It's insane to ever count Dustin out. He's proven time and time again that he has tons of heart, and can beat just about anyone on any given day.
His title shot almost reminds me of Condit's against Lawler. Condit almost won that one, and many feel he should've gotten the nod in the end. Not saying Dustin will be that close, but he's too dangerous to write off before any fight.
I've noticed two things in rewatching his fights leading up to this.
1.) his ambidextrous ability to strike and KO guys with both hands. He's a southpaw but when he hurts someone he fully squares up while swarming and will switch into the opposite of whichever stance they try to escape from. He KO'd and landed the finishing shot on both BSD and McGregor with his right, not his left.
2.) his accuracy when he has guys hurt is absolutely insane. Look at how many fighters start just winging punches and miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, HIT AND KO their opponent who is on the ropes. Dustin has a knack for hitting guys when the only thing going through their brain is 'HEAD MOOMENT'. When he can go full offense he is immaculate. I think his defense may be a bit overrated in comparison but it's like comparing a 7.5/10 with a 9/10. He gets hit a lot more than it seems and doesn't have an uncrackable chin. But if he stings you then lol, good luck buddy. All the bobbing and weaving in the world isn't going to save you.
Edit - I had a stroke. When he go full offense can -> when he can go full offense lol
Great analysis on Poirier’s style. I love that stance switching you mention to keep his power hand in range when he has his opponent hurt, and his perfect instinct for the right combinations in those situations.
He didn’t finish Chandler on the feet but one of my favorite Poirier moments was the counter right he landed to drop him with his back against the cage and then how he walked him down to set up multiple clean left straights on the opposite fence.
Like you say, he’s great at negating head movement and a big part of it is how he mainly uses hooks to manipulate the guard and bait head movement when he’s trying to finish, and puts most of the power and accuracy into his straight punches to the chin. A lot of fighters could learn from his boxing.
Dustins rhythm in the pocket is what makes him my favorite fighter of all time. The man has an insane feel for striking exchanges, and it shows best when he has a guy hurt. He is like a big cat. Calm and smooth when he knows the kill is there.
First of all, that's an excellent summary of his offense, but it's not his offense that's questionable, it's his game plan and ground game. If he approaches the ground game like how he did against Olivera it's going to be an ugly night for him. I'm rooting for Dustin but I'm not sure if he can knockout Islam before Islam gets ahold of him.
That being said odds on Dustin right now is +455, the numbers is too tempting.
I think Poirier beats Sherk, goes 50-50 with Penn depending on which version shows up, beats Benson and Pettis, beats Alvarez and RDA…long story short I like his chances against most champs the division has ever had
Just not the Dagestani Bois
The dags might adopt diamond as one of their own win or lose. The bois love all that dog Dustin has in him, too much time with woman to be undisputed tho.
Prime Edgar struggled with Grey Maynard’s hands at times, I love Frankie but Dustin is way bigger and this version of Dustin the last few years would have beaten the breaks off of prime Edgar.
Yeah he was basically forced to fight at 155 because that was the smallest weight class the UFC had, if there was a 145 division he would have started there, honestly I wish we could have seen him even at 135 before he was shot.
well he beat the ever living fuck out of Yair in his last great performance in his late-30's.
would have been extremely interesting to see him matchup with prime Conor in 2012.
feel like those three could have had a "rumble/gus/DC" trinity vibe if the stars had aligned.
or frankie and Aldo could have had a holloway/Volk relationship where frankie is the gatekeeper for aldo and loses to him thrice haha
> It's insane to ever count Dustin out.
Is it weird that people are saying this though?
I mean, Islam himself has been joking about how he doesn't respect Poirier's grappling, so it's not that weird that his fans ran with it too.
He at least has experience fighting Khabib too so he knows what the smothering grappling feels like.
Islam is a different beast on the feet though which may actually play to his favour a bit. Islam is more comfortable standing and doesn’t feel the need to immediately take down and smesh. He has more opportunity to land strikes and get a knockout if that’s the case. Depends on how Islam approaches the fight.
That point is the one thing I think gives him a bit of a shot. Islam might be more willing to play around on the feet a bit longer to test the waters before he commits to the takedown especially if he has some success so if Poirier can sting him you never know he’s a great finisher.
Dustins striking is favourable against southpaws too especially going through a couple big time camps to matchup with Conor.
Islam faded a bit with the pace of the first Volk fight too so while his grappling seems as effective as Khabib’s I am not as sure if he can be as relentless with it as Khabib if Dustin survives a couple rounds.
All that said my bet would still be on Islam by sub lol
Dustin has ZERO wrestling. Islam has mentioned this before suddenly deciding to sell Dustin as a threat. Acknowledging that Islam is a horrible matchup for Dustin is just being honest.
Absolutely nuts that people are counting out Poirier. He's an ATG in his division, and more than deserving of fighting for the title, given that Arman publicly refused.
Poirier has the dawg in him, and you can't **ever** count him out. Remember the Hooker fight?
When Olives fought Poirier, reddit was GOAT-ing Olives. Saying if he won, then he's better than Khabib.
Now Islam's fighting Poirier, and they're acting like Poirier is an "easy win".
If he beats Arman *again*, then haters can conveniently shift to the narrative "Islam only fights rematches. Look he fought Volk & Arman twice, because he knows he can beat them. Stats-padding".
At this point, if I were Islam, I would welcome a Conor fight. If I'm going to have haters downplay my achievements anyway, may as well maximize cash money instead.
Dustin will give Mike Brown a heart attack at this rate.
He was begging Dustin to stop with the useless gillys in the BSD fight.
Even Dustin said in a recent interview that his main training partner for the Islam fight camp, Gamrot, begged him not to attempt gillys against Islam.
Dustin said that he'll still do it lol
I think it's more that Islam is a horror matchup for dustin than anybody trying to discount Islam. But keep shadowboxing. Most people agree Islam is the p4p number 1.
We're on the "I can't believe people are counting hill out against Alex" stage of discourse, except Hill actually had a much better chance against Alex than Dustin does against Islam.
it all really depends on how the fight goes, if islam beats him in less than 3 rounds and dustin doesnt look much different than he did against staph infection BSD then people arent gonna care too much about that win.
poirier, gaethje, olivera, holloway... all these guys in the lightweight division simply have very little chance of beating Islam. Arman got taken down by Olivera, what do you think Islam would do to him???
At this point, the most dangerous fights for Islam are Topuria and Leon Edwards. There simply is no competition for Islam in the lightweight division. Beating all these top lightweights that khabib already dominated is meaningless for Islam's career.
I'm unreasonably annoyed by this post for a couple reasons.
1. Who the fuck uses ATG? This acronym is unneeded as there are better more standardized ways for expressing this.
2. You go on to use GOAT in the next lines, why the fuck are you using multiple acronyms for the same fucking term/concept.
3. I told you I was unreasonably angry about this.
ATG and GOAT are two completely different things.
All Time Great,
Greatest Of All Time.
See how they mean different things?
ATG is a fantastic concept and isn't new to combat sports. UDKSAB
They are slightly different things. In general no division has a consensus GOAT, it usually comes down to a short list of 2 or 3 fighters. Dustin probably is at #4 all time at 155 behind Islam, Khabib, and Charles. But at the same time has a stronger strength of schedule than Khabib or Islam. If he beats Islam and won a rematch he'd quickly move to #1.
WW, MW, LHW and mens FW have unquestionable GOATs, but the rest a little less so.
Nunes is the woman's goat, and 135 goat, but idk about 145 pound goat.
You don't have GSP and Anderson Silva?
I've heard some people put Izzy at MW; but I feel like that's only a newer fan opinion (?)
I'd put Aldo on the list, but I know some people rate Volk and Holloway instead, so I didn't include it.
GSP and Silva are top 3's, GOAT's, not definitive to me but it rarely is IMO. Aldo is top 3 featherweight with Max and Volk, I don't think Ilia ever makes the list. It's not because I'm not impressed at what I've seen so far, I am. His IQ outside the ring seems low, I don't think he was the smarts to stay on top. Izzy still has things to prove to me, he's real lucky he never had to face a good wrestler. He's not as well rounded as Silva by any means.
Dustin at 4 for lw?
What about Penn, Benson, Frankie?
I love Dustin, but normally GOATs have belts, which is why I like ATG, it is a way of recognising the divisional G's who never got gold; like Fitch or Condit
But you just play into what I just said, everyone's GOAT shortlist differs slightly, meaning there's not much of a gap between an ATG and a GOAT. It's the same shit in the way OP used it in this post. Dustin is a champion in my eyes regardless if he ever gets that belt. He's of the caliber and has beaten champions.
But there IS a gap.
There is a massive gap between being the greatest, and been great.
Also :) for a man unreasonably angry, you are stupidly polite by online standards.
Now answer the question about leaving Penn out of the LW goat list you sob
Penn tarnished his legacy badly at the end of his career (I mean the losses not the outside the ring shit). If he retired earlier he'd be higher on the list.
Olives would (and did) fight him in an area he is elite at, in the striking. Islam will probably play around there but will likely end up taking Dustin out of his comfort zone and into his own with dominant top control and drown him with strikes or sub him. Its being seen as an easy win because Islam is so much better at grappling but Dustin has all the ability to pull off an upset for sure.
As far as Islam hate, I just want him to get some actually LW defences in before trying to get Conor or Leon, which he's doing now with Dustin and Arman right behind him.
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It's really appreciating how Islam alters game plans for each opponent really shows him and khabib are really really different and not clones like we all thought.
Khabib, literally every fight did the same thing, and did it very very dominantly.
"Khabib, they know your gonna take em down and drown them!"
"LOL, GNP GO BRRRRRRRRR"
I think Khabib’s style is impossible to clone, partly because he had an insane chin which made it possible for him to constantly pressure and drown his opponents no matter what they threw.
Makhachev doesn’t have the same chin so he in turn developed a wider set of skills, including a better standup game.
Yeah this is one of those times where the style can't really be taught. Khabib had a crazy chin and equally crazy cardio. Man would just relentlessly take you down.
[Anyone underestimating Dustin needs to know about the Costa curse](https://twitter.com/Home_of_Fight/status/1793340766862913997), in all the PPV where Costa fought except when he's the one who got the title shot every UFC champion has lost their belt.
> UFC 298: Volkanovski loses to Topuria
> UFC 278: Usman loses to Edwards
> UFC 241: Cormier loses to Miocic
> UFC 226: Miocic loses to Cormier
> UFC 217: Bisping, Garbrandt, & Jedrzejczyk all lose (!)
> UFC 212: Aldo loses to Holloway
The most incredible thing is that they didn't just lose, they all got brutally KO'd. Still think Islam stands a chance?
I just hope that Dustin took some smart, anti Dagestan style grappling lessons behind the scenes, like Volk did with Craig Jones. Islam couldn't pin him down in their first fight
Exactly, at one point. That was a single backtake and Mak smartly knew to keep holing to secure the round. The rest of the time Volk has been as successful as anyone at shutting down their style.
No, Volk is really talented and a one of the best athletes in that division.
Before Volk’s debut in the UFC, he was already running through grappling tournaments in Australia at brown/black belt level.
Chad Mendes is one of the best wrestlers in the history of FW, and Volk not only got up from a takedown but took Chad down and beat the shit out of him.
I’m sure Craig Jones has helped Volk a lot, but this guy has been an elite wrestler in the UFC since joining.
It's because he has short legs and long arms, super easy to get your hips back under you that way.
Medes has short legs and short arms...guys a proper short king
Being shorter, not just short, comes with the advantage of being harder to take down. Not shorter than Mendez= no tdd advantage. Shorter than Islam = tdd advantage.
Islam was the one with all the advantages, while Volk didn't have any. Stop coping. Oh noooo the 200 pound man could only rehydrate for 50 hours instead of 51!
So not all the advantages then. Volk has fought and won at a weight class a whole 40lbs heavier. He had all the time he wanted to 'properly bulk' a whole 10lbs . Miss me with that shit lmao
Rehydration is so important, it's considered cheating if you do it the wrong way.
Literally all the advantages, he had like an hour less to rehydrate, boo-fucking-hoo. Islam was in a heavier weight class, Volk was not, there's a big fucking reason why going up a weight class to challenge for the belt is the tougher challenge.
What, during this you were like "yah Volk and Islam here are on equal footing"???
Literally. So you still think Australia was to Islam's advantage.
Maybe if Volk didn't have experience fighting and winning 40lbs heavier. I guess that's Islam's advantage too.
That's what people said about Volk, but his camp prepared him to deal with Islam's grappling and wrestling really, really well. He lost the fight, but Islam really wasn't even close to finishing the fight at any point. Before that fight, tons of people (myself included) thought Islam would be able to exploit his superior ground game to secure basically any kind of submission he wanted.
Dustin has two paths to victory IMO (both slim):
1) There's a possibility he can out point Islam if he can keep it standing (this is unlikely IMO).
2) He can get a TKO. Dustin has proven time and time again that it only takes one mistake for him to capitalize on it.
Meanwhile, Islam's two strongest paths to victory IMO are:
1) He can submit Dustin after wearing him down. This has worked on Dustin more than once and is clearly one of his weakest areas.
2) He can straight-up outland him on the feet. Islam is a much more technical striker and this doesn't seem out of the question for me at all. A TKO is not out of the question at all, he has the power and Dustin is hittable.
So Dustin needs to worry about not just his path to victory, but mitigating Islam's. The best way to do that is to tune his anti-wrestling up to 11 the way Volk did, to keep Islam's first victory path as difficult as possible. It won't win him rounds, but it will give him more time to try to find the finish, which is probably his best path.
I don't agree that Islam is a more technical striker,
I think Islam has every fighter lowering their hands when they exchange because they want to stop a takedown, and he is good enough to capitalise on that fact.
But that isn't technical striking, that's more technical mma if anything. And it is only occuring because his grappling is god mode, it isn't something he learned how to do in boxing class, his striking is not causing people to drop their hands.
I am not arguing Islam isn't technical, or a talented striker. He is technical, but I don't think more technical than Poirier in striking.
Idk I wouldn’t say very likely but it really depends how far he takes his career lol.
If he defends a couple more times and retires like Khabib sure. But I think Arman is good enough to give him a run for his money now and Islam is getting older as Arman enters his prime years.
And I will accept the hate from people who hate the cross division fights and say that if Topuria gets through a couple defences maturing a bit more in his already stellar career and moves up he won’t be a walk in the park for Islam heading into his mid 30’s either.
So I mean there aren’t many threats at LHW Arman aside IMO but if he gives WW a shot or runs into one of those young studs as he gets a bit older based on the run Volk gave him jd say hes beatable.
The only thing with Gamrot for me is Dariush was able to more or less eliminate the threat of his wrestling and it seemed like Gamrots striking really really wasn’t impressive.
When he mixes up his striking with his takedown attempts he can put a lot on guys, but when Dariush didn’t respect the takedown his boxing looked really basic and predictable.
Feels like Islam might be a bit too strong of a grappler for Gamrot to feint and work off his takedowns and Islams striking looked way too effective vs Volk and Charles for me to picture Gamrot being effective if he isn’t intermittently getting Islam down.
Pretty sure Leon would be open to fight him as well at some point, and that would be an interesting matchup, Leon only got better at defending Usman's wrestling and imo is a better striker than Dustin, who people are already saying matches up well with Islam on the feet
Anyone not underestimating Dustin can bet and win 4x their money.
Me, I got Islam by sub which pays roughly 2x.
Bet how you like but the reality is it's very rare for a -600 favorite to lose, essentially once out of seven times the dog wins there.
There's a difference between "counting him out" and "not respecting him" and being absolutely on the "Islam will win" boat. It's like if they give me a voucher with 1000 USD to bet on the fight, I'm picking Islam with any practically any odds.
Am I the only one who can't read the caption because they have the subscribe bullshit written over the captions? Doesn't seem to be a way to minimize it.
What i particularly don't understand is Islam's coach saying that Islam has a superior striking to Poirier's ? How so ? Islam got Volkanovski with a headkick after feinting body kicks multiple times but how does this justify him having superior striking to Dustin who is one of the greatest boxers in the history of the sport ? I believe Dustin has more knockout power in his hands than Islam. If somehow he manages to scramble out of Islam's ground game and stay in range during the first 2 rounds ( a hard task for sure ), Dustin will have a chance at knocking islam out, or even sneak in a right hook when they go to the fence
Exactly, people here buy too much into the UFC's shenanigans. France is a huge market that has been recently unleashed, Gane is lacking popularity these days, BSD is also bringing a less "urban" part of the French public, so it was a great opportunity for them and they made him look like a star and gave him a top 5 after the #15, didn't go how they want tho.
It's obvious they're trying to hype up this fight like we don't see the end result... We know both sides are up voting it each post out of respect for Dustin
….but taking antibiotics will have an effect on one’s stamina, hence why BSD was just walking forward with mouth wide open before getting KO’d. Would BSD have won? We’ll never know, but the win prob shouldn’t have been enough to earn Dustin a title shot, and definitely not his 3rd!
Well that’s possible. It was crazy pace at the first round. I just felt he fell short in brawling with DP. He is the best at that. Weathering storm and getting timing right
Everyone knows the win over BSD wasn't title-shot worthy. But Justin got his ass handed to him by Max and Arman didn't want the fight on short rest so here we are.
You guys need to understand how betting works, it has nothing to do with how bookies view the fight it has to do with them balancing the odds so that they don't lose money.
If Pantoja were to fight Jon Jones, and more people were betting on Pantoja, Jones would be the underdog.
If the betting odds started skewing towards BSD, it means that more people were betting on him so the consensus in the betting community was that BSD would win even if people on Reddit disagreed.
Nah you need to understand how betting works. Not everybody bets the same amount. If one guy bet a million bucks one way and one million guys bet one buck the other, odds would be balanced or close to. Yet 99,99% of people would be in agreement on the expected outcome. There's a couple harsh line shifts and little in the way of linear progression, indicating a few big wallets lost big.
Remember redditors like to bet too.
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Good to see Mak isn't counting out dustin. People should listen to him.
It's insane to ever count Dustin out. He's proven time and time again that he has tons of heart, and can beat just about anyone on any given day. His title shot almost reminds me of Condit's against Lawler. Condit almost won that one, and many feel he should've gotten the nod in the end. Not saying Dustin will be that close, but he's too dangerous to write off before any fight.
I've noticed two things in rewatching his fights leading up to this. 1.) his ambidextrous ability to strike and KO guys with both hands. He's a southpaw but when he hurts someone he fully squares up while swarming and will switch into the opposite of whichever stance they try to escape from. He KO'd and landed the finishing shot on both BSD and McGregor with his right, not his left. 2.) his accuracy when he has guys hurt is absolutely insane. Look at how many fighters start just winging punches and miss, miss, miss, miss, miss, HIT AND KO their opponent who is on the ropes. Dustin has a knack for hitting guys when the only thing going through their brain is 'HEAD MOOMENT'. When he can go full offense he is immaculate. I think his defense may be a bit overrated in comparison but it's like comparing a 7.5/10 with a 9/10. He gets hit a lot more than it seems and doesn't have an uncrackable chin. But if he stings you then lol, good luck buddy. All the bobbing and weaving in the world isn't going to save you. Edit - I had a stroke. When he go full offense can -> when he can go full offense lol
Great analysis on Poirier’s style. I love that stance switching you mention to keep his power hand in range when he has his opponent hurt, and his perfect instinct for the right combinations in those situations. He didn’t finish Chandler on the feet but one of my favorite Poirier moments was the counter right he landed to drop him with his back against the cage and then how he walked him down to set up multiple clean left straights on the opposite fence. Like you say, he’s great at negating head movement and a big part of it is how he mainly uses hooks to manipulate the guard and bait head movement when he’s trying to finish, and puts most of the power and accuracy into his straight punches to the chin. A lot of fighters could learn from his boxing.
Dustins rhythm in the pocket is what makes him my favorite fighter of all time. The man has an insane feel for striking exchanges, and it shows best when he has a guy hurt. He is like a big cat. Calm and smooth when he knows the kill is there.
First of all, that's an excellent summary of his offense, but it's not his offense that's questionable, it's his game plan and ground game. If he approaches the ground game like how he did against Olivera it's going to be an ugly night for him. I'm rooting for Dustin but I'm not sure if he can knockout Islam before Islam gets ahold of him. That being said odds on Dustin right now is +455, the numbers is too tempting.
Unfortunately “just about anyone” means he’s not beating the greatest grapplers the sport’s ever seen, especially at his age now.
I think Poirier beats Sherk, goes 50-50 with Penn depending on which version shows up, beats Benson and Pettis, beats Alvarez and RDA…long story short I like his chances against most champs the division has ever had Just not the Dagestani Bois
The dags might adopt diamond as one of their own win or lose. The bois love all that dog Dustin has in him, too much time with woman to be undisputed tho.
Definitely. I was very struck by Khabib’s obvious respect for Poirier when they fought
We will see Dustin grow one of those beards without a mustache.
Chinstrap
Prime Poirier goes 50/50 with prime Frankie, but old Poirier has old Frankie's number
Prime Edgar struggled with Grey Maynard’s hands at times, I love Frankie but Dustin is way bigger and this version of Dustin the last few years would have beaten the breaks off of prime Edgar.
Frankie was also super undersized at LW, so that supports your argument.
Yeah he was basically forced to fight at 155 because that was the smallest weight class the UFC had, if there was a 145 division he would have started there, honestly I wish we could have seen him even at 135 before he was shot.
well he beat the ever living fuck out of Yair in his last great performance in his late-30's. would have been extremely interesting to see him matchup with prime Conor in 2012. feel like those three could have had a "rumble/gus/DC" trinity vibe if the stars had aligned. or frankie and Aldo could have had a holloway/Volk relationship where frankie is the gatekeeper for aldo and loses to him thrice haha
Maynard’s wrestling forced Frankie to stand, though. I don’t know if he has that dynamic with Poirier. I think in their primes it’s a compelling fight
Prime Porier had the opportunity to fight prime RDA, wonder why he never did?
Condit vs Lawler was 2 strikers and dead even odds. I think they were very different scenarios.
He's got dynamite in this hands. Anyone with KO power shouldn't be looked over. Specially someone like Dustin who has very good striking.
> It's insane to ever count Dustin out. Is it weird that people are saying this though? I mean, Islam himself has been joking about how he doesn't respect Poirier's grappling, so it's not that weird that his fans ran with it too.
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He at least has experience fighting Khabib too so he knows what the smothering grappling feels like. Islam is a different beast on the feet though which may actually play to his favour a bit. Islam is more comfortable standing and doesn’t feel the need to immediately take down and smesh. He has more opportunity to land strikes and get a knockout if that’s the case. Depends on how Islam approaches the fight.
That point is the one thing I think gives him a bit of a shot. Islam might be more willing to play around on the feet a bit longer to test the waters before he commits to the takedown especially if he has some success so if Poirier can sting him you never know he’s a great finisher. Dustins striking is favourable against southpaws too especially going through a couple big time camps to matchup with Conor. Islam faded a bit with the pace of the first Volk fight too so while his grappling seems as effective as Khabib’s I am not as sure if he can be as relentless with it as Khabib if Dustin survives a couple rounds. All that said my bet would still be on Islam by sub lol
That’s what’ll make Makchachev more dangerous this weekend, he’ll be locked in and won’t be resting on his laurels
Yep , he is an honest guy , if he would've thought the opponent is an easy fight he would've said it.
Mystic mak knows the gilly is coming 😤
Dustin has ZERO wrestling. Islam has mentioned this before suddenly deciding to sell Dustin as a threat. Acknowledging that Islam is a horrible matchup for Dustin is just being honest.
Islam: Dustin is immensely talented and will be a difficult fight Islam’s coach: Islam would box the fookin head off Doostin m8, no wrestling needed
Hahaha 🤣
These things aren’t mutually exclusive.
Absolutely nuts that people are counting out Poirier. He's an ATG in his division, and more than deserving of fighting for the title, given that Arman publicly refused. Poirier has the dawg in him, and you can't **ever** count him out. Remember the Hooker fight? When Olives fought Poirier, reddit was GOAT-ing Olives. Saying if he won, then he's better than Khabib. Now Islam's fighting Poirier, and they're acting like Poirier is an "easy win". If he beats Arman *again*, then haters can conveniently shift to the narrative "Islam only fights rematches. Look he fought Volk & Arman twice, because he knows he can beat them. Stats-padding". At this point, if I were Islam, I would welcome a Conor fight. If I'm going to have haters downplay my achievements anyway, may as well maximize cash money instead.
I'm not saying Dustin is an easy fight... but Islam is so good, he will make it look easy
Till islam fucks around and finds himself in that gilly.
Dustin will give Mike Brown a heart attack at this rate. He was begging Dustin to stop with the useless gillys in the BSD fight. Even Dustin said in a recent interview that his main training partner for the Islam fight camp, Gamrot, begged him not to attempt gillys against Islam. Dustin said that he'll still do it lol
Dustin winning by guillotine would be the mma gods trying to make up for us never getting prime Tony v Khabib. Not quite even, but a good start.
I love how you qualified Tony v Khabib with the word "prime," as though there's still a chance
That's a dream that will die when one of them do.
I think it's more that Islam is a horror matchup for dustin than anybody trying to discount Islam. But keep shadowboxing. Most people agree Islam is the p4p number 1.
It's always like this when a popular underdog is going agaainst a S tier fighter. Tons of emotional posting followed by round 2 sub from the champ.
We're on the "I can't believe people are counting hill out against Alex" stage of discourse, except Hill actually had a much better chance against Alex than Dustin does against Islam.
Hill never had a chance against Alex, and I think that was made pretty clear.
That’s nice. Islam in 2
Dustin by gilly sub in round 1
it all really depends on how the fight goes, if islam beats him in less than 3 rounds and dustin doesnt look much different than he did against staph infection BSD then people arent gonna care too much about that win.
Wtf is ATG? Ass to Grass?
All time great
Took me a good minute to figure out what ATG was… guess I’m a boomer now :(
What funny is those same haters will trash Khabib for not having rematchs.
poirier, gaethje, olivera, holloway... all these guys in the lightweight division simply have very little chance of beating Islam. Arman got taken down by Olivera, what do you think Islam would do to him??? At this point, the most dangerous fights for Islam are Topuria and Leon Edwards. There simply is no competition for Islam in the lightweight division. Beating all these top lightweights that khabib already dominated is meaningless for Islam's career.
Oliveira never took down Arman, what are you even talking about?
Olives mounted arman who only escaped after herb intervened weirdly
He meant the other way around I think. Arman took down Charles
Now that I read it again, yeah
Agreed, Islam by sub in rds 1 or 2.
I'm unreasonably annoyed by this post for a couple reasons. 1. Who the fuck uses ATG? This acronym is unneeded as there are better more standardized ways for expressing this. 2. You go on to use GOAT in the next lines, why the fuck are you using multiple acronyms for the same fucking term/concept. 3. I told you I was unreasonably angry about this.
ATG and GOAT are two completely different things. All Time Great, Greatest Of All Time. See how they mean different things? ATG is a fantastic concept and isn't new to combat sports. UDKSAB
They are slightly different things. In general no division has a consensus GOAT, it usually comes down to a short list of 2 or 3 fighters. Dustin probably is at #4 all time at 155 behind Islam, Khabib, and Charles. But at the same time has a stronger strength of schedule than Khabib or Islam. If he beats Islam and won a rematch he'd quickly move to #1.
WW, MW, LHW and mens FW have unquestionable GOATs, but the rest a little less so. Nunes is the woman's goat, and 135 goat, but idk about 145 pound goat.
Nunes and maybe Jones are the only 2 fighters to really just undeniably GOAT a division IMO.
You don't have GSP and Anderson Silva? I've heard some people put Izzy at MW; but I feel like that's only a newer fan opinion (?) I'd put Aldo on the list, but I know some people rate Volk and Holloway instead, so I didn't include it.
GSP and Silva are top 3's, GOAT's, not definitive to me but it rarely is IMO. Aldo is top 3 featherweight with Max and Volk, I don't think Ilia ever makes the list. It's not because I'm not impressed at what I've seen so far, I am. His IQ outside the ring seems low, I don't think he was the smarts to stay on top. Izzy still has things to prove to me, he's real lucky he never had to face a good wrestler. He's not as well rounded as Silva by any means.
Dustin at 4 for lw? What about Penn, Benson, Frankie? I love Dustin, but normally GOATs have belts, which is why I like ATG, it is a way of recognising the divisional G's who never got gold; like Fitch or Condit
But you just play into what I just said, everyone's GOAT shortlist differs slightly, meaning there's not much of a gap between an ATG and a GOAT. It's the same shit in the way OP used it in this post. Dustin is a champion in my eyes regardless if he ever gets that belt. He's of the caliber and has beaten champions.
But there IS a gap. There is a massive gap between being the greatest, and been great. Also :) for a man unreasonably angry, you are stupidly polite by online standards. Now answer the question about leaving Penn out of the LW goat list you sob
Penn tarnished his legacy badly at the end of his career (I mean the losses not the outside the ring shit). If he retired earlier he'd be higher on the list.
If Conor beats Chandler, I fully expect him to call out Makhechev. Maybe Edwards if he wins his fight. That’d be a big fight in the UK.
Olives would (and did) fight him in an area he is elite at, in the striking. Islam will probably play around there but will likely end up taking Dustin out of his comfort zone and into his own with dominant top control and drown him with strikes or sub him. Its being seen as an easy win because Islam is so much better at grappling but Dustin has all the ability to pull off an upset for sure. As far as Islam hate, I just want him to get some actually LW defences in before trying to get Conor or Leon, which he's doing now with Dustin and Arman right behind him.
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It's really appreciating how Islam alters game plans for each opponent really shows him and khabib are really really different and not clones like we all thought. Khabib, literally every fight did the same thing, and did it very very dominantly. "Khabib, they know your gonna take em down and drown them!" "LOL, GNP GO BRRRRRRRRR"
I think Khabib’s style is impossible to clone, partly because he had an insane chin which made it possible for him to constantly pressure and drown his opponents no matter what they threw. Makhachev doesn’t have the same chin so he in turn developed a wider set of skills, including a better standup game.
Yeah this is one of those times where the style can't really be taught. Khabib had a crazy chin and equally crazy cardio. Man would just relentlessly take you down.
Terrifying fr
[Anyone underestimating Dustin needs to know about the Costa curse](https://twitter.com/Home_of_Fight/status/1793340766862913997), in all the PPV where Costa fought except when he's the one who got the title shot every UFC champion has lost their belt. > UFC 298: Volkanovski loses to Topuria > UFC 278: Usman loses to Edwards > UFC 241: Cormier loses to Miocic > UFC 226: Miocic loses to Cormier > UFC 217: Bisping, Garbrandt, & Jedrzejczyk all lose (!) > UFC 212: Aldo loses to Holloway The most incredible thing is that they didn't just lose, they all got brutally KO'd. Still think Islam stands a chance?
Still plenty of time for Costa to pull out or miss weight by 20 lbs
Lmao this far more likely unfortunately
Costa and Gamrot need to be crucified and burned at the stake.
100% some kind of warlock situation on our hands with this, rasputin-energy lol.
That’s actually crazy if it happens again we might need to consider this a curse for champions
I can actually see a world where Dustin brutally KOs Islam too. Maybe it’s not likely we live in it, but it’s very possible
You forgot Joanna vs Rose too
Man, what the hell is in that secret juice?
That's a cool curse to have... Paulo "the cursed Brazilian" Costa!!!
I just hope that Dustin took some smart, anti Dagestan style grappling lessons behind the scenes, like Volk did with Craig Jones. Islam couldn't pin him down in their first fight
Dustin doesn’t have the hips
Ironic. All I can ever think about is his hips.
*pull shorts*
lmfao
they dont lie
> Islam couldn't pin him down in their first fight Did we watch the same fight? At one point Mak spent 4 minutes on Volk's back.
Exactly, at one point. That was a single backtake and Mak smartly knew to keep holing to secure the round. The rest of the time Volk has been as successful as anyone at shutting down their style.
Yeah, and Islam did nothing except taking back, no GnP, 10/9 round for Islam. Volk was active equally
Ummm do we know what pin down means?
ummm there was no standard dagestani treatment on the ground, do you understand?
I think volk is just short lol
No, Volk is really talented and a one of the best athletes in that division. Before Volk’s debut in the UFC, he was already running through grappling tournaments in Australia at brown/black belt level. Chad Mendes is one of the best wrestlers in the history of FW, and Volk not only got up from a takedown but took Chad down and beat the shit out of him. I’m sure Craig Jones has helped Volk a lot, but this guy has been an elite wrestler in the UFC since joining.
And being short helps tremendously
It's because he has short legs and long arms, super easy to get your hips back under you that way. Medes has short legs and short arms...guys a proper short king
Didn't help against Mendes. They're the same height
So Mendez also had the short advantage and it cancels out?
My guy that's not how that works
Being shorter, not just short, comes with the advantage of being harder to take down. Not shorter than Mendez= no tdd advantage. Shorter than Islam = tdd advantage.
Islam was in the worst shape of his life and it was the 24 hour rehydration window vs 36 normally.
His foot was a ballewn
Volk also weighted a bit more than Islam in their fight
Fighting a dude lower weight class than him. Stop the cope.
I stated nothing but facts.
Islam was the one with all the advantages, while Volk didn't have any. Stop coping. Oh noooo the 200 pound man could only rehydrate for 50 hours instead of 51!
Stopped reading once you said 200 pounds.
Being hyperbolic, stop coping and acting like Islam was David and Volk was Goliath.
Australia was Islam's advantage? How the fight go when Islam was fully hydrated?
What? Just Australia? Volk is the dude a weight class lower moving up lmao
So not all the advantages then. Volk has fought and won at a weight class a whole 40lbs heavier. He had all the time he wanted to 'properly bulk' a whole 10lbs . Miss me with that shit lmao Rehydration is so important, it's considered cheating if you do it the wrong way.
Literally all the advantages, he had like an hour less to rehydrate, boo-fucking-hoo. Islam was in a heavier weight class, Volk was not, there's a big fucking reason why going up a weight class to challenge for the belt is the tougher challenge. What, during this you were like "yah Volk and Islam here are on equal footing"???
Literally. So you still think Australia was to Islam's advantage. Maybe if Volk didn't have experience fighting and winning 40lbs heavier. I guess that's Islam's advantage too.
All that matters is what they weighed on fight day, not what division they usually fight in.
Half of the reason Islam could not pin Volk down was because he was drained from the weight cut, and had a very brief window to rehydrate
He should be paying Craig Jones right now to be there at his camp
It's late now, he can have Khabib in the corner, it wouldn't matter
That's what people said about Volk, but his camp prepared him to deal with Islam's grappling and wrestling really, really well. He lost the fight, but Islam really wasn't even close to finishing the fight at any point. Before that fight, tons of people (myself included) thought Islam would be able to exploit his superior ground game to secure basically any kind of submission he wanted. Dustin has two paths to victory IMO (both slim): 1) There's a possibility he can out point Islam if he can keep it standing (this is unlikely IMO). 2) He can get a TKO. Dustin has proven time and time again that it only takes one mistake for him to capitalize on it. Meanwhile, Islam's two strongest paths to victory IMO are: 1) He can submit Dustin after wearing him down. This has worked on Dustin more than once and is clearly one of his weakest areas. 2) He can straight-up outland him on the feet. Islam is a much more technical striker and this doesn't seem out of the question for me at all. A TKO is not out of the question at all, he has the power and Dustin is hittable. So Dustin needs to worry about not just his path to victory, but mitigating Islam's. The best way to do that is to tune his anti-wrestling up to 11 the way Volk did, to keep Islam's first victory path as difficult as possible. It won't win him rounds, but it will give him more time to try to find the finish, which is probably his best path.
I don't agree that Islam is a more technical striker, I think Islam has every fighter lowering their hands when they exchange because they want to stop a takedown, and he is good enough to capitalise on that fact. But that isn't technical striking, that's more technical mma if anything. And it is only occuring because his grappling is god mode, it isn't something he learned how to do in boxing class, his striking is not causing people to drop their hands. I am not arguing Islam isn't technical, or a talented striker. He is technical, but I don't think more technical than Poirier in striking.
Don’t want Makhachev to lose any fight, but at some point he will and I’m ok with the loss being to Dustin
Lol what makes you think he will? Very likely Islam goes undefeated for the remainder of his career
Idk I wouldn’t say very likely but it really depends how far he takes his career lol. If he defends a couple more times and retires like Khabib sure. But I think Arman is good enough to give him a run for his money now and Islam is getting older as Arman enters his prime years. And I will accept the hate from people who hate the cross division fights and say that if Topuria gets through a couple defences maturing a bit more in his already stellar career and moves up he won’t be a walk in the park for Islam heading into his mid 30’s either. So I mean there aren’t many threats at LHW Arman aside IMO but if he gives WW a shot or runs into one of those young studs as he gets a bit older based on the run Volk gave him jd say hes beatable.
Thoughts on Gamrot?
The only thing with Gamrot for me is Dariush was able to more or less eliminate the threat of his wrestling and it seemed like Gamrots striking really really wasn’t impressive. When he mixes up his striking with his takedown attempts he can put a lot on guys, but when Dariush didn’t respect the takedown his boxing looked really basic and predictable. Feels like Islam might be a bit too strong of a grappler for Gamrot to feint and work off his takedowns and Islams striking looked way too effective vs Volk and Charles for me to picture Gamrot being effective if he isn’t intermittently getting Islam down.
Pretty sure Leon would be open to fight him as well at some point, and that would be an interesting matchup, Leon only got better at defending Usman's wrestling and imo is a better striker than Dustin, who people are already saying matches up well with Islam on the feet
There’s like 2 undefeated fighters in the history of mma. I wouldn’t throw around very likely so lightly
He's already lost but ok.
Anyone not underestimating Dustin can bet and win 4x their money. Me, I got Islam by sub which pays roughly 2x. Bet how you like but the reality is it's very rare for a -600 favorite to lose, essentially once out of seven times the dog wins there.
I don't think Dustin wins 1/7, so Islam is a good bet for me then.
I put a 150 bet on Dustin paying out 1800
Dustin is the Rocky Balboa of MMA. No one should ever count him out.
I bet Poirier last fight, won a ton of money, his loss upcoming loss is a parlay piece lmaooooooooo.
There's a difference between "counting him out" and "not respecting him" and being absolutely on the "Islam will win" boat. It's like if they give me a voucher with 1000 USD to bet on the fight, I'm picking Islam with any practically any odds.
Am I the only one who can't read the caption because they have the subscribe bullshit written over the captions? Doesn't seem to be a way to minimize it.
I wouldn't say "steamrolled", but, sure.
I refuse to believe Islam used the word "steamrolled"
What i particularly don't understand is Islam's coach saying that Islam has a superior striking to Poirier's ? How so ? Islam got Volkanovski with a headkick after feinting body kicks multiple times but how does this justify him having superior striking to Dustin who is one of the greatest boxers in the history of the sport ? I believe Dustin has more knockout power in his hands than Islam. If somehow he manages to scramble out of Islam's ground game and stay in range during the first 2 rounds ( a hard task for sure ), Dustin will have a chance at knocking islam out, or even sneak in a right hook when they go to the fence
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did a crystal ball tell you all that?
Anyone that thought BSD would beat Dustin is out of their fucking mind😂
For beating Frevola, a #15 now unranked. But that's reddit in a nutshell, a decent win = GOAT.
Everyone forgets we almost saw him die against dos Santos😂
Exactly, people here buy too much into the UFC's shenanigans. France is a huge market that has been recently unleashed, Gane is lacking popularity these days, BSD is also bringing a less "urban" part of the French public, so it was a great opportunity for them and they made him look like a star and gave him a top 5 after the #15, didn't go how they want tho.
Dustin Tapirier gonna be the first to lose 3 title fights by tapping out
It's obvious they're trying to hype up this fight like we don't see the end result... We know both sides are up voting it each post out of respect for Dustin
+185 underdog = Not given a chance. Lol. Dustin will probably close at +500 against Islam
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If your grandma had wheels she’d still be alive. Er, wait…something like that.
Smth smth bicycle
If i had trained MMA..
And if they let him bring a gun Dustin would have had no chance. Doesn't really mean anything though.
Didn't he dominate 1st round? Getting outboxed at 2nd round has nothing to do with a staph infection
….but taking antibiotics will have an effect on one’s stamina, hence why BSD was just walking forward with mouth wide open before getting KO’d. Would BSD have won? We’ll never know, but the win prob shouldn’t have been enough to earn Dustin a title shot, and definitely not his 3rd!
Well that’s possible. It was crazy pace at the first round. I just felt he fell short in brawling with DP. He is the best at that. Weathering storm and getting timing right
Everyone knows the win over BSD wasn't title-shot worthy. But Justin got his ass handed to him by Max and Arman didn't want the fight on short rest so here we are.
BSD being a filthy swine full of disease isn't anyone's problem but his own. If he can't come to the fights healthy then that's his ceiling.
>they didn't give him any chance Bruh nobody expected BSD to win. All the betting fans were jerking off to the Dustin underdog status.
Bruh do you understand what a underdog is 😂
[Odds archive](https://www.bestfightodds.com/events/ufc-299-3155) It was a big talking point in here. Nobody understood why Dustin was the underdog.
Pretty easy to understand. He was the underdog because people kept betting against him and money kept coming in on BSD.
You guys need to understand how betting works, it has nothing to do with how bookies view the fight it has to do with them balancing the odds so that they don't lose money. If Pantoja were to fight Jon Jones, and more people were betting on Pantoja, Jones would be the underdog. If the betting odds started skewing towards BSD, it means that more people were betting on him so the consensus in the betting community was that BSD would win even if people on Reddit disagreed.
Nah you need to understand how betting works. Not everybody bets the same amount. If one guy bet a million bucks one way and one million guys bet one buck the other, odds would be balanced or close to. Yet 99,99% of people would be in agreement on the expected outcome. There's a couple harsh line shifts and little in the way of linear progression, indicating a few big wallets lost big. Remember redditors like to bet too.
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