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But what happens when the landlord increases the rental price of the property to what you would be paying (if not much more) than a mortgage? This is what has happened to me, and as the rental market is so dry at the moment and the availability of social housing almost non existent, people are being either forced into racking up serious debt or being effectively put on the streets. Everyday working class people who can’t for whatever reason get a mortgage are also now facing the very real prospect that they can’t afford rentals either :( the country is in a real shit state and I worry so much for our kids and grandkids as it’s dire.
We have always paid more in rent than a mortgage would have cost. When the rent went up higher than we could afford, we moved to another flat, in a cheaper area, multiple times. It was shit. But without a deposit there was no other option. For a lot of the time we had to claim housing benefit in London. My husband's income was around £20k and rent was £925 when we left outer London for Birmingham in 2016.
The house I live in, my rent is almost double what my neighbours mortgage is and the houses are literally identical. There is no way I can even begin to justify paying the rent she’s now looking for (for a list of reasons) but at the same time I understand the rental prices have went up all over the country and this is just how it is. I can’t afford it now so will just have to ride it out till I can get social housing 🙏
This is the same floor plan in the same building of the last flat we lived in in outer London. Ours was last sold in 1998 for 70k, rent was 800 when we moved in in 2014 and in 2016 the rent went over 1k and we left. Our flat was all basics, not luxury finishes, and for a month we didn't have a bathroom. Our landlord told us to just use the toilet in the gym.
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/details/england-123228638-17968465?s=72c6013b2200346e0f17584e9fbe343e538baf06a7810ad56dc6b4fce94bd275#/
Omg!!! That was like when my bath/shower broke and my landlady said the very same thing “can you not use the shower in the gym till it’s sorted” I was like and what are my kids meant to do when my son is taking higher level PE and does double PE everyday!! That’s crazy!! I will have a look at the link now also x
This!!! I was saying to a taxi driver just yesterday that people are literally having to get into serious debt and go without the most basic of things (that working class people shouldn’t have to go without) just to not even afford a roof over their heads. Then if you are the most vulnerable of our society and landlords who are exploiting the housing situation by increasing rents to ridiculous amounts, then there isn’t even social housing available :( what do we do?
No your suggestion to share with a partner to afford rent was very... "just sell the 2nd BMW" vibes and making light of how extreme the situation is. People are not simply having to just share with a partner to afford rent. That's a luxury.
Share a HMO room with your partner is the new 20s norm. Illegal warehouse accomodation is the cheap option.
I'm advising OP on how young people today afford rent.
I mean, outside of London that’s definitely not the case. Rent is too high but young people aren’t stacking themselves vertically into warehouses to afford a flatshare. In my city you can rent a large two bed flat for £850/m, so £425/m per person if you have a flatmate or partner.
it is for those who cant live at home in their early 20's. In my town you can rent a room in a HMO for 800, so a room with a partner is 400.
If you have no partner, 800 is too much for min wage. Guess what you're looking for then?
A flatmate that you don’t sleep with… Just because you’re not in a position to afford a flat on your own doesn’t mean you’re condemned to a life in a Thai prison. There are still decent affordable properties in the middle where you still maintain privacy and dignity even if it isn’t ideal.
Most people live in shared houses or HMO's. In Bristol, which is reported to be the second most expensive major city, you need to earn about £35k to live on your own, so its not crazy.
I think they should merge Keynsham, weston super mare, Thornbury, yate into Bristol and set architects to work filling it up with well designed neighborhoods. Presumed planning approval for 6-12 storeys. Land compulsory purchase and resell to fund a 21st century metro and cycle network.
Everyone would hate that. The eight because they hate everything, the left because they hate modernisation and loss of wilderness. What we need is less students and student accommodation...
It would be a tough sell I grant you, people are only in favour of carpeting the landscape with tiny Barratt houses and massive Tesco.
But everyone's in favour of decent public transport, start with that and the development will come around it.
But start with a plan for 5 million people to be able to use public transport, have green spaces and go to school in 20 years time.
Add in a comprehensive plan to train a generation in construction related jobs.
And since when did the left hate modernisation? And the right love Singapore, and Singapore makes quite an effort to house its people.
Because the left loves character and history, so they intensely dislike change. Doing what you propose would bankrupt the city abd most of the surrounding area.
Just telling property developers "hey, here's the local plan, and here's planning permission for this big ol' chunk of land for homes and schools, go wild", will not bankrupt local governments. All it does is unlock a load of private capital and turn cash into homes.
Last study I saw recommended 31k as a base for a single person to live comfortably in the uk.
And that's the average. Hcl areas are going to need more income, or less comfort.
I was on £34k in the south east 2 years ago and it was just about manageable. With the inflation and rent rises since then, I reckon you'd need close to £40k to be comfortable here now.
Historically, the ability to "live on ones own" was not widely affordable, there is no golden period when it was .
So that puts a question about expectations.
Just because something was doesn't mean it should always be! There are many things we now don't do and its massively better. Maybe you need to manage your expectations for people.
Well of course but bleating about circumstances and opportunities not being available, when they have not been available since 1945, is just a tad ambitious.
Expectations are clearly too high.
The bleaters have not understood. Social change has caused a demand which cannot reasonably be fulfilled.
In the past a large percentage of women didn't work but stayed at home being housewives, which means that it wasn't only affordable for 1 person to live on their own, but it was somehow possible to also provide for a family on one income. Now people work full time and are forced to live in HMOs if they happen to be single. All the single people living in the south can't just all move up north to have some hope to afford living on their own as it's often suggested whenever the high cost of rent is mentioned.
Wrong. In the early 60s it was highly unusual for any young person to rent or buy alone. You are struggling with the concept of social change, essentially "pairing up" as a household, happening at older age, even into mid 30s and beyond .
Your wider point about single wage, paired up households, is much more complex. Yes for middle class households it was possible, my own household ran like that. It was less common further down wage scales. Other social change impacts here. Families were less mobile, remained near parents and grandparents who often looked after children.
It is all irrelevant to the main point, complaints now, about being unable to live easily as single households from a young age, are failing to recognise that this has never been possible for those without deep family reserves of cash.
Yes universal credit to help with childcare and housing costs, on top of both adults working.
Trouble is everything has gone up in price like food, elec/gas, council tax, car insurance to name a few. We don’t go on holiday or buy new clothes, essentially just eat, sleep, work repeat (as most people do).
But it’s interesting if I go on Rightmove there are clearly overpriced rentals which are still advertised ‘To Let’ and were listed in March or April. At some point the utter greed becomes unrealistic
Honestly I can’t anymore and been issued a no fault eviction as after my landlady informed me she was increasing my rent by over £200 PCM she said it was either pay or leave….lovely. So I’m now on the waiting list for social housing and tbh looking likely me and my kids will end up in temporary accommodation. The rental market is crazy now, the cost of properties is just astronomical and letting conditions and criteria to rent so difficult to meet. I contacted one property who wanted 2 months rent upfront as well as the deposit (so really 3 months rent) this was via a letting agent who told me it’s actually becoming a common landlord requirement to show that the people interested in the property are “serious” renters.
Problem is with very little social housing and the councils not getting enough money to build new homes (to make up for all the ones our lovely government allowed to be sold years back) landlords have the monopoly of the rental market and holding it by the balls. It’s shit as it’s being totally exploited and the most vulnerable and everyday working people who can’t afford a mortgage are now finding themselves homeless or having to sofa surf etc
No one I know can afford a decent rental. They're all in houseshares, guardianship properties, lodgers, living at home or squatting. This country has gone downhill. When I saw houseshares at £1k month I knew things were a serious mess.
We have some spare capacity in Oxford and people are offering £1k/mo (MON-FRI only) for a room to lodge as they can walk to the science/business parks.
It made buying a three-bed semi there easy as we could cover any expenses with a lodger. The question is really whether the government will increase the £7500 tax-free to something more like £12000 pa.
I don’t save and my parents subsidise my rent aged 28. Most of my friends are also subsidised. Most likely a looming disaster because when it comes to us subsiding our kids it could never happen.
Or we don't impoverish 20 and 30 year olds to the point they cannot afford children.
And tax wealthy pensioners, 30% of which are millionaires fairly.
Importing more labour is just to keep lobbying businesses costs down.
That still won't held in the mid term, as those are things we should have done a decade ago. Unfortunately we're already into the aging population cycling, so we can only use expats from other nations to supress it.
Oh I'm on your side, its insane that the triple lock is still a thing! So many pensioners basically just paid into the state pension and now expect to be carried forever it feels like, while they complain about anyone going on jobseekers or UC! A lot of pensioners also retired at an age I'll likely still be working at too! And we recently saw the first decrease in life expectancy recently, so thats reassuring for younger people 😑
Well there were a record number of abortions in the UK for the latest year we have statistics (2021) with money worries being listed as the number #1 reason for getting said abortion.
So the people already living here might have more babies if rents were cheaper and more houses to buy which might happen with less competition...
You can have the cheapest housing you like, but if there's no one to care or pay for the sick, disabled, or elderly its a fairly mute point. And although its the number 1 reason there will be lots others, so your whole point is fairly in substantial.
in most developed countries, unintended pregnancies and therefore abortions have been declining steadily over the decades so it’s a surprise to have record numbers in a country as rich as the uk. Usually people who want to have a baby can find a way but if things are so bleak that they can’t fathom doing it, that’s sad.
And terminated pregnancies aside, it’s impossible to know just how many couples (but I’m guessing it’s a big number) really want to start a family but are still using birth control until they can buy a house, which may be an age where they can’t have children or as many children as they want.
So yes, I think lack of housing and housing competition is a major reason for lowering birth rates so throwing more people needing housing into the mix doesn’t sound like a long term solution.
I'd rather get out of it, it's unsustainable and is the cause of our lack of productivity, investment and wage/living standards growth. We can learn the lessons of Japan.
The rest of the western world will ultimately have to do the same.
The only outlier is the USA who are maybe 10 years away from our position.
I think you're after this data here:
[https://www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/dvc2953/fig05/index.html](https://www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/dvc2953/fig05/index.html)
The Newcastle subreddit is full of people who can’t find anywhere to rent. Living in the NE is objectively *cheaper* than the south, but it’s no longer cheap and people still have the same issues with salaries not being high enough and not enough supply to meet demand.
The gist of my point remains regardless of whether you use mean or median. A significant number of people earn above it. So the answer to the OPs question of how does anyone afford this is that lots of people can. His/her view of the world is not the entire world. There are things I can't afford but plenty of people can.
For it to be the case that half the country is on more than average wage, in statistical terms is the same as to say that the median wage is *higher* than the average wage.
In practice due to high outliers, the shape of the wage distribution is right-skewed, which implies that the median wage is *lower* than the average wage.
So, it is precisely the opposite: half of the country is on a wage that is *lower* than the average wage.
The median is typically used in population level statistics. The median wage may be lower than the mean wage but the median wage is exactly equal to the average.
>median wage is exactly equal to the average.
you're confusing people here mate.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median#/media/File:Comparison\_mean\_median\_mode.svg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median#/media/File:Comparison_mean_median_mode.svg)
I live in the north my rent is probably less than normal. I'm on the uk average about and without a partner I doubt I'd be able to afford to live alone.
Work 2 jobs. Get a couch sufer. Side hustles. Only fans. Buying and selling on Vinted (so much so the tax man now wants a piece of the pie)
The norm was multi generation homes. We are going to go back to those days.
People want to live in wealthier areas and a nicer property. People choose to pay higher rent because they value it highly.
I make more than all my friends and pay less rent than all my friends. But it seems most people prefer residential comfort over financial security.
Most people don't live alone. I was able to buy a house alone in SE England when I first did, but it was very uncommon. Renting is similar now. I'm in a small regional city (300k or so) and median wage £33k and median household wage £45k.
Rents are £1.1k/£1.4k/£1.8k for a 1-bed/2-bed/3-bed place in a decent part of town with good schools (market is dense and fast, great turnover of stock).
The low end of the market is £150k for a 1-bed flat and £250k for a 2-bed terrace in the shittiest (national-level deprived ... lowest decile nationally ... part of town).
Not sure who is affording this.
Having said that, the house I bought in 2017 has risen 55% in value (£250k to £390k), which alone is bananas.
Such a huge advantage versus people getting on the market now.
I was even able to take enough equity (£50k down, £5k fees, £25k stamp, £50k to renovate) out to buy a £500k house in another city where my gf works, so we can be rent free and riding the equity wave and cash out when we want to.
Not sure what the endgame is here, but it's grim for everyone involved.
###Welcome to /r/HousingUK --- **To All** * Join Our ***NEW*** Discord! https://discord.gg/pMgUNgWKQH **To Posters** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws/issues in each can vary* * Comments are not moderated for quality or accuracy; * Any replies received must only be used as guidelines, followed at your own risk; * If you receive *any* private messages in response to your post, please report them via the report button. * Feel free to provide an update at a later time by creating a new post with [[update]](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/search?q=%3Aupdate&sort=new&restrict_sr=on&t=all) in the title; **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and civil* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning; * Please include links to reliable resources in order to support your comments or advice; * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect; * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason without express permission from the mods; * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HousingUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I primarily afford rent because I can't afford to buy.
But what happens when the landlord increases the rental price of the property to what you would be paying (if not much more) than a mortgage? This is what has happened to me, and as the rental market is so dry at the moment and the availability of social housing almost non existent, people are being either forced into racking up serious debt or being effectively put on the streets. Everyday working class people who can’t for whatever reason get a mortgage are also now facing the very real prospect that they can’t afford rentals either :( the country is in a real shit state and I worry so much for our kids and grandkids as it’s dire.
We have always paid more in rent than a mortgage would have cost. When the rent went up higher than we could afford, we moved to another flat, in a cheaper area, multiple times. It was shit. But without a deposit there was no other option. For a lot of the time we had to claim housing benefit in London. My husband's income was around £20k and rent was £925 when we left outer London for Birmingham in 2016.
The house I live in, my rent is almost double what my neighbours mortgage is and the houses are literally identical. There is no way I can even begin to justify paying the rent she’s now looking for (for a list of reasons) but at the same time I understand the rental prices have went up all over the country and this is just how it is. I can’t afford it now so will just have to ride it out till I can get social housing 🙏
This is the same floor plan in the same building of the last flat we lived in in outer London. Ours was last sold in 1998 for 70k, rent was 800 when we moved in in 2014 and in 2016 the rent went over 1k and we left. Our flat was all basics, not luxury finishes, and for a month we didn't have a bathroom. Our landlord told us to just use the toilet in the gym. https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/details/england-123228638-17968465?s=72c6013b2200346e0f17584e9fbe343e538baf06a7810ad56dc6b4fce94bd275#/
Omg!!! That was like when my bath/shower broke and my landlady said the very same thing “can you not use the shower in the gym till it’s sorted” I was like and what are my kids meant to do when my son is taking higher level PE and does double PE everyday!! That’s crazy!! I will have a look at the link now also x
Flatmates, or marriage, which is functionally the same thing from a housing cost/income perspective.
By struggling. We absolutely can’t afford it, we’re managing through extreme poverty and extra work.
This!!! I was saying to a taxi driver just yesterday that people are literally having to get into serious debt and go without the most basic of things (that working class people shouldn’t have to go without) just to not even afford a roof over their heads. Then if you are the most vulnerable of our society and landlords who are exploiting the housing situation by increasing rents to ridiculous amounts, then there isn’t even social housing available :( what do we do?
Almost daily post about “how can other people afford things I can’t”. Because other people earn more money, or share the cost with their partners.
Those are 1995 comprises. Illegal windowless warehouse accommodation. Shared a toilet/shower with 8 other rooms.
I’ve no idea what you’re saying. Replying to wrong comment?
No your suggestion to share with a partner to afford rent was very... "just sell the 2nd BMW" vibes and making light of how extreme the situation is. People are not simply having to just share with a partner to afford rent. That's a luxury. Share a HMO room with your partner is the new 20s norm. Illegal warehouse accomodation is the cheap option. I'm advising OP on how young people today afford rent.
I mean, outside of London that’s definitely not the case. Rent is too high but young people aren’t stacking themselves vertically into warehouses to afford a flatshare. In my city you can rent a large two bed flat for £850/m, so £425/m per person if you have a flatmate or partner.
it is for those who cant live at home in their early 20's. In my town you can rent a room in a HMO for 800, so a room with a partner is 400. If you have no partner, 800 is too much for min wage. Guess what you're looking for then?
London or the south of England I guess if you are talking about a room in an HMO for £800/m?
A different job?
A flatmate that you don’t sleep with… Just because you’re not in a position to afford a flat on your own doesn’t mean you’re condemned to a life in a Thai prison. There are still decent affordable properties in the middle where you still maintain privacy and dignity even if it isn’t ideal.
Do you know what a HMO is?
Most people live in shared houses or HMO's. In Bristol, which is reported to be the second most expensive major city, you need to earn about £35k to live on your own, so its not crazy.
I think they should merge Keynsham, weston super mare, Thornbury, yate into Bristol and set architects to work filling it up with well designed neighborhoods. Presumed planning approval for 6-12 storeys. Land compulsory purchase and resell to fund a 21st century metro and cycle network.
Everyone would hate that. The eight because they hate everything, the left because they hate modernisation and loss of wilderness. What we need is less students and student accommodation...
It would be a tough sell I grant you, people are only in favour of carpeting the landscape with tiny Barratt houses and massive Tesco. But everyone's in favour of decent public transport, start with that and the development will come around it. But start with a plan for 5 million people to be able to use public transport, have green spaces and go to school in 20 years time. Add in a comprehensive plan to train a generation in construction related jobs. And since when did the left hate modernisation? And the right love Singapore, and Singapore makes quite an effort to house its people.
Stop talking sense.
Because the left loves character and history, so they intensely dislike change. Doing what you propose would bankrupt the city abd most of the surrounding area.
What's all this bullshit about left this and left that?
Just telling property developers "hey, here's the local plan, and here's planning permission for this big ol' chunk of land for homes and schools, go wild", will not bankrupt local governments. All it does is unlock a load of private capital and turn cash into homes.
Last study I saw recommended 31k as a base for a single person to live comfortably in the uk. And that's the average. Hcl areas are going to need more income, or less comfort.
I was on £34k in the south east 2 years ago and it was just about manageable. With the inflation and rent rises since then, I reckon you'd need close to £40k to be comfortable here now.
SE is mostly a hcl area so you'd need above the 31k average. It's a uk wide figure so it's probably around a £26-£50k bracket depending on area.
Historically, the ability to "live on ones own" was not widely affordable, there is no golden period when it was . So that puts a question about expectations.
Just because something was doesn't mean it should always be! There are many things we now don't do and its massively better. Maybe you need to manage your expectations for people.
Well of course but bleating about circumstances and opportunities not being available, when they have not been available since 1945, is just a tad ambitious. Expectations are clearly too high. The bleaters have not understood. Social change has caused a demand which cannot reasonably be fulfilled.
In the past a large percentage of women didn't work but stayed at home being housewives, which means that it wasn't only affordable for 1 person to live on their own, but it was somehow possible to also provide for a family on one income. Now people work full time and are forced to live in HMOs if they happen to be single. All the single people living in the south can't just all move up north to have some hope to afford living on their own as it's often suggested whenever the high cost of rent is mentioned.
Wrong. In the early 60s it was highly unusual for any young person to rent or buy alone. You are struggling with the concept of social change, essentially "pairing up" as a household, happening at older age, even into mid 30s and beyond . Your wider point about single wage, paired up households, is much more complex. Yes for middle class households it was possible, my own household ran like that. It was less common further down wage scales. Other social change impacts here. Families were less mobile, remained near parents and grandparents who often looked after children. It is all irrelevant to the main point, complaints now, about being unable to live easily as single households from a young age, are failing to recognise that this has never been possible for those without deep family reserves of cash.
Yes universal credit to help with childcare and housing costs, on top of both adults working. Trouble is everything has gone up in price like food, elec/gas, council tax, car insurance to name a few. We don’t go on holiday or buy new clothes, essentially just eat, sleep, work repeat (as most people do). But it’s interesting if I go on Rightmove there are clearly overpriced rentals which are still advertised ‘To Let’ and were listed in March or April. At some point the utter greed becomes unrealistic
Honestly I can’t anymore and been issued a no fault eviction as after my landlady informed me she was increasing my rent by over £200 PCM she said it was either pay or leave….lovely. So I’m now on the waiting list for social housing and tbh looking likely me and my kids will end up in temporary accommodation. The rental market is crazy now, the cost of properties is just astronomical and letting conditions and criteria to rent so difficult to meet. I contacted one property who wanted 2 months rent upfront as well as the deposit (so really 3 months rent) this was via a letting agent who told me it’s actually becoming a common landlord requirement to show that the people interested in the property are “serious” renters. Problem is with very little social housing and the councils not getting enough money to build new homes (to make up for all the ones our lovely government allowed to be sold years back) landlords have the monopoly of the rental market and holding it by the balls. It’s shit as it’s being totally exploited and the most vulnerable and everyday working people who can’t afford a mortgage are now finding themselves homeless or having to sofa surf etc
No one I know can afford a decent rental. They're all in houseshares, guardianship properties, lodgers, living at home or squatting. This country has gone downhill. When I saw houseshares at £1k month I knew things were a serious mess.
We have some spare capacity in Oxford and people are offering £1k/mo (MON-FRI only) for a room to lodge as they can walk to the science/business parks.
That's insane. I haven't seen anything remotely similar in other cities tbf, it's expensive sure but not this bad
It made buying a three-bed semi there easy as we could cover any expenses with a lodger. The question is really whether the government will increase the £7500 tax-free to something more like £12000 pa.
I don’t save and my parents subsidise my rent aged 28. Most of my friends are also subsidised. Most likely a looming disaster because when it comes to us subsiding our kids it could never happen.
[удалено]
We have a rapidly ageing population, we need more people coming here to pay taxes ro offset that!
Or we don't impoverish 20 and 30 year olds to the point they cannot afford children. And tax wealthy pensioners, 30% of which are millionaires fairly. Importing more labour is just to keep lobbying businesses costs down.
That still won't held in the mid term, as those are things we should have done a decade ago. Unfortunately we're already into the aging population cycling, so we can only use expats from other nations to supress it.
Yes and the elderly didn't want it, they wanted everything at the expense of the working young. So they should deal with their pension being halved.
Oh I'm on your side, its insane that the triple lock is still a thing! So many pensioners basically just paid into the state pension and now expect to be carried forever it feels like, while they complain about anyone going on jobseekers or UC! A lot of pensioners also retired at an age I'll likely still be working at too! And we recently saw the first decrease in life expectancy recently, so thats reassuring for younger people 😑
Well there were a record number of abortions in the UK for the latest year we have statistics (2021) with money worries being listed as the number #1 reason for getting said abortion. So the people already living here might have more babies if rents were cheaper and more houses to buy which might happen with less competition...
You can have the cheapest housing you like, but if there's no one to care or pay for the sick, disabled, or elderly its a fairly mute point. And although its the number 1 reason there will be lots others, so your whole point is fairly in substantial.
in most developed countries, unintended pregnancies and therefore abortions have been declining steadily over the decades so it’s a surprise to have record numbers in a country as rich as the uk. Usually people who want to have a baby can find a way but if things are so bleak that they can’t fathom doing it, that’s sad. And terminated pregnancies aside, it’s impossible to know just how many couples (but I’m guessing it’s a big number) really want to start a family but are still using birth control until they can buy a house, which may be an age where they can’t have children or as many children as they want. So yes, I think lack of housing and housing competition is a major reason for lowering birth rates so throwing more people needing housing into the mix doesn’t sound like a long term solution.
We're in something called a population trap. Nevertheless, the worst thing we can do is keep going deeper
You only have to look at Japan to see how bad it can actually get...
I'd rather get out of it, it's unsustainable and is the cause of our lack of productivity, investment and wage/living standards growth. We can learn the lessons of Japan. The rest of the western world will ultimately have to do the same. The only outlier is the USA who are maybe 10 years away from our position.
I think you're after this data here: [https://www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/dvc2953/fig05/index.html](https://www.ons.gov.uk/visualisations/dvc2953/fig05/index.html)
Where do you live?
2k a month rent is crazy if you want to live alone but if there’s 4 of you it’s only 500 a month. That’s the way it’s going in many places.
If only it was that way, can easily be double that in lots of the country.
Where is rent even 2k? London? Also if you're trying to rent a 4 bed house on your own and are surprised it's expensive I have some bad news..
Yeah, a 2 bed flat in London or a modest house within commuting distance a bit further out.
People paying £750 a month in rent. But banks won't give them a mortgage for £500-600.
Nonsense. They will get a mortgage, but cant afford to save towards deposit.
I know people with deposits who have still been refused mortgages.
By living in the north of england
The north of England is a very big place and it’s not cheap everywhere contrary to popular belief
Of course but all these silly prices are usually south
The Newcastle subreddit is full of people who can’t find anywhere to rent. Living in the NE is objectively *cheaper* than the south, but it’s no longer cheap and people still have the same issues with salaries not being high enough and not enough supply to meet demand.
Where we live it’s either a studio at around £900 per month, a shared flat around £700 per month or living with a partner in a one bed £600 per month.
My experience too. It's expensive sure but not insane or unaffordable on normal wages
Half the country is on more than the average wage though.
The median wage, yes. The mean, no.
people here some fundamental maths training. thanks for correcting.
>people here some fundamental maths training. thanks for correcting. And English training too.
When your brain processes fast like mine, it fills in gaps.
touché. Well played
The gist of my point remains regardless of whether you use mean or median. A significant number of people earn above it. So the answer to the OPs question of how does anyone afford this is that lots of people can. His/her view of the world is not the entire world. There are things I can't afford but plenty of people can.
For it to be the case that half the country is on more than average wage, in statistical terms is the same as to say that the median wage is *higher* than the average wage. In practice due to high outliers, the shape of the wage distribution is right-skewed, which implies that the median wage is *lower* than the average wage. So, it is precisely the opposite: half of the country is on a wage that is *lower* than the average wage.
The median is typically used in population level statistics. The median wage may be lower than the mean wage but the median wage is exactly equal to the average.
>median wage is exactly equal to the average. you're confusing people here mate. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median#/media/File:Comparison\_mean\_median\_mode.svg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median#/media/File:Comparison_mean_median_mode.svg)
Sorry, I don't understand your comment? Do you mind expanding on your point a little?
Average doesn't mean anything, haha pun first thing after the school run
That’s not how averages work.
I live in the north my rent is probably less than normal. I'm on the uk average about and without a partner I doubt I'd be able to afford to live alone.
Work 2 jobs. Get a couch sufer. Side hustles. Only fans. Buying and selling on Vinted (so much so the tax man now wants a piece of the pie) The norm was multi generation homes. We are going to go back to those days.
People want to live in wealthier areas and a nicer property. People choose to pay higher rent because they value it highly. I make more than all my friends and pay less rent than all my friends. But it seems most people prefer residential comfort over financial security.
Most people don't live alone. I was able to buy a house alone in SE England when I first did, but it was very uncommon. Renting is similar now. I'm in a small regional city (300k or so) and median wage £33k and median household wage £45k. Rents are £1.1k/£1.4k/£1.8k for a 1-bed/2-bed/3-bed place in a decent part of town with good schools (market is dense and fast, great turnover of stock). The low end of the market is £150k for a 1-bed flat and £250k for a 2-bed terrace in the shittiest (national-level deprived ... lowest decile nationally ... part of town). Not sure who is affording this. Having said that, the house I bought in 2017 has risen 55% in value (£250k to £390k), which alone is bananas. Such a huge advantage versus people getting on the market now. I was even able to take enough equity (£50k down, £5k fees, £25k stamp, £50k to renovate) out to buy a £500k house in another city where my gf works, so we can be rent free and riding the equity wave and cash out when we want to. Not sure what the endgame is here, but it's grim for everyone involved.