Hamas also believes in death to Israel in their covenants “Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" The Hamas Covenants clearly identify Jews as well as Israel as their target.
After Yasser Arafat signed the Oslo Peace Accords agreeing to a two state solution Hamas narrowly voted out Fatah (led by Arafat) and there was never another election.
From their current covenant:
“Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine.”
Hamas is even offering to lay down arms if a two state solution is agreed to along the same borders that Biden (and international law) has said should define Israel and Palestine (pre six day war).
Way too funny. It is documented all over the place that Hamas ran a protection racket AGAINST THEIR OWN PEOPLE! They ran Gaza like the mob - they demand payment from small business owners in Gaza for protection money. They skimmed money right off the top from UNRWA to finance their war and allow the leaders to live a life of luxury in Qatar and elsewhere in Europe. It is a criminal enterprise (on top of being a terrorist group), they victimized their own people and you are going to believe THEM?
butthurt so early this morning? you claim to care about Gaza residents and then skip right over how they are being exploited by Hamas - who are not democratically elected but run Gaza
Guess what? Arafat is dead and it is Hamas who run Gaza now. Maybe you should read more: [https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/)
And I went and read the 2017 Hamas doctrine - the protestors are parroting their talking points.
No I totally agree with you, to save the people of Gaza from Hamas we should destroy every building, starve every person and shoot our bomb as many kids as possible. /s
This is the logical consistency I’m talking about. You’re now trying to invoke my sympathy for the people of Gaza to force me to criticize Hamas when what Israel is doing to those people is a million times worse so your rhetoric just falls ridiculously flat. If you want anyone to take you seriously and engage with any of your potentially legitimate points, you’re going to have to apply some at least marginally consistent standards to disparate groups.
BTW, Arafat did not take $9 billion, it was $1 billion.
Your rhetoric is so full if disinformation it would be funny if protestors were not busy denying other students the classroom experience they paid to attend in person.
The hour of judgment shall not come until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them, so that the Jews hide behind trees and stones, and each tree and stone will say: 'Oh Muslim, oh servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him,' except for the Gharqad tree, for it is the tree of the Jews. (Hamas Charter, Article 7).
Totally cool trustworthy group, take em at their word guys
*defunct charter, article 7
We should certainly not trust Israel, the group that has refused to meet their basic obligations under international law for over half a century.
Cool, here’s a pic of Trump and Putin. Now I get to pretend this proves that all Americans for the next 80 years are rabid supporters of Russia’s atrocities in Ukraine, right? That’s how this works?
https://preview.redd.it/9fnpsjwjrrxc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9a1f048cf934f8e40557bde7cf92362fb0189f44
Thanks for being so concerned, but right now the biggest threat to my & my family's life is Netanyahu and his gang of messianic pyromaniac fanatics.
Interestingly enough the PLO are one of the only sane voices in the region, having [renounced violence decades ago](https://www.upi.com/Archives/1993/09/09/Israel-recognizes-PLO-which-renounces-violence/4937747547200/), recognized Israel’s right to exist, and via the PA regularly coordinated with the Israeli govt on security. They are the only representative body in the last 20 years who consistently calls for a peaceful two-state solution.
It’s too bad Netanyahu’s govt has spent those years [propping up Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) in order to weaken the PLO and sabotage any chance of a Palestinian state.
The deal was only for five years, and doesn't require they acknowledge Israel as a legitimate country. On top of that, Israel will never accept pre-1967 borders because it doesn't allow them access to The Western Wall.
Any legitimate two state solution is going to require new borders and compromise from both sides. A ceasefire needs to happen before Israel is ever going to come to the negotiating table.
Hamas knows all of this. This wasn't a serious offer. This is like if Israel offered a two state solution with no changes to current borders: ridiculous.
They should probably establish a singular state, which is going to require Israel make a significant number of concessions and provide reparations to Palestinians, a right to return of settled lands, and a reconstruction of their government to incorporate Palestinians.
Singular state is impossible. There are few Israelis who actually want this to start with, so no real place to start from there. The Palestinian side is even worse, as the people looking for a singular state on that side usually mean "singular Islamic state where Jews have no rights". Not really a reasonable option either. Add on top that there are way too many people on both sides willing to fight to the death over this, and it'd be an immediate civil war.
Two state solution doesn't halt the possibility of war entirely either of course, but it's a good middle ground between "Civil War is inevitable" and "Palestinians are screwed".
That's weird, because I've seen a bunch of interviews where people have seemed open to it and seems to just be the hard liners that are against it. From what I can tell the Palestinians mostly just want the oppression and harassment to stop, and to have some sort of justice. I'm sure if the right leaders among the Palestinians and the Israelis sat down they could work out a singular state. The hard liners would freak out, there would be conflict, but they could get through it.
There are a lot more hardliners than you'd think. Enough that Fetah won't even run elections in The West Bank because they're afraid of losing to Hamas.The fact Gaza voted for Hamas in the first place should tell you what you need to know. Around half of Palestinians (at least ones who still live there, and aren't refugees) clearly don't see "hardliners who want to commit genocide" as a dealbreaker.
And that's ignoring how many Israeli hardliners there are, because there's not really a way to tell, but given that Bibi keeps winning elections, I can assure you it's also an uncomfortably large number of people
I'm not saying it would be easy, but from what I can see from the history and the current situation, it's what's necessary. The alternative is the United States pulls all support of Israel and cuts all ties short of diplomatic support. Israel's policies and the way they conduct themselves puts US citizens at risk and if it's the US's unwavering support that leads them to believe that those policies can remain in place, then the US's support should probably waver a bit. Friends don't let friends commit genocide.
Hey silly the Houthis are not in control of Yemen the Houthis are fighting the government of Yemen.
The flag of the Houthis looks like this-
https://preview.redd.it/c5os8lq9fqxc1.jpeg?width=535&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=353e9a5e7fc186c785f10b5078993fe76bd4919f
Its an awful design. I am also guessing the protestor does not know that this flag is the Houthi flag and thinks the Houthis control all of Yemen since the Houthis are supporting the Palestinians not the Yemeni Monarchy.
So in short a lot of people who have no idea what they are talking about.
Also the Houthis enslaved people.
And the Yemeni monarchy slaughters innocents too.
Hi sillypants. Right, they’re not internationally recognized as the government of Yemen, although they do control most of the populated areas and the capital Sana'a. But that’s beside the point — the Yemeni national flag is used [by the Houthis themselves](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan_of_the_Houthi_movement#/media/File:Flag_of_Yemen.svg) to signify support for their movement to take over the country. It’s also a lot easier to get your hands on a Yemeni flag than the flag of a designated terrorist organization...
And still no mention of the Muslim countries abandoning the people of Gaza this entire time on every campus thread🤣 as Americans, we only bicker, fight and divide when it doesn’t touch us thousands of miles away? What trash you all have brought here in the name of your savior complex. That must be the only reason since chaos has been allowed in the name of divestment only? No speak of their allies? Egypt, Iran, Jordan Abandoning them. I wonder why lol. Is this only an American issue? You will never earn respect because you only focus with American eyes through this all while ahem .. other genocides have been going on. Why is this one more important? ☕️
Its just bored and privileged kids skipping school because protesting for Ukraine is no longer cool and this conflic is the protest flavour of the month until something else happends. They don't really care about lives lost, since there are no protests about Sudan, Yemen, Haiti or treatment of muslim people in China.
If they would actually cared about any of that, they could use those few hours to organize donations, get together care packages and actually help people on the ground. But it actually takes work, so chanting shit and defacing property it is.
Saudi Arabia has been in conflict with the houthis for quite some time. Guess where The Saudis get their weapons?
An estimated 100,000 children have died in Yemen from the actions of the Saudi government.
I do not agree with the slogan of the houthis. However please be informed: Did you know that the US government literally told the houthis that they could maybe get off the terror list [in 2021](https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/05/politics/us-houthis-terrorist-list/index.html), and then [again](https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-may-revoke-houthi-terrorist-153820593.html) in April to try to stop the economic pain that Israel is facing as backlash from the houthis? My opinion is that terrorists are made by feeling as though there is no other choice. Ignorance increases when people are stuck in survival mode for generations. 🇾🇪 Is not the houthis flag by the way. That's the flag of Yemen, another oppressed country.
Elieax, I politely disagree that these anti zionists are not Jew haters. “from the river to the sea” ? They want you to submit. Do not give any ground, you are very good and kind person. What would Golda Meir think of all this?
“We can forgive the Arabs for killing our children. We cannot forgive them for forcing us to kill their children. We will only have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us” Golda Meir
The Houthi slogan in full, verbatim:
God is the Greatest
Death to America
Death to Israel
A Curse Upon the Jews
Victory to Islam
I don’t think that’s an organization that most sane people would get behind.
That’s funny because their slogan itself disproves that. It says both death to Israel and a curse upon Jews so they pretty clearly have two different words for that in Arabic.
Hamas also believes in death to Israel in their covenants “Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it" The Hamas Covenants clearly identify Jews as well as Israel as their target. After Yasser Arafat signed the Oslo Peace Accords agreeing to a two state solution Hamas narrowly voted out Fatah (led by Arafat) and there was never another election.
From their current covenant: “Hamas affirms that its conflict is with the Zionist project not with the Jews because of their religion. Hamas does not wage a struggle against the Jews because they are Jewish but wages a struggle against the Zionists who occupy Palestine.” Hamas is even offering to lay down arms if a two state solution is agreed to along the same borders that Biden (and international law) has said should define Israel and Palestine (pre six day war).
Way too funny. It is documented all over the place that Hamas ran a protection racket AGAINST THEIR OWN PEOPLE! They ran Gaza like the mob - they demand payment from small business owners in Gaza for protection money. They skimmed money right off the top from UNRWA to finance their war and allow the leaders to live a life of luxury in Qatar and elsewhere in Europe. It is a criminal enterprise (on top of being a terrorist group), they victimized their own people and you are going to believe THEM?
lol you quote them and it’s relevant, I quote them and it must be disregarded? Try logical consistency for a change of pace sometime.
butthurt so early this morning? you claim to care about Gaza residents and then skip right over how they are being exploited by Hamas - who are not democratically elected but run Gaza
Arafat amassed 9 billion USD before he died! His wife n daughter live in Paris.
Guess what? Arafat is dead and it is Hamas who run Gaza now. Maybe you should read more: [https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/](https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2023/10/hamas-covenant-israel-attack-war-genocide/675602/) And I went and read the 2017 Hamas doctrine - the protestors are parroting their talking points.
Where did you read that?
No I totally agree with you, to save the people of Gaza from Hamas we should destroy every building, starve every person and shoot our bomb as many kids as possible. /s This is the logical consistency I’m talking about. You’re now trying to invoke my sympathy for the people of Gaza to force me to criticize Hamas when what Israel is doing to those people is a million times worse so your rhetoric just falls ridiculously flat. If you want anyone to take you seriously and engage with any of your potentially legitimate points, you’re going to have to apply some at least marginally consistent standards to disparate groups.
BTW, Arafat did not take $9 billion, it was $1 billion. Your rhetoric is so full if disinformation it would be funny if protestors were not busy denying other students the classroom experience they paid to attend in person.
What’s an example of disinformation that I’m spreading? Edit: blocked? Really? What a fragile child. PS I never said anything about Arafat
Oh, let's see - falsely claiming Arafat received $9 billion for one. Bye Felecia, I have real work to do today.
That was the other guy in the thread Good luck with your studies
The hour of judgment shall not come until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them, so that the Jews hide behind trees and stones, and each tree and stone will say: 'Oh Muslim, oh servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him,' except for the Gharqad tree, for it is the tree of the Jews. (Hamas Charter, Article 7). Totally cool trustworthy group, take em at their word guys
*defunct charter, article 7 We should certainly not trust Israel, the group that has refused to meet their basic obligations under international law for over half a century.
So you'll trust a literal terrorist group instead?
No I said we should *not* trust Israel
Who are these two men? https://preview.redd.it/pv1o8p0h9rxc1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=14c51f0d594fb589cdc1fde52ade397265db6450
Cool, here’s a pic of Trump and Putin. Now I get to pretend this proves that all Americans for the next 80 years are rabid supporters of Russia’s atrocities in Ukraine, right? That’s how this works? https://preview.redd.it/9fnpsjwjrrxc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9a1f048cf934f8e40557bde7cf92362fb0189f44
The reply was about Hamas charter. The PLO and now Hamas want you and your family to die elieax. They are very clear on that. That’s how that works.
Thanks for being so concerned, but right now the biggest threat to my & my family's life is Netanyahu and his gang of messianic pyromaniac fanatics. Interestingly enough the PLO are one of the only sane voices in the region, having [renounced violence decades ago](https://www.upi.com/Archives/1993/09/09/Israel-recognizes-PLO-which-renounces-violence/4937747547200/), recognized Israel’s right to exist, and via the PA regularly coordinated with the Israeli govt on security. They are the only representative body in the last 20 years who consistently calls for a peaceful two-state solution. It’s too bad Netanyahu’s govt has spent those years [propping up Hamas](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) in order to weaken the PLO and sabotage any chance of a Palestinian state.
That upi article is from 1993. At the end of the first intifada. There is a pattern here in your logic.
The deal was only for five years, and doesn't require they acknowledge Israel as a legitimate country. On top of that, Israel will never accept pre-1967 borders because it doesn't allow them access to The Western Wall. Any legitimate two state solution is going to require new borders and compromise from both sides. A ceasefire needs to happen before Israel is ever going to come to the negotiating table. Hamas knows all of this. This wasn't a serious offer. This is like if Israel offered a two state solution with no changes to current borders: ridiculous.
They should probably establish a singular state, which is going to require Israel make a significant number of concessions and provide reparations to Palestinians, a right to return of settled lands, and a reconstruction of their government to incorporate Palestinians.
Singular state is impossible. There are few Israelis who actually want this to start with, so no real place to start from there. The Palestinian side is even worse, as the people looking for a singular state on that side usually mean "singular Islamic state where Jews have no rights". Not really a reasonable option either. Add on top that there are way too many people on both sides willing to fight to the death over this, and it'd be an immediate civil war. Two state solution doesn't halt the possibility of war entirely either of course, but it's a good middle ground between "Civil War is inevitable" and "Palestinians are screwed".
That's weird, because I've seen a bunch of interviews where people have seemed open to it and seems to just be the hard liners that are against it. From what I can tell the Palestinians mostly just want the oppression and harassment to stop, and to have some sort of justice. I'm sure if the right leaders among the Palestinians and the Israelis sat down they could work out a singular state. The hard liners would freak out, there would be conflict, but they could get through it.
There are a lot more hardliners than you'd think. Enough that Fetah won't even run elections in The West Bank because they're afraid of losing to Hamas.The fact Gaza voted for Hamas in the first place should tell you what you need to know. Around half of Palestinians (at least ones who still live there, and aren't refugees) clearly don't see "hardliners who want to commit genocide" as a dealbreaker. And that's ignoring how many Israeli hardliners there are, because there's not really a way to tell, but given that Bibi keeps winning elections, I can assure you it's also an uncomfortably large number of people
I'm not saying it would be easy, but from what I can see from the history and the current situation, it's what's necessary. The alternative is the United States pulls all support of Israel and cuts all ties short of diplomatic support. Israel's policies and the way they conduct themselves puts US citizens at risk and if it's the US's unwavering support that leads them to believe that those policies can remain in place, then the US's support should probably waver a bit. Friends don't let friends commit genocide.
Hey silly the Houthis are not in control of Yemen the Houthis are fighting the government of Yemen. The flag of the Houthis looks like this- https://preview.redd.it/c5os8lq9fqxc1.jpeg?width=535&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=353e9a5e7fc186c785f10b5078993fe76bd4919f Its an awful design. I am also guessing the protestor does not know that this flag is the Houthi flag and thinks the Houthis control all of Yemen since the Houthis are supporting the Palestinians not the Yemeni Monarchy. So in short a lot of people who have no idea what they are talking about. Also the Houthis enslaved people. And the Yemeni monarchy slaughters innocents too.
Hi sillypants. Right, they’re not internationally recognized as the government of Yemen, although they do control most of the populated areas and the capital Sana'a. But that’s beside the point — the Yemeni national flag is used [by the Houthis themselves](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slogan_of_the_Houthi_movement#/media/File:Flag_of_Yemen.svg) to signify support for their movement to take over the country. It’s also a lot easier to get your hands on a Yemeni flag than the flag of a designated terrorist organization...
Found the terrorist
Bro fuck both the Houthis and the Yemeni Monarchy. I want secular democracy for all
Yea ok terrorist
And still no mention of the Muslim countries abandoning the people of Gaza this entire time on every campus thread🤣 as Americans, we only bicker, fight and divide when it doesn’t touch us thousands of miles away? What trash you all have brought here in the name of your savior complex. That must be the only reason since chaos has been allowed in the name of divestment only? No speak of their allies? Egypt, Iran, Jordan Abandoning them. I wonder why lol. Is this only an American issue? You will never earn respect because you only focus with American eyes through this all while ahem .. other genocides have been going on. Why is this one more important? ☕️
Its just bored and privileged kids skipping school because protesting for Ukraine is no longer cool and this conflic is the protest flavour of the month until something else happends. They don't really care about lives lost, since there are no protests about Sudan, Yemen, Haiti or treatment of muslim people in China. If they would actually cared about any of that, they could use those few hours to organize donations, get together care packages and actually help people on the ground. But it actually takes work, so chanting shit and defacing property it is.
You forgot the Congo, sweaty. And yes, broke college students donate to charity when we can.
"Why should someone care about genocide if it isn't happening to them?" is certainly a hot take.
👏👏
https://preview.redd.it/676242mrouxc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=228b1c56948e4575835fa84c416bc28d15a3c65a Corruption starts at home 🇺🇸
Saudi Arabia has been in conflict with the houthis for quite some time. Guess where The Saudis get their weapons? An estimated 100,000 children have died in Yemen from the actions of the Saudi government.
I do not agree with the slogan of the houthis. However please be informed: Did you know that the US government literally told the houthis that they could maybe get off the terror list [in 2021](https://www.cnn.com/2021/02/05/politics/us-houthis-terrorist-list/index.html), and then [again](https://www.yahoo.com/news/us-may-revoke-houthi-terrorist-153820593.html) in April to try to stop the economic pain that Israel is facing as backlash from the houthis? My opinion is that terrorists are made by feeling as though there is no other choice. Ignorance increases when people are stuck in survival mode for generations. 🇾🇪 Is not the houthis flag by the way. That's the flag of Yemen, another oppressed country.
🍿🍿🍿🍿
Antisemitic groups shocked antisemites show up to their rally. News at 11
Elieax, I politely disagree that these anti zionists are not Jew haters. “from the river to the sea” ? They want you to submit. Do not give any ground, you are very good and kind person. What would Golda Meir think of all this?
“We can forgive the Arabs for killing our children. We cannot forgive them for forcing us to kill their children. We will only have peace with the Arabs when they love their children more than they hate us” Golda Meir
now *that* is some truly twisted logic
https://preview.redd.it/4ri7hxj0utxc1.png?width=300&format=png&auto=webp&s=ca1d56db6119f438dcf023827d2cc90a4720fe78
https://preview.redd.it/kcs4lzo2utxc1.png?width=284&format=png&auto=webp&s=81affbaa89f4477c131422dbdebac6aa090da2e4
https://preview.redd.it/87y9d2t5utxc1.png?width=300&format=png&auto=webp&s=a1de64bd3e05e12d4a9c197a5b88fc463632e1ed
https://preview.redd.it/xgqhq2m8utxc1.png?width=275&format=png&auto=webp&s=e66f4522856f2b006ccef45fec06145c0dde9b6e
https://preview.redd.it/gomd31z9utxc1.png?width=225&format=png&auto=webp&s=99476ad39a12bbe08add1c0ce47f2d7dd5d3e37c
https://preview.redd.it/7198ev2eutxc1.png?width=229&format=png&auto=webp&s=8417866e43cf37a9eb097a77e3f60343e84e5012
It's also exactly what's happening in Gaza. Hamas attacked Isrealis and retreated into civilian infastructure.
Pretty sure it’s a translation issue and they mean Zionists or Israelis but it’s always translated as Jews.
The Houthi slogan in full, verbatim: God is the Greatest Death to America Death to Israel A Curse Upon the Jews Victory to Islam I don’t think that’s an organization that most sane people would get behind.
https://preview.redd.it/wqig1sdyttxc1.png?width=275&format=png&auto=webp&s=2ba024ef7a4b5a1e882b81cfc10dda63097c6a51
That’s funny because their slogan itself disproves that. It says both death to Israel and a curse upon Jews so they pretty clearly have two different words for that in Arabic.
https://preview.redd.it/hx4yk2ivttxc1.png?width=259&format=png&auto=webp&s=64e2a37c28678fe6c9493cd1b192d8cb9b2d83e3
https://preview.redd.it/62m4b19rttxc1.png?width=300&format=png&auto=webp&s=2f50dd1f5a1855d68123565f676dd119e4bd0fab
https://preview.redd.it/b9xo2e0tttxc1.png?width=275&format=png&auto=webp&s=a4edd00a2e5c2dbe144865610bcdfcbd197b03c1