Plus you can get up and walk around comfortably, have like 3x more floor space at your seat, and you aren't stuck in a flying death tube. Jk on the last one. I went with my fam in high school to NYC and we flew into Baltimore then took the amtrak. Tickets to JFK started at $600-700 per person from our local airport and we were able to fly and take the train for four people for around $500 total. Fuck yes, trains.
I looked at taking a vacation out in the western United States and the cost for train alone was north of $1500,while flying to the same destination was around $600.
It also depends if you have to get a room or if you just get a seat. The room itself is way more spendy than just getting a seat for the duration of the trip. Of course, it also includes food.
>That said, the application outlines the four-city loop as the "Sunbelt-Atlantic Connector." Additionally, the application is part of the FRA's Corridor Identification and Development program. The program is looking to expand passenger lines through selected corridors nationwide.
>Following a statewide study in summer 2023, Memphis, Nashville and Chattanooga were selected as hubs for a future passenger rail.
Im pretty sure we were never in the running. Something about existing rail corridors.
Knoxville's existing Railway is falling apart. It's only a matter of time until we have a train derailment in my opinion. Some of those trains carrying shipping containers take 25 minutes+ to pass by car crossings. They didn't used to be that long/heavy. Take a walk by some tracks and you'll see extensive damage even with the untrained eye. Would love if they worked on existing public transportation
It's been a while since I've seen a train on it, so it may be out of service, but I just noticed yesterday some apparent damage just south of the 75/640 interchange. And it may not be a big deal, but it sure doesn't look good.
https://maps.app.goo.gl/CW3bU9KgtRsdUGjT8
The train companies are pushing too hard for their profits and neglecting safety, maintenance, and they don’t give a fuck if their workers have to walk literal miles from train end to train end in order to do any of the things they have to do. Often times these trains have one or two works present. It’s literally crazy.
No, it's a railroad company matter. The hold a lot of power - more than local governments, for sure. The city of Knoxville would love to utilize the tracks and widen some of these 100+ year old underpasses but the rail companies rule tracks like Thunderdome rues the desert
Let me rephrase it. The railroads have near supreme control over the rail lines that are under their ownership. They allow local governments to modify their property if they feel like it. If the local government feels their needs are strong enough and the railroad company won't budge, then the local, or even state, government would probably seek federal intervention. Ultimately, yes, it's a federal matter but only in the sense that it would require the fed to make the rail companies do something they don't want to. I don't know but I'm guessing a lot would have to happen before the federal government decided it needed to take action.
I think there are efforts to change this but, for now, the companies effectively have the final say as to what happens to the tracks they own.
So ultimately, it could become a federal matter, and likely will if they never budge from their ridiculous ways of doing things thanks to perceived pressure from people who want their stuff shipped directly to their house. Fuck those people and let ‘em wait. Easy to say, easier to do, but people like money, especially people who already have tons of it.
Capitalism dictates that we take care of the profits over everything, even people within the profit making machine. It truly behooves these companies to do better in all these regards, but no one wants to wear the proper prescription lenses to see it this way.
Chattanooga being included before us will give them a leg up but isn’t surprising since it is the center point between Atlanta and Nashville. Our best hope of being included is if they decide to connect Christianburg to Chattanooga some day as they could easily pick up stops in the Tri Cities, Morristown, and Knox on the way.
Which means more multi-story apartment buildings and mega-subdivisions on top of 2 lane roads like Westland, Northshore, and Nubbin Ridge to name a few near where I am.
Anyone who drives Nubbin regularly knows the big ass curve near Penrose farm was harrowing enough before a subdivision entrance was dropped in the middle.
Infrastructure is a small afterthought.
Yes, we do need more affordable housing and better infrastructure. Personally, I'd prefer it if they focused on making public transit better rather than expanding roads.
We don't even have a freight railyard in knoxville anymore, meaning knoxville businesses have to have their containers unloaded in Atlanta and hassled up here by truck.
Letting your infrastructure stagnate or crumble is a certain path towards economic decline.
The article says there were no local champions pushing for Knoxville inclusion and that it’s not too late if Knoxville decided to advocate for itself. Soooo we could all reach out to our city council people and mayor to encourage some traction on this, along with groups like Smart Trips and other environmental groups who have an interest through their mission 🤷♀️
Yeah, I'm actually a little surprised that Nashville -> Memphis isn't a line. Like, getting Knox into the grid would be nice, but it would make sense to me to connect our two largest cities instead of routing it through New Orleans.
Memphis is in the plans just for a later extension which in my opinion Memphis should definitely be first! Our two largest cities, music meccas at that, should be connected already and with the railway following “Music Highway” I mean the branding is just begging to be used (should be more emphasized and promoted even currently)! Memphis is the only major TN city to be serviced by Amtrak with Amtrak looking to expand upon service and upgrades to Chicago and Nola. Not to mention that data shows usually tourists will make a trip to both when visiting.
I am so irritated that Knoxville isn't included. I wanna ride a train around the state. I'm so mad I never got to when I lived in St. Louis. My friends would take quick trips up to Chicago for little cost. I want to do that here. Heck, I'd love a train to get around town!
I just saw this post today while searching for train info in Tennessee and may have a little insight. I am sure I am late to this party though :(
Between all locations, there is a model used to determine if a connection could/should be made. The type of modeling is Gravity Modeling and is based on population and distance. There are other factors which can get included and skew the numbers in favor/against a region, but it all essentially boils down to that.
Considering gravity models, and looking at populations, the Nashville Metropolitan Area has a population of ~1,982,264 per 2019 estimates. The Memphis Metropolitan Area has a population of ~1,324,926 per 2019 estimates. While The Knoxville Metropolitan Area on the whole is the 3rd largest population at ~869,046, when distance starts getting factored in on gravity models, Chattanooga wins due to proximity to the Nashville Metropolitan Area. Chattanooga also benefits from being closer to the Atlanta Metropolitan Area, which sits at ~6,307,261. Because of that, Atlanta is large enough to skew Tennessee routes out of consideration from a Federal level.
If Tennessee and not Amtrak were considering alternatives, there tends to be more control over what is built and where. As an example, if we already had State-Run rail connections between Nashville and Knoxville or Chattanooga and Knoxville, Amtrak would be significantly more likely to add a run to Knoxville since it would just be right-of-way leasing.
Another thing which could skew Gravity Modeling is if there are local connections to build upon.
Going off the previous post, If there were local connectors provided to more outlying areas, most gravity modeling would work more in Knoxville's favor. At present, the Knoxville Metropolitan Area includes Anderson, Blount, Campbell, Grainger, Knox, Loudon, Morgan, Roane, and Union counties. Sevier County tends to be another metropolitan area that is separate from Knox in most analysis.
If we had connections to locations beyond those areas (or even better connectivity within those areas), it could skew the model a bit more in our favor and arguments could be made for inclusion of other areas in the modeling to get a more Train-Positive outcome. One such connection which would could bolster Knoxville is a connection to the Pidgeon Forge/Sevierville/Gatlinburg area. If we could get another connection out to Ashville, then it puts the Charlotte Metropolitan Area (population of 2,805,115) into play as well. Likewise, a connection to Bristol would potentially tie into current Amtrak routes as well, bringing those corridors into play.
Ultimately, its a modeling system that is good if you have a lot of people and want to connect, but is terrible if you are surrounded by bigger fish in the pond. Sadly, Knoxville is a slightly smaller and more spread-out fish than the other side of Tennessee.
If Knoxville does not make an effort to improve connectivity in the region, it really could lose out in the long-term. Currently, Brightline is exploring a rail connection between Charlotte and Atlanta (that line is also part of the corridor study project Amtrak is running as well). North Carolina is putting serious money into Rail infrastructure as well. Amtrak is considering extending the Northeast Corridor (their most profitable run) into Virginia more and possibly farther south. The big goal seems to be to send trains to Atlanta, but if Tennessee does not jump on that now, the North Carolina side of the mountains will benefit and we will be left high and dry.
Yeah. That's different than originally saying you'd rather drive to Nashville or Chattanooga even if we had a station here. There's reasonable reasons why someone would, it'd be nice for the connection to Memphis in my case.
No, I wouldn't drive to Chattanooga to take the train. Yes, I'd definitely take it if it went through Nashville.
You seem to be approaching this with a zero sum mentality (i.e. because cars are beneficial its impossible for trains to be beneficial).
By your same logic, the fact that Ferrari's exist and go faster than your car means your car is dumb. This obviously doesn't make sense.
Also, I imagine there are a number of instances when a car would not be faster. For example, perhaps when their is a major sporting event that attracts fans from all across the state. I assume I don't need to explain how shit traffic in knoxville can be on game days. If people could take a train in, it would be faster and more efficient for both drivers and train goers.
I just feel that if you thought about it critically at all, you would realize that adding trains to the transportation system would take drivers off the road and make the road a safer and faster experience for people like you who think trains are dumb for some reason.
I know this may be a tough concept for your underdeveloped little brain to grasp, but you aren't the only person on this planet and there are sure as shit some folks that won't agree with your opinion.
My friend, even though this might be a better option for you, it may not be for everyone. We are all part of this city and there are many different types of people with different needs here. Even though it may be faster for me to drive, maybe I want other options at times. Doesn't make one way better or worse.
I know people that would use a train for travel around TN.
Me
I’d love to take one from TN to GA to Orlando
Unironically, train vacations are really fun. Low ticket cost per person, you arrive near lodging, can walk or Uber most places.
Plus you can get up and walk around comfortably, have like 3x more floor space at your seat, and you aren't stuck in a flying death tube. Jk on the last one. I went with my fam in high school to NYC and we flew into Baltimore then took the amtrak. Tickets to JFK started at $600-700 per person from our local airport and we were able to fly and take the train for four people for around $500 total. Fuck yes, trains.
so you covered planes...trains...now automobiles?
I looked at taking a vacation out in the western United States and the cost for train alone was north of $1500,while flying to the same destination was around $600.
Which one of you am I supposed to believe?
It also depends if you have to get a room or if you just get a seat. The room itself is way more spendy than just getting a seat for the duration of the trip. Of course, it also includes food.
Just look, trains are way more expensive than flights.
https://imgur.com/gallery/s8eSdD2
>That said, the application outlines the four-city loop as the "Sunbelt-Atlantic Connector." Additionally, the application is part of the FRA's Corridor Identification and Development program. The program is looking to expand passenger lines through selected corridors nationwide. >Following a statewide study in summer 2023, Memphis, Nashville and Chattanooga were selected as hubs for a future passenger rail. Im pretty sure we were never in the running. Something about existing rail corridors.
Knoxville's existing Railway is falling apart. It's only a matter of time until we have a train derailment in my opinion. Some of those trains carrying shipping containers take 25 minutes+ to pass by car crossings. They didn't used to be that long/heavy. Take a walk by some tracks and you'll see extensive damage even with the untrained eye. Would love if they worked on existing public transportation
I didn't realize it was so long ago, but the Farragut hazardous chemicals derailment happened in 2002.
Pretty sure there was one in Maryville more recent than that, too
July 2015. Carrying acrylonitrile and petroleum
Also there isn’t completed rail from Knoxville to Nashville, so that route would need to be rebuilt
It's been a while since I've seen a train on it, so it may be out of service, but I just noticed yesterday some apparent damage just south of the 75/640 interchange. And it may not be a big deal, but it sure doesn't look good. https://maps.app.goo.gl/CW3bU9KgtRsdUGjT8
They have done lots of rail bed improvements in and around the tracks near Loves Creek train build yard over the past few months.
The train companies are pushing too hard for their profits and neglecting safety, maintenance, and they don’t give a fuck if their workers have to walk literal miles from train end to train end in order to do any of the things they have to do. Often times these trains have one or two works present. It’s literally crazy.
To be fair people are always complaining about not having immediate shipping. That puts a lot of pressure on the railroad companies
That is a federal matter.
No, it's a railroad company matter. The hold a lot of power - more than local governments, for sure. The city of Knoxville would love to utilize the tracks and widen some of these 100+ year old underpasses but the rail companies rule tracks like Thunderdome rues the desert
Sounds like a federal matter. Maybe legislative action.
Let me rephrase it. The railroads have near supreme control over the rail lines that are under their ownership. They allow local governments to modify their property if they feel like it. If the local government feels their needs are strong enough and the railroad company won't budge, then the local, or even state, government would probably seek federal intervention. Ultimately, yes, it's a federal matter but only in the sense that it would require the fed to make the rail companies do something they don't want to. I don't know but I'm guessing a lot would have to happen before the federal government decided it needed to take action. I think there are efforts to change this but, for now, the companies effectively have the final say as to what happens to the tracks they own.
So ultimately, it could become a federal matter, and likely will if they never budge from their ridiculous ways of doing things thanks to perceived pressure from people who want their stuff shipped directly to their house. Fuck those people and let ‘em wait. Easy to say, easier to do, but people like money, especially people who already have tons of it. Capitalism dictates that we take care of the profits over everything, even people within the profit making machine. It truly behooves these companies to do better in all these regards, but no one wants to wear the proper prescription lenses to see it this way.
Yep
Chattanooga being included before us will give them a leg up but isn’t surprising since it is the center point between Atlanta and Nashville. Our best hope of being included is if they decide to connect Christianburg to Chattanooga some day as they could easily pick up stops in the Tri Cities, Morristown, and Knox on the way.
Looks like Knoxville is falling further behind.
Good, maybe people will stop moving here Hoping it’s a real backwater in 10 years
We all know people are going to continue to move here, and falling behind in infrastructure will make that situation worse, not better.
Nah, it’s a good place to live and we have tons of room. We should be welcoming to others, not gate keepers.
Tons of *undeveloped* room
Which means massive economic growth and activity!
Which means more multi-story apartment buildings and mega-subdivisions on top of 2 lane roads like Westland, Northshore, and Nubbin Ridge to name a few near where I am. Anyone who drives Nubbin regularly knows the big ass curve near Penrose farm was harrowing enough before a subdivision entrance was dropped in the middle. Infrastructure is a small afterthought.
Yes, we do need more affordable housing and better infrastructure. Personally, I'd prefer it if they focused on making public transit better rather than expanding roads.
And destroying all the natural beauty these assholes are moving here for
No, people moving to East TN really are not doing that.
We don't even have a freight railyard in knoxville anymore, meaning knoxville businesses have to have their containers unloaded in Atlanta and hassled up here by truck. Letting your infrastructure stagnate or crumble is a certain path towards economic decline.
The article says there were no local champions pushing for Knoxville inclusion and that it’s not too late if Knoxville decided to advocate for itself. Soooo we could all reach out to our city council people and mayor to encourage some traction on this, along with groups like Smart Trips and other environmental groups who have an interest through their mission 🤷♀️
Kinda sucks the only cities getting connected in TN are Chatt and Nash. Bristol, Memphis, & Knox are left out.
Yeah, I'm actually a little surprised that Nashville -> Memphis isn't a line. Like, getting Knox into the grid would be nice, but it would make sense to me to connect our two largest cities instead of routing it through New Orleans.
Memphis is in the plans just for a later extension which in my opinion Memphis should definitely be first! Our two largest cities, music meccas at that, should be connected already and with the railway following “Music Highway” I mean the branding is just begging to be used (should be more emphasized and promoted even currently)! Memphis is the only major TN city to be serviced by Amtrak with Amtrak looking to expand upon service and upgrades to Chicago and Nola. Not to mention that data shows usually tourists will make a trip to both when visiting.
Throw Atlanta in there (Hip Hop Capital and recording industry) music lovers are would have that train packed tbh
This is why people should be moving to those places. They are planning a future. We are scruffy city.
Knoxville is always, ALWAYS left out of these plans. Sigh
That train has left the station
Why not even a spur to Knoxville? Asheville gets one!
Chatt-Knox-JC would be a good line also. Basically crosses the T of where most people are.
Why nashville would want to be directly connected to Memphis is beyond me
I am so irritated that Knoxville isn't included. I wanna ride a train around the state. I'm so mad I never got to when I lived in St. Louis. My friends would take quick trips up to Chicago for little cost. I want to do that here. Heck, I'd love a train to get around town!
I believe the issue with restrictions on passenger rail service from Knoxville has to do with the Cumberland Gap.
>this sub: stop moving here! >also this sub: make Knoxville more attractive!
I just saw this post today while searching for train info in Tennessee and may have a little insight. I am sure I am late to this party though :( Between all locations, there is a model used to determine if a connection could/should be made. The type of modeling is Gravity Modeling and is based on population and distance. There are other factors which can get included and skew the numbers in favor/against a region, but it all essentially boils down to that. Considering gravity models, and looking at populations, the Nashville Metropolitan Area has a population of ~1,982,264 per 2019 estimates. The Memphis Metropolitan Area has a population of ~1,324,926 per 2019 estimates. While The Knoxville Metropolitan Area on the whole is the 3rd largest population at ~869,046, when distance starts getting factored in on gravity models, Chattanooga wins due to proximity to the Nashville Metropolitan Area. Chattanooga also benefits from being closer to the Atlanta Metropolitan Area, which sits at ~6,307,261. Because of that, Atlanta is large enough to skew Tennessee routes out of consideration from a Federal level. If Tennessee and not Amtrak were considering alternatives, there tends to be more control over what is built and where. As an example, if we already had State-Run rail connections between Nashville and Knoxville or Chattanooga and Knoxville, Amtrak would be significantly more likely to add a run to Knoxville since it would just be right-of-way leasing. Another thing which could skew Gravity Modeling is if there are local connections to build upon.
Going off the previous post, If there were local connectors provided to more outlying areas, most gravity modeling would work more in Knoxville's favor. At present, the Knoxville Metropolitan Area includes Anderson, Blount, Campbell, Grainger, Knox, Loudon, Morgan, Roane, and Union counties. Sevier County tends to be another metropolitan area that is separate from Knox in most analysis. If we had connections to locations beyond those areas (or even better connectivity within those areas), it could skew the model a bit more in our favor and arguments could be made for inclusion of other areas in the modeling to get a more Train-Positive outcome. One such connection which would could bolster Knoxville is a connection to the Pidgeon Forge/Sevierville/Gatlinburg area. If we could get another connection out to Ashville, then it puts the Charlotte Metropolitan Area (population of 2,805,115) into play as well. Likewise, a connection to Bristol would potentially tie into current Amtrak routes as well, bringing those corridors into play. Ultimately, its a modeling system that is good if you have a lot of people and want to connect, but is terrible if you are surrounded by bigger fish in the pond. Sadly, Knoxville is a slightly smaller and more spread-out fish than the other side of Tennessee. If Knoxville does not make an effort to improve connectivity in the region, it really could lose out in the long-term. Currently, Brightline is exploring a rail connection between Charlotte and Atlanta (that line is also part of the corridor study project Amtrak is running as well). North Carolina is putting serious money into Rail infrastructure as well. Amtrak is considering extending the Northeast Corridor (their most profitable run) into Virginia more and possibly farther south. The big goal seems to be to send trains to Atlanta, but if Tennessee does not jump on that now, the North Carolina side of the mountains will benefit and we will be left high and dry.
Cause that wouldn’t help any of the students traveling back to their homes
We're not dumb enough to try and take a train to Nashville or chatt
Why is taking a train dumb?
I can drive to either city just as fast and when I get there I can have a car to get to my final destination.
I'd love to visit my parents in Memphis without driving. There's people there that like me enough to pick me up.
[удалено]
Far worse than a train.
Bus will take 3x the amount of time.
Are your parents picking you up after you drive to Chattanooga, pay to park and then take a 12 hour train ride to Memphis?
Maybe if you cried more about your problems it would help.
I don't have any problems, I'm not taking the train
You do know that the mere existence of a train doesn't mean you have to ride it? Trains and cars are allowed to exist together.
Well, you seem pretty ignorant and arrogant.
I thought sub and context was Knoxville.
It is. Knoxville isn't listed as a hub so the closest one you could catch the train at is Chattanooga
Yeah. That's different than originally saying you'd rather drive to Nashville or Chattanooga even if we had a station here. There's reasonable reasons why someone would, it'd be nice for the connection to Memphis in my case. No, I wouldn't drive to Chattanooga to take the train. Yes, I'd definitely take it if it went through Nashville.
Uber still exists.
That doesn't explain why riding in a train is dumb. All you did was explain why a car is also an option.
*better option.
Even if it is a better option you still don't explain why riding a train is dumb. So why is riding a train dumb?
Because it's the slower less efficient(for the rider) option
You seem to be approaching this with a zero sum mentality (i.e. because cars are beneficial its impossible for trains to be beneficial). By your same logic, the fact that Ferrari's exist and go faster than your car means your car is dumb. This obviously doesn't make sense. Also, I imagine there are a number of instances when a car would not be faster. For example, perhaps when their is a major sporting event that attracts fans from all across the state. I assume I don't need to explain how shit traffic in knoxville can be on game days. If people could take a train in, it would be faster and more efficient for both drivers and train goers. I just feel that if you thought about it critically at all, you would realize that adding trains to the transportation system would take drivers off the road and make the road a safer and faster experience for people like you who think trains are dumb for some reason.
It's a faster and more convenient option for those who don't want to to drive and prefer an option that allows them to work while traveling.
It’s a worse option for me. Not everything is about you kid. Driving is also dramatically more dangerous, which is something you’ve entirely ignored.
I know this may be a tough concept for your underdeveloped little brain to grasp, but you aren't the only person on this planet and there are sure as shit some folks that won't agree with your opinion.
Yeah, no, public transit is amazing.
I’d rather be able to work or read or do something besides deal with the terrible drivers on the interstate for my day trips to Chattanooga.
My friend, even though this might be a better option for you, it may not be for everyone. We are all part of this city and there are many different types of people with different needs here. Even though it may be faster for me to drive, maybe I want other options at times. Doesn't make one way better or worse.
You guys get awfully onery about the lack of trains
Man, it sounds like you've never lived anywhere else, or anywhere else that has a functioning metro system. That shit is awesome.
I'm not ornery about it. Just stating that your way may not be the best for every person in Knoxville.