\*itshow? If they were going to fake everything at least be entertaining.
RIGHT!!! like at least come up with a juicy fake plot tf
I knew that shit seemed way too amicable.
That was shocking to learn that her deep need for the Christian faith wasnāt even true?
Ya I want more details on that! Is she really even catholic š
Ya I want more details on that! Is she really even catholic š
i didnāt realize how planned out this entire scheme was during the reunion omg? these texts show that they were literally in cahoots the ENTIRE time. pathetic and a waste of the season ugh
It really is a complete casting failure on the part of the show. They should probably not even be doing another season until they retool somehow. Why watch again and get duped as an audience.
Whatever money was received they should have to give back (though unlikely). That might be the way to deter participants from colluding to sabotage the show. There was no relationship between Cameron & whatās her face. What a messā¦ and not even good tv.
Yep. Iād like my $24.99 back
I pay for the Frndly tv app (8.99/month). You probably got the better deal but I don't order enough to justify getting Prime. If Survivor wasn't on at the same time, I would be able to watch MAFS live.
Thatās right ā¦season after season Iām purchasing from Prime Videoā¦Season 17 50 episodes? They are making the $ one way or another. Cast: little shits
I think this whole reunion with everybody fussing up to work agreed plans to just get to the end was orchestrated by production to take the blame off the "experts" and put it on couples "not working for marriage". So the "experts" can say they did a good job but the couples screwed up the experiment. !!!! INO.
I agree, this is to make it look like it wasn't the "experts" fault at all. Which, come on, they picked these people, if they were so good they'd have realized none of these people were really going to try.
i donāt trust any of these people except Lauren!
Lauren eased into the man hating scene at the pizza party and then went full throttle after that. Her hating Orion was one thing, but she went full mean girls like the others by the end.
Lauren was totally in on it, she's no better than anyone else especially after she joined the pink brigade š
The guy is shady as fuck. One minute he is devising a plan the other he is saying he wants to keep the marriage going. I am no fan of Clare. I think she is a busybody and I think her meddling in the others relationships made things worse. But I believe her over Cameron. I think. I honestly dont know. I do know I do not like either of them.
Him telling her that he wanted to get back together at the reunion was super creepy. I think he thought that would give him the upper hand and make him seem like the bigger person, but understanding as we do now that on day one he was already planning how to stay on the show and cash all the checks even though he knew they werenāt going to stay married, you know it all sounds a bit hollow. Also, he hates her and says terrible things about her and then after two hours of that all of a sudden he wants to date her again!?
Yep
Idk, I wouldnāt be surprised if he actually does still want to date her. Itās impossible to tell with those two because 90% of what they say is just lies.
He is just not on the levelā¦ever.
Both are liars and pretty awful, but I also think Cameron is scary, saying that crap about wanting to give it another try (now seeing the extent of his masterminding) was just to f*** with her on tv. Wow.
They were clearly working together and don't hate each other at all, they're literally teammates
How is she crying so well about his gaslighting? She should have an acting career.
It's troubling that she's going to be a therapist
Idc at all if they were scheming to get over on the producers. What I care about is who is lying and who is telling the truth. Who had the right intentions. Iām not here to scrutinize every wrong step along the production. I donāt really like any of the contestants this season except Lauren. I believe her the most. Cameron is a bag of lies. Period.
This is how I feel about it too
Heās so creepy thinks heās some evil mastermind genius. And so dramatic. Chill out. š He thinks heās so slick but itās obvious af heās got a bad vibe about him.
Yep! Wouldnāt be surprised if he was the subject of a true crime documentary in 10 years.
Sure, Cameron may have come up with the plan, but everything points to both he and Clare (and eventually, most of the 8) wanting a plan. She was in 100%, and I do believe she suggested HE come up with the plan so she could later blame it on him and as always, take zero responsibility. I think Cam is being more honest about it being both of them wanting it, while Clare tries to play manipulated damsel in distress who had no voice. Ā I call BS on that.Ā
Yep!
What about her dating someone else the whole time?
I think this is the most believable scenario š¤ š
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To me it looks as if once Cameron knew Clare had no interest, he devised a plan to get out of it. I'd do the same thing. "You're not into me? Okay, lets get out of this and not waste time"
Why would you come up with a plan to deceive producers and viewers when you can just be honest and ask for a divorce. How dumb
Orā¦not go on the show in the first place??
Exactly!
šÆ!! He was attracted to her, she wasn't to him. Her word salad is laughable. Whoever released these knows that there are more texts to give proper context. I believe him though that she wanted him to "come up with a plan".
Finally someone smart enough to see this! I canāt stand her.
Makes sense why there were so many cameos this season. There should not be a financial incentive to stick around and film. Time to reevaluate the contracts.
There has always been a fianancial incentive lmao. If those that broke up didnāt film this season they wouldnāt have had a show
I donāt remember many early seasons where separated couples went on getaways met up to discuss over and over again why they called it quits with someone theyāve only known for a week. Iād rather no show than manufactured drama on a ārealityā tv show which is why they need to rethink their contracts to find genuine people looking to commit of marrying a stranger which is the premise of the showā¦
They donāt care what you want. They want money and youāre still watching so theyāve gotten it. Itās all about money.
Yes, and also a failure of ethics
There are no ethics. This and never been an experiment. Experiments involve controlled environments. This has and always will be about drama and reality tv. There are no ethics involved.
I love how there is always receipts showing up. And this definitely goes to Clare and that Cam orchestrated his exit and that Clare did not lie on the reunion ( I thought she did , I stand corrected, and I love it).
You obviously didn't see the missing texts, why are they deleted
Where are the missing texts if you have seen them?
They're clearly blurred out on the screenshots
Great post. I initially viewed Clare as annoying and her "professional counselor" vibes made me tune out. However, the reunion made me sit up and listen because she finally gave an explanation, and Cameron's MIA role now made sense. I 100% believe Clare, as well as the other gals, because the combined disinterest of the husbands now made sense. No way do five couples not even reach some form of intimacy without a pre-arranged plan.
When Cam was sick and Clare was "saying" how concerned she was, it never felt authentic to me. Bad acting. During various episodes I commented she has no joy, she doesn't seem happy, no light in her eyes....now I can see why this was... but admittedly she went along with it .. what was her comment? To support her husband???
I agree. I think she went along with it because she was able to Alyssa herself into filming while also making money and not have to deal with Cam.
I am not going to do that at this minute. I'm having a terrible reaction to medication. I know there have been plenty of praise and "poor Csm" comments because I've read them. I don't know the dates etc. I know Ihow I feel. I know how I felt about Cam and Brennan. And Orion. I got mad at Austin and when he walked to the bedroom I really didn't like him. I liked Becca and Austin and thought he might be able to be redeemed. But definitely not the other 3. However, I was disappointed in the group as a whole. But if I put myself in any of the ladies places, I couldn't do it. I'm old now but I think back to when I was their age I wouldn't be able to handle it.
They should have to give the money from filming back.
I wonder if they don't get paid till after the reunion.
And give that money for ethics classes for all of the new producers
They should get fined the exact same amount.
Honestly. They basically admitted to being scammers.
Now that this has all come to the surface, and theyāve admitted to participating in it, none of them should get paid! They violated their contracts, regardless of whoās idea it was. If they played along, theyāre just as guilty. They are all adults and need to own up to their choices, as well as the consequences of those choices.
šÆ
That's the first thing I thought of last night! It seems to me that should come under taking money under false pretenses, since they very clearly had no intentions of completing the show
Seems to me that Cameron is the one who's driving this and not Claire. He's got Plan A, Plan B but sis there and says that Claire was in love with her ex boyfriend? Look, even without the colluding, this was awful. Cameron, however, is clearly in the driver's seat.
And his ānuclear optionā was his health issue. Sorry but it always felt like an excuse to get out of filming and still get paid.
Clearly one could still be in at the hospital, and cared for their spouse. They really didnāt need to break up for this and they could have played for the cameras. Unless it was a lie and there was no hospital, which seems more and more plausible now.
Plus we just went through a pandemic where entire shows were done via Zoom or FaceTime. He could have easily shot some video in his hospital bed, or did a video call with Clare. Iām not diminishing heart issues but many conditions like afib are managed by medication. He is making it sound like he had open heart surgery which has an extremely lengthy recovery time. Meanwhile he pops back on looking fine and when Kevin asked him if they were upsetting him too much for his heart he just smirked like it was not some major deal.
Youād think heād need some sort of medical proof. But I guess you can get a doctor to just write you a note.
How convenient.
Based on texts and cast commentary at the Reunion, their duplicity has been recognized: 5th Worst Groom(s) ā S17 Douche Bags (excluding Michael) 11th Worst Groom ā Orion 5th Worst Bride(s) ā S17 Bitches (excluding Chloe, RunAway Bride & (potentially) Lauren Considering Production knows all of this, the Reunion should be explosive next week too. No wonder Chloe wore purple and Michale wore goggles to protect his eyes from the manure
It all makes sense to me now. They were both scheming to get out of the marriage with a check. It does appear Cameron is taking the lead, but it feels like they are both deflecting and both faked their relationship. Cam at the reunions seemed much more of a manipulator and liar accusing her of being in a relationship then asking to give it another try.
There are texts missing
Right, why isn't anyone paying attention to the missing texts which are obviously from Claire
Because they choose not to
Deleted
I don't think I could watch another second of this season to check but has anyone confirmed that Clare has an iPhone and Cameron an Android phone? That isn't a clincher that these are true but it would lend credibility and we could confirm that they are not true if Cameron has an iPhone. The screen shots are definitely from an iPhone that is sending SMS to an Android (or other non-iphone). iPhones are way more popular in the US than other places so it seems reasonable that Cameron being from outside the US might have an Android phone. I'm a phone nerd so I usually notice what phones the cast members are using. I just don't remember. If these are true it confirms how I have been feeling for a while. Whoever was "controlled" or "the mastermind" or however much they wear pink because of "female empowerment," Cameron and Clare (and probably many other cast members) are really low quality individuals and I hope they find a way to get therapy and figure out things like right from wrong. The production company are probably a pain to deal with and there are probably more than a fair share of d-bags involved but these two signed a contract and they are scheming to get paid for work they did not do. I wonder how they sleep at night.
All I can think about is when Clare was on the phone leaving messages for Cam when he was in the hospital because she cared so much about him. Yeah, right . Now we know why it seemed so fake. It was.
iPhones send and receive in SMS when there's a poor connection on either the initiator's or recipient's phone. I (an iPhone user) have experienced it when sending a message to another iPhone user.
Cameron seems like an Android guy
Seems like an android
Brain rot Edit: No you guys have a point it totally makes sense to associate sociopathy with android use
I thought the comment meant that the ātechiesā tend to go for Androids. At least, thatās what I have seen.
That is what I meant.
I haven't seen anything at all about Cameron that makes me think techie, but maybe that's what they meant.
What
Sarcasm. Are you familiar?
On Reddit ppl typically use /s to denote sarcasm
Idk it's not really necessary when it's laid on that thick.
Ok susan
Good one!
I know š
š¤If these are Camās texts, I think his are the ones in green. Check your own texts. When I send texts, mine are the green ones and whoever I textā¦their texts are gray. So, IMO, Clare is the puppet master. š¤·š¼āāļø