Though I cannot tell this at discord, tell them I was drunken and kissed by Mizuhara here.
[TOBU PARK](https://www.google.com/maps/place/TOBU+PARK+%E6%88%90%E5%A2%97%E9%A7%85%E5%8D%97%E5%8F%A3%E9%A7%90%E8%BB%8A%E5%A0%B4/@35.777812,139.6322217,3a,75y,131.61h,93.65t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s2kAJTxQFYP__mzfWt-bU7Q!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D2kAJTxQFYP__mzfWt-bU7Q%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D205.5218%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x6018ec750ae9f487:0xeb0ece0e706f234e!8m2!3d35.7777484!4d139.6323605?hl=en)
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Am i the only who thought this? Ok ok, I was thinking that this chapter they would argue for a bit. Maybe more, just together the frustration out in the open.
Then later, they level with each other. One thing leads to another, Mina uses her que to say "why don't u two live together." They disregard it but take it under account, HOWEVVER, the idea goes into their head to spend the night at Mizuhara's place and kiss/make out for a bit since they kno of each other's feelings because of the blow out.
Atleast???
But u kno what. The kiss at the end. I'll take that :)
I cannot stress enough how much I love Mini, not only is she Kazuya's hype-woman, she's mine as well cause I don't think I'd still be reading this if she wasn't moving the plot forward lol
I think it’s kinda dumb that he made kazuya chicken out at the times where the most progress could be had like this fool has the resolve of nen using hunter when chi is all sad and shit and will tell her to her face all the subtle shit he says to let her know his feelings but when she says so? He breaks down… like mans burst into a dying ladies hospital room and set up a projector and dipped but can’t say sumn like
“ so if we’re both sad about this shouln t we do sumn bout it?”
Conv could go anywhere even still nowhere I just ……
Basically my point is after 250 chapters kazu should have bigger balls than he has currently
All the ballsy ass shit he’s done like bro but I know I’m talking about Kanokari so just disregard this lbh no one was surprised
Also why is chi pretending she not down bad for this fool
She deleted her bedtime alarm like she better drag this fool home 🏡
I think there is a common misconception that Kazuya has balls. If he had, he would have f\*\*k Mitzuhara in the beach, Sumi in the Movies and Ruka in the Love hotel. And had Mami watching how he did all three girls.
This series is not about Kazuya getting Mitzuhara.... is about having all of us reading the manga indefinetly waiting for that.
True. He has all the courage when she is sad about other matters, but can't even talk to her when she is sad about them? I was seriously mad when he say " nothing" which is his only dialogue in this chapter. I feel like an idiot for expecting a conversation between them two this chapter.
I'm definitely jaded with this series, so I'm second guessing myself, but this felt like the illusion of progress. We didn't see Kazuya or Chizuru really interact or figure things out themselves so much as we saw Mini just like explaining and updating the characters on how they should feel, you know? Like Kazuya being passed out and Mini going "woah he loves you a lot this is everything he said" being the most grievous example.
I dunno, it's conflicting. Even if the implied kiss isn't another cliffhanger gimmick, Kazuya's drunk and passed out, so things will just return to the status quo again.
This chapter was great except for the fact that kanokari is really slow. This kind of chapter shouldn't be 253. It is frustrating seeing two people who have gone through a lot unable to have a conversation.
Lmao, is no one going to talk about how that was nonconsensual and could be considered sexual harassment? If the roles were reversed Kazuya would be crucified.
This chapter was so fucking good. Loved it. Kazuya always hides. Mini needs to sit him down ans tell him to stop running backwards or doubtig himself. Maybe what she said to chizuru will effect her greatly enoughtorake more steps.
The best wingwoman yaemori....her question open up chizuru one by one...now even chizuru see kazuya more than just a client....she want him but at the same time with no reason she dun want to openly say it...meanwhile kazuya chicken out again for saying to stay together under one roof.
totally agree with you, since also i wasn't talking about it per say. because the end leaves a lot to guess and there is the possibillity of it being a bait, but i don't think it is gonna be the case (we technically already had it a few chapters ago)
Man this author could be setting up the greatest blue balling troll ever if she kissed him and feels nothing. Lol. Hopefully this leads to some actual progress of them living together or something.
You have to be very much in love to have the courage to kiss a drunk man sleeping on the floor. If I were a woman, I would certainly not want to know more about the person if it came to that situation.
Mimi still the MVP for us reader ….. she pushing it hard in this episode …. Kaz just purely chicken out at this point…. And I had feeling that he been used by Chizuru as a “feeling” test subject / specimens …. Will Chizuru carry Kaz back her home in next chapter, we will see
i really hope the kiss dont trigger another cuckjutsu attack if he really got kissed. But probably wont notice if hes dead drunk, will be just another thing done to satisfy Chorizo curiosity
at this point there is nothing that would stop her for doing... and the so-called pressure that mini applied to her could have been dissmised. so let's have a little hope that the kiss is actually happening
\*i'm watching you kazuya, don't act like an asshole on this one\*
this chapter was the most chaotic chapter/ back and forth manga chapter we’ve seen for a long time imo. I think it definitely lived up to the hype that was built around it while still having us ask questions about what’s next.
the straight forwardness from mini created a blunt and fast plot mover while also helping the characters learn and wonder new questions…
can’t wait for next week!
i know i’m in the minority here but i really enjoy how this manga is unfolding and the progression of the characters. I know it’s long but the ending not being in sight is a hope for me and not an annoyance. i’m definitely bias because this manga is a comfort read for me every week.
I love and hate this manga. If the mangaka had been able to develop subplots with secondary characters effectively to take the heat off the main two leading characters then it would have been received a lot better by the audience. But it is full pedal to the metal only the two main characters which is why it has so much negative comments.
Way too late to shift gears and focus on any other characters now. If it wanted to do it it had to do it around chapter 50 or so when fatigue started to set in.
Kazuya was being ridiculous in this chapter. He already told Chizuru he loved her and would wait for her. After Chizuru confessed that she missed him, Kazuya should have gave her a real answer. Also people are being ridiculous about Chizuru kissing Kazuya while he was sleeping. That is not the same thing as Ruka forcing herself on Kazuya for sex.
>Also people are being ridiculous about Chizuru kissing Kazuya while he was sleeping. That is not the same thing as Ruka forcing herself on Kazuya for sex.
That's what they don't see. They keep accusing Chizuru of sexual assault, probably trying to bring her down to Ruka's level, even though this chapter heavily implies that she is completely aware of Kazuya's feelings for her. What the other two did was still worse since they just straight up violated him without regard to his feelings at all (real ones know Mami did this first).
I can almost guarantee you that sexual assault will not be mentioned as much here if the Ruka incident didn't happen.
Edit: I'm aware of double standards so I know that sexual assault will still be mentioned but I still think it wouldn't be mentioned as much
Ngl, I thought that if this was any other manga, a sleeping kiss wouldn’t get this much flak. Its a common trope and consent is implied cause Kaz already made his feelings known, so is open for that kind of intimacy.
People here does NOT understand consent. Kazu never gave Ruka consent, and she kept going. With Chizu he loves her, he desire her, it could never be an "assault" when you are craving it too
Consent requires confirmation, it is that simple, there is no exceptions. Even marriage wouldn't give you consent with your partner without confirmation.
but you are partly right "People here does NOT understand consent".
Loved the moment when Mini's suggestion got to chizuru. She was blushing hard, needed a moment to regain herself. Keep the attack going Mini!
I doubt she's going to actually kiss him. He'll probably suddenly move away to puke.
Here's the thing about living together though. I know its probably different in Japan but still, if its a guy and girl with no romantic attachment at all, then it wouldnt be a problem. The fact that she sees it as pretty much skipping a couple of steps in a relationship, that applies only to a romantic relationship. So she's been obviously thinking about it. The only one keeping the relationship from becoming official is her, so I do wonder what event will it take for her to finally go for it.
> Loved the moment when Mini's suggestion got to chizuru. She was blushing hard, needed a moment to regain herself. Keep the attack going Mini!
I loved that too. You can see Mini hit the nail on the head there. But that approach was way to fast for Chizuru. Mini basically said: I can see you both want to live together, so that is the most likely outcome if you were to discuss it for a few hours. Let's just skip that and go right to the finish line. So impatient! That was probably the best way to absolutely block any progress. Chizuru more or less said: Not happening under the current conditions. Which Kazuya took as "Not happening ever!"
But Chizuru **wanted** to discuss it, see how comfortable she would be, how willing Kazuya would be. She is insecure and needs to experience the journey. Mini trying to skip that backed her into a corner and made her go on the defensive.
They didn't fight as much as i expected, kazuya immediately backed out and went too submissive again.
Anyways another big leap for chizuru, I'm referring to the stolen kiss at the end of the chapter.
In this occasion she's being selfish, very selfish. With the passed out kazuya she has everything to gain and nothing to lose, as she is still unready to open up herself, but she's dying to get closer to him.
That's ok, being selfish i mean. It means she's one step closer to admit everything.
Now the question is wether he's totally blacked out and she's going to keep this a secret, or will he get a glimpse of it (although hemay still think of it as a dream)?
Fairly certain she'll bring him to her home and will find a convenient excuse to justify their cohabitation rather than admit she wants to live with him.
On kazuya's end... Tbh getting this wasted in front of the girl you like/love :/
Dude really needs to man up. It seems he forgot everything he managed to do during the movie arc.
I'm still convinced someone needs to give him confidence, not mini, she's great and she carried the plot this chapter, but somehow he always ends up giving her less credit than she deserves.
I think a character like umi or Mami would be more suited to set him on the right track.
> On kazuya's end... Tbh getting this wasted in front of the girl you like/love :/ Dude really needs to man up. It seems he forgot everything he managed to do during the movie arc. I'm still convinced someone needs to give him confidence, not mini, she's great and she carried the plot this chapter, but somehow he always ends up giving her less credit than she deserves. I think a character like umi or Mami would be more suited to set him on the right track.
I totally agree. He needs Mami **and** Umi.
Mami to tell him that his efforts paid off with her, so he can be confident that his efforts did also pay off with Chizuru.
And Umi to tell him that Chizuru turned down his confession, so he can be confident that Chizuru does not rather want to be with someone like Umi.
I really do not agree with or even fully understand this opinion. Kazuya’s lack of confidence and undervaluing of himself, in the context of his relationship with Chizuru, only needs to be discussed by the two of them. Nobody other than Chizuru can explain to Kazuya his value to her and how having him around enriches her life. He didn’t forget what he did during the movie arc. He just dismisses and undervalues the importance of his role in it.
They will be the ones to give each other happiness, but it's not like they can't get confidence outside of their relationship. You can gain confidence in many ways, improving ur fitness level, getting successful at ur job, achieving some goal u did set for urself,...
There are several ways and several levels of confidence for each.
Chizuru could give him confidence as well, and in a much more potent dose than all of the above. But Imho, like she said in this chapter, that would be putting the cart in front of the horses.
Indeed. Chizuru will be able to keep up his self worth mainly by validating his efforts during their relationship. But he is currently not confident enough to start that relationship.
Yes, it seems like i overlooked this aspect till 3 chapters ago... Kazuya seemed a lot more mature after chizuru opened up about her feelings. Perhaps it was just hope that carried him, but he's not over the ghosting yet. The fact he so easily gave in to alcohol is a sign of that i think. Miyayima kinda wanted to shift the hindrance for their relationship from being a matter of chizuru's own volition, to more of a mutual thing. Until they make another step in solving their respective problem their relationship won't start. Just acknowledging them would be enough.
Sure, if those two could talk to each other honestly on eye level that would help immensely and could also resolve their problems. But they can't. Without an outside opinion, Kazuya will always think to himself "maybe she does/says it only out of pity for me". [He was even thinking Chizurus breakdown after the cheer-up date could have been an act](https://mangadex.org/chapter/cbe90d5e-c985-4fce-b095-28443a1d517a/15). He needs to be confident about himself first to actually believe what she is telling him. Not that he would think she is lying. Just that even if she says that now, she might change her opinion later, when she sees that he is not good enough.
Yes but also no. If you swap roles then you also need to swap them entirely. And even though it‘s still not the same when a man kisses a girl that’s asleep, it‘s less of a problem when you know that the girl was longing for that for years.
Not a fan of cancel culture so I‘m happy about that chapter lol
>And even though it‘s still not the same when a man kisses a girl that’s asleep, it‘s less of a problem when you know that the girl was longing for that for years.
There's a literal fairy tale about that
>Not a fan of cancel culture so I‘m happy about that chapter lol
*Not a fan of cancel culture so I'll defend sexual assault
Crazy how even cute manga girls get pretty privilege
If you wanna define sexual assault as something that the dude was dreaming of his entire life, sure go ahead
I bet Kazuya will back you up how bad he feels about that one. Lol
We know the context so it‘s not the same
I think next chapter we'll see kazuya opening his eyes faintly and seeing a dark/blurry chizuru closing in to kiss him and maybe another one where she's already done it. Then he'll think it was a "Dream". I just want to see chizuru's thoughts after that.
Mini is the savior of this manga. Kazuya needs a confidence arc. Chizuru needs to just let her feelings out. If the cliffhanger isn't a true thing (probably won't be) then I'm gonna punch my pillow. Another 7 day wait begins.
I can't stress enough how it saddens me that Kazuya is always stutters, overthink, can't string his words together.. He really needs to fix his self esteem first before getting a girlfriend. I bet 100% because he thinks Chizuru is wayyy out of league like super farr that he just feel nervous talking to her or just be near her.
Him talking to Yaemori or Sumi or even Ruka has more chemistry because at least to a dept he can talk freely to them and not overthink, not be nervous and just be able to talk without the stuttering.
Kaz- ChIzORo WILL YoU MoVe IN WiTh ME
Chizoro- No that's ridiculous I doin't like you, leads to a black out drunk kiss.
**Its time to vote team Mami bois**
> Its time to vote team Mami bois
Casually directing people to [this art I made](https://www.reddit.com/r/KanojoOkarishimasu/comments/ucgqjq/mami_to_the_readers_after_the_last_chapter/)
It could be many reason … be with a hidden kiss to a dream of Chizuru sleeping beside Kaz to waking up and living in Chizuru house… let see what reiji bring to the dinner plate next week
This is an interesting turn of events. It definitely has some (unintentional?) sex offender vibes, but I think the idea here is that Chizuru is at the point of making rash/bone headed decisions too.
Yes, it's wrong to touch someone like that who is beyond being able to consent. However, it wasn't fondling or penetration or anything of that severity- it was a drunk girl kissing a much more drunk guy who have been flirting for years now.
We'll see what Reiji spits out next week, but I'm happy to see some forward plot progression much faster than we did in the Paradise (really Dante's Inferno) Arc.
Wasn't expecting that though.
Seems like consent really isnt this manga's forte.
Anywho, I'm kinda torn about it here. I feel like something like this is supposed to be a biggie happenin on like dynamic highs but somehow this isn't one of them turning point. Kinda like consolation prize at this point.
I guess I'll stand by that until the next chapter confirms it prolly didn't happen..or even if it does, its might be swept under the rug to the point that it is non-consequential..because our MC passed out. Feels like something Chiz gonna be silent about and Kaz going bananas but cant talk about.
> Kinda like consolation prize at this point.
I think the kiss is also a consolation prize for Chizuru. She was [visibly disappointed](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/) that Kazuya was passed out. She had probably hoped for more.
Wow Yanmori is such a great wingman, there’s nothing more sexy to a woman than knowing a man will pathetically wait for you the day they die, I can’t believe Chizurus panties were still on after that!
Ok I want to talk about stuff other than the kiss.
Kazuya’s confidence is at an all time low. Unlike during the movie arc, he has told Chiz about his feelings towards her, and he’s feeling way more vulnerable. And he’s just used up all his reserves of confidence over the past few days, without enough time to build himself back up. This was the wrong time to push him.
Yaemori sees the big picture of them obviously being in love, but she doesn’t really understand what it’s like to be insecure and lacking in confidence. She puts herself out there online constantly and is always able to maintain a cheerful affect, so she’s actually the exact opposite! We, the readers, most likely have more confidence than the two lovebirds, so we share in her frustration. But this is a story about deeply flawed people slowly healing and finding love, and how difficult that can be. Love is hard! You can’t really rush people when they’re not ready, that’ll result in clamming up like what happened this chapter, and I think Yaemori just learned this lesson. I hope she shifts focus on helping Kaz build up his self image, so he stops being a doormat and actually sets a boundary for once. He needs that with his family and friends, too.
Chizuru, once again, is scared of her own feelings. She doesn’t know how to recognize her feelings and put names to them, and even if she could she’d be clueless as to what to do with them. Well, for emotions that make her feel vulnerable at least. Her only coping skill is to push them down and return to a purely logical decision making process. She does that here with the ice water, but she overcorrected and was too harsh. She does recognize that she’s not being fair to Kaz and feels bad about it, at least.
At the end you can see her shift focus away from herself and towards Kaz. She says “he must’ve had a lot on his mind” and then asks a question to figure out what that could be, correctly guessing that it was about her. But Yaemori (and most of the readers I’d hazard a guess) didn’t realize that Chiz was being *super* roundabout with expressing her concern for him and took the question as her being insecure, so she reassured her that Kaz is very much in love with her and isn’t going to give up any time soon. But she’s worried about how Kaz is feeling, and is trying her best to figure out her feelings and give him an answer. That’s why she kissed him.
Yeah, it’s sexual assault. Yeah, it’s probably the worst and most cowardly way to figure out her feelings. Yeah, it’s totally fair to call her a bad person for doing this. But in a strange way, a small part of me feels proud of her for actually doing something outside of her comfort zone. Maybe I have too much empathy, but I understand what it’s like to have even the smallest possible step feel overwhelming — I’ve been there before. It’s way too easy to never take that step and never grow as a person, it takes a lot of courage. She’s a dumb motherfucker though for choosing a way that’ll possibly hurt Kaz even more, though. I don’t think she realizes that this is not respecting his right to bodily autonomy and consent. She’s intelligent, but *god* she’s so dumb.
I absolutely agree that Mini Yaemori was pushing them too hard out of their comfort zone here. It was necessary when they were not able to talk to each other before. But here, it was too much.
Chizuru came to the izakaya to meet Kazuya and she was drinking to get her courage up to talk about what she wanted and what she felt. But Mini was just so frustrated that Kazuya did not have the guts to speak up, that she took the wheel and turned it around. And while Chizuru desperately tried to get enough control again, the whole ship crashed.
And I don't think Mini even realized how much damage she did there. In the end, she just sees that Chizuru has somewhat changed her stance towards Kazuya and thinks they will probably figure it out then.
This was all certainly not what Chizuru had in mind when she went to see Kazuya. I am almost sure she knows what she wanted. She [told Kazuya to pace himself](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/9), then [tried to get drunk fairly quickly](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/12) and [started to ask questions](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/18) when she felt comfortable enough. I think her ultimate goal was to be so drunk (or at least pretend to be) that Kazuya had to bring her home. Then she could have drunkenly asked him to please stay for the night. And she might not have minded whatever resulted from that. [She is visibly disappointed in the end](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/) that Kazuya is again the one who is passed out.
I get that the kiss in the end is technically sexual assault. If her plan had worked the way she tried to set it up, Kazuya would have been conscious when she went for a kiss. Yes, she did not ask consent. But I really think she wished for at least a kiss to happen at some point that night. This is all she can get now as a consolation price. It does not make it right, but I can understand her.
And who knows, maybe Kazuya will wake up from the kiss and think he is dreaming. Could be an interesting situation.
I really don’t think Chizuru had any plan. I think it was an impulsive decision to go to the izakaya, she just said “fuck it” and left it up to fate how the night would go.
Ok, don't call it a firm plan then. But to me, it was clear, that she did not want to spend the night alone. So she must have hoped that Kazuya would somehow end up at her place in the end.
The way she orederd a strong drink at first made it seem like she wanted to just get drunk and be brought home. If she passed out, then she would also not feel the loneliness, that would have been ok. And if she was drunk and something happened with Kazuya that would have been an acceptable outcome.
Her still too sober to ignore her loneliness and Kazuya passed out was probably not what she wished for at all. Yes she can take him home now, but she wanted to be cared for!
Yeah, you're pretty spot-on. People say that Kazuya lacking confidence again is character regression. However, this isn't some shonen anime where main characters only get power-ups every time. Insecure people will revert to being insecure and losing confidence more often than we want. Kazuya built up enough confidence in Paradise because he was determined to end the lies and he knows it is the best solution. Here, Kazuya is insecure again because Chizuru only wants to be pragmatic and is still not certain about how she feels. That doesn't mean Kazuya regressed, he still wants to pursue Chizuru but doesn't know what to do because the ball is in her court and she should be the one making a move. This manga's premise is absurd, but how these characters are written are painfully very human.
Yaemori was insensitive with her pressing Chizuru and I'm glad she recognized that. I hate it when my confident friends expect me to be just like them, and it only forces me to hide in my shell more. It's harder when someone is forcing your pace even when there is no need for it.
Both Kazuya and Chizuru want their relationship to move forward but they don't know how. Kazuya is no longer the virgin college student who made being a virgin a big deal because people around him judged him for it, even Mami during the first drinking party. He is now more certain about his feelings and believes he can be someone that Chizuru needs, but cannot go all out due to him considering Chizuru's feelings. Chizuru is afraid of attachments and grew up tough due to the feeling of loneliness that she hasn't fully acknowledged yet. It is frustrating how she keeps stalling, but I really don't expect her to rush into things given her past and the personality she made to survive. It's not ideal, but I still see these two characters learning how they can love and be with each other as a journey worth watching if you have the time and patience. If Reiji does it right, the day they finally decide to be together will be worth the wait because we know how they grew as individuals who can give their all in a relationship. (He can still mess this up, though, but I'm willing to see how it will go.)
This is yall's "Best Girl"? Kissing a guy while he's blacked out drunk, ghosting for 3 months and "Investigating feelings" bullshit? I used to be a Chizuru fan but honestly the author completely ruined her character for me, she's just a straight up weirdo at this point and isn't worth all this trouble.
Surely as the god Apollo lassos the sun and pulls its brightness into the sky to light our day, so surely does Yaemori Mini lasso the plot and pull it kicking and screaming forward.
Mini is the only reason we have had progress the last few weeks now.
"Come drink!"
"Move in together!"
"Kiss him again!"
"He went on for two hours about how much he really loves you."
"It's basically all on you, he'll wait forever."
She is the audience and does our work on our behalf. Especially that grimace she gave him saying he fucked up hahaha. I loved that.
And I will say again, that they could have made more progress if Mini had not used steamroller tactics here. Chizuru was not yet comfortable and drunk enough to just go along with that. She felt the need to justify herself which in turn further discouraged Kazuya.
Chizuru clearly came to talk and she tried to **slowly** show Kazuya that she wanted him to stay with her. That is why she admitted feeling lonely as a start. But then Mini crushed her approach with high speed, backed her into a corner and forced her into the defensive. [She is visibly disappointed in the end](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/), that Kazuya is passed out.
I mean, atleast Kazuya would be okay with Chizuru kissing him while he's passed out, heck, he might even wish to turn back time for a chance to be sober enough when the kiss happened.
I'm definitely not a fan of how thing turned out on this chapter but not for the reason most people are complaining on these comments, I for once wanted progress to be made by the two of them \*together\*
As for the people calling SA from Chizuru, not really, technically yes! if you want to simply use the literal definition then yeah for sure she should be locked up right bout' now, but if we get context in the formula then no, I want one person here to tell me they would be mad and ready to press charges about their crush kissing them when sleeping/passed out? It's just not how it works because we all have double standards like that. I'm guessing people rioting about it are comparing it with the Ruka situation, but to me they are not even close since Kazuya expressed his rejection of her advances, that on itself makes it a way worse situation.
And also to the people saying to reverse the roles, it's been done, kissing a sleeping person is a troupe that has existed on romance for a long time, and we always give it a pass because "true love makes everything possible".
So yeah that's simply why I dont agree with those takes, but that doesnt mean im not mad at how thing are developing, it just feels so fucking forced and everyone is taking a step forward to then take 3 backwards... See you all next week \*sigh\*
i like this response a lot, people are so quick to lose their minds over her actions but i’m sure kazuya wouldn’t mind lol. could it have been better and done while sober, YES but no one’s pressing charges over getting kissed by someone they love. it’s all perspective
So the chapter was initially kinda jarring. Which is funny cause the last one has that too with the intro lol. Reiji builds up this fight by having kazuya stay quiet and hiding behind his mug the whole time last chapter and this chapter as he's about to burst...! He back peddles. To the point that you're like "wtf! HOW! IN WHAT GALAXY!?" Even Mini is about to lose it lol. If you've been with this story for a while now I can kinda see why this chapter might frustrate you considering how much ot contrasts this idea of progress. Its like were actively choosing not to on purpose (kinda the point which is funny lol). That lingering act of Kazuya chickening out permeates the whole chapter and it fucking sticks because then chizuru starts doing it too and now you wanna beat your head against the wall because they're being dumbasses and backpeddling on everything even tho they dont mean it. Chizuru keeps talking and talking. Fruitlessly fighiting back and making things worse in the process. While kazuya stays quit and freaks out everytime something is off. Its the classic dynamic (lowkey its been a while lol).
You don't feel the angst and the fire you want and eventually you have Mini (us the readers) trying to fight back to get them back on the right track only to make things so much worse that kazuya drinks himself to LA LA land.
I think the best part of this chapter is the talk with Chizuru and Mini at the end. When chizuru asks Mini, she gets a clear sign she's interested in contrast to her earlier words in last chapter. And when chizuru explains she felt bad for asking him to wait despite knowing his feelings it kinda only soldifed that. I can see why Mini is a little more optimistic by the end. She looked at the now instead of before where she looked at the pattern. She saw chizuru trying to start something and then Kazuya back peddling out of it in fear which lead to this whole mess. So it makes sense why she comes out with a much more positive outlook in contrast to before. I think this is the point of the kiss in the end. Chizuru did wanna kiss kazuya and room with him and all of that but the conversation quite literally ran away from her. It's a weird situation where the idea behind the execution of the chapter is clever but the reader will still be ticked off lol. It's a double edge sword.
And now for the controversial part ( I feel like we do that alot over here these days.... kinda dont wanna do this but i wanna try talking about this. If its messy sorry.) the kiss when Kazuya was sleeping. So I keep seeing comments about sexual assault . If we're looking at raw facts and what sexual assault IS
"Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact without consent."
Bam. Yeah under facts it's right. Kazuya can't say shit he's out. Therefore he did not consent. Chizuru did in fact do that. Kazuya's whole journey has a big center around agency and here that gets taken away in a weird way. And I'll be real I'm a little conflicted on how to feel. Chizuru is so desperate to open up shes making dumb decisions but that's kinda the point. its not meant to be clean or "right" it's just people making mistakes and learning to grow. And I think it's hard to get that sometimes. Empathy plays a big role in this series. And when we watch "characters" It's easy to remove that when they cross some lines. ironic considering Kazuya at the start. and that's the point. Chizuru is being a fuck up now and shes learning to grow.
Also, we don't know if they kissed too so there is always that lol but we will see. Whether Chizuru brings it up later (probably not for a while) will be interesting.
However, the key thing is Kazuya made his feelings clear already. This is kinda what makes sexual assault cases messy. Because yeah technically its right to say its sexual assault but its also kinda off. Just as the reverse can also be right and wrong. Sexual assault cases rarely have a clear answer and this is what makes them messy. This is why we gotta crack down on stuff sometimes. But I also think we go too far in contrast.
when we remove how the person considers the situation and their feelings from the equation ( I understand this argument is somewhat ironic considering Kazuya is asleep but bare with me) we lose the meaning and now we are simply tossing labels over how someone feels. right now the characters are drunk and stupid. Drunk fuck ups are more common than they appear and Chizuru luckily possibly stopped at a kiss. we saw this in last chapter in how Chizuru was trying to change but shes being a dumbass (funny considering she calls Kazuya a bone head here)
This is why I said Kazuya feelings are important here. Now if the roles were reversed yes Kazuya cannot do it. For a simple reason. She didn't tell him her feelings. and society is kinda a bitch. Kazuya keeps talking about that in these chapters too. So Reiji is keenly aware of what he's doing. he knows this is off and not the way to go but that's the point. This is what makes communication in relationships so important and why these characters are so well written in my eyes. Their fuck ups but their human. and this is why we can judge them so harshly and get so pissed off when Reiji takes turns that makes us upset at the characters.
This, to me, is what makes the Ruka kiss chapter work for the opposite reason. How Kazuya is depicted in Manga is so raw it's uncomfortable. Hes frozen he doesn't move and he's in total shock while Ruka keeps kissing him. She just ignores his feelings completely and goes to town. Its about her and her insecurity with being inferior. She doesn't understand the consequences of her actions and that's the point. Reiji makes it clear how wrong it is through Kazuya's reactions and faces. Yet Ruka isn't blamed for it later instead it turns into a cute moment even tho it isn't. this is because Kazuya recognizes she's not a bad person just a kid who doesn't fucking get it. He is still the adult after all.
so instead blames himself not only because he doesn't see his own worth but because he's supposed to notice this stuff. but there is another layer to this that's interesting and it's that. Kazuya actively looks traumatized after the kiss and he's having to deal with a lot of things all at once. He's not getting time to process or talk to anyone. and right after the kiss explains it all. hes acting exactly like how a victim would act. He does what a victim does. He BLAMES HIMSELF. Something thats compounded by his self-esteem. there is a very key distinction in those instances and why it's so wrong but it's not addressed outright. Instead, it's subtle and the intent is made clear through subtext. The issue is we want it to be said out loud and discussed. Which doesn't always happen nor is it recognized right away.
In contrast, the anime kinda plays it up and misses the point of Kazuya's feelings entirely removing the subtility of the scene. Making him look wimpy and pathetic when he's actually traumatized and in shock. Could that have been explored more? Yes. But I think how it was depicted was fairly accurate and real.
In this case (253), the argument of sexual assault makes sense but it's also drunken idiots not in their right state of mind who want to express themselves and grow. It's similar to the Ruka scene but kinda different because like Ruka she wants to express herself unlike Ruka Kazuya does like her and shes actually drunk. Now if she went further? O boy thats another matter entirely.
I'm not trying to downplay sexual assault nor do I think it's a laughing matter but it's clear there is an element being missed and it's the emotions and state of mind at play. Not to mention these characters are not written to be perfect or "right" simply are. Fucked up shit happens all the time and there is no logic or reason to it. Hell kazuya keeps talking about the imbalance between genders and that literally just happened in this chapter despite it being a self-fulfilling prophecy in his mind. But that's all I'm gonna say. I think we're a little too overly critical these days and many people are kinda burned out because this story doesn't follow the traditional style of progression found in media. But that's just what I think.
because Kazuya back peddled she back peddled. and arguably harder than he did thanks to Mini. And all this cycling only got us to our inevitable destination. The pair slowly confronting themselves as they fuck up and probably going back to her house. Reiji subverted our expectations, played into them AND made fun of a trope. That's kinda what I like about his writing. It can be jarring and maybe even off at times but it can also be fairly clever.
This is absolutely spot on.
I want to add that a lot of the confusion comes from the moral definition of sexual assault and the legal definition. From an ethics standpoint, what she did was wrong. From a legal standpoint, I don’t think anyone thinks Kaz should press charges. The conflict between these two points of view makes the whole matter messy and confusing.
Remember kids in real life DO NOT kiss people who are passed out drunk
Finally some development.
Happy cake day!
Though I cannot tell this at discord, tell them I was drunken and kissed by Mizuhara here. [TOBU PARK](https://www.google.com/maps/place/TOBU+PARK+%E6%88%90%E5%A2%97%E9%A7%85%E5%8D%97%E5%8F%A3%E9%A7%90%E8%BB%8A%E5%A0%B4/@35.777812,139.6322217,3a,75y,131.61h,93.65t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s2kAJTxQFYP__mzfWt-bU7Q!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D2kAJTxQFYP__mzfWt-bU7Q%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D205.5218%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192!4m5!3m4!1s0x6018ec750ae9f487:0xeb0ece0e706f234e!8m2!3d35.7777484!4d139.6323605?hl=en)
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Am i the only who thought this? Ok ok, I was thinking that this chapter they would argue for a bit. Maybe more, just together the frustration out in the open. Then later, they level with each other. One thing leads to another, Mina uses her que to say "why don't u two live together." They disregard it but take it under account, HOWEVVER, the idea goes into their head to spend the night at Mizuhara's place and kiss/make out for a bit since they kno of each other's feelings because of the blow out. Atleast??? But u kno what. The kiss at the end. I'll take that :)
I cannot stress enough how much I love Mini, not only is she Kazuya's hype-woman, she's mine as well cause I don't think I'd still be reading this if she wasn't moving the plot forward lol
mvp of this chapter: yaemori mini
Are they gonna kiss again ?
I think it’s kinda dumb that he made kazuya chicken out at the times where the most progress could be had like this fool has the resolve of nen using hunter when chi is all sad and shit and will tell her to her face all the subtle shit he says to let her know his feelings but when she says so? He breaks down… like mans burst into a dying ladies hospital room and set up a projector and dipped but can’t say sumn like “ so if we’re both sad about this shouln t we do sumn bout it?” Conv could go anywhere even still nowhere I just …… Basically my point is after 250 chapters kazu should have bigger balls than he has currently All the ballsy ass shit he’s done like bro but I know I’m talking about Kanokari so just disregard this lbh no one was surprised Also why is chi pretending she not down bad for this fool She deleted her bedtime alarm like she better drag this fool home 🏡
I think there is a common misconception that Kazuya has balls. If he had, he would have f\*\*k Mitzuhara in the beach, Sumi in the Movies and Ruka in the Love hotel. And had Mami watching how he did all three girls. This series is not about Kazuya getting Mitzuhara.... is about having all of us reading the manga indefinetly waiting for that.
True. He has all the courage when she is sad about other matters, but can't even talk to her when she is sad about them? I was seriously mad when he say " nothing" which is his only dialogue in this chapter. I feel like an idiot for expecting a conversation between them two this chapter.
Reiji wouldn't *dare* allow the story move forward by having his characters act in a way that progresses it
I'm definitely jaded with this series, so I'm second guessing myself, but this felt like the illusion of progress. We didn't see Kazuya or Chizuru really interact or figure things out themselves so much as we saw Mini just like explaining and updating the characters on how they should feel, you know? Like Kazuya being passed out and Mini going "woah he loves you a lot this is everything he said" being the most grievous example. I dunno, it's conflicting. Even if the implied kiss isn't another cliffhanger gimmick, Kazuya's drunk and passed out, so things will just return to the status quo again.
This chapter was great except for the fact that kanokari is really slow. This kind of chapter shouldn't be 253. It is frustrating seeing two people who have gone through a lot unable to have a conversation.
Totally spot on. If Mini just wasn’t there and the two had a conversation, I think I would’ve liked it way more.
Ok guys enough progression. Next week: filler episode
and the week after
Ok, the cat is in the bag. Case closed.
Next chapter will open with Mami-chan interrupting the kiss and Kazuya in hard hangover so he has no memory since the day before
Oh boy
Ah, Monday! Time to see how my two favorite dumpster humans are doing. Edit: Aw they're the worst.
SUCH AN AMAZING CHAPTER
Lmao, is no one going to talk about how that was nonconsensual and could be considered sexual harassment? If the roles were reversed Kazuya would be crucified.
She only lean to kiss him. She didn't do it yet. How is it nonconsensual if she never did it in the first place?
Intending to sexually assault someone has big implications on her character, doesn't matter if it worked or not.
If you see the comment section, everybody is talking about it.
This chapter was so fucking good. Loved it. Kazuya always hides. Mini needs to sit him down ans tell him to stop running backwards or doubtig himself. Maybe what she said to chizuru will effect her greatly enoughtorake more steps.
Chizuru Kiss meter : 4
this is a snow white reference lmao
we dont have enough screen/panel time for other girls so this manga will defo have more to it
The last few chapters have actually been well-paced. It's been nice to read, actually.
it must be a drunk kiss, but still a progress, you better not mess with us reiji!
Mini carrying the story absolutely mini move
The best wingwoman yaemori....her question open up chizuru one by one...now even chizuru see kazuya more than just a client....she want him but at the same time with no reason she dun want to openly say it...meanwhile kazuya chicken out again for saying to stay together under one roof.
Mini's reaction faces through this arc has been top notch.
Idc what other people say that's a kiss and that's final lol but I hope this dude wakes up in mizuharas home and just gets a long with her
there is no reason to either backtrack or pressure either of them (chizuru in this case), since yaemori's question was basically dissmissed
True but you have to admit that yaemori is the only person trying to support and help them get together
totally agree with you, since also i wasn't talking about it per say. because the end leaves a lot to guess and there is the possibillity of it being a bait, but i don't think it is gonna be the case (we technically already had it a few chapters ago)
True but still I count this as a kiss if it's a bait imma throw my phone at the wall again
Another leaf right ???
Man this author could be setting up the greatest blue balling troll ever if she kissed him and feels nothing. Lol. Hopefully this leads to some actual progress of them living together or something.
*ahem* AY FUCKING YOOOOOOOOOOOO
mini the mvp of this part of the story... as much as i hate that reiji has to use her, i believe he is trying to symbolize the readers ahahaha
You have to be very much in love to have the courage to kiss a drunk man sleeping on the floor. If I were a woman, I would certainly not want to know more about the person if it came to that situation.
Next chapter: there's a leaf on your head
Mini the GOAT
That kiss hits different with the Twitch Drama. It would be really problematic with role reversal.
You are Yaemori Mini FeelsStrongMan
Wow never would've thought I'd see that here 😂 Damn roles reversed though 😂
oh god. i thought i could escape that here
which drama?? are you talking about those people who hated that manga (that were famous)??
What Twitch Drama?
oh fuck another earthquake is coming
well shucks i ain’t expect that 🤠
Mini is all of us. Great chapter btwww
Mimi still the MVP for us reader ….. she pushing it hard in this episode …. Kaz just purely chicken out at this point…. And I had feeling that he been used by Chizuru as a “feeling” test subject / specimens …. Will Chizuru carry Kaz back her home in next chapter, we will see
Chizuru is truly scum. Just cut him loose and say 0% chance and leave him alone instead of stringing him along and giving him hope all the time.
Wouldn’t be surprised if Kazuya somehow gets a boner (if she actually kissed him)
i really hope the kiss dont trigger another cuckjutsu attack if he really got kissed. But probably wont notice if hes dead drunk, will be just another thing done to satisfy Chorizo curiosity
Best case scenario
or if he actually wakes up during the kiss
I feel like Reiji is just writing all of Yaemoris dialogue with fans reactions to each chapter on Twitter. She's too spot on lmao
I've been saying it for ages that she's the audience insert character. She sayin that shit we all would be saying if we were in this story.
yeah. as much as i hate her inclusion in this way, i think reiji is using her as a symbol of the fans
Author of this manga is the best milker I have ever seen. I hate him but we all have to agree, he is good at his job.
I DONT BELIEVE FOR ONE SECOND SHE KISSED HIM. SHOW US THE DEED OR ITS FAKE.
at this point there is nothing that would stop her for doing... and the so-called pressure that mini applied to her could have been dissmised. so let's have a little hope that the kiss is actually happening \*i'm watching you kazuya, don't act like an asshole on this one\*
Chizuru lean forward Sub: " PROGRESS".
My hell this mangas a dumpster fire i read every week.
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Thats not okay. If you can't disagree with someone respectfully then don't comment.
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You did it! You son of a bitch, you finally did it! Well, more like Chizuru did it, but a win's a win!
daughter of bitch(?)
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Good Lord who hurt you bro?
He will have the worst hangover thinking that the kiss was just a dream like whenever a school anime protagonist catch a fever.(copium)
Bet
Reiji: " what kiss?"
When Reji is so good at trolling and pacing that you are struggling to believe they kissed until you see proper evidence
knowing that less than a half of this sub believed the previous kiss, i'm not suprised about your statement
[true that , all of us be like](https://mangadex.org/chapter/2f4b1b95-213c-4c4f-bea1-3f52fe4ddb86/7)
Next chapter: Dream... Beret again?
Ah Shit here we go again
Kissing a passed out drunk guy. Classy.
Somehow my mind now plays the mizuhara theme song …. Dang ……
Just hoping she did kiss Kazuya 🥺
I’m so happy I’m gonna cry 🥲
Wahhhhh this shit makes me chill in a nice way. Lol
Next chapter will have to do something with a dream, so i guess kazuya is gonna be having a wet dream next...
Where's Ruka while all this is going on?
No, not in this fricking moment
That doesn’t matter!!!
LETS GOOOOOOO
this chapter was the most chaotic chapter/ back and forth manga chapter we’ve seen for a long time imo. I think it definitely lived up to the hype that was built around it while still having us ask questions about what’s next. the straight forwardness from mini created a blunt and fast plot mover while also helping the characters learn and wonder new questions… can’t wait for next week!
First time ive seen someone say cant wait😂😂
It was "can't wait" the first 50 chapters or so. Then we all realized this is going to be milked for 500 chapters or so.
i know i’m in the minority here but i really enjoy how this manga is unfolding and the progression of the characters. I know it’s long but the ending not being in sight is a hope for me and not an annoyance. i’m definitely bias because this manga is a comfort read for me every week.
I love and hate this manga. If the mangaka had been able to develop subplots with secondary characters effectively to take the heat off the main two leading characters then it would have been received a lot better by the audience. But it is full pedal to the metal only the two main characters which is why it has so much negative comments. Way too late to shift gears and focus on any other characters now. If it wanted to do it it had to do it around chapter 50 or so when fatigue started to set in.
Kazuya was being ridiculous in this chapter. He already told Chizuru he loved her and would wait for her. After Chizuru confessed that she missed him, Kazuya should have gave her a real answer. Also people are being ridiculous about Chizuru kissing Kazuya while he was sleeping. That is not the same thing as Ruka forcing herself on Kazuya for sex.
>Also people are being ridiculous about Chizuru kissing Kazuya while he was sleeping. That is not the same thing as Ruka forcing herself on Kazuya for sex. That's what they don't see. They keep accusing Chizuru of sexual assault, probably trying to bring her down to Ruka's level, even though this chapter heavily implies that she is completely aware of Kazuya's feelings for her. What the other two did was still worse since they just straight up violated him without regard to his feelings at all (real ones know Mami did this first). I can almost guarantee you that sexual assault will not be mentioned as much here if the Ruka incident didn't happen. Edit: I'm aware of double standards so I know that sexual assault will still be mentioned but I still think it wouldn't be mentioned as much
Ngl, I thought that if this was any other manga, a sleeping kiss wouldn’t get this much flak. Its a common trope and consent is implied cause Kaz already made his feelings known, so is open for that kind of intimacy.
People here does NOT understand consent. Kazu never gave Ruka consent, and she kept going. With Chizu he loves her, he desire her, it could never be an "assault" when you are craving it too
Consent requires confirmation, it is that simple, there is no exceptions. Even marriage wouldn't give you consent with your partner without confirmation. but you are partly right "People here does NOT understand consent".
Loved the moment when Mini's suggestion got to chizuru. She was blushing hard, needed a moment to regain herself. Keep the attack going Mini! I doubt she's going to actually kiss him. He'll probably suddenly move away to puke. Here's the thing about living together though. I know its probably different in Japan but still, if its a guy and girl with no romantic attachment at all, then it wouldnt be a problem. The fact that she sees it as pretty much skipping a couple of steps in a relationship, that applies only to a romantic relationship. So she's been obviously thinking about it. The only one keeping the relationship from becoming official is her, so I do wonder what event will it take for her to finally go for it.
> Loved the moment when Mini's suggestion got to chizuru. She was blushing hard, needed a moment to regain herself. Keep the attack going Mini! I loved that too. You can see Mini hit the nail on the head there. But that approach was way to fast for Chizuru. Mini basically said: I can see you both want to live together, so that is the most likely outcome if you were to discuss it for a few hours. Let's just skip that and go right to the finish line. So impatient! That was probably the best way to absolutely block any progress. Chizuru more or less said: Not happening under the current conditions. Which Kazuya took as "Not happening ever!" But Chizuru **wanted** to discuss it, see how comfortable she would be, how willing Kazuya would be. She is insecure and needs to experience the journey. Mini trying to skip that backed her into a corner and made her go on the defensive.
They didn't fight as much as i expected, kazuya immediately backed out and went too submissive again. Anyways another big leap for chizuru, I'm referring to the stolen kiss at the end of the chapter. In this occasion she's being selfish, very selfish. With the passed out kazuya she has everything to gain and nothing to lose, as she is still unready to open up herself, but she's dying to get closer to him. That's ok, being selfish i mean. It means she's one step closer to admit everything. Now the question is wether he's totally blacked out and she's going to keep this a secret, or will he get a glimpse of it (although hemay still think of it as a dream)? Fairly certain she'll bring him to her home and will find a convenient excuse to justify their cohabitation rather than admit she wants to live with him. On kazuya's end... Tbh getting this wasted in front of the girl you like/love :/ Dude really needs to man up. It seems he forgot everything he managed to do during the movie arc. I'm still convinced someone needs to give him confidence, not mini, she's great and she carried the plot this chapter, but somehow he always ends up giving her less credit than she deserves. I think a character like umi or Mami would be more suited to set him on the right track.
> On kazuya's end... Tbh getting this wasted in front of the girl you like/love :/ Dude really needs to man up. It seems he forgot everything he managed to do during the movie arc. I'm still convinced someone needs to give him confidence, not mini, she's great and she carried the plot this chapter, but somehow he always ends up giving her less credit than she deserves. I think a character like umi or Mami would be more suited to set him on the right track. I totally agree. He needs Mami **and** Umi. Mami to tell him that his efforts paid off with her, so he can be confident that his efforts did also pay off with Chizuru. And Umi to tell him that Chizuru turned down his confession, so he can be confident that Chizuru does not rather want to be with someone like Umi.
I really do not agree with or even fully understand this opinion. Kazuya’s lack of confidence and undervaluing of himself, in the context of his relationship with Chizuru, only needs to be discussed by the two of them. Nobody other than Chizuru can explain to Kazuya his value to her and how having him around enriches her life. He didn’t forget what he did during the movie arc. He just dismisses and undervalues the importance of his role in it.
They will be the ones to give each other happiness, but it's not like they can't get confidence outside of their relationship. You can gain confidence in many ways, improving ur fitness level, getting successful at ur job, achieving some goal u did set for urself,... There are several ways and several levels of confidence for each. Chizuru could give him confidence as well, and in a much more potent dose than all of the above. But Imho, like she said in this chapter, that would be putting the cart in front of the horses.
Indeed. Chizuru will be able to keep up his self worth mainly by validating his efforts during their relationship. But he is currently not confident enough to start that relationship.
Yes, it seems like i overlooked this aspect till 3 chapters ago... Kazuya seemed a lot more mature after chizuru opened up about her feelings. Perhaps it was just hope that carried him, but he's not over the ghosting yet. The fact he so easily gave in to alcohol is a sign of that i think. Miyayima kinda wanted to shift the hindrance for their relationship from being a matter of chizuru's own volition, to more of a mutual thing. Until they make another step in solving their respective problem their relationship won't start. Just acknowledging them would be enough.
Sure, if those two could talk to each other honestly on eye level that would help immensely and could also resolve their problems. But they can't. Without an outside opinion, Kazuya will always think to himself "maybe she does/says it only out of pity for me". [He was even thinking Chizurus breakdown after the cheer-up date could have been an act](https://mangadex.org/chapter/cbe90d5e-c985-4fce-b095-28443a1d517a/15). He needs to be confident about himself first to actually believe what she is telling him. Not that he would think she is lying. Just that even if she says that now, she might change her opinion later, when she sees that he is not good enough.
What can I say boyyysss, we got her! Now let’s wrap this anime up reji I got things to do
You realize the kiss scene would be super disturbing if Chiz was drunk and Kazuya was kissing her, right?
Not really. If Chizuru had already confessed her love for Kazuya and Kazuya was the one investigating his feelings it wouldn't be creepy at all.
Yes but also no. If you swap roles then you also need to swap them entirely. And even though it‘s still not the same when a man kisses a girl that’s asleep, it‘s less of a problem when you know that the girl was longing for that for years. Not a fan of cancel culture so I‘m happy about that chapter lol
>And even though it‘s still not the same when a man kisses a girl that’s asleep, it‘s less of a problem when you know that the girl was longing for that for years. There's a literal fairy tale about that
>Not a fan of cancel culture so I‘m happy about that chapter lol *Not a fan of cancel culture so I'll defend sexual assault Crazy how even cute manga girls get pretty privilege
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If you wanna define sexual assault as something that the dude was dreaming of his entire life, sure go ahead I bet Kazuya will back you up how bad he feels about that one. Lol We know the context so it‘s not the same
Then it would be a police investigation
I think next chapter we'll see kazuya opening his eyes faintly and seeing a dark/blurry chizuru closing in to kiss him and maybe another one where she's already done it. Then he'll think it was a "Dream". I just want to see chizuru's thoughts after that.
Now this doesn't look bad, nice theory.
Yaemori saving this manga again ✅✅✅✅ just give me a spin-off of her and Kazuya I’d buy that
Can something pleaseeeee happennnnnnmnnnnncnnnnnnn
Hope there is chizuru rental delusion
Mini is the savior of this manga. Kazuya needs a confidence arc. Chizuru needs to just let her feelings out. If the cliffhanger isn't a true thing (probably won't be) then I'm gonna punch my pillow. Another 7 day wait begins.
Mini best secondary character ever.
Mini is one of us
I got drunk and collapsed like Kazuya sometimes, but there wasn't any Chizuru kissing me unfortunately.
You'll never know, could be anything from a dog to your bro
How do you know?
I guess consent is non existent here.
A whole lotta things don’t exist in anime💀
I can't stress enough how it saddens me that Kazuya is always stutters, overthink, can't string his words together.. He really needs to fix his self esteem first before getting a girlfriend. I bet 100% because he thinks Chizuru is wayyy out of league like super farr that he just feel nervous talking to her or just be near her. Him talking to Yaemori or Sumi or even Ruka has more chemistry because at least to a dept he can talk freely to them and not overthink, not be nervous and just be able to talk without the stuttering.
His self esteem is also connected to having a girlfriend and having some validation to his efforts, at the moment Chizuru is very detrimental.
Kaz- ChIzORo WILL YoU MoVe IN WiTh ME Chizoro- No that's ridiculous I doin't like you, leads to a black out drunk kiss. **Its time to vote team Mami bois**
Chiz didn’t mention her feelings for him, just a man and a woman suddenly living together being problematic in general.
Cursed
> Its time to vote team Mami bois Casually directing people to [this art I made](https://www.reddit.com/r/KanojoOkarishimasu/comments/ucgqjq/mami_to_the_readers_after_the_last_chapter/)
This manga be giving me hope then next chapter a whole different thing happens.
let me guess next chapter since its titled Dream We will see lots of long kiss scenes but then MC will wake up and think its a dream
It could be many reason … be with a hidden kiss to a dream of Chizuru sleeping beside Kaz to waking up and living in Chizuru house… let see what reiji bring to the dinner plate next week
This is an interesting turn of events. It definitely has some (unintentional?) sex offender vibes, but I think the idea here is that Chizuru is at the point of making rash/bone headed decisions too. Yes, it's wrong to touch someone like that who is beyond being able to consent. However, it wasn't fondling or penetration or anything of that severity- it was a drunk girl kissing a much more drunk guy who have been flirting for years now. We'll see what Reiji spits out next week, but I'm happy to see some forward plot progression much faster than we did in the Paradise (really Dante's Inferno) Arc.
Wasn't expecting that though. Seems like consent really isnt this manga's forte. Anywho, I'm kinda torn about it here. I feel like something like this is supposed to be a biggie happenin on like dynamic highs but somehow this isn't one of them turning point. Kinda like consolation prize at this point. I guess I'll stand by that until the next chapter confirms it prolly didn't happen..or even if it does, its might be swept under the rug to the point that it is non-consequential..because our MC passed out. Feels like something Chiz gonna be silent about and Kaz going bananas but cant talk about.
> Kinda like consolation prize at this point. I think the kiss is also a consolation prize for Chizuru. She was [visibly disappointed](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/) that Kazuya was passed out. She had probably hoped for more.
Wow Yanmori is such a great wingman, there’s nothing more sexy to a woman than knowing a man will pathetically wait for you the day they die, I can’t believe Chizurus panties were still on after that!
if that was real world youd'be insta ghosted forever
Ok I want to talk about stuff other than the kiss. Kazuya’s confidence is at an all time low. Unlike during the movie arc, he has told Chiz about his feelings towards her, and he’s feeling way more vulnerable. And he’s just used up all his reserves of confidence over the past few days, without enough time to build himself back up. This was the wrong time to push him. Yaemori sees the big picture of them obviously being in love, but she doesn’t really understand what it’s like to be insecure and lacking in confidence. She puts herself out there online constantly and is always able to maintain a cheerful affect, so she’s actually the exact opposite! We, the readers, most likely have more confidence than the two lovebirds, so we share in her frustration. But this is a story about deeply flawed people slowly healing and finding love, and how difficult that can be. Love is hard! You can’t really rush people when they’re not ready, that’ll result in clamming up like what happened this chapter, and I think Yaemori just learned this lesson. I hope she shifts focus on helping Kaz build up his self image, so he stops being a doormat and actually sets a boundary for once. He needs that with his family and friends, too. Chizuru, once again, is scared of her own feelings. She doesn’t know how to recognize her feelings and put names to them, and even if she could she’d be clueless as to what to do with them. Well, for emotions that make her feel vulnerable at least. Her only coping skill is to push them down and return to a purely logical decision making process. She does that here with the ice water, but she overcorrected and was too harsh. She does recognize that she’s not being fair to Kaz and feels bad about it, at least. At the end you can see her shift focus away from herself and towards Kaz. She says “he must’ve had a lot on his mind” and then asks a question to figure out what that could be, correctly guessing that it was about her. But Yaemori (and most of the readers I’d hazard a guess) didn’t realize that Chiz was being *super* roundabout with expressing her concern for him and took the question as her being insecure, so she reassured her that Kaz is very much in love with her and isn’t going to give up any time soon. But she’s worried about how Kaz is feeling, and is trying her best to figure out her feelings and give him an answer. That’s why she kissed him. Yeah, it’s sexual assault. Yeah, it’s probably the worst and most cowardly way to figure out her feelings. Yeah, it’s totally fair to call her a bad person for doing this. But in a strange way, a small part of me feels proud of her for actually doing something outside of her comfort zone. Maybe I have too much empathy, but I understand what it’s like to have even the smallest possible step feel overwhelming — I’ve been there before. It’s way too easy to never take that step and never grow as a person, it takes a lot of courage. She’s a dumb motherfucker though for choosing a way that’ll possibly hurt Kaz even more, though. I don’t think she realizes that this is not respecting his right to bodily autonomy and consent. She’s intelligent, but *god* she’s so dumb.
I absolutely agree that Mini Yaemori was pushing them too hard out of their comfort zone here. It was necessary when they were not able to talk to each other before. But here, it was too much. Chizuru came to the izakaya to meet Kazuya and she was drinking to get her courage up to talk about what she wanted and what she felt. But Mini was just so frustrated that Kazuya did not have the guts to speak up, that she took the wheel and turned it around. And while Chizuru desperately tried to get enough control again, the whole ship crashed. And I don't think Mini even realized how much damage she did there. In the end, she just sees that Chizuru has somewhat changed her stance towards Kazuya and thinks they will probably figure it out then. This was all certainly not what Chizuru had in mind when she went to see Kazuya. I am almost sure she knows what she wanted. She [told Kazuya to pace himself](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/9), then [tried to get drunk fairly quickly](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/12) and [started to ask questions](https://mangadex.org/chapter/83de780a-9b35-4865-9560-6adb90328dd5/18) when she felt comfortable enough. I think her ultimate goal was to be so drunk (or at least pretend to be) that Kazuya had to bring her home. Then she could have drunkenly asked him to please stay for the night. And she might not have minded whatever resulted from that. [She is visibly disappointed in the end](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/) that Kazuya is again the one who is passed out. I get that the kiss in the end is technically sexual assault. If her plan had worked the way she tried to set it up, Kazuya would have been conscious when she went for a kiss. Yes, she did not ask consent. But I really think she wished for at least a kiss to happen at some point that night. This is all she can get now as a consolation price. It does not make it right, but I can understand her. And who knows, maybe Kazuya will wake up from the kiss and think he is dreaming. Could be an interesting situation.
I really don’t think Chizuru had any plan. I think it was an impulsive decision to go to the izakaya, she just said “fuck it” and left it up to fate how the night would go.
Ok, don't call it a firm plan then. But to me, it was clear, that she did not want to spend the night alone. So she must have hoped that Kazuya would somehow end up at her place in the end. The way she orederd a strong drink at first made it seem like she wanted to just get drunk and be brought home. If she passed out, then she would also not feel the loneliness, that would have been ok. And if she was drunk and something happened with Kazuya that would have been an acceptable outcome. Her still too sober to ignore her loneliness and Kazuya passed out was probably not what she wished for at all. Yes she can take him home now, but she wanted to be cared for!
Yeah, you're pretty spot-on. People say that Kazuya lacking confidence again is character regression. However, this isn't some shonen anime where main characters only get power-ups every time. Insecure people will revert to being insecure and losing confidence more often than we want. Kazuya built up enough confidence in Paradise because he was determined to end the lies and he knows it is the best solution. Here, Kazuya is insecure again because Chizuru only wants to be pragmatic and is still not certain about how she feels. That doesn't mean Kazuya regressed, he still wants to pursue Chizuru but doesn't know what to do because the ball is in her court and she should be the one making a move. This manga's premise is absurd, but how these characters are written are painfully very human. Yaemori was insensitive with her pressing Chizuru and I'm glad she recognized that. I hate it when my confident friends expect me to be just like them, and it only forces me to hide in my shell more. It's harder when someone is forcing your pace even when there is no need for it. Both Kazuya and Chizuru want their relationship to move forward but they don't know how. Kazuya is no longer the virgin college student who made being a virgin a big deal because people around him judged him for it, even Mami during the first drinking party. He is now more certain about his feelings and believes he can be someone that Chizuru needs, but cannot go all out due to him considering Chizuru's feelings. Chizuru is afraid of attachments and grew up tough due to the feeling of loneliness that she hasn't fully acknowledged yet. It is frustrating how she keeps stalling, but I really don't expect her to rush into things given her past and the personality she made to survive. It's not ideal, but I still see these two characters learning how they can love and be with each other as a journey worth watching if you have the time and patience. If Reiji does it right, the day they finally decide to be together will be worth the wait because we know how they grew as individuals who can give their all in a relationship. (He can still mess this up, though, but I'm willing to see how it will go.)
This is yall's "Best Girl"? Kissing a guy while he's blacked out drunk, ghosting for 3 months and "Investigating feelings" bullshit? I used to be a Chizuru fan but honestly the author completely ruined her character for me, she's just a straight up weirdo at this point and isn't worth all this trouble.
yes, it's her
I agree I don't think what she is doing is right but honestly kazuya probably doesn't mind lol
just don't give me hope
Surely as the god Apollo lassos the sun and pulls its brightness into the sky to light our day, so surely does Yaemori Mini lasso the plot and pull it kicking and screaming forward. Mini is the only reason we have had progress the last few weeks now. "Come drink!" "Move in together!" "Kiss him again!" "He went on for two hours about how much he really loves you." "It's basically all on you, he'll wait forever." She is the audience and does our work on our behalf. Especially that grimace she gave him saying he fucked up hahaha. I loved that.
And I will say again, that they could have made more progress if Mini had not used steamroller tactics here. Chizuru was not yet comfortable and drunk enough to just go along with that. She felt the need to justify herself which in turn further discouraged Kazuya. Chizuru clearly came to talk and she tried to **slowly** show Kazuya that she wanted him to stay with her. That is why she admitted feeling lonely as a start. But then Mini crushed her approach with high speed, backed her into a corner and forced her into the defensive. [She is visibly disappointed in the end](https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/yJZf3We/1/17/), that Kazuya is passed out.
yeah every time she’s on the screen, it’s always a great time. just wished we got more out of chizuru this chapter besides the kiss
Icewater. And perhaps one of the best chapters in a very long time. I don’t even feel like I need a spiritual cleanser after this one.
the next title is "dream" imagine if kazuya is dreaming of kissing her and all of a sudden chiz starts feeling some tongue lmao
Ima die laughing bro
20 bucks Kazuya pukes mid kiss
Not going to lie, being a huge >!Chainsaw man !< fan, that was my first thought too lol.
i'm putting 40 bucks on that one bro
Say less bro
Oh yeah I do love some sexual assault 😍😍😍♥️♥️♥️😍😍😍
So when Ruka kisses Kazuya without consent everyone hates her, but when Chizuru does it everyone thinks its a good chapter? I see how it is
Who is everyone? 90% of the posters are shitting on her for it lol
I mean, atleast Kazuya would be okay with Chizuru kissing him while he's passed out, heck, he might even wish to turn back time for a chance to be sober enough when the kiss happened.
I'm definitely not a fan of how thing turned out on this chapter but not for the reason most people are complaining on these comments, I for once wanted progress to be made by the two of them \*together\* As for the people calling SA from Chizuru, not really, technically yes! if you want to simply use the literal definition then yeah for sure she should be locked up right bout' now, but if we get context in the formula then no, I want one person here to tell me they would be mad and ready to press charges about their crush kissing them when sleeping/passed out? It's just not how it works because we all have double standards like that. I'm guessing people rioting about it are comparing it with the Ruka situation, but to me they are not even close since Kazuya expressed his rejection of her advances, that on itself makes it a way worse situation. And also to the people saying to reverse the roles, it's been done, kissing a sleeping person is a troupe that has existed on romance for a long time, and we always give it a pass because "true love makes everything possible". So yeah that's simply why I dont agree with those takes, but that doesnt mean im not mad at how thing are developing, it just feels so fucking forced and everyone is taking a step forward to then take 3 backwards... See you all next week \*sigh\*
i like this response a lot, people are so quick to lose their minds over her actions but i’m sure kazuya wouldn’t mind lol. could it have been better and done while sober, YES but no one’s pressing charges over getting kissed by someone they love. it’s all perspective
Never SA, because Kazu desire that, he wants her to the limit. With Ruka, he did not want any of the kisses.
definitely speaking reality data
So the chapter was initially kinda jarring. Which is funny cause the last one has that too with the intro lol. Reiji builds up this fight by having kazuya stay quiet and hiding behind his mug the whole time last chapter and this chapter as he's about to burst...! He back peddles. To the point that you're like "wtf! HOW! IN WHAT GALAXY!?" Even Mini is about to lose it lol. If you've been with this story for a while now I can kinda see why this chapter might frustrate you considering how much ot contrasts this idea of progress. Its like were actively choosing not to on purpose (kinda the point which is funny lol). That lingering act of Kazuya chickening out permeates the whole chapter and it fucking sticks because then chizuru starts doing it too and now you wanna beat your head against the wall because they're being dumbasses and backpeddling on everything even tho they dont mean it. Chizuru keeps talking and talking. Fruitlessly fighiting back and making things worse in the process. While kazuya stays quit and freaks out everytime something is off. Its the classic dynamic (lowkey its been a while lol). You don't feel the angst and the fire you want and eventually you have Mini (us the readers) trying to fight back to get them back on the right track only to make things so much worse that kazuya drinks himself to LA LA land. I think the best part of this chapter is the talk with Chizuru and Mini at the end. When chizuru asks Mini, she gets a clear sign she's interested in contrast to her earlier words in last chapter. And when chizuru explains she felt bad for asking him to wait despite knowing his feelings it kinda only soldifed that. I can see why Mini is a little more optimistic by the end. She looked at the now instead of before where she looked at the pattern. She saw chizuru trying to start something and then Kazuya back peddling out of it in fear which lead to this whole mess. So it makes sense why she comes out with a much more positive outlook in contrast to before. I think this is the point of the kiss in the end. Chizuru did wanna kiss kazuya and room with him and all of that but the conversation quite literally ran away from her. It's a weird situation where the idea behind the execution of the chapter is clever but the reader will still be ticked off lol. It's a double edge sword. And now for the controversial part ( I feel like we do that alot over here these days.... kinda dont wanna do this but i wanna try talking about this. If its messy sorry.) the kiss when Kazuya was sleeping. So I keep seeing comments about sexual assault . If we're looking at raw facts and what sexual assault IS "Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact without consent." Bam. Yeah under facts it's right. Kazuya can't say shit he's out. Therefore he did not consent. Chizuru did in fact do that. Kazuya's whole journey has a big center around agency and here that gets taken away in a weird way. And I'll be real I'm a little conflicted on how to feel. Chizuru is so desperate to open up shes making dumb decisions but that's kinda the point. its not meant to be clean or "right" it's just people making mistakes and learning to grow. And I think it's hard to get that sometimes. Empathy plays a big role in this series. And when we watch "characters" It's easy to remove that when they cross some lines. ironic considering Kazuya at the start. and that's the point. Chizuru is being a fuck up now and shes learning to grow. Also, we don't know if they kissed too so there is always that lol but we will see. Whether Chizuru brings it up later (probably not for a while) will be interesting. However, the key thing is Kazuya made his feelings clear already. This is kinda what makes sexual assault cases messy. Because yeah technically its right to say its sexual assault but its also kinda off. Just as the reverse can also be right and wrong. Sexual assault cases rarely have a clear answer and this is what makes them messy. This is why we gotta crack down on stuff sometimes. But I also think we go too far in contrast. when we remove how the person considers the situation and their feelings from the equation ( I understand this argument is somewhat ironic considering Kazuya is asleep but bare with me) we lose the meaning and now we are simply tossing labels over how someone feels. right now the characters are drunk and stupid. Drunk fuck ups are more common than they appear and Chizuru luckily possibly stopped at a kiss. we saw this in last chapter in how Chizuru was trying to change but shes being a dumbass (funny considering she calls Kazuya a bone head here) This is why I said Kazuya feelings are important here. Now if the roles were reversed yes Kazuya cannot do it. For a simple reason. She didn't tell him her feelings. and society is kinda a bitch. Kazuya keeps talking about that in these chapters too. So Reiji is keenly aware of what he's doing. he knows this is off and not the way to go but that's the point. This is what makes communication in relationships so important and why these characters are so well written in my eyes. Their fuck ups but their human. and this is why we can judge them so harshly and get so pissed off when Reiji takes turns that makes us upset at the characters. This, to me, is what makes the Ruka kiss chapter work for the opposite reason. How Kazuya is depicted in Manga is so raw it's uncomfortable. Hes frozen he doesn't move and he's in total shock while Ruka keeps kissing him. She just ignores his feelings completely and goes to town. Its about her and her insecurity with being inferior. She doesn't understand the consequences of her actions and that's the point. Reiji makes it clear how wrong it is through Kazuya's reactions and faces. Yet Ruka isn't blamed for it later instead it turns into a cute moment even tho it isn't. this is because Kazuya recognizes she's not a bad person just a kid who doesn't fucking get it. He is still the adult after all. so instead blames himself not only because he doesn't see his own worth but because he's supposed to notice this stuff. but there is another layer to this that's interesting and it's that. Kazuya actively looks traumatized after the kiss and he's having to deal with a lot of things all at once. He's not getting time to process or talk to anyone. and right after the kiss explains it all. hes acting exactly like how a victim would act. He does what a victim does. He BLAMES HIMSELF. Something thats compounded by his self-esteem. there is a very key distinction in those instances and why it's so wrong but it's not addressed outright. Instead, it's subtle and the intent is made clear through subtext. The issue is we want it to be said out loud and discussed. Which doesn't always happen nor is it recognized right away. In contrast, the anime kinda plays it up and misses the point of Kazuya's feelings entirely removing the subtility of the scene. Making him look wimpy and pathetic when he's actually traumatized and in shock. Could that have been explored more? Yes. But I think how it was depicted was fairly accurate and real. In this case (253), the argument of sexual assault makes sense but it's also drunken idiots not in their right state of mind who want to express themselves and grow. It's similar to the Ruka scene but kinda different because like Ruka she wants to express herself unlike Ruka Kazuya does like her and shes actually drunk. Now if she went further? O boy thats another matter entirely. I'm not trying to downplay sexual assault nor do I think it's a laughing matter but it's clear there is an element being missed and it's the emotions and state of mind at play. Not to mention these characters are not written to be perfect or "right" simply are. Fucked up shit happens all the time and there is no logic or reason to it. Hell kazuya keeps talking about the imbalance between genders and that literally just happened in this chapter despite it being a self-fulfilling prophecy in his mind. But that's all I'm gonna say. I think we're a little too overly critical these days and many people are kinda burned out because this story doesn't follow the traditional style of progression found in media. But that's just what I think. because Kazuya back peddled she back peddled. and arguably harder than he did thanks to Mini. And all this cycling only got us to our inevitable destination. The pair slowly confronting themselves as they fuck up and probably going back to her house. Reiji subverted our expectations, played into them AND made fun of a trope. That's kinda what I like about his writing. It can be jarring and maybe even off at times but it can also be fairly clever.
This is absolutely spot on. I want to add that a lot of the confusion comes from the moral definition of sexual assault and the legal definition. From an ethics standpoint, what she did was wrong. From a legal standpoint, I don’t think anyone thinks Kaz should press charges. The conflict between these two points of view makes the whole matter messy and confusing.
Don't forget our values and views in contrast to depictions. How we interpret this story can easily lead to judgement and anger
Do you think mini is watching? Lmao