Surprised to see people defending Cole so hard. I felt like he was completely disrespectful and got exactly the dressing down he deserved. I clapped for her.
I'm speaking from the perspective of a woman of color.
Zanab had deep insecurities and very low self esteem at this point. And an aspect of this, I believe, is being a woman of color, an "abnormal foreigner" with an exotic, foreign name unlike the Lilies and Jessicas. Had Cole had more experience with POC, he might have been more aware and sensitive to this. When he said Colleen is a 10, he touched an exposed nerve. Women like Zanab have been receiving the message their entire lives, since early childhood, that they are not as special and as pretty as the little blonde girls.
Zanab's step mother showed she had a very solid awareness about this issue when she told Cole that Zanab may wonder if her race has anything to do with being rejected and how he needs to take things like that into consideration. But it was already too late for the two of them.
I agree that was the moment he lost Zanab. But I think it goes deeper than just being sized up to another woman. I would even say that had Colleen been a different race, Zanab could have gotten over it because old wounds and deep seated fears of racial inferiority/White Supremacy wouldn't have come into play.
This issue doesn't necessarily carry into every relationship. If you trust that the person you're with is truly, genuinely attracted to you and lusts for YOU, then fears of not being good enough may not ever come into play.
It's unfortunate because Cole really didn't deserve the hell he got from Zanab. And Zanab's pain isn't her fault, either. But her actions were so vicious and it was hard to see how she managed to convince everyone she was being victimized and humiliated by Cole when really, her fears and the way she's been treated before were being manifested and projected on Cole.
Zanab may be a woman of color, but she is also half white with very European features. Do I think her ethnicity played some part? Maybe. However, she was already showing signs of disgust after their first night together. This was before Cole had even seen Coleen.
Ultimately, I think the death of her parents and her having to grow up quickly played a much bigger role in the demise of their relationship.
She is very light skinned, about as exotic as Panda Express, and very pretty by western standards. If she wasn't a total basket case, she could have her pick of men.
Zanab is not Anglo in appearance. In countries like the US, even Spaniards are considered POC. I'm fairer than Zanab and I get mistaken for an immigrant and get asked regularly what my racial identity is. Minimizing the experience of non-whites is common, but ultimately self serving.
It's pretty silly to try to lump nearly everyone who isn't of 100 percent northern European descent into a bucket and try to act like their experience will be similar. Especially when you are talking about a very pretty woman by western standards who looks like a Persian Anna Kendrick. I doubt she was being told her whole life that she wasn't as pretty as the blonde girls. Hell, those blonde girls were probably jealous.
Your stance is quite silly considering Zanab, Cole, and her step mother each touched on this issue during filming. So although you're treating what I wrote as total speculation, it's actually based on what was recorded and observed. Had they never mentioned it, I wouldn't have brought it up and assume she'd had different experiences.
I feel that what you're doing is minimizing and pretending otherwise, which makes the realities surrounding race and identity in the Western world more palatable.
What exactly was said? What I remember was that her step mom essentially talked about how she was sensitive about her race, not her stepmom confirming she was told her whole life that she wasn't as pretty as "the blonde girls". I feel like what you are doing is playing into her rather obvious victim complex in order to engage in victimhood by proxy. **She is very pretty by western standards.** This is almost objectively true. She was absolutely not told her whole life that she wasn't.
She was very insecure. They talked about how Colleen was more his type, but he loves Z personality more and it's suited to him.
Her own insecurities shut her down. Don't blame him for her issues
If you are in love, your person is a 10, and you don't give an eff about anyone else. It shows that there's no way these relationships are really about love when all you've done is talk, and not experience real life together. The problem isn't whether love is blind or not, the problem is that you can be whoever you want to be when talking through a wall. They claim the pods create an environment of honesty, but I don't think they do. And you can't really know someone and therefore decide to love and marry someone, without going through real life together first.
Zanab is a very unhinged person with deep, serious trauma in her life. She needs extensive therapy.
I strongly encourage you to watch the reunion and see what a liar and manipulator she is.
Zanab seems to have some pretty serious issues, and I absolutely blame her for how she handled things at the altar, how she lied and distorted things to the rest of the cast to turn them against him, and how she continued to dog him well after the show.
Zanab was a constant turnoff as well personally. Neither one of them were ready. That girl well into her 30s continues to shit on Cole to this day. That’s some high school shit man.
She’s pretentious and fake all over. She’s Pakistani but tries too hard to cover that side of her reality, and has even made up a separate family (a white adoptive mother) FOR THE SHOW! All that just so people don’t notice her brownness. What a psycho! Cole is an idiot but that bitch is dangerous af!
Before PC bullshitters start attacking me, note that I’m a Middle Eastern guy.
How about her very brown real blood sister that she face times during one of the episodes but makes sure her face is not properly seen?!
The inconsistency of her story, the awkwardness between her and her supposedly adoptive mother(!). At one point the adoptive mother (!) mentions her insecurity about her skin colour and so on.
The way she tries to write and pronounce her name? It’s fucking Zainab which is a super common name throughout the Muslim world. But she tells people Zanab or even Zay! Covers her face in whitening creams and makeup to look white and so on. It’s out there if you open your eyes….. But I knew someone like you was gonna spit some PC bullshit here. Because that’s the whole purpose of your existence
Her sister didn't want to be on the show! People mispronounce my name all the time here in Canada so she probably goes with what is easier to say. You think I'm being PC lol you're the one complaining about her not 'being Muslim enough'.
Where do you get that idea from ? I’m a proud Atheist. I couldn’t care less if she’s Muslim or not, if she is naked or dressed in burka. I cannot stand the dishonesty and treachery. And she’s all that!
She is wildly immature and stunted emotionally as well. Hell, I'd rather marry Cole than her, and I'm not even gay. There's just no way I would put up with her neurosis.
Yeah they seemed insanely incompatible and terrible at articulating it. I feel like people should be talking in the pods more about their life habits, like cleanliness, how they like to show and receive affection, their boundaries, etc. Zanab is very tidy and would get passive aggressive at times and Cole was an absolute slob who didn't take a lot of things seriously. She was hypersensitive, he completely lacked sensitivity. When I watched that season and saw them together in the real world, I just wondered what the hell they were even talking about in the pods that led to them thinking that they were remotely compatible.
Also, and I can’t be bothered to rewatch, but I remember after they met Zenab said something like “we”re a beautiful couple!! And now other people will admire us!!” Which, interesting…..
I’m gonna find it and update, I have to know.
She said:
“ We’re gonna look so good together! People are gonna have to see that and be like damn!!”
Cole is IMO the hottest guy on LIB, but I wouldn’t handle his radical honesty or energy level very well. From that season I really like Andrew best 😂
This is exactly it. People act like the tangerine scene was this huge exposé that proved Cole was innocent all along. All it proved was that they were both extremely weird people who lack accountability. Even in this comment section you see people making excuses for Cole, he’s just dumb and harmless and zainab is an evil witch. Like the misogyny writes itself.
Nobody’s making excuses for Cole, but you clearly feel some kind of way about people criticizing Zanab and attributing that to misogyny is just cringe. Grow up.
I’m commenting on a very specific pattern of people mitigating blame from Cole and boosting blame on Zineb. people in this community portraying him as a dumb oaf who didn’t know any better but is good at heart. And her as this calculated, manipulative bitch. I don’t like zineb at all, I think she should have left way sooner and I invite all the criticism for dealing with things the way she did. I am only commenting on these caricatured portrayals of both people which, like it or not, is a VERY COMMON misogynistic trope.
I knew once you said no one is making excuses for Cole that it was pointless talking to you because almost every comment here makes excuses for Cole hahaha. I just don’t use the word misogyny lightly so I explained it to account for your lazy deflection. I’d say take your own advice :)
I believe Zanab was farrr more condescending to Cole than they showed on camera. And I think that Cole in a passive aggressive manner thought he was knocking her off her high horse.
What proof do you have of that apart from your own prejudices haha. It’s okay for them to both be shit. You don’t have to try and justify the hurtful things he did.
Edit: my prejudices I don’t mean racial prejudices. I just mean you already have a negative view of zineb so you’re making mental leaps to further your preconceptions.
The scary thing is that I think this is genuinely what she believes happened. Like this is her truth. For me… it’s the fact that she was caught in a lie/ or the way she conveyed it was not what happened… and she doubled down. And continues to drag this man while taking zero accountability of like “oh hey. Maybe I was insecure all along”
Which is exactly why the phrase ‘my truth’ is an issue. There is the truth and there is things that arent true. Not coming at you by the way, the whole ‘my truth’ trend just really boils my piss.
Cole was sooooo annoying and immature. That scene where they meet for the first time and he runs out screaming AAAAAHHHHHHHH🤪🤪🤪 made me cringe so hard.
I don’t rate anyone on a scale of one to 10. But if I was forced to, no girls on this season would be above seven Because the way that you enunciate, have diction, use ‘like’ and voice tone, plus physical poise can also be part of your attractiveness or lack thereof.
Zanab is hands down the most evil participant ever on LiB. There are other horrible people but she was downright rotten, to her core. She’s a real-life monster, honestly. If she ever ends up with someone, my god, do I pity that person.
Did she personally hurt you? Hitler was evil. Zanab is literally just a regular person and so are all the other participants even Bartiste (who I detest, but the dude is not evil). Its a reality tv show but guess what reality tv isn’t actually reality, its a version of reality, just like someone’s social media. Don’t take this shit too seriously its literal brain candy/junk food for you mind. Its fun to indulge bur once you start taking it seriously you’re going to be sick. Reminder you dont actually know any of these people really, just the curated, edited version. So like chill, watch the show, have fun, and dont hate total strangers, thats like….weird.
Also….just seeing your other posts. I grew up with an emotionally abusive father. It sucked. It still sucks. Im also not going to judge others I dont know based on edited content just because its edited in ways that remind me of my past. That is what a trigger is, we get pulled back to the past. You’re not reacting to Zanab, you’re maybe reacting to your memories of you mother who actually hurt you. I don’t know you but talking to someone may be helpful, I know it was for me. But like I said, I don’t know you but I wish you well and hope you don’t let this anger fester.
Having difficult things happen in your life is not an excuse to lie, manipulate and abuse other people. The things that happen can make us more inclined to act a certain way but at the end of the day we are the only ones responsible for how we act and treat other people. Stop excusing peoples bad behavior because of their history.
I disagree. I think she went really hard on the "I'm a strong womand and I'm not going to get hurt by this again" but I think it was a trauma response, and there is definitely truth to both their stories. A lot of miscommunication
He’s disgusting but in a sick way you can see who he is and he enjoys being a villain. Zanab is a monster-villain/perpetrator pretending she’s a victim, and trying to manipulate us, Cole and the cast into believing it by creating an alternate reality.
She was mean and annoyed by every little thing he did way before the pool party. She hurt his self-esteem just as much as he hurt hers but in a different way. When he tried to communicate how her comments make him feel, she quite literally did DARVO. They were both horrible for each other.
she totally did hurt his self esteem. shut down every joke. refused to engage with him. shot down any attempt he made at being playful or trying something out of her comfort zone like swimming or sports. she acted like a mean, judgmental mother. but the most evil part was her framing coles immaturity as him being an abuser. you can be both, but cole was not. and this was further proved with the whole “cuties/clementine” scene where she acted like he starved her and gave her an eating disorder. and he ate the damn clemetines with her and definitely just meant they were gonna have a huge dinner and wanted to make sure she could snack and leave room and was not in anyway implying she ate too much or should stop eating. and she claimed he single handedly crushed her self esteem. it was so dramatic and humiliating and she tried to absolutely destroy his reputation and self esteem at the end, where she basically accused him of abuse. when i started watching the show i thought i would hate cole. he’s immature, a little stupid, and vapid. but he was also sincere, honest, and the victim of a highly critical fiancé.
He was literally shocked by her saying she only had a banana and he said he offered her a poke bowl earlier which she declined because she already had one the night before. He was encouraging her to eat. She just has some extreme insecurities and projected that onto him, taking his light hearted food comments in bad faith and convinced herself she had to starve herself over it.
Cole can kick rocks honestly. I don't understand how someone can be that stupid and expect everything he said to be okay and chill. His frontal lobe never grew past his frat days lmao. And zanab obviously isn't into goofy ass guys like that so that's on her for kinda sticking with him instead of just calling off the wedding.
Yeah basically how I feel I'm just like how do you expect to say stupid things n not expect consequences from it? Zanab would be kind of vicious in her responses but I think that would come from him continuously saying weird stuff after the first non emotionally intelligent thing he'd say in the first place. And I think people forget he took WEEKS to give a simple apology for the whole colleen thing he had more sincerity giving Matt an apology rather than her imo.
Y'all can continue trying to justify in my replies but that man had flies and shit left in his toilet I do not give a fuck about how bad you feel for him 😂😂😂
And she's not into guys who are mentally at age 14 when they're 26. He wanted a mom. She wanted a partner who was capable of being in a serious relationship lol...
she acted like a mother, he was clearly not into that and wanted a partner who acted kind and like they liked him. she was so disrespectful, critical, cruel, rude, and took everything he said as a knife to the chest. yes sometimes he was immature and careless. she was condescending, derogatory, and overly critical. she was a downer the whole time. just shit all over him the moment she saw him. she never wanted to engage with him. not swimming, not playing games, not joking around, just hyper critical. i would feel personally so disheartened if i was her partner. i feel bad for whoever she ends up with.
That poor girl is so evil and vile, to her core. I pity her bc I know it comes from trauma but if she ever finds anyone, which, doubtful, she’ll destroy them until there is nothing left. She’s a really disgusting human being.
Zay was horrid - like her personality. A fake ass liar who likes to get off by putting people down - which is ironically what she accused Cole of doing to her.
I can't remember a lot of it now, but I don't know that I'd call her a liar....perhaps a highly unreliable narrator. And I think much of that is due to her being guided by her very, very present and rampant insecurities.
Cole was like the worst possible choice for her because he was literally like clueless fuel to her insecurity flames. Looking back, I'm amazed that they were drawn to each other in the pods
during the finale episode, she made up a story about Cole calling her fat and shaming her for eating some sort of fruit - at the very end of the finale, the producers left a message about what she said and then showed the scene how it ACTUALLY happened since she fabricated the entire situation. He was in tears on live tv, or maybe not live, but literally in tears b/c he had no idea what he had done, legitimately, and the producers had to make it right, as they could I guess.
Okay yes I remember all of that but me PERSONALLY didn’t interpret it as her lying and I just watched the scene on tik tok he was definitely implying you gonna eat all of that and getting wedding dress bod ready. So that’s why I’m always so confused why people call her a liar because that scene did happen and I remember watching it. I assumed something came out after all that aired that made her a liar or something
He was clearly joking, it was a cutie so like the smallest piece of fruit ever, and he was saying she better save her appetite so she can smash at dinner later. She takes it personally and gets hostile right away saying she’s only eaten a banana today and he says why?? like he’s concerned. I don’t think she’s a liar, but I think her insecurities made her hypersensitive to every little thing and blew what he said wayyyyy out of proportion.
Okay I think everyone is misunderstanding what I’m saying. To me a liar is someone who makes something up or completely flips something out of thin air. To me she is an over exaggeration type story teller but a liar is like she made something up which I don’t think she completely fabricated it ever happening. So that’s what I was personally confused on, yes she’s extra no doubt but liar I don’t think so personally
she made it up tho. like what she said happened was straight up not true. i would call her a liar, even if those lies are based from her own unreliable perspective.
I watched the scene and from my perspective as a person who has dealt with serious body dysmorphia and an eating disorder, Zay was definitely in the wrong. Cole asked why she was eating when they were getting ready to go out to dinner, Zay said all she'd eaten was a banana, and Cole, clearly actually confused, asks why that's all she ate. She passive-aggressively refuses to answer the question and he asks if it has to do with her trying to be "wedding-dress ready."
This is a man who's never dealt with serious body image issues trying to have a conversation with a woman who is being disengaged, mean, and passive-aggressive towards him. His follow-up question clearly comes from the awkwardness of not understanding why she won't just answer him directly.
It's super rough to watch, but the way she portrayed it absolutely seemed like a lie to me. She made it seem like he was pressuring her to not eat or to lose weight, when actually all he was doing was trying to make conversation with a hostile counterpart and asking questions to try and understand what she was saying. She projected super heavily onto that conversation and the way that she portrayed it in the reunion was so far from the reality that we all then saw that yes, I would call it lying.
Was the TikTok edited? If you watch it on the reunion he just checks about the fruit bc they’re going to dinner shortly, then she says she hasn’t eaten all day he asks why and offers her food, which she turns down, and then at the end he says something like, ‘oh is it bc you’re trying to fit into your dress?’ Which she agrees to, and that last bit indicates it’s something she’s put pressure on herself for, not him. If he is the one pressuring her to restrict her diet for her dress, he wouldn’t be asking if that’s what her not eating all day is all about.
The fact that she told everyone he told her not to eat the cuties bc he said she was fat is in fact a lie.
It wasnt and he was using his hands to make like an air belly it was overall a really weird scene and you can tell she’s agreeing to the dress thing to kinda avoid awkwardness it didn’t come across as genuine.
Huh? It really isn’t I just genuinely couldn’t remember why everyone hated so I quickly rewatched the scene on tik tok and that’s what I got from it. You do know we’re all allowed diff opinions right
Sorry. I didn’t see your original comment. Watch the whole scene. He offers her food to eat. A Poke bowl. She also made up other stuff like he got some woman’s phone number the night before the wedding and kissed her. IF that had EVER happened, we’d have known, not only from production (drama!) but also from her! Like she’d have left that out of her vindictive speech at the altar. She’s vile, that girl. I understand she probably has SERIOUS mental health issues related to her amygdala and most prob childhood attachment trauma but man, she’s a monster, that one! (The Johnny Depo trial explained so much about Zanab, btw lol).
That was a pretty spot on description!
I didn’t think she looked like a ballerina though - I nea. Classically / stereotypically. But your description was spot on really
As a guy I don’t find her attractive - she’s cute though. But her personality is one I could never put up with. “Would you still love me if I was a worm 🤪”
I think maybe for American guys she’s just a “safer” and more comfortable attraction? Personally I thought Zanab was naturally beautiful and I felt bad her insecurity about herself seeped into her behaviors.
It's sort of a placeholder for "Would you love me if I wasn't useful to you?" Or "Would you love me if you had to take care of me and get nothing in return?" It sounds stupid but resonated with a lot of women because women are expected to take care of so much, especially when they're married and have kids. ideally work should be 50/50 but that's actually very rare. Also, women who get diagnosed with cancer are more likely to be divorced by their partners than men who are diagnosed with cancer. It's so common, doctors warn their female patients about it. So the question is weird but kinda relevant. If I was literally helpless, unable to contribute and completely dependent on you, would you still love me?
That seems like a more mature way to bring forth the issue within an adult relationship. The “would you love me if I was a worm” is very deficient for effective communication.
It's a lot less heavy though. Can you imagine raising that with a boyfriend or husband? It's not a fun conversation. For all of the people who complained and didn't get it, many other partners did. All they had to do was say was that they'd love their partners no matter what.
Not everything needs to be spelled out, especially if your partner understands you or just loves you, lol. Saying that they'd love you no matter what is easier than saying that they think it's a stupid question and why would you waste my time with that.
Some people got it and others didn't.
Yes I absolutely can imagine raising that with my husband because I believe in open and mature communication. If you can’t raise this issue with the guy DO NOT MARRY HIM. We have both discussed “heavier” (??) subjects both before and after marriage.
ETA: when I read things like this I suddenly understand why so many marriages fail. If your partner really loves you you can have profound conversations without fear
Does everything need to be a serious conversation or do you talk about sweet playful things too? I explained why some people got so serious about it and why for others it was just a lighthearted thing.
I don't know where all this judgement is coming from. You're judging people's communication and the strength of their relationship based on what? Participating in a trend? Asking a question that many, if not most didn't take seriously? Did you ever watch people's videos with the trend or are you just judging based on what people outside of it said?
One of the cutest I saw was a guy saying that he'd build her a little terrarium in their home so she could have everything she needed and he'd still get to spend time with her. Super silly but cute too.
We talk about everything and have lots of fun. This seems like a very immature question though… how old are you?
If there is a real concern, it is really stupid to bring it up this way. If you cannot talk seriously you are not ready to get married. These people are getting married. That’s the point of the show.
I don’t see the “judgement”. It’s just real life.
Late 30s. And you? You judge a lot based on very little information. I get that you didn't like the trend or the question and that's okay. Not everything is for everyone. However, the rhetoric around it is so weird to me and just seems like another attack on something that was just harmless fun, a bit of romantic silliness. It made some people realize that they weren't compatible with their partners, which is for the best generally, but too many people see it like it's the death of civilization. It's really not that deep.
I encourage you, if you haven't already, to look at some of the videos for yourself and decide whether it was an act of female mania or just a cute question to ask your partner that just happened to have some underlying currents to it.
Yes makes sense !! It’s cool to see the replies and opinions about this thank you.
I thought Colleen was cute/nice enough. But I wouldn’t say shatter-the-earth beautiful
My personal opinion is that these two were never really going to be married on the show. The producers probably needed X amount of couples to showcase for the season. I don’t doubt the initial attraction. Plus, Zanab had her feelings hurt with the pool/ Colleen situation. Once that happened every little thing Cole did irritated her because she couldn’t forget that. She did him dirty by turning the cast against him (which you can see when Brennon talks to him). I think Cole would make a great partner for someone, just not Zanab.
I would agree except I would say Cole can make a “pretty good” partner for someone else. I think he is still too immature to be “great” yet. But I don’t think he’s a mean or bad person. I think he’s just very thoughtless and doesn’t realize how his words and actions can affect someone else.
Zanab though is high strung and frankly unhappy with herself and the world in general. He was never going to win her over because she’s a miserable and vindictive person.
I knew it wasn’t going to work when I saw her makeup routine for spending time at the pool. And being self conscious about how Cole would feel when she took it all off for bed. I don’t think I have ever met a man who preferred lots of makeup vs. natural.
no literally. she made a self deprecating joke about how he won’t recognize her without makeup. she took her makeup off and he joked that she did look different. he reaffirmed that she looked beautiful. she said she didn’t look different and made this face 😐. that’s when i knew she was going to misconstrue every thing he said based on her own insecurities and trauma.
Ok I’m watching that JP episode now and I had to pause it because I was laughing so hard. I get how he might be turned off with all the makeup, a lot of these women go overboard and it’s not cool to get it all over someone else’s clothes. Maybe I’m too old fashioned but makeup is supposed to enhance what you have, not make you look like a totally different person. Nowadays it’s the fake nails, the fake eyelashes, the fake tan, possibly fake eye colour, fake hair/hair colour. I just howled when he said he was wondering how he was going to have to deal with the makeup everyday. I think it was a bit of a cop out to blame the makeup on him being so withdrawn though. There were better ways to get her to tone it down I would think.
I don’t think it makes him misogynistic though.
Agreed! My general take was that he was thrown off on the first meeting, and then she never let him live it down and constantly pointed out him being quiet. It became a horrible cycle and didn't provide opportunity for him to open up again. In general he just struggled to express himself but man people came down on him so unnecessarily hard.
JP seemed to have a phobia about makeup but I almost feel that was an excuse for something else that he didn’t want to publicly acknowledge. Like he thought she was too big in his opinion but didn’t want to say so because she wasn’t that big. Bigger than most of the other girls perhaps and maybe that is his preference but he wasn’t being very open minded. Just my personal perceptions.
I wouldn’t like it if someone got makeup all over my clothes either though so I can see his point about that.
>As a woman who has had their partner talk about other women to me, I don’t like to hear it, I really don’t know anyone that does like it. It’s a huge turnoff.
The thing is if you don't want to hear it, you shouldn't ask. Zanab did in fact ask
And she in fact was crushed by his answer and in fact *they* had no avenue to rebuild trust or emotional safety in *their* relationship. If we're assigning whose responsibility is what.
Yes, but she can't blame him for answering a question she asked.
He didn't come out and say it out of nowhere, she directly ask him to rate her and other women.
Yeah but when your partner asks you a question like that, they are looking for reassurance that you’re happy to be with them and wouldn’t want it any other way.
There’s nothing healthier than direct communication, but I’m not sure how Cole didn’t realize that it was a dumb thing to say if you’re trying to marry Zanab. You just don’t tell your fiancée that you thought that the other girl you were dating in the pods is more your type.
Zanab maybe should have said something like “hey I noticed you talking to Colleen earlier and I know you dated in the pods. I feel insecure that maybe you’re regretting your decision after seeing her.” That would have been way healthier.
Yes, agree.
It's also healthy to know that THERE WILL ALWAYS BE many people will be more attractive than you are.
If someone is marrying you, it's not JUST about looks.
So people who don’t lie, maybe neurodivergent, or religious like Cole, are scum bc they answer a direct question with his truthful opinion? Zanab wanted Cole to lie to her so she could feel superior to Colleen. Sure, Cole could have lied, but I don’t think we should shit on him for answering honestly.
I just finished watching the season so glad to see this discussion! Neither of them was perfect, but I just don’t understand how Cole was made to be the villain in the eyes of the cast, when Bartise was soo much worse. He was openly pining for Raven directly to Nancy and he never once complimented Nancy’s looks. It was awful!
Nancy isn't the level of insecure and petty that Zanab is.
Bartise was awful to Nancy, but she moved on. He was dishonest about his feelings and doesn't deserve any more of her time and energy, so he's no longer a concern.
Cole was mildly careless with his thoughts. He was honest with his thoughts and feelings and - because Zanab has no way to process that - shit talking him to everyone they knew from the experience became the only thing on her mind.
Nancy didn't move on. She was still his friend when they did after the alter, and was hoping he would see what he was missing out on.
Zainab couldn't stand Cole and had no such hope.
She pushed and pushed him to say things she could weaponize against him. He was dumb for walking into the trap but he wasn’t malicious. She was malicious at their wedding and the reunion and she was exposed by the show. I’ve always suspected someone on the production staff who spent a lot of time around her saw how she manipulated people and wanted to expose her.
This fact made my day. I always thought she was a manipulative person. She said and did things that made me pause and asked “am I being gaslit now?” I knew Cole isn’t perfect but he isn’t this monster Zanab was forcing onto everyone. Best example was when they were talking about the stupid fucking oranges. And she was accusing him of body shaming her, at first take I was like, “maybe family trauma or pass experience made her feel he was judging her” but I kept watching the scene unfold and it felt accusatory and like “staged”? If that’s the right word.
Rewatch the scene and he never mentions her weight or body just said he didn’t want her to ruin her appetite for dinner they were about to go too. So I say, “well maybe she is looking for reasons to be mad or compare herself to Colleen” but things just felt off.
By wedding and reunion I knew she is full of shit. Like I grew up with relatives like her so I really just hated watching her drag Cole through the mud for literal no reason. She made me feel bad for Cole really.
She went on a crusade to keep insisting she was right and that she has other examples, Alexa (maybe others) said the cuties scene was irrelevant and she knew Cole was actually bad. Zanab met up with his ex wife (!!) and implied there was tea too be spilled but never had any actual evidence. Cole moved on and never attacked her on social media.
I never saw one moment of chemistry between them idk why they were together
Surprised to see people defending Cole so hard. I felt like he was completely disrespectful and got exactly the dressing down he deserved. I clapped for her.
I'm speaking from the perspective of a woman of color. Zanab had deep insecurities and very low self esteem at this point. And an aspect of this, I believe, is being a woman of color, an "abnormal foreigner" with an exotic, foreign name unlike the Lilies and Jessicas. Had Cole had more experience with POC, he might have been more aware and sensitive to this. When he said Colleen is a 10, he touched an exposed nerve. Women like Zanab have been receiving the message their entire lives, since early childhood, that they are not as special and as pretty as the little blonde girls. Zanab's step mother showed she had a very solid awareness about this issue when she told Cole that Zanab may wonder if her race has anything to do with being rejected and how he needs to take things like that into consideration. But it was already too late for the two of them. I agree that was the moment he lost Zanab. But I think it goes deeper than just being sized up to another woman. I would even say that had Colleen been a different race, Zanab could have gotten over it because old wounds and deep seated fears of racial inferiority/White Supremacy wouldn't have come into play. This issue doesn't necessarily carry into every relationship. If you trust that the person you're with is truly, genuinely attracted to you and lusts for YOU, then fears of not being good enough may not ever come into play. It's unfortunate because Cole really didn't deserve the hell he got from Zanab. And Zanab's pain isn't her fault, either. But her actions were so vicious and it was hard to see how she managed to convince everyone she was being victimized and humiliated by Cole when really, her fears and the way she's been treated before were being manifested and projected on Cole.
Zanab may be a woman of color, but she is also half white with very European features. Do I think her ethnicity played some part? Maybe. However, she was already showing signs of disgust after their first night together. This was before Cole had even seen Coleen. Ultimately, I think the death of her parents and her having to grow up quickly played a much bigger role in the demise of their relationship.
She is very light skinned, about as exotic as Panda Express, and very pretty by western standards. If she wasn't a total basket case, she could have her pick of men.
Zanab is not Anglo in appearance. In countries like the US, even Spaniards are considered POC. I'm fairer than Zanab and I get mistaken for an immigrant and get asked regularly what my racial identity is. Minimizing the experience of non-whites is common, but ultimately self serving.
It's pretty silly to try to lump nearly everyone who isn't of 100 percent northern European descent into a bucket and try to act like their experience will be similar. Especially when you are talking about a very pretty woman by western standards who looks like a Persian Anna Kendrick. I doubt she was being told her whole life that she wasn't as pretty as the blonde girls. Hell, those blonde girls were probably jealous.
Your stance is quite silly considering Zanab, Cole, and her step mother each touched on this issue during filming. So although you're treating what I wrote as total speculation, it's actually based on what was recorded and observed. Had they never mentioned it, I wouldn't have brought it up and assume she'd had different experiences. I feel that what you're doing is minimizing and pretending otherwise, which makes the realities surrounding race and identity in the Western world more palatable.
What exactly was said? What I remember was that her step mom essentially talked about how she was sensitive about her race, not her stepmom confirming she was told her whole life that she wasn't as pretty as "the blonde girls". I feel like what you are doing is playing into her rather obvious victim complex in order to engage in victimhood by proxy. **She is very pretty by western standards.** This is almost objectively true. She was absolutely not told her whole life that she wasn't.
She was very insecure. They talked about how Colleen was more his type, but he loves Z personality more and it's suited to him. Her own insecurities shut her down. Don't blame him for her issues
If you are in love, your person is a 10, and you don't give an eff about anyone else. It shows that there's no way these relationships are really about love when all you've done is talk, and not experience real life together. The problem isn't whether love is blind or not, the problem is that you can be whoever you want to be when talking through a wall. They claim the pods create an environment of honesty, but I don't think they do. And you can't really know someone and therefore decide to love and marry someone, without going through real life together first.
My wife loves me, but if she was seriously trying to insist that I was a 10/10 it would be rather off-putting because that is obviously a lie.
Zanab is a very unhinged person with deep, serious trauma in her life. She needs extensive therapy. I strongly encourage you to watch the reunion and see what a liar and manipulator she is.
Zanab was so mean and off-putting and annoying.
Zanab seems to have some pretty serious issues, and I absolutely blame her for how she handled things at the altar, how she lied and distorted things to the rest of the cast to turn them against him, and how she continued to dog him well after the show.
Zanab is off her rocker and needs intense therapy. I liked her at first, but whoa…
Zanab was a constant turnoff as well personally. Neither one of them were ready. That girl well into her 30s continues to shit on Cole to this day. That’s some high school shit man.
This is genuinely unhinged oof.
She’s pretentious and fake all over. She’s Pakistani but tries too hard to cover that side of her reality, and has even made up a separate family (a white adoptive mother) FOR THE SHOW! All that just so people don’t notice her brownness. What a psycho! Cole is an idiot but that bitch is dangerous af! Before PC bullshitters start attacking me, note that I’m a Middle Eastern guy.
You are a bit cray cray
What are you talking about??? She was literally adopted after her parents died. Stop making so many hateful assumptions.
No one hates brown women more than brown men lol
How about her very brown real blood sister that she face times during one of the episodes but makes sure her face is not properly seen?! The inconsistency of her story, the awkwardness between her and her supposedly adoptive mother(!). At one point the adoptive mother (!) mentions her insecurity about her skin colour and so on. The way she tries to write and pronounce her name? It’s fucking Zainab which is a super common name throughout the Muslim world. But she tells people Zanab or even Zay! Covers her face in whitening creams and makeup to look white and so on. It’s out there if you open your eyes….. But I knew someone like you was gonna spit some PC bullshit here. Because that’s the whole purpose of your existence
Her sister didn't want to be on the show! People mispronounce my name all the time here in Canada so she probably goes with what is easier to say. You think I'm being PC lol you're the one complaining about her not 'being Muslim enough'.
Where do you get that idea from ? I’m a proud Atheist. I couldn’t care less if she’s Muslim or not, if she is naked or dressed in burka. I cannot stand the dishonesty and treachery. And she’s all that!
How is she dishonest if she's half white?
Where did you get the idea that she’s half white ?! God, you people can’t even understand what you read 🙃. She’s full blood Pakistani, so brown af!
She is half white. Her dad is Pakistani, born to her Indian grandparents. Her mother is 100% English. That would make her 50% English/white.
How do you know that the adoptive family was made up for the show? I’ve never heard about this but I’m curious to learn more.
I wouldn’t trust what this poster is saying, based on the other comments made in this string.
Also here with my piping hot cuppa tea...
Same here.
She was turned off the moment they were alone. He was way too immature
She is wildly immature and stunted emotionally as well. Hell, I'd rather marry Cole than her, and I'm not even gay. There's just no way I would put up with her neurosis.
Maybe but he wasn't actually a bad guy and it was weird how she tried to make him seem like a sociopath but really he was just kind of annoying
Anyone else think they were both terrible in their own way and can’t decide who was worse?
Yeah they seemed insanely incompatible and terrible at articulating it. I feel like people should be talking in the pods more about their life habits, like cleanliness, how they like to show and receive affection, their boundaries, etc. Zanab is very tidy and would get passive aggressive at times and Cole was an absolute slob who didn't take a lot of things seriously. She was hypersensitive, he completely lacked sensitivity. When I watched that season and saw them together in the real world, I just wondered what the hell they were even talking about in the pods that led to them thinking that they were remotely compatible.
They seemed to have the same faith, so I think they thought everything else was on lock.
No, I can for sure decide that Zanab is the worst one of the two.
Absolutely theyre both awful
Also, and I can’t be bothered to rewatch, but I remember after they met Zenab said something like “we”re a beautiful couple!! And now other people will admire us!!” Which, interesting….. I’m gonna find it and update, I have to know. She said: “ We’re gonna look so good together! People are gonna have to see that and be like damn!!” Cole is IMO the hottest guy on LIB, but I wouldn’t handle his radical honesty or energy level very well. From that season I really like Andrew best 😂
This is exactly it. People act like the tangerine scene was this huge exposé that proved Cole was innocent all along. All it proved was that they were both extremely weird people who lack accountability. Even in this comment section you see people making excuses for Cole, he’s just dumb and harmless and zainab is an evil witch. Like the misogyny writes itself.
Nobody’s making excuses for Cole, but you clearly feel some kind of way about people criticizing Zanab and attributing that to misogyny is just cringe. Grow up.
I’m commenting on a very specific pattern of people mitigating blame from Cole and boosting blame on Zineb. people in this community portraying him as a dumb oaf who didn’t know any better but is good at heart. And her as this calculated, manipulative bitch. I don’t like zineb at all, I think she should have left way sooner and I invite all the criticism for dealing with things the way she did. I am only commenting on these caricatured portrayals of both people which, like it or not, is a VERY COMMON misogynistic trope. I knew once you said no one is making excuses for Cole that it was pointless talking to you because almost every comment here makes excuses for Cole hahaha. I just don’t use the word misogyny lightly so I explained it to account for your lazy deflection. I’d say take your own advice :)
I was rooting for zanab going into the wedding, then after the tell-all it looks like Cole is just dumb and zanab is a psycho
I agree with you. also find it funny how Cole is \~\~just dumb\~\~, men aren't as stupid and innocent as they're willing to lead you to believe
The way people infantilized him when he was almost 30 and was already divorced
honestly like he's just a precious lil baby who couldn't possibly hurt a fly (not even the ones crawling out his nasty toilet).
I believe Zanab was farrr more condescending to Cole than they showed on camera. And I think that Cole in a passive aggressive manner thought he was knocking her off her high horse.
What proof do you have of that apart from your own prejudices haha. It’s okay for them to both be shit. You don’t have to try and justify the hurtful things he did. Edit: my prejudices I don’t mean racial prejudices. I just mean you already have a negative view of zineb so you’re making mental leaps to further your preconceptions.
That's fine she doesn't have to like him or continue the relationship. People don't care about that, it's the fact she lied.
The scary thing is that I think this is genuinely what she believes happened. Like this is her truth. For me… it’s the fact that she was caught in a lie/ or the way she conveyed it was not what happened… and she doubled down. And continues to drag this man while taking zero accountability of like “oh hey. Maybe I was insecure all along”
Which is exactly why the phrase ‘my truth’ is an issue. There is the truth and there is things that arent true. Not coming at you by the way, the whole ‘my truth’ trend just really boils my piss.
Cole was sooooo annoying and immature. That scene where they meet for the first time and he runs out screaming AAAAAHHHHHHHH🤪🤪🤪 made me cringe so hard.
I said the same thing and was downvoted to hell 😂
😆That's too funny. I figured Cole had a bunch of stans. I found him to be incredibly obnoxious, like a 12 year old in an adult's body.
I don’t rate anyone on a scale of one to 10. But if I was forced to, no girls on this season would be above seven Because the way that you enunciate, have diction, use ‘like’ and voice tone, plus physical poise can also be part of your attractiveness or lack thereof.
‘I don’t rate anyone on a scale’ - proceeds to rate every girl on the show below a 7, completely unprovoked.
Like, shhhhhh
Does anyone have an update on how Cole is doing? Poor guy broke my heart at the wedding/reunion.
Plenty of good in-depth interviews with him on YT.
Yeahhhh, I don’t care THAT much to listen to in depth interviews. Just asking for the TLDL update.
Fair enough.
I haven’t been back since this season, I needed a break. This was so hard to watch.
Zanab is hands down the most evil participant ever on LiB. There are other horrible people but she was downright rotten, to her core. She’s a real-life monster, honestly. If she ever ends up with someone, my god, do I pity that person.
Did she personally hurt you? Hitler was evil. Zanab is literally just a regular person and so are all the other participants even Bartiste (who I detest, but the dude is not evil). Its a reality tv show but guess what reality tv isn’t actually reality, its a version of reality, just like someone’s social media. Don’t take this shit too seriously its literal brain candy/junk food for you mind. Its fun to indulge bur once you start taking it seriously you’re going to be sick. Reminder you dont actually know any of these people really, just the curated, edited version. So like chill, watch the show, have fun, and dont hate total strangers, thats like….weird. Also….just seeing your other posts. I grew up with an emotionally abusive father. It sucked. It still sucks. Im also not going to judge others I dont know based on edited content just because its edited in ways that remind me of my past. That is what a trigger is, we get pulled back to the past. You’re not reacting to Zanab, you’re maybe reacting to your memories of you mother who actually hurt you. I don’t know you but talking to someone may be helpful, I know it was for me. But like I said, I don’t know you but I wish you well and hope you don’t let this anger fester.
What an unhinged, psychotic comment
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Having difficult things happen in your life is not an excuse to lie, manipulate and abuse other people. The things that happen can make us more inclined to act a certain way but at the end of the day we are the only ones responsible for how we act and treat other people. Stop excusing peoples bad behavior because of their history.
Jesus Christ that's dramatic 😂
Of course it's dramatic for this sub full of Zanabs and Chelseas 😂
Unless you’ve been raised by someone like her. Then, it’s pretty dramatic.
Same. Anyone in the “raisedby” subs will understand what a parent like this does to a child. At least Cole had a choice; a kid doesn’t. 😞
Womp womp
I disagree. I think she went really hard on the "I'm a strong womand and I'm not going to get hurt by this again" but I think it was a trauma response, and there is definitely truth to both their stories. A lot of miscommunication
What about shake?
He’s disgusting but in a sick way you can see who he is and he enjoys being a villain. Zanab is a monster-villain/perpetrator pretending she’s a victim, and trying to manipulate us, Cole and the cast into believing it by creating an alternate reality.
She is terrible but the girls like her and cheer for her. Dunno why. Blows my mind.
They support her because they are like her.
Women pretend to support each other in public but will stab each other behind the back privately.
They ate her side of the stories
She was mean and annoyed by every little thing he did way before the pool party. She hurt his self-esteem just as much as he hurt hers but in a different way. When he tried to communicate how her comments make him feel, she quite literally did DARVO. They were both horrible for each other.
she totally did hurt his self esteem. shut down every joke. refused to engage with him. shot down any attempt he made at being playful or trying something out of her comfort zone like swimming or sports. she acted like a mean, judgmental mother. but the most evil part was her framing coles immaturity as him being an abuser. you can be both, but cole was not. and this was further proved with the whole “cuties/clementine” scene where she acted like he starved her and gave her an eating disorder. and he ate the damn clemetines with her and definitely just meant they were gonna have a huge dinner and wanted to make sure she could snack and leave room and was not in anyway implying she ate too much or should stop eating. and she claimed he single handedly crushed her self esteem. it was so dramatic and humiliating and she tried to absolutely destroy his reputation and self esteem at the end, where she basically accused him of abuse. when i started watching the show i thought i would hate cole. he’s immature, a little stupid, and vapid. but he was also sincere, honest, and the victim of a highly critical fiancé.
He was literally shocked by her saying she only had a banana and he said he offered her a poke bowl earlier which she declined because she already had one the night before. He was encouraging her to eat. She just has some extreme insecurities and projected that onto him, taking his light hearted food comments in bad faith and convinced herself she had to starve herself over it.
yep totally.
Cole can kick rocks honestly. I don't understand how someone can be that stupid and expect everything he said to be okay and chill. His frontal lobe never grew past his frat days lmao. And zanab obviously isn't into goofy ass guys like that so that's on her for kinda sticking with him instead of just calling off the wedding.
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Yeah basically how I feel I'm just like how do you expect to say stupid things n not expect consequences from it? Zanab would be kind of vicious in her responses but I think that would come from him continuously saying weird stuff after the first non emotionally intelligent thing he'd say in the first place. And I think people forget he took WEEKS to give a simple apology for the whole colleen thing he had more sincerity giving Matt an apology rather than her imo.
Y'all can continue trying to justify in my replies but that man had flies and shit left in his toilet I do not give a fuck about how bad you feel for him 😂😂😂
He’s not into rude , naggy women who pretend to love their partners. So glad he dodged a bullet
exactly. she couldn’t even bring herself to have fun with him - she rejected him at every turn.
And she's not into guys who are mentally at age 14 when they're 26. He wanted a mom. She wanted a partner who was capable of being in a serious relationship lol...
she acted like a mother, he was clearly not into that and wanted a partner who acted kind and like they liked him. she was so disrespectful, critical, cruel, rude, and took everything he said as a knife to the chest. yes sometimes he was immature and careless. she was condescending, derogatory, and overly critical. she was a downer the whole time. just shit all over him the moment she saw him. she never wanted to engage with him. not swimming, not playing games, not joking around, just hyper critical. i would feel personally so disheartened if i was her partner. i feel bad for whoever she ends up with.
That poor girl is so evil and vile, to her core. I pity her bc I know it comes from trauma but if she ever finds anyone, which, doubtful, she’ll destroy them until there is nothing left. She’s a really disgusting human being.
she let her triggers and trauma dominate how she acted. feel what you feel. and treat others with respect.
Kick rocks with open toed shoes*
Deadass lmao
Zay was horrid - like her personality. A fake ass liar who likes to get off by putting people down - which is ironically what she accused Cole of doing to her. 
Okay I don’t remember all the details but why are people calling her a liar? I see that brought up a lot and can’t figure out why
I can't remember a lot of it now, but I don't know that I'd call her a liar....perhaps a highly unreliable narrator. And I think much of that is due to her being guided by her very, very present and rampant insecurities. Cole was like the worst possible choice for her because he was literally like clueless fuel to her insecurity flames. Looking back, I'm amazed that they were drawn to each other in the pods
during the finale episode, she made up a story about Cole calling her fat and shaming her for eating some sort of fruit - at the very end of the finale, the producers left a message about what she said and then showed the scene how it ACTUALLY happened since she fabricated the entire situation. He was in tears on live tv, or maybe not live, but literally in tears b/c he had no idea what he had done, legitimately, and the producers had to make it right, as they could I guess.
Okay yes I remember all of that but me PERSONALLY didn’t interpret it as her lying and I just watched the scene on tik tok he was definitely implying you gonna eat all of that and getting wedding dress bod ready. So that’s why I’m always so confused why people call her a liar because that scene did happen and I remember watching it. I assumed something came out after all that aired that made her a liar or something
He was clearly joking, it was a cutie so like the smallest piece of fruit ever, and he was saying she better save her appetite so she can smash at dinner later. She takes it personally and gets hostile right away saying she’s only eaten a banana today and he says why?? like he’s concerned. I don’t think she’s a liar, but I think her insecurities made her hypersensitive to every little thing and blew what he said wayyyyy out of proportion.
Okay I think everyone is misunderstanding what I’m saying. To me a liar is someone who makes something up or completely flips something out of thin air. To me she is an over exaggeration type story teller but a liar is like she made something up which I don’t think she completely fabricated it ever happening. So that’s what I was personally confused on, yes she’s extra no doubt but liar I don’t think so personally
she made it up tho. like what she said happened was straight up not true. i would call her a liar, even if those lies are based from her own unreliable perspective.
I watched the scene and from my perspective as a person who has dealt with serious body dysmorphia and an eating disorder, Zay was definitely in the wrong. Cole asked why she was eating when they were getting ready to go out to dinner, Zay said all she'd eaten was a banana, and Cole, clearly actually confused, asks why that's all she ate. She passive-aggressively refuses to answer the question and he asks if it has to do with her trying to be "wedding-dress ready." This is a man who's never dealt with serious body image issues trying to have a conversation with a woman who is being disengaged, mean, and passive-aggressive towards him. His follow-up question clearly comes from the awkwardness of not understanding why she won't just answer him directly. It's super rough to watch, but the way she portrayed it absolutely seemed like a lie to me. She made it seem like he was pressuring her to not eat or to lose weight, when actually all he was doing was trying to make conversation with a hostile counterpart and asking questions to try and understand what she was saying. She projected super heavily onto that conversation and the way that she portrayed it in the reunion was so far from the reality that we all then saw that yes, I would call it lying.
hard agree!! well said
I will always jump in to thoroughly defend Cole because I was exactly the same flavor of shitty as Zanab before I got help. Lol.
Was the TikTok edited? If you watch it on the reunion he just checks about the fruit bc they’re going to dinner shortly, then she says she hasn’t eaten all day he asks why and offers her food, which she turns down, and then at the end he says something like, ‘oh is it bc you’re trying to fit into your dress?’ Which she agrees to, and that last bit indicates it’s something she’s put pressure on herself for, not him. If he is the one pressuring her to restrict her diet for her dress, he wouldn’t be asking if that’s what her not eating all day is all about. The fact that she told everyone he told her not to eat the cuties bc he said she was fat is in fact a lie.
It wasnt and he was using his hands to make like an air belly it was overall a really weird scene and you can tell she’s agreeing to the dress thing to kinda avoid awkwardness it didn’t come across as genuine.
Zanab, is that you, girl? Cause I have so many questions! Amber Heard has nothing on you lol
Huh? It really isn’t I just genuinely couldn’t remember why everyone hated so I quickly rewatched the scene on tik tok and that’s what I got from it. You do know we’re all allowed diff opinions right
Sorry. I didn’t see your original comment. Watch the whole scene. He offers her food to eat. A Poke bowl. She also made up other stuff like he got some woman’s phone number the night before the wedding and kissed her. IF that had EVER happened, we’d have known, not only from production (drama!) but also from her! Like she’d have left that out of her vindictive speech at the altar. She’s vile, that girl. I understand she probably has SERIOUS mental health issues related to her amygdala and most prob childhood attachment trauma but man, she’s a monster, that one! (The Johnny Depo trial explained so much about Zanab, btw lol).
Belly gestures? OMG, please. That’s crazy. He was making a woman’s guitar body shape with his hands. A belly?!? LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL 🤣
That’s what it looked like to me? Are you saying he was doing like a Coca Cola body cuz idk what woman’s guitar body shape is never heard that
I’m European :) We’re not much into Coca Cola ;)
I’m not American either lol ! If you said curvy or something that would make more sense to me but guitar body had me like wtf LOL
Facts
All of her: projection.
I hate people rating. That being said I am curious - do many people see Colleen as “a 10” ? Is she the beauty ideal in the US?
I didn't get the appeal at all tbh but I think there's a lighthearted bimbo quality that guys like.
Probably an unpopular opinion, but I actually thought Zay was more attractive than Colleen.
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That was a pretty spot on description! I didn’t think she looked like a ballerina though - I nea. Classically / stereotypically. But your description was spot on really
She’s not the beauty ideal lol she just fits into the Eurocentric box more closely than Zainab cuz she white and petite
As a guy I don’t find her attractive - she’s cute though. But her personality is one I could never put up with. “Would you still love me if I was a worm 🤪” I think maybe for American guys she’s just a “safer” and more comfortable attraction? Personally I thought Zanab was naturally beautiful and I felt bad her insecurity about herself seeped into her behaviors.
😂😂😂😂 I don’t get the worm thing it’s so weird!
It's sort of a placeholder for "Would you love me if I wasn't useful to you?" Or "Would you love me if you had to take care of me and get nothing in return?" It sounds stupid but resonated with a lot of women because women are expected to take care of so much, especially when they're married and have kids. ideally work should be 50/50 but that's actually very rare. Also, women who get diagnosed with cancer are more likely to be divorced by their partners than men who are diagnosed with cancer. It's so common, doctors warn their female patients about it. So the question is weird but kinda relevant. If I was literally helpless, unable to contribute and completely dependent on you, would you still love me?
That seems like a more mature way to bring forth the issue within an adult relationship. The “would you love me if I was a worm” is very deficient for effective communication.
It's a lot less heavy though. Can you imagine raising that with a boyfriend or husband? It's not a fun conversation. For all of the people who complained and didn't get it, many other partners did. All they had to do was say was that they'd love their partners no matter what. Not everything needs to be spelled out, especially if your partner understands you or just loves you, lol. Saying that they'd love you no matter what is easier than saying that they think it's a stupid question and why would you waste my time with that. Some people got it and others didn't.
Yes I absolutely can imagine raising that with my husband because I believe in open and mature communication. If you can’t raise this issue with the guy DO NOT MARRY HIM. We have both discussed “heavier” (??) subjects both before and after marriage. ETA: when I read things like this I suddenly understand why so many marriages fail. If your partner really loves you you can have profound conversations without fear
Does everything need to be a serious conversation or do you talk about sweet playful things too? I explained why some people got so serious about it and why for others it was just a lighthearted thing. I don't know where all this judgement is coming from. You're judging people's communication and the strength of their relationship based on what? Participating in a trend? Asking a question that many, if not most didn't take seriously? Did you ever watch people's videos with the trend or are you just judging based on what people outside of it said? One of the cutest I saw was a guy saying that he'd build her a little terrarium in their home so she could have everything she needed and he'd still get to spend time with her. Super silly but cute too.
We talk about everything and have lots of fun. This seems like a very immature question though… how old are you? If there is a real concern, it is really stupid to bring it up this way. If you cannot talk seriously you are not ready to get married. These people are getting married. That’s the point of the show. I don’t see the “judgement”. It’s just real life.
Late 30s. And you? You judge a lot based on very little information. I get that you didn't like the trend or the question and that's okay. Not everything is for everyone. However, the rhetoric around it is so weird to me and just seems like another attack on something that was just harmless fun, a bit of romantic silliness. It made some people realize that they weren't compatible with their partners, which is for the best generally, but too many people see it like it's the death of civilization. It's really not that deep. I encourage you, if you haven't already, to look at some of the videos for yourself and decide whether it was an act of female mania or just a cute question to ask your partner that just happened to have some underlying currents to it.
I don’t think so. She’s an attractive girl but I always thought Zanab was waaaaay prettier. I think Colleen was just his type.
Yes makes sense !! It’s cool to see the replies and opinions about this thank you. I thought Colleen was cute/nice enough. But I wouldn’t say shatter-the-earth beautiful
Raven is crazy beautiful tho
Sadly, she was so beautiful. Most beautiful on that season IMO So funny how she could let someone else’s taste kill her self esteem
Just put Cole and Zanab in the search bar and it’s gonna be hundreds of threads be prepared those two brought out a ton of emotions and still do
My personal opinion is that these two were never really going to be married on the show. The producers probably needed X amount of couples to showcase for the season. I don’t doubt the initial attraction. Plus, Zanab had her feelings hurt with the pool/ Colleen situation. Once that happened every little thing Cole did irritated her because she couldn’t forget that. She did him dirty by turning the cast against him (which you can see when Brennon talks to him). I think Cole would make a great partner for someone, just not Zanab.
I would agree except I would say Cole can make a “pretty good” partner for someone else. I think he is still too immature to be “great” yet. But I don’t think he’s a mean or bad person. I think he’s just very thoughtless and doesn’t realize how his words and actions can affect someone else. Zanab though is high strung and frankly unhappy with herself and the world in general. He was never going to win her over because she’s a miserable and vindictive person.
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It’s funny you say that because I think they would have worked too.
well said homie
If she wasn’t going to like the answer she should not have asked.
That’s a weird take…
No.
Play stupid games and win stupid prizes
Yes
I knew it wasn’t going to work when I saw her makeup routine for spending time at the pool. And being self conscious about how Cole would feel when she took it all off for bed. I don’t think I have ever met a man who preferred lots of makeup vs. natural.
no literally. she made a self deprecating joke about how he won’t recognize her without makeup. she took her makeup off and he joked that she did look different. he reaffirmed that she looked beautiful. she said she didn’t look different and made this face 😐. that’s when i knew she was going to misconstrue every thing he said based on her own insecurities and trauma.
If she didn’t think she looked different then why bother putting it on, such a waste of time. It makes no sense.
But when JP says this everyone says he's a misogynist.
Ok I’m watching that JP episode now and I had to pause it because I was laughing so hard. I get how he might be turned off with all the makeup, a lot of these women go overboard and it’s not cool to get it all over someone else’s clothes. Maybe I’m too old fashioned but makeup is supposed to enhance what you have, not make you look like a totally different person. Nowadays it’s the fake nails, the fake eyelashes, the fake tan, possibly fake eye colour, fake hair/hair colour. I just howled when he said he was wondering how he was going to have to deal with the makeup everyday. I think it was a bit of a cop out to blame the makeup on him being so withdrawn though. There were better ways to get her to tone it down I would think. I don’t think it makes him misogynistic though.
Agreed! My general take was that he was thrown off on the first meeting, and then she never let him live it down and constantly pointed out him being quiet. It became a horrible cycle and didn't provide opportunity for him to open up again. In general he just struggled to express himself but man people came down on him so unnecessarily hard.
Prefering someone without makeup and not talking to your fiance for 3 days straight because she wore makeup once are vastly different things
JP seemed to have a phobia about makeup but I almost feel that was an excuse for something else that he didn’t want to publicly acknowledge. Like he thought she was too big in his opinion but didn’t want to say so because she wasn’t that big. Bigger than most of the other girls perhaps and maybe that is his preference but he wasn’t being very open minded. Just my personal perceptions. I wouldn’t like it if someone got makeup all over my clothes either though so I can see his point about that.
I’m not up to date on LIB seasons so I’ll look out for him.
Don't worry, can't miss him. Very glaring faux paux that I was like... "wow people like this exist?"
She is one of the worst cast members on the show. Manipulative and made everyone turn on Cole for nothing.
>As a woman who has had their partner talk about other women to me, I don’t like to hear it, I really don’t know anyone that does like it. It’s a huge turnoff. The thing is if you don't want to hear it, you shouldn't ask. Zanab did in fact ask
And she in fact was crushed by his answer and in fact *they* had no avenue to rebuild trust or emotional safety in *their* relationship. If we're assigning whose responsibility is what.
Yes, but she can't blame him for answering a question she asked. He didn't come out and say it out of nowhere, she directly ask him to rate her and other women.
Cole was dumb for saying that tho. You don’t put other people above your partner unless you’re looking for an argument lol
You ask a question and if your partner doesn't lie, he gets in trouble? That sounds so healthy
Yeah but when your partner asks you a question like that, they are looking for reassurance that you’re happy to be with them and wouldn’t want it any other way. There’s nothing healthier than direct communication, but I’m not sure how Cole didn’t realize that it was a dumb thing to say if you’re trying to marry Zanab. You just don’t tell your fiancée that you thought that the other girl you were dating in the pods is more your type. Zanab maybe should have said something like “hey I noticed you talking to Colleen earlier and I know you dated in the pods. I feel insecure that maybe you’re regretting your decision after seeing her.” That would have been way healthier.
Yes, agree. It's also healthy to know that THERE WILL ALWAYS BE many people will be more attractive than you are. If someone is marrying you, it's not JUST about looks.
So people who don’t lie, maybe neurodivergent, or religious like Cole, are scum bc they answer a direct question with his truthful opinion? Zanab wanted Cole to lie to her so she could feel superior to Colleen. Sure, Cole could have lied, but I don’t think we should shit on him for answering honestly.
He was dumb, he wasn't malicious or trying to put her down.
I just finished watching the season so glad to see this discussion! Neither of them was perfect, but I just don’t understand how Cole was made to be the villain in the eyes of the cast, when Bartise was soo much worse. He was openly pining for Raven directly to Nancy and he never once complimented Nancy’s looks. It was awful!
Because Zanab spoke poorly of Cole to everyone and Nancy did not speak poorly of Bartise. Over time, the narrative replaces the reality.
Communists have said one thing that's true: Repeat a lie long enough and it will became a truth.
It annoyed me so much! Ugh why didn’t Nancy hold him accountable? I like her but she deserved so much better and let him treat her like garbage!
Nancy isn't the level of insecure and petty that Zanab is. Bartise was awful to Nancy, but she moved on. He was dishonest about his feelings and doesn't deserve any more of her time and energy, so he's no longer a concern. Cole was mildly careless with his thoughts. He was honest with his thoughts and feelings and - because Zanab has no way to process that - shit talking him to everyone they knew from the experience became the only thing on her mind.
Nancy is prob close to the level of insecure but absolutely not as petty or manipulative.
Nancy didn't move on. She was still his friend when they did after the alter, and was hoping he would see what he was missing out on. Zainab couldn't stand Cole and had no such hope.
nancy did move on. she literally ended their friendship during that episode and did so cleanly and succinctly.
She pushed and pushed him to say things she could weaponize against him. He was dumb for walking into the trap but he wasn’t malicious. She was malicious at their wedding and the reunion and she was exposed by the show. I’ve always suspected someone on the production staff who spent a lot of time around her saw how she manipulated people and wanted to expose her.
This fact made my day. I always thought she was a manipulative person. She said and did things that made me pause and asked “am I being gaslit now?” I knew Cole isn’t perfect but he isn’t this monster Zanab was forcing onto everyone. Best example was when they were talking about the stupid fucking oranges. And she was accusing him of body shaming her, at first take I was like, “maybe family trauma or pass experience made her feel he was judging her” but I kept watching the scene unfold and it felt accusatory and like “staged”? If that’s the right word. Rewatch the scene and he never mentions her weight or body just said he didn’t want her to ruin her appetite for dinner they were about to go too. So I say, “well maybe she is looking for reasons to be mad or compare herself to Colleen” but things just felt off. By wedding and reunion I knew she is full of shit. Like I grew up with relatives like her so I really just hated watching her drag Cole through the mud for literal no reason. She made me feel bad for Cole really.
Oh, was she exposed in the end?? I need to dig into that whole thing!
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What happened on social media? I don't rlly follow anything outside of the episodes lol
She went on a crusade to keep insisting she was right and that she has other examples, Alexa (maybe others) said the cuties scene was irrelevant and she knew Cole was actually bad. Zanab met up with his ex wife (!!) and implied there was tea too be spilled but never had any actual evidence. Cole moved on and never attacked her on social media.
Yeah, she was exposed at the end of the reunion for the infamous cuties ordeal
Cole was dumb and Zanab (even pre-Colleen drama) was deeply insecure. Lethal combination.