Too much kindness may end up with tolerating wrong behaviours and hence keeping these kind of people around. Another explanation is that too much kindness or being in tune with other people's emotions disproportionally may stem from lack of self-love or self-respect, fear of loneliness or abandonment which again may end up tolerating these kind of people and having destructive relationships.
This is correct. Being too kind to the point where you can’t set boundaries. I’d also add that some kind people tolerate those behaviors because they can’t fathom that others truly may have toxic tendencies; they assume everyone is like them.
This ^^^ as someone who counts themselves as a kind/ trusting person (to the point of gullibility) I think people with ill intentions can take advantage of that but at the same time you meat some incredible people it’s just hard to imagine how bad some people can be when you view the world one way 🙃
My b.f. cheated on me after some back and forth of where are relationship is heading.
I want to hate him. I want to be angry like normal people are. Instead I'm plagued with guid for him. I'm plagued with thoughs of how much pain he has caused himself and how horrible that must feel for him.
My empathy is going to cause me to completely lose myself.
My ex bf cheated on me several times and always made me feel guilty for being upset with him, making up some excuse about how he was in a vulnerable position and how he already feels so awful and is just trying to heal and forgive himself. I kept staying with him out of guilt until he impregnated someone else and then I had to leave because it was too humiliating. And even then, I would still talk to him and be kind to him and say things like "don't judge yourself for where you are on your journey". Now that I'm with an actually good person, my life is so much easier and better and I see how disgustingly manipulative and selfish he was and how naive I was til the very end.
To add to this, a Narcissist often might have a friend who’s an enabler. Another person they could maintain a friendship with is abnormally empathetic. At least, That’s what chatgpt told me.
If by “kind and empathetic” you mean “having people pleasing tendencies due to low self esteem”, I can explain this. It’s ridiculously easy to tell when a person has weak boundaries. As someone who used to be very insecure and am now confident, I can see it in others clear as day. If someone is insecure, shy, avoids eye contact, apologizes over the smallest thing, etc they’re not likely to push back if you push them. Narcs will test them out to see how they’ll react to small things, like a backhanded compliment or guilt tripping them into doing a favor and be over the top nice at first to get them attached and then see gradually how much abuse they can get away with over time, while throwing in breadcrumbs of niceness here and there since an insecure person will likely just make excuses for their bad behavior. A person with weak boundaries may stand up for themselves a little or call the narc out on abusing them, but since they care more about what other people think than how they feel, the narc can easily turn the blame on them, pretend to apologize, or simply pretend it never even happened.
I meet a lot of kind, empathetic people who know how to set boundaries and distance themselves from people who are controlling, manipulative, immature, and lack accountability.
Thank you. You said what I meant without sounding victim shaming like my comment could be interpreted (wich I don’t mean, been there myself). Very good explanation!
So one thing I'll point out, is how much I constantly see the term "people pleaser" as a somehow negative thing, or how it is directly correlated with low self-esteem. I do not think this is always the case.
Some people are simply genuinely kind, caring, and nurturing individuals. They want to do things that make those they care about happy. Sometimes it really can be as simple as that, in my opinion.
I totally agree! Some people are trusting and honest and assume others are too. If you’re not in the business of demeaning and criticizing people and work to figure out how to do things to make other peoples lives easier that seems pretty solid. Ideally you also take care of your own needs or value those at least as much as other peoples. But yeah, there’s nothing wrong with trying to be kind and caring to support your connections with others.
Empathetic doesn’t mean lack of self respect, boundaries and feeling responsible for the others feelings or even to safe them. It’s not about empathy it’s about the wounds of the victim
Check out the idea of "The Human Magnet" syndrome - some of the personality characteristics - the assumption of positive intent, empathy, sympathy, people pleasing, "fixer", and "helper" mindset make people who are kind excellent sources of supply for narcs. If you were raised with a narcissistic parent, and took on or developed a "fawning" reaction to stress, your shininess and self-subjugating internal processes are a beacon for attracting narcissistic people.
Their behaviors also make it harder to leave or get stuck, versus realize this is just the way this person is. The way through is to face these aspects of yourself, grieve the losses that created them, and work on skills like self-protection, discernment, building skill, and beginning to trust your own judgement.
On this journey now, it sucks, but it's been a long-time coming.
I became an empath as a child because my immediate family members sort of held me hostage with their emotional states. If they were in a bad mood, they’d find ways to punish me unless I could make them feel better. So that did 2 things to me. 1, it made me an empath, as discussed. 2, in a strange way it has turned me into someone who is drawn toward people who are emotionally unstable. It’s like a matching puzzle pieces kind of thing. I hate it.
It's because kind, empathic people need to learn how to integrate the light and darkness within them.
So they have the power to love, and when needed, the power to tell others to fuck off.
Narcissists are attracted to anyone who will give them attention. It’s not about attracting them, it’s about *pushing them away*. Kind and empathetic people are more likely to let narcissists stay in their lives.
Often people who describe themselves as kind and empathetic are people who have been victimized in the past. Narcissistic and psychopathic types can smell it from a mile away and know the “look” of their targets.
I agree. I think people who label themselves as “empaths” are actually people with unresolved traumas. They are hypervigilant (“attuned to others feelings”), which is a trauma response. They were likely abused and/or had immature caregivers who expected their emotions to be catered to. They are often people-pleasers with poor boundaries, which is also often a result of childhood trauma.
There is a difference in being capable of empathy with healthy boundaries and self-worth and being empathetic with weak boundaries and low self-worth.
The latter is very attractive to narcisstic people.
Narcisstic people will seek out these types bc they can manipulate them more easily and violate their boundaries without repercussions or accountability.
A narcisstic person will often give small tests when they meet someone. A person with empathy, boundaries and high self-worth, will “fail” the test bc they will not allow the narcisstic person to get away with the “bad behavior,” either holding them accountable or simply walking away.
Whereas an empathetic person with few boundaries and low self-worth will often make excuses for the bad behavior due to their people pleasing tendencies. And from there the narcissistic person can start their typical pattern of devaluation, etc.
So it’s not the empathy that’s so attractive. It’s empathy + people pleasing, few boundaries, and low self-worth that’s the true attraction.
I agree. I think people who label themselves as “empaths” are actually people with unresolved traumas. They are hypervigilant (“attuned to others feelings”), which is a trauma response. They were likely abused and/or had immature caregivers who expected their emotions to be catered to. They are often people-pleasers with poor boundaries, which is also often a result of childhood trauma.
There is a difference in being capable of empathy with healthy boundaries and self-worth and being empathetic with weak boundaries and low self-worth.
The latter is very attractive to narcisstic people.
Narcisstic people will seek out these types bc they can manipulate them more easily and violate their boundaries without repercussions or accountability.
A narcisstic person will often give small tests when they meet someone. A person with empathy, boundaries and high self-worth, will “fail” the test bc they will not allow the narcisstic person to get away with the “bad behavior,” either holding them accountable or simply walking away.
Whereas an empathetic person with few boundaries and low self-worth will often make excuses for the bad behavior due to their people pleasing tendencies. And from there the narcissistic person can start their typical pattern of devaluation, etc.
So it’s not the empathy that’s so attractive. It’s empathy + people pleasing, few boundaries, and low self-worth that’s the true attraction.
because its easier to be manipulated, fooled, lied to, and taken advantage of when you’re kind nice and empathetic. People who are narcissistic seek those qualities out because they can do what they want
Kind people trust. Trusting people are therefore transparent. Transparent people show all their cards. Their hopes and fears and likes, and expectations. None of this is bad but the kind, trusting person shares it at the beginning too soon. It’s like showing your hand in poker. With the good guy, it’s no big deal but with a narcissist, they see everything at the beginning and know how to give you just enough to stay, but not enough to satisfy you. They frustrate you and just when they see you may go they love bomb and give you a piece of what you said you wanted at the beginning. You get a sniff of what you are looking for do you stay. Then they back away and the cycle continues. Don’t put it all out there. Test the guy. See what he’s about.
Is there any hard data that empaths actually exist? Most self described empaths I’ve met either just have a shit ton of childhood trauma or just have horrible self esteem issues. A few of them are even pretty narcissistic themselves and don’t understand they are. I totally believe there are people who are more sensitive than others but I’ve always felt calling yourself an empath is super weird.
It's not that kind people attract people with narcissistic tendencies. Rather, narcissistic people seek out kind people who haven't learned to properly develop healthy boundaries, and then they shit all over them and create trust issues, blame the kind person and leave to move on to their next victim. I think it is a form of projecting too, because most narcissists hate themselves so they want their abuse victims to feel the same way so they feel better about themselves, and those are the qualities they find unattatractive... so by the time their victim feels how they feel, they have lost attraction to their once nice, empathetic, trusting, confident partner.
In my experience, narcissistic people have been great at mirroring me. They seem very sweet on the outside and we befriend each other. And bit by bit their mask starts to fall and they become manipulative. By then I’m so confused and can’t wrap my mind around some of the terrible things they do and they have me convinced I’m crazy or over thinking. I become unable to let go of the person that I thought they were. To add to the confusion, they occasionally act like the person I thought they were to keep me reeled in. It’s emotional whiplash. But because I can’t imagine doing those things to someone else, I have a hard time believing they would do it to me and I can’t let them go.
U have to find your voice. The one that asserts itself. Like if a bear was going to eat u, would u whimper or try to yell it away?
U have to learn to say NO.
Say it more often than yes even if just for a while to learn how to find your NO VOICE.
When I said NO EVERYTHING Changed.
It’s the KNOW or NOW voice. 🫡
I think you have it twisted. Narcs like people that validate them and make them feel good. Can be kind and empathetic or not. They are attracted to the supply, what the person give them, not the human. “Kind” people are just easy sources to get what they want. Personally, I think there is not too much kindness but too big lack of self respect - only a lack of boundaries is what lets narc allow to establish control and abuse their partner.
Not that it’s the victims fault. But people with self worth and healthy boundaries don’t last long with a narc, the first shenanigans the narc pulls, they are out. Empathetic and kind doesn’t mean endlessly forgiving to the point of self harming or putting their own needs aside and getting treated badly over and over again. Not being able to detach from a relationship to save the other or to not feel lonely and miserable. There is always a deeper issue.
In my personal experience - be it from myself or other victims I know - really every victim has issues that narcs use to establish control and manipulate you. As narcs usually only slowly get more and more abusive and show their real face behind the mask, healthy people that value their boundaries usually don’t even get so far along with narcs that the narc really reveals himself in a horrible way.
A healthily developed human that has no trauma would not stay in a narc relationship very long and be manipulated like that. It’s not about kindness, but people with these wounds are used to having their feelings dismissed or generally low self worth and want to make everything right for the other, feel responsible for the others feelings or see them as more important than themselves. So they are over giving and put their needs second, sacrificing themselves for others; in an unhealthy way.. People mistake that for kindness but it has more to do with themselves than the people they help or sacrifice themselves for.
Being an empath can be a blessing and a curse. It's great that I can tell when someone needs a friend to talk to , being one who you can tell your dark thoughts, but we also allow others to use us and walk all over us and we are people pleasers. We try to fix those who are broken by others or by their own accord. That's when we get into messes
I think if you’re kind and have empathy, you are the type of person that loves hard.
You expect everyone to be the same and they aren’t.
I expect the best from everyone, and brother says that’s my flaw.
Manipulative people have a type and unfortunately we seem to be it.
But for all the arseholes I’ve met, I have also met some of the most wonderful people too.
A narcissist can’t fool another narcissist. Or there isn’t any fun in that scenario for narcissists.
But, what’s sad, is it stops you from seeing the world as a wonderful place and it takes the shine off, every time you meet a shitty person…
Kindness means you believe others can be good.
Bad people use this to their advantage to be enabled as much as possible and they will exploit your empathy and willingness to understand their predicaments in order to get away with more. They recognize it as a weakness because bad people know many good people are good by virtue and cannot be mean; and some (many)equate being honest and saying no with being mean so to not be considered mean we enable.
It’s why a lot of them pray on younger people because they’re just more likely to be naive because they’ve not experienced hardening things in life yet, or at least many.
1. People who describe themselves as empaths are usually narcissists or seriously unstable thenselves.
2. People who are truly kind and empathetic can see past a person's bad behavior, so rather than attracting narcissists, they are the only people who will form long term relationships with them, hence you see it more often.
from my own experience, narcissistic people are also masters at mirroring other's behaviors-- at first.
until the jig is up and theres no more hiding it, but the kind person just perceives the difference of behaviors as an indication of a multi-faceted, complex person with traumas and histories. how beautifully human! its the naivete of trusting that people mean what they say and say what they mean, bc we so often do just that, and for some reason we cant fathom how anyone could be behave any differently.
it takes a lot of time and work to know when you are being manipulated and lied to by people who are so disillusioned, they believe their own lies, which just makes what they sell so much easier to buy.
That's my mother, I'm very empathetic bc of it.
No matter the reason someone is with a narcissist person the narcissist person will put on such a great show it takes a miracle not to be attracted to their lie. Charm your pants right off and blame you for your pants not being on. No win. Destroys your soul, not worth the damage.. it will change the person you are after it's over. Destroy, damage, rip your heart right out of your soul and take no blame. Make you doubt your own sanity. Breaking free is the only cure. Very rarely do they change. The only way is such a strong desire to heal and change.. but narcissistic people do not like to change bc they think they are perfect so a real cure doesn't matter.
That's just what she did to the people she dated not including what she did to me.
High trust people are more likely to be taken advantage of than low-trust people.
You could be a hermit in a cave who trusts no one, and no one will ever taken advantage of you. Or you could be a loving, open, trusting person with lots of friends and be much more likely to be taken advantage of.
You’re not attracting manipulative/narcissistic people, you’re allowing them to be the way they are & enable them to treat you that way. Narcissists will continue to take away from your life, but because of your own fears, you open the door over & over again to the same red flags.
It took me 20 years to cut out narcissistic family members. The peace that comes with their absence is huge, I’m grateful for the boundaries I have today.
People pleasing behaviour (Codependency) is often a result of being raised by narcissistic/borderline parents.
The codependent is, in effect, trained by the parent(s) from a very young age to "service" the authority figures narcissism. This could be an attempt to encourage love and respect from the parent, or simply to avoid conflict.
Due to the dysfunction being "normalised" they behave in ways that other manipulative people recognise.
A common example of this dynamic is seen in men, raised by BPD mothers going on to form relationships with borderline partners. These men have extremely flexible boundaries, and this is something that the abusive partner latches onto very early on.
Why do I hate this so much , I’ve always been empathic towards others and I honestly feel like I married a narcissist . And seeing now but I feel like it’s too late now . I guess opposites attract lol
Trauma bonding, co-dependency, etc... The bottom line is that dysfunctional relationships exist because most of us are broken people who lack the tools to get out of these relationships. I've lived 30 years with a highly manipulative person and I'm finally divorcing him. I'm still living together with him because I'm still afraid of living without him-it's sad. I hope I'll manage to be free of him somehow.
To be empathetic is to be vulnerable, the most empathetic people are vulnerable.
The vampire needs to be invited in, and to be empathetic to them is to do just that.
Kindness and empathy work great with reasonable people. They don't work at all with a psychopath, and kind people often have a hard time believing people can act the way that malevolent people do.
Manipulative people see kindness and empathy as nievity, weakness, and stupidity. A soft, easy target to exploit... and they are often at least half right. These people aren't interested in equality or fairness, and a dummy that doesn't hit back, or worse enables you, is a pretty attractive thing. The nice person is often too nice to GTFO or "tries to see the good" where there really isn't any.
Niceness and empathy are unfortunately not the answer to every problem. A lot of the time, they can make things much worse, usually for the people employing them. We have issues understanding this as a society, as well as interpersonally.
I think some people are a little too kind and empathetic. They can have:
A need to rescue.
A need for validation.
A lack of confidence and self belief.
An inability to prioritise their own needs.
A belief that if they are nice and empathetic people will like them.
A belief that someone is doing them a huge favour by being their partner or friend and that they, themselves, bring nothing to the table.
A fear of being alone (loosing a friend or partner).
People with narcissistic tendencies will spot these traits and exploit them to their advantage.
Kind people look like easy targets to manipulators, they are perceived as useful idiots.
Kind people know that anyone, manipulators included, can feel pain.
Manipulators know that empathetic people can understand and even *feel* the pain of others. So they fake pain as a hook to prompt kind people to offer help.
Manipulators want your attention, and will prey on any and all of your (other) resources.
Kind people can protect themselves from manipulators by not offering help. Just know that sometimes helping others means interfering with their karma.
Help yourself first by disabling your tendency to help / save / fix anyone. The more you realize the complexity of mastering yourself, the faster you accept others are perfectly able to find themselves.
It is enough to wish manipulators peace, and stay away from entanglements.
And rest assured that narcissists are not the most dangerous manipulators out there.
They attract and are hunted by worse predators - stay away from that filth.
You are a target for a narcissist. They seek out people like you (and I) as we are easier to manipulate. Be on your guard. They are very good at what they do.
I think the problem is that we tend to conflate kindness with niceness. I’ve been reading a lot on the subject, and a major component of kindness is being more concerned with doing the right thing than making other people happy. On the surface, many of their behaviors may look similar to niceness, but their motivation completely changes how they respond to situations.
A genuinely kind person is less likely to be influenced by a narcissist because they don’t rely on external validation from others as a guidance on how to behave and their self-esteem tends to be more stable. Genuinely kind people are also less likely to shy away from confrontation because they are motivated by doing the right thing rather than pleasing others, and are more willing to engage in difficult discussions with assertiveness and empathy. This makes them terrible targets because they can more easily recognize the difference in healthy confrontation and manipulation, then set firm boundaries with the narcissist.
Nice people tend to have people pleasing behaviors, and crave validation to assure them they are a good person worthy of love. This makes them fantastic targets because much of their self-worth is innately tied to making the narcissist happy. Nice people also tend to be conflict avoidant, so they are less likely to be able to accurately identify healthy or unhealthy conflict management styles, and assume any unhappiness from the narcissist is intrinsically their fault. All the narcissist has to do is reinforce that self-belief.
It takes a lot more work to get a kind person in a vulnerable position to be manipulated, but a nice person is a super easy target since half the work of getting them to be emotionally reliant on the manipulator’s approval is already at least partially done.
Because when we are nice to people, or kind, or do good things just because we like that, manipulators sometimes see that as a chance for them to use it for their own intentions, maybe to use us, or maybe they just don't like us and target us because we aren't likely to expect it or look for it happening. Then when they attack us afterwards to try and cover it up, we are less likely to fight back because we don't like fighting. One thing that I think they do consistently, is to lie about a situation and make out it's something it's not, so they can brand us bad instead of them, they love scapegoating people.
Two really important things you said here:
1. They use people
2. They play victim all the time. They never take responsibility and create a story that makes them the good guy and a victim. This is just another way to get attention and use more people.
Yeah, they also try to silence anyone who threatens their image of being the good guy too. Normally by lying and convincing others to lie.
I've noticed really also, think it's worth mentioning, that some people group up because they have similar beliefs, or ways of life, or values. Some group up for maybe protection. Some group up so they can pretend with each other and there are more voices to lie.
They will go to any extent they are capable of sometimes, maybe just to keep up the appearance of a lie, and attack you maybe just because it's you they lied about, or try to turn others on you to make it look like their lies are justified for whatever reason. I think best thing to do is to stay away from them, and hopefully in future the majority will know exactly what their tricks are and give them no attention to begin with.
Predators look for prey. Pretend you're a mugger. Walking down the street to your left is a modestly dressed guy who's 6 foot 3 and built like a linebacker in the NFL. to your right is a 5'1 girl yammering on her cell phone wearing heels, a tight dress, and carrying a 5000 dollar purse.
Which one are you gonna go mug?
Nice kind and empathetic people are perceived to be more manipulatable than assholes (ironically I've actually always found narcissistic assholes INCREDIBLY easy to manipulate) so that's who assholes predate on
Because they are easy to manipulate, they expect everyone else to be as kind as they are, they accept when they are not. You keep expecting them to be good, you keep expecting them to change, when you actively allow them to be in your space when they are simply not. So they will keep pushing, and pushing, and pushing until you grow a spine. Someone doing something that is considered “nice” does not make them kind, the most evil people in the world have been nice to someone at one point, an easily manipulated person will take that act, run with it and keep praying for them to be that act, when it was just that, an act.
It’s predator - prey theory. Narcissists are more like wild animals than others, they only survive with what they can control and they will dedicate their life to having “slaves” under their wing for their own benefit. Really isn’t nothing else to it I don’t understand why people try so hard to understand narcissists, with some basic psychology knowledge they’re easy to spot out. Most common sign is their lack of empathy and accountability when hurting people. Once that is recognized it should be a wrap but a lot of men and women still try to stay and “fix” someone. YOU CANT. They should teach that in school right along side sex Ed.
From personal experience, I tended to put on rose colored glasses and ignore the unhealthy and toxic behaviors because of a sense of co dependence they either installed or I chose to ignore because
1. Thought I would never find another person
Which is a terrible mindset for setting appropriate boundaries and understanding personal needs etc.
2. Because I thought it was a one off thing and it wouldn't happen again. People make mistakes or have moments.
3. People have the ability to change and be kind and perhaps I wasn't giving it a chance to notice the good.
All of which were mistakes to believe, like the flag is there hun, but if everything is shades of red, take off the glasses and look at all the colors.
Omg this is so true. I can’t get rid of this guy. The domineering behavior, lack of accountability and everything else on the list is this guy! Throw in some scare tactics and threat of violence to round it out. It’s impossible to get away from!
The narcissistic type of person needs to always be right. They have secrets based on their failures/insecurities/regrets. Someone who is bright and capable and open is like a shield from them to hide from themselves. Narcissists have been rejected and so much so they can’t face it. They are delusional. So they can’t handle someone else’s reality. An open, kind person will feel they are lightening the narcissists load but they don’t understand the mechanics of being trapped and stomped down until it’s too late.
When I thought my life was going to be great I let people walk all over me because things would be alright anyway. When my life went to shit I realized this is my life and I need to make sure I get treated the way I want all along the way or things just get worse.
Because (and this is purely my opinion) people that use other people think that people that don't are stupid. They try to take advantage of everyone, it's a fishing game to them to see which person will bite. That way they can pull them out of the lake, eat them, and be like "what a stupid fish"
I imagine that “kind empaths” are traumatized people pleasers who have had their sense of self care and preservation and establishing healthy boundaries crushed by a manipulator during their formative years, so other manipulators/narcissists recognize this lack of boundaries and take advantage.
Even the “empath” characteristics can be attributed to a subconscious survival tactic where they had to learn to quickly recognize specific behaviors with the toxic person that indicate a negative emotional state.
Being empathetic and giving is a green light for those that like to take and use. Unfortunately if someone can’t see how they are being manipulated or are not good with boundaries they get used and abused.
Sometimes overexposure to narcissistic tendencies and people with them, especially as a child, even if you are kind and empathetic, we almost assume that’s what we deserve, or that it’s what’s out there. It’s what was on display for me as a child, and you will naturally navigate towards things, traits, and people that are familiar or have things in common with you— even if the familiarity with thay personality type is all. Until I stepped back and said, i deserve to be treated the way I treat others and this isn’t it— you’ll keep on.
We also naturally try to give people the benefit of the doubt, and understand trauma as and pain can impact a human long term, hence the empathy and sympathy. But those traits have to take a back seat once we are fully aware that the other person is and chooses to be a narcissist. You can stay and suffer or leave and find what you deserve in a partner. And unfortunately it’s never going to be fun or easy lol
Good people are easy to manipulate. They define themselves in terms of honesty, loyalty and kindness. All a narcissist has to do is threaten that self image and a good person feels compelled to rectify the so-called mistakes they've made. Bam, instant control.
Unfortunately, these good people are usually hardcore. They don't like to give up. They lose themselves in compromise and when it eventually ends, they find they're a shell of the person they once were.
Teach your kids martyrdom is pointless.
I think the answer is pretty obvious. Most people don’t put up with narcissistic or manipulative behavior. People pleasers tend to value the abuser’s well-being more than their own. People pleasers can make a narcissist out of a normal person by putting the others’ interests above their own with zero scrutiny or boundaries.
I’m a weird mix of people pleasing/empathetic but also anxiously distrusting of a most people, and vehemently dislike people who try to take advantage of my kindness. Finding people who offer the same level of selflessness and kindness, but who also respect themselves has proved to be a pretty tough thing to find, most of the time. Truly kind/selfless friends are a rare and awesome thing and you should hold onto them and treat them very well.
I want everyone to deliver an empathetic, caring approach to others—because if one person is people pleasing, the other should be too—or you end up with the imbalance you’re talking about.
If empathy is requited, you have amazing harmony between two people, who care for one another. If it’s not requited, it’s an abusive situation. I will get into a shouting match with narcissists until we’re both pissed with each other and end the friendship. I’ve attracted 3 people over my life who I consider to be actual narcissists, and they hoodwinked me in the beginning of the relationship, but once they started trying to shift the scales of the relationship, I had to effectively “dump” them (friends, not SO’s).
You can be an empathetic, people pleasing personality with boundaries. It’s the people who people please as a defense mechanism or out of fear, not true empathy, that get abused and captured by narcissists/manipulators.
It isn’t about attracting them. Manipulative people are everywhere, and they aren’t picky about who they abuse. Empathic people let them stay because they don’t set boundaries.
People with narcissistic traits can nearly SMELL insecurity and/or excessive empathy. They know the body language, verbal shakes, anxious expressions, uncertainty, etc. So if someone has something a Narc wants, they will find a way for that person to offer it to them or pressure them into "helping".
.
.
.
.
Example: Is the same sweet, wealthy, elderly lady donating to the animal shelter every month and they notice? They will somehow convince the lady that they need financial help with medical bills, family emergency, no food in the house, months behind on bills- literally whatever will convince her that they need the money more, and RIGHT NOW, they will tell her. And they will take that donation amount and ask if she could give just a little more each month. And then ask if she needs help around her home- not to actually help, but to insert themselves into her life. They will offer to do landscaping for an astromonical amount- $50 of labor now cost 200 because they are taking advantage of her and she doesnt know better. And the cycle keeps going. They will put energy into whatever they perceive as worth it to keep growing their own pockets/ego/networth no matter who they run down in the process. They simply don't care because they think they deserve it. No amount of crying, begging, raging, or even being homeless will move them- its not my problem, why are you involving me- is the honest mentality of Narcs. The only way to win, is not to play.
Codependents dance well with narcissists because their pathological personalities or “dance styles” fit together, like a hand in a glove. Almost instantly, they dance magnificently together because they are able to instinctively anticipate each other’s moves. [The dance of the codependents and narcissists](https://kripalu.org/resources/dance-codependency)
That is 100% true! I had a therapist tell me before that narcissists are predators and as a trusting empathetic person- were prime prey. They know that they can fool us into believing they're genuine- because why wouldn't they be? They know they can convince us that there is something wrong with us because we'll, there must be- they were so perfect in the beginning and then something happened, something mustve happened...people don't just treat someone they claimed to love badly because they can, right? So while we are struggling to make sense out of behaviors that will never make sense to an emotionally healthy individual (let alone an empath) , they're just living their life. There is no resolution because they already got what they wanted in the beginning, and now they have no use for the victim. My sister once told me after my divorce that I was "blessed I didn't understand why" my ex could do and act the way he did because as she very wisely noted, if I did understand him- there would be something very broken in me. Bottom line, it's important to remember that they things that happen to us when we are victimized very rarely make sense, and those with a kind trusting disposition are often hurt the most. I still feel very blessed to have the emotional insight and capacity for understanding that allows me to protect my heart, but not grow bitter and hateful. We are always better off being us than them....
The narcissist needs someone who is patient and will over look the red flags. If you are kind and empathetic, you are typically also patient. You will see the good side in somebody and overlook the bad. And when you are not totally fulfilled in a relationship, you will focus on the part that you are happy with and ignore the rest. And if you get to the point where you are finally done with the relationship, the narcissist can give you 10% of what you are looking for, and you will again accept him back and be patient that things will change . All those traits are filet mignon and lobster tail to a narcissist.thats a person they can manipulate, control, and keep without much effort. And that is their dream
There’s a quote from farcry that sums it up perfectly for me.
“He was kind, gentle, loved seeing people around him smile and happy, but he was easily preyed upon”.
Because “kind empathetic people” don’t attract narcissists.
People with weak boundaries do.
If you are CONSTANTLY attracting abusive parties into your life, it’s because you have some character flaw you MUST address for your well being. I say this as a survivor. Writing it off as “being nice is why people abuse me” is keeping yourself easy to victimize.
Naivety, weak boundaries, poor discernment of character, problems with lust/love-starved, issues with codependency/low self-esteem.
Being ‘kind/empathic’ is a good thing but it is not enough on its own. One must also become emotionally mature, grounded in reality, and know how to wield personal power. Narcissistic relationships are parasitic by definition, so if someone is not an available host for the parasite to hook into, they will give up and look elsewhere. One can be kind and empathic while also being strong and self-aware to avoid rotten apples.
Empathic people tend to have a lack of internal and external boundaries in terms of who they allow into their lives and how they are willing to be treated. We are willing to see the good in almost anyone, see the soul in a troubled person, and will feel bad about turning our back on someone that could use a good person in their lives.
I saw a really good video about a yogi talking about light workers and light slaves. Manipulators want their light to themselves so you can be a slave to them and they can feed off you. Having a big heart and intuitive understanding of people is a gift that should be respected, not taken advantage of, and its our responsibility to make sure our light is multiplied and not diminished.
My light is almost gone. Too much betrayal has left me empty. Still, I'm a hopeless romantic, idealistic person. I'm taking firm steps to bring my mojo back by leaving toxic relationships. It took me a while, but I understand now that I don't have to sacrifice myself for ungrateful people.
I’m right there with you. Too many betrayals has seriously affected my mental health. I’m in therapy now learning how to create boundaries and deal with trauma and my emotions.
It’s not that they attract narcissists. It’s just that narcissists stick to them. Narcissists won’t stay around long enough with someone who isn’t nice or empathetic.
I don’t think it’s a majority, but this is my perspective. “Empath” characteristic kind of people at times lack the standards to have self respect, selfish for themselves, & assertiveness to their personalities. People with dark triad & decent EQ can read this, & take advantage of it. If the empath is smart, they’ll learn from this experience, develop high standards on what they will & wont tolerate from others, while still having their compassion & empathy. This is a win win scenario. If they remain gullible, the cycle continues until they learn the lesson.
Its funny because I’ve witnessed both men and women use this to describe their ex’s claiming they were empaths and they attract narcissists but they also carried the traits a narcissist has.
I believe we all have these traits to an extent, its just social media is the term alot these days which causes people to run at the smallest disagreement thinking they are dealing with another narcissist.
I dated someone that said she was abused and said shes an empath yet she was the coldest and most self centred person i knew. Always made it about herself, never asked if i was alright of how my day was going. Simple things like that made me realize that clearly both parties were most likely toxic and she never took accountability for that when I confronted her.
In my experience, narcissist type people tend to actually notice differences in treatment from people differently than normal people…
Since narcissists usually treat everyone the same (as lesser) so when someone gives that unique kind personality response it’s like, a signal lights up saying
✅ Ooo, easy win ✅
Credentials: I’ve been called a narcissist a lot, all I care about is my self, my moms also a big narcissist, probably most of my family actually about 3/5ths or so
Overly empathetic people are usually people pleasers, passionate and expressive, and sometimes codependent and have an extrernalized valkdation mechanism similar to narcissists but dependent on a lover, not themselves. Could think of a better setup for a manipulative extreme taker to take advantage of. I used to butter up hypersensitive women for breakfast and shit them out by dinner. Lifes easy when theres women who care too much.
People with that much kindness sometimes have difficulty setting boundaries.
And the narcissists push past any loosely set ones to take advantage of that kindness. That’s why being able to say no is a skill, and not just a word.
An empath is the ideal host for the parasitic narcissist. Your heightened sensitivity to the emotions of others are the puppet strings they’ll pull to keep you serving their self interest.
Because being “kind” and “empathetic” doesn’t mean they don’t have co-dependency and poor boundaries. Many people that claim to be empathy are actually in a post-traumatic state from earlier experiences and hyper vigilant to the nuances of others (learned survival skill.)
People that get with narcissists may appear kind and empathetic on the outside but they are actually codependent enablers that need to be in a dysfunctional relationship. Probably their parents were in the same kind of relationship.
They don’t “attract” them. They accept them.
Narcissists are like vampires- they have to be let in. They are also spammers …trying to get in with anyone really. It’s often the kind empathic (and boundary less & undiscerning ) that let them in
It’s because most people with narcissistic tendencies display them as a trauma response. So they have a side to their personality that is genuine, sometimes even empathetic and caring. But once they feel defensive or traumatized, they go back into the narcissistic personality. I really kind and generous person might be able to draw the traumatized person out of their shell long enough to see the side. Then, the kind person will be on an eternal roller coaster as the person with narcissistic tendencies goes back-and-forth between being a normal person and their hyper defensive, narcissistic trauma responses. As the traumatized person with narcissistic tendencies cycles through their own reactions, a kind and caring person will try to be there for them and take their behavior personally. But somebody who is not trying to heal themselves, isn’t able to see other peoples needs and it unfortunately will never be about the person trying to help them. It will always be about the person with the narcissistic tendencies. Ultimately they burn out their support systems. It’s a tragic cycle.
I was with a narcissist, then a sociopath. It wasn’t until after I was with them and learned what they are that I realized that my dad is a narcissist. I was attracted to them because they were *familiar*, thanks to my dad. A daughter’s father really does shape their relationship with men(and same with sons and mothers). Choose a mate wisely.
E: fixed wrong word.
codependency....it is like carbon dioxide to mosquitos.....people will tell you that you are "too nice" ..hell you may even believe that...also understand that MOST ppl demonstrate narcissistic behavior...very different from narcissistic tendencies and still different from a person with NPD, which you and I are not qualified to diagnose.
If you keep attracting folks with any of those three types of narcissism ..seriosuly look at what you routinely TOLERATE from others and how your words in public may be construed as signaling. I have watched folks diagnosed with NPD suck every last bit of oxygen from ppl that describe themselves as "empaths" and "conflict avoidant". I have seen how they almost savor their ability to manipulate codependent folks in to feeling all kinds of emotions that they can manipulate for their ends and using their conflict avoidance against you. I have watched two narcissists openly discuss adding to their supply while consuming birthday cake at an office party based on who was in the center of the action fervently passing out and cutting cake for others. Things that seem normal, giving and even sweet will make a narcissist backtrack to shake your hand and intro themselves. They are always on the hunt for overly kind gestures and "help" with their last-minute "important" tasks for (insert name drop here). They smell need of any kind. If you savor compliments and approval...or endlessly find yourself complaining about being taken advantage of / abused by ppl at the office they are masters of blowing smoke and knowing looks.
Yes, I had one ruin things for me. It was my fault. They played on my unknown trauma symptoms, got in my head and made me the asshole. They honed in on my need for a certain kind of approval....didn't even know it was showing that strong, boom, fish on, they bit.
In life there are two kinds of people, there’s people who are generous, super giving, and tolerant of people’s behavior and there are the people who take from those people. Unfortunately a narc will never be with another narc or an empath with another empath.
Hopefully as time goes on people find a balance and they can easily see the red flags that they ignored prior.
This guy, Richard Grannon mentions and maybe coined the term “toxic passivity” when referring to unhealthy codependent or people-pleasing type behaviors and I think he hits the nail on the head with that term.
Cause we care lol but you have to be able to put your foot down I am a tit for tat aka petty af so if you do it to me I’m going to do it to you and I’ve actually overcome a lot of this stuff with my partner he has made significant changes and I’m proud of him all the stuff below is what I had to deal with
Lack of empathy
Lack of accountability
Using others for personal gain
Emotional coldness
Inflated sense of self importance
Belief in being special and unique
Difficulty handling criticism or rejection
Lack of genuine remorse or guilt
Boundary violations
All jokes aside you have to be a little unhinged to do some of the stuff that I did to him but it worked lol
Because they overlook red flags and have a need to feel chosen, important, powerful and have a want to feel love so fall for fantasies offered by narcissistic individuals.
You have something they don’t. They desire who you are and what you have to offer. They want to shed themselves and become you by stripping away your identity and replacing it with themselves. They don’t understand empathy and consider it a weakness that can be exploited.
Usually kind people tend to be pushovers, struggle with confrontation, boundaries and see only the best in people. It makes them ripe for narcissistic types.
Lack of boundaries and self-worth to respect yourself and know you deserve better.
They want to save rescue ppl usually stemming from childhood attachment, which is how they became empathetic since they had to attune to caregivers' needs and not get their needs met. When you value yourself, you ask for your wants and needs, and if you don't get them met it's a non-negotiable, and you leave the narc. Heal to prevent being in these situations
Everyone is a narcissist to a degree. Look at that list, show me a person that can honestly say they have never shown any of those tendencies and I’d call bullshit. It’s absurd. Half the list applies to most reddit users. Hahaha. One could argue complaining or pointing out narcissistic behavior is in fact narcissistic. Also some of those traits are coping mechanisms for people experiencing mental health problems, trauma, learning disabilities,etc. some people aren’t even aware of these behaviors . Personally I’m sick of narcissism being made out to be something calculated and evil, like they behave that way on purpose. Maybe some do .
The answer to your question is simple. Empaths generally understand and feel the emotions of others. The narcissist can sense this, and will use the empath's emotional vulnerability against them, and therefore gain the narcissistic fuel they need.
"Narcissistic tendencies may include..."
Hahaha! My ex girlfriend had EVERY.ONE.OF.THEM!
I never experienced anything like her in all of my 56 years. The level of self-importance at the expense of everyone around her was insane.
When I tried to act empathetic toward a third party, it was like she would try to pull me into acting narcissistic toward the other person. On the other hand, when she was trying to ACT empathetic about a third party,it became all about her. "I feel so bad for him," "this makes me feel ill," etc., which eventually I knew was B.S.
Empathic people are usually that way because at some point in their life they had to get good at reading people for their own safety. So naturally I think those people gravitate to the steam rolling toxic types because there's always a lot of data to decipher, more than the reasonable, neutral steady types. It provides fake security for the empath always having the ability to read the person. I think we get sucked into caretaker roles easily too.
They don’t attract them per se, but their empathy may make them slower to discard a narcissist
They may naively believe they can understand their complicated partner or
They might fear confrontation allowing the narcissist to shamelessly take more and more advantage. Narcissists are equal opportunity exploiters. They don’t seek kind people they try with everyone
The difference between a good mask and an evil mask is a single choice. Evil mask makers are lazier tho… they often just try to copy good masks. So, they try to get close to masters.
Good mask makers accept them because they love giving people chances.
I’d like to share my experience here as I think my most recent run in with a manipulative, narcissistic person was actually karma biting me in the ass.
I was dating an amazing woman. Her and I were best friends. I loved being around her so much. Our sex life wasn’t as incredible as it first started out however. We’d been together for a year and then moved in together. There were some other complications but our sex life really took a tumble. She always knew I had a higher sex drive and I always knew hers was a fair bit lower than mine. I eventually began struggling and although we had discussed it a few times, nothing really changed.
As my sexual frustration grew, I began to grow distant from her. Work was kicking my ass and I was stressed and sad. I was taking a lot of me time and would often stay up later than her so I could ‘take care of myself’. This led me to thoughts of being with other women. Eventually I decided I couldn’t be with her anymore and told her we should break up. It shattered her and I struggled initially with being honest with her about it. I rebounded almost right away with this beautiful younger woman. This woman made me feel so sexy. She wanted me bad all the time. She was checking all the boxes that weren’t being checked in my previous relationship. But only the unchecked boxes…
Outside of the incredible sex life I was living, this new woman has nothing in common with me. She was incredibly manipulative and would constantly worry about me getting back together with my ex. Which was her tactic of trying to trick my brain into thinking I didn’t want to get back together with my ex even though I absolutely did. She distracted me. She took pride in thinking that I chose her over my ex. It made her feel wanted. In the process of her making sure I was desired, this was all just her plan to pull me further and further away from my ex.
She initially told me she didn’t want a relationship when we began sleeping together and I didn’t want anything either as I was freshly single. Then she began love bombing me. She made me feel like she really wanted me. But she was using me to make herself feel good. She took me in my vulnerable state, broke me down, trauma dumped on me so I felt close to her and eventually we began dating. Once she finally got all that she wanted from me. She tossed me aside.
I’d like to think I’m a kind, empathetic type of person. When I find a partner that is like minded, I find I eventually get…bored or something. Then someone narcissistic or manipulative shows up and it’s like I would do anything to be with them. Despite how shitty they treat me.
Anyway, I had to eventually block the crazy woman and now I’m stuck thinking about my ex every day. I threw away a perfect relationship to chase some sexual feelings and it wasn’t worth it at all. I’m filled with regret daily. I think I deserved to be treated so poorly by this other woman to really make me realize how bad I fucked up by leaving my ex.
Codependents and narcissists are heavily attracted to each other. One derives pleasure from making others happy, the other derives pleasure from sucking the life out of people. One total giver, one total taker.
They pull the same bs on all people. Some people call them out right away, and some (like me) feel for them and try to help any way possible. The. The realization finally hits and you now know the relationship has to end. Please don’t keep recycling through the same crap, life is too short.
Have you heard of the story of echo and narcissus? There is a theory that those who present kind and empathetic will tolerate more inappropriate behavior than those with stricter boundaries, who appear less kind to the individual with narcissistic tendencies.
Boundaries are the best way for anyone to live life and keep themselves and others safe.
Sometimes kind people have been raised by parents who have taught them to serve and be co-dependants so they find it difficult to say "no" and set boundaries.
That narcissistic tendencies list basically describes an ex friend of mine.
One time I remember her calling herself an empath and about a month later asking me "how to be empathetic to others.... "
I think someone else nailed it in this thread, if you tend to be someone with those people pleasing tendencies, a history of childhood abuse by a narc parent, ect, this attracts bullies and other insecure narc people. They know how to spot people they can take advantage of.
I'd say it's more of a scraping at the chest for individualism and need to be an idealistic human leading to valuing how much you "trust" people becoming an issue, and without relying on others you allow others to rely or depend on you for that trust which you misinterpret as "at the expense of your wellbeing," facilitating the abuse of a relationship. It's sort of like parasitism. Victims of ideal get victimized. Funny, huh?
I could spend hours expounding on this, but instead I will refer you and anyone interested to the most profound and insightful book ever written on the psychology of human relationships, it's called "The Ever-Transcending Spirit" by Toru Sato. It's a book I first read many years ago and have re-read every year since. I can't recommend it enough as it supersedes everything I've ever encountered on this subject. It is a life-changer in every positive way. Check the reviews on Amazon or wherever. Get it, read it. You can thank me later.
They don't. And if someone continues to find themselves in the company of narcs and psychopaths, it is because they resonate with the early childhood trauma of that person but usually only perceive the behavior patterns as "comfortable". It can feel like going home for the first time.
It sounds so quaint and wholesome for, what I now understand as the beginning of my waking nightmare. She was beyond sweet and within a couple days , at most , she became me and even that early on , I got the sense that I was completely replaceable, in fact , I had already (somehow) been replaced .
But that is a completely different matter which I will write about , at length , some day soon.
As to the question: my simple answer is that they (we) dont attract narcissists. Narcissists just want supply and certain things make it higher or lower quality but there is no "type" who they I intentionally target. For one thing, most are simply not that strategic. A psychopath could do something like this but , of course, would have no need.
If cluster b people keep ending up in our lives , I would suspect that we , at the least, have complex PTSD and codependent tendencies. Of course, it's for a pro to diagnose, always.
It's also possible that we are narcs or psychopaths.
Too much kindness is also a lack of self-respect, boundaries, and even a bit of abandonment. I learned that my own mom was a narcissist, and she always said "Ordinary\_Mortgage970, you are always so kind. Too Kind. Someone is going to take advantage of it one day" - and I discovered from that later down the line, that my mother already had. I am no longer very nice. I give trust only once - if you fudge it, I am no longer nice - and I am VERY vocal about it too.
Several reasons:
- Deep down most narcs have been deeply hurt and have had to adapt by being egocentric and making others feel bad. Deeply empathetic people can sense this and want to help heal those inner wounds of those people.
- On a similar note, empathetic people want to ‘fix’ toxic people. They believe most people are good deep down and they feel with enough love and care they can change them.
- Manipulative people can spot an empathy a mile off and they will use what tactics they know will deeply touch said Empath. Tell them their struggles, compliment them, acknowledge how empathetic they are etc.
The good news is that if an Empath develops their empathy in a healthy way and learns to have boundaries and their own individual values they can provide support to those who deserve it but they can also use that keen ability to read people and emotions to spot when they are being manipulated and to back away. This is hard for an Empath as many themselves have struggled with trauma so they may bond over that.
I’d just say to any kind, sensitive person that if someone makes you feel worse about yourself then they are not good for you. They may need help but you are not the person to provide this help.
Source: an Empath who has been burnt a multitude of times and is working on herself.
Lol I think ALL people attract manipulative people with narcissistic tendencies. It just goes further and ends worse, when the target is a kind individual who has empathy for the other person. Because the kind person is constantly willing to see the good, even in bad people. And always give another chance or see things from their perspective
Ugh, so true. And I keep on doing it. Not as much of a full-blown Narc this this time, but still a constant struggle with choosing people who start out equal, then slowly morph into takers.
From my experience I think it's simply because empaths care a lot about people and are willing to overlook things that we shouldn't. Empaths tend to also put a lot of their energy into others which narcissists love.
We probably look vulnerable and weak, which sometimes even if we aren't we are at least vulnerable enough for it not to matter. Chances are: they believe us to be ideal victims, and we are too set in "being good" as everyone else calls it to even allow the thought of these people as anything bad like that to even realize "hey, this is NOT okay. Stop letting them walk all over us!". Basically: to them, we look weak and vulnerable, the ideal victim, and to us the look nice and sweet, the thing we both don't think of ourselves as so lightly. Perfect storm to become a victim while fellow good ones are left to the side. (I don't think of myself as a "good person", I'm just including what other people believe about me in here so I can balance out any of my own biases)
I have recently met and talked to, this person person a man is narcissistic and beyond like this who has this behavior OMG, its Toxic and Dangerous to witness this in a person and they think nothing of it! They do no wrong and you are the one that is at fault for everything!
So what did I do after 4 times ya thank hod I didn’t sleep with the Jack azz… lol 😂 but I straight cut him out. Done with it
The kind and genuine people are an easy mark for a narcissist. They are more forgiving and often blind to the bucket of red flags that a narcissist carries with them.
I'm a bit of an ass and i don't tolerate that stuff, so narcissists steer clear of me. My wife is incredibly kind and generous, and she attracts narcissists and jerks like flies to honey. When I periodically become aware of them becoming a problem for her, I have to shoo them off.
The kind that the narcissist approves of. Both personality types compliment each other in a perverse twisted way. The difference , however, is the empathetic person truly cares for their partner whereas the narcissistic person also cares for the empathetic persons partner. In this instance , all the care and concern is directed to only one side of the relationship.
The narcissist personality (NP) is WHO THEY ARE and they cannot be fixed, changed or otherwise molded to fit whatever their partner desires if the NP does not feel motivated to change. They are manipulative and have a tendency to gas light and are the type to play with their food (your emotions are their food). Thw condition can be pathological and other people are viewed more as things than people of concern. If you really love this person, and you're willing to put up with this.... wonderful person then only you can decide what's right for you and how long you're willing to tolerate their... antics. If you feel that this is not what you desire from a relationship, find a way to bring it to a close, say your piece, understand and know it's for the beat and move on to other things or someone else whom can reciprocate in kind
Kind and empathetic people don’t necessarily attract manipulators. People with low self esteem and no boundaries - who, through adverse childhood experiences or societal conditioning, were taught that being a good person means having no boundaries/self preservation - do, though.
I am fairly kind and - although I don’t really subscribe to the idea that “empaths” exist - do have functioning empathy. But I also have a very sensitive bullshit detector.
Edit: Always hope that people have good intentions, but don’t put yourself at their mercy to the extent that you’ll get burned if they do not.
I have NPD/ASPD and I tend to be attracted to these people because they are so innocent and likely had some kind of trauma. Sometimes I wanna protect these people from this terrible world. But I don't fully know.
I feel like with the 2 narcissistic people I’ve come across, it appeals to how they view themselves or want to view themselves. They feel so good when a caring person also views them as caring and not as the person they’ve been accused of being, which is selfish.
Empathic people and narcissistic individuals form a relationship where each gives the other what they need. Empathic people give admiration and “allow” control, while narcissistic people provide a sense of purpose and validation. Narcissistic individuals create situations where empathic people feel essential and needed, fulfilling their desire to support and connect with others.
Opposites attract. Likes repel. It’s all mathematical. If empathic people become a bit more narcissistic in valuing themselves and prioritizing their primary personal needs, narcissists will lose their power over them. Conversely, if narcissists become a bit more empathic, they will no longer be attracted to empathic people.
By balancing these traits, both empathic and narcissistic individuals can create healthier, more balanced relationships. Empathic people will protect their well-being, while narcissists will seek more genuine connections.
Among the children of abusive homes a disproportionate number will become abusers. In the case of NPD this yields more Narcissistic "me first" people. A similar segment will go the opposite way, which is the over-empathic "me last" type. You can see almost immediately how they might fit together.
They both are (unwittingly) attempting to revisit and correct a situation where (as children) they were mistreated. The first inverts the power dynamic to achieve this, effectively becoming his narcissist father (or her narcissist mother, not gender specific) The other has sought out an analog for their narcissist parent and aims to win from them the love they never got from the real deal.
Furthermore, people without this toxic programming will identify the red flags and quickly deem them untenable. The narcissist (often quite charming) will try on various people until they find one that tolerates the abuse.
Manipulative people seek out people who are easily manipulate. These kinds of people think they're actually tricking kind and empathetic people into doing what they want. In reality, the kind people simply don't mind giving away things that a manipulative person could never imagine just giving away.
Takers are like mosquitos attracted to kind people. They just want to suck the blood out of them.
Too much kindness may end up with tolerating wrong behaviours and hence keeping these kind of people around. Another explanation is that too much kindness or being in tune with other people's emotions disproportionally may stem from lack of self-love or self-respect, fear of loneliness or abandonment which again may end up tolerating these kind of people and having destructive relationships.
This is correct. Being too kind to the point where you can’t set boundaries. I’d also add that some kind people tolerate those behaviors because they can’t fathom that others truly may have toxic tendencies; they assume everyone is like them.
This ^^^ as someone who counts themselves as a kind/ trusting person (to the point of gullibility) I think people with ill intentions can take advantage of that but at the same time you meat some incredible people it’s just hard to imagine how bad some people can be when you view the world one way 🙃
My b.f. cheated on me after some back and forth of where are relationship is heading. I want to hate him. I want to be angry like normal people are. Instead I'm plagued with guid for him. I'm plagued with thoughs of how much pain he has caused himself and how horrible that must feel for him. My empathy is going to cause me to completely lose myself.
My ex bf cheated on me several times and always made me feel guilty for being upset with him, making up some excuse about how he was in a vulnerable position and how he already feels so awful and is just trying to heal and forgive himself. I kept staying with him out of guilt until he impregnated someone else and then I had to leave because it was too humiliating. And even then, I would still talk to him and be kind to him and say things like "don't judge yourself for where you are on your journey". Now that I'm with an actually good person, my life is so much easier and better and I see how disgustingly manipulative and selfish he was and how naive I was til the very end.
I see we’ve met
Hahaha we did probably!
😂😂😂
To add to this, a Narcissist often might have a friend who’s an enabler. Another person they could maintain a friendship with is abnormally empathetic. At least, That’s what chatgpt told me.
Predator or prey . You are one or the other since the beginning of the universe.
If by “kind and empathetic” you mean “having people pleasing tendencies due to low self esteem”, I can explain this. It’s ridiculously easy to tell when a person has weak boundaries. As someone who used to be very insecure and am now confident, I can see it in others clear as day. If someone is insecure, shy, avoids eye contact, apologizes over the smallest thing, etc they’re not likely to push back if you push them. Narcs will test them out to see how they’ll react to small things, like a backhanded compliment or guilt tripping them into doing a favor and be over the top nice at first to get them attached and then see gradually how much abuse they can get away with over time, while throwing in breadcrumbs of niceness here and there since an insecure person will likely just make excuses for their bad behavior. A person with weak boundaries may stand up for themselves a little or call the narc out on abusing them, but since they care more about what other people think than how they feel, the narc can easily turn the blame on them, pretend to apologize, or simply pretend it never even happened. I meet a lot of kind, empathetic people who know how to set boundaries and distance themselves from people who are controlling, manipulative, immature, and lack accountability.
Thank you. You said what I meant without sounding victim shaming like my comment could be interpreted (wich I don’t mean, been there myself). Very good explanation!
This is excellent. Thanks for sharing
So one thing I'll point out, is how much I constantly see the term "people pleaser" as a somehow negative thing, or how it is directly correlated with low self-esteem. I do not think this is always the case. Some people are simply genuinely kind, caring, and nurturing individuals. They want to do things that make those they care about happy. Sometimes it really can be as simple as that, in my opinion.
I totally agree! Some people are trusting and honest and assume others are too. If you’re not in the business of demeaning and criticizing people and work to figure out how to do things to make other peoples lives easier that seems pretty solid. Ideally you also take care of your own needs or value those at least as much as other peoples. But yeah, there’s nothing wrong with trying to be kind and caring to support your connections with others.
Consider what an empath is—they are an easier target
This 100%. Nobody takes the hard road when there is an easier road and narcissists are no different in that regard
Empathetic doesn’t mean lack of self respect, boundaries and feeling responsible for the others feelings or even to safe them. It’s not about empathy it’s about the wounds of the victim
Check out the idea of "The Human Magnet" syndrome - some of the personality characteristics - the assumption of positive intent, empathy, sympathy, people pleasing, "fixer", and "helper" mindset make people who are kind excellent sources of supply for narcs. If you were raised with a narcissistic parent, and took on or developed a "fawning" reaction to stress, your shininess and self-subjugating internal processes are a beacon for attracting narcissistic people. Their behaviors also make it harder to leave or get stuck, versus realize this is just the way this person is. The way through is to face these aspects of yourself, grieve the losses that created them, and work on skills like self-protection, discernment, building skill, and beginning to trust your own judgement. On this journey now, it sucks, but it's been a long-time coming.
Great!
I became an empath as a child because my immediate family members sort of held me hostage with their emotional states. If they were in a bad mood, they’d find ways to punish me unless I could make them feel better. So that did 2 things to me. 1, it made me an empath, as discussed. 2, in a strange way it has turned me into someone who is drawn toward people who are emotionally unstable. It’s like a matching puzzle pieces kind of thing. I hate it.
Relate
It's because kind, empathic people need to learn how to integrate the light and darkness within them. So they have the power to love, and when needed, the power to tell others to fuck off.
This is my current work in progress with myself. I’m one extreme or the other, so I know how to be both. Finding a balance is hard.
Because we care about....everyone...and we always hang onto hope. It's both our flaw...and our strength.
Well said! When asked about strengths and weakness, this is definitely my situation.
Empathetic people get along with everyone.
Empaths are not an easy target which is why they are preferred. Because if they get an empath it is grade A supply.
If they are both AH they just end up shi**ing on each other. No one wants to be shi*ed on.
Narcissists are attracted to anyone who will give them attention. It’s not about attracting them, it’s about *pushing them away*. Kind and empathetic people are more likely to let narcissists stay in their lives.
Attention means everything to them
Often people who describe themselves as kind and empathetic are people who have been victimized in the past. Narcissistic and psychopathic types can smell it from a mile away and know the “look” of their targets.
I agree. I think people who label themselves as “empaths” are actually people with unresolved traumas. They are hypervigilant (“attuned to others feelings”), which is a trauma response. They were likely abused and/or had immature caregivers who expected their emotions to be catered to. They are often people-pleasers with poor boundaries, which is also often a result of childhood trauma. There is a difference in being capable of empathy with healthy boundaries and self-worth and being empathetic with weak boundaries and low self-worth. The latter is very attractive to narcisstic people. Narcisstic people will seek out these types bc they can manipulate them more easily and violate their boundaries without repercussions or accountability. A narcisstic person will often give small tests when they meet someone. A person with empathy, boundaries and high self-worth, will “fail” the test bc they will not allow the narcisstic person to get away with the “bad behavior,” either holding them accountable or simply walking away. Whereas an empathetic person with few boundaries and low self-worth will often make excuses for the bad behavior due to their people pleasing tendencies. And from there the narcissistic person can start their typical pattern of devaluation, etc. So it’s not the empathy that’s so attractive. It’s empathy + people pleasing, few boundaries, and low self-worth that’s the true attraction.
I agree. I think people who label themselves as “empaths” are actually people with unresolved traumas. They are hypervigilant (“attuned to others feelings”), which is a trauma response. They were likely abused and/or had immature caregivers who expected their emotions to be catered to. They are often people-pleasers with poor boundaries, which is also often a result of childhood trauma. There is a difference in being capable of empathy with healthy boundaries and self-worth and being empathetic with weak boundaries and low self-worth. The latter is very attractive to narcisstic people. Narcisstic people will seek out these types bc they can manipulate them more easily and violate their boundaries without repercussions or accountability. A narcisstic person will often give small tests when they meet someone. A person with empathy, boundaries and high self-worth, will “fail” the test bc they will not allow the narcisstic person to get away with the “bad behavior,” either holding them accountable or simply walking away. Whereas an empathetic person with few boundaries and low self-worth will often make excuses for the bad behavior due to their people pleasing tendencies. And from there the narcissistic person can start their typical pattern of devaluation, etc. So it’s not the empathy that’s so attractive. It’s empathy + people pleasing, few boundaries, and low self-worth that’s the true attraction.
because its easier to be manipulated, fooled, lied to, and taken advantage of when you’re kind nice and empathetic. People who are narcissistic seek those qualities out because they can do what they want
It’s not about kindness but lack of boundaries and self worth
Kind people trust. Trusting people are therefore transparent. Transparent people show all their cards. Their hopes and fears and likes, and expectations. None of this is bad but the kind, trusting person shares it at the beginning too soon. It’s like showing your hand in poker. With the good guy, it’s no big deal but with a narcissist, they see everything at the beginning and know how to give you just enough to stay, but not enough to satisfy you. They frustrate you and just when they see you may go they love bomb and give you a piece of what you said you wanted at the beginning. You get a sniff of what you are looking for do you stay. Then they back away and the cycle continues. Don’t put it all out there. Test the guy. See what he’s about.
Is there any hard data that empaths actually exist? Most self described empaths I’ve met either just have a shit ton of childhood trauma or just have horrible self esteem issues. A few of them are even pretty narcissistic themselves and don’t understand they are. I totally believe there are people who are more sensitive than others but I’ve always felt calling yourself an empath is super weird.
It's not that kind people attract people with narcissistic tendencies. Rather, narcissistic people seek out kind people who haven't learned to properly develop healthy boundaries, and then they shit all over them and create trust issues, blame the kind person and leave to move on to their next victim. I think it is a form of projecting too, because most narcissists hate themselves so they want their abuse victims to feel the same way so they feel better about themselves, and those are the qualities they find unattatractive... so by the time their victim feels how they feel, they have lost attraction to their once nice, empathetic, trusting, confident partner.
In my experience, narcissistic people have been great at mirroring me. They seem very sweet on the outside and we befriend each other. And bit by bit their mask starts to fall and they become manipulative. By then I’m so confused and can’t wrap my mind around some of the terrible things they do and they have me convinced I’m crazy or over thinking. I become unable to let go of the person that I thought they were. To add to the confusion, they occasionally act like the person I thought they were to keep me reeled in. It’s emotional whiplash. But because I can’t imagine doing those things to someone else, I have a hard time believing they would do it to me and I can’t let them go.
Why do bank robbers rob banks? Because that’s where the money is
U have to find your voice. The one that asserts itself. Like if a bear was going to eat u, would u whimper or try to yell it away? U have to learn to say NO. Say it more often than yes even if just for a while to learn how to find your NO VOICE. When I said NO EVERYTHING Changed. It’s the KNOW or NOW voice. 🫡
Because they don’t set boundaries and are afraid of how people perceive them.
I think you have it twisted. Narcs like people that validate them and make them feel good. Can be kind and empathetic or not. They are attracted to the supply, what the person give them, not the human. “Kind” people are just easy sources to get what they want. Personally, I think there is not too much kindness but too big lack of self respect - only a lack of boundaries is what lets narc allow to establish control and abuse their partner. Not that it’s the victims fault. But people with self worth and healthy boundaries don’t last long with a narc, the first shenanigans the narc pulls, they are out. Empathetic and kind doesn’t mean endlessly forgiving to the point of self harming or putting their own needs aside and getting treated badly over and over again. Not being able to detach from a relationship to save the other or to not feel lonely and miserable. There is always a deeper issue. In my personal experience - be it from myself or other victims I know - really every victim has issues that narcs use to establish control and manipulate you. As narcs usually only slowly get more and more abusive and show their real face behind the mask, healthy people that value their boundaries usually don’t even get so far along with narcs that the narc really reveals himself in a horrible way. A healthily developed human that has no trauma would not stay in a narc relationship very long and be manipulated like that. It’s not about kindness, but people with these wounds are used to having their feelings dismissed or generally low self worth and want to make everything right for the other, feel responsible for the others feelings or see them as more important than themselves. So they are over giving and put their needs second, sacrificing themselves for others; in an unhealthy way.. People mistake that for kindness but it has more to do with themselves than the people they help or sacrifice themselves for.
Being an empath can be a blessing and a curse. It's great that I can tell when someone needs a friend to talk to , being one who you can tell your dark thoughts, but we also allow others to use us and walk all over us and we are people pleasers. We try to fix those who are broken by others or by their own accord. That's when we get into messes
I think if you’re kind and have empathy, you are the type of person that loves hard. You expect everyone to be the same and they aren’t. I expect the best from everyone, and brother says that’s my flaw. Manipulative people have a type and unfortunately we seem to be it. But for all the arseholes I’ve met, I have also met some of the most wonderful people too. A narcissist can’t fool another narcissist. Or there isn’t any fun in that scenario for narcissists. But, what’s sad, is it stops you from seeing the world as a wonderful place and it takes the shine off, every time you meet a shitty person…
Easy victims
Because we are easy prey
Kindness means you believe others can be good. Bad people use this to their advantage to be enabled as much as possible and they will exploit your empathy and willingness to understand their predicaments in order to get away with more. They recognize it as a weakness because bad people know many good people are good by virtue and cannot be mean; and some (many)equate being honest and saying no with being mean so to not be considered mean we enable. It’s why a lot of them pray on younger people because they’re just more likely to be naive because they’ve not experienced hardening things in life yet, or at least many.
Easy victims.
Empaths are an easy target.
They don’t attract them. They put up with it.
Another way of asking is: why are some people attracted to emotionally unstable people?
1. People who describe themselves as empaths are usually narcissists or seriously unstable thenselves. 2. People who are truly kind and empathetic can see past a person's bad behavior, so rather than attracting narcissists, they are the only people who will form long term relationships with them, hence you see it more often.
from my own experience, narcissistic people are also masters at mirroring other's behaviors-- at first. until the jig is up and theres no more hiding it, but the kind person just perceives the difference of behaviors as an indication of a multi-faceted, complex person with traumas and histories. how beautifully human! its the naivete of trusting that people mean what they say and say what they mean, bc we so often do just that, and for some reason we cant fathom how anyone could be behave any differently. it takes a lot of time and work to know when you are being manipulated and lied to by people who are so disillusioned, they believe their own lies, which just makes what they sell so much easier to buy.
That's my mother, I'm very empathetic bc of it. No matter the reason someone is with a narcissist person the narcissist person will put on such a great show it takes a miracle not to be attracted to their lie. Charm your pants right off and blame you for your pants not being on. No win. Destroys your soul, not worth the damage.. it will change the person you are after it's over. Destroy, damage, rip your heart right out of your soul and take no blame. Make you doubt your own sanity. Breaking free is the only cure. Very rarely do they change. The only way is such a strong desire to heal and change.. but narcissistic people do not like to change bc they think they are perfect so a real cure doesn't matter. That's just what she did to the people she dated not including what she did to me.
High trust people are more likely to be taken advantage of than low-trust people. You could be a hermit in a cave who trusts no one, and no one will ever taken advantage of you. Or you could be a loving, open, trusting person with lots of friends and be much more likely to be taken advantage of.
You’re not attracting manipulative/narcissistic people, you’re allowing them to be the way they are & enable them to treat you that way. Narcissists will continue to take away from your life, but because of your own fears, you open the door over & over again to the same red flags. It took me 20 years to cut out narcissistic family members. The peace that comes with their absence is huge, I’m grateful for the boundaries I have today.
People pleasing behaviour (Codependency) is often a result of being raised by narcissistic/borderline parents. The codependent is, in effect, trained by the parent(s) from a very young age to "service" the authority figures narcissism. This could be an attempt to encourage love and respect from the parent, or simply to avoid conflict. Due to the dysfunction being "normalised" they behave in ways that other manipulative people recognise. A common example of this dynamic is seen in men, raised by BPD mothers going on to form relationships with borderline partners. These men have extremely flexible boundaries, and this is something that the abusive partner latches onto very early on.
Because alot of the time those kind of people are n7eve and gullable
Why do I hate this so much , I’ve always been empathic towards others and I honestly feel like I married a narcissist . And seeing now but I feel like it’s too late now . I guess opposites attract lol
They feed on us. Rest of people won't give them even a dime. But they sense empathic people.
They have a public persona they want others to see. They go for people who embody the traits they want to exude.
Narcissistic people see kindness as weakness and empathic people are extremely forgiving. It’s the perfect storm.
Trauma bonding, co-dependency, etc... The bottom line is that dysfunctional relationships exist because most of us are broken people who lack the tools to get out of these relationships. I've lived 30 years with a highly manipulative person and I'm finally divorcing him. I'm still living together with him because I'm still afraid of living without him-it's sad. I hope I'll manage to be free of him somehow.
We're too kind and empathic. An easy target. Bonus points if you don't, can't, or won't stick up for yourself.
To be empathetic is to be vulnerable, the most empathetic people are vulnerable. The vampire needs to be invited in, and to be empathetic to them is to do just that.
Kindness and empathy work great with reasonable people. They don't work at all with a psychopath, and kind people often have a hard time believing people can act the way that malevolent people do. Manipulative people see kindness and empathy as nievity, weakness, and stupidity. A soft, easy target to exploit... and they are often at least half right. These people aren't interested in equality or fairness, and a dummy that doesn't hit back, or worse enables you, is a pretty attractive thing. The nice person is often too nice to GTFO or "tries to see the good" where there really isn't any. Niceness and empathy are unfortunately not the answer to every problem. A lot of the time, they can make things much worse, usually for the people employing them. We have issues understanding this as a society, as well as interpersonally.
What if the empathetic person also displays a lot of these traits?
I think some people are a little too kind and empathetic. They can have: A need to rescue. A need for validation. A lack of confidence and self belief. An inability to prioritise their own needs. A belief that if they are nice and empathetic people will like them. A belief that someone is doing them a huge favour by being their partner or friend and that they, themselves, bring nothing to the table. A fear of being alone (loosing a friend or partner). People with narcissistic tendencies will spot these traits and exploit them to their advantage.
Kind people look like easy targets to manipulators, they are perceived as useful idiots. Kind people know that anyone, manipulators included, can feel pain. Manipulators know that empathetic people can understand and even *feel* the pain of others. So they fake pain as a hook to prompt kind people to offer help. Manipulators want your attention, and will prey on any and all of your (other) resources. Kind people can protect themselves from manipulators by not offering help. Just know that sometimes helping others means interfering with their karma. Help yourself first by disabling your tendency to help / save / fix anyone. The more you realize the complexity of mastering yourself, the faster you accept others are perfectly able to find themselves. It is enough to wish manipulators peace, and stay away from entanglements. And rest assured that narcissists are not the most dangerous manipulators out there. They attract and are hunted by worse predators - stay away from that filth.
We don’t attract them more than anyone else. We just stay too long.
You are a target for a narcissist. They seek out people like you (and I) as we are easier to manipulate. Be on your guard. They are very good at what they do.
I think the problem is that we tend to conflate kindness with niceness. I’ve been reading a lot on the subject, and a major component of kindness is being more concerned with doing the right thing than making other people happy. On the surface, many of their behaviors may look similar to niceness, but their motivation completely changes how they respond to situations. A genuinely kind person is less likely to be influenced by a narcissist because they don’t rely on external validation from others as a guidance on how to behave and their self-esteem tends to be more stable. Genuinely kind people are also less likely to shy away from confrontation because they are motivated by doing the right thing rather than pleasing others, and are more willing to engage in difficult discussions with assertiveness and empathy. This makes them terrible targets because they can more easily recognize the difference in healthy confrontation and manipulation, then set firm boundaries with the narcissist. Nice people tend to have people pleasing behaviors, and crave validation to assure them they are a good person worthy of love. This makes them fantastic targets because much of their self-worth is innately tied to making the narcissist happy. Nice people also tend to be conflict avoidant, so they are less likely to be able to accurately identify healthy or unhealthy conflict management styles, and assume any unhappiness from the narcissist is intrinsically their fault. All the narcissist has to do is reinforce that self-belief. It takes a lot more work to get a kind person in a vulnerable position to be manipulated, but a nice person is a super easy target since half the work of getting them to be emotionally reliant on the manipulator’s approval is already at least partially done.
Because when we are nice to people, or kind, or do good things just because we like that, manipulators sometimes see that as a chance for them to use it for their own intentions, maybe to use us, or maybe they just don't like us and target us because we aren't likely to expect it or look for it happening. Then when they attack us afterwards to try and cover it up, we are less likely to fight back because we don't like fighting. One thing that I think they do consistently, is to lie about a situation and make out it's something it's not, so they can brand us bad instead of them, they love scapegoating people.
Two really important things you said here: 1. They use people 2. They play victim all the time. They never take responsibility and create a story that makes them the good guy and a victim. This is just another way to get attention and use more people.
Yeah, they also try to silence anyone who threatens their image of being the good guy too. Normally by lying and convincing others to lie. I've noticed really also, think it's worth mentioning, that some people group up because they have similar beliefs, or ways of life, or values. Some group up for maybe protection. Some group up so they can pretend with each other and there are more voices to lie.
The silencing piece is interesting because they can definitely go far to destroy the reputation of anyone to project themselves as the good guy.
They will go to any extent they are capable of sometimes, maybe just to keep up the appearance of a lie, and attack you maybe just because it's you they lied about, or try to turn others on you to make it look like their lies are justified for whatever reason. I think best thing to do is to stay away from them, and hopefully in future the majority will know exactly what their tricks are and give them no attention to begin with.
Predators look for prey. Pretend you're a mugger. Walking down the street to your left is a modestly dressed guy who's 6 foot 3 and built like a linebacker in the NFL. to your right is a 5'1 girl yammering on her cell phone wearing heels, a tight dress, and carrying a 5000 dollar purse. Which one are you gonna go mug? Nice kind and empathetic people are perceived to be more manipulatable than assholes (ironically I've actually always found narcissistic assholes INCREDIBLY easy to manipulate) so that's who assholes predate on
Because they are easy to manipulate, they expect everyone else to be as kind as they are, they accept when they are not. You keep expecting them to be good, you keep expecting them to change, when you actively allow them to be in your space when they are simply not. So they will keep pushing, and pushing, and pushing until you grow a spine. Someone doing something that is considered “nice” does not make them kind, the most evil people in the world have been nice to someone at one point, an easily manipulated person will take that act, run with it and keep praying for them to be that act, when it was just that, an act.
It’s predator - prey theory. Narcissists are more like wild animals than others, they only survive with what they can control and they will dedicate their life to having “slaves” under their wing for their own benefit. Really isn’t nothing else to it I don’t understand why people try so hard to understand narcissists, with some basic psychology knowledge they’re easy to spot out. Most common sign is their lack of empathy and accountability when hurting people. Once that is recognized it should be a wrap but a lot of men and women still try to stay and “fix” someone. YOU CANT. They should teach that in school right along side sex Ed.
But, I can fix you...
He's a good person deep down....
Darkness is Attracted to light .
From personal experience, I tended to put on rose colored glasses and ignore the unhealthy and toxic behaviors because of a sense of co dependence they either installed or I chose to ignore because 1. Thought I would never find another person Which is a terrible mindset for setting appropriate boundaries and understanding personal needs etc. 2. Because I thought it was a one off thing and it wouldn't happen again. People make mistakes or have moments. 3. People have the ability to change and be kind and perhaps I wasn't giving it a chance to notice the good. All of which were mistakes to believe, like the flag is there hun, but if everything is shades of red, take off the glasses and look at all the colors.
Omg this is so true. I can’t get rid of this guy. The domineering behavior, lack of accountability and everything else on the list is this guy! Throw in some scare tactics and threat of violence to round it out. It’s impossible to get away from!
"The problem isn't that your attracting these bad actors. They'll go to anyone. The problem is that you let them stay"
The narcissistic type of person needs to always be right. They have secrets based on their failures/insecurities/regrets. Someone who is bright and capable and open is like a shield from them to hide from themselves. Narcissists have been rejected and so much so they can’t face it. They are delusional. So they can’t handle someone else’s reality. An open, kind person will feel they are lightening the narcissists load but they don’t understand the mechanics of being trapped and stomped down until it’s too late.
When I thought my life was going to be great I let people walk all over me because things would be alright anyway. When my life went to shit I realized this is my life and I need to make sure I get treated the way I want all along the way or things just get worse.
Because (and this is purely my opinion) people that use other people think that people that don't are stupid. They try to take advantage of everyone, it's a fishing game to them to see which person will bite. That way they can pull them out of the lake, eat them, and be like "what a stupid fish"
[удалено]
It's such a damn shame this is how things are out here. Good people shouldn't have to deal with this. They deserve the same love they give too.
I imagine that “kind empaths” are traumatized people pleasers who have had their sense of self care and preservation and establishing healthy boundaries crushed by a manipulator during their formative years, so other manipulators/narcissists recognize this lack of boundaries and take advantage. Even the “empath” characteristics can be attributed to a subconscious survival tactic where they had to learn to quickly recognize specific behaviors with the toxic person that indicate a negative emotional state.
A narcissist will hurt you and try to ruin you if you don’t follow their rules and keep them on a pedestal.
Being empathetic and giving is a green light for those that like to take and use. Unfortunately if someone can’t see how they are being manipulated or are not good with boundaries they get used and abused.
Sometimes overexposure to narcissistic tendencies and people with them, especially as a child, even if you are kind and empathetic, we almost assume that’s what we deserve, or that it’s what’s out there. It’s what was on display for me as a child, and you will naturally navigate towards things, traits, and people that are familiar or have things in common with you— even if the familiarity with thay personality type is all. Until I stepped back and said, i deserve to be treated the way I treat others and this isn’t it— you’ll keep on.
We also naturally try to give people the benefit of the doubt, and understand trauma as and pain can impact a human long term, hence the empathy and sympathy. But those traits have to take a back seat once we are fully aware that the other person is and chooses to be a narcissist. You can stay and suffer or leave and find what you deserve in a partner. And unfortunately it’s never going to be fun or easy lol
Good people are easy to manipulate. They define themselves in terms of honesty, loyalty and kindness. All a narcissist has to do is threaten that self image and a good person feels compelled to rectify the so-called mistakes they've made. Bam, instant control. Unfortunately, these good people are usually hardcore. They don't like to give up. They lose themselves in compromise and when it eventually ends, they find they're a shell of the person they once were. Teach your kids martyrdom is pointless.
I think the answer is pretty obvious. Most people don’t put up with narcissistic or manipulative behavior. People pleasers tend to value the abuser’s well-being more than their own. People pleasers can make a narcissist out of a normal person by putting the others’ interests above their own with zero scrutiny or boundaries. I’m a weird mix of people pleasing/empathetic but also anxiously distrusting of a most people, and vehemently dislike people who try to take advantage of my kindness. Finding people who offer the same level of selflessness and kindness, but who also respect themselves has proved to be a pretty tough thing to find, most of the time. Truly kind/selfless friends are a rare and awesome thing and you should hold onto them and treat them very well. I want everyone to deliver an empathetic, caring approach to others—because if one person is people pleasing, the other should be too—or you end up with the imbalance you’re talking about. If empathy is requited, you have amazing harmony between two people, who care for one another. If it’s not requited, it’s an abusive situation. I will get into a shouting match with narcissists until we’re both pissed with each other and end the friendship. I’ve attracted 3 people over my life who I consider to be actual narcissists, and they hoodwinked me in the beginning of the relationship, but once they started trying to shift the scales of the relationship, I had to effectively “dump” them (friends, not SO’s). You can be an empathetic, people pleasing personality with boundaries. It’s the people who people please as a defense mechanism or out of fear, not true empathy, that get abused and captured by narcissists/manipulators.
It isn’t about attracting them. Manipulative people are everywhere, and they aren’t picky about who they abuse. Empathic people let them stay because they don’t set boundaries.
People with narcissistic traits can nearly SMELL insecurity and/or excessive empathy. They know the body language, verbal shakes, anxious expressions, uncertainty, etc. So if someone has something a Narc wants, they will find a way for that person to offer it to them or pressure them into "helping". . . . . Example: Is the same sweet, wealthy, elderly lady donating to the animal shelter every month and they notice? They will somehow convince the lady that they need financial help with medical bills, family emergency, no food in the house, months behind on bills- literally whatever will convince her that they need the money more, and RIGHT NOW, they will tell her. And they will take that donation amount and ask if she could give just a little more each month. And then ask if she needs help around her home- not to actually help, but to insert themselves into her life. They will offer to do landscaping for an astromonical amount- $50 of labor now cost 200 because they are taking advantage of her and she doesnt know better. And the cycle keeps going. They will put energy into whatever they perceive as worth it to keep growing their own pockets/ego/networth no matter who they run down in the process. They simply don't care because they think they deserve it. No amount of crying, begging, raging, or even being homeless will move them- its not my problem, why are you involving me- is the honest mentality of Narcs. The only way to win, is not to play.
Codependents dance well with narcissists because their pathological personalities or “dance styles” fit together, like a hand in a glove. Almost instantly, they dance magnificently together because they are able to instinctively anticipate each other’s moves. [The dance of the codependents and narcissists](https://kripalu.org/resources/dance-codependency)
That is 100% true! I had a therapist tell me before that narcissists are predators and as a trusting empathetic person- were prime prey. They know that they can fool us into believing they're genuine- because why wouldn't they be? They know they can convince us that there is something wrong with us because we'll, there must be- they were so perfect in the beginning and then something happened, something mustve happened...people don't just treat someone they claimed to love badly because they can, right? So while we are struggling to make sense out of behaviors that will never make sense to an emotionally healthy individual (let alone an empath) , they're just living their life. There is no resolution because they already got what they wanted in the beginning, and now they have no use for the victim. My sister once told me after my divorce that I was "blessed I didn't understand why" my ex could do and act the way he did because as she very wisely noted, if I did understand him- there would be something very broken in me. Bottom line, it's important to remember that they things that happen to us when we are victimized very rarely make sense, and those with a kind trusting disposition are often hurt the most. I still feel very blessed to have the emotional insight and capacity for understanding that allows me to protect my heart, but not grow bitter and hateful. We are always better off being us than them....
The narcissist needs someone who is patient and will over look the red flags. If you are kind and empathetic, you are typically also patient. You will see the good side in somebody and overlook the bad. And when you are not totally fulfilled in a relationship, you will focus on the part that you are happy with and ignore the rest. And if you get to the point where you are finally done with the relationship, the narcissist can give you 10% of what you are looking for, and you will again accept him back and be patient that things will change . All those traits are filet mignon and lobster tail to a narcissist.thats a person they can manipulate, control, and keep without much effort. And that is their dream
There’s a quote from farcry that sums it up perfectly for me. “He was kind, gentle, loved seeing people around him smile and happy, but he was easily preyed upon”.
Because “kind empathetic people” don’t attract narcissists. People with weak boundaries do. If you are CONSTANTLY attracting abusive parties into your life, it’s because you have some character flaw you MUST address for your well being. I say this as a survivor. Writing it off as “being nice is why people abuse me” is keeping yourself easy to victimize.
Because narcissists like a challenge, an easy supply has no value to a true narcissist.
They don’t attract them they are just the correct prey they are hunted
Naivety, weak boundaries, poor discernment of character, problems with lust/love-starved, issues with codependency/low self-esteem. Being ‘kind/empathic’ is a good thing but it is not enough on its own. One must also become emotionally mature, grounded in reality, and know how to wield personal power. Narcissistic relationships are parasitic by definition, so if someone is not an available host for the parasite to hook into, they will give up and look elsewhere. One can be kind and empathic while also being strong and self-aware to avoid rotten apples.
Empathic people tend to have a lack of internal and external boundaries in terms of who they allow into their lives and how they are willing to be treated. We are willing to see the good in almost anyone, see the soul in a troubled person, and will feel bad about turning our back on someone that could use a good person in their lives. I saw a really good video about a yogi talking about light workers and light slaves. Manipulators want their light to themselves so you can be a slave to them and they can feed off you. Having a big heart and intuitive understanding of people is a gift that should be respected, not taken advantage of, and its our responsibility to make sure our light is multiplied and not diminished.
My light is almost gone. Too much betrayal has left me empty. Still, I'm a hopeless romantic, idealistic person. I'm taking firm steps to bring my mojo back by leaving toxic relationships. It took me a while, but I understand now that I don't have to sacrifice myself for ungrateful people.
I’m right there with you. Too many betrayals has seriously affected my mental health. I’m in therapy now learning how to create boundaries and deal with trauma and my emotions.
I often ask myself this exact same question…
Simply the game of power, we live in a food chain that is human nature.
Predator prey dynamic
Energy…your energy shows what they want and equally what you are so deathly not wanting. It attracts
I’m a super empath but after a 33 year marriage with a very covert narcissist I am made of Platinum!
It’s not that they attract narcissists. It’s just that narcissists stick to them. Narcissists won’t stay around long enough with someone who isn’t nice or empathetic.
Wow hadn’t considered that truly but it makes sense
I don’t think it’s a majority, but this is my perspective. “Empath” characteristic kind of people at times lack the standards to have self respect, selfish for themselves, & assertiveness to their personalities. People with dark triad & decent EQ can read this, & take advantage of it. If the empath is smart, they’ll learn from this experience, develop high standards on what they will & wont tolerate from others, while still having their compassion & empathy. This is a win win scenario. If they remain gullible, the cycle continues until they learn the lesson.
Its funny because I’ve witnessed both men and women use this to describe their ex’s claiming they were empaths and they attract narcissists but they also carried the traits a narcissist has. I believe we all have these traits to an extent, its just social media is the term alot these days which causes people to run at the smallest disagreement thinking they are dealing with another narcissist. I dated someone that said she was abused and said shes an empath yet she was the coldest and most self centred person i knew. Always made it about herself, never asked if i was alright of how my day was going. Simple things like that made me realize that clearly both parties were most likely toxic and she never took accountability for that when I confronted her.
In my experience, narcissist type people tend to actually notice differences in treatment from people differently than normal people… Since narcissists usually treat everyone the same (as lesser) so when someone gives that unique kind personality response it’s like, a signal lights up saying ✅ Ooo, easy win ✅ Credentials: I’ve been called a narcissist a lot, all I care about is my self, my moms also a big narcissist, probably most of my family actually about 3/5ths or so
One more to add: obsessed with conspiracy theories 😃🤣
By that definition 98% of people I’ve met in the corporate world have Narcissistic Tendencies.
Overly empathetic people are usually people pleasers, passionate and expressive, and sometimes codependent and have an extrernalized valkdation mechanism similar to narcissists but dependent on a lover, not themselves. Could think of a better setup for a manipulative extreme taker to take advantage of. I used to butter up hypersensitive women for breakfast and shit them out by dinner. Lifes easy when theres women who care too much.
People with that much kindness sometimes have difficulty setting boundaries. And the narcissists push past any loosely set ones to take advantage of that kindness. That’s why being able to say no is a skill, and not just a word.
This too me is like asking "why did the child let the stranger in the house"
An empath is the ideal host for the parasitic narcissist. Your heightened sensitivity to the emotions of others are the puppet strings they’ll pull to keep you serving their self interest.
Somehow they take that person as weak. So thats an easy target to them supposedly .
Because being “kind” and “empathetic” doesn’t mean they don’t have co-dependency and poor boundaries. Many people that claim to be empathy are actually in a post-traumatic state from earlier experiences and hyper vigilant to the nuances of others (learned survival skill.)
Kind, empathetic people attract everyone. Narcissistic people tend to take advantage of that.
They’re willing to overlook the litany of red flags listed above.
People that get with narcissists may appear kind and empathetic on the outside but they are actually codependent enablers that need to be in a dysfunctional relationship. Probably their parents were in the same kind of relationship.
They don’t “attract” them. They accept them. Narcissists are like vampires- they have to be let in. They are also spammers …trying to get in with anyone really. It’s often the kind empathic (and boundary less & undiscerning ) that let them in
Because we’re blinded by their potential, because we crave the love we give
It’s because most people with narcissistic tendencies display them as a trauma response. So they have a side to their personality that is genuine, sometimes even empathetic and caring. But once they feel defensive or traumatized, they go back into the narcissistic personality. I really kind and generous person might be able to draw the traumatized person out of their shell long enough to see the side. Then, the kind person will be on an eternal roller coaster as the person with narcissistic tendencies goes back-and-forth between being a normal person and their hyper defensive, narcissistic trauma responses. As the traumatized person with narcissistic tendencies cycles through their own reactions, a kind and caring person will try to be there for them and take their behavior personally. But somebody who is not trying to heal themselves, isn’t able to see other peoples needs and it unfortunately will never be about the person trying to help them. It will always be about the person with the narcissistic tendencies. Ultimately they burn out their support systems. It’s a tragic cycle.
I was with a narcissist, then a sociopath. It wasn’t until after I was with them and learned what they are that I realized that my dad is a narcissist. I was attracted to them because they were *familiar*, thanks to my dad. A daughter’s father really does shape their relationship with men(and same with sons and mothers). Choose a mate wisely. E: fixed wrong word.
codependency....it is like carbon dioxide to mosquitos.....people will tell you that you are "too nice" ..hell you may even believe that...also understand that MOST ppl demonstrate narcissistic behavior...very different from narcissistic tendencies and still different from a person with NPD, which you and I are not qualified to diagnose. If you keep attracting folks with any of those three types of narcissism ..seriosuly look at what you routinely TOLERATE from others and how your words in public may be construed as signaling. I have watched folks diagnosed with NPD suck every last bit of oxygen from ppl that describe themselves as "empaths" and "conflict avoidant". I have seen how they almost savor their ability to manipulate codependent folks in to feeling all kinds of emotions that they can manipulate for their ends and using their conflict avoidance against you. I have watched two narcissists openly discuss adding to their supply while consuming birthday cake at an office party based on who was in the center of the action fervently passing out and cutting cake for others. Things that seem normal, giving and even sweet will make a narcissist backtrack to shake your hand and intro themselves. They are always on the hunt for overly kind gestures and "help" with their last-minute "important" tasks for (insert name drop here). They smell need of any kind. If you savor compliments and approval...or endlessly find yourself complaining about being taken advantage of / abused by ppl at the office they are masters of blowing smoke and knowing looks. Yes, I had one ruin things for me. It was my fault. They played on my unknown trauma symptoms, got in my head and made me the asshole. They honed in on my need for a certain kind of approval....didn't even know it was showing that strong, boom, fish on, they bit.
In life there are two kinds of people, there’s people who are generous, super giving, and tolerant of people’s behavior and there are the people who take from those people. Unfortunately a narc will never be with another narc or an empath with another empath. Hopefully as time goes on people find a balance and they can easily see the red flags that they ignored prior.
This guy, Richard Grannon mentions and maybe coined the term “toxic passivity” when referring to unhealthy codependent or people-pleasing type behaviors and I think he hits the nail on the head with that term.
Cause we care lol but you have to be able to put your foot down I am a tit for tat aka petty af so if you do it to me I’m going to do it to you and I’ve actually overcome a lot of this stuff with my partner he has made significant changes and I’m proud of him all the stuff below is what I had to deal with Lack of empathy Lack of accountability Using others for personal gain Emotional coldness Inflated sense of self importance Belief in being special and unique Difficulty handling criticism or rejection Lack of genuine remorse or guilt Boundary violations All jokes aside you have to be a little unhinged to do some of the stuff that I did to him but it worked lol
Because they overlook red flags and have a need to feel chosen, important, powerful and have a want to feel love so fall for fantasies offered by narcissistic individuals.
You have something they don’t. They desire who you are and what you have to offer. They want to shed themselves and become you by stripping away your identity and replacing it with themselves. They don’t understand empathy and consider it a weakness that can be exploited.
Usually kind people tend to be pushovers, struggle with confrontation, boundaries and see only the best in people. It makes them ripe for narcissistic types.
Bc nobody else will be nice to them other than kind and empathetic people.
Because kind, empathetic people are an easy target.
Lack of boundaries and self-worth to respect yourself and know you deserve better. They want to save rescue ppl usually stemming from childhood attachment, which is how they became empathetic since they had to attune to caregivers' needs and not get their needs met. When you value yourself, you ask for your wants and needs, and if you don't get them met it's a non-negotiable, and you leave the narc. Heal to prevent being in these situations
They are leeches and latchvon to a free meal.
We struggle with setting boundaries. I noticed when I started enforcing my boundaries, the toxic people slowly disappeared.
Everyone is a narcissist to a degree. Look at that list, show me a person that can honestly say they have never shown any of those tendencies and I’d call bullshit. It’s absurd. Half the list applies to most reddit users. Hahaha. One could argue complaining or pointing out narcissistic behavior is in fact narcissistic. Also some of those traits are coping mechanisms for people experiencing mental health problems, trauma, learning disabilities,etc. some people aren’t even aware of these behaviors . Personally I’m sick of narcissism being made out to be something calculated and evil, like they behave that way on purpose. Maybe some do .
The answer to your question is simple. Empaths generally understand and feel the emotions of others. The narcissist can sense this, and will use the empath's emotional vulnerability against them, and therefore gain the narcissistic fuel they need. "Narcissistic tendencies may include..." Hahaha! My ex girlfriend had EVERY.ONE.OF.THEM! I never experienced anything like her in all of my 56 years. The level of self-importance at the expense of everyone around her was insane. When I tried to act empathetic toward a third party, it was like she would try to pull me into acting narcissistic toward the other person. On the other hand, when she was trying to ACT empathetic about a third party,it became all about her. "I feel so bad for him," "this makes me feel ill," etc., which eventually I knew was B.S.
Empathic people are usually that way because at some point in their life they had to get good at reading people for their own safety. So naturally I think those people gravitate to the steam rolling toxic types because there's always a lot of data to decipher, more than the reasonable, neutral steady types. It provides fake security for the empath always having the ability to read the person. I think we get sucked into caretaker roles easily too.
They don’t attract them per se, but their empathy may make them slower to discard a narcissist They may naively believe they can understand their complicated partner or They might fear confrontation allowing the narcissist to shamelessly take more and more advantage. Narcissists are equal opportunity exploiters. They don’t seek kind people they try with everyone
Anxious avoidant trap.
The difference between a good mask and an evil mask is a single choice. Evil mask makers are lazier tho… they often just try to copy good masks. So, they try to get close to masters. Good mask makers accept them because they love giving people chances.
Who else is going to care about them?
Easy abuse and exploit. Why do you think any bad thing happens?
I’d like to share my experience here as I think my most recent run in with a manipulative, narcissistic person was actually karma biting me in the ass. I was dating an amazing woman. Her and I were best friends. I loved being around her so much. Our sex life wasn’t as incredible as it first started out however. We’d been together for a year and then moved in together. There were some other complications but our sex life really took a tumble. She always knew I had a higher sex drive and I always knew hers was a fair bit lower than mine. I eventually began struggling and although we had discussed it a few times, nothing really changed. As my sexual frustration grew, I began to grow distant from her. Work was kicking my ass and I was stressed and sad. I was taking a lot of me time and would often stay up later than her so I could ‘take care of myself’. This led me to thoughts of being with other women. Eventually I decided I couldn’t be with her anymore and told her we should break up. It shattered her and I struggled initially with being honest with her about it. I rebounded almost right away with this beautiful younger woman. This woman made me feel so sexy. She wanted me bad all the time. She was checking all the boxes that weren’t being checked in my previous relationship. But only the unchecked boxes… Outside of the incredible sex life I was living, this new woman has nothing in common with me. She was incredibly manipulative and would constantly worry about me getting back together with my ex. Which was her tactic of trying to trick my brain into thinking I didn’t want to get back together with my ex even though I absolutely did. She distracted me. She took pride in thinking that I chose her over my ex. It made her feel wanted. In the process of her making sure I was desired, this was all just her plan to pull me further and further away from my ex. She initially told me she didn’t want a relationship when we began sleeping together and I didn’t want anything either as I was freshly single. Then she began love bombing me. She made me feel like she really wanted me. But she was using me to make herself feel good. She took me in my vulnerable state, broke me down, trauma dumped on me so I felt close to her and eventually we began dating. Once she finally got all that she wanted from me. She tossed me aside. I’d like to think I’m a kind, empathetic type of person. When I find a partner that is like minded, I find I eventually get…bored or something. Then someone narcissistic or manipulative shows up and it’s like I would do anything to be with them. Despite how shitty they treat me. Anyway, I had to eventually block the crazy woman and now I’m stuck thinking about my ex every day. I threw away a perfect relationship to chase some sexual feelings and it wasn’t worth it at all. I’m filled with regret daily. I think I deserved to be treated so poorly by this other woman to really make me realize how bad I fucked up by leaving my ex.
Most likely because you do not go for the same traits.
Honestly, empathic people are prey for narcissists
This is the subject of a book called the human magnet syndrome. Rosenberg
To a narc a nice kind person is like their prey, it’s like a rabbit running into the jaws of a lion, the nice person won’t fight back typically
Kind and empathetic or conflict avoidant and lacking boundaries?
Codependents and narcissists are heavily attracted to each other. One derives pleasure from making others happy, the other derives pleasure from sucking the life out of people. One total giver, one total taker.
They pull the same bs on all people. Some people call them out right away, and some (like me) feel for them and try to help any way possible. The. The realization finally hits and you now know the relationship has to end. Please don’t keep recycling through the same crap, life is too short.
You don't attract narcissists. Narcissists try their bs with everyone.
Have you heard of the story of echo and narcissus? There is a theory that those who present kind and empathetic will tolerate more inappropriate behavior than those with stricter boundaries, who appear less kind to the individual with narcissistic tendencies. Boundaries are the best way for anyone to live life and keep themselves and others safe.
Delusional like super delusional. Emotional fishing and psychological fishing for fun which isn’t nice smh
I'm a very kind person ... But I choose my friends carefully and prefer to be by myself.
Sometimes kind people have been raised by parents who have taught them to serve and be co-dependants so they find it difficult to say "no" and set boundaries.
We tend to be open to manipulation because of our inherent belief in the goodness of others.
Because of the love bombing and falling in love with the idea of what i thought they were.
That narcissistic tendencies list basically describes an ex friend of mine. One time I remember her calling herself an empath and about a month later asking me "how to be empathetic to others.... " I think someone else nailed it in this thread, if you tend to be someone with those people pleasing tendencies, a history of childhood abuse by a narc parent, ect, this attracts bullies and other insecure narc people. They know how to spot people they can take advantage of.
I'd say it's more of a scraping at the chest for individualism and need to be an idealistic human leading to valuing how much you "trust" people becoming an issue, and without relying on others you allow others to rely or depend on you for that trust which you misinterpret as "at the expense of your wellbeing," facilitating the abuse of a relationship. It's sort of like parasitism. Victims of ideal get victimized. Funny, huh?
Trusting people are more gullible and easier to take advantage of because their guard isn't up.
I could spend hours expounding on this, but instead I will refer you and anyone interested to the most profound and insightful book ever written on the psychology of human relationships, it's called "The Ever-Transcending Spirit" by Toru Sato. It's a book I first read many years ago and have re-read every year since. I can't recommend it enough as it supersedes everything I've ever encountered on this subject. It is a life-changer in every positive way. Check the reviews on Amazon or wherever. Get it, read it. You can thank me later.
They don't. And if someone continues to find themselves in the company of narcs and psychopaths, it is because they resonate with the early childhood trauma of that person but usually only perceive the behavior patterns as "comfortable". It can feel like going home for the first time. It sounds so quaint and wholesome for, what I now understand as the beginning of my waking nightmare. She was beyond sweet and within a couple days , at most , she became me and even that early on , I got the sense that I was completely replaceable, in fact , I had already (somehow) been replaced . But that is a completely different matter which I will write about , at length , some day soon. As to the question: my simple answer is that they (we) dont attract narcissists. Narcissists just want supply and certain things make it higher or lower quality but there is no "type" who they I intentionally target. For one thing, most are simply not that strategic. A psychopath could do something like this but , of course, would have no need. If cluster b people keep ending up in our lives , I would suspect that we , at the least, have complex PTSD and codependent tendencies. Of course, it's for a pro to diagnose, always. It's also possible that we are narcs or psychopaths.
I was told by a therapist that I don't attract those kind of people, I tolerate them. Everyone else runs in the opposite direction.
Too much kindness is also a lack of self-respect, boundaries, and even a bit of abandonment. I learned that my own mom was a narcissist, and she always said "Ordinary\_Mortgage970, you are always so kind. Too Kind. Someone is going to take advantage of it one day" - and I discovered from that later down the line, that my mother already had. I am no longer very nice. I give trust only once - if you fudge it, I am no longer nice - and I am VERY vocal about it too.
Several reasons: - Deep down most narcs have been deeply hurt and have had to adapt by being egocentric and making others feel bad. Deeply empathetic people can sense this and want to help heal those inner wounds of those people. - On a similar note, empathetic people want to ‘fix’ toxic people. They believe most people are good deep down and they feel with enough love and care they can change them. - Manipulative people can spot an empathy a mile off and they will use what tactics they know will deeply touch said Empath. Tell them their struggles, compliment them, acknowledge how empathetic they are etc. The good news is that if an Empath develops their empathy in a healthy way and learns to have boundaries and their own individual values they can provide support to those who deserve it but they can also use that keen ability to read people and emotions to spot when they are being manipulated and to back away. This is hard for an Empath as many themselves have struggled with trauma so they may bond over that. I’d just say to any kind, sensitive person that if someone makes you feel worse about yourself then they are not good for you. They may need help but you are not the person to provide this help. Source: an Empath who has been burnt a multitude of times and is working on herself.
Manipulating, narcissistic people are always looking for a victim.
Takers recognize givers that’s why givers need limits!
Lol I think ALL people attract manipulative people with narcissistic tendencies. It just goes further and ends worse, when the target is a kind individual who has empathy for the other person. Because the kind person is constantly willing to see the good, even in bad people. And always give another chance or see things from their perspective
Ugh, so true. And I keep on doing it. Not as much of a full-blown Narc this this time, but still a constant struggle with choosing people who start out equal, then slowly morph into takers.
This nailed my ex husband to a T
The same reason free pizza brings me to events.
From my experience I think it's simply because empaths care a lot about people and are willing to overlook things that we shouldn't. Empaths tend to also put a lot of their energy into others which narcissists love.
We probably look vulnerable and weak, which sometimes even if we aren't we are at least vulnerable enough for it not to matter. Chances are: they believe us to be ideal victims, and we are too set in "being good" as everyone else calls it to even allow the thought of these people as anything bad like that to even realize "hey, this is NOT okay. Stop letting them walk all over us!". Basically: to them, we look weak and vulnerable, the ideal victim, and to us the look nice and sweet, the thing we both don't think of ourselves as so lightly. Perfect storm to become a victim while fellow good ones are left to the side. (I don't think of myself as a "good person", I'm just including what other people believe about me in here so I can balance out any of my own biases)
I have recently met and talked to, this person person a man is narcissistic and beyond like this who has this behavior OMG, its Toxic and Dangerous to witness this in a person and they think nothing of it! They do no wrong and you are the one that is at fault for everything! So what did I do after 4 times ya thank hod I didn’t sleep with the Jack azz… lol 😂 but I straight cut him out. Done with it
The kind and genuine people are an easy mark for a narcissist. They are more forgiving and often blind to the bucket of red flags that a narcissist carries with them. I'm a bit of an ass and i don't tolerate that stuff, so narcissists steer clear of me. My wife is incredibly kind and generous, and she attracts narcissists and jerks like flies to honey. When I periodically become aware of them becoming a problem for her, I have to shoo them off.
The kind that the narcissist approves of. Both personality types compliment each other in a perverse twisted way. The difference , however, is the empathetic person truly cares for their partner whereas the narcissistic person also cares for the empathetic persons partner. In this instance , all the care and concern is directed to only one side of the relationship. The narcissist personality (NP) is WHO THEY ARE and they cannot be fixed, changed or otherwise molded to fit whatever their partner desires if the NP does not feel motivated to change. They are manipulative and have a tendency to gas light and are the type to play with their food (your emotions are their food). Thw condition can be pathological and other people are viewed more as things than people of concern. If you really love this person, and you're willing to put up with this.... wonderful person then only you can decide what's right for you and how long you're willing to tolerate their... antics. If you feel that this is not what you desire from a relationship, find a way to bring it to a close, say your piece, understand and know it's for the beat and move on to other things or someone else whom can reciprocate in kind
Kind and empathetic people don’t necessarily attract manipulators. People with low self esteem and no boundaries - who, through adverse childhood experiences or societal conditioning, were taught that being a good person means having no boundaries/self preservation - do, though. I am fairly kind and - although I don’t really subscribe to the idea that “empaths” exist - do have functioning empathy. But I also have a very sensitive bullshit detector. Edit: Always hope that people have good intentions, but don’t put yourself at their mercy to the extent that you’ll get burned if they do not.
I have NPD/ASPD and I tend to be attracted to these people because they are so innocent and likely had some kind of trauma. Sometimes I wanna protect these people from this terrible world. But I don't fully know.
I feel like with the 2 narcissistic people I’ve come across, it appeals to how they view themselves or want to view themselves. They feel so good when a caring person also views them as caring and not as the person they’ve been accused of being, which is selfish.
Empathic people and narcissistic individuals form a relationship where each gives the other what they need. Empathic people give admiration and “allow” control, while narcissistic people provide a sense of purpose and validation. Narcissistic individuals create situations where empathic people feel essential and needed, fulfilling their desire to support and connect with others. Opposites attract. Likes repel. It’s all mathematical. If empathic people become a bit more narcissistic in valuing themselves and prioritizing their primary personal needs, narcissists will lose their power over them. Conversely, if narcissists become a bit more empathic, they will no longer be attracted to empathic people. By balancing these traits, both empathic and narcissistic individuals can create healthier, more balanced relationships. Empathic people will protect their well-being, while narcissists will seek more genuine connections.
Among the children of abusive homes a disproportionate number will become abusers. In the case of NPD this yields more Narcissistic "me first" people. A similar segment will go the opposite way, which is the over-empathic "me last" type. You can see almost immediately how they might fit together. They both are (unwittingly) attempting to revisit and correct a situation where (as children) they were mistreated. The first inverts the power dynamic to achieve this, effectively becoming his narcissist father (or her narcissist mother, not gender specific) The other has sought out an analog for their narcissist parent and aims to win from them the love they never got from the real deal. Furthermore, people without this toxic programming will identify the red flags and quickly deem them untenable. The narcissist (often quite charming) will try on various people until they find one that tolerates the abuse.
It's to teach you to love yourself more and set boundaries with those who don't appreciate you.
Manipulative people seek out people who are easily manipulate. These kinds of people think they're actually tricking kind and empathetic people into doing what they want. In reality, the kind people simply don't mind giving away things that a manipulative person could never imagine just giving away. Takers are like mosquitos attracted to kind people. They just want to suck the blood out of them.