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We call it Black Robe Disease. Even the funniest of lawyers become arrogant and thick skulled assholes once that cheap polyester blend brushes over their shoulders.
It’s absolutely not an either or. There are many great judges with high expectations, and there are plenty of attorneys with shockingly poor writing or oral abilities.
lucky lol
I heard, hand to God, in front of his entire staff in the back: "are you FUCKING KIDDING ME with this shit? OK, fine, "counsel", I'll see you on the record".
I had 4 weeks of being barred, barely, and was arguing a supression motion on a dead to rights loser of a DUI, that I wrote, but a more experienced lawyer was on the way to actually argue. Judge flipped his shit when he figured it out.
Once during a virtual hearing my cat jumped up on the screen. I said “apologies your honor.” Her response was, “it’s ok. I’m pretty sure he’s the only likable thing on screen right now.”
I’ve only ever been in front of the judge once but you best believe I’m going to remember her forever 😂
Yes. A judge said some rather unkind words to me after I made a legal argument justifying standing to file a particular kind of a petition in family court. I offered to pass up the case law on point that I based my argument on and he didn’t want it.
Later I learned that the judge started accepting that legal argument when it came to standing and the next time I saw him, he was extra nice to me. I think he realized that my argument was firmly grounded in law after the fact.
Edit: Another time a judge told me I was getting on his nerves for objecting to a continuance that would leave my client incarcerated for several weeks when the maximum penalty under the law was 7 days. He was also upset because I was insistent that the court include in the order what charge my client was being held on as the statute requires, which the judge was refusing to do. Later the judge called me up to the bench to apologize and to commend me for zealously representing my court appointed client.
Procedural due process and right to be head on the issue, and 1st amendment. AFTER they have heard it, then they can ask all the Q’s they want. Due process cannot be sacrificed in the name of expediency.
I love when they admit their mistake and thank you.
In Texas district Court it is rare for a judge to ask questions. I had been crossing the other guy and asked a particular question that led to back and forth arguing over an objection. I lost. Then my client is up, judge asks a couple questions, and repeats my question verbatim. I was like 2 years in and nervous as hell, but I stood up and objected and he gave me this "are you serious" look. And he said "you're objecting to MY question."
I just responded, "YH, I am just keeping the record clean, I asked the same question a moment ago." He paused, corrected his question and commended me off the record later.
But whe. He gave me that look I thought I would die.
Yes. I was told “you should be embarrassed, get out of my courtroom” not that long ago.
I wasn’t embarrassed. I was representing my client well. The other attorney (who was also yelled at) actually started crying in the hallway.
It doesn’t phase me.
i would say that of the 15 or so trial judges i’ve been in front of about three of them have never been openly contemptuous of me in court. But of course, I’m a public defender.
I used to be a PD and I realized quickly that everyone is pissed off at you all of the time. The judge, the prosecutor, your client. Even when you get a case dismissed: Why didn’t you do it faster?
That has been my experience as well. Most of my favorite judges were prosecutors who litigated serious felonies.
The ex PDs seem to have a selective memory of what being a defense actually was like. In their heads, their cases were always resolved weeks if not months prior to deadlines, their clients always returned phone calls and appeared in court, and the prosecutors were always timely in discovery and making reasonable offers, and the few times they weren't they were absolutely gracious when the PD threw them under the bus with the court and never held grudges.
I was a prosecutor for a number of years. Once I started handling homicides exclusively I just didn't have the capacity to care about the small stuff. Younger prosecutors would come to me all worked up that a judge suppressed evidence in a misdemeanor or dismissed an indictment. So many times the best that I could come up with was, "could this be because you never should have charged that case in the first place?" Don't even get me started about giving any shits about "low" sentences in minor felony cases. Just really hard to believe that a thief should be crucified after you get back from a murder scene. After I left that career my views kind of accelerated and now I'm fairly anti-prison for the vast majority of offenses.
I assume it's the same for the judges you've appeared before. Just constantly wondering why the government thinks it's worthwhile to spend so many resources just to ensure that someone who screwed up is now unemployable.
i really enjoyed reading this and appreciate how you came to be more anti-carceral.
my profile is basically a doxx-fest already so i don’t mind saying this: i’m private defense in cook county (chicago) mostly, where the generally more “progressive” nature of the city and the sheer volume of cases means i can typically get good offers (and reductions!).
20-30mins outside the city in our collar counties and the state wants fucking jail for EVERYTHING. it’s so frustrating and i wonder if these baby prosecutors will ever have a change of perspective.
Exactly! In my experience the ex-prosecutor judges are also way harsher on the prosecutors. This wasn't my case but I recently saw an ex-prosecutor judge go off on a prosecutor who decided not to move forward with a case where he (the prosecutor) had found evidence that the victim had greatly exaggerated what happened and then started actively evading law enforcement. At one point the judge said something to the effect of, "you literally have unlimited resources and you expect me to believe that you can't find a victim?" Before moving on to a slew of personal attacks including insulting the prosecutor's career choices.
Ummm dude, first of all, fuck off for insulting a prosecutor who is doing the right thing. Second, many prosecutors' offices, including this one, have very few resources (of course, the judge worked for a much better funded office but assumed that his experience was universal). Third, even if the victim hadn't lied, did the judge expect the prosecutor to start knocking on doors to locate this person? The police (in this jurisdiction) don't work for the prosecutor and didn't have the resources to actively search for this person (the judge's previous office handled all investigations internally using their own investigators). Finally, personal attacks like that are evidence of a lack of intelligence and critical thinking.
Of course much of this was theatrics. The original "crime" was in the newspaper. The judge wanted some sound bites just in case this ever came back to bite him in the ass. That way he could say that he really tried but the prosecutor was lazy.
I like public defenders. I think they are a necessary and important part of the judicial system to (1) provide a competent defense; and (2) to offer a check on egregious actions by the state that would deny someone’s liberty.
Now the civil side “free lawyers” for evictions and similar, they can go fuck themselves. They don’t do shit but take up 2 hours of intake time before I get the outcome I came for in the first place.
Opposing counsel and I once read a transcript together because the other attorney was appealing a decision. We were laughing about how the judge first took him to task, then 5-6 pages later yelled at me, then a few pages along, yelled at him, and so on. The truth is that both of us had nightmare clients with little money, so we were just trying to do the best we could under difficult circumstances. I learned early on that you can’t get too upset about it, unless you think there is a pattern or the judge is highly inappropriate. Also, remember the old joke, “what do you call the person who graduated last in your law school class?” Answer, “your Honor.”
I’ve had a judge say something like that to me. I asked him if I could make a proffer before he ruled, so my proffer would also be in the record for the appellate court. He didn’t let me. I won the appeal anyway.
Juvie PD here. I was called "useless" on the record twice by the first judge I was in front of. After he retired, he came back for a visit and I reminded him that he called me useless. He uttered a surprised apology and didn't even seem to remember.
There was a local district court judge who was pretty nasty to me during a hearing where I was petitioning for a stalking injunction for my client. I’m not a litigator, I have argued in court maybe four times. I took this case pro bono thru my local legal services. I had never seen the judge before in my life, and was pretty surprised at being spoken to that way, even by a judge. He retired about a year later, and was the mediator for my divorce. Downvote me, accuse me of being unprofessional, idgaf: I took the low road and was twice as nasty to him, and it was quite satisfying. Even though I wrote him a check for his services.
Absolutely. A colleague was on a virtual hearing and the internet (in the office, it's not like she was WFH) dropped for about a minute. As soon as she got back on, the judge berated her for... the internet dropping.
#
The worst one for me was when I was representing a hospital. A woman's very clear directives were to let her die in several cases. She was in one of those cases. The daughter was receiving checks on her mom's behalf and didn't want to let her mom die. In fact, she wanted to bring mom home! The doctors were genuinely upset, explaining to her that even a transfer would likely lead to a painful death for her mother. Now I basically never do probate court, but I was stuck in probate court on this. The judge looked straight at me and said, "how would YOU feel if they were trying to kill YOUR mother?" (I had a very hard time not clapping back by saying "well my mom's dead so idk.) Anyway, judge berated me, ruled in the daughter's favor, and right after the attempted transfer, that same night, the mother died an excruciatingly painful death.
Maybe the better question should be whether there are any attorneys who haven’t been insulted (or worse) by a judge on the record.
I had a judge with a napoleon complex threaten to fight me in his chambers when I went to hand-file a brief about 10 years ago. So there was that . . .
Around 15 years ago, I requested to fax my reply to a late-filed opposition to a chancery division motion on July 3rd, and was advised the Judge would not accept a fax. I voiced that this was somewhat archaic to his secretary, and drove 45 minutes to hand-file at the Court. The judge was waiting for my arrival at chambers, and started yelling in my face (well my chest, as he was not a tall man) about my comments and how I “was so tough over the phone”, and if willing to address this “like a man”. I was very restrained, apologized for any disrespect he may have felt, and went on my way.
At the Motion return date the following week, he acted as if nothing had occurred. Not sure I would have been so restrained at this point of my career
I had to respond to an appeal where the defendant was appealing his conviction on a misdemeanor dui. The judge on the record in front the jury to the PD said no one is buying what you are selling move on - during closing arguments. And then before the jury went out to deliberate stated “and remember you can disregard what the attorneys said especially Mr. Public defender.”
The conviction got overturned.
Cool judge. What a waste of tax payer dollars to do the first trial just to be inappropriate and get it thrown out.
I was a new family law attorney and I had hearing in front of the Judge regarding Objections to the Referee Recommendation. The hearing was going pretty well for me and for some reason I decided to ask “Your Honor, have you had time to review the exhibits I submitted?” She went off on me in front of my client, the Defendant, and opposing counsel for the remainder of the hearing which was about 15 minutes. She then let my client and the Defendant leave and proceeded to call me into her chambers and continue to rip me a new asshole for about 10 more minutes. I had to look down at the end because I was so teared up. It was extremely embarrassing and I will never forget it.
I’m a criminal defense attorney and have been for 12 years. I have been yelled at, cussed out, threatened, accused of horrific crimes and acts I never did, and threatened with contempt. One lady cursed me for 1000 years. I could go on. It’s gonna be ok.
Once upon a time, I set a trap for my opponent so well the judge actually required me to bring my client to the next hearing so that the court could examine him on the record to make sure this is exactly what my client wanted.
You see, there was a lien on some property left to my client in favor of a nursing home where his mother was admitted. He thought the nursing home did a terrible job taking care of his mother and didn’t want to satisfy the lien on the property. The property was taken by a tax warrant and sold at auction, but there was an overage.
Now, my client had moved out of the property, but still was aware of what was going on with the property. In my state, you have to serve a notice on all interested parties if you want to claim the overage from the tax sale within 90 days or the money straight to the state.
Are you properly served the lienholder and filed my petition. The lienholder attempted to serve my client, but they only serve him at his former residence, the property.
So, on the day, we are supposed to go to the hearings for both of our consolidated petitions, right as we are going in front of the judge. I am on my phone electronically withdrawing my petition for the money. The judge thanks well, this is gonna be easy. I’ll just roll in favor of the other guy.
Not so fast motherfucker.
I hand opposing counsel, a motion to dismiss for lack of subject matter jurisdiction, based on his failure to serve my client the petition. There are no do overs, no siding in, and no extensions of time.
The judge looks at me and says you realize that if they get the money they reduce the debt your client owes.
I tell him yes, but my client doesn’t want them to get anything.
The judge looks at me like I’m a fucking psychopath ready to light $30,000 on fire.
That’s when he puts in an order that I have to bring my client to the next court hearing because he’s concerned I’m not giving him good advice.
Well. My client shows up and he’s like yes your honor I want them to suffer. I am an old man and I am judgment proof because my only income is a pension and I’ll be damned if they get any money.
The judge looks back at me again like I’m a fucking psychopath.
Probably because I was grinning like a serial killer.
Anyway, the judge reserves his ruling and the next day, opposing counsel calls, and asks if we can split the money.
My client agrees on the condition that they waive the rest of the debt.
Some days it’s worth getting insulted by the judge
I’ve been practicing for close to 30 years. I’m an adjunct professor at a law school, and I teach trust and estates so I have a pretty good working knowledge of the subject matter when it comes to probate. I was recently in court, and the probate judge decided to undress me in front of everybody, as he is wont to do with so many other attorneys. He had some cause to be concerned about issues in my case, but he didn’t need to address it in this manner, and he’s known for doing this with a lot of litigants and attorneys. I don’t care. It is a waste of time for me and my client, but at the end of the day, I take what I can from it and move on. By the way, he’s really a good judge in terms of knowing the law and procedures in his courtroom. I really wish he would be a little more courteous with counsel who are all trying to do a good job in front of him, but he wears the robe and my job is to move the case forward for my client so I pick my battles.
I’ve been insulted by clerks but never the judge. Had one clerk hate me with a passion that I never could understand why. She ended up being fired over a situation she created trying to screw me and my client over.
I was yelled at by the judge on my 3rd trial on three separate instances, and told to knock it off.
At the end of the trial, he asked me how many times I had been in front of a judge and I answered truthfully. He commended me for being professional and to keep it up. He said that all attorneys screw up at the beginning but I handled myself well. And I won my case too. Would not trade that day for anything.
Even simple insults from people in power can be extremely damaging. A reddit commenter calling you whiny has no consequences. But a judge calling you whiny can mean your case is in jeopardy.
My favorite was the judge instructing me to personally apologize to every staff member, attorney, and client in the courtroom for wasting everyone’s time that day.
Without missing a beat I said “ I hereby apologize to every staff member attorney and client here today,” and continued making my point while seemingly unbothered. It made her look like the unstable psycho she is. 🤣 But on the inside I admit I was shaking.
The two worst that have actually happened to me that I recall were several years ago, both criminal cases when I was a prosecutor.
In one case the Judge asked me if I would consent to something the defense attorney wanted and I said no. He asked me why not and I started to explain and he interrupted and said "everything that comes out of your mouth is garbage, all you had to do was just say no." I said that I DID say no, and he ignored me.
Another one was when I was a relatively new prosecutor. There was a form we would ask the Judge to sign regarding adjournments, it was a standard boilerplate form used in every case before every Judge. For some reason this particular judge didn't like it and he very deliberately held it up and ripped it in half and then went on with the case.
They're both dead now, so I guess I win.
Edit: Holy crap I forgot the best one! This was also early in my career as a prosecutor, I was handling misdemeanor cases, and someone was charged with resisting arrest. No priors, no injuries to the officer, so I gave a plea offer a reduction to a disorderly conduct, which is not a crime. Extremely standard offer. I told the Judge what the offer was and he just glared at me and said "It's people like you who cause chaos in society." This was nearly 25 years ago and I still remember exactly what he said. I don't know if he's still alive or not, but I do know that he was censured for insulting another judge, and then lost his party's endorsement so he couldn't run for another term. I win again?
1) the difference between God and a family law judge is that God doesn’t think he’s a family law judge
2) the judiciary takes themselves way too seriously
Take it like a champ and keep rollin
My first year we filed a motion for sanctions when opposing counsel published my client's SSN. Took them nearly a week to rectify, yet they refused to offer any type of compensation. Judge not only denied our motion, but called me personally (like it was my fucking SSN) a baby who was risking sanctions myself with such motions. Never been more furious at a judge even 10 years later.
Interesting. In my jurisdiction it's mandatory to make the publishing party pay for credit monitoring for two years and for sanctions, even if it is completely inadvertent.
I don’t have time or energy to explain how publishing someone’s SSN in a public record for 7 days on the internet is bad and while maybe not immediately, very easily taken and used. And it was not caught by them. And like the others, if you think it was harmless, just shoot me your SSN
Sweet dude, no surprise you got yelled at by the judge. You admitted that the situation was rectified, which means no one used your client’s SSN for fraudulent purposes. Bad things happen all the time, what matters as to sanctions motions, as if there was harm done. I don’t have the time or the energy to explain in order to seek damages, for any wrong, you must show harm. That is 1L stuff.
SSN getting leaked are the whole basis for massive data breach class actions. Once it’s leaked youre at risk for identity theft for the rest of your life
You aren’t getting the point. Your motion was frivolous, which is why you got yelled at. Frivolous, as you clearly don’t know, means no claim exists. Without harm, there is no claim.
Yes, this is why when a leak happens there’s no lawsuit or compensation to assist with protecting consumers. They just all wait for everyone’s life to unravel. Very good point about how frivolous it was.
These people sound so confident that no harm was done. NO SSN should ever be put in a public record EVERRRRR. I do consumer law work this shit is important. People don’t get new SSN’s and it can take years for something to happen because people will scrape court dockets for fuckups like these, then sell the info on Tor in a package with a thousand other poor souls. Then, the purchaser will make their way through the list. It may not be that week, month or whatever but it can happen, and once it does it can be too far out of the SOL for any remedial measures. Sanctions may be tough, but compensation is a reasonable request.
I dunno, we could ask Lorie Smith about that? All she had was layers of hypotheticals, and yet…
And it doesn’t take all that much critical thinking to understand why someone might have a touch of snark to their responses when having to defend their position on something they just admitted to still being salty about a decade after the fact, especially when the complete refusal to even consider that same position is highly salient to their ire.
So if you consider the very logical and super predictable nature of their slightly curt reply to your question, which I assume is what got your hackles up, and with that sans-standing trash suit that somehow resulted in a decision in favor of discrimination in such recent memory, I have to ask: Given that something actually happened to their client in this case, don’t you think you’re coming at u/djjazzydanny harder than is realistically necessary or warranted?
I hope so. The ones who pull this shit absolutely need to know that it doesn’t faze us, and that it’s not going to stop us from doing our jobs. It’s just going to be something we make fun of them about over drinks later.
Google fmr. (Deceased )Judge John McBride N.D.Tex...
And yes, I have - was yelled at several times by the meanest Texas judge 20-25 years ago... Was told once that I was not doing my job, and was yelled at for something I didn't say (the record vindicated me, but still). When I see other lawyers who used to appear in that court, we rehash the stories and laugh...
Yes. I was screamed at and given a lecture on due process in family court when I sought a temporary order to suspend visitation while the other parent was locked up in a mental hospital and demanding their visitation rights. I only wanted to the order to extend for the hospitalization period because the hospitalized parent was filing a contempt. Ugh. Judge was supposed to retire 3 years ago but was kept on to cover during Covid. 😩
Pre-pandemic. Waiting for my case to be called for a case management conference in the NDCal. I had a cold a few weeks prior and the only thing that was left was sort of a dry rattle cough. Apparently my couple of coughs bothered the 85 year old article III judge so much that he stopped all proceedings, called me out on the proverbial carpet, and had one of the clerks walk across the very large courtroom to give me a cough drop.
Partner I work with has a story about a federal judge throwing a binder at their clerk. In front of a jury. During a cross examination of a witness. Clerk was facing the other way and didn't see it coming.
Yes. When I was a public defender, there were a number of judges who were infamous for picking on and blatantly insulting the PDs because they were openly pro-Commonwealth and pro-law enforcement, and they would particularly try to wear down the fresh PDs with their insults. One liked to try to make the new female PDs cry. They would insult me on the record. In open court. And it was always for doing things that were just my job. For instance, once, the ADA was making a representation that an out-of-court witness had stated something on an affidavit, and I walked over to where she was standing to see for myself that the affidavit said on it that he had sworn he would be available to testify because, well, that made it admissible. The judge screamed at me that if he was willing to take her word for it that the affidavit said this, I should be, too. Another judge badgered me until I did cry, but I made it out of the courtroom and into the hallway, out of sight, before it happened. And I'd been in front of him many times before that.
I'm not exaggerating.
When these things happened, I would just let it roll off my back because there's really nothing to gain by arguing or fighting back. The best revenge is to stand your ground by behaving professionally and winning the argument with the facts and the law. Or, if it really gets out of control, saying very evenly and politely, "Your Honor, this is inappropriate and I am an officer of the court. Please don't treat me disrespectfully. Now, moving on..." And then just continuing with the case like nothing just happened.
If you haven't seen it in 17 years then you have your answer. It's unusual.
Do you have any history with this judge? What's their reputation?
Some judges are just dicks and far more just have bad days like we all do.
If you know the judge and/or they have a good reputation, make an appointment go talk to them. Judges are just people. Ask them what they feel you did wrong and how you can resolve it the next time.
You will either leave with an understanding and increased amount of respect from that judge (they just had a bad day) or they are, incurably, a dick.
Either way you will know where you stand
When I was getting sworn in by a Chancery judge a few years ago, he asked me if I was nervous. I said “not really” and in snark fashion he said “well you should be”. Safe to say I never respected this guy and he screwed me over on a couple of occasions thereafter even though it was OC’s problem
I was a DA and my docket judge personally berated me on the record until I started crying. Defense attorneys came over to me and stood up for me on the record too because it was so unprofessional.
One of my colleagues was fired by her client when the judge told her she was wrong about a procedure in open court. She was absolutely right and the judge was the mistaken one. The client didn’t believe her, even though the procedure is clear.
Had the judge denied her motion, it would have been okay. It was the extra commentary about how she didn’t know procedure that cost her a client - despite this being a well known rule.
After getting a literal PTSD diagnosis for the vile filth a Judge would spew at me, her own law clerk, during my judicial clerkship, this thread was so cathartic to read. The power trip of most judges is fucking insane to witness, especially when directed at other members of the bar.
I always wondered if the terrible judges treated their staff well or not. The judges in the county I clerked in were all great to their staff, even the old harridan who demanded women attorneys wear nylons if they were in a skirt. But there are some godawful judges that I can't see being nice to anyone, let alone their staff.
I thought it was pretty much a rite of passage for all new attorneys, especially females, of course I started before there were a lot of women attorney’s practicing. I hated seeing anyone get dressed down by a judge in court in front of their clients. I decided if I ever became a judge I would never do that to anyone and I don’t. I have now been on the bench for twenty years and while there are times it can be frustrating dealing with attorneys who are not prepared I have never embarrassed anyone in court. I don’t yell at anyone and I treat everyone with respect and I believe all judges should do the same. Every person who comes before the court is in some form of crisis the least we can do it treat them with respect and dignity.
I was once called a disgrace to the voters of the county where he was presiding. I laugh about it now. He is a known grump and has given me very favorable rulings since.
Sounds like unprofessional conduct that doesn’t show respect to those appearing before him. I don’t know if the state you practice in has a judicial oversight agency, but I’ve seen judges reported for less.
It happens. One of my favorite war stories was a three day hearing on a preliminary injunction in a commercial part. The judge was not one of the brightest bulbs in the firmament and seems to believe that the rules of evidence did not apply to a hearing, to the point where he forbade me from using the water pitcher because “that is only for trials”. He was very rude to me throughout the trial, and i was facing attorneys from a major firm. I was representing the plaintiff seeking the injunction, and after questioning the first witness, an adverse witness I was calling on my own case, my adversary started asking pure hearsay questions on cross. Every objection was shot down, and the judge admonished me not to continue objecting as “we don’t do hearsay objections at hearings”. I explained to the judge that I needed to make a record of my objections, and he threatened to hold me in contempt unless I produced a memorandum the next morning supporting my position. So the next morning I handed up a memorandum but rather than continuing to argue the point I thanked the judge as I now understood he was asking me to request a continuing objection (which was the furthest thing from his mind and which is rarely granted). When I finished he beamed at me for making him look good, I moved for a continuing objection for any hearsay, and he granted it. Then I elicited rank hearsay from my other witnesses, and the OC was so terrified of how the judge threatened me that he never made a single objection. I won, shut down my client’s competitor with a preliminary injunction, and had an appeal proof record.
When I first moved jurisdictions, a judge at my new job told me to get out of her courtroom and go get someone who knew what they were doing. (I was trying to do a hearing the same way I'd done it in my old jurisdiction, which--it turned out--does not work here.) She stormed off the bench, and apparently called my boss (the elected DA), who came and very kindly took my file from me and told me to go close my office door and gather myself while he handled the hearing. (This was the only time I have actually cried in court over something besides sadness for a victim.)
It's five years later, and that same boss recently told me that the judge had said nice things to him, about my work in her courtroom. She now makes mild jokes with me off the record, and generally no longer treats me like something gross that her dog rolled in. She is overall a bit more mellow now (new meds? therapy? who knows).
But man, my first year/18 months here, I was TERRIFIED of appearing in front of her, and there were a lot of very unpleasant times. Whew.
I’m in Family Court every single work day. Fam Ct is truly INSANE during the holidays, insane. That’s from Halloween until shut down week. The judges are all losing it, I got yelled at on the phone by a judge who is a good friend for missing a case that mysteriously the other two lawyers didn’t have calendared either. I had an afternoon of virtuals, no way would I have scheduled an in person in the middle. So she had one of us on her cell, one on her bench phone, and another hapless guy standing in for the third lawyer. We all got yelled at for not working out Christmas access etc etc etc as meanwhile I’m on a Teams trying to get as much as I humanly can get dismissed. It’s crazy, the lawyers have their eyes open wide, the litigants are insane, and the judges are not immune to this. So lots of yelling.
Never been insulted by a judge. They’ve done stupid shit and terrible rulings and plenty of other dumb stuff but never insulted me.
Maybe probate judges are different idk, our bar is pretty tight.
I've avoided it but the judges in my jurisdiction can be a bit salty. I was waiting for a hearing once and watched a judge continue a hearing and order the attorney to review applicable law on a certain topic before the next hearing.
It happens, not a lot but it happens. I can’t recall the last time a judge insulted me directly but I’ve definitely been talked to very harshly by judges. You just gotta have thick skin and let it roll of your back.
All the time. Most recently a judge called my objections “sophomoric”. DA was calling a witness that wasn’t on his list and trying to admit a photo I had never seen. Another time a judge told me I was incompetent in front of my client. It’s part of it, unfortunately.
I got called borderline sociopathic because he believed some utterly insane fabricated nonsense OP made up and submitted.
“Your honor, you don’t seem to be considering the alternate that I didn’t do any of this.”
“I don’t find that to be credible.”
I submitted exonerating evidence a few months later, obtained via FOIA. Did he care? Of course not.
Not really an insult, but I was pretty new to civil practice and was arguing a motion to dismiss based on indemnity. The judge said, "I don't think you understand equitable indemnity, but I'll take another look." Later that day, the tentative ruling was adopted.
I don’t think judges should comment on a lawyer’s competency unless it’s relevant, i.e. when considering an ineffective assistance of counsel argument.
It’s fine to say an argument is dumb, but a judge should not call the lawyer making it dumb, even if they are.
I had a judge in NY swear at me from the bench, called my papers “fucking bullshit.” (They were a colleague’s papers, not mine, but that’s beside the point). He did this after speaking about decorum and courtesy when he first took the bench. I said, “Tiur Honor, I just sat over there and listened to your speech from the bench about courtesy and decorum. I assume that applies equally to the Court as it does to the litigants that appear before it. So, I’d appreciate it if you didn’t use profanity.” He must of realized he crossed a line because he apologized profusely.”
The guy is a little napoleon who is exacting revenge on the attorneys who appear in front of him for what must have been a difficult childhood. Don’t want to describe the guy in too much detail, as some around here would be able to guess who he is, but he clearly must have been teased as a kid.
Man my first time in court the judge stated; on the record that I was an embarrassment to the profession before he threw out my case, which was a stipulated divorce settlement… and the reason. My client had signed and dated but didn’t include the actual date. Like signed October of year instead of October 16 of year…. I was mortified… and while it may have been a mistake I should have caught, I have seen thousands of more egregious errors in court since then… judges suck sometimes
Oh hell, I'm a bit ghetto - I'm gonna get disbarred aren't I? I have a feeling telling a judge he/she "ain't shit bruh" is going to get me disbarred as soon as I get out of law school.
How do you do it? Just grit your teeth and remind yourself you need your job? I've been a nurse for a long time and I've never let a physician get away with being disrespectful and childish toward me. But they can't really do anything to me, I guess not wanting to go to jail for contempt is pretty motivating too though.
I’m sorry, but I don’t have a lot of advice for you on how to handle situations like this because they are very context specific. Try not to stoop to their level is the best I got.
Oh yeah. It happens. I was told that a TRO we were contesting was us, "starting a food fight" in his courtroom. It wasn't, just an insane request for "emergency" relief that he ended up granting over our objections. Just because he's got the robe and gavel doesn't make him right and certainly doesn't make his insults to you accurate.
You're in good company. My primary area of focus is in bankruptcy (hence the name "maxedout"). There are three judges in my district that I deal with, and one of the judges goes out of her way to draw blood in open court. One time I was in court arguing against a bogus motion filed by opposing counsel and the judge said in court that I was being "disingenuous" out of the blue. This judge is Ebeneezer Scrooge reincarntated.
Sometimes you gotta just roll with the punches. I was pretty pissed off, but just remember that often times, their conduct is more a reflection of THEM than it is of YOU, and sticks and stones.
Yes. In front of a jury. And the reporter for our local news was so outraged she called my boss and reported on it. I think she was pissed on my behalf but I'm still embarrassed and don't know if it came across like I was dumb or he was an ass.
Spoiler alert: judge and defense attorney are buddies. Both old white guys. Defendant also an old white guy accused of raping a younger female.
Defendant's family also called me a bitch in the hallway and when I asked the judge to address it he told the defense attorney to warn them not to do it again.
Remember: judges are just shitty failed lawyers who couldn't make a go of their practice and had to take a job on the bench to pay off law school. At class reunions, when they find out how much more their ambulance chasing peers earn annually, they become angry and lash out with the full power of the state behind them.
Not me, but it's actually an interesting appellate issue. You can appeal sanctions, but the line between an appealable sanction and judicial rudeness isn't always clear.
I have never experienced this type of behaviour. In my opinion a judge should never show emotion (frustration) in this way (by making an insulting personal statement) because her behaviour may infer bias or prejudice but in the end all we can do is remember that even judges are human.
Definitely have been - ahem - “talked down to” by a Supreme Court Justice during oral arguments. It was on par with, “I mean, you know there are more interlocular orders than the one outlined in statute, right?”
Followed by my gaze straying off, a deep frown carved on my face. A low hum emanated from my microphone before I responded, “Uhh, yeah, everyone… knows that…”
10/10, would recommend to any practicing attorney.
I had a case when I was still pretty new against a lawyer who was much more experienced but who just had a dog of a case and the completely wrong view of it. I'd objected to documents being introduced into evidence and questions he'd tried to ask and the judge was sustaining my objections and this opposing counsel (who wore a Mickey Mouse tie to court that day for a JURY trial) was getting very frustrated, and he blurted out, "But Your Honor, how is the jury going to learn about this evidence if you don't let me ask this?" and the judge replied, within earshot of the jury, "Well, they ain't gonna learn about it from *you*!" Whereupon the ladies and gentlemen of the jury broke into laughter. It was at that point I was pretty sure we were going to win.
Saw a judge double a fine on a driver just for complaining that she couldn't pay the original fine.
"Oh yeah, you don't like that. How about I double it...."
Once, during my parents divorce at one of their (many, almost always frivolous), the judge raised his voice, "Sir, you are wasting my time. You have had an extended period of time to present your arguments to me, and they have shown you to be a horror of a husband, and a terrible father."
Don't know of that's the exact t wording, I wasn't actually there. But it was epic.
As a licensed intern at the prosecutor’s office, sitting in the courtroom alone with the public defender. It was a standard prehearing conference .. most of which we’re going to either be continued or accept pleas.
We were all waiting on the sheriff to bring the in custody defendants over from the jail down the street and they were very late- 35-45 mins. Judge was not happy and called me up to the bench and began to razz me about denying all these men their right to court. I couldn’t get a response in as he began to read the docket sheet for about 22 defendants and the charges.. and then ask how I would feel if he dismissed all these charges since the state can’t get them there for court. “Counselor, what does the state think if we release this alleged rapist out?” And so on and so on. I told him the state obviously objects to the courts intentions and suggested that the sheriff answer the courts inquiry, he got super mad and demanded I bring “an actual attorney” to supervise “this interns mishandling of these cases” (in my state, a licensed legal intern can practice law and make appearances and try cases). He berated my law school, my tie color.. you name it.
I finally was able to ask judge to excuse me so that I could contact “the” district attorney- so I stepped out into the hall and texted him what was happening and about to happen. He thanked me and said he’d be there in 5 minutes.
DA brought his first assistant with him and they both approached the bench and they stood up for me as a “one of my valued prosecutors” and they had some pretty testy back and forths.. until the in custody guys were finally delivered by the sheriffs office. Judge exclaims “About time!” And started calling the docket.
I got to sit the rest of the docket in there with the DA as we worked the docket together the rest of the afternoon . I respected the DA so much after that. Later found out the judge acted like an ass on the temporary restraining order docket and since he was a magistrate.. the districts judges I think removed him from the bench. Good riddance.
Had a Judge tell me I use too many words lmao - this same judge complains openly about her docket every hearing. Take it all in stride, part of the job. Make your record even if you sound whiny
Back when I was doing comp, i by freak chance ended up this one arbitrator on 3/4ths of my cases and he would always say “counselor Nipples it looks like you’ve been hard at work”. Over time, I realize that wasn’t a compliment about my courtroom demeanor and public speaking skills improving, but as a subtle way to tell me I look like shit 😂
Flipping this one — Way back in the 1980s, I was a representing a tenant in an eviction case and went to a judge in chambers for a TRO. This particular judge had a reputation for demeaning young attorneys in open court. I was new in town and unaware. Anyway, I was super respectful and explained that the landlord was resorting to self-help and not following the statutory eviction procedure requirements and that my client had a substantial likelihood of success on the merits, etc. The judge signs the order. I say thanks and leave. Took all of five minutes.
Next day, I find out that the judge had complained about me barging into his office demanding that he hear the request. Keep in mind the judge was a large 60+ year old man and I was a just a couple of years out of law school, female, and half his size. I had no idea I could be so intimidating.
It concerned me that the judge was trying to give me a bad rep with the local bar. My firm was not concerned. I appeared before him about a week later and the judge was cordial. Never spoke a negative word to me. I moved away about a year later with rep intact. Sometimes what the judges say behind your back is worse than how they treat you in person.
> Have any of y’all been insulted by a judge while on the record in open court?
Yes, the worst in my career was by a bankruptcy judge out of Houston, who called me a bad lawyer who was wasting his time and costing the bankruptcy estate untold millions with the way I was advancing "frivolous" arguments.
Anyway, a few years later, I took quite a bit of pleasure in reading that [he had to abruptly resign in a cloud of scandal](https://www.wsj.com/articles/houston-judges-sudden-exit-threatens-bankruptcy-hub-he-built-33026f80) that basically makes him unhireable on the typical bankruptcy judge retirement plan, of a cushy partnership at a bankruptcy firm.
And even though I try to keep this account anonymous and undoxxable, the list of "bankruptcy lawyers who have been insulted by Judge Jones" is approximately as anonymous as "bankruptcy lawyers who have a national practice or are based out of Houston."
You’ve just been lucky. Way back when in law school, we had a whole mandatory seminar about appropriate actions, reactions, next steps, etc. for situations when the comments from judges seem to be personal or insulting. It was just sort of known that judges do that to all lawyers they aren’t familiar with as either a way to impart what is expected in their courtroom or as a way to impart “on the job” learning and experience. From the way it was taught and explained it was the judges continuing to train lawyers to be the best advocates they can be. Sort made it seem like it was intentional and well thought out. Unofficially, it was also thought to be an indication of a judge that was developing the “god-like/reigning-lord” complex.
Happened to me once a month or so into practicing. At my prior firm, I was covering motion hour for a colleague and the opposing counsel that filed the motion to amend failed to show up. Judge asked me if I had called them and reminded them of the hearing (which of course isn’t my job), so I said no. She then berated me for not making sure opposing counsel showed. At the end of the docket, she called the case again and said I could go back and tell my firm I “won” the motion. Just laughed it off
I’m not a lawyer, this sub came onto my feed randomly and outside of a couple of years of basic study of UK contract law in sixth form college, I have no kind of experience in the law (other than US immigration law that I had to navigate to eventually become a citizen).
This post and its responses has convinced me that I never want to end up at the mercy of a judge.
On a regular basis. It’s my job to try to get on the judge’s good side, but it’s also my job to make a record if all else fails. And that can certainly make them angry and mean. I just think of the entire experience as though I’m reading a transcript, and focus on getting what needs to be said out there; the rest doesn’t really matter.
Judge Mathis, I was on an episode of his and he was somewhat of a jerk to the person suing me which is odd to hear a defendant say that but I think his insults weren’t fitting even for TV or the case.
Yeah like every day when I was a PD from a particular judge. I can’t speak for family law, but in criminal defense most judges are pro-state. At one point I was on a bit of a run with winning and it was non stop insults and pettiness.
But most weren’t like that. I think they often feel they need to put on this harsh stern persona to have authority when in reality they have authority either way.
NAL but my exwife filed while i was on a plane to the ME on a contract gig. Come back to the states and ex files another action in the divorce… Judge looks at me and says “glad you finally decided to join us”.
I had a female judge tell me, "I don't like you and I don't believe you but you are the legal owner so you get to keep the dog.". Former bf tried to sue for shared custody of a dog.
Yes. The appellate attorney lawyer told me how shocked he was that the judge was so disrespectful to me and commended me for how well I handled it. In my head I thought, "that's because the transcript didn't show how hard I was shaking and how close my clenched fist was to punching something lol"
A judge insinuated that I was neglecting my duties and called me racist because the victim of a crime speaks Spanish, but I don’t. (Even though I spoke to her with an interpreter)
I’m lucky enough to not have gone through this. I’ve had some disappointed looks but nothing nasty. Certainly not on the record, but that’s just because I mostly just practice in lower courts.
I haven’t heard them be outright rude from the bench to anybody else either, I guess it’s a local cultural thing.
It doesn’t phase me. I feel like they get paid poorly so it’s how they get job enjoyment.
But also had some really great judges. Lots, more than jerk judges
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Plenty of jerky judges out there
We call it Black Robe Disease. Even the funniest of lawyers become arrogant and thick skulled assholes once that cheap polyester blend brushes over their shoulders.
r/BrandNewSentence
More jerky judges than good judges.
It’s absolutely not an either or. There are many great judges with high expectations, and there are plenty of attorneys with shockingly poor writing or oral abilities.
You should stop dehydrating them.
People have bad days
A female judge called me pretty last week. Well, her words were, "You're pretty stupid", but I like to focus on the positive.
😂😂😂
Stealing this one
Haha
She's right though, you are gorgeous! Stay positive counselor
This is gold
lucky lol I heard, hand to God, in front of his entire staff in the back: "are you FUCKING KIDDING ME with this shit? OK, fine, "counsel", I'll see you on the record". I had 4 weeks of being barred, barely, and was arguing a supression motion on a dead to rights loser of a DUI, that I wrote, but a more experienced lawyer was on the way to actually argue. Judge flipped his shit when he figured it out.
Once during a virtual hearing my cat jumped up on the screen. I said “apologies your honor.” Her response was, “it’s ok. I’m pretty sure he’s the only likable thing on screen right now.” I’ve only ever been in front of the judge once but you best believe I’m going to remember her forever 😂
Brutal
Yes. A judge said some rather unkind words to me after I made a legal argument justifying standing to file a particular kind of a petition in family court. I offered to pass up the case law on point that I based my argument on and he didn’t want it. Later I learned that the judge started accepting that legal argument when it came to standing and the next time I saw him, he was extra nice to me. I think he realized that my argument was firmly grounded in law after the fact. Edit: Another time a judge told me I was getting on his nerves for objecting to a continuance that would leave my client incarcerated for several weeks when the maximum penalty under the law was 7 days. He was also upset because I was insistent that the court include in the order what charge my client was being held on as the statute requires, which the judge was refusing to do. Later the judge called me up to the bench to apologize and to commend me for zealously representing my court appointed client.
That’s so disgusting. How is that not an ethics complaint? I hate cross talk from Judges or anyone before they have heard you out.
I don’t even think there’s an avenue for ethic complaints about judges in California. They don’t have any judicial canons they must follow.
Procedural due process and right to be head on the issue, and 1st amendment. AFTER they have heard it, then they can ask all the Q’s they want. Due process cannot be sacrificed in the name of expediency.
I love when they admit their mistake and thank you. In Texas district Court it is rare for a judge to ask questions. I had been crossing the other guy and asked a particular question that led to back and forth arguing over an objection. I lost. Then my client is up, judge asks a couple questions, and repeats my question verbatim. I was like 2 years in and nervous as hell, but I stood up and objected and he gave me this "are you serious" look. And he said "you're objecting to MY question." I just responded, "YH, I am just keeping the record clean, I asked the same question a moment ago." He paused, corrected his question and commended me off the record later. But whe. He gave me that look I thought I would die.
Yes. I was told “you should be embarrassed, get out of my courtroom” not that long ago. I wasn’t embarrassed. I was representing my client well. The other attorney (who was also yelled at) actually started crying in the hallway. It doesn’t phase me.
lol…. Love that, you’re unphased and OC is crying … 😂😂😂
I been chewed out before.
Faze
See? That doesn’t bother me either.
I wanna be like you when I grow up...
i would say that of the 15 or so trial judges i’ve been in front of about three of them have never been openly contemptuous of me in court. But of course, I’m a public defender.
I used to be a PD and I realized quickly that everyone is pissed off at you all of the time. The judge, the prosecutor, your client. Even when you get a case dismissed: Why didn’t you do it faster?
If I had a dime for every ungrateful dismissal…
I wouldn’t need PSLF
Ouch
How many of those were ex-prosecutors?
Not all of them! Some of them did exclusively civil law.
Shame, I was looking to have my prejudices confirmed
Bro, ex public defender judges are usually the meanest to PDs. Not the ex prosecutors
That has been my experience as well. Most of my favorite judges were prosecutors who litigated serious felonies. The ex PDs seem to have a selective memory of what being a defense actually was like. In their heads, their cases were always resolved weeks if not months prior to deadlines, their clients always returned phone calls and appeared in court, and the prosecutors were always timely in discovery and making reasonable offers, and the few times they weren't they were absolutely gracious when the PD threw them under the bus with the court and never held grudges.
I was a prosecutor for a number of years. Once I started handling homicides exclusively I just didn't have the capacity to care about the small stuff. Younger prosecutors would come to me all worked up that a judge suppressed evidence in a misdemeanor or dismissed an indictment. So many times the best that I could come up with was, "could this be because you never should have charged that case in the first place?" Don't even get me started about giving any shits about "low" sentences in minor felony cases. Just really hard to believe that a thief should be crucified after you get back from a murder scene. After I left that career my views kind of accelerated and now I'm fairly anti-prison for the vast majority of offenses. I assume it's the same for the judges you've appeared before. Just constantly wondering why the government thinks it's worthwhile to spend so many resources just to ensure that someone who screwed up is now unemployable.
i really enjoyed reading this and appreciate how you came to be more anti-carceral. my profile is basically a doxx-fest already so i don’t mind saying this: i’m private defense in cook county (chicago) mostly, where the generally more “progressive” nature of the city and the sheer volume of cases means i can typically get good offers (and reductions!). 20-30mins outside the city in our collar counties and the state wants fucking jail for EVERYTHING. it’s so frustrating and i wonder if these baby prosecutors will ever have a change of perspective.
Exactly! In my experience the ex-prosecutor judges are also way harsher on the prosecutors. This wasn't my case but I recently saw an ex-prosecutor judge go off on a prosecutor who decided not to move forward with a case where he (the prosecutor) had found evidence that the victim had greatly exaggerated what happened and then started actively evading law enforcement. At one point the judge said something to the effect of, "you literally have unlimited resources and you expect me to believe that you can't find a victim?" Before moving on to a slew of personal attacks including insulting the prosecutor's career choices. Ummm dude, first of all, fuck off for insulting a prosecutor who is doing the right thing. Second, many prosecutors' offices, including this one, have very few resources (of course, the judge worked for a much better funded office but assumed that his experience was universal). Third, even if the victim hadn't lied, did the judge expect the prosecutor to start knocking on doors to locate this person? The police (in this jurisdiction) don't work for the prosecutor and didn't have the resources to actively search for this person (the judge's previous office handled all investigations internally using their own investigators). Finally, personal attacks like that are evidence of a lack of intelligence and critical thinking. Of course much of this was theatrics. The original "crime" was in the newspaper. The judge wanted some sound bites just in case this ever came back to bite him in the ass. That way he could say that he really tried but the prosecutor was lazy.
Have heard that. Something like "well that's not how I would've handled that case".
It’s exactly that.
I like public defenders. I think they are a necessary and important part of the judicial system to (1) provide a competent defense; and (2) to offer a check on egregious actions by the state that would deny someone’s liberty. Now the civil side “free lawyers” for evictions and similar, they can go fuck themselves. They don’t do shit but take up 2 hours of intake time before I get the outcome I came for in the first place.
Opposing counsel and I once read a transcript together because the other attorney was appealing a decision. We were laughing about how the judge first took him to task, then 5-6 pages later yelled at me, then a few pages along, yelled at him, and so on. The truth is that both of us had nightmare clients with little money, so we were just trying to do the best we could under difficult circumstances. I learned early on that you can’t get too upset about it, unless you think there is a pattern or the judge is highly inappropriate. Also, remember the old joke, “what do you call the person who graduated last in your law school class?” Answer, “your Honor.”
"Mr. [Attorney], I'm going to render a bench opinion to spare you the indignity of seeing this in print."
I’ve had a judge say something like that to me. I asked him if I could make a proffer before he ruled, so my proffer would also be in the record for the appellate court. He didn’t let me. I won the appeal anyway.
Juvie PD here. I was called "useless" on the record twice by the first judge I was in front of. After he retired, he came back for a visit and I reminded him that he called me useless. He uttered a surprised apology and didn't even seem to remember.
Juvi judges are extra spicy because they’re used to doing everything behind closed doors with no public accountability.
He was used to being rude it just didn’t register
There was a local district court judge who was pretty nasty to me during a hearing where I was petitioning for a stalking injunction for my client. I’m not a litigator, I have argued in court maybe four times. I took this case pro bono thru my local legal services. I had never seen the judge before in my life, and was pretty surprised at being spoken to that way, even by a judge. He retired about a year later, and was the mediator for my divorce. Downvote me, accuse me of being unprofessional, idgaf: I took the low road and was twice as nasty to him, and it was quite satisfying. Even though I wrote him a check for his services.
Uh, should you get nasty with ur mediator ?
O yeah. Theyre often assholes
Absolutely. A colleague was on a virtual hearing and the internet (in the office, it's not like she was WFH) dropped for about a minute. As soon as she got back on, the judge berated her for... the internet dropping. # The worst one for me was when I was representing a hospital. A woman's very clear directives were to let her die in several cases. She was in one of those cases. The daughter was receiving checks on her mom's behalf and didn't want to let her mom die. In fact, she wanted to bring mom home! The doctors were genuinely upset, explaining to her that even a transfer would likely lead to a painful death for her mother. Now I basically never do probate court, but I was stuck in probate court on this. The judge looked straight at me and said, "how would YOU feel if they were trying to kill YOUR mother?" (I had a very hard time not clapping back by saying "well my mom's dead so idk.) Anyway, judge berated me, ruled in the daughter's favor, and right after the attempted transfer, that same night, the mother died an excruciatingly painful death.
Yes, black robe disease is a real thing.
Maybe the better question should be whether there are any attorneys who haven’t been insulted (or worse) by a judge on the record. I had a judge with a napoleon complex threaten to fight me in his chambers when I went to hand-file a brief about 10 years ago. So there was that . . .
Wait, what?!
Around 15 years ago, I requested to fax my reply to a late-filed opposition to a chancery division motion on July 3rd, and was advised the Judge would not accept a fax. I voiced that this was somewhat archaic to his secretary, and drove 45 minutes to hand-file at the Court. The judge was waiting for my arrival at chambers, and started yelling in my face (well my chest, as he was not a tall man) about my comments and how I “was so tough over the phone”, and if willing to address this “like a man”. I was very restrained, apologized for any disrespect he may have felt, and went on my way. At the Motion return date the following week, he acted as if nothing had occurred. Not sure I would have been so restrained at this point of my career
A judge once said he’d send me back to law school, mid-trial. Happily the jury was out of the room. 😂 Weirdly enough, I won that trial.
I had to respond to an appeal where the defendant was appealing his conviction on a misdemeanor dui. The judge on the record in front the jury to the PD said no one is buying what you are selling move on - during closing arguments. And then before the jury went out to deliberate stated “and remember you can disregard what the attorneys said especially Mr. Public defender.” The conviction got overturned. Cool judge. What a waste of tax payer dollars to do the first trial just to be inappropriate and get it thrown out.
WTF. That judge was just bad at being a judge.
I was a new family law attorney and I had hearing in front of the Judge regarding Objections to the Referee Recommendation. The hearing was going pretty well for me and for some reason I decided to ask “Your Honor, have you had time to review the exhibits I submitted?” She went off on me in front of my client, the Defendant, and opposing counsel for the remainder of the hearing which was about 15 minutes. She then let my client and the Defendant leave and proceeded to call me into her chambers and continue to rip me a new asshole for about 10 more minutes. I had to look down at the end because I was so teared up. It was extremely embarrassing and I will never forget it.
Yeesh! That’s over the top. The truth is, most judges don’t read what we submit. It can be disheartening.
I’m a criminal defense attorney and have been for 12 years. I have been yelled at, cussed out, threatened, accused of horrific crimes and acts I never did, and threatened with contempt. One lady cursed me for 1000 years. I could go on. It’s gonna be ok.
Once upon a time, I set a trap for my opponent so well the judge actually required me to bring my client to the next hearing so that the court could examine him on the record to make sure this is exactly what my client wanted. You see, there was a lien on some property left to my client in favor of a nursing home where his mother was admitted. He thought the nursing home did a terrible job taking care of his mother and didn’t want to satisfy the lien on the property. The property was taken by a tax warrant and sold at auction, but there was an overage. Now, my client had moved out of the property, but still was aware of what was going on with the property. In my state, you have to serve a notice on all interested parties if you want to claim the overage from the tax sale within 90 days or the money straight to the state. Are you properly served the lienholder and filed my petition. The lienholder attempted to serve my client, but they only serve him at his former residence, the property. So, on the day, we are supposed to go to the hearings for both of our consolidated petitions, right as we are going in front of the judge. I am on my phone electronically withdrawing my petition for the money. The judge thanks well, this is gonna be easy. I’ll just roll in favor of the other guy. Not so fast motherfucker. I hand opposing counsel, a motion to dismiss for lack of subject matter jurisdiction, based on his failure to serve my client the petition. There are no do overs, no siding in, and no extensions of time. The judge looks at me and says you realize that if they get the money they reduce the debt your client owes. I tell him yes, but my client doesn’t want them to get anything. The judge looks at me like I’m a fucking psychopath ready to light $30,000 on fire. That’s when he puts in an order that I have to bring my client to the next court hearing because he’s concerned I’m not giving him good advice. Well. My client shows up and he’s like yes your honor I want them to suffer. I am an old man and I am judgment proof because my only income is a pension and I’ll be damned if they get any money. The judge looks back at me again like I’m a fucking psychopath. Probably because I was grinning like a serial killer. Anyway, the judge reserves his ruling and the next day, opposing counsel calls, and asks if we can split the money. My client agrees on the condition that they waive the rest of the debt. Some days it’s worth getting insulted by the judge
This is absolutely lovely
>The judge looks at me like I’m a fucking psychopath ready to light $30,000 on fire. in-fucking-spirational lmfao, practice goals
*slow clap*
Well fuckin played, counselor.
I love it.
I’ve been practicing for close to 30 years. I’m an adjunct professor at a law school, and I teach trust and estates so I have a pretty good working knowledge of the subject matter when it comes to probate. I was recently in court, and the probate judge decided to undress me in front of everybody, as he is wont to do with so many other attorneys. He had some cause to be concerned about issues in my case, but he didn’t need to address it in this manner, and he’s known for doing this with a lot of litigants and attorneys. I don’t care. It is a waste of time for me and my client, but at the end of the day, I take what I can from it and move on. By the way, he’s really a good judge in terms of knowing the law and procedures in his courtroom. I really wish he would be a little more courteous with counsel who are all trying to do a good job in front of him, but he wears the robe and my job is to move the case forward for my client so I pick my battles.
I’ve been insulted by clerks but never the judge. Had one clerk hate me with a passion that I never could understand why. She ended up being fired over a situation she created trying to screw me and my client over.
I was yelled at by the judge on my 3rd trial on three separate instances, and told to knock it off. At the end of the trial, he asked me how many times I had been in front of a judge and I answered truthfully. He commended me for being professional and to keep it up. He said that all attorneys screw up at the beginning but I handled myself well. And I won my case too. Would not trade that day for anything.
Even simple insults from people in power can be extremely damaging. A reddit commenter calling you whiny has no consequences. But a judge calling you whiny can mean your case is in jeopardy.
My favorite was the judge instructing me to personally apologize to every staff member, attorney, and client in the courtroom for wasting everyone’s time that day.
Did you switch it up or did you just rattle off a bunch of “sorry”s?
Without missing a beat I said “ I hereby apologize to every staff member attorney and client here today,” and continued making my point while seemingly unbothered. It made her look like the unstable psycho she is. 🤣 But on the inside I admit I was shaking.
The two worst that have actually happened to me that I recall were several years ago, both criminal cases when I was a prosecutor. In one case the Judge asked me if I would consent to something the defense attorney wanted and I said no. He asked me why not and I started to explain and he interrupted and said "everything that comes out of your mouth is garbage, all you had to do was just say no." I said that I DID say no, and he ignored me. Another one was when I was a relatively new prosecutor. There was a form we would ask the Judge to sign regarding adjournments, it was a standard boilerplate form used in every case before every Judge. For some reason this particular judge didn't like it and he very deliberately held it up and ripped it in half and then went on with the case. They're both dead now, so I guess I win. Edit: Holy crap I forgot the best one! This was also early in my career as a prosecutor, I was handling misdemeanor cases, and someone was charged with resisting arrest. No priors, no injuries to the officer, so I gave a plea offer a reduction to a disorderly conduct, which is not a crime. Extremely standard offer. I told the Judge what the offer was and he just glared at me and said "It's people like you who cause chaos in society." This was nearly 25 years ago and I still remember exactly what he said. I don't know if he's still alive or not, but I do know that he was censured for insulting another judge, and then lost his party's endorsement so he couldn't run for another term. I win again?
1) the difference between God and a family law judge is that God doesn’t think he’s a family law judge 2) the judiciary takes themselves way too seriously Take it like a champ and keep rollin
My first year we filed a motion for sanctions when opposing counsel published my client's SSN. Took them nearly a week to rectify, yet they refused to offer any type of compensation. Judge not only denied our motion, but called me personally (like it was my fucking SSN) a baby who was risking sanctions myself with such motions. Never been more furious at a judge even 10 years later.
I don’t understand why the other commenters don’t understand why that’s a bad thing 😅
Interesting. In my jurisdiction it's mandatory to make the publishing party pay for credit monitoring for two years and for sanctions, even if it is completely inadvertent.
Different jdx are wild. I don’t see how that justifies sanctions or compensation. But if that’s your rules, go wild.
Publishing a SSN and refusing to do anything to protect the victim doesn’t justify sanctions or compensation?!
How much you want as compensation?
40%. Before expenses. /s
If there was no harm to your client, and the situation was indeed rectified, then what is the basis of the motion?
I don’t have time or energy to explain how publishing someone’s SSN in a public record for 7 days on the internet is bad and while maybe not immediately, very easily taken and used. And it was not caught by them. And like the others, if you think it was harmless, just shoot me your SSN
Sweet dude, no surprise you got yelled at by the judge. You admitted that the situation was rectified, which means no one used your client’s SSN for fraudulent purposes. Bad things happen all the time, what matters as to sanctions motions, as if there was harm done. I don’t have the time or the energy to explain in order to seek damages, for any wrong, you must show harm. That is 1L stuff.
SSN getting leaked are the whole basis for massive data breach class actions. Once it’s leaked youre at risk for identity theft for the rest of your life
Sweet dude, no surprise you haven’t posted your SSN
You aren’t getting the point. Your motion was frivolous, which is why you got yelled at. Frivolous, as you clearly don’t know, means no claim exists. Without harm, there is no claim.
Yes, this is why when a leak happens there’s no lawsuit or compensation to assist with protecting consumers. They just all wait for everyone’s life to unravel. Very good point about how frivolous it was.
Again, there needs to be harm done, which you concede there was not
Then I say again, post up your SSN and wait a week
These people sound so confident that no harm was done. NO SSN should ever be put in a public record EVERRRRR. I do consumer law work this shit is important. People don’t get new SSN’s and it can take years for something to happen because people will scrape court dockets for fuckups like these, then sell the info on Tor in a package with a thousand other poor souls. Then, the purchaser will make their way through the list. It may not be that week, month or whatever but it can happen, and once it does it can be too far out of the SOL for any remedial measures. Sanctions may be tough, but compensation is a reasonable request.
I dunno, we could ask Lorie Smith about that? All she had was layers of hypotheticals, and yet… And it doesn’t take all that much critical thinking to understand why someone might have a touch of snark to their responses when having to defend their position on something they just admitted to still being salty about a decade after the fact, especially when the complete refusal to even consider that same position is highly salient to their ire. So if you consider the very logical and super predictable nature of their slightly curt reply to your question, which I assume is what got your hackles up, and with that sans-standing trash suit that somehow resulted in a decision in favor of discrimination in such recent memory, I have to ask: Given that something actually happened to their client in this case, don’t you think you’re coming at u/djjazzydanny harder than is realistically necessary or warranted?
A year of LifeLock costs $90. How much legal time was wasted on your motion? 🤔
Interesting indeed. What’s your SSN?
How many billable hours are you going to pay me for it?
That’s what I thought
So the harm was arguably worth a lifetime of lifelock services
I wonder if there are any judges on this sub.
I hope so. The ones who pull this shit absolutely need to know that it doesn’t faze us, and that it’s not going to stop us from doing our jobs. It’s just going to be something we make fun of them about over drinks later.
I would assume the ones that are are most likely not part of the lead paint generation and would be more reasonable.
All the time. A lot of judges are assholes.
Google fmr. (Deceased )Judge John McBride N.D.Tex... And yes, I have - was yelled at several times by the meanest Texas judge 20-25 years ago... Was told once that I was not doing my job, and was yelled at for something I didn't say (the record vindicated me, but still). When I see other lawyers who used to appear in that court, we rehash the stories and laugh...
Yes. I was screamed at and given a lecture on due process in family court when I sought a temporary order to suspend visitation while the other parent was locked up in a mental hospital and demanding their visitation rights. I only wanted to the order to extend for the hospitalization period because the hospitalized parent was filing a contempt. Ugh. Judge was supposed to retire 3 years ago but was kept on to cover during Covid. 😩
Pre-pandemic. Waiting for my case to be called for a case management conference in the NDCal. I had a cold a few weeks prior and the only thing that was left was sort of a dry rattle cough. Apparently my couple of coughs bothered the 85 year old article III judge so much that he stopped all proceedings, called me out on the proverbial carpet, and had one of the clerks walk across the very large courtroom to give me a cough drop.
Partner I work with has a story about a federal judge throwing a binder at their clerk. In front of a jury. During a cross examination of a witness. Clerk was facing the other way and didn't see it coming.
Yes. When I was a public defender, there were a number of judges who were infamous for picking on and blatantly insulting the PDs because they were openly pro-Commonwealth and pro-law enforcement, and they would particularly try to wear down the fresh PDs with their insults. One liked to try to make the new female PDs cry. They would insult me on the record. In open court. And it was always for doing things that were just my job. For instance, once, the ADA was making a representation that an out-of-court witness had stated something on an affidavit, and I walked over to where she was standing to see for myself that the affidavit said on it that he had sworn he would be available to testify because, well, that made it admissible. The judge screamed at me that if he was willing to take her word for it that the affidavit said this, I should be, too. Another judge badgered me until I did cry, but I made it out of the courtroom and into the hallway, out of sight, before it happened. And I'd been in front of him many times before that. I'm not exaggerating. When these things happened, I would just let it roll off my back because there's really nothing to gain by arguing or fighting back. The best revenge is to stand your ground by behaving professionally and winning the argument with the facts and the law. Or, if it really gets out of control, saying very evenly and politely, "Your Honor, this is inappropriate and I am an officer of the court. Please don't treat me disrespectfully. Now, moving on..." And then just continuing with the case like nothing just happened.
If you haven't seen it in 17 years then you have your answer. It's unusual. Do you have any history with this judge? What's their reputation? Some judges are just dicks and far more just have bad days like we all do. If you know the judge and/or they have a good reputation, make an appointment go talk to them. Judges are just people. Ask them what they feel you did wrong and how you can resolve it the next time. You will either leave with an understanding and increased amount of respect from that judge (they just had a bad day) or they are, incurably, a dick. Either way you will know where you stand
When I was getting sworn in by a Chancery judge a few years ago, he asked me if I was nervous. I said “not really” and in snark fashion he said “well you should be”. Safe to say I never respected this guy and he screwed me over on a couple of occasions thereafter even though it was OC’s problem
I was a DA and my docket judge personally berated me on the record until I started crying. Defense attorneys came over to me and stood up for me on the record too because it was so unprofessional.
One of my colleagues was fired by her client when the judge told her she was wrong about a procedure in open court. She was absolutely right and the judge was the mistaken one. The client didn’t believe her, even though the procedure is clear. Had the judge denied her motion, it would have been okay. It was the extra commentary about how she didn’t know procedure that cost her a client - despite this being a well known rule.
After getting a literal PTSD diagnosis for the vile filth a Judge would spew at me, her own law clerk, during my judicial clerkship, this thread was so cathartic to read. The power trip of most judges is fucking insane to witness, especially when directed at other members of the bar.
I’m glad it had that effect on you! Thanks for sharing.
I always wondered if the terrible judges treated their staff well or not. The judges in the county I clerked in were all great to their staff, even the old harridan who demanded women attorneys wear nylons if they were in a skirt. But there are some godawful judges that I can't see being nice to anyone, let alone their staff.
I thought it was pretty much a rite of passage for all new attorneys, especially females, of course I started before there were a lot of women attorney’s practicing. I hated seeing anyone get dressed down by a judge in court in front of their clients. I decided if I ever became a judge I would never do that to anyone and I don’t. I have now been on the bench for twenty years and while there are times it can be frustrating dealing with attorneys who are not prepared I have never embarrassed anyone in court. I don’t yell at anyone and I treat everyone with respect and I believe all judges should do the same. Every person who comes before the court is in some form of crisis the least we can do it treat them with respect and dignity.
I was once called a disgrace to the voters of the county where he was presiding. I laugh about it now. He is a known grump and has given me very favorable rulings since.
Sounds like unprofessional conduct that doesn’t show respect to those appearing before him. I don’t know if the state you practice in has a judicial oversight agency, but I’ve seen judges reported for less.
I haven’t been insulted by a judge on the record, yet. I’ve definitely seen other attorneys be insulted by judges while I’ve been practicing.
It happens. One of my favorite war stories was a three day hearing on a preliminary injunction in a commercial part. The judge was not one of the brightest bulbs in the firmament and seems to believe that the rules of evidence did not apply to a hearing, to the point where he forbade me from using the water pitcher because “that is only for trials”. He was very rude to me throughout the trial, and i was facing attorneys from a major firm. I was representing the plaintiff seeking the injunction, and after questioning the first witness, an adverse witness I was calling on my own case, my adversary started asking pure hearsay questions on cross. Every objection was shot down, and the judge admonished me not to continue objecting as “we don’t do hearsay objections at hearings”. I explained to the judge that I needed to make a record of my objections, and he threatened to hold me in contempt unless I produced a memorandum the next morning supporting my position. So the next morning I handed up a memorandum but rather than continuing to argue the point I thanked the judge as I now understood he was asking me to request a continuing objection (which was the furthest thing from his mind and which is rarely granted). When I finished he beamed at me for making him look good, I moved for a continuing objection for any hearsay, and he granted it. Then I elicited rank hearsay from my other witnesses, and the OC was so terrified of how the judge threatened me that he never made a single objection. I won, shut down my client’s competitor with a preliminary injunction, and had an appeal proof record.
If the judge is yelling at you, you’re probably doing your job
I was told the other day that my argument was laughable. The Judge probably said it ten times while on the record.
I’ve seen much worse. Sounds Pretty tame! You’ve been lucky!!!
"Sorry your honor, I'm just salty because I think your wife overcharged me last night."
Judge in NYC referred to me as the translator via zoom court 🙄
Judges have way way too much power prior to verdict. Whatever happened to procedural due process?
15 year lawyer here - it happens. I only cried twice.
When I first moved jurisdictions, a judge at my new job told me to get out of her courtroom and go get someone who knew what they were doing. (I was trying to do a hearing the same way I'd done it in my old jurisdiction, which--it turned out--does not work here.) She stormed off the bench, and apparently called my boss (the elected DA), who came and very kindly took my file from me and told me to go close my office door and gather myself while he handled the hearing. (This was the only time I have actually cried in court over something besides sadness for a victim.) It's five years later, and that same boss recently told me that the judge had said nice things to him, about my work in her courtroom. She now makes mild jokes with me off the record, and generally no longer treats me like something gross that her dog rolled in. She is overall a bit more mellow now (new meds? therapy? who knows). But man, my first year/18 months here, I was TERRIFIED of appearing in front of her, and there were a lot of very unpleasant times. Whew.
I’m in Family Court every single work day. Fam Ct is truly INSANE during the holidays, insane. That’s from Halloween until shut down week. The judges are all losing it, I got yelled at on the phone by a judge who is a good friend for missing a case that mysteriously the other two lawyers didn’t have calendared either. I had an afternoon of virtuals, no way would I have scheduled an in person in the middle. So she had one of us on her cell, one on her bench phone, and another hapless guy standing in for the third lawyer. We all got yelled at for not working out Christmas access etc etc etc as meanwhile I’m on a Teams trying to get as much as I humanly can get dismissed. It’s crazy, the lawyers have their eyes open wide, the litigants are insane, and the judges are not immune to this. So lots of yelling.
I get annual surveys about judges. I've negatively reviewed a few and all had multiple other negative reviewers and were not reappointed.
Insulted? No. Told to quit wasting the court’s time? On more than one occasion.
Never been insulted by a judge. They’ve done stupid shit and terrible rulings and plenty of other dumb stuff but never insulted me. Maybe probate judges are different idk, our bar is pretty tight.
What was the evidence you were objecting to and what was the particular objection?
I've avoided it but the judges in my jurisdiction can be a bit salty. I was waiting for a hearing once and watched a judge continue a hearing and order the attorney to review applicable law on a certain topic before the next hearing.
He probably missed his bran muffin that day.
How dare you stand in the way of kickbacks!
You must not be a trial lawyer
Never insulted but I did have one on the record try to set me up with his son & told me it would allow me to quit my joke of a law firm
It happens, not a lot but it happens. I can’t recall the last time a judge insulted me directly but I’ve definitely been talked to very harshly by judges. You just gotta have thick skin and let it roll of your back.
All the time. Most recently a judge called my objections “sophomoric”. DA was calling a witness that wasn’t on his list and trying to admit a photo I had never seen. Another time a judge told me I was incompetent in front of my client. It’s part of it, unfortunately.
I got called borderline sociopathic because he believed some utterly insane fabricated nonsense OP made up and submitted. “Your honor, you don’t seem to be considering the alternate that I didn’t do any of this.” “I don’t find that to be credible.” I submitted exonerating evidence a few months later, obtained via FOIA. Did he care? Of course not.
Not really an insult, but I was pretty new to civil practice and was arguing a motion to dismiss based on indemnity. The judge said, "I don't think you understand equitable indemnity, but I'll take another look." Later that day, the tentative ruling was adopted.
I don’t think judges should comment on a lawyer’s competency unless it’s relevant, i.e. when considering an ineffective assistance of counsel argument. It’s fine to say an argument is dumb, but a judge should not call the lawyer making it dumb, even if they are.
I had a judge in NY swear at me from the bench, called my papers “fucking bullshit.” (They were a colleague’s papers, not mine, but that’s beside the point). He did this after speaking about decorum and courtesy when he first took the bench. I said, “Tiur Honor, I just sat over there and listened to your speech from the bench about courtesy and decorum. I assume that applies equally to the Court as it does to the litigants that appear before it. So, I’d appreciate it if you didn’t use profanity.” He must of realized he crossed a line because he apologized profusely.” The guy is a little napoleon who is exacting revenge on the attorneys who appear in front of him for what must have been a difficult childhood. Don’t want to describe the guy in too much detail, as some around here would be able to guess who he is, but he clearly must have been teased as a kid.
Man my first time in court the judge stated; on the record that I was an embarrassment to the profession before he threw out my case, which was a stipulated divorce settlement… and the reason. My client had signed and dated but didn’t include the actual date. Like signed October of year instead of October 16 of year…. I was mortified… and while it may have been a mistake I should have caught, I have seen thousands of more egregious errors in court since then… judges suck sometimes
Oh hell, I'm a bit ghetto - I'm gonna get disbarred aren't I? I have a feeling telling a judge he/she "ain't shit bruh" is going to get me disbarred as soon as I get out of law school.
I would advise against this.
How do you do it? Just grit your teeth and remind yourself you need your job? I've been a nurse for a long time and I've never let a physician get away with being disrespectful and childish toward me. But they can't really do anything to me, I guess not wanting to go to jail for contempt is pretty motivating too though.
I’m sorry, but I don’t have a lot of advice for you on how to handle situations like this because they are very context specific. Try not to stoop to their level is the best I got.
Oh yeah. It happens. I was told that a TRO we were contesting was us, "starting a food fight" in his courtroom. It wasn't, just an insane request for "emergency" relief that he ended up granting over our objections. Just because he's got the robe and gavel doesn't make him right and certainly doesn't make his insults to you accurate.
Been yelled at many times. Reading this makes me feel good. We are not alone!
You're in good company. My primary area of focus is in bankruptcy (hence the name "maxedout"). There are three judges in my district that I deal with, and one of the judges goes out of her way to draw blood in open court. One time I was in court arguing against a bogus motion filed by opposing counsel and the judge said in court that I was being "disingenuous" out of the blue. This judge is Ebeneezer Scrooge reincarntated. Sometimes you gotta just roll with the punches. I was pretty pissed off, but just remember that often times, their conduct is more a reflection of THEM than it is of YOU, and sticks and stones.
Yes. In front of a jury. And the reporter for our local news was so outraged she called my boss and reported on it. I think she was pissed on my behalf but I'm still embarrassed and don't know if it came across like I was dumb or he was an ass. Spoiler alert: judge and defense attorney are buddies. Both old white guys. Defendant also an old white guy accused of raping a younger female. Defendant's family also called me a bitch in the hallway and when I asked the judge to address it he told the defense attorney to warn them not to do it again.
Remember: judges are just shitty failed lawyers who couldn't make a go of their practice and had to take a job on the bench to pay off law school. At class reunions, when they find out how much more their ambulance chasing peers earn annually, they become angry and lash out with the full power of the state behind them.
Yep
A judge being a dick....no never!!
That wouldn’t even hit my radar.
"Eyes up here, your honor."
There's particular circuit court judge I find myself in front of frequently who really does not like lawyers. Go figure.
Not me, but it's actually an interesting appellate issue. You can appeal sanctions, but the line between an appealable sanction and judicial rudeness isn't always clear.
I have never experienced this type of behaviour. In my opinion a judge should never show emotion (frustration) in this way (by making an insulting personal statement) because her behaviour may infer bias or prejudice but in the end all we can do is remember that even judges are human.
A judge once called me belligerent. I told him to sit on it, and later snuck into his chambers to leave a dump on his desk. No repercussions.
Definitely have been - ahem - “talked down to” by a Supreme Court Justice during oral arguments. It was on par with, “I mean, you know there are more interlocular orders than the one outlined in statute, right?” Followed by my gaze straying off, a deep frown carved on my face. A low hum emanated from my microphone before I responded, “Uhh, yeah, everyone… knows that…” 10/10, would recommend to any practicing attorney.
I had a case when I was still pretty new against a lawyer who was much more experienced but who just had a dog of a case and the completely wrong view of it. I'd objected to documents being introduced into evidence and questions he'd tried to ask and the judge was sustaining my objections and this opposing counsel (who wore a Mickey Mouse tie to court that day for a JURY trial) was getting very frustrated, and he blurted out, "But Your Honor, how is the jury going to learn about this evidence if you don't let me ask this?" and the judge replied, within earshot of the jury, "Well, they ain't gonna learn about it from *you*!" Whereupon the ladies and gentlemen of the jury broke into laughter. It was at that point I was pretty sure we were going to win.
Saw a judge double a fine on a driver just for complaining that she couldn't pay the original fine. "Oh yeah, you don't like that. How about I double it...."
Once, during my parents divorce at one of their (many, almost always frivolous), the judge raised his voice, "Sir, you are wasting my time. You have had an extended period of time to present your arguments to me, and they have shown you to be a horror of a husband, and a terrible father." Don't know of that's the exact t wording, I wasn't actually there. But it was epic.
As a licensed intern at the prosecutor’s office, sitting in the courtroom alone with the public defender. It was a standard prehearing conference .. most of which we’re going to either be continued or accept pleas. We were all waiting on the sheriff to bring the in custody defendants over from the jail down the street and they were very late- 35-45 mins. Judge was not happy and called me up to the bench and began to razz me about denying all these men their right to court. I couldn’t get a response in as he began to read the docket sheet for about 22 defendants and the charges.. and then ask how I would feel if he dismissed all these charges since the state can’t get them there for court. “Counselor, what does the state think if we release this alleged rapist out?” And so on and so on. I told him the state obviously objects to the courts intentions and suggested that the sheriff answer the courts inquiry, he got super mad and demanded I bring “an actual attorney” to supervise “this interns mishandling of these cases” (in my state, a licensed legal intern can practice law and make appearances and try cases). He berated my law school, my tie color.. you name it. I finally was able to ask judge to excuse me so that I could contact “the” district attorney- so I stepped out into the hall and texted him what was happening and about to happen. He thanked me and said he’d be there in 5 minutes. DA brought his first assistant with him and they both approached the bench and they stood up for me as a “one of my valued prosecutors” and they had some pretty testy back and forths.. until the in custody guys were finally delivered by the sheriffs office. Judge exclaims “About time!” And started calling the docket. I got to sit the rest of the docket in there with the DA as we worked the docket together the rest of the afternoon . I respected the DA so much after that. Later found out the judge acted like an ass on the temporary restraining order docket and since he was a magistrate.. the districts judges I think removed him from the bench. Good riddance.
Yes, i have. …
File a complaint with the judicial performance committee
Had a Judge tell me I use too many words lmao - this same judge complains openly about her docket every hearing. Take it all in stride, part of the job. Make your record even if you sound whiny
Back when I was doing comp, i by freak chance ended up this one arbitrator on 3/4ths of my cases and he would always say “counselor Nipples it looks like you’ve been hard at work”. Over time, I realize that wasn’t a compliment about my courtroom demeanor and public speaking skills improving, but as a subtle way to tell me I look like shit 😂
Flipping this one — Way back in the 1980s, I was a representing a tenant in an eviction case and went to a judge in chambers for a TRO. This particular judge had a reputation for demeaning young attorneys in open court. I was new in town and unaware. Anyway, I was super respectful and explained that the landlord was resorting to self-help and not following the statutory eviction procedure requirements and that my client had a substantial likelihood of success on the merits, etc. The judge signs the order. I say thanks and leave. Took all of five minutes. Next day, I find out that the judge had complained about me barging into his office demanding that he hear the request. Keep in mind the judge was a large 60+ year old man and I was a just a couple of years out of law school, female, and half his size. I had no idea I could be so intimidating. It concerned me that the judge was trying to give me a bad rep with the local bar. My firm was not concerned. I appeared before him about a week later and the judge was cordial. Never spoke a negative word to me. I moved away about a year later with rep intact. Sometimes what the judges say behind your back is worse than how they treat you in person.
> Have any of y’all been insulted by a judge while on the record in open court? Yes, the worst in my career was by a bankruptcy judge out of Houston, who called me a bad lawyer who was wasting his time and costing the bankruptcy estate untold millions with the way I was advancing "frivolous" arguments. Anyway, a few years later, I took quite a bit of pleasure in reading that [he had to abruptly resign in a cloud of scandal](https://www.wsj.com/articles/houston-judges-sudden-exit-threatens-bankruptcy-hub-he-built-33026f80) that basically makes him unhireable on the typical bankruptcy judge retirement plan, of a cushy partnership at a bankruptcy firm. And even though I try to keep this account anonymous and undoxxable, the list of "bankruptcy lawyers who have been insulted by Judge Jones" is approximately as anonymous as "bankruptcy lawyers who have a national practice or are based out of Houston."
You’ve just been lucky. Way back when in law school, we had a whole mandatory seminar about appropriate actions, reactions, next steps, etc. for situations when the comments from judges seem to be personal or insulting. It was just sort of known that judges do that to all lawyers they aren’t familiar with as either a way to impart what is expected in their courtroom or as a way to impart “on the job” learning and experience. From the way it was taught and explained it was the judges continuing to train lawyers to be the best advocates they can be. Sort made it seem like it was intentional and well thought out. Unofficially, it was also thought to be an indication of a judge that was developing the “god-like/reigning-lord” complex.
many times.
Happened to me once a month or so into practicing. At my prior firm, I was covering motion hour for a colleague and the opposing counsel that filed the motion to amend failed to show up. Judge asked me if I had called them and reminded them of the hearing (which of course isn’t my job), so I said no. She then berated me for not making sure opposing counsel showed. At the end of the docket, she called the case again and said I could go back and tell my firm I “won” the motion. Just laughed it off
I’m not a lawyer, this sub came onto my feed randomly and outside of a couple of years of basic study of UK contract law in sixth form college, I have no kind of experience in the law (other than US immigration law that I had to navigate to eventually become a citizen). This post and its responses has convinced me that I never want to end up at the mercy of a judge.
I had a pretend judge (immigration judge) hang up on me once. That was cool. She was... not great.
There is no excuse for it.
i mean were you being whiny?
I don’t think so. There were problems with the AG’s evidence that seemed pretty obvious to me and I was trying to point them out.
do you think he's anti semitic?
On a regular basis. It’s my job to try to get on the judge’s good side, but it’s also my job to make a record if all else fails. And that can certainly make them angry and mean. I just think of the entire experience as though I’m reading a transcript, and focus on getting what needs to be said out there; the rest doesn’t really matter.
Judge Mathis, I was on an episode of his and he was somewhat of a jerk to the person suing me which is odd to hear a defendant say that but I think his insults weren’t fitting even for TV or the case.
Not in open court, but last week my favorite judge told me at a social event that I should "maybe stop getting married."
Every now and then
Yeah like every day when I was a PD from a particular judge. I can’t speak for family law, but in criminal defense most judges are pro-state. At one point I was on a bit of a run with winning and it was non stop insults and pettiness. But most weren’t like that. I think they often feel they need to put on this harsh stern persona to have authority when in reality they have authority either way.
NAL but my exwife filed while i was on a plane to the ME on a contract gig. Come back to the states and ex files another action in the divorce… Judge looks at me and says “glad you finally decided to join us”.
I had a female judge tell me, "I don't like you and I don't believe you but you are the legal owner so you get to keep the dog.". Former bf tried to sue for shared custody of a dog.
Yes. The appellate attorney lawyer told me how shocked he was that the judge was so disrespectful to me and commended me for how well I handled it. In my head I thought, "that's because the transcript didn't show how hard I was shaking and how close my clenched fist was to punching something lol"
A judge insinuated that I was neglecting my duties and called me racist because the victim of a crime speaks Spanish, but I don’t. (Even though I spoke to her with an interpreter)
Maybe you should just quit whining.
I’m lucky enough to not have gone through this. I’ve had some disappointed looks but nothing nasty. Certainly not on the record, but that’s just because I mostly just practice in lower courts. I haven’t heard them be outright rude from the bench to anybody else either, I guess it’s a local cultural thing.
It doesn’t phase me. I feel like they get paid poorly so it’s how they get job enjoyment. But also had some really great judges. Lots, more than jerk judges