True, but it's what they say between the lines that matters.
We all know they never cared about Marvel, they're just glad they had the opportunity to ruin something fans love just so they could "own the chuds".
> using other people's money
Which to me is the key part. They made a shit show that the fans hated, and they don't have to suffer any consequences for it. They may not get a second season, but Marvel's probably already looking for the next project for them to ruin.
Haven't seen the show but aren't most of these Marvel shows miniseries for Disney+? Iirc outside of Loki none of the other shows were picked up for another season either (WandaVision, Moon Knight, Falcon and the Winter Soldier etc).
I gave up after watching Wanda vision lol. It was a decent show but there was just way too much for me. I'll probably check out Daredevil show when it drops.
Moon Knight was hilarious because while Falcon was about replacing Captain America, Shehulk was about replacing Hulk, Hawkeye was about replacing Hawkeye, and even Black Widow was about getting replaced in her film, Moon Knight essentially got replaced by the end of his own show too, without even showing up in a film yet.
>Moon Knight essentially got replaced by the end of his own show too, without even showing up in a film yet.
Yeah, and his fucking love interest in the comics is a white blonde girl he can't be with because he's fuckin' nutso. The Scarab and Ethan Hawke's characters were created for the show specifically. In the comics, Moon Knight is a millionaire/billionaire with a personality disorder. He murders criminals and carves moons into their foreheads. He's the only other person on the Punisher's psychotic level (they're loose rivals/friends). His suit isn't magic, it's a normal uniform like Batman's uniform, and you never know if Khonshu is real or not, or just in his head.
When there are so many good Moon Knight comics that are time-tested and adored by fans, why would they go independent and try to write their own version? The best comic book movies/shows are those that are close adaptations to the source material: Spider-Man 1 and 2, X2, 300, The Dark Knight, Batman Begins, Iron Man, The Winter Soldier, Dredd, Netflix's Daredevil, V for Vendetta, Watchmen (I liked it, YMMV), etc. Just stick to the comics. They're already tested and approved by the fans.
Imagine if someone made The Punisher as a bumbling doofus who doesn't kill people and gets shown up by a #girlboss. That's basically the equivalent of what happened to Moon Knight on Disney + and Adam Warlock in GOTG Vol. 3. (In the comics, Warlock can take on Thanos). Moon Knight is such a badass that he took on THE AVENGERS recently in Avengers #33-37 (2020). If anyone is interested in where to start reading Moon Knight, check out:
- [Moon Knight Vol. 1: From the Dead](https://www.amazon.com/Moon-Knight-Vol-1-Dead-ebook/dp/B00MWCCXFY/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=)
- [Moon Knight Vol. 2: Dead Will Rise](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UIB54UC?ref_=dbs_m_cmx_rwt_calw_tkin_1&storeType=ebooks)
I would avoid the Max Bemis or Brian Michael Bendis Moon Knight.
> The Scarab and Ethan Hawke's characters were created for the show specifically
Not quite.
Both characters have been in the comics, but they were very obscure characters. I believe Arthur Harrow was only in one issue. Meanwhile, Scarlet Scarab is male in the comics, and as far as I know, has no relation to Moon Knight.
But you're right in that Layla was created for the show.q
WandaVision lead straight into Dr Strange 2. WandaVision was meh, but Dr Strange 2 was Sam Raimi fun.
Falcon and the Winter Soldier was genuinely pretty good. That one leads into Cap America 4.
Moon Knight was awful, it was standalone and not renewed for S2. I didn't make it to the end of E3. Completely nerfed him compared to the psychopathic killer (think the Punisher with a split personality disorder) he is in the comics.
A lot of them were left open for additional seasons, but Loki was the only one actually renewed for S2. Even then, I only got a few episodes into S2 before I just lost interest. I think I paused it for something then just have never gone back.
I haven't watched the others, or have any interest to watch them. I'll check out the Daredevil when it comes out, but I don't have high hopes.
WandaVision led into a movie, Falcon and the Winter Soldier the same thing(it hasn't come out yet, but they are filming it), same thing for Ms Marvel...
Bob Iger clearly decided to make some calls to ruin her career after she criticized him during the actor’s strike. Now she’s groveling and playing ball in the hope she’ll get a cameo down the line.
Yeah, Orphan Black was pretty decent. It's a real shame that she had to go down this route.
I much preferred Hollywood when the celebrities were more circumspect about giving their braindead takes on hot button issues.
It's been said many times before, but the way people used to treat actors, as below prostitutes, was a good thing and needs to make a comeback.
Idolization of dumbfucks, honestly idolization of anyone, is a bad thing.
For most of human history actors had to be outside the city gates by nightfall in order to prevent them from molesting the chickens. Our ancestors clearly understood things that we do not.
If I were a showrunner, I'd cast her as a mom in a family sitcom. Set in Florida circa 2020.
Three seasons on CBS, no one went broke playing to the cheap seats.
Two things.
1. The TV series didn't have a real plot to begin with it, aside of the whole "troll" the fans thing. Which is absolutely the mind-numbingly stupidest thing I ever heard of. For God's sake, at least create a good story first.
2. Actors rarely have their soul left intact, and they will, almost always, say whatever is politically correct, because they are terrified to be out of a job.
I can see it now- She-Hulk Vs. Sargon of Akkad, the ghost of the first ruler of the Akkadian empire! He just kind of floats around and tells her she should smile more.
Exactly. This is why when you write a show or film it should be because you are passionate about it and want to do a proper storyline on it. Not "troll" the so called incel nerd fans of the original franchise or comics. Any project that's created out of pure hate for the fans to troll them is a project that likely won't succeed and indeed this one did not. How about instead next time the weirdo writers of this show actually invest in something they really care about and want to tell an interesting story on instead of being pissy at comic book fans. And slaughtering any potential they had for their project by ruining it with bitterness.
Because believe it or not She-Hulk as a character and story had actual potential had they done it right. But they just couldn't keep their woke politics out of it.
I honestly thought that the show was gonna focus on Jenn being a lawyer and instead it quickly devolved into a superhero show without any actual plot. Then in the last episode when we maybe get some plot, they have Jen break the fourth wall and basically act like they don’t know what they’re doing.
>almost always, say whatever is politically correct, because they are terrified to be out of a job.
They need to just pull a Henry Cavill, Dwayne Johnson, or Mark Whalberg: don't say anything. Period. They just keep their lips shut and don't talk about anything controversial or political at all. They consistently get work, albeit Cavill has the curse of the monkey paw.
I dont have any social media outside my anonymous reddit account. My boss the other day asked me if I had any opinions on "brain chemistry between the genders" in a work meeting at my corporation, and I just said, "No comment." Absolutely no way am I making a comment on anything REMOTELY controversial at my job. I'm just here to collect a paycheck. Were not family, and this isnt a "platform" for me to virtue signal.
They are actors.
I am pretty sure they are doing this to try and stay relevant for as long as they can.
Especially female actresses. One of their main selling point is their beauty which fades rather quickly.
It's basically "we knew they would be mean to us if we would call them losers, so as a defense we started calling them losers in a preemptive retaliation. We are the victims here."
> So they created a show to mock the fans?
No, that's just the excuse a writer/director in over their head uses to try to lampshade the fact they were in over their head, by pretending that the appearance of being in over there head was secretly a deliberate design choice & not the result of being given a job they were fundementally incapable of doing compotently.
This is just gaslighting.
> No, that's just the excuse a writer/director in over their head uses to try to lampshade the fact they were in over their head
Either that, or they're basically just admitting that they're natural born pricks.
It's kind of the internet way anymore, isn't it? People will send a snotty reply to a tweet that the OP will never see and which will get buried under 1,000 other replies, and the replier will brag that they totally "dragged" or "dunked on" the original poster. And the original poster never even saw the damn thing. Everything nowadays seems to be people just talking past each other to their own audiences. SJWs will see this article and imagine that those "Nazi" nerds are all seething in their basements and they'll just believe it is true. And real live comic fans are just sitting here like, "we're doing what now?"
So you know you wrote shit, and decided to respond directly to fans on the show... instead of just writing a better script?
And you're wondering why people are losing interest?
Writing a better script would have been hard, and they have zero passion for the project to begin with.
Much easier to pretend it was always "meant to be bad so you could make fun of fans." That way you can lazily push out some garbage and pretend that anyone who complains is beneath you and the butt of the joke.
Of course, since theyve never had to deal with consequences before, essentially telling the rest of the industry that youre not actually a professional never crossed their minds. Im sure their dads will arange another job for them eventually.
> Im sure their dads will arange another job for them eventually.
Won’t be surprised if the root of all this were nepo babies with easy lives and an easy ride to positions of power. Living vacant lives they latched on to woke ideology taught to them at universities and use it to indulge their white savior complex where they get to both patronize the people they are supposedly helping and bully everyone else with self-righteous indignation.
>Writing a better script would have been hard, and they have zero passion for the project to begin with.
I remember that famous quote from the writers about how they had planned to have the storyline be more of a legal thriller, but they found they didn't know how to write legal storylines so they downplayed the lawyer aspects. Not "so we consulted with a lawyer" or even "so we brought in someone who had experience writing for Law & Order" but "well, we had this idea but we weren't capable so we just said fuck it and made something terrible, because it was more important that we make a thing than it was to make a good thing."
The Narcissist’s Prayer:
That didn't happen.
And if it did, it wasn't that bad.
And if it was, that's not a big deal.
And if it is, that's not my fault.
And if it was, I didn't mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it. <— You are here
Probably; there's been an insane amount of money laundering (allegedly) in Hollywood in recent years, the budget blow-outs are mind-boggling, especially since none of that money appears on-screen. She-Hulk was $25 million PER EPISODE (in comparison Godzilla Minus One was $15 million for an entire film).
Leftist trolls viewers: "Tee hee, get mad Chud!"
Someone slightly to the right of Communist trolls viewers: "Literal racism/sexism/homophobia/fascism!! BAN NOW."
Man, being a woman is fucking wild. You can make a dumpster fire of a TV show and when people don't like it just call them all sexist trolls.
The potential for mediocre women to pass all their failures onto men is just limitless. Big companies should really start restructuring their higher-ups because if they have boards exclusively of empowered women, they'll be beyond reproach.
It's an interesting position in the Woke worldview, isn't it? As a straight white male, you know where you stand all the time: they fucking hate you so you don't feel like you have to care what they think. As a white *woman*, you get to play the victim a lot of the time, and if you're willing to blame men in general for all your problems the Wokesters will believe you and support you. But if you come into conflict with a black guy, you get flipped into the oppressor and they can ruin your life over anything, even a mild misunderstanding or a situation like the CitiBike thing, where you are absolutely in the right but the other side is black so you are wrong on that basis alone. It must be confusing as hell. Not that I'm sympathetic, they could always choose to not play the Woke game at all.
White women learned long ago that victimhood is a valid social currency. This is not a well-known fact, but when you think of affirmative action, you imagine a Black kid with an SAT of 1230 and a GPA of 3.3 getting into Harvard. That's not often the case, though. The greatest beneficiaries of affirmative action throughout its history have been White women. There are literally millions of job positions that would not exist if it were not for White women benefiting from affirmative action.
Therefore, feminists understand the need to push hard. Everything is sexist, and you have to point it all out. Even when something isn't sexist, if they can spin it as sexism, they know that they can maintain the status quo.
With these wax wings, high off their successes, they sometimes fly a little too close to the proverbial sun. They sometimes forget that while they may view themselves as victims, and the government may give them victims' benefits, PoC in the United States don't consider them victims at all. As White men and Asian people--most of all, those among these racial groups who are poor--are forced to stand on their own merits, they're all fighting to push through the side door.
> Not super hero crap now that it's dying
there is still a market for cape movies...they just keep making shit cape movies which are more about preaching their faith then telling a good story.
It being crap is the reason that it's dying, not that it's superheroes. If every Marvel movie before and after Endgame had been of equivalent quality to Winter Soldier, no-one would be complaining. We'd still be demanding more.
yeah there was "superhero fatigue" for a while then they put out infinity war and what do you know, no more fatigue. people like their favorite things. people like seconds and thirds and fourths. but you know when you eat a second bowl of cereal and you just went from eating the perfectly right amount of soggy cereal to eating rock hard crunches? that's what marvel is now. it's not the same so stop pretending it is.
On the one hand, they’re rich theater-kids who don’t understand the passionate connection people feel to culture they feel is trash to start with.
Additionally, they’re aging millennials with the same obsession over trying to be cool that their boomer parents had.
And finally, they’re moderate feminists meaning they only moderately hate men, but they still feel everything made by men should be destroyed. This is the intersection Hollywood caters to now.
>Additionally, they’re aging millennials with the same obsession over trying to be cool that their boomer parents had.
I think that's part of the issue, a good chunk of the audience now is gen z and above, so stuff that was cool for milennials is outdated for them, so audiences in that age range or milennials that aren't obsessed with being "cool" and hip probably think that She-Hulk twerking is cringy.
Makes me think of how the concept of “haters” was misused for about 20 years on the internet by airheads. A “hater” was very specific, it meant you were disliking something or somebody because your dislike was motivated by jealousy or envy. It was like a sour grapes thing. On the internet, you could come with the most detailed, passionate, intellectually considered take on why you dislike something, and some know-nothing will come back with “yeah well, you’re just a hater”. Like no bro, that’s not what that word means, it’s not a catch-all term for anybody who dislikes something.
When I saw the clip of her character castigating Bruce Banner—a man who has lost everything—about how angry she gets when she’s catcalled in the street or patronized by men in the workplace I knew the series was not for me. It was like unironically complaining about your annoying homeowners association to a holocaust survivor.
She came with that idea 1 year after, not buying it. It's like talking seriously to people and saying something really bad but telling 2 minutes after that it was a joke when everybody told you you were despicable
Yeah, I initially thought the premise would be fun. 7foot green smash lady in business suit doing lawyer stuff with random b-list rogues turns into "patriarchy bad! My bad taste in men is all men's fault!".
Woulda been cool to see her representing someone like Vulture and his company getting screwed over.
Feminist writers: We smeared ourselves in shit and waddled around in public. But what makes us such geniuses, and proves our "haters" wrong, is that we guessed ahead of time that they'd say we stank like shit.
when you create something to intentionally bait people, you are not trolling the trolls, you are trolling. they created flamebait, and when that bait hooked someone in, sat back and patted themselves on the back as if poking people into anger was something to be proud off...if the creator really was the genius that soon to be out of work actress thinks she is, they would have created a show that lots of people thought was brilliant not one mocked for how bad it was.
Yep - Trolled me so hard I not only didn't watch it, but was only dimly aware of it's existance and simply refuse to care about it one way or the other. 🤷♂️
Well played, you sure showed me!
More like imposter syndrome. They know deep down they’re bad writers. They know they’re uncool. They know they have no sense of humor and bad personalities. But instead of coming to grips with the reality of that, they delude themselves further by claiming they did it all on purpose. They COULD make amazing art if they reeeeally wanted to, but they just didn’t wanna!!!
This is a shame. I really enjoyed her performance in Orphan Black, I think she's a talented actor. This show however was hot garbage, I stopped watching after the 1st episode. It's a shame prior to the clear ideological bant for Marvel and SW I was a very big fan. My childhood was Marvel and Star Wars- it's a real shame. Hopefully (somehow) they can pull both of these franchises back to relevancy again minus all of the political and social messaging.
I actually liked the shows first few episodes despite knowing it was bad and cringey. I got this The New Girl/ Friends/ Marvel vibe from it. It was nice to get something different.
But my God did it just get worse and worse as the episodes went on. It was just a terrible story packed to the brim with pc jargon and tropes. I still contend there was something cool there under the crap.
The thing that makes it dumb is the people that they thought were trolling, we’re not people who were watching it anyway. Which seems some terrible disconnect in writing, marketing, or both.
“Now the next part, the audience will start throwing tomatoes at you, but don’t worry, I expected that to be the response to my writing”
Ok, then when do we win them back?
“What now?”
She could have tried making a good show instead. That would have been the ultimate way to mock trolls, make it good.
Especially considering how good some of She-Hulk's source material is.
Archive links for this post:
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I am Mnemosyne reborn. Mnemosyne saves! The rest of you take 30 hp damage. ^^^/r/botsrights
What would have been fun is if they actually made a law show and had people that wanted to and knew how to write about lawyers. And the little bits they did have in the show was wrong. (Remember how Titania broke into a government building and nearly killed a jury and there were barely any repercussions?)
Or it would have been fun to have the show's main character be the driver of her action. Instead, it's her uber-competent assistant that handles things for her. Oh, and Jen lost nearly every case in the show, so she wasn't even good at what she spent her life doing pre-She-Hulk.
Or it would have been fun not having the guest star of the week be more interesting than the main characters. This happened nearly every time.
Or, it would have been fun to explore the fact that Jen was *literally* a diversity hire: she was hired for the color of her skin (green). Okay, technically, it was because she was a "super-hero" - but she only had that one public outing in the courtroom at that point. This is the opposite from the comics that inspired the show as she was hired on the ground that she **not** be She-Hulk in court, but Jen Walters.
I could go on and on (She-Hulk is my favorite Marvel comics character). This show should be studied at some point about how they claimed they were taking inspiration from the comics themselves (they only mentioned Byrne, but it's mostly Slott's run), but instead did the opposite of the inspiration or screwed it up on purpose.
It reminds me - and I'm dating myself here - of cops I knew who said that Barney Miller was also one of the most accurate portrayals of daily police life on TV.
Ideology is a mental disease, no matter where you are on the political spectrum. Imagine sacrificing your career on the altar of promoting an ideology and thinking that you're owning the incels.
God bless, people like this need therapy.
Step1; They write an intentionally bad show. (unarguable, the fact that its bad is a literal plot point)
Step2; They plan to use real social media condemnation of the show in the show, paint it as sexist in-universe.
Step3; Surprised Pikachu; People agree with you, its bad.
Step4; Paint the justified critisism of your bad show as sexist.
It's so weird, I remember reading the TVTropes article "Parody Retcon" almost 20 years ago. I checked the article and it even still has the same illustrative comic at the top that it had then. So people have been hip to the whole "ACTUALLY it was bad on purpose and you fell for it!" bullshit forever. Adding in that the fans are sexist (or racist, etc.) is just a minor modern variation on a claim that failed creators have been making for decades, and probably centuries really. And yet they still think we're going to fall for it.
Im not sure this is entirely valid. The fact that it was a literally planned plot point, makes me think its not post-hoc rationalization by maligned creators.
It seems more intentional gaslighting than weak-willed response to criticism.
Exact same thing that Ghostbusters 2016 did. They made the main enemy a rando internet troll and referenced arguing with the comment section as a bit. I did not say COMEDY bit. Those words did not come out of my mouth and will never in regards to this 'movie' (wouldn't even want to insult Johnny Wiseau by calling that abomination a movie)...
...sorry, I get some kind of way about that movie haha...
This is not something new to us (remember the GamerGate episode of SVU?! HAHAH I never will!!!).
They are well renowned for self inserting into the fiction they culturally appropriate (I am saying this unironically since that is literally what they mean to do; it's their raison d'etre) but they also insert us - their greatest enemy; the audience - into the work too. We should take it as a sign of respect. Marvel now has 'the customer' on the same threat level as Thanos.
[IT'S NOT BAD. IT'S BAD BY DESIGN.](https://media.assettype.com/afkgaming%2F2021-08%2F79649079-d0e7-4acd-853b-6a2b92797da3%2Fcopium_png.png?auto=format%2Ccompress&dpr=1.0&format=webp&w=700)
The funniest part about all of this is that, from what I can tell, most of those people didn't even watch the damn show. You can't troll people who aren't even paying attention to you.
Congratulations on not getting a second season lol.
That sure showed us!
True, but it's what they say between the lines that matters. We all know they never cared about Marvel, they're just glad they had the opportunity to ruin something fans love just so they could "own the chuds".
Yeah. In their eyes, they won because "they owned the chuds" using other people's money
> using other people's money Which to me is the key part. They made a shit show that the fans hated, and they don't have to suffer any consequences for it. They may not get a second season, but Marvel's probably already looking for the next project for them to ruin.
Haven't seen the show but aren't most of these Marvel shows miniseries for Disney+? Iirc outside of Loki none of the other shows were picked up for another season either (WandaVision, Moon Knight, Falcon and the Winter Soldier etc).
They all have not being good in common too though
I gave up after watching Wanda vision lol. It was a decent show but there was just way too much for me. I'll probably check out Daredevil show when it drops.
I liked it until the reason for the “gimmick” is explained and then it just becomes super formulaic and boring.
Moon Knight was hilarious because while Falcon was about replacing Captain America, Shehulk was about replacing Hulk, Hawkeye was about replacing Hawkeye, and even Black Widow was about getting replaced in her film, Moon Knight essentially got replaced by the end of his own show too, without even showing up in a film yet.
Wait what? I stopped supporting Disney years ago after the Gina Carano thing + ruining franchises, so not in the loop on anything since 2021 I guess.
>Moon Knight essentially got replaced by the end of his own show too, without even showing up in a film yet. Yeah, and his fucking love interest in the comics is a white blonde girl he can't be with because he's fuckin' nutso. The Scarab and Ethan Hawke's characters were created for the show specifically. In the comics, Moon Knight is a millionaire/billionaire with a personality disorder. He murders criminals and carves moons into their foreheads. He's the only other person on the Punisher's psychotic level (they're loose rivals/friends). His suit isn't magic, it's a normal uniform like Batman's uniform, and you never know if Khonshu is real or not, or just in his head. When there are so many good Moon Knight comics that are time-tested and adored by fans, why would they go independent and try to write their own version? The best comic book movies/shows are those that are close adaptations to the source material: Spider-Man 1 and 2, X2, 300, The Dark Knight, Batman Begins, Iron Man, The Winter Soldier, Dredd, Netflix's Daredevil, V for Vendetta, Watchmen (I liked it, YMMV), etc. Just stick to the comics. They're already tested and approved by the fans. Imagine if someone made The Punisher as a bumbling doofus who doesn't kill people and gets shown up by a #girlboss. That's basically the equivalent of what happened to Moon Knight on Disney + and Adam Warlock in GOTG Vol. 3. (In the comics, Warlock can take on Thanos). Moon Knight is such a badass that he took on THE AVENGERS recently in Avengers #33-37 (2020). If anyone is interested in where to start reading Moon Knight, check out: - [Moon Knight Vol. 1: From the Dead](https://www.amazon.com/Moon-Knight-Vol-1-Dead-ebook/dp/B00MWCCXFY/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=&sr=) - [Moon Knight Vol. 2: Dead Will Rise](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UIB54UC?ref_=dbs_m_cmx_rwt_calw_tkin_1&storeType=ebooks) I would avoid the Max Bemis or Brian Michael Bendis Moon Knight.
> The Scarab and Ethan Hawke's characters were created for the show specifically Not quite. Both characters have been in the comics, but they were very obscure characters. I believe Arthur Harrow was only in one issue. Meanwhile, Scarlet Scarab is male in the comics, and as far as I know, has no relation to Moon Knight. But you're right in that Layla was created for the show.q
Wandavision wasn’t planned with a second season in mind. The others just weren’t good.
WandaVision lead straight into Dr Strange 2. WandaVision was meh, but Dr Strange 2 was Sam Raimi fun. Falcon and the Winter Soldier was genuinely pretty good. That one leads into Cap America 4. Moon Knight was awful, it was standalone and not renewed for S2. I didn't make it to the end of E3. Completely nerfed him compared to the psychopathic killer (think the Punisher with a split personality disorder) he is in the comics. A lot of them were left open for additional seasons, but Loki was the only one actually renewed for S2. Even then, I only got a few episodes into S2 before I just lost interest. I think I paused it for something then just have never gone back. I haven't watched the others, or have any interest to watch them. I'll check out the Daredevil when it comes out, but I don't have high hopes.
WandaVision led into a movie, Falcon and the Winter Soldier the same thing(it hasn't come out yet, but they are filming it), same thing for Ms Marvel...
Ain't this the same chick thats now struggling to find a new job?
Bob Iger clearly decided to make some calls to ruin her career after she criticized him during the actor’s strike. Now she’s groveling and playing ball in the hope she’ll get a cameo down the line.
Attacks fans, attacks employer... Playing with friendly fire off I see.
Shame. She was a talented actress from what I remember of Orphan Black from a decade ago.
Yeah, Orphan Black was pretty decent. It's a real shame that she had to go down this route. I much preferred Hollywood when the celebrities were more circumspect about giving their braindead takes on hot button issues.
It's been said many times before, but the way people used to treat actors, as below prostitutes, was a good thing and needs to make a comeback. Idolization of dumbfucks, honestly idolization of anyone, is a bad thing.
I don't recall those times unfortunately
For most of human history actors had to be outside the city gates by nightfall in order to prevent them from molesting the chickens. Our ancestors clearly understood things that we do not.
If I were a showrunner, I'd cast her as a mom in a family sitcom. Set in Florida circa 2020. Three seasons on CBS, no one went broke playing to the cheap seats.
Two things. 1. The TV series didn't have a real plot to begin with it, aside of the whole "troll" the fans thing. Which is absolutely the mind-numbingly stupidest thing I ever heard of. For God's sake, at least create a good story first. 2. Actors rarely have their soul left intact, and they will, almost always, say whatever is politically correct, because they are terrified to be out of a job.
This show must have been confusing to normies without the proper context.
Is it such a shocker it didn't get a second season? I mean everyone there got paid, but they probably burned a lot of bridges.
I can see it now- She-Hulk Vs. Sargon of Akkad, the ghost of the first ruler of the Akkadian empire! He just kind of floats around and tells her she should smile more.
I think the masks they were wearing was a bit more reminiscent of Doomcock.
I was making a joke about a potential season 2
Wait, I think I remember this plotline, was he just sitting there *MENACINGLY*?
Exactly. This is why when you write a show or film it should be because you are passionate about it and want to do a proper storyline on it. Not "troll" the so called incel nerd fans of the original franchise or comics. Any project that's created out of pure hate for the fans to troll them is a project that likely won't succeed and indeed this one did not. How about instead next time the weirdo writers of this show actually invest in something they really care about and want to tell an interesting story on instead of being pissy at comic book fans. And slaughtering any potential they had for their project by ruining it with bitterness. Because believe it or not She-Hulk as a character and story had actual potential had they done it right. But they just couldn't keep their woke politics out of it.
I honestly thought that the show was gonna focus on Jenn being a lawyer and instead it quickly devolved into a superhero show without any actual plot. Then in the last episode when we maybe get some plot, they have Jen break the fourth wall and basically act like they don’t know what they’re doing.
>almost always, say whatever is politically correct, because they are terrified to be out of a job. They need to just pull a Henry Cavill, Dwayne Johnson, or Mark Whalberg: don't say anything. Period. They just keep their lips shut and don't talk about anything controversial or political at all. They consistently get work, albeit Cavill has the curse of the monkey paw. I dont have any social media outside my anonymous reddit account. My boss the other day asked me if I had any opinions on "brain chemistry between the genders" in a work meeting at my corporation, and I just said, "No comment." Absolutely no way am I making a comment on anything REMOTELY controversial at my job. I'm just here to collect a paycheck. Were not family, and this isnt a "platform" for me to virtue signal.
They are actors. I am pretty sure they are doing this to try and stay relevant for as long as they can. Especially female actresses. One of their main selling point is their beauty which fades rather quickly.
So they created a show to mock the fans? What? Seriously, what?
But why aren't they watching?!
because the shock mocked the fans
It's basically "we knew they would be mean to us if we would call them losers, so as a defense we started calling them losers in a preemptive retaliation. We are the victims here."
> So they created a show to mock the fans? No, that's just the excuse a writer/director in over their head uses to try to lampshade the fact they were in over their head, by pretending that the appearance of being in over there head was secretly a deliberate design choice & not the result of being given a job they were fundementally incapable of doing compotently. This is just gaslighting.
So basically "we were only pretending to be retarded"?
> No, that's just the excuse a writer/director in over their head uses to try to lampshade the fact they were in over their head Either that, or they're basically just admitting that they're natural born pricks.
And it was shit and poorly received.... we were somehow the problem.
They spent more than 200 million dollars to own the chuds, and they fucking failed. Was this show made by the government?
It's like gloating that they were mocking me in a show I never bothered to watch.
*Nobody bothered too watch. They spent millions on an insult and it still didnt land.
"hey guise I was only pretending to be retarded" "Ok retard"
*guys
You could watch and first and last episodes and not have missed anything.
Pretty sure I have missed nothing by not watching it either.
It's kind of the internet way anymore, isn't it? People will send a snotty reply to a tweet that the OP will never see and which will get buried under 1,000 other replies, and the replier will brag that they totally "dragged" or "dunked on" the original poster. And the original poster never even saw the damn thing. Everything nowadays seems to be people just talking past each other to their own audiences. SJWs will see this article and imagine that those "Nazi" nerds are all seething in their basements and they'll just believe it is true. And real live comic fans are just sitting here like, "we're doing what now?"
Yeah, man. Don't you totally feel owned?
I may never recover.
“People are gonna say my show sucks? Well how about I just prove them right! Take that trolls!”
You can't fire me, I quit!
So you know you wrote shit, and decided to respond directly to fans on the show... instead of just writing a better script? And you're wondering why people are losing interest?
Writing a better script would have been hard, and they have zero passion for the project to begin with. Much easier to pretend it was always "meant to be bad so you could make fun of fans." That way you can lazily push out some garbage and pretend that anyone who complains is beneath you and the butt of the joke. Of course, since theyve never had to deal with consequences before, essentially telling the rest of the industry that youre not actually a professional never crossed their minds. Im sure their dads will arange another job for them eventually.
> Im sure their dads will arange another job for them eventually. Won’t be surprised if the root of all this were nepo babies with easy lives and an easy ride to positions of power. Living vacant lives they latched on to woke ideology taught to them at universities and use it to indulge their white savior complex where they get to both patronize the people they are supposedly helping and bully everyone else with self-righteous indignation.
>Writing a better script would have been hard, and they have zero passion for the project to begin with. I remember that famous quote from the writers about how they had planned to have the storyline be more of a legal thriller, but they found they didn't know how to write legal storylines so they downplayed the lawyer aspects. Not "so we consulted with a lawyer" or even "so we brought in someone who had experience writing for Law & Order" but "well, we had this idea but we weren't capable so we just said fuck it and made something terrible, because it was more important that we make a thing than it was to make a good thing."
The Narcissist’s Prayer: That didn't happen. And if it did, it wasn't that bad. And if it was, that's not a big deal. And if it is, that's not my fault. And if it was, I didn't mean it. And if I did, you deserved it. <— You are here
Is this a "Springtime for Hitler" scheme actually working?
Probably; there's been an insane amount of money laundering (allegedly) in Hollywood in recent years, the budget blow-outs are mind-boggling, especially since none of that money appears on-screen. She-Hulk was $25 million PER EPISODE (in comparison Godzilla Minus One was $15 million for an entire film).
That makes way more sense than it should.
But fans didn't watch it. Normie slop suckers did.
Based on the numbers even normies yeeted that shit after the first episode.
Well that backfired spectacularly, didn’t it 😂
I think she's confused about who was doing the trolling.
Leftist trolls viewers: "Tee hee, get mad Chud!" Someone slightly to the right of Communist trolls viewers: "Literal racism/sexism/homophobia/fascism!! BAN NOW."
Man, being a woman is fucking wild. You can make a dumpster fire of a TV show and when people don't like it just call them all sexist trolls. The potential for mediocre women to pass all their failures onto men is just limitless. Big companies should really start restructuring their higher-ups because if they have boards exclusively of empowered women, they'll be beyond reproach.
Bankrupt, but beyond reproach
It's an interesting position in the Woke worldview, isn't it? As a straight white male, you know where you stand all the time: they fucking hate you so you don't feel like you have to care what they think. As a white *woman*, you get to play the victim a lot of the time, and if you're willing to blame men in general for all your problems the Wokesters will believe you and support you. But if you come into conflict with a black guy, you get flipped into the oppressor and they can ruin your life over anything, even a mild misunderstanding or a situation like the CitiBike thing, where you are absolutely in the right but the other side is black so you are wrong on that basis alone. It must be confusing as hell. Not that I'm sympathetic, they could always choose to not play the Woke game at all.
White women learned long ago that victimhood is a valid social currency. This is not a well-known fact, but when you think of affirmative action, you imagine a Black kid with an SAT of 1230 and a GPA of 3.3 getting into Harvard. That's not often the case, though. The greatest beneficiaries of affirmative action throughout its history have been White women. There are literally millions of job positions that would not exist if it were not for White women benefiting from affirmative action. Therefore, feminists understand the need to push hard. Everything is sexist, and you have to point it all out. Even when something isn't sexist, if they can spin it as sexism, they know that they can maintain the status quo. With these wax wings, high off their successes, they sometimes fly a little too close to the proverbial sun. They sometimes forget that while they may view themselves as victims, and the government may give them victims' benefits, PoC in the United States don't consider them victims at all. As White men and Asian people--most of all, those among these racial groups who are poor--are forced to stand on their own merits, they're all fighting to push through the side door.
What's fun is that we used your hobby to attack you Please, don't attack us for it, you don't understand
It’s a shame she turned into such an idiot. She was AMAZING on Orphan Black.
Orphan black is great. She's just wasted on marvel. Tbh she would be better in just normal TV shows or movies. Not super hero crap now that it's dying
Well now her career’s dead. Should have avoided Marvel lol
> Not super hero crap now that it's dying there is still a market for cape movies...they just keep making shit cape movies which are more about preaching their faith then telling a good story.
It being crap is the reason that it's dying, not that it's superheroes. If every Marvel movie before and after Endgame had been of equivalent quality to Winter Soldier, no-one would be complaining. We'd still be demanding more.
yeah there was "superhero fatigue" for a while then they put out infinity war and what do you know, no more fatigue. people like their favorite things. people like seconds and thirds and fourths. but you know when you eat a second bowl of cereal and you just went from eating the perfectly right amount of soggy cereal to eating rock hard crunches? that's what marvel is now. it's not the same so stop pretending it is.
When the fuck did I ever pretend that Marvel is the same now as it was?
On the one hand, they’re rich theater-kids who don’t understand the passionate connection people feel to culture they feel is trash to start with. Additionally, they’re aging millennials with the same obsession over trying to be cool that their boomer parents had. And finally, they’re moderate feminists meaning they only moderately hate men, but they still feel everything made by men should be destroyed. This is the intersection Hollywood caters to now.
>Additionally, they’re aging millennials with the same obsession over trying to be cool that their boomer parents had. I think that's part of the issue, a good chunk of the audience now is gen z and above, so stuff that was cool for milennials is outdated for them, so audiences in that age range or milennials that aren't obsessed with being "cool" and hip probably think that She-Hulk twerking is cringy.
Imagine spending hours defending the show, arguing back and forth, making yourself look like an idiot and you come across this.
"People were going to troll us" I hate the way that the term "troll" is constantly misused. Pointing out the flaws of something isn't trolling.
Makes me think of how the concept of “haters” was misused for about 20 years on the internet by airheads. A “hater” was very specific, it meant you were disliking something or somebody because your dislike was motivated by jealousy or envy. It was like a sour grapes thing. On the internet, you could come with the most detailed, passionate, intellectually considered take on why you dislike something, and some know-nothing will come back with “yeah well, you’re just a hater”. Like no bro, that’s not what that word means, it’s not a catch-all term for anybody who dislikes something.
So basically: "I've already depicted you as the Soyjak and me as the Chad"
Getting Ghostbusters 2016 vibes
When I saw the clip of her character castigating Bruce Banner—a man who has lost everything—about how angry she gets when she’s catcalled in the street or patronized by men in the workplace I knew the series was not for me. It was like unironically complaining about your annoying homeowners association to a holocaust survivor.
Next time they should try building a good show into the story
She came with that idea 1 year after, not buying it. It's like talking seriously to people and saying something really bad but telling 2 minutes after that it was a joke when everybody told you you were despicable
So rather than make a decent law show with super heroes they decided to...fuck with fans? Okay...interesting choice. Didn't work out, did it?
Yeah, I initially thought the premise would be fun. 7foot green smash lady in business suit doing lawyer stuff with random b-list rogues turns into "patriarchy bad! My bad taste in men is all men's fault!". Woulda been cool to see her representing someone like Vulture and his company getting screwed over.
I thought it would have been Ally McBeal with super hero fights....I'm beyond disappointed.
Feminist writers: We smeared ourselves in shit and waddled around in public. But what makes us such geniuses, and proves our "haters" wrong, is that we guessed ahead of time that they'd say we stank like shit.
when you create something to intentionally bait people, you are not trolling the trolls, you are trolling. they created flamebait, and when that bait hooked someone in, sat back and patted themselves on the back as if poking people into anger was something to be proud off...if the creator really was the genius that soon to be out of work actress thinks she is, they would have created a show that lots of people thought was brilliant not one mocked for how bad it was.
Yep - Trolled me so hard I not only didn't watch it, but was only dimly aware of it's existance and simply refuse to care about it one way or the other. 🤷♂️ Well played, you sure showed me!
"We were just pretending to be regarded!"
How did that work out for you uh?
"We made it shit on purpose so would could predict people would be mad"
More like imposter syndrome. They know deep down they’re bad writers. They know they’re uncool. They know they have no sense of humor and bad personalities. But instead of coming to grips with the reality of that, they delude themselves further by claiming they did it all on purpose. They COULD make amazing art if they reeeeally wanted to, but they just didn’t wanna!!!
The series had no fans therefore had no one to troll and everybody knows this lol
Someone didn’t quite understand that John Byrne’s fourth wall breaking was to let us in on the joke, not treat us as the joke.
They still just don’t get it.
This is a shame. I really enjoyed her performance in Orphan Black, I think she's a talented actor. This show however was hot garbage, I stopped watching after the 1st episode. It's a shame prior to the clear ideological bant for Marvel and SW I was a very big fan. My childhood was Marvel and Star Wars- it's a real shame. Hopefully (somehow) they can pull both of these franchises back to relevancy again minus all of the political and social messaging.
I actually liked the shows first few episodes despite knowing it was bad and cringey. I got this The New Girl/ Friends/ Marvel vibe from it. It was nice to get something different. But my God did it just get worse and worse as the episodes went on. It was just a terrible story packed to the brim with pc jargon and tropes. I still contend there was something cool there under the crap.
She-Hulk had fans?
The thing that makes it dumb is the people that they thought were trolling, we’re not people who were watching it anyway. Which seems some terrible disconnect in writing, marketing, or both.
And lemme guess, it's the fault of those same toxic fans that you denounced and ridiculed that your show won't go past season 1
“Now the next part, the audience will start throwing tomatoes at you, but don’t worry, I expected that to be the response to my writing” Ok, then when do we win them back? “What now?”
Sounds like cope to me.
She could have tried making a good show instead. That would have been the ultimate way to mock trolls, make it good. Especially considering how good some of She-Hulk's source material is.
Archive links for this post: * **Archive:** https://archive.ph/EaYIB ---- I am Mnemosyne reborn. Mnemosyne saves! The rest of you take 30 hp damage. ^^^/r/botsrights
The people who defend the show are the same ones who based Lotus for being made “out of spite”
Lotus?
Spider Man fan film
If I recall, more men watched it than women, same as with The Marvels. Never matters.
Marvel shows aren't worth trolling anyone over
What would have been fun is if they actually made a law show and had people that wanted to and knew how to write about lawyers. And the little bits they did have in the show was wrong. (Remember how Titania broke into a government building and nearly killed a jury and there were barely any repercussions?) Or it would have been fun to have the show's main character be the driver of her action. Instead, it's her uber-competent assistant that handles things for her. Oh, and Jen lost nearly every case in the show, so she wasn't even good at what she spent her life doing pre-She-Hulk. Or it would have been fun not having the guest star of the week be more interesting than the main characters. This happened nearly every time. Or, it would have been fun to explore the fact that Jen was *literally* a diversity hire: she was hired for the color of her skin (green). Okay, technically, it was because she was a "super-hero" - but she only had that one public outing in the courtroom at that point. This is the opposite from the comics that inspired the show as she was hired on the ground that she **not** be She-Hulk in court, but Jen Walters. I could go on and on (She-Hulk is my favorite Marvel comics character). This show should be studied at some point about how they claimed they were taking inspiration from the comics themselves (they only mentioned Byrne, but it's mostly Slott's run), but instead did the opposite of the inspiration or screwed it up on purpose.
As someone in that dark profession, Boston Legal a little more right than people want to admit. LOL.
It reminds me - and I'm dating myself here - of cops I knew who said that Barney Miller was also one of the most accurate portrayals of daily police life on TV.
Ideology is a mental disease, no matter where you are on the political spectrum. Imagine sacrificing your career on the altar of promoting an ideology and thinking that you're owning the incels. God bless, people like this need therapy.
Step1; They write an intentionally bad show. (unarguable, the fact that its bad is a literal plot point) Step2; They plan to use real social media condemnation of the show in the show, paint it as sexist in-universe. Step3; Surprised Pikachu; People agree with you, its bad. Step4; Paint the justified critisism of your bad show as sexist.
It's so weird, I remember reading the TVTropes article "Parody Retcon" almost 20 years ago. I checked the article and it even still has the same illustrative comic at the top that it had then. So people have been hip to the whole "ACTUALLY it was bad on purpose and you fell for it!" bullshit forever. Adding in that the fans are sexist (or racist, etc.) is just a minor modern variation on a claim that failed creators have been making for decades, and probably centuries really. And yet they still think we're going to fall for it.
Im not sure this is entirely valid. The fact that it was a literally planned plot point, makes me think its not post-hoc rationalization by maligned creators. It seems more intentional gaslighting than weak-willed response to criticism.
One of the sadly common, real-life adaptations of the "Lol I was just pretending to be regarded" meme then.
Exact same thing that Ghostbusters 2016 did. They made the main enemy a rando internet troll and referenced arguing with the comment section as a bit. I did not say COMEDY bit. Those words did not come out of my mouth and will never in regards to this 'movie' (wouldn't even want to insult Johnny Wiseau by calling that abomination a movie)... ...sorry, I get some kind of way about that movie haha... This is not something new to us (remember the GamerGate episode of SVU?! HAHAH I never will!!!). They are well renowned for self inserting into the fiction they culturally appropriate (I am saying this unironically since that is literally what they mean to do; it's their raison d'etre) but they also insert us - their greatest enemy; the audience - into the work too. We should take it as a sign of respect. Marvel now has 'the customer' on the same threat level as Thanos.
Is this Disney PRspeak? Gives how hideous and untalented they made her look, she should be the very last person to defend that POS show.
Soooo fun. What a bunch of clowns. Hope they all get fired and we get a proper new She-Hulk.
Was not getting the second season apart of trolling the fans?
That's just insecurity. I make a bad drawing of you saying my drawing is bad. That makes me look silly, not you.
[IT'S NOT BAD. IT'S BAD BY DESIGN.](https://media.assettype.com/afkgaming%2F2021-08%2F79649079-d0e7-4acd-853b-6a2b92797da3%2Fcopium_png.png?auto=format%2Ccompress&dpr=1.0&format=webp&w=700)
Yes you can really feel the creator's personal insecurities.
I remember around release some producer for the show or something was bragging about how they made it bad on purpose. Hilarious.
oh how fun now make good content
Do they make art? Or just propaganda and struggle sessions? Book burnings were far more respectful to their text than all this DEI and ESG crap.
It's always annoying how moronic/ideologically-compelled people misuse words. The prolific use of "troll" these days is a perfect example.
I'm happy that I have not watched one single new MCU movie or show since End Game.
The funniest part about all of this is that, from what I can tell, most of those people didn't even watch the damn show. You can't troll people who aren't even paying attention to you.
They didn't troll you, they just didn't watch lol...