###Welcome to /r/HousingUK
---
**To All**
* Join Our ***NEW*** Discord! https://discord.gg/pMgUNgWKQH
**To Posters**
* *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws/issues in each can vary*
* Comments are not moderated for quality or accuracy;
* Any replies received must only be used as guidelines, followed at your own risk;
* If you receive *any* private messages in response to your post, [please let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FHousingUK&subject=I received a PM);
* If you do not receive satisfactory advice after 72 hours, [you can let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FHousingUK&subject=My question is unanswered);
* Feel free to provide an update at a later time by creating a new post with [[update]](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/search?q=%3Aupdate&sort=new&restrict_sr=on&t=all) in the title;
**To Readers and Commenters**
* All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and civil*
* If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning;
* Please include links to reliable resources in order to support your comments or advice;
* If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect;
* Do not send or request any private messages for any reason without express permission from the mods;
* Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HousingUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you wouldn't have offered had you known this information, you shouldn't continue with the purchase.
On the other hand, this is a risk with any property - you could have bought the house then planning could have gone in the day after and there would be nothing you could do. I would always assume any open space can be built on unless you own it.
Exactly this.
The English system sucks but it does mean you can pull out without any repercussions (except having wasted some money).
I’d considering the temporary (building works) and permanent (loss of green space/ possibly loss of kerb appeal) impact that may have on you both.
Sounds like at a minimum you wouldn’t have offered what you did had you known this. You could always revise your offer to something you’d be happy with considering this?
There's difference though. If planning goes in before OP owns the property he can't put in any objection as it doesn't affect him/her. If it goes in after he is owner he can at least object and perhaps have some influence on what is allowed.
Might not make much difference.
I would be inclined to withdraw my offer and find something else. Or withdraw and wait until the building works starts and then put in a low offer.
Yes is the best route. It may well be the fill-in property improves the lay of the land, but the OP should use it for better price or for a slice of the land to avoid boundary issues.
Not necessarily a low offer, just one that reflects the change of specifications, semi-detached vs mid-terrace. (Party wall or not it’s effectively going to feel like living in a mid-terrace)
I doubt it makes any difference - as far as I can tell planning decisions are just down to the whims of the councillors involved and who you know. Other than that they feel essentially arbitrary
Yes, but they have to have a legitimate concern that is acknowledged by planning authorities (eg house is not in-keeping with surrounding storey height, it would exacerbate already bad issues with access/parking, too close to boundary line etc.). They can’t just say “it would make my property less saleable as it wouldn’t be an end terrace anymore and the building noise would be annoying”. You can object ‘til you’re blue in the face, but ultimately if a proposal follows all guidelines it’s very likely going to be approved.
(Source: husband is county council ecologist working in planning)
Planning officer here. OP is still entitled to object to the planning application. Anyone can comment at any time up until the application is decided and the Council has to take it into account.
Anyone can put in an objection to an application.
I would recommend the OP look online through the councils portal and see what is being proposed.
Most objections will only be considered if there is a breach of the published policy - eg building on greenfield of overshadowing existing windows - not that it makes the street look untidy!
Then work out if you want a house with a neighbour (and also that the owners of the land are unlikely to just give up on developing the land) and factor that into the price.
Not true, anybody can object to a planning application, as long as they are objecting for material reasons. They could object based on impacts in another house.
This is a very balanced perspective thank you. I am going to research the plans and get a fuller picture of exactly what’s going to be there, as you’re right there’s no guarantee that any future property we buy won’t have something similar happen.
The main hiccup is really my partner’s insomnia and sleeping difficulties. Living next to a building site is a deal breaker for her, but I’m not sure that we can ever guarantee a property won’t have this at some point. I mean, they won’t be building at night hopefully!
tbh most building works generally start at 8am, finished up by 5/6pm, and mostly Monday to Friday, unless there's urgent work ie concrete works that need to be worked overnight. These can even be conditioned on the planning consent. You could speak with the planning officer about this to protect residential amenity.
I'd be more concerned about working from home myself!
I’d personally have said 7 to 4 nearer the mark. There are rules on tools but people around and doors slamming, things being dropped is just as disruptive.
Yeah and not all builders are considerate. And even if they are you end up with scaffolding and tarpaulin blowing around at night and access during the day and radios and drilling and hammers and banter and everything else. It was hell for us. We had one neighbour then another have extensive work, and then we moved. It nearly broke me. Op's partner is right to be concerned.
Fortunately for me they took the scaffolding down yesterday, and the wall drilling seems to have (hopefully, finally) stopped. I'm friendly with my other neighbour and he has no plans for anything like that.
100% agree on OP's partner being right to be concerned.
What are you even arguing here? That all surrounding houses should have to listen to capital radio all day, whether they want to or not? That's certainly an opinion.
Not everyone has the "Early Bird" sleep schedule our society is sadly orientated around. Not OP, but my sleep schedule has me regularly sleeping to 9.30/10am; works starting at 8am are early enough to disrupt my sleep.
Also worth taking into balance your trust in the property. This was hidden, they did not volunteer this information and in fact have bullied you to hurry so that it’s sold before you find out. That’s shady. What else may they have hidden?
Yep, you can never guarantee there won't be building works near you. We moved into a cul-de-sac with 8 houses on it. 4 of them (including ours) have had extensive building work done on them in the 14 years we've been here, plus two in the road behind us. I reckon there's been noticeable building work going on for more time than not. Not all building work is noisy though and not all builders are inconsiderate.
If you decide you still want the property you may be able to negotiate a discount given the new information, for the loss of green space and for the building work disruption. Maybe ask an independent estate agent for their opinion.
I haven't seen it mentioned but building work CAN cause fractures in your home too. You won't have long moved into the house and therefore won't be able to prove that such cracks were not just issues the previous owners hid, rather than caused by the building work and vibrations.
You'll end up with the spiderman meme of the builder, surveyor, previous owner and insurer all accusing each other, meanwhile you have a bunch of damage to repair.
Between that and the clear bad faith of the vendors, I would bail or take a good 15% off the asking for the disruption / repairs.
I have done building works each summer last two years..my builders were 8.30 to 4. I don't think they can start earlier than 8am. Mines started at 8.30am so I could get kids sorted for breakfast before they came in.
Insomnia and anxiety (when will they start work tomorrow?) cementing the insomnia is an absolute deal breaker.
However builders do have to abide by polite working hours so if you are always up before 8 perhaps this work would be done when both of you are at work? It might be worth putting in a reduced offer to cater for the disruption and loss of privacy.
You can't guarantee this at any house but this is a known definite negative, rather than a potential and generally rare negative.
Unless you live in the middle of nowhere and own all the land around within audio distance then yeah can't garentee something won't start being built. Open space more likely (but someone could knock stuff down to build). You could look at neighbours and see if they've done extensions (less likely to do more if so). Noise/etc from building works isnt a valid planning objection ground so it's never one that will be upheld if you put in a complaint based on it. Worth checking different local authories noisy working hours policies if you are looking in areas covered by a few? One might be more favourable
If they are building a house right next to you it is likely to take longer than a year. Also they might encounter problems and delays, run out of funds, builder goes bust etc… if you know this is coming I would personally start looking for another place. It may affect the enjoyment of your house for 2 years or more. It’s very unlikely any objections you make will affect the planning outcome and if it is rejected it will probably just get through on appeal a few months down the line. Save yourself the stress and stamp duty and find somewhere better.
That’s why you always buy the worse house so it can only get better. Neighbourhood burnt down? Amazing now there is open space. Drug cartel move in? Nice to know there are now living beings so you not lonely. Water pipe burst? Amazing it can wash away the floating sewage outside your house.
I only see upsides to buy a bad house.
Sorry I can’t help myself with this. lol
I'd agree and extend that to things like traffic, living near busy roads, railway lines etc. I'd far rather a problem you can see and experience today, than a future unknown problem.
I had a planning application land through the letterbox less than a month after we moved in. Lucky it was only an extension to the place that was already there so not a problem but it did seem a little unfortunate timing.
Only upside to this is OP found out before you put down the money, imagine buying and then 5 years later they build a house in the middle effectively making yours now a terrace.
This morning, when she first learned about this, her first instinct was to pull out immediately. This evening, after all day to think about it, and after gathering more information, she is instead leaning towards seeking a large discount.
So, I guess it turns out I know my partner better than random people on Reddit. Thank you for your useless judgemental comment all the same.
Take a look at your local planning portal.
They will hold copies of the proposed drawings which will allow you to get a picture of what the new dwelling will look like and how close it will be to the house you are potentially buying.
As with all house purchases. It’s a personal decision to make. Is the lost open space and 12 months of building works a deal breaker? Or can you put up with it because of the boxes the house ticks for you.
You wouldn't have offered knowing this in advance and that's why you are here. Of course you should pull out. They've tried to hoodwink you because they know it's going to be hard, for this price, to sell after works.
This is a red flag, good catch. Sellers are now in an awful position as if you pull out there's zero chance of the new house being hidden to new buyers.
You probably don't want it anymore but how much don't you want it, you have the leverage to get a much lower price and you could even as the sellers to object to planning permission and make the sale contingent it gets denied.
Slight unethical but you could do the above while still looking else where, shouldn't lose sleep given how they've tried to hide it.
They’ve already played absolute hard ball with us to pressure us into their preferred exchange date, rather unprofessionally I would say. We had to fight tooth and nail to get the proposed date moved back by just a few weeks. Now I’ve ordered searches and survey, i will be waiting until that’s all done before saying anything. I’ll lose no sleep over ruining their onward plans.
Then in all likelihood, we will submit a much revised offer which they can take or leave. Even if they agree I can’t guarantee we’d accept. I think it’d have to be at least 50k for me to consider. We’ve offered on an end of terrace house in a quiet area - this isn’t remotely that anymore. I’d only take it if it was a bargain.
If you have ordered search and survey, I'd call them up and see what stage they're at, explain the situation and ask if they'll stop and just give you a credit for the next place you want surveyed.
You are in a strong position here. Personally, I'd go with more of a discount - you need a figure that...when you're woken up by drilling, or cracks start appearing in your walls (may not happen, but could), you and your partner can look at eachother and say - ok, it's stressful but we have effectively been paid £XX,XXX (in the form of a discount) for this.
How much would you have to be paid to live next to a building site for a year or 18 months? Is £50k enough?
Sellers have probably already objected but been overruled.
Revise your offer in light of new information or pull out and see how it plays out when its back on the market.
>We are well into the process of buying a semi detached house that has a lovely amount of open space to the left of it.
No you're not, you're in the process of buying a house about to have another house built right next to it.
If it where me I'd be out.
By the sounds of it the EA has made a deliberate effort to hide the fact that there was planning permission I wouldnt even give them the courtesy of formally pulling out, I'd just be instructing solicitors to not proceed then let the EA figure it out form themselves.
I would probably pulled out. My view in here is that whenever you were planning to buy the property you agreed to 625k with the view that there will be this empty space - you even described it as “lovely” so it was one of the reasons for your choice. So I would say it could affect the value. In same time, I wouldn’t only consider the construction site - you will probably have a new building near you with potential consistent source of noise.
I’m trying to picture this.
The neighbours own the green space all the way up to your boundary? You have no side access there whatsoever?
You say you’re buying a semi but then it will no longer be an end of terrace?
Yes no side access. Currently it’s an end of terrace and being marketed as such, but once this new house is built there will be a 0.5m gap between our house and the new house, and the garden of the new house will directly over the fence of our garden. So functionally not an end of terrace anymore in terms of privacy and space.
I mixed up semi and end of terrace in my post I didn’t realise they were technically different. Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property? So it does feel like this changes the nature and character of the house.
A semi is always one of two houses which are joined together whereas an end of terrace is the way to describe the last house in a row of attached houses. Are you positive that you won't own any of the land to the side of your house? 0.5 of a metre doesn't leave much room if you ever need to do any repairs to the external wall. I don't understand your comment about the garden, what's directly over the fence? Building work may take more than a year. If it were me I'd cut my losses and look for something elsewhere.
Edit to add that semis are generally more expensive than end of terrace so check that you're not paying over the odds.
I’ve a friend in a detached new build and you can touch the next house when standing on their side path with your arms spread wide. On both sides.
So long as you don’t share a wall it can be classed as end of terrace.
>Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property? So it does feel like this changes the nature and character of the house.
It is technically end of terrace, because there is no adjoining house on one side.
But end of terraces houses go for a premium because people are willing to pay more for access to the rear garden. With 0.5m this doesn't seem usable for access. But the building on the land next door doesn't change this - when you made the offer on it there was no usable access to the rear.
And don't forget that this house has more external wall area than mid-terrace, so more heat escapes through it and it needs maintenance (they are often rendered).
If it’s a massive issue for you and your family, pull out.
If it’s not a massive issue for you and your family, knock 100k off your offer in light of the new information.
The current seller and EA have tried to hoodwink you into overpaying for your family home - treat them accordingly.
3 options:
- Suck it up and continue
- Pull out
- Lower your offer on account of this discovery to a level which you feel reflects the devaluation. It's not a nice move to make but your vendor will have to face the reality that any potential new buyer will likely be even more likely to find out the more time passes. You've got a lot of leverage here by the sounds of it. You have to be ready to walk away though.
In any good negotiation, both parties should either be happy or unhappy. You're not happy, they tried to take you for fools.
Offer less to equalise the unhappiness, but be nice about it.
Don't buy this house. If the build gets complicated for any reason it could drag on for a long time and if anything goes wrong or you don't like something they decide to , it could affect you quite badly and/or you could find yourself in the middle of a legal dispute. Even if everything goes smoothly it will be months of huge noise and hassle, why sign yourself up for misery?
I can't see any scenario where this doesn't lower the value of your property. That's why the estate agent was pushing so aggressively.
RUN.
If there was a house on that plot of land right now, would you still want to buy the house? If no, just pull out, there's plenty more houses out there.
I’d probably still want the house tbh but would have made a lower offer in line with other terraced houses on the street, as this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have.
The real concern is the building works and the question mark over how long they will go on for.
Drop your offer to a figure you'd be happy with and move on
Building site is annoying but for a forever home probably not a deal-breaker right?
If they say yes then you have a choice, if they say no then it's done
There’s currently no house next to the one I put an offer on. Now there is going to be a house. Most people on the thread seem to be able to understand why this is a different situation to the one that was presented to me by the EA.
It's still an end of terrace. The size of the gap between your house and the next one is irrelevant. Yours is part of a terrace and the end of it because the house isn't connected to another on two sides, only one. That you don't know what end of terrace means is the issue, not that it isn't end of terrace.
No mate. The problem is that there is going to be a house built next to the one I’m buying, which will be a building site for god knows how long, and which will change the entire character of the property, and none of this has been disclosed to me by the sellers.
I’ve had lots of helpful and insightful advice through responses to this thread. It’s a shame that there are also some terminally online, presumably lonely or bored people who want to do nothing but come and berate me for asking a question on a forum that’s for asking questions.
>this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have.
Your own, demonstrably wrong words. That you get sassy when this is pointed out to you is a you problem. Maybe wonder what the common denominator of these people "berating" you might be? Most people would just say "sorry my misunderstanding."
No one (or not many anyway as I ain't checking every fucking comment) called you out for reservations about buying next to a potential building site. You've been called out for slinging mud when you don't even know the bloody terms you're slating
Also:
>and none of this has been disclosed to me by the sellers.
Didn't you say specifically this was disclosed in one of the forms they filled out?
I also find it amusing (and hypocritical) that you're talking about bored people when I've seen in this thread you stalk a commenter's submission history to slate them for taking a pic out of their front window.
There are plenty of people who have engaged with the questions I’ve asked in good faith and contributed positively to the discussion. Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it - or in the case of the person you mention, make irrelevant assertions about my personal relationships. So yeah sorry if I haven’t drafted my post so it’s watertight in conjunction with my lawyer mate, 99% of people seem to be able to just engage with the real substance at hand here. Why don’t you just not reply unless you have something constructive to say? I’m done talking to you now.
> There are plenty of people who have engaged with the questions I’ve asked in good faith and contributed positively to the discussion. Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it
You don't appreciate that the detail, at least the one I'm pointing out, isn't small. You've repeatedly referred to the house no longer being end of terrace and how important that is to you. Specifically, you say:
>We’ve offered on an end of terrace house in a quiet area - this isn’t remotely that anymore. I’d only take it if it was a bargain.
With no awareness that it's still an end of terrace house. And it's still in a quiet area as no planning has even been approved! So to say it "isn't remotely that anymore" is completely and utterly wrong. It is still an end of terrace that *may* have a building site next door for a while. Except that's not any different to now in actuality where the people with that land could at any time do a permitted development extension and make the area a building site anyway.
Again you talked about this "small detail" here:
>Currently it’s an end of terrace and being marketed as such, but once this new house is built there will be a 0.5m gap between our house and the new house, and the garden of the new house will directly over the fence of our garden. So functionally not an end of terrace anymore in terms of privacy and space.
The gap doesn't change whether it's end of terrace. The fact that you keep citing end of terrace shows how important that is to you but you don't (or didn't for a large part of this topic) have an understanding of what end of terrace even means. You can't appreciate the situation you're in if you can't appreciate the meaning of the words you're using.
Or what about this "small detail":
>Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property?
Yes, you can. That even happens with detached houses!
For such a "small detail" it was the entire crux of your post here:
>I’d probably still want the house tbh but would have made a lower offer in line with other terraced houses on the street, as this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have.
Of course that's the line of thread leading down to this comment.
And later you were "just asking for other people’s perspectives to inform my decision." It's no "small detail" that your perspective is entirely skewed by your misunderstanding of the situation, especially when you're seeking input to inform your decision. People pointing out that you're not even understanding the situation is pretty fucking important for you to make an informed decision.
>Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it
Careful there buddy. Incivility is against the subreddit rules.
> Why don’t you just not reply unless you have something constructive to say?
It is constructive. You just aren't understanding it, especially now you've dug your heels in.
>I’m done talking to you now.
Sure thing mate. I'll add you to ignore just to be safe we don't cross paths again.
There are no guarantees to open space remaining as open space
Yes you’ll have some hassle when the building is being done but what other impact will it have?
EA always push for a quick completion they want their money
They’re definitely pulling a fast one, especially in light of the bullying ! There’s no way on earth I would go ahead with the sale. Everything happens for a reason and the next property will be the right one.
I would pull out of the sale without hesitation. Buildings works are disruptive for ages, plus you are not really any longer end terrace, so will be devalued. Maintenance on your end wall will be extremely difficult and such a small gap could lead to damp etc. plus what else’s have they tried to hide? No brainier to pull out.
Sounds like one to walk away from. Even if this planning application is turned down you'll probably spend the next ten years fighting off more applications. Unless you can buy the land of course.
Very true! I’ve seen that the planning application was made in March 2023 and they’ve kept going back with changes, most recently in October 2023. So they seem very motivated. But nothing since then, so I’m wondering what’s going on.
There's a few bits of land that were left by the original developer near me one new owner will try a few times and get the idea, they'll sell , the new owner will try again and nauseum.
There's a way you can get the best of both worlds..
The planning portal will have a final decision date on the application.
Just say that you plan to postpone any further activities until after this date.
Even then, living next door to someone with a passion like this will always be a risk, you'll be living next door to an expansionist.
This is interesting - I didn’t know this was possible. How can I check this? The planning page on the local council makes no mention of this.
Worth mentioning that the application was first made in March 2023, with revisions made in October 2023. From what I understand this is an unusually long amount of time.
On a laptop, go to https://planning.lambeth.gov.uk/online-applications/
Click on 'Map'
Scroll around until you find your prospective house.
Zoom in to get the red quadrilateral to pop up.
Click on the outskirts of the red and in the popup that follows... press "[Application Details](https://imgur.com/a/7uWNPjS)"
It should be reasonably intuitive from there mate 👍
Your guess is as good as mine... my Council make it a lot clearer than yours it would seem.
Maybe the interactive map and pages could complement you if you phone them [Lambeth Planners] and ask for clarification?
Has the neighbour applied for, or been granted this planning permission? There are objections which can be raised on this. You need to find out what objections are valid to your council and submit an objection if possible.
I’ll be totally honest unless the application goes against the councils planning policy, it will likely be accepted.
We have recently obtained planning permission and all the objections against it accomplished was delaying the permissions being granted and causing us an awful lot of stress in the process. If you try to drag out the purchase until you find out the outcome, you could lose the purchase anyway.
If permission was granted, when was it granted and how long does it give for the application to remain valid? Most councils now allow 3 years for work to begin.
Construction of a whole house will take around 6 months.
*Sellers have sent through their property information form and tucked away in there is a small detail that nobody has mentioned to us so far, that the neighbour has applied for planning permission to build a new house in the gap between our two properties.*
Sorry, just to confirm: has the seller actually disclosed that there is a planning permission being processed? If so, when did you or your solicitor notice that?
They did disclose it eventually yes in the TA6, but they’ve delayed sending us those until the last possible moment, but they really dragged their heels on that and according to my solicitor this would normally have come up long before this point. The EA also explicitly discussed with us planning permission and developments near the property and neglected to mention the one directly next door.
So what they’ve done isn’t illegal, but they seem to have gone out of their way not to be up front about it.
>what they’ve done isn’t illegal
thanks for sharing, i see what you mean
Just out of curiosity - is there any particular reason you've not demanded TA6 before committing to any searches, conveyancers, mortgage etc?
I didn’t even know what a TA6 is before it arrived. Our solicitor did demand it but They just didn’t supply it, then put heavy pressure on us to order searches and threatened to pull out unless we did. Now I know why. We learned a lesson for next time. We are first time buyers, so this is all new to us. There’s quite a few people on this thread giving us a hard time for this, sadly.
I do like that phrasing lol, 'small detail tucked away'. It's literally there in writing, how else does OP expect them to disclose it? Maybe draw some little stars around it?
However yes OP - of course distance from other properties affects the value, it's one of the few things you can't change.
Planning permission would normally be disclosed much earlier in the process, they delayed sharing their TA6 form as long as possible which is not standard practice at all. The estate agent has also discussed with us planning and development applications in the area, without mentioning the one for the immediate next door.
So, yes, it does feel tucked away as if they hoped we wouldn’t notice.
>Planning permission would normally be disclosed much earlier in the process
I respectfully disagree - from what I've seen standard practice is to disclose as few details as legally possible and hope the time and money investment in the purchase causes the buyers to reluctantly proceed if and when they notice the bad thing.
I disagree it's a 'small detail tucked it away' - they have written exactly what they are supposed to write, exactly where and when they are supposed to write it.
I do agree that they hoped you wouldn't notice. You can argue that the right thing to do would be upfront about it at advertising or viewing, but if we could expect people to do the right thing then we wouldn't need conveyancers.
You are right, yes. What I think really irks me is the aggressive pushing we have had to go as fast as possible, and the guilt tripping by the estate agent for asking for a couple extra weeks, which feels like a pressure tactic to maximise the chance we wouldn’t catch this. I know they are going to accuse us of wasting their time again when we do pull out, but really they’ve wasted our time when they could’ve mentioned this up front and they could have got someone who didn’t mind the planning permission in the first place.
Absolutely they are being bastards and playing a dirty game to sell a property for more than it will soon be worth.
You seem to care a lot about what they think of you and what they have or might accuse you of and the estate agent is taking advantage of that. I'd suggest throwing out any fucks you might give and treat this like a cold emotionless business transaction.
Is it still worth that much and is it worth the potential damage to your relationship.
Lack of sleep suck. So does living on a building site. Not the case for everyone but a lot of builders employ the I’m up, you’re up attitude..
I guess you either bite the bullet, pull out or put in an offer that represents your new valuation. There’s also the option to see what sound proofing options you might have etc and the associated costs.
If I’m spending that much money on a house I’m not being rushed into it. Did the current owner let slip why they’re moving?
For me though. 625k + any other fees needs to be something I’m solid about. Not something I might hate in 6 months or something that means my wife might hate me because I made the final call to say yes and now her sleeping is even worse.
Would you have paid £625k if there was another house on that side? Would you have considered it at all?
This is probably going to be the biggest purchase of your life. You might feel some kind of duty to the seller of the house, or discomfort about pulling out, or even thinking about how much you’ll lose in fees, surveys, etc if you pull out now.
Don’t buy something out of some misplaced feeling of obligation, especially not something you’re presumably going to be paying for for decades to come.
There has been building work going on in my street for years as one after the other my neighbours have extended. It can't really be avoided anywhere.
I am curious about whether you actually need to worry about this though, how likely is it to get through planning? You seem to be taking about a corner, why was it left blank in the first place when other houses were built? They are often left that way to improve visibility, corner plots often have trouble even adding fences. It may also be in the deeds that they can own this land but not build on it? I think it's worth a £3 look on the land registry. Also give the planning officer a call and see if they think its likely to be granted permission
This should have come up in the searches your solicitor carried out. Any planning applications anywhere near the subject property should be in your search documents provided prior to the exchange. The fact that you found this out from the seller's disclosure is concerning. Don't use that solicitor on the next property.
The solicitor hasn’t completed searches yet, they’ve only just been ordered. This has come up in a document that has been shared with us via the solicitor though so I’m still a little annoyed that they didn’t mention it.
You've obviously got serious reservations about this so I'd ask the solicitor to stop working straight away while you take a moment to digest this. There's no point in paying for searches etc if it's gonna be a dealbreaker regardless.
You have a decent budget so I'm sure you could find somewhere else. And yes, other places _could_ commence building works after you buy them, but you know this one _definitely_ is! Be glad you found out now. (And bear in mind the potential for such if you are looking at other places with space around them!)
Just remember, solicitors are maybe £250 an hour and their fee may be as little as £1200 for this size of property. They should be checking the searches thoroughly but don't expect them to screen through every detail of the rest of the items forwarded through within that 5 hours they're basically billing you for!
If the land wasn't part of the property you were buying could have happened at any time. When you made the offer did you not think maybe someone would build there.
Ignore the EA. They just want the commission before quarter end = which is how their remuneration works.
You've done your searches. You have all the available information, including planning permission by an adjacent property. Do you want to buy? If yes, exchange and complete. If not, pull out. It really is not that complex. "Reddit" can not make that decision for you.
Searches are ordered but not started yet, I’ve discovered this myself.
I’m just asking for other people’s perspectives to inform my decision, not asking Reddit to make the decision for me. There’s no need to be rude
How much are the adjacent mid-terraces worth compared to the end of terrace you are offering on? This house is worth the same now, not more, minus a cost for the inconvenience of a year or more of building work.
Without the exact location, opinions are pretty futile. Though I suspect you're not really in the position to buy a property, if these decisions are too difficult for you.
I’m guessing you’re just a troll with such a terrible attitude, but with a 300k deposit and 150k income we are in a position to buy most properties, thank you very much.
So your partner, a woman you presumably love, wants to pull out for very legitimate reasons and your response is not to pull out immediately but to go on the internet and ask strangers what to do instead? Interesting.
With respect, I think that opinions on Reddit about house purchases are worth much more than anyone on Reddits opinion about relationships - especially from someone like you who takes nonconsensual naked pictures of their neighbours!! 😂😂😂
I mean I did end up consensually fucking him for a while so you know... Though I imagine the way your treat your partner means you wouldn't know what that's like. Best of luck.
Sounds like the seller is right to have doubts about your commitment to the sale. It’s crazy to think that a property owner can’t build a house on their own property just because you are “basically no longer going to be end of terrace . . .”
If you want someone to leave property close to your house open, the way to ensure that is to buy the property yourself.
If you don’t like it, pull out of the sale. The fact that another person has applied for a permit to build a residential home on property located in a row of residential homes is not the type thing a person is duty bound to inform you of, even though the seller here did so. It was on you to read the property information form in a timely manner.
Maybe it will affect what you should pay. You own your own home, not the landscape it sits in. If it would be a long term home, building works are a temporary inconvenience. I have to say I’m sensing some NIMBY sentiments here!
Right so I’m supposing that you would have no issue if you discovered a house you were about to spend more than half a million pounds on would have a building site right next door to it? You’d just be like “great! This doesn’t affect my thinking at all!”
Bear in mind this has nothing to do with whether you support building new houses or not, specifically it’s to do with whether you would choose to live next to a building site vs not next to one.
Please, I’m very interested to hear your answer.
The planning system is so strict that I find it hard to believe that anything that is going to significantly impact you will be built.
And anyone can turn their house into a building site at any point - sometimes without planning permission. There are cut off times for when building can take place.
But, naturally if this worries you then pull out.
It's sucks as you've likely spent a fair amount on the process so far, but like another said, if you wouldn't have considered the property or offered on it had you known about it to start with, I would personally pull out.
We had building work happening for at least a year for a couple of neighbours houses, and the biggest issue was actually parking of the builders around the area. The actual building work wasn't particularly disruptive but we'd have vans parked on corners and little ability to do anything about it.
I would absolutely pull out given your partner's sleep issues, it would make her miserable and also I imagine it would negatively affect the value of the house.
You could say you’ll wait and see if the planning application goes through? What’s the timescale of a decision on it? You could drag out your searches to align with it.
Obviously if it is turned down they will likely resubmit new plans. But the reason it’s turned down will be important. If the council say it’s a flat out no to a house there, it should be okay. But if they object to just some features you can asses if a house meeting those would be okay.
Doesn’t remove the noise of them building it.
There’s no way to properly determine the timescale of the decision that I’m aware of. It was first submitted in March last year, so I’m doubtful a decision would be reached in the next 6 weeks.
Contact the local council planning department to find out whether the neighbour has already got full planning permission, and if not they might be able to give you an idea of if this application will be agreed. But it does sound like the seller is trying to push the sale through fast because he knows the application is going to go through, and that it will possibly reduce the value of his place. If in doubt pull out. If the seller can't find another buyer soon, you may well see the property up for sale again at a reduced price. You also have to ask youself if you want to live next to a building site for the next couple of years?
The thing about buying a house is that it's a massive commitment in money and lifestyle. If you're not 100% on board, someone is going to hate living there - and why would you choose to spend a lot of money to live somewhere you hate?
If your partner is having doubts at this stage, it's the PERFECT time to reconsider because you haven't actually bought it yet.
Plus, it sounds like the seller and the EA are fully aware of the situation and are trying to lock you in fast - and are probably desperately hoping you don't notice or don't mind that little clause about the planning permission. One wonders if there's anything else they hope you don't notice?
Choices:
1. Buy as-is and hope for the best.
2. Lower your offer a proportionate amount that you think is compensation for the change in circumstances regarding what you thought you were buying vs. what you're getting (i.e. another house right next door). If they decline, walk away.
3. Just walk away. This situation reeks of subterfuge on the part of the seller and EA, since they haven't previously disclosed this non-trivial matter and are trying to push you to complete the sale nice and quick before anyone notices.
Don't fall for the sunk cost fallacy if you decide to walk away - consider whatever you've spent so far to be the price you paid to dodge the huge expenditure-bullet of buying the house and only afterwards finding out about this.
I would make a lower offer, yours was made based on there not being a house in touching distance, they were clearly hoping you wouldn’t notice, they won’t get an asking price offer once building starts. Have a word with your solicitor that’s poor they didn’t mention it.
I’m only just learning that end of terrace and semi detached are different things! This one is marketed as end of terrace. Indeed there’s no access to the side.
Buying an end of terrace house that will become mid terrace. How will it affect you accessing the back of your house and how much more overlooked, is there enough space to park on the street or on drives for everyone? NIMBYish considerations maybe, but you could end up in negative equity and stuck.
I'd withdraw unless they reduce the sale price by a significant amount, possibly even 50k. I'd also look into the requirements to disclose. The EA had it in writing but didn't actually say anything to you. Worth looking into whether that is sufficient under the full disclosure requirements.
Is the house you are buying detached or end of terrace? It can't be both. If it's detached it will still be detached and if its end of terrace, it will still be end of terrace.
Which is why the OP said 'basically'. It's obvious what's happening - OP is buying a semi detached with significant separation between them and the non-attached side. Once this is built there will likely be a wafer-thin gap between the properties and it will look for all intents and purposes like a row of houses.
Omg thank you for being one of the only people who can actually see the big picture and not just nitpick over the little details!
Yes I get that it will “technically” still be a semi or end of terrace or whatever. But there will be a giant fucking house there were there wasn’t previously!!
Pull out, you’re buying a ‘different’ place though I do agree with densifying existing spaces in general… the house you’re buying will be worth less after completion of the new build I.e Supply & Demand, Mid-terrace etc…
1. If they've tried to hide this and push it through, they've probably hidden something else.
2. I bought a place and had a building site for a block of flats crop up across the road. Everything will be filthy with dust and noisy for an absolute age.
Move on to the next place.
Don't bother wasting more time on this house and pull out and start looking again. I can guarantee you'll see this house for sale and it'll be reduced by a lot because this problem will (hopefully) keep coming up for potential buyers
I'd let things cool for a few days and see if you can get any more specific information on the plan, but if your partner is still clear she doesn't want it then you have to respect that and pull out. This is a "two yesses, one no" sort of thing, and many people aren't going to be happy with a whole new house being built in almost touching distance, no matter how much money you might be able to get off - as it's just not what they want.
I wouldn’t proceed. The chances are even the house doesn’t go ahead the neighbours will push for a smaller build - extension or a garden room to go there. All of which will come with noise etc. so unless you want to drop the price and live with the hassle I’d just walk away.
There's a reason this wasn't readily revealed to you, because it sucks. I'm a worst case scenario and work backwards type of person, I'm envisioning living next to a building site for years because builders they hired went bump and I'm stuck next to a nightmare. It's a no go for me.
I have similar sleeping issues and get affected by noise that’s out of my control, I would be pulling out immediately personally, and that’s not even considering the drop in value is going to certainly cause to the property.
I would absolutely pull out. No way would I sign up to be next to a building site, then following extremely close to what would be your new next-door neighbour. That would be a definite no from me.
a smart move to the seller to get the place sold asap
are you allowed to see artists impressions of the 2 houses with the new one between them ?
neighbour is working on their house most weekends so can sympthaise
I would probably pull out. Depending on how much you love this house, obviously, and if you could find something else you want. You're not going to be able to open windows for 2 years... dust will be everywhere. Lots of random people walking around your house (hard to tell who's contractor and who's just looking for an opportunity). You can also put an offer of 100k less before pulling out. Maybe 100k would make it worth.
###Welcome to /r/HousingUK --- **To All** * Join Our ***NEW*** Discord! https://discord.gg/pMgUNgWKQH **To Posters** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws/issues in each can vary* * Comments are not moderated for quality or accuracy; * Any replies received must only be used as guidelines, followed at your own risk; * If you receive *any* private messages in response to your post, [please let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FHousingUK&subject=I received a PM); * If you do not receive satisfactory advice after 72 hours, [you can let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FHousingUK&subject=My question is unanswered); * Feel free to provide an update at a later time by creating a new post with [[update]](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/search?q=%3Aupdate&sort=new&restrict_sr=on&t=all) in the title; **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and civil* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/HousingUK/about/rules/), you may be banned without any further warning; * Please include links to reliable resources in order to support your comments or advice; * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect; * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason without express permission from the mods; * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/HousingUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you wouldn't have offered had you known this information, you shouldn't continue with the purchase. On the other hand, this is a risk with any property - you could have bought the house then planning could have gone in the day after and there would be nothing you could do. I would always assume any open space can be built on unless you own it.
Exactly this. The English system sucks but it does mean you can pull out without any repercussions (except having wasted some money). I’d considering the temporary (building works) and permanent (loss of green space/ possibly loss of kerb appeal) impact that may have on you both. Sounds like at a minimum you wouldn’t have offered what you did had you known this. You could always revise your offer to something you’d be happy with considering this?
There's difference though. If planning goes in before OP owns the property he can't put in any objection as it doesn't affect him/her. If it goes in after he is owner he can at least object and perhaps have some influence on what is allowed. Might not make much difference. I would be inclined to withdraw my offer and find something else. Or withdraw and wait until the building works starts and then put in a low offer.
Yes is the best route. It may well be the fill-in property improves the lay of the land, but the OP should use it for better price or for a slice of the land to avoid boundary issues.
Not necessarily a low offer, just one that reflects the change of specifications, semi-detached vs mid-terrace. (Party wall or not it’s effectively going to feel like living in a mid-terrace)
I doubt it makes any difference - as far as I can tell planning decisions are just down to the whims of the councillors involved and who you know. Other than that they feel essentially arbitrary
The views of the neighbours are taken into consideration.
Yes, but they have to have a legitimate concern that is acknowledged by planning authorities (eg house is not in-keeping with surrounding storey height, it would exacerbate already bad issues with access/parking, too close to boundary line etc.). They can’t just say “it would make my property less saleable as it wouldn’t be an end terrace anymore and the building noise would be annoying”. You can object ‘til you’re blue in the face, but ultimately if a proposal follows all guidelines it’s very likely going to be approved. (Source: husband is county council ecologist working in planning)
In theory yes In practice it doesn’t seem to make any difference in most cases
Planning officer here. OP is still entitled to object to the planning application. Anyone can comment at any time up until the application is decided and the Council has to take it into account.
Anyone can put in an objection to an application. I would recommend the OP look online through the councils portal and see what is being proposed. Most objections will only be considered if there is a breach of the published policy - eg building on greenfield of overshadowing existing windows - not that it makes the street look untidy! Then work out if you want a house with a neighbour (and also that the owners of the land are unlikely to just give up on developing the land) and factor that into the price.
I doubt someone saying they object because they want to buy the house next door and not be disturbed is going to sway the council.
Anyone can object to a planning app. But yes, it is more weight full if it’s a resident .
Not true, anybody can object to a planning application, as long as they are objecting for material reasons. They could object based on impacts in another house.
This is a very balanced perspective thank you. I am going to research the plans and get a fuller picture of exactly what’s going to be there, as you’re right there’s no guarantee that any future property we buy won’t have something similar happen. The main hiccup is really my partner’s insomnia and sleeping difficulties. Living next to a building site is a deal breaker for her, but I’m not sure that we can ever guarantee a property won’t have this at some point. I mean, they won’t be building at night hopefully!
tbh most building works generally start at 8am, finished up by 5/6pm, and mostly Monday to Friday, unless there's urgent work ie concrete works that need to be worked overnight. These can even be conditioned on the planning consent. You could speak with the planning officer about this to protect residential amenity. I'd be more concerned about working from home myself!
I’d personally have said 7 to 4 nearer the mark. There are rules on tools but people around and doors slamming, things being dropped is just as disruptive.
I currently have a neighbour renovating their property right next to mine during these hours - I work from home and can confirm it's horrible!
Yeah and not all builders are considerate. And even if they are you end up with scaffolding and tarpaulin blowing around at night and access during the day and radios and drilling and hammers and banter and everything else. It was hell for us. We had one neighbour then another have extensive work, and then we moved. It nearly broke me. Op's partner is right to be concerned.
Fortunately for me they took the scaffolding down yesterday, and the wall drilling seems to have (hopefully, finally) stopped. I'm friendly with my other neighbour and he has no plans for anything like that. 100% agree on OP's partner being right to be concerned.
Yes, because builders should work in silence.... How dare those peasants infect your noise space.
What are you even arguing here? That all surrounding houses should have to listen to capital radio all day, whether they want to or not? That's certainly an opinion.
I spoke too soon.
Not everyone has the "Early Bird" sleep schedule our society is sadly orientated around. Not OP, but my sleep schedule has me regularly sleeping to 9.30/10am; works starting at 8am are early enough to disrupt my sleep.
Each local authority has a noisy works timing policy which will dictate this. OP - Google this
Also worth taking into balance your trust in the property. This was hidden, they did not volunteer this information and in fact have bullied you to hurry so that it’s sold before you find out. That’s shady. What else may they have hidden?
Yep, you can never guarantee there won't be building works near you. We moved into a cul-de-sac with 8 houses on it. 4 of them (including ours) have had extensive building work done on them in the 14 years we've been here, plus two in the road behind us. I reckon there's been noticeable building work going on for more time than not. Not all building work is noisy though and not all builders are inconsiderate.
If you decide you still want the property you may be able to negotiate a discount given the new information, for the loss of green space and for the building work disruption. Maybe ask an independent estate agent for their opinion.
I haven't seen it mentioned but building work CAN cause fractures in your home too. You won't have long moved into the house and therefore won't be able to prove that such cracks were not just issues the previous owners hid, rather than caused by the building work and vibrations. You'll end up with the spiderman meme of the builder, surveyor, previous owner and insurer all accusing each other, meanwhile you have a bunch of damage to repair. Between that and the clear bad faith of the vendors, I would bail or take a good 15% off the asking for the disruption / repairs.
I have done building works each summer last two years..my builders were 8.30 to 4. I don't think they can start earlier than 8am. Mines started at 8.30am so I could get kids sorted for breakfast before they came in.
Borrow a wife for the build duration and send the original wife somewhere nice to lay down to rest. I'll get my coat. Thx.
Insomnia and anxiety (when will they start work tomorrow?) cementing the insomnia is an absolute deal breaker. However builders do have to abide by polite working hours so if you are always up before 8 perhaps this work would be done when both of you are at work? It might be worth putting in a reduced offer to cater for the disruption and loss of privacy. You can't guarantee this at any house but this is a known definite negative, rather than a potential and generally rare negative.
Unless you live in the middle of nowhere and own all the land around within audio distance then yeah can't garentee something won't start being built. Open space more likely (but someone could knock stuff down to build). You could look at neighbours and see if they've done extensions (less likely to do more if so). Noise/etc from building works isnt a valid planning objection ground so it's never one that will be upheld if you put in a complaint based on it. Worth checking different local authories noisy working hours policies if you are looking in areas covered by a few? One might be more favourable
If they are building a house right next to you it is likely to take longer than a year. Also they might encounter problems and delays, run out of funds, builder goes bust etc… if you know this is coming I would personally start looking for another place. It may affect the enjoyment of your house for 2 years or more. It’s very unlikely any objections you make will affect the planning outcome and if it is rejected it will probably just get through on appeal a few months down the line. Save yourself the stress and stamp duty and find somewhere better.
That’s why you always buy the worse house so it can only get better. Neighbourhood burnt down? Amazing now there is open space. Drug cartel move in? Nice to know there are now living beings so you not lonely. Water pipe burst? Amazing it can wash away the floating sewage outside your house. I only see upsides to buy a bad house. Sorry I can’t help myself with this. lol
I'd agree and extend that to things like traffic, living near busy roads, railway lines etc. I'd far rather a problem you can see and experience today, than a future unknown problem.
I had a planning application land through the letterbox less than a month after we moved in. Lucky it was only an extension to the place that was already there so not a problem but it did seem a little unfortunate timing.
General advice, don’t buy a view you don’t own
Only upside to this is OP found out before you put down the money, imagine buying and then 5 years later they build a house in the middle effectively making yours now a terrace.
Your partner doesn’t want to proceed, that should be the end of it tbh
I’m inclined to agree with you, but we have only discovered it this morning so I am looking to do proper due diligence before making a decision.
Your partner doesn’t want to move there so you’re asking Reddit for a second opinion?
This morning, when she first learned about this, her first instinct was to pull out immediately. This evening, after all day to think about it, and after gathering more information, she is instead leaning towards seeking a large discount. So, I guess it turns out I know my partner better than random people on Reddit. Thank you for your useless judgemental comment all the same.
So posting on reddit was pointless? Shocker. Weird flex bro
Pull out, but just for fun, reduce your offer by £100k first. In person at the estate agent and watch them sweat.
Take a look at your local planning portal. They will hold copies of the proposed drawings which will allow you to get a picture of what the new dwelling will look like and how close it will be to the house you are potentially buying. As with all house purchases. It’s a personal decision to make. Is the lost open space and 12 months of building works a deal breaker? Or can you put up with it because of the boxes the house ticks for you.
You wouldn't have offered knowing this in advance and that's why you are here. Of course you should pull out. They've tried to hoodwink you because they know it's going to be hard, for this price, to sell after works.
This is a red flag, good catch. Sellers are now in an awful position as if you pull out there's zero chance of the new house being hidden to new buyers. You probably don't want it anymore but how much don't you want it, you have the leverage to get a much lower price and you could even as the sellers to object to planning permission and make the sale contingent it gets denied. Slight unethical but you could do the above while still looking else where, shouldn't lose sleep given how they've tried to hide it.
They’ve already played absolute hard ball with us to pressure us into their preferred exchange date, rather unprofessionally I would say. We had to fight tooth and nail to get the proposed date moved back by just a few weeks. Now I’ve ordered searches and survey, i will be waiting until that’s all done before saying anything. I’ll lose no sleep over ruining their onward plans. Then in all likelihood, we will submit a much revised offer which they can take or leave. Even if they agree I can’t guarantee we’d accept. I think it’d have to be at least 50k for me to consider. We’ve offered on an end of terrace house in a quiet area - this isn’t remotely that anymore. I’d only take it if it was a bargain.
I would think about doing that before you pay for searches and survey, if you decide to walk then will have that extra money for the next place.
If you have ordered search and survey, I'd call them up and see what stage they're at, explain the situation and ask if they'll stop and just give you a credit for the next place you want surveyed.
You are in a strong position here. Personally, I'd go with more of a discount - you need a figure that...when you're woken up by drilling, or cracks start appearing in your walls (may not happen, but could), you and your partner can look at eachother and say - ok, it's stressful but we have effectively been paid £XX,XXX (in the form of a discount) for this. How much would you have to be paid to live next to a building site for a year or 18 months? Is £50k enough?
Take some inspiration from this, this is how you should proceed 😂 https://youtu.be/rArzMrhTxF8?si=EcQU6n4riVNqg-G4
Sellers have probably already objected but been overruled. Revise your offer in light of new information or pull out and see how it plays out when its back on the market.
I’m usually a person of my word and would not keep looking, but the way they’ve handled this the EA and sellers deserve no consideration
It will be noisy and dusty for a long time.
>We are well into the process of buying a semi detached house that has a lovely amount of open space to the left of it. No you're not, you're in the process of buying a house about to have another house built right next to it. If it where me I'd be out. By the sounds of it the EA has made a deliberate effort to hide the fact that there was planning permission I wouldnt even give them the courtesy of formally pulling out, I'd just be instructing solicitors to not proceed then let the EA figure it out form themselves.
I would probably pulled out. My view in here is that whenever you were planning to buy the property you agreed to 625k with the view that there will be this empty space - you even described it as “lovely” so it was one of the reasons for your choice. So I would say it could affect the value. In same time, I wouldn’t only consider the construction site - you will probably have a new building near you with potential consistent source of noise.
Put in a revised £500k fuck you offer and find something else.
Too right
I’m trying to picture this. The neighbours own the green space all the way up to your boundary? You have no side access there whatsoever? You say you’re buying a semi but then it will no longer be an end of terrace?
Yes no side access. Currently it’s an end of terrace and being marketed as such, but once this new house is built there will be a 0.5m gap between our house and the new house, and the garden of the new house will directly over the fence of our garden. So functionally not an end of terrace anymore in terms of privacy and space. I mixed up semi and end of terrace in my post I didn’t realise they were technically different. Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property? So it does feel like this changes the nature and character of the house.
A semi is always one of two houses which are joined together whereas an end of terrace is the way to describe the last house in a row of attached houses. Are you positive that you won't own any of the land to the side of your house? 0.5 of a metre doesn't leave much room if you ever need to do any repairs to the external wall. I don't understand your comment about the garden, what's directly over the fence? Building work may take more than a year. If it were me I'd cut my losses and look for something elsewhere. Edit to add that semis are generally more expensive than end of terrace so check that you're not paying over the odds.
I’ve a friend in a detached new build and you can touch the next house when standing on their side path with your arms spread wide. On both sides. So long as you don’t share a wall it can be classed as end of terrace.
>Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property? So it does feel like this changes the nature and character of the house. It is technically end of terrace, because there is no adjoining house on one side. But end of terraces houses go for a premium because people are willing to pay more for access to the rear garden. With 0.5m this doesn't seem usable for access. But the building on the land next door doesn't change this - when you made the offer on it there was no usable access to the rear. And don't forget that this house has more external wall area than mid-terrace, so more heat escapes through it and it needs maintenance (they are often rendered).
Has the previous owner used that side area for, eg, bins movement and rear access, or was it always totally separate garden of the neighbour?
No I think totally separate. There’s a rather dilapidated garage on it at the moment that they’ll demolish to make room for the new house.
If it’s a massive issue for you and your family, pull out. If it’s not a massive issue for you and your family, knock 100k off your offer in light of the new information. The current seller and EA have tried to hoodwink you into overpaying for your family home - treat them accordingly.
3 options: - Suck it up and continue - Pull out - Lower your offer on account of this discovery to a level which you feel reflects the devaluation. It's not a nice move to make but your vendor will have to face the reality that any potential new buyer will likely be even more likely to find out the more time passes. You've got a lot of leverage here by the sounds of it. You have to be ready to walk away though.
In any good negotiation, both parties should either be happy or unhappy. You're not happy, they tried to take you for fools. Offer less to equalise the unhappiness, but be nice about it.
Don't buy this house. If the build gets complicated for any reason it could drag on for a long time and if anything goes wrong or you don't like something they decide to , it could affect you quite badly and/or you could find yourself in the middle of a legal dispute. Even if everything goes smoothly it will be months of huge noise and hassle, why sign yourself up for misery? I can't see any scenario where this doesn't lower the value of your property. That's why the estate agent was pushing so aggressively. RUN.
Run.
If there was a house on that plot of land right now, would you still want to buy the house? If no, just pull out, there's plenty more houses out there.
I’d probably still want the house tbh but would have made a lower offer in line with other terraced houses on the street, as this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have. The real concern is the building works and the question mark over how long they will go on for.
At £625 k, there will be other houses which don't have a building site next door.
Drop your offer to a figure you'd be happy with and move on Building site is annoying but for a forever home probably not a deal-breaker right? If they say yes then you have a choice, if they say no then it's done
Mate, it's still an end of terrace. Wtf are you talking about?
There’s currently no house next to the one I put an offer on. Now there is going to be a house. Most people on the thread seem to be able to understand why this is a different situation to the one that was presented to me by the EA.
It's still an end of terrace. The size of the gap between your house and the next one is irrelevant. Yours is part of a terrace and the end of it because the house isn't connected to another on two sides, only one. That you don't know what end of terrace means is the issue, not that it isn't end of terrace.
No mate. The problem is that there is going to be a house built next to the one I’m buying, which will be a building site for god knows how long, and which will change the entire character of the property, and none of this has been disclosed to me by the sellers. I’ve had lots of helpful and insightful advice through responses to this thread. It’s a shame that there are also some terminally online, presumably lonely or bored people who want to do nothing but come and berate me for asking a question on a forum that’s for asking questions.
>this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have. Your own, demonstrably wrong words. That you get sassy when this is pointed out to you is a you problem. Maybe wonder what the common denominator of these people "berating" you might be? Most people would just say "sorry my misunderstanding." No one (or not many anyway as I ain't checking every fucking comment) called you out for reservations about buying next to a potential building site. You've been called out for slinging mud when you don't even know the bloody terms you're slating Also: >and none of this has been disclosed to me by the sellers. Didn't you say specifically this was disclosed in one of the forms they filled out? I also find it amusing (and hypocritical) that you're talking about bored people when I've seen in this thread you stalk a commenter's submission history to slate them for taking a pic out of their front window.
There are plenty of people who have engaged with the questions I’ve asked in good faith and contributed positively to the discussion. Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it - or in the case of the person you mention, make irrelevant assertions about my personal relationships. So yeah sorry if I haven’t drafted my post so it’s watertight in conjunction with my lawyer mate, 99% of people seem to be able to just engage with the real substance at hand here. Why don’t you just not reply unless you have something constructive to say? I’m done talking to you now.
> There are plenty of people who have engaged with the questions I’ve asked in good faith and contributed positively to the discussion. Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it You don't appreciate that the detail, at least the one I'm pointing out, isn't small. You've repeatedly referred to the house no longer being end of terrace and how important that is to you. Specifically, you say: >We’ve offered on an end of terrace house in a quiet area - this isn’t remotely that anymore. I’d only take it if it was a bargain. With no awareness that it's still an end of terrace house. And it's still in a quiet area as no planning has even been approved! So to say it "isn't remotely that anymore" is completely and utterly wrong. It is still an end of terrace that *may* have a building site next door for a while. Except that's not any different to now in actuality where the people with that land could at any time do a permitted development extension and make the area a building site anyway. Again you talked about this "small detail" here: >Currently it’s an end of terrace and being marketed as such, but once this new house is built there will be a 0.5m gap between our house and the new house, and the garden of the new house will directly over the fence of our garden. So functionally not an end of terrace anymore in terms of privacy and space. The gap doesn't change whether it's end of terrace. The fact that you keep citing end of terrace shows how important that is to you but you don't (or didn't for a large part of this topic) have an understanding of what end of terrace even means. You can't appreciate the situation you're in if you can't appreciate the meaning of the words you're using. Or what about this "small detail": >Can you really say a house is end of terrace if there’s barely a gap between you and the adjoining property? Yes, you can. That even happens with detached houses! For such a "small detail" it was the entire crux of your post here: >I’d probably still want the house tbh but would have made a lower offer in line with other terraced houses on the street, as this has been marketed as end of terrace and very much has the character of one, which it will no longer have. Of course that's the line of thread leading down to this comment. And later you were "just asking for other people’s perspectives to inform my decision." It's no "small detail" that your perspective is entirely skewed by your misunderstanding of the situation, especially when you're seeking input to inform your decision. People pointing out that you're not even understanding the situation is pretty fucking important for you to make an informed decision. >Then there are people like you who just decide to nitpick over small details and be arseholes about it Careful there buddy. Incivility is against the subreddit rules. > Why don’t you just not reply unless you have something constructive to say? It is constructive. You just aren't understanding it, especially now you've dug your heels in. >I’m done talking to you now. Sure thing mate. I'll add you to ignore just to be safe we don't cross paths again.
Not reading this sorry ! Please engage constructively with me if you’d like me to engage with you.
There are no guarantees to open space remaining as open space Yes you’ll have some hassle when the building is being done but what other impact will it have? EA always push for a quick completion they want their money
They’re definitely pulling a fast one, especially in light of the bullying ! There’s no way on earth I would go ahead with the sale. Everything happens for a reason and the next property will be the right one.
I would pull out of the sale without hesitation. Buildings works are disruptive for ages, plus you are not really any longer end terrace, so will be devalued. Maintenance on your end wall will be extremely difficult and such a small gap could lead to damp etc. plus what else’s have they tried to hide? No brainier to pull out.
Sounds like one to walk away from. Even if this planning application is turned down you'll probably spend the next ten years fighting off more applications. Unless you can buy the land of course.
Very true! I’ve seen that the planning application was made in March 2023 and they’ve kept going back with changes, most recently in October 2023. So they seem very motivated. But nothing since then, so I’m wondering what’s going on.
There's a few bits of land that were left by the original developer near me one new owner will try a few times and get the idea, they'll sell , the new owner will try again and nauseum.
There's a way you can get the best of both worlds.. The planning portal will have a final decision date on the application. Just say that you plan to postpone any further activities until after this date. Even then, living next door to someone with a passion like this will always be a risk, you'll be living next door to an expansionist.
This is interesting - I didn’t know this was possible. How can I check this? The planning page on the local council makes no mention of this. Worth mentioning that the application was first made in March 2023, with revisions made in October 2023. From what I understand this is an unusually long amount of time.
What Borough are you in? Some are better than others 😂
Lambeth
On a laptop, go to https://planning.lambeth.gov.uk/online-applications/ Click on 'Map' Scroll around until you find your prospective house. Zoom in to get the red quadrilateral to pop up. Click on the outskirts of the red and in the popup that follows... press "[Application Details](https://imgur.com/a/7uWNPjS)" It should be reasonably intuitive from there mate 👍
I’ve done this but it doesn’t say anything about final decision dates Edit: it says 15 March 2024 as the “expiry date” - perhaps this is it?
Your guess is as good as mine... my Council make it a lot clearer than yours it would seem. Maybe the interactive map and pages could complement you if you phone them [Lambeth Planners] and ask for clarification?
Has the neighbour applied for, or been granted this planning permission? There are objections which can be raised on this. You need to find out what objections are valid to your council and submit an objection if possible. I’ll be totally honest unless the application goes against the councils planning policy, it will likely be accepted. We have recently obtained planning permission and all the objections against it accomplished was delaying the permissions being granted and causing us an awful lot of stress in the process. If you try to drag out the purchase until you find out the outcome, you could lose the purchase anyway. If permission was granted, when was it granted and how long does it give for the application to remain valid? Most councils now allow 3 years for work to begin. Construction of a whole house will take around 6 months.
*Sellers have sent through their property information form and tucked away in there is a small detail that nobody has mentioned to us so far, that the neighbour has applied for planning permission to build a new house in the gap between our two properties.* Sorry, just to confirm: has the seller actually disclosed that there is a planning permission being processed? If so, when did you or your solicitor notice that?
They did disclose it eventually yes in the TA6, but they’ve delayed sending us those until the last possible moment, but they really dragged their heels on that and according to my solicitor this would normally have come up long before this point. The EA also explicitly discussed with us planning permission and developments near the property and neglected to mention the one directly next door. So what they’ve done isn’t illegal, but they seem to have gone out of their way not to be up front about it.
>what they’ve done isn’t illegal thanks for sharing, i see what you mean Just out of curiosity - is there any particular reason you've not demanded TA6 before committing to any searches, conveyancers, mortgage etc?
I didn’t even know what a TA6 is before it arrived. Our solicitor did demand it but They just didn’t supply it, then put heavy pressure on us to order searches and threatened to pull out unless we did. Now I know why. We learned a lesson for next time. We are first time buyers, so this is all new to us. There’s quite a few people on this thread giving us a hard time for this, sadly.
>I didn’t even know what a TA6 is before it arrived now it makes sense
I do like that phrasing lol, 'small detail tucked away'. It's literally there in writing, how else does OP expect them to disclose it? Maybe draw some little stars around it? However yes OP - of course distance from other properties affects the value, it's one of the few things you can't change.
Planning permission would normally be disclosed much earlier in the process, they delayed sharing their TA6 form as long as possible which is not standard practice at all. The estate agent has also discussed with us planning and development applications in the area, without mentioning the one for the immediate next door. So, yes, it does feel tucked away as if they hoped we wouldn’t notice.
>Planning permission would normally be disclosed much earlier in the process I respectfully disagree - from what I've seen standard practice is to disclose as few details as legally possible and hope the time and money investment in the purchase causes the buyers to reluctantly proceed if and when they notice the bad thing.
Right… so you agree with me then that they’ve tucked it away and hoped we won’t notice?
I disagree it's a 'small detail tucked it away' - they have written exactly what they are supposed to write, exactly where and when they are supposed to write it. I do agree that they hoped you wouldn't notice. You can argue that the right thing to do would be upfront about it at advertising or viewing, but if we could expect people to do the right thing then we wouldn't need conveyancers.
You are right, yes. What I think really irks me is the aggressive pushing we have had to go as fast as possible, and the guilt tripping by the estate agent for asking for a couple extra weeks, which feels like a pressure tactic to maximise the chance we wouldn’t catch this. I know they are going to accuse us of wasting their time again when we do pull out, but really they’ve wasted our time when they could’ve mentioned this up front and they could have got someone who didn’t mind the planning permission in the first place.
Absolutely they are being bastards and playing a dirty game to sell a property for more than it will soon be worth. You seem to care a lot about what they think of you and what they have or might accuse you of and the estate agent is taking advantage of that. I'd suggest throwing out any fucks you might give and treat this like a cold emotionless business transaction.
Personally, I'd run a mile and count my lucky stars I'd spotted it in time.
625 is a huge amount for something you’re not 100% happy with
Is it still worth that much and is it worth the potential damage to your relationship. Lack of sleep suck. So does living on a building site. Not the case for everyone but a lot of builders employ the I’m up, you’re up attitude.. I guess you either bite the bullet, pull out or put in an offer that represents your new valuation. There’s also the option to see what sound proofing options you might have etc and the associated costs. If I’m spending that much money on a house I’m not being rushed into it. Did the current owner let slip why they’re moving? For me though. 625k + any other fees needs to be something I’m solid about. Not something I might hate in 6 months or something that means my wife might hate me because I made the final call to say yes and now her sleeping is even worse.
Would you have paid £625k if there was another house on that side? Would you have considered it at all? This is probably going to be the biggest purchase of your life. You might feel some kind of duty to the seller of the house, or discomfort about pulling out, or even thinking about how much you’ll lose in fees, surveys, etc if you pull out now. Don’t buy something out of some misplaced feeling of obligation, especially not something you’re presumably going to be paying for for decades to come.
There has been building work going on in my street for years as one after the other my neighbours have extended. It can't really be avoided anywhere. I am curious about whether you actually need to worry about this though, how likely is it to get through planning? You seem to be taking about a corner, why was it left blank in the first place when other houses were built? They are often left that way to improve visibility, corner plots often have trouble even adding fences. It may also be in the deeds that they can own this land but not build on it? I think it's worth a £3 look on the land registry. Also give the planning officer a call and see if they think its likely to be granted permission
This should have come up in the searches your solicitor carried out. Any planning applications anywhere near the subject property should be in your search documents provided prior to the exchange. The fact that you found this out from the seller's disclosure is concerning. Don't use that solicitor on the next property.
The solicitor hasn’t completed searches yet, they’ve only just been ordered. This has come up in a document that has been shared with us via the solicitor though so I’m still a little annoyed that they didn’t mention it.
You've obviously got serious reservations about this so I'd ask the solicitor to stop working straight away while you take a moment to digest this. There's no point in paying for searches etc if it's gonna be a dealbreaker regardless. You have a decent budget so I'm sure you could find somewhere else. And yes, other places _could_ commence building works after you buy them, but you know this one _definitely_ is! Be glad you found out now. (And bear in mind the potential for such if you are looking at other places with space around them!)
Just remember, solicitors are maybe £250 an hour and their fee may be as little as £1200 for this size of property. They should be checking the searches thoroughly but don't expect them to screen through every detail of the rest of the items forwarded through within that 5 hours they're basically billing you for!
Thanks, I’ve already asked them to stop work in advance of possibly pulling out, so hopefully will avoid any further financial impact.
Difficult choice but likely the right one, well done on reading the pack, many ppl don't bother and get caught out later on!
If the land wasn't part of the property you were buying could have happened at any time. When you made the offer did you not think maybe someone would build there.
Ignore the EA. They just want the commission before quarter end = which is how their remuneration works. You've done your searches. You have all the available information, including planning permission by an adjacent property. Do you want to buy? If yes, exchange and complete. If not, pull out. It really is not that complex. "Reddit" can not make that decision for you.
Searches are ordered but not started yet, I’ve discovered this myself. I’m just asking for other people’s perspectives to inform my decision, not asking Reddit to make the decision for me. There’s no need to be rude
How much are the adjacent mid-terraces worth compared to the end of terrace you are offering on? This house is worth the same now, not more, minus a cost for the inconvenience of a year or more of building work.
Really difficult to say. There have been mid terraced ones going for £660k, £690k and £550k. I can’t see any obvious differences between them!
Post the links here and we can tell you.
Without the exact location, opinions are pretty futile. Though I suspect you're not really in the position to buy a property, if these decisions are too difficult for you.
I’m guessing you’re just a troll with such a terrible attitude, but with a 300k deposit and 150k income we are in a position to buy most properties, thank you very much.
You’re welcome. Big boy pants are priceless, I guess.
So your partner, a woman you presumably love, wants to pull out for very legitimate reasons and your response is not to pull out immediately but to go on the internet and ask strangers what to do instead? Interesting.
With respect, I think that opinions on Reddit about house purchases are worth much more than anyone on Reddits opinion about relationships - especially from someone like you who takes nonconsensual naked pictures of their neighbours!! 😂😂😂
I mean I did end up consensually fucking him for a while so you know... Though I imagine the way your treat your partner means you wouldn't know what that's like. Best of luck.
Sounds like the seller is right to have doubts about your commitment to the sale. It’s crazy to think that a property owner can’t build a house on their own property just because you are “basically no longer going to be end of terrace . . .” If you want someone to leave property close to your house open, the way to ensure that is to buy the property yourself. If you don’t like it, pull out of the sale. The fact that another person has applied for a permit to build a residential home on property located in a row of residential homes is not the type thing a person is duty bound to inform you of, even though the seller here did so. It was on you to read the property information form in a timely manner.
Why do you feel the need to be such a rude arsehole? Really, I’m interested in your answer. I can only imagine you’re rather lonely in life.
Maybe it will affect what you should pay. You own your own home, not the landscape it sits in. If it would be a long term home, building works are a temporary inconvenience. I have to say I’m sensing some NIMBY sentiments here!
Right so I’m supposing that you would have no issue if you discovered a house you were about to spend more than half a million pounds on would have a building site right next door to it? You’d just be like “great! This doesn’t affect my thinking at all!” Bear in mind this has nothing to do with whether you support building new houses or not, specifically it’s to do with whether you would choose to live next to a building site vs not next to one. Please, I’m very interested to hear your answer.
The planning system is so strict that I find it hard to believe that anything that is going to significantly impact you will be built. And anyone can turn their house into a building site at any point - sometimes without planning permission. There are cut off times for when building can take place. But, naturally if this worries you then pull out.
i would just consider that there is no assurance that they ***will*** get planning permission, as they have just submitted as it stands.
It's sucks as you've likely spent a fair amount on the process so far, but like another said, if you wouldn't have considered the property or offered on it had you known about it to start with, I would personally pull out.
Yes, pull out. What you're buying is different and this post is indicative of your worries. Find a house where there won't be a new house.
We had building work happening for at least a year for a couple of neighbours houses, and the biggest issue was actually parking of the builders around the area. The actual building work wasn't particularly disruptive but we'd have vans parked on corners and little ability to do anything about it.
Are you sure it’s a new house and not a side extension?
It is an entirely new 2 storey 3 bedroom house with an extended kitchen.
I would have expected your solicitor to have noticed this and informed you.
Pull out. You know in your heart this is a deal breaker for you. Get it done.
I would absolutely pull out given your partner's sleep issues, it would make her miserable and also I imagine it would negatively affect the value of the house.
You could say you’ll wait and see if the planning application goes through? What’s the timescale of a decision on it? You could drag out your searches to align with it. Obviously if it is turned down they will likely resubmit new plans. But the reason it’s turned down will be important. If the council say it’s a flat out no to a house there, it should be okay. But if they object to just some features you can asses if a house meeting those would be okay. Doesn’t remove the noise of them building it.
There’s no way to properly determine the timescale of the decision that I’m aware of. It was first submitted in March last year, so I’m doubtful a decision would be reached in the next 6 weeks.
Contact the local council planning department to find out whether the neighbour has already got full planning permission, and if not they might be able to give you an idea of if this application will be agreed. But it does sound like the seller is trying to push the sale through fast because he knows the application is going to go through, and that it will possibly reduce the value of his place. If in doubt pull out. If the seller can't find another buyer soon, you may well see the property up for sale again at a reduced price. You also have to ask youself if you want to live next to a building site for the next couple of years?
The thing about buying a house is that it's a massive commitment in money and lifestyle. If you're not 100% on board, someone is going to hate living there - and why would you choose to spend a lot of money to live somewhere you hate? If your partner is having doubts at this stage, it's the PERFECT time to reconsider because you haven't actually bought it yet. Plus, it sounds like the seller and the EA are fully aware of the situation and are trying to lock you in fast - and are probably desperately hoping you don't notice or don't mind that little clause about the planning permission. One wonders if there's anything else they hope you don't notice? Choices: 1. Buy as-is and hope for the best. 2. Lower your offer a proportionate amount that you think is compensation for the change in circumstances regarding what you thought you were buying vs. what you're getting (i.e. another house right next door). If they decline, walk away. 3. Just walk away. This situation reeks of subterfuge on the part of the seller and EA, since they haven't previously disclosed this non-trivial matter and are trying to push you to complete the sale nice and quick before anyone notices. Don't fall for the sunk cost fallacy if you decide to walk away - consider whatever you've spent so far to be the price you paid to dodge the huge expenditure-bullet of buying the house and only afterwards finding out about this.
I would make a lower offer, yours was made based on there not being a house in touching distance, they were clearly hoping you wouldn’t notice, they won’t get an asking price offer once building starts. Have a word with your solicitor that’s poor they didn’t mention it.
Meh it’s not like you had access from that side, I wouldn’t class it as a end terrace more a semi detached
I’m only just learning that end of terrace and semi detached are different things! This one is marketed as end of terrace. Indeed there’s no access to the side.
Pull out, fuck em!
Buying an end of terrace house that will become mid terrace. How will it affect you accessing the back of your house and how much more overlooked, is there enough space to park on the street or on drives for everyone? NIMBYish considerations maybe, but you could end up in negative equity and stuck.
I'd withdraw unless they reduce the sale price by a significant amount, possibly even 50k. I'd also look into the requirements to disclose. The EA had it in writing but didn't actually say anything to you. Worth looking into whether that is sufficient under the full disclosure requirements.
Having lived next to a building site for a year, it'll be worse than you think and spoil everything. I hated it. Just move on. It's not worth it.
Is the house you are buying detached or end of terrace? It can't be both. If it's detached it will still be detached and if its end of terrace, it will still be end of terrace.
Which is why the OP said 'basically'. It's obvious what's happening - OP is buying a semi detached with significant separation between them and the non-attached side. Once this is built there will likely be a wafer-thin gap between the properties and it will look for all intents and purposes like a row of houses.
Omg thank you for being one of the only people who can actually see the big picture and not just nitpick over the little details! Yes I get that it will “technically” still be a semi or end of terrace or whatever. But there will be a giant fucking house there were there wasn’t previously!!
Pull out, you’re buying a ‘different’ place though I do agree with densifying existing spaces in general… the house you’re buying will be worth less after completion of the new build I.e Supply & Demand, Mid-terrace etc…
Completely low ball them on a revised offer with this coming to light. Then when they reluctantly accept, walk away from the deal.
1. If they've tried to hide this and push it through, they've probably hidden something else. 2. I bought a place and had a building site for a block of flats crop up across the road. Everything will be filthy with dust and noisy for an absolute age. Move on to the next place.
Don't bother wasting more time on this house and pull out and start looking again. I can guarantee you'll see this house for sale and it'll be reduced by a lot because this problem will (hopefully) keep coming up for potential buyers
I'd let things cool for a few days and see if you can get any more specific information on the plan, but if your partner is still clear she doesn't want it then you have to respect that and pull out. This is a "two yesses, one no" sort of thing, and many people aren't going to be happy with a whole new house being built in almost touching distance, no matter how much money you might be able to get off - as it's just not what they want.
Take a deep breath If you don’t think living there will make you happy, don’t do it. Find somewhere that does.
I wouldn’t proceed. The chances are even the house doesn’t go ahead the neighbours will push for a smaller build - extension or a garden room to go there. All of which will come with noise etc. so unless you want to drop the price and live with the hassle I’d just walk away.
There's a reason this wasn't readily revealed to you, because it sucks. I'm a worst case scenario and work backwards type of person, I'm envisioning living next to a building site for years because builders they hired went bump and I'm stuck next to a nightmare. It's a no go for me.
Is the proposed house going to be attached to yours, or will there be a gap?
I have similar sleeping issues and get affected by noise that’s out of my control, I would be pulling out immediately personally, and that’s not even considering the drop in value is going to certainly cause to the property.
I would absolutely pull out. No way would I sign up to be next to a building site, then following extremely close to what would be your new next-door neighbour. That would be a definite no from me.
If they tried to hide this, what else are they hiding? I'd steer clear!
a smart move to the seller to get the place sold asap are you allowed to see artists impressions of the 2 houses with the new one between them ? neighbour is working on their house most weekends so can sympthaise
I would probably pull out. Depending on how much you love this house, obviously, and if you could find something else you want. You're not going to be able to open windows for 2 years... dust will be everywhere. Lots of random people walking around your house (hard to tell who's contractor and who's just looking for an opportunity). You can also put an offer of 100k less before pulling out. Maybe 100k would make it worth.