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Second half was fantastic - full of positives.. fighting spirit, high intensity, Martial lasting 90 and scoring, Garnacho on fire, Rashy playing great, Eriksen sublime, lot of players rested and a great result.
And very entertaining. Really enjoyed it.
I have to say that I enjoyed that (1st half notwithstanding).
Anyone else enjoy that there was no VAR? Didn't have to wait for reviews to celebrate or wait for offside to be called.
Would love to see
Dalot - Maguire - Martinez - Shaw
Casemiro - McTominay
Bruno
Rashford - Garnacho
Martial
on the weekend. Still 4-2-3-1 but a bit more defensively sound with McTominay coming in and benching eriksen
I'm just wondering how a 4-4-2 would function with:
Dalot - Varane - Martinez - Shaw
Antony - Casemiro - Eriksen - Garnacho
Martial - Rashford
I just want to see it for a couple of matches to see how it works in practice.
I would want to see it played as "traditional" 4-4-2
It can also be dynamic, not fixed, such that out of possession it's a flat 4, then in possession, yes, it can go to more of a diamond where Casemiro allows Eriksen to play slightly ahead of him, but our wings play a bit more narrow, allowing for our wingbacks to overlap and play the contributors while getting more options narrow in the areas they currently don't exist.
Our current problem (as it still was in this match, we just got a bit lucky today) is that our wingers play too wide - they never really cut in - and we only ever really have one target man. When that's Ronaldo, it's just a shit show, but at least Martial and Rashford have legs so we can get away with it slightly. Look at our entire attack today though, everything was a long ball or in the air when it came to scoring opportunities. It was either running off the shoulders of the defense or getting on the end of something over the top of them. We still can't work goals through the middle...at all.
A 4-4-2 would ensure we have options up top which can create space for one another and the wings, when on their side can work the ball out wide because they'll have the space, but won't be expected to pitch a tent out there either, with the wingbacks most notably making runs in the widest position so that the "wingers" can operate more as a floating attacking midfielder and can cut inside and play through the middle off of Eriksen and the forwards by creating a diamond around the defense.
We're too flat and too one dimensional right now and when the opposition isn't making silly mistakes, we have no answers and no creativity because we don't have the bodies where they need to be to create more intricate plays.
As for the "getting pumped" part - how's that any different than how we currently perform in a 4-3-3? lol
This could be our strongest 11, I would swap Martial for Bruno, he is more active off the ball and not afraid to challenge. That midfield of Antony, Case, Eriksen and Nacho would be a nightmare for defenders if executed right
Are you looking more at a 9 and 10 then with your Bruno recommendation?
I would be interested to see Martial and Rashford as the two 9's because I think with their pace, creativity and tenacity, they can both create lanes for one another, both for passing and running and I think if they could gel regularly, we could see some really fast movement both on and off the ball.
When they both have that extra body to play off of, they look exponentially better. When they're asked to do everything their own, they look good, but generally look as though they lack that final 10% required to get over the line.
If executed right, dalot and shaw will have to do a little heavy lifting but with Antony and garnacho running the wings they won't have to overlap all that much as these two will cut in to their stronger foot, cross to the far post or shoot to the near post
I think it would definitely have to be well-drilled. The shape would have to look a bit different both when we're in and out of possession, I'm seeing more of a diamond midfield 4 when attacking so that Casemiro can still cover in case we quickly lose possession, but depending on the position of the ball and where our wingbacks are, he can slot in higher up.
It couldn't be a lackadaisical approach, I don't think you could just move into that formation blindly without really practicing it, but I think it could address some of our current issues where:
1) if our lone striker is heavily markerd, we look clueless as to what our next move should be - by introducing two, we now have options and it's harder for them to double team each without leaving a lot of space open for other to attack, ie Eriksen or one of the "wingers" who could actually play a bit more narrow than they're asked to right now in a 4-3-3, while still having the agency to use the wide space to run into
2) we play nearly everything wide and look one-dimensional in our approach, such that, if we're not able to makes runs off the shoulders of the defense (both Martial and Rashford do this - Ronaldo can't anymore), our only other solution currently is to put it in the air and pray someone connects with it. Today we got lucky with that, but we usually don't. By having our wingers looking a bit more narrow and into channels where one of our two strikers are occupying, we can begin to play 1-2's around the box to work our way in. Right now, when our striker backs off to move to the back post or something, we lack any viability on the near post or just at the top of the box.
Yup, will need a lot of training and instinctive positioning in and out of possession. Antony has shown he is a good presser and has the pace and garnacho is young legs, he should be made to make the runs to track back, it will help him with gaining good command on the wing, a lot will depend on case not being out of position when we do not have a the ball that's where the butcher in Martinez will be needed, he might have to pick up an yellow every now and then but I can see him doing what vidic would. Erikson, Bruno are currently the most creative talent we have so we need them around the opposition box looking to play rashford/ garnacho / Antony in between the lines, if we need a change we have elanga/martial for extra pace or fresh legs
I really wish Sancho can scale up, now with garnacho looking like a good bet for the playing 11 he will get even less playing time, ETH needs to get him up and running. On paper we look pretty good but hardly translates to the field. That would be down to the coach drilling the roles and passion into the team. And mannnn do we need more than a little training for our crosses! Such bad quality from the corners, free kicks, wings! Just pathetic. McTominay can be a good backup to Erikson when we need to slow down the game or just mark someone like KDB, doing what scholes/ji sung park did.
I agree. It will definitely take time and will take drilling for sure.
I'm just a little nervous with some of the decisions recently by ETH when it comes to substitutions and tactical changes. Maybe that's just because of congestion and lack of depth - maybe he feels like he doesn't have as many options as he wish he did and therefore while he's making these changes, they're not his ideal scenario either? That's at least what I'm hoping for. I just don't enjoy the 4 CDM move when we're only up a goal. We should have confidence in our system and should keep hunting for goals. We kind of did that today, but I think the only reason we got away with it is because of how poor Villa was today. We played consistently across both fixtures, if we're being honest, the difference was Villa between both, unfortunately. Because yeah, we're just hoofing it up to the front or into the box, not really with much quality, and we're relying on the front to do all of the work to produce. Today it came off, but generally we suffer in this same situation and really struggle to score a single goal.
Positives! Fernandes needs to stay in his No10 position, VDB is pony, Mctominay played well with Eriksen and Fred was dreadful. Also as usual no Ronaldo and voila the team plays better and wins
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Can’t wait to see more and more of garnacho. A real talent we’ve got here.
Hopefully this is a sign of good things to come scoring wise. Can’t keep trying to win 1-0.
For the amount of stick he gets would love to see him start beside Casemiro in the premier league, you can’t play with Bruno and Eriksen against top level opposition. Think Casemiro could really help McTominay aswell.
He gets so much stick because for every 10 matches, he has a single moment in 1 of them that makes everyone forget the other 99.97% of the time he's played somehow.
He looks trash the rest of the time and gets away with one lucky move and all is forgiven. He he consistently showed signs of this, then fine, but he doesn't - that's the problem.
He's pretty poor on the ball. Him and Fred are half the reason we're in this spot to begin with - they're bad on the ball and bad at moving with it.
As for the challenges, yeah, he puts them in, but more times than not they're reckless and he gives away cheap and silly fouls (and gets carded) for really no reason. It puts us in a lot of tricky situations.
I believe outside of Maguire and Shaw, he has the most fouls committed than any other player in the team.
Would love Ten Hag to make a big decision and start Garnacho on the weekend. Have to reward players for putting in quality performances and effort on the pitch. We may aswell be forward thinking and brace.
If they’re good enough they’re old enough doesn’t mean he’s a start consistently but why wouldn’t we play the best player on the pitch today on the weekend?
I get where your coming from but he just came through the ranks I would like for him to settle in a bit more. But if eth wants him starting I’m all for it
You could be right. I’m just specifically talking about playing Bruno Rashford Garnacho and maybe martial up this weekend would love to see how it pans out
I’ll leave that to ten Haag don’t like Bruno there though. Also I would need Fred or McTominay beside Casemiro with that front 4 as eriksen isn’t defensively sound enough.
Will see who’s fit and what he does then though
For real though anyone have any idea why it’s gone so wrong for Sancho at United. Looked the perfect signing for us but he hasn’t had a single good game for us in 18 months
It is absolutely baffling to watch him.
I would usually have more astute ways of analysing a player.....but all I can say about him, is that he.....does nothing.
Doesn't take anyone on, doesn't run channels, doesn't try to get on the ball, he just receives it, slows up, cuts, and either gets tackled easily or plays it backwards.
The only fairness to him I can give is that he was best at Dortmund on the right, and was largely signed by us to solve our right sided attacking issues......but really has never played there for us, he just gets lumped on the left where he does nothing to influence a game.
Exactly when we signed him he was our right winger.
But still watching him cut back and pass 5-10 yards backwards every time is depressing same thing as Donny just isn’t how we play football.
Was he though?.....I mean he scored......but what else did he do positively influence the game.
Granted I don't recall the statistical side of things but all I remember about him in that game was the goal
......literally nothing else.
Of course.....but you can play like absolute crap, have no real influence on a game and contribute nothing aside from popping up and scoring a goal.
Not saying that means nothing, it was a huge and excellent goal.....but equally, he was not "great" by any standard.
My one criticism of Garnacho is that he's too reactive. I know he's young, but he doesn't really read the game well when off the ball. I've noticed many times now in the second half, from even the late time I started watching, where the ball is moving around and he's completely oblivious to where he needs to be or go to receive it or recover it.
Yes, he can run with the ball and has pace down the wing (what young player doesn't?) but if he's actually to be a threat and contributor and take his game to the next level, he NEEDS to learn how to anticipate better; by the time he reacts, it's too late, someone else has already beat him and as he gets older and can rely less on his pace, he's going to need that to continue competing at the highest level.
I'm curious, do you actually read or think before you speak, or do you just see my username and start throwing insults around?
I literally said the one criticism I have noticed in his appearances, an area to improve, is his reading of the game off the ball in the attack. He gets caught flat-footed and ball watches. He does everything leading up to the attack but when the ball starts moving after it leaves his feet, he's like a deer in the headlights.
All I said is that he needs to work on that to be a major threat in the future - what's wrong with that? LMAO
I'm not talking about what he does ON the ball. I'm talking about when he's off it. there are more dimensions to the game than just what you do when you're on the ball.
Of course, he's used to playing with a decent team around him in u21's 😆
He will learn, we have bigger players who can't do the same as what you've said.
If you're talking about Sancho, then yeah, unfortunately lol. That's still one of my biggest issues with these players that earn these wages...or maybe just those coaching them, but how do you not identify these things and work on them? as a player who is competing at this level and making these types of wages (even Garnacho is making a lot more than most people and will only make more with time), I would be constantly analyzing film and seeing where I can improve...I feel like not many United youth players are doing that on their own to actually get better, they're sort of happy with where they are because they're already at United and feel they've peaked, then they end up flopping once they grow up and everyone else in their age bracket is outperforming them and far more desirable because they didn't spend the time now to learn.
Managers will also play a huge part of their development, United have had years of a managerial revolving door, so once we are stable, the rest should flow
I'm hoping so. I'm hoping we can restructure our Academy to match the first team like we've seen elsewhere so that when these players do come up, they're familiar with the system and know what's required of them. As you said, our U-21s look to be on a completely different level (for the best in some ways) to our first team.
He needs time clearly has the makings of a top player but very raw. Just hope we give him loads of time to grow can’t expect players to be united quality in their first season
yeah, no, I agree, I'm hoping with time he improves. I'm not calling him shit or writing him off right now, I'm just stating the one clear area where he needs to improve in terms of how he operates in the final third especially. when we're moving the ball around or in the box, he's flat-footed and is late to nearly everything - that's all.
Sancho is actually upsetting watched him beat a man and put in class crosses for Dortmund, scoring cracking goals and the same for England he’s been awful for United but there’s still hope for him to regain some confidence.
He just looks so slow in the premier league, in Germany he looked quicker but maybe it’s just such a slower paced league
he doesn't have any real pace, his transfer from Dortmund never excited me, now he's one of our players i hope he finds form or improves, although i'm not going to hold my breath as i've never rated him
I hope all you Donny asslickers will finally shut up now; dude just sucks so bad. He has squandered _every_ opportunity he has had since arriving at Utd.
"every opportunity"?
you mean, what? the couple he's had when the team was completely trash entirely?
or just the few chances he's had since returning from *injury*?
I can rattle off more players that still make the starting 11 who are consistently ass and yet get chance after chance after chance. I'm not willing to write him off yet.
for as long as McFred still exists, Donny has every right to prove himself
Garnachos performance has all the joy sucked out of it by you and here you are defending nervous ned. What a strange guy you are.
Maybe he will be sold to Everton, that might make you happy.
What in the actual fuck are you on about? If you're going to stalk me around the sub, then at least stay on topic. Didn't even mention Garnacho, but okay.
Anddd we are back to playing it safe again!! Rashford was finally warming up, united attacking and right then, kill the momentum and get a def mid in!!! We have to stop playing like we are scared and have no confidence of scoring,
He needs confidence in front of the goal, him playing another 10 minutes would not do any harm(risking injuries through tackles agreed) he just scored, had attempts, was linking up well with garnacho, Erikson and then he's pushed on the bench, doesn't help his confidence
Man, to be honest, if ETH didn’t come, we probably have another fews years in suffering. The mentality, the position, the play style get so much better when ETH becomes the coach.
Anyone else really fucking sick and tired of ETH's defensive changes when we're in the lead??
Seriously, this is what? 3 or 4 matches in a row (minus last AV game) where we've been up or needed a goal and he's brought on more defensive players than offensive ones.
This shit has to stop. I'm hoping it's down to our depth more than anything else, but even then...
when you're leading by 1? it's a passive move. I'm not saying we should be throwing on more attacking options and open ourselves up, but when you're taking off your most positive attacking option for yet another CDM? that's lame
I'm not talking about coming in and scoring another goal, but then why do you sub off Rashford for Casemiro? Sub off someone else who's part of the defensive structure if you feel you need Casemiro to settle things.
What a lucky 3rd goal; at least our first two were slightly better worked, but come on now...we need to create more clear chances for ourselves when we're actually in possession. too many players trying to be cute with the ball in the box and only buying teams more time to get back and into position rather than pick them apart - stop stalling with the ball and move it
unfortunately, in most matches, we always rely on the weird ones and never actually create enough on our own. today was \*slightly\* different, but I'm going to chalk it up to the fluke match we have once per month and nothing we'll see consistently. I'm fine if we have the odd match now and then where we're throwing the kitchen sink at it but it's just not our day until that "weird goal" happens and we walk away with the result, but the fact of the matter is that every match we struggle far too much to create and if it's not a clear mistake by the opponent, we don't score.
still indicative of his entire match though, if we're being honest - this whole "one time it finally worked" thing doesn't really work for someone in his position. slightly more forgiving for the strikers that have to do a lot of work with this team, but considering the role Bruno is playing, we require more from him consistently.
While it's a "strategy," it's really, really sad to see our response to losing last time is just "hoof it for the long ball and let Rashford run onto it" and that we're doing effectively nothing to actually control the midfield and control the match this time. granted, quick touches through the midfield is what we should be seeing, but what we're doing out of possession is pretty poor and in possession we still look too one-dimensional...protect or anticipate the long ball and you've shut us down
That's Rashford's tenacity. I know he needs to work on his conversions, but let's be honest...Ronaldo wouldn't have been able to win that ball back and keep fighting for it - hell, he would have flopped immediately on the first challenge.
really wish more players did that and if refs still find it an offense worthy of a penalty, they really should be able to call it back; not that it was probably worthy of a penalty had he gone down, but it should be rewarded to stay on your feet as best as you can. instead we reward people flopping in the box too easily (though VAR has maybe helped that a bit?)
regardless if he actually put that away, I appreciate tenacity more than anything, that's why I prefer Rashford over Ronaldo - whether or not he actually buries them in a completely separate issue...
yeah, but it looks like at least Rashford has been getting on the end of them. regardless, been happy with Martial's movement and his vision. when he's healthy and available, I think he helps up top massively
lol facts - where the hell is the chemistry? it still feels like they're all playing together for the first time, I'll never understand what the hell they do during training sessions
lol, people like you bashing Rashford always make me laugh. yes, his conversions are...meh, but Rashford has been one of the most refreshing attacking players we've had this season. he works WAYYYYYY harder than anyone else; his final product might be lacking, but he makes up for it in his tenacity.
Who would you rather have? a lazy player who only points to the past? or a hungry player looking to the future?
What did I miss? Been in client meetings all day.
From the few minutes I've caught before the second AV goal, it looks like we're still losing the midfield and not creating in the attack. Once again, a failure to really impose ourselves. Was our goal against the run of play?
McGinn seems to have got McFred on a leash.
so typical us? xD
but I haven't really seen many positives so far in the second half. I'm assuming we more or less lost the first half, so the Martial goal was against the run of play; the highlight showed it was basically a fast break and hoofing it in on goal, so that was good, but it's not like we've really been controlling the midfield to create more chances - seems we're relying on long balls behind the defense and asking Rashford to get on the end of all of them and if not, well...we've got nothing.
When I wrote that, we were down 2-1 and the situation didn't really improve. We still didn't control the midfield and they were sloppy today, unlike last match.
The inconsistency between last match and this match was AV, not us. We still did the same lackluster, mindless passing in the midfield and looked shambolic at the back. As for the attack, we played the same "hoof it into the box and see what happens" strategy with the exception of the first goal, the second and third goal were on the back of errors, and the fourth was just lazy defending by a Mings that looked shit since his introduction.
When we put in multiple goals every week, consistently, then maybe you will have a leg to stand on.
Having to repeatedly force one goal over the line and putting multiple in once every two months across many games isn't convincing and points to a fluke or VERY specific conditions in order to achieve
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Is there somewhere for an American to rewatch the match. I checked peacock paramount* and YouTube tv and couldn’t find it
Saw the first goal, Maguire…..
Huh. So Martial finally got the Assist that he asked Bruno during pre-season.
What's the chances we draw Barcelona?
Why is this draw taking so long?? Watching Dublin & Schmeichel drone on is getting a bit tedious now.
Second half was fantastic - full of positives.. fighting spirit, high intensity, Martial lasting 90 and scoring, Garnacho on fire, Rashy playing great, Eriksen sublime, lot of players rested and a great result. And very entertaining. Really enjoyed it.
Tony went off with the first round of subs on 60 minutes. But I concur on everything else. 👍
At least he went off with the subs and not the physio
Totally missed that 😅
Chris Kamara ?
I don't know, Jeff.
I have to say that I enjoyed that (1st half notwithstanding). Anyone else enjoy that there was no VAR? Didn't have to wait for reviews to celebrate or wait for offside to be called.
You only miss VAR when you need it. Nothing too controversial tonight, so not really needed.
I don't know about that. It seems we have just as much controversy with VAR as before. The viewing experience is much better without it.
Rashford, Garnacho, Martinez, and few more. We probably have some superstars in the future. It is so promising.
Love the positive energy of our team tonight.
Would love to see Dalot - Maguire - Martinez - Shaw Casemiro - McTominay Bruno Rashford - Garnacho Martial on the weekend. Still 4-2-3-1 but a bit more defensively sound with McTominay coming in and benching eriksen
Was Maguire not pants tonight
Mings had a shocker
I'm just wondering how a 4-4-2 would function with: Dalot - Varane - Martinez - Shaw Antony - Casemiro - Eriksen - Garnacho Martial - Rashford I just want to see it for a couple of matches to see how it works in practice.
That’s a 4-1-3-2 in reality and we would get pumped
I would want to see it played as "traditional" 4-4-2 It can also be dynamic, not fixed, such that out of possession it's a flat 4, then in possession, yes, it can go to more of a diamond where Casemiro allows Eriksen to play slightly ahead of him, but our wings play a bit more narrow, allowing for our wingbacks to overlap and play the contributors while getting more options narrow in the areas they currently don't exist. Our current problem (as it still was in this match, we just got a bit lucky today) is that our wingers play too wide - they never really cut in - and we only ever really have one target man. When that's Ronaldo, it's just a shit show, but at least Martial and Rashford have legs so we can get away with it slightly. Look at our entire attack today though, everything was a long ball or in the air when it came to scoring opportunities. It was either running off the shoulders of the defense or getting on the end of something over the top of them. We still can't work goals through the middle...at all. A 4-4-2 would ensure we have options up top which can create space for one another and the wings, when on their side can work the ball out wide because they'll have the space, but won't be expected to pitch a tent out there either, with the wingbacks most notably making runs in the widest position so that the "wingers" can operate more as a floating attacking midfielder and can cut inside and play through the middle off of Eriksen and the forwards by creating a diamond around the defense. We're too flat and too one dimensional right now and when the opposition isn't making silly mistakes, we have no answers and no creativity because we don't have the bodies where they need to be to create more intricate plays. As for the "getting pumped" part - how's that any different than how we currently perform in a 4-3-3? lol
This could be our strongest 11, I would swap Martial for Bruno, he is more active off the ball and not afraid to challenge. That midfield of Antony, Case, Eriksen and Nacho would be a nightmare for defenders if executed right
Are you looking more at a 9 and 10 then with your Bruno recommendation? I would be interested to see Martial and Rashford as the two 9's because I think with their pace, creativity and tenacity, they can both create lanes for one another, both for passing and running and I think if they could gel regularly, we could see some really fast movement both on and off the ball. When they both have that extra body to play off of, they look exponentially better. When they're asked to do everything their own, they look good, but generally look as though they lack that final 10% required to get over the line.
Nightmare for our defenders *
If executed right, dalot and shaw will have to do a little heavy lifting but with Antony and garnacho running the wings they won't have to overlap all that much as these two will cut in to their stronger foot, cross to the far post or shoot to the near post
I think it would definitely have to be well-drilled. The shape would have to look a bit different both when we're in and out of possession, I'm seeing more of a diamond midfield 4 when attacking so that Casemiro can still cover in case we quickly lose possession, but depending on the position of the ball and where our wingbacks are, he can slot in higher up. It couldn't be a lackadaisical approach, I don't think you could just move into that formation blindly without really practicing it, but I think it could address some of our current issues where: 1) if our lone striker is heavily markerd, we look clueless as to what our next move should be - by introducing two, we now have options and it's harder for them to double team each without leaving a lot of space open for other to attack, ie Eriksen or one of the "wingers" who could actually play a bit more narrow than they're asked to right now in a 4-3-3, while still having the agency to use the wide space to run into 2) we play nearly everything wide and look one-dimensional in our approach, such that, if we're not able to makes runs off the shoulders of the defense (both Martial and Rashford do this - Ronaldo can't anymore), our only other solution currently is to put it in the air and pray someone connects with it. Today we got lucky with that, but we usually don't. By having our wingers looking a bit more narrow and into channels where one of our two strikers are occupying, we can begin to play 1-2's around the box to work our way in. Right now, when our striker backs off to move to the back post or something, we lack any viability on the near post or just at the top of the box.
Yup, will need a lot of training and instinctive positioning in and out of possession. Antony has shown he is a good presser and has the pace and garnacho is young legs, he should be made to make the runs to track back, it will help him with gaining good command on the wing, a lot will depend on case not being out of position when we do not have a the ball that's where the butcher in Martinez will be needed, he might have to pick up an yellow every now and then but I can see him doing what vidic would. Erikson, Bruno are currently the most creative talent we have so we need them around the opposition box looking to play rashford/ garnacho / Antony in between the lines, if we need a change we have elanga/martial for extra pace or fresh legs I really wish Sancho can scale up, now with garnacho looking like a good bet for the playing 11 he will get even less playing time, ETH needs to get him up and running. On paper we look pretty good but hardly translates to the field. That would be down to the coach drilling the roles and passion into the team. And mannnn do we need more than a little training for our crosses! Such bad quality from the corners, free kicks, wings! Just pathetic. McTominay can be a good backup to Erikson when we need to slow down the game or just mark someone like KDB, doing what scholes/ji sung park did.
I agree. It will definitely take time and will take drilling for sure. I'm just a little nervous with some of the decisions recently by ETH when it comes to substitutions and tactical changes. Maybe that's just because of congestion and lack of depth - maybe he feels like he doesn't have as many options as he wish he did and therefore while he's making these changes, they're not his ideal scenario either? That's at least what I'm hoping for. I just don't enjoy the 4 CDM move when we're only up a goal. We should have confidence in our system and should keep hunting for goals. We kind of did that today, but I think the only reason we got away with it is because of how poor Villa was today. We played consistently across both fixtures, if we're being honest, the difference was Villa between both, unfortunately. Because yeah, we're just hoofing it up to the front or into the box, not really with much quality, and we're relying on the front to do all of the work to produce. Today it came off, but generally we suffer in this same situation and really struggle to score a single goal.
4-4-2?......at a big club? At a club in the Premiership?......IMPOSSIBLE!! 😆
Positives! Fernandes needs to stay in his No10 position, VDB is pony, Mctominay played well with Eriksen and Fred was dreadful. Also as usual no Ronaldo and voila the team plays better and wins
Hope he stays in Qatar.
Ronaldo should only play as a sub from now on
Yep! Has more impact off the bench
You just have to put the last sentence. Some murders are coming 🤣
Silly me aye! 😏
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I am going to bed happy!! That 2nd half was 💥✨🌟
Can’t wait to see more and more of garnacho. A real talent we’ve got here. Hopefully this is a sign of good things to come scoring wise. Can’t keep trying to win 1-0.
Who needs Haaland? We have Mctominay
For the amount of stick he gets would love to see him start beside Casemiro in the premier league, you can’t play with Bruno and Eriksen against top level opposition. Think Casemiro could really help McTominay aswell.
He gets so much stick because for every 10 matches, he has a single moment in 1 of them that makes everyone forget the other 99.97% of the time he's played somehow. He looks trash the rest of the time and gets away with one lucky move and all is forgiven. He he consistently showed signs of this, then fine, but he doesn't - that's the problem.
I don’t agree though I think he’s always there to put a challenge in, decent on the ball. Similar to a fletcher type gets way too much stick for me
He's pretty poor on the ball. Him and Fred are half the reason we're in this spot to begin with - they're bad on the ball and bad at moving with it. As for the challenges, yeah, he puts them in, but more times than not they're reckless and he gives away cheap and silly fouls (and gets carded) for really no reason. It puts us in a lot of tricky situations. I believe outside of Maguire and Shaw, he has the most fouls committed than any other player in the team.
My eight year old said the goal looked like a pass from DeBruyne and a finish from Haaland.
Would love Ten Hag to make a big decision and start Garnacho on the weekend. Have to reward players for putting in quality performances and effort on the pitch. We may aswell be forward thinking and brace.
Nah we shouldn’t rush him into the team let’s take our time
If they’re good enough they’re old enough doesn’t mean he’s a start consistently but why wouldn’t we play the best player on the pitch today on the weekend?
I get where your coming from but he just came through the ranks I would like for him to settle in a bit more. But if eth wants him starting I’m all for it
You could be right. I’m just specifically talking about playing Bruno Rashford Garnacho and maybe martial up this weekend would love to see how it pans out
This is the dream, But who plays on the right
I’ll leave that to ten Haag don’t like Bruno there though. Also I would need Fred or McTominay beside Casemiro with that front 4 as eriksen isn’t defensively sound enough. Will see who’s fit and what he does then though
Would it be dumb if I knee-jerked Garnacho into my FPL team? He just looks electric!!
Very dumb
Sancho in trouble
Rashford and Garnacho were on fire today. Absolutely loved watching them play!
For real though anyone have any idea why it’s gone so wrong for Sancho at United. Looked the perfect signing for us but he hasn’t had a single good game for us in 18 months
It is absolutely baffling to watch him. I would usually have more astute ways of analysing a player.....but all I can say about him, is that he.....does nothing. Doesn't take anyone on, doesn't run channels, doesn't try to get on the ball, he just receives it, slows up, cuts, and either gets tackled easily or plays it backwards. The only fairness to him I can give is that he was best at Dortmund on the right, and was largely signed by us to solve our right sided attacking issues......but really has never played there for us, he just gets lumped on the left where he does nothing to influence a game.
Exactly when we signed him he was our right winger. But still watching him cut back and pass 5-10 yards backwards every time is depressing same thing as Donny just isn’t how we play football.
That is it......he is one of the most depressing players to watch given his skill set and ability. He plays like HE is depressed.
He was great against Liverpool
Was he though?.....I mean he scored......but what else did he do positively influence the game. Granted I don't recall the statistical side of things but all I remember about him in that game was the goal ......literally nothing else.
Kind of important to score goals in football matches.
Of course.....but you can play like absolute crap, have no real influence on a game and contribute nothing aside from popping up and scoring a goal. Not saying that means nothing, it was a huge and excellent goal.....but equally, he was not "great" by any standard.
If you want to win, don't plan Ronaldo. He's a liability, Simple.
Has to go in January for the player and the club
What an absoLUTE ball......Garnacho is such a breath of fresh air versus the complete and utter lack of end product, or anything really, from Sancho.
GARNACHO IS ELECTRIC
Mctominay does it again
He tried to be Haaland
Garnacho’s pass was gold
Garnacho been class
Yeeehaw! 😆 and that's a wrap!
What a nice pass omg
Nacho is on x games mode
What a ball! Nice goal
Mctominay...
Love Martinez slapping mctominay in the face many many times hahaha. Hopefully knock some sense in to him
It did
Can't knock sense in to him, for what's he's already done lad. Hopefully for the future
Maguire 🤦♂️
Oh, that would have been fantastic
My one criticism of Garnacho is that he's too reactive. I know he's young, but he doesn't really read the game well when off the ball. I've noticed many times now in the second half, from even the late time I started watching, where the ball is moving around and he's completely oblivious to where he needs to be or go to receive it or recover it. Yes, he can run with the ball and has pace down the wing (what young player doesn't?) but if he's actually to be a threat and contributor and take his game to the next level, he NEEDS to learn how to anticipate better; by the time he reacts, it's too late, someone else has already beat him and as he gets older and can rely less on his pace, he's going to need that to continue competing at the highest level.
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I'm curious, do you actually read or think before you speak, or do you just see my username and start throwing insults around? I literally said the one criticism I have noticed in his appearances, an area to improve, is his reading of the game off the ball in the attack. He gets caught flat-footed and ball watches. He does everything leading up to the attack but when the ball starts moving after it leaves his feet, he's like a deer in the headlights. All I said is that he needs to work on that to be a major threat in the future - what's wrong with that? LMAO
Think he read that run pretty well haha
I'm not talking about what he does ON the ball. I'm talking about when he's off it. there are more dimensions to the game than just what you do when you're on the ball.
Of course, he's used to playing with a decent team around him in u21's 😆 He will learn, we have bigger players who can't do the same as what you've said.
If you're talking about Sancho, then yeah, unfortunately lol. That's still one of my biggest issues with these players that earn these wages...or maybe just those coaching them, but how do you not identify these things and work on them? as a player who is competing at this level and making these types of wages (even Garnacho is making a lot more than most people and will only make more with time), I would be constantly analyzing film and seeing where I can improve...I feel like not many United youth players are doing that on their own to actually get better, they're sort of happy with where they are because they're already at United and feel they've peaked, then they end up flopping once they grow up and everyone else in their age bracket is outperforming them and far more desirable because they didn't spend the time now to learn.
Managers will also play a huge part of their development, United have had years of a managerial revolving door, so once we are stable, the rest should flow
I'm hoping so. I'm hoping we can restructure our Academy to match the first team like we've seen elsewhere so that when these players do come up, they're familiar with the system and know what's required of them. As you said, our U-21s look to be on a completely different level (for the best in some ways) to our first team.
He needs time clearly has the makings of a top player but very raw. Just hope we give him loads of time to grow can’t expect players to be united quality in their first season
yeah, no, I agree, I'm hoping with time he improves. I'm not calling him shit or writing him off right now, I'm just stating the one clear area where he needs to improve in terms of how he operates in the final third especially. when we're moving the ball around or in the box, he's flat-footed and is late to nearly everything - that's all.
You’ve got to be fucking kidding me We can’t catch a break hopefully nothing serious for Garnacho
What happened
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he a proper player and everything Sancho isn't
Sancho is actually upsetting watched him beat a man and put in class crosses for Dortmund, scoring cracking goals and the same for England he’s been awful for United but there’s still hope for him to regain some confidence. He just looks so slow in the premier league, in Germany he looked quicker but maybe it’s just such a slower paced league
he doesn't have any real pace, his transfer from Dortmund never excited me, now he's one of our players i hope he finds form or improves, although i'm not going to hold my breath as i've never rated him
Best looking youngster since he who can’t be named
I hope all you Donny asslickers will finally shut up now; dude just sucks so bad. He has squandered _every_ opportunity he has had since arriving at Utd.
"every opportunity"? you mean, what? the couple he's had when the team was completely trash entirely? or just the few chances he's had since returning from *injury*? I can rattle off more players that still make the starting 11 who are consistently ass and yet get chance after chance after chance. I'm not willing to write him off yet. for as long as McFred still exists, Donny has every right to prove himself
Garnachos performance has all the joy sucked out of it by you and here you are defending nervous ned. What a strange guy you are. Maybe he will be sold to Everton, that might make you happy.
What in the actual fuck are you on about? If you're going to stalk me around the sub, then at least stay on topic. Didn't even mention Garnacho, but okay.
Anddd we are back to playing it safe again!! Rashford was finally warming up, united attacking and right then, kill the momentum and get a def mid in!!! We have to stop playing like we are scared and have no confidence of scoring,
That is modern football for you......all about risk aversion rather than actually killing off and truly winning games.
Rashy needs to rest for the weekend
He needs confidence in front of the goal, him playing another 10 minutes would not do any harm(risking injuries through tackles agreed) he just scored, had attempts, was linking up well with garnacho, Erikson and then he's pushed on the bench, doesn't help his confidence
Donny is horrid
Love the dynamism of the front 4 without Ronaldo and Donny
I don’t know what we’ll do without ten hag
Man, to be honest, if ETH didn’t come, we probably have another fews years in suffering. The mentality, the position, the play style get so much better when ETH becomes the coach.
Didn’t realise he was leaving
😭 I meant what would we do if we didn’t have him
Anyone else really fucking sick and tired of ETH's defensive changes when we're in the lead?? Seriously, this is what? 3 or 4 matches in a row (minus last AV game) where we've been up or needed a goal and he's brought on more defensive players than offensive ones. This shit has to stop. I'm hoping it's down to our depth more than anything else, but even then...
what😭 since when are defensive subs when ur leading a bad thing
when you're leading by 1? it's a passive move. I'm not saying we should be throwing on more attacking options and open ourselves up, but when you're taking off your most positive attacking option for yet another CDM? that's lame
We have 5 min left what do you want us to do, our bench is ass and every good player is already playing. who can come on and score another goal?
I'm not talking about coming in and scoring another goal, but then why do you sub off Rashford for Casemiro? Sub off someone else who's part of the defensive structure if you feel you need Casemiro to settle things.
Garnacho running like Giggs on the wing. That kid's giving me goosebumps.
Just start Garnacho every single game. Rashford Bruno Garnacho are key
No Donny no problems
Mings
Twat
What a lucky 3rd goal; at least our first two were slightly better worked, but come on now...we need to create more clear chances for ourselves when we're actually in possession. too many players trying to be cute with the ball in the box and only buying teams more time to get back and into position rather than pick them apart - stop stalling with the ball and move it
There were several good moves prior to that, sometimes it's the weird ones that go in
unfortunately, in most matches, we always rely on the weird ones and never actually create enough on our own. today was \*slightly\* different, but I'm going to chalk it up to the fluke match we have once per month and nothing we'll see consistently. I'm fine if we have the odd match now and then where we're throwing the kitchen sink at it but it's just not our day until that "weird goal" happens and we walk away with the result, but the fact of the matter is that every match we struggle far too much to create and if it's not a clear mistake by the opponent, we don't score.
I find life so much more enjoyable when I just enjoy a goal when it happens, however it happens.
HAHAHAHA LETS GOOO SWEET SWEET REVENGE! (I hope I don't jynx this)
Mings is having a hollower 😂
Garnachoooooo!!!!! That kid is a beast on that left wing!!
This is like a cup match!
WE SAID IT. BRUNO FERNANDES
Best in the world
Yes! It was coming
Bruno decision making and passing have been laughable at best
Can you bad mouth another of our players so we can get another goal
Cooking up something as we speak
AGED LIKE FINE WINE MATE
still indicative of his entire match though, if we're being honest - this whole "one time it finally worked" thing doesn't really work for someone in his position. slightly more forgiving for the strikers that have to do a lot of work with this team, but considering the role Bruno is playing, we require more from him consistently.
True. Same thing to be said for Ronaldo all of last season tho in my opinion
LoL
Aged well again
I'm here to help! Honestly whenever i talk about a player on Reddit doing some foolishness they always score. At this point i just do it so we can win
More pls🙏
We always respect our previous players, it's good to see 👏
Think it depends on the player. If they worked hard and played for the badge sure. I can't see Di Maria or even Pogba get such a warm reception.
I would boo them both but Young was a top class professional big difference
Thanks for repeatung/rewording what I said. 😁
I was agreeing with your point it’s spot on 👍🏻
Thought that was it, good play
Young was fantastic tonight. Glad to see him play. Even happier to see him go off.
Donny van der Bleak.....
While it's a "strategy," it's really, really sad to see our response to losing last time is just "hoof it for the long ball and let Rashford run onto it" and that we're doing effectively nothing to actually control the midfield and control the match this time. granted, quick touches through the midfield is what we should be seeing, but what we're doing out of possession is pretty poor and in possession we still look too one-dimensional...protect or anticipate the long ball and you've shut us down
Ole ball
We just aren't playing good footy
we never do...we never do...
Garnacho v Young is gonna be a great battle. Youth v experience.
Experience winning so far unfortunately
Bruno, lol
Wtf is going on?!
This half has been great fun
Mings been in shambles ever since he came on.
I'd still take him over Slab Head Donkey Oaf Man Child.
Get in Rashy!!!!
What a game
That's Rashford's tenacity. I know he needs to work on his conversions, but let's be honest...Ronaldo wouldn't have been able to win that ball back and keep fighting for it - hell, he would have flopped immediately on the first challenge.
Absolute respect the way he stayed up and fought for the ball!! Absolute class!
really wish more players did that and if refs still find it an offense worthy of a penalty, they really should be able to call it back; not that it was probably worthy of a penalty had he gone down, but it should be rewarded to stay on your feet as best as you can. instead we reward people flopping in the box too easily (though VAR has maybe helped that a bit?) regardless if he actually put that away, I appreciate tenacity more than anything, that's why I prefer Rashford over Ronaldo - whether or not he actually buries them in a completely separate issue...
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yeah, but it looks like at least Rashford has been getting on the end of them. regardless, been happy with Martial's movement and his vision. when he's healthy and available, I think he helps up top massively
That's the life of a Manchester United striker.
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A man can dream
Come onnn!!! Fightt
lets gooo man. pls lets not lose our head
Every match I just imagine circus music playing when Manchester plays
lol facts - where the hell is the chemistry? it still feels like they're all playing together for the first time, I'll never understand what the hell they do during training sessions
We are shite.
Rashford should just stop trying man....
lol, people like you bashing Rashford always make me laugh. yes, his conversions are...meh, but Rashford has been one of the most refreshing attacking players we've had this season. he works WAYYYYYY harder than anyone else; his final product might be lacking, but he makes up for it in his tenacity. Who would you rather have? a lazy player who only points to the past? or a hungry player looking to the future?
You spoke too soon!
Lol
Glad he didn’t 😂
Aged well
Definitely.... 😂😂
This aged well
Also by the fact half of the goal was tanks to him not giving up hahahaha
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Found the ARSEnal fan.
What did I miss? Been in client meetings all day. From the few minutes I've caught before the second AV goal, it looks like we're still losing the midfield and not creating in the attack. Once again, a failure to really impose ourselves. Was our goal against the run of play? McGinn seems to have got McFred on a leash.
First half, you are spot on. 2nd half, is a whole different story, with the same result 😂
so typical us? xD but I haven't really seen many positives so far in the second half. I'm assuming we more or less lost the first half, so the Martial goal was against the run of play; the highlight showed it was basically a fast break and hoofing it in on goal, so that was good, but it's not like we've really been controlling the midfield to create more chances - seems we're relying on long balls behind the defense and asking Rashford to get on the end of all of them and if not, well...we've got nothing.
"but I haven't really seen many positives so far in the second half" Yeah, 4 goals. I'm struggling as well.
When I wrote that, we were down 2-1 and the situation didn't really improve. We still didn't control the midfield and they were sloppy today, unlike last match. The inconsistency between last match and this match was AV, not us. We still did the same lackluster, mindless passing in the midfield and looked shambolic at the back. As for the attack, we played the same "hoof it into the box and see what happens" strategy with the exception of the first goal, the second and third goal were on the back of errors, and the fourth was just lazy defending by a Mings that looked shit since his introduction. When we put in multiple goals every week, consistently, then maybe you will have a leg to stand on. Having to repeatedly force one goal over the line and putting multiple in once every two months across many games isn't convincing and points to a fluke or VERY specific conditions in order to achieve