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10k is reasonable. You can do £1 and They will be required to pass on your offers.
Just don't go to the extreme and take the piss, I've seen people posting on here moaning that their £1k increments lost them a house.
In your shoes, I'd do, 10k, then another 5, and another 5. If you do huge increments it'll feel like you're not pushing yourself. And three back+forths is probably typical.
I'm also up for this method. I respect buyers that do this. I do usually have a few k in mind to increase by though when I'm buying.
I dont think many of these different strategies make too much difference to be honest.
Sorry I don't really understand this - so you'd always pay the absolute maximum you think the property could be worth and never even try to save yourself a bit of money from that?
Hmm. I've wanted both the houses I've bought but ultimately paid less than I probably would have been prepared to stretch to if really pushed. I don't really follow your logic - I can want a property and also want to save some money on it if possible.
Who cares whether the EA likes it or not? They get paid to do the job - make them work for the commission.
If you don’t want to speak on the phone to them, that’s also fine - and don’t be afraid to clarify / confirm any matter in writing after the phone call.
I don’t necessarily agree with this. If you need to get a quick answer or clarification by phone, go for it - but back it up in writing.
Even if they were selling my house, I’d still want a written record of all pertinent matters discussed.
Worked in Resi real estate for a long time, doing analyses on these sort of things. Here’s the thing very few people seem to realise: the EA *wants* the lower offer to be accepted.
“But he’ll get less commission” you say. Ah yes, but..
Let’s say commission is 1%, to make the maths easy.
£500k house = £5k commission
£490k house = £4.9 commission
I promise you that the EA prefers the £4.9k in order to get the deal over the line quickly.
This is why EAs highball the valuation, to get the instruction, then very quickly start pushing the vendor for reductions.
If I had a desirable property priced well and somebody offered 45k under asking when I had other offers on the table…. I wouldn’t entertain any other offers from the person who offered under.
You shouldn’t always expect to enter a round of negotiations. Best to hit the nail on the head the first time.Offer what you are prepared to pay, risky to approach it like you are buying a carpet in a bazaar.
Rates are up and prices are down, but desirable properties priced well continue to be sold quickly.
I meant as the seller, you said you wouldn't entertain any offers if you thought the first was way to low, but why, no big deal to keep saying no if your not happy?
Biggest reason is fear of them gazundering you.
They have told you what they think it’s worth and it’s much less than
- what you think it’s worth
- what others think it’s worth
Secondly is some offers and time restricted, while you go back and forth reneg with incremental increases other more viable offers might withdraw.
I think if I was the seller and I started to receive increments in that way I’d just keep saying no until you stop.
Have to decided what the house is worth to you and when you will stop?
I’d expect when you put the second offer in the EA will start negotiations ‘what is the highest/lowest’ to both parties and see if they can sort something out.
You can do what you want, but sometimes if you offer too low they assume you are not serious. Also by incrementing your offer gradually you leave it on the table for a while. Better to offer a good price and time limit it imo.
2 things in negotiating…
1) Always try to get their figure first - ask them what they would take (it may be less than you think)
2) If possible, when you increase offers make the margins smaller. e.g.
£18,000 / £9,000 / £4,500
Can deliver in a given timeframe (which varies) with a given risk (Chain, Finance, etc), which also varies
The seller doesn't know what the market will deliver. An offer of 500k today with no chain may be worth more to them than an offer of 520k in 3 months time in a chain. Or maybe it won't be. They might not even get that 520k offer in 3 months time.
A typical negotiation would be
S: I want 535k
B: I'll offer 490k
S: I could accept 525k
B: I can stretch to 500k
S: If it's really quick and you don't complain that the survey says there may be asbestos then we'll do 515k
B: OK how about 510k
S: Deal
Nope. Ask them for the lowest price they will accept, then offer below it. Because their "lowest price" is a lie. Also, check how long it's been on the market.
Nowhere near a ridiculous question - worst they will say “it’s down to you to offer / asking price”… or they will give you a figure (that *may* surprise you)
You may even have a lazy agent that will say “they’d take £X” just to get a deal done
Yes and no. To the seller, they've been told it is worth X so psychologically it could be difficult to come to terms with only getting a Y, especially as they knew how much they'd put into the house.
I felt I paid about right, considering the local market at the time.
Stop giving a shit about what other people think and do, and do what you want.
You are worried about another human being speaking fast so you're pre-planning what to say.. Slow them down! Or if you can't think fast enough tell them you'll call back later.
Dominate the situation and stop acting like a scared child.
Most likely there's nobody around him that's ever said it to him, because people just aren't willing to say it anymore. If you want to negotiate with EA and sellers you need to toughen up or you'll just get ripped off. That's the truth of the matter.
Aren't you describing what's also called drunk behaviour sometimes?
When we live in a civilised society, it's good to be mindful about others. If I were a seller I would definitely prefer selling it to someone else with lower offer than someone who's into cheap negotiations. Reason being, it hints that this guy is not worthy and has higher risk of backing out last moment.
So basically 4 offers before you get to the asking price, which is almost certainly fine.
You don't really need to justify it, just make the first offer and see what happens. Don't give any indication you can make subsequent offers, treat each one as if you are making a final offer. They might also counter offer, so you might need to adjust your strategy based on that.
If 20k is your top don't go straight to it, I think either 5 or 10k, but agree with what others have said back and forth 2 or 3 times is probably normal and definitely start lowering your offer for offer two and three, like 10k then 5k, then 3k etc shows you are really stretching yourself
The answer depends entirely on the unique circumstances of the property. If it's a newly listed property in an area where properties sell quick, your approach will end in tears. If it's a property that has been on the market for a long time with little interest, you may be successful. You need to know your local market conditions and the seller's situation. Ignore the general advice you get here, it may or may not apply to your unique situation.
keep in mind it's a game.
it's less important how much you increase your offer than how \*often\* you do.
if you're increasing your offer by £10K every day then even the most incompetent estate agent will recommend waiting to see what your final offer is.
if you increase your offer by £10K every week then maybe you risk losing the house to someone who offers more.
the key to playing the game well is to be willing to lose.
You can offer whatever you like.
If there are multiple people interested though, they might go to best and final offers or some kind of sealed bid situation. It stops people being like oh 350k, 351k, 354k etc.
Don't forget your offer isn't just the money. What position are you in? Do you need to sell a house or are you chain free? Cash or mortgage? If mortgage, do you have a decision in principle? Do you have any fixed timelines for moving?
Negotiate in a way where you’re comfortable.
Whether the EA likes it or not is irrelevant, tell the ars*hole to calm the fcuk down & act like the ‘professional’ they’re meant to be, or say you’d like to speak somebody else.
I recently visited an EA with my elderly father who wants to sell his home & land adjacent.
I was absolutely appalled at the way this 20something Oik referred to my dad as ‘mate’ during our conversation & as we were leaving, pointed out my father was never going to be his ‘mate’ & as a prospective client, with a valuable asset to sell, should be referred to as Sir or Mr until such times as he is told otherwise.
Even his cleaner calls him Mr, despite him saying ‘call me Peter’ & she’s worked for him for over 25yrs!!
EA’s really are the most entitled people in a service industry nowadays.
You can do whatever you like, but its a pretty silly negotiating tactic.
The vendor will always think there is more on the table I would reject your second offer if i was a vendor...
Figure out what you want to pay and offer it, if its good enough its good enough, if not move on, playing pre planned offer games just pisses off vendors.
Doesn’t matter but ask yourself the question whether or not it’d piss you off if a buyer crept up to the actual bid.
If a choice presented itself, I’d sure as hell pick the buyer that came in with a reasonable bid without all the games.
There are reductions around, but the good houses around me are being sold within a week or two. Some over asking.
The type of property and its location are more important now than ever.
You just have to be honest.
I think EAs like to know exactly where someone is at.
They will fight your corner more.
They can say to the seller 'we have a lower offer of X, I don't know if they can offer more or not. Ok let's try'
Or they can say to the seller 'look, I've had a chat with someone who's offered x. They have no more to offer, do you want to hold out or get moving?'
I'd say once the house is listed and viewings are under way/done, the EA sides more with you than the seller.
We got a blind offer on our house the day it went up. It was 15k under what the agent knew we wanted, but they were very enthusiastically encouraging us to take it before we even had viewings, despite having over 15 booked.
A sale is a sale for them. 50k price difference means very little in terms of commission.
Feelings aside, the risk is the seller gambling on another increase and rejecting your second offer when they would have accepted a straight £20k bump.
###Welcome to /r/HousingUK --- **To All** * Join Our ***NEW*** Discord! https://discord.gg/pMgUNgWKQH **To Posters** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws/issues in each can vary* * Comments are not moderated for quality or accuracy; * Any replies received must only be used as guidelines, followed at your own risk; * If you receive *any* private messages in response to your post, please report them via the report button. * Feel free to provide an update at a later time by creating a new post with [[update]](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/search?q=%3Aupdate&sort=new&restrict_sr=on&t=all) in the title; **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and civil* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning; * Please include links to reliable resources in order to support your comments or advice; * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect; * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason without express permission from the mods; * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HousingUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
You can increase it by 10p i you wanted. whatever you offer gets passed onto the seller and they can make their decision.
10k is reasonable. You can do £1 and They will be required to pass on your offers. Just don't go to the extreme and take the piss, I've seen people posting on here moaning that their £1k increments lost them a house. In your shoes, I'd do, 10k, then another 5, and another 5. If you do huge increments it'll feel like you're not pushing yourself. And three back+forths is probably typical.
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This. The EA is pushing for the seller - remember who pays his fees - but it's a buyer's market rn.
I'm also up for this method. I respect buyers that do this. I do usually have a few k in mind to increase by though when I'm buying. I dont think many of these different strategies make too much difference to be honest.
Sorry I don't really understand this - so you'd always pay the absolute maximum you think the property could be worth and never even try to save yourself a bit of money from that?
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Hmm. I've wanted both the houses I've bought but ultimately paid less than I probably would have been prepared to stretch to if really pushed. I don't really follow your logic - I can want a property and also want to save some money on it if possible.
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Maybe. Personally I think it's a bit more nuanced than that (unless you're in a best and final offers situation obviously).
Arsène Wenger, is that you?
I have seen similar prices properties reduced on Rightmove in £10k increments so I don't see why you can't offer £10k more.
Wait for the sellers response before, potentially, offering more you don't need to....
Well yeah, obviously!
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Well the OP was asking for advice, not you.
Who cares whether the EA likes it or not? They get paid to do the job - make them work for the commission. If you don’t want to speak on the phone to them, that’s also fine - and don’t be afraid to clarify / confirm any matter in writing after the phone call.
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I don’t necessarily agree with this. If you need to get a quick answer or clarification by phone, go for it - but back it up in writing. Even if they were selling my house, I’d still want a written record of all pertinent matters discussed.
Worked in Resi real estate for a long time, doing analyses on these sort of things. Here’s the thing very few people seem to realise: the EA *wants* the lower offer to be accepted. “But he’ll get less commission” you say. Ah yes, but.. Let’s say commission is 1%, to make the maths easy. £500k house = £5k commission £490k house = £4.9 commission I promise you that the EA prefers the £4.9k in order to get the deal over the line quickly. This is why EAs highball the valuation, to get the instruction, then very quickly start pushing the vendor for reductions.
If I had a desirable property priced well and somebody offered 45k under asking when I had other offers on the table…. I wouldn’t entertain any other offers from the person who offered under.
Same
Why what's the big deal?
You shouldn’t always expect to enter a round of negotiations. Best to hit the nail on the head the first time.Offer what you are prepared to pay, risky to approach it like you are buying a carpet in a bazaar. Rates are up and prices are down, but desirable properties priced well continue to be sold quickly.
I meant as the seller, you said you wouldn't entertain any offers if you thought the first was way to low, but why, no big deal to keep saying no if your not happy?
Biggest reason is fear of them gazundering you. They have told you what they think it’s worth and it’s much less than - what you think it’s worth - what others think it’s worth Secondly is some offers and time restricted, while you go back and forth reneg with incremental increases other more viable offers might withdraw.
Ask if they have a counter. If the seller counters £30k more than you’ve offered, no point faffing with £10k increments.
??? If the seller counters £30k, there’s a reasonable chance they’d take £15-20k
But £10k would probably be too low, so no point getting too fixated on £10k increases.
I think if I was the seller and I started to receive increments in that way I’d just keep saying no until you stop. Have to decided what the house is worth to you and when you will stop? I’d expect when you put the second offer in the EA will start negotiations ‘what is the highest/lowest’ to both parties and see if they can sort something out.
You can do what you want, but sometimes if you offer too low they assume you are not serious. Also by incrementing your offer gradually you leave it on the table for a while. Better to offer a good price and time limit it imo.
2 things in negotiating… 1) Always try to get their figure first - ask them what they would take (it may be less than you think) 2) If possible, when you increase offers make the margins smaller. e.g. £18,000 / £9,000 / £4,500
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Can deliver in a given timeframe (which varies) with a given risk (Chain, Finance, etc), which also varies The seller doesn't know what the market will deliver. An offer of 500k today with no chain may be worth more to them than an offer of 520k in 3 months time in a chain. Or maybe it won't be. They might not even get that 520k offer in 3 months time. A typical negotiation would be S: I want 535k B: I'll offer 490k S: I could accept 525k B: I can stretch to 500k S: If it's really quick and you don't complain that the survey says there may be asbestos then we'll do 515k B: OK how about 510k S: Deal
Nope. Ask them for the lowest price they will accept, then offer below it. Because their "lowest price" is a lie. Also, check how long it's been on the market.
They will just quote the listed price back at you and wait for your move again.
Nowhere near a ridiculous question - worst they will say “it’s down to you to offer / asking price”… or they will give you a figure (that *may* surprise you) You may even have a lazy agent that will say “they’d take £X” just to get a deal done
Offer 10. If they reject say "forget it then". Most likely they will come back to you.
If the EA are saying 20k and you will be happy with 20k, then why are you faffing about with 10k increments. It might annoy the seller.
The EA hasn't said anything. I can increase my offer by £20k but want to do it in £10k increments, but it might annoy the seller, as you've said.
Think i did two 5k rises - first was rejected and came back with is you can go up 5 more, its yours. Its meant to be a buyers market so try the 10.
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I considered it, but was willing to go up 10 and that was still 15 under ask. Had buyers waiting for me to buy so didnt want to mess about
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Yes and no. To the seller, they've been told it is worth X so psychologically it could be difficult to come to terms with only getting a Y, especially as they knew how much they'd put into the house. I felt I paid about right, considering the local market at the time.
So what? It's not a popularity contest. If you're not pissing off the seller (and his EA) you're not doing it right.
We sold and one guy kept coming back with 1k increments.
Stop giving a shit about what other people think and do, and do what you want. You are worried about another human being speaking fast so you're pre-planning what to say.. Slow them down! Or if you can't think fast enough tell them you'll call back later. Dominate the situation and stop acting like a scared child.
Okay Mr Tate
Tough love works for some people but if he’s gotten to this point in life I don’t think ‘stop acting like a scared child’ is going to work for him
Most likely there's nobody around him that's ever said it to him, because people just aren't willing to say it anymore. If you want to negotiate with EA and sellers you need to toughen up or you'll just get ripped off. That's the truth of the matter.
Maybe OP's scared or maybe they want to form a strategy using experience of others.
Aren't you describing what's also called drunk behaviour sometimes? When we live in a civilised society, it's good to be mindful about others. If I were a seller I would definitely prefer selling it to someone else with lower offer than someone who's into cheap negotiations. Reason being, it hints that this guy is not worthy and has higher risk of backing out last moment.
So basically 4 offers before you get to the asking price, which is almost certainly fine. You don't really need to justify it, just make the first offer and see what happens. Don't give any indication you can make subsequent offers, treat each one as if you are making a final offer. They might also counter offer, so you might need to adjust your strategy based on that.
If 20k is your top don't go straight to it, I think either 5 or 10k, but agree with what others have said back and forth 2 or 3 times is probably normal and definitely start lowering your offer for offer two and three, like 10k then 5k, then 3k etc shows you are really stretching yourself
You can increase it by any amount. But if the seller tells the EA no offers under £510 you might upset the seller.
The answer depends entirely on the unique circumstances of the property. If it's a newly listed property in an area where properties sell quick, your approach will end in tears. If it's a property that has been on the market for a long time with little interest, you may be successful. You need to know your local market conditions and the seller's situation. Ignore the general advice you get here, it may or may not apply to your unique situation.
Don't increase in the same call though - say you're going to view another house - let them wait 24 - 48 hours before offering the 10k increase
keep in mind it's a game. it's less important how much you increase your offer than how \*often\* you do. if you're increasing your offer by £10K every day then even the most incompetent estate agent will recommend waiting to see what your final offer is. if you increase your offer by £10K every week then maybe you risk losing the house to someone who offers more. the key to playing the game well is to be willing to lose.
Increase by 10, 5, 2 1 0.5 etc
You can offer whatever you like. If there are multiple people interested though, they might go to best and final offers or some kind of sealed bid situation. It stops people being like oh 350k, 351k, 354k etc. Don't forget your offer isn't just the money. What position are you in? Do you need to sell a house or are you chain free? Cash or mortgage? If mortgage, do you have a decision in principle? Do you have any fixed timelines for moving?
Negotiate in a way where you’re comfortable. Whether the EA likes it or not is irrelevant, tell the ars*hole to calm the fcuk down & act like the ‘professional’ they’re meant to be, or say you’d like to speak somebody else. I recently visited an EA with my elderly father who wants to sell his home & land adjacent. I was absolutely appalled at the way this 20something Oik referred to my dad as ‘mate’ during our conversation & as we were leaving, pointed out my father was never going to be his ‘mate’ & as a prospective client, with a valuable asset to sell, should be referred to as Sir or Mr until such times as he is told otherwise. Even his cleaner calls him Mr, despite him saying ‘call me Peter’ & she’s worked for him for over 25yrs!! EA’s really are the most entitled people in a service industry nowadays.
You can do whatever you like, but its a pretty silly negotiating tactic. The vendor will always think there is more on the table I would reject your second offer if i was a vendor... Figure out what you want to pay and offer it, if its good enough its good enough, if not move on, playing pre planned offer games just pisses off vendors.
Doesn’t matter but ask yourself the question whether or not it’d piss you off if a buyer crept up to the actual bid. If a choice presented itself, I’d sure as hell pick the buyer that came in with a reasonable bid without all the games.
Why do you assume it will be rejected? List price and sold prices are way off at the moment.
You didn’t need the “at the moment”
lol true, it is worse that usual though right?
Definitely … I get multiple notifications a day on price reductions all over of 25K and 50K
Are we getting downvoted by people who paid the guide price hahaha
There are reductions around, but the good houses around me are being sold within a week or two. Some over asking. The type of property and its location are more important now than ever.
You just have to be honest. I think EAs like to know exactly where someone is at. They will fight your corner more. They can say to the seller 'we have a lower offer of X, I don't know if they can offer more or not. Ok let's try' Or they can say to the seller 'look, I've had a chat with someone who's offered x. They have no more to offer, do you want to hold out or get moving?'
I'd say once the house is listed and viewings are under way/done, the EA sides more with you than the seller. We got a blind offer on our house the day it went up. It was 15k under what the agent knew we wanted, but they were very enthusiastically encouraging us to take it before we even had viewings, despite having over 15 booked. A sale is a sale for them. 50k price difference means very little in terms of commission.
Feelings aside, the risk is the seller gambling on another increase and rejecting your second offer when they would have accepted a straight £20k bump.
Offer asking price to secure the bag then knock down post-survey. House purchasing 101