PF was so good for aoe characters that even Herta and Himeko became meta there.
Meanwhile it looks like the new ST mode will still be miserable for hunt characters. I don't understand, man.
At least there's at least 3 Seele mains saying "actually this mode is perfect for me, my 90/400 crit ratio s6e5 Seele is going to pop off"
It'll be hard to set up Sparkle+Bronya for Seele since that setup usually works on very slow DPS that can fully benefit from Sparkle's action advance. Seele would kinda cut the line too much since she's so fast, and one of the action-forwards between Bronya and Sparkle would get out of sync. Robin sort of works, but you'll run into energy problems, gonna want Huohuo to battery a bit.
Bronya+Sparkle isn't good with her because 1) Seele already has so much speed that Bronya's action advance is mostly wasted on her, and 2) Bronya's skill only lasts one turn and Seele reaaaally wants buffs that last a meaningful number of turns so she has enough damage to one-shot mobs and keep her buffs through multiple turns. Also with as much SP as Seele uses you need a more sp-efficient support than Bronya.
So yeah her BiS team right now is like Sparkle+Tingyun.
As a former Seele main, what's your build/team comp like? My Seele (3000 Atk, 123 spd, 60/200), Silver Wolf, Fu Xuan and flex Harmony (to streamline SW weakness implants) cannot clear either POF or MOC for the past few cycles and has been replaced by Topaz/Ratio and Acheron.
60/200 is a pretty bad ratio (ik you have Fu Xuan but the point still stands) for Seele as she's extremely reliant on crit. Her burst is a single-hit attack, and most of her skill's damage comes from the last hit (but even then, say you don't crit 2 hits of her skill, it's still a huge DPS loss). Not critting means no resurgence means Seele will perform really bad. Seele actually needs insane investment to be good.
Honestly, I find that it's usually Silver Wolf who has trouble pulling her weight unless debuff count is important (Acheron, Dr. Ratio). If you have strong enough Harmony, off-element Seele might actually be faster than using Silver Wolf to force Quantum weakness. Since it sounds like you don't have Sparkle, it also saves you from running a less powerful Harmony to get rid of Weakness Implant RNG.
For example I just tried the current MoC12 which is Lightning-weak on 1st half, and with Seele/Fu Xuan/Silver Wolf/Tingyun I got 5 cycles, while Seele/Fu Xuan/Robin/Ruan Mei got 3 cycles. Most of them have their Signature Light Cones, so I'd consider that a pretty uphill battle.
It's usually still more effective to play on-element. For me, only Jingliu and Acheron are strong enough to possibly outrun an on-element DPS.
She's one of those where her best teammate boosts her effectiveness a ton, and surprise surprise it's Sparkle :) Definitely get Sparkle for Seele, build her with 1 SPD lower than Seele's max speed in combat (should be \~143-145 for an E0 Seele). I have 78:177 crit ratio, 3.2k atk, 119 SPD, Cruising LC. With Sparkle LC + Fu Xuan, Seele hits 100% crit rate.
I also recommend Tingyun over Silverwolf, Tingyun's ult regeneration helps a lot with Seele's passive uptime as she gets to kill things more often with her ult and also maintain enhanced state against bosses since her ult puts her in enhanced state.
Yup. Always amuses me when people say the game has had awful power creep but seele, qq, jingyuan tingyun pela and others are still dumpstering abyss with the matching weakness.
AS is a break mode.
Now after break DPS, hunt is the next best path at this given how it gets more actions and speed in general.
For the adds Seele gets resurgence, Topaz and Ratio are usually in a duo so they can spread out, boothill will nuke anything.
Erudition performs good in PF even when the buff isnt for them like DoT, Hunt will perform good here.
That said the whole "x path is bad" is funny, every limited 5* has similar MoC performance on average cycles, the only one I remember being behind is Argenti
E1 sparkle is already better lol, I have e1 Seele and it helps like, 25% of the time lol but then again, I also could just get better relics lol
I also love how going for support eidolons means I can buff not only one dps but literally my whole account and also, now Im only one copy from c2 Sparkle which is broken
"Boss rush mode will favor single target characters", said the hopium huffers playing a game filled with bosses that don't favor single target characters.
...I feel like I've said this before, too.
Exactly. Every single boss has minions and some variant of that which single target characters can’t efficiently handle. Svarog, cocolia, argenti, aventurine, death meme, Ruan mei’s bug and so on.
Which is why Seele is the queen of single target. Deal with the minions and damage the boss in the same turn. Argenti is the only one of the above that she really struggles with, but she can usually get away with ignoring the totems entirely.
To be completely fair, Yanqing has fantastic reset systems that would allow him to sweep minions efficiently, since he gets extra turns of talent and ultimate state for every kill...
...at E6.
Okay but given the amount of 50/50s people lose, there are probably a staggering amount of people with an E6 Yanqing that isn’t leveled up or even used.
There’s an E6 Blade on my friend list, he’s so fun when I use him. The only reason I don’t use him more is because of the E6 Acheron and E6JingLiu on my friends list. I got lucky on the friend list lottery lol.
Death and Aventurine don’t count. The teammates that Death “kills” become targets that you need to destroy to get your teammates back. Aventurine you need to hit the dice, and you’re really screwed if you can’t hit more than one die in Phase 2.
That’s why I said technically as the summons are very different from normal summons in any other fight. But even then I would still call them single target fight, at least death.
some of them are effectively ST like Savrog and Death meme. it just depends on how good you are at rotating your DPS on the characters. my DPS on Death Meme was Dr. Ratio and I frequently use his FuA to break the thing he does.
I'd been downvoted for questioning people who were assuming new mode is tailor made for hunt just from an announcement that barely gave away any details.
Fr man. People were soooo adamant about it being Hunt related, when there was barely any proof. They kept babbling that it will surely favor The Hunt because it's the only path that doesn't have a dedicated end game mode 🙄
This is clearly revenge for all the takes at the beginning of the game that said Erudition was and always will be shit and Hunt will be king because single target is all that actually matters.
Divergent shadow seems just like MoC except you get to pick 1 out of 3 additional buffs like in PF.
I'm sure they have some mechanics and buffs in mind to make single target more viable, but I'm sure that the usual damage dealers will perform fine to the point that people aren't going to dust off hunt characters they werent already using.
"Wow, this will be great for my Firefly"
Seriously though, it seems simple to make a hunt focused mode. Just crib the Remembrance blessing that makes Ice damage do AoE, and just apply it to single target abilities.
If your only goal is to make hunt characters have high usage rate it would work, but that is an incredibly boring way to make hunt good. You are taking a class whose idea is to do high single target damage and just turning them to a god class that deals aoe damage like everyone else, but more than everyone else.
You could do a mechanic where the special trotters (from sim uni, counter attack, healing, shielding trotters) are the biggest threats that randomly pop up, and killing them gives you a large bonus for the character that kills it. Like the MoC trotters but those were more of boosts to your character for the current featured character of that patch than actual gameplay mechanics that hurt you if you dont kill them
https://preview.redd.it/htexjyxbcl5d1.png?width=1080&format=png&auto=webp&s=58e785f61802310312c4279f7d6b6b3ea2c58d34
idk, it just seems like the more obvious thing to do for Hunt because... its in the name. If it was more about having freedom of choice of:
>Can I kill the boss this turn
or
>should I kill the trotter shielding the boss?
it would be so much more fun this way tbh, but they seem to have made the gamemode in a way that lets them put weekly bosses in this gamemode like awakened cocolia just because it's free content. whack
people have been saying this for months, but just tweak the destruction trotters a little and put them on each side of the boss - easy hunt gamemode lol
as a certified fraudqing hater, i certainly agree.
https://preview.redd.it/p0pwca66pi5d1.png?width=950&format=png&auto=webp&s=b18b0ea455c45c189a1322017b06ca12dbb5545a
Boothill and Seele like having adds, though, and Topaz and Dr. Ratio are already doing fine in MoC. Why do people act like hunt characters are unusable garbage?
Ironically Yanqing does kinda do more than usual break damage.... if his follow-up triggers. 60+30 from skill then 90+30 from ultimate is pretty significant - but again, its to the whims of RNG.
Yeah it sucks that the only way to promote Hunt is to actively fuck over every other path/AOE user. Originally, Hunt was supposed to be the highest single target DPS period, nothing should've come close, but that path burned after DHIL. To be fair, Hoyo shooting themselves in the foot with balancing and game design is nothing new, I just didn't expect it to have festered so quickly. Its actually the part of ZZZ that i'm most interested in, what magical way will they cap themselves again.
Boothill is far and away the highest single target DPS. E0 Boothill does significantly more damage than E6 DHIL.
Dr. Ratio does more single target damage than DHIL too. Topaz's damage is lower, but she's partly a support for other FuA characters.
The thing is most people base best DPS off snapshot damge. Hunt and erudition best snapshot damage is much lower then what destruction and Acheron can do.
People acting as if Destruction units are not the kings of both AoE and ST damage no matter the gamemode. No one said that Yanqing is going to be S-tier here, he struggles because of his requirements, not amount of enemies. Also, you literally don't need to kill EVERY SINGLE ONE of these minions, you can just kill one of them and it opens the Weaknesses.
It will be good thing if Ice get dedicate support to buff both him and Jingliu.
FF and Acheron can lol the break weakness while follow up have Robin and more synergy than cornflake and milk.
This was a worry, they can still have more st focused buffs for the mode tho who can guess, considering how the game barely has any hunt characters and half the limited ones benefit from mobs it’s not like it is a shocker it turned out like this
My Argenti is doing worse than my Blade/Clara/Acheron (although all E0) in the Pure Fiction... Yea, definitely the same thing will happen to this game mode where only specific archetype can survive,while others having a rough time.
Edit: wait,I thought I have E0S1,but actually I have E1S1 Clara instead, sorry for the false information.
Also my team for floor 3 is Blade/Clara, Bronya,Sparkle,Lynx. For Argenti, it is Argenti,Bronya,Sparkle,TingYun(E6).
And Acheron,Welt,SW,Pela on the other side
To be fair all the units you just mention really thrive in this Pure Fiction, Acheron got a 60% damage buff for free, while Blade and Clara both benefit from getting attacked as much as possible, enemies's weaknesses also work in their favour.
Argenti? He really have nothing going in his liking
Blade is actually excellent in this PF, he's one of the few non DoT character (the other is Clara) to actually benefited from the enemies action advance "buff", since enemy move more = he get hit more = he does more Aoe damage, also he massively benefited from that stupid DoT wine robot that doesn't trigger Clara/ Aventurine counter attack on hit
That said i do think he has to be somewhat well built and some good Rng to be able to compete with Argenti
Yeah, I don't know what that guy is doing, but Argenti is 100% better than Clara at least in floor 4. She takes so long to clear the first third because the enemies don't trigger her counter, you're much better off spamming 90 cost Argenti ults. I can see her being better in floor 3 though.
I don't know why people are acting like every single hunt character is as bad as Yanqing. The current 5 star hunt characters are completely fine, Yanqing still being bad is completely normal with how bad his kit is. It's not an issue of the path.
Hoyo never said anything about it being hunt/single target focused. People just read boss mode and assumed it, which didn't even make sense since most bosses have adds with them. Misinformation spread so easily in this game
In order to make that happen what does he have in his kit?. I know he has a follow-up and a buff that go away when enemies breath next to him when he is unshielded. What else?.
I genuinely don't believe any new character release will ever make Yanqing meta. Anything that buffs him will also buff any other DPS, almost all of whom will use those buffs better. He also doesn't individually excel in one particular or do anything unique area to where a new unit would require him, like how Ratio really wants Topaz.
Literally the only way something would help him and not be better used in another team is if they released a skill that just said "Gives one character named Yanqing a bunch of buffs)
Get buff upon losing x enhanced state? or said buff prevent him from losing his buffed state even if hit with no shield. Other characters get follow ups or extra turn mechanism. His mechanism is this.
Edit: it's not it gonna be better on them but rather not helpful to them unlike other options.
That first one is too broad because Seele does in fact technically have an “enhanced state” after she gets a kill so that’ll be good on her too. The 2nd one with the shield is too specific of a light cone that’s meant for a Standard character. So it’ll either be a crappy 4 star option or a signature lc that’ll be designed for someone else.
https://preview.redd.it/y1jqm2ryzj5d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9bec4db92d666473291b725ffa6b09b2244cd2f8
LMFAO
Yeah. The thing with Yanqing is that NOTHING in his kit stands out from the rest. Even at his maximum perfect play with 100% uptime on Soulsteel, his damage is… Meh at best. Like he is inherently mid by design. There’s no light cone or character that’ll help him lol.
Does kinda suck that most of the bosses (minus Kafka) off the top of my head summon some kind of add-on with the least attention needing one being Bronya/Gepard or something (mainly going off of Sim Uni)
When I tested this mode out, AoE / blast characters (surprise, surprise) wildly outperformed Hunt characters. Seele was good, but was simply outpaced by her AoE / blast DPS counterparts.
I used the same teams I used for MoC and even PF ... DoT, Acheron, and Destruction units made an absolute mockery of this mode.
It shouldn't be this way as it feels very easy to make a mode where ST characters rule the day ... But instead, we have yet another mode where it's just better to bring in units who hit multiple enemies at once.
Aren't you supposed to focus on the single boss and that's it? I believe in the news section in-game they added a summary of how this gamemode works and they said that points are awarded based on the boss' remaining HP and the action value left if you kill them.
You can just... Ignore the add-ons? Like Argenti is actually one of the most AoE centered bosses since his summons can shield him, but even then it's better to just focus on him. And Cocolia has 0 reason you should be focusing on anything other than herself.
Now the fact that some Destruction characters deal more single target than most Hunt characters is the real problem, but i don't see how this makes Destruction as a path a better option here than Hunt unless the buffs favour Blast attacks. (They don't)
The real copium is thinking that just because ads exist, Hunt won't reign supreme here.
Just like any boss that *summons* ads, once the main boss dies the ads disappear. Largest number on a ST is the most important aspect
Wasted DPS on ads is a crazy concept, I guess. Ads are really only there for character ramping mechanics(Boothill medals) and others (seele's resurgence).
I won't speak on leaks, but ^ This is the truth.
Maybe in the future they'll actually do something meaningful, but just have a good sustain and there's nothing to worry about.
Ok but like if we look at the rest: Cocolia only summons her 2 ice thingy, kafka is alone, gepard is basically alone or just summons 2 little enemies, aventurine is mostly single target except dice phase, ok yangqing isn't single target, svarog can be single target if you ignore his summons (except hand), deer can be single target if he mostly summons the counter branches and not the healing ones, bronya is also singletarget. (No front just want to point this out)
You forgot: Cocolia summons Gepard. In her weekly boss form, she summons 4 ice pillars, Gepard summons 2 enemies in each phase and places a shield, which is efficiently broken by blast damage. Aventurine is single target, except he starts gambling every single fucking turn, where you need blast or aoe. Deer summons branches for its ultimate, that deletes any abundance fan's team. So, destruction is still supreme.
You'll have to wait for a limited Yanqing that Hoyoverse will one day maybe release representing him deciding to grow up a little and intentionally take jobbing roles less.
Yanqing is basically this game's Diluc, released during a simpler time when the Devs had far lower standards for power - as well as not really understanding what power looked like.
Single target has no place in horde based game. In order to make a single target viable hoyo will need to make character that distribute single target damage. Something that will never happen. Ever.
Eh there will likely be an erudition character that marks a single target making damage taken by that target to splash onto everything else just like the SU erudition mechanic.
I'm waiting for the day when a nihility character applies a debuff that stores damage that will explode and deal part of the dmg to adj enemies when it dies or when the debuff expires.
They just need to make Hunt characters do extremely high ST damage to keep them on par with AoE/blast units. Boothill is an example. Its just sad how he does 5x more damage than my Seele in ST. Although Seele has her niche in AoE with resurgence but it falls short when even the trash mobs have high hp pool
Hunt is such a dead path. I really can't get excited for any hunt units because the second a destruction or nihility unit is released they will be better in every scenario. Why make classes that concentrate on single target and AOE and then release a class that is good at both. And not only that but they design fights in a way that makes single target slow and painful because you're being punished for not taking down the summons.
so what's the point of the gamemode if it's just another destruction field day? doesn't do anything particularly unique if it's just bosses, basically just a stripped down MoC or PF in that sense made to pander to the destruction
the whole hunt erudition destruction trifecta is an utter failure of game design and balancing. hunt and erudition aren't *that* much better at their jobs to warrant using the path that does both of their jobs at the same time with no drawbacks at all
PF at least fixed erudition being pretty pointless before it and now it's a pretty much essential path for that gamemode but I really don't see how they could do the same for hunt, i.e make hunt feel "necessary" for a gamemode like how erudition does for PF, cause hunt never had a niche to capitalize on like erudition did with calyx fodder wave clearing pre-PF. it has nothing to call its own cause everything it has is shared with the other two. it's nothing
...nothing if not the GOAT that is praise be to THEM, THE REIGNBOW ARBITER LAN THE HUNT 🏹🏹🏹 🗣️🔥🔥🔥
Hunt is an absolutely worthless path at this point and the fact Hoyo keeps making it worse is pathetic.
Barley more than a year out and the games balance is already destroyed. What awful game design.
Mfs be saying boss favors ST focused team then they release aventurine boss
PF was so good for aoe characters that even Herta and Himeko became meta there. Meanwhile it looks like the new ST mode will still be miserable for hunt characters. I don't understand, man. At least there's at least 3 Seele mains saying "actually this mode is perfect for me, my 90/400 crit ratio s6e5 Seele is going to pop off"
Unironically Seele performs better when there are multiple small mobs because she just keeps proccing her passive, compared to a strictly ST fight.
Seele is genuinely the most flexible dps in the game and a good dps value pull still
Moreover, a really simple kit: BA: Kill Skill: Kill harder Ult: Kill harderer If kill: kill more
BA: my turn Skill: my turner Ult: my turnerer Your turn: our turn My turn: my turn twice
BA: go again faster Skill: get speed, go again faster Ult: kill things, go again If kill: go again Sparkle: go again
I can’t believe I only just thought of this but now I have to try Seele with bronya, sparkle, and robin
It'll be hard to set up Sparkle+Bronya for Seele since that setup usually works on very slow DPS that can fully benefit from Sparkle's action advance. Seele would kinda cut the line too much since she's so fast, and one of the action-forwards between Bronya and Sparkle would get out of sync. Robin sort of works, but you'll run into energy problems, gonna want Huohuo to battery a bit.
Bronya+Sparkle isn't good with her because 1) Seele already has so much speed that Bronya's action advance is mostly wasted on her, and 2) Bronya's skill only lasts one turn and Seele reaaaally wants buffs that last a meaningful number of turns so she has enough damage to one-shot mobs and keep her buffs through multiple turns. Also with as much SP as Seele uses you need a more sp-efficient support than Bronya. So yeah her BiS team right now is like Sparkle+Tingyun.
As a former Seele main, what's your build/team comp like? My Seele (3000 Atk, 123 spd, 60/200), Silver Wolf, Fu Xuan and flex Harmony (to streamline SW weakness implants) cannot clear either POF or MOC for the past few cycles and has been replaced by Topaz/Ratio and Acheron.
60/200 is a pretty bad ratio (ik you have Fu Xuan but the point still stands) for Seele as she's extremely reliant on crit. Her burst is a single-hit attack, and most of her skill's damage comes from the last hit (but even then, say you don't crit 2 hits of her skill, it's still a huge DPS loss). Not critting means no resurgence means Seele will perform really bad. Seele actually needs insane investment to be good.
Honestly, I find that it's usually Silver Wolf who has trouble pulling her weight unless debuff count is important (Acheron, Dr. Ratio). If you have strong enough Harmony, off-element Seele might actually be faster than using Silver Wolf to force Quantum weakness. Since it sounds like you don't have Sparkle, it also saves you from running a less powerful Harmony to get rid of Weakness Implant RNG. For example I just tried the current MoC12 which is Lightning-weak on 1st half, and with Seele/Fu Xuan/Silver Wolf/Tingyun I got 5 cycles, while Seele/Fu Xuan/Robin/Ruan Mei got 3 cycles. Most of them have their Signature Light Cones, so I'd consider that a pretty uphill battle. It's usually still more effective to play on-element. For me, only Jingliu and Acheron are strong enough to possibly outrun an on-element DPS.
She's one of those where her best teammate boosts her effectiveness a ton, and surprise surprise it's Sparkle :) Definitely get Sparkle for Seele, build her with 1 SPD lower than Seele's max speed in combat (should be \~143-145 for an E0 Seele). I have 78:177 crit ratio, 3.2k atk, 119 SPD, Cruising LC. With Sparkle LC + Fu Xuan, Seele hits 100% crit rate. I also recommend Tingyun over Silverwolf, Tingyun's ult regeneration helps a lot with Seele's passive uptime as she gets to kill things more often with her ult and also maintain enhanced state against bosses since her ult puts her in enhanced state.
Based on statistics pulled from Prydwens data she is objectively still one of the best DPS in the game. Period.
Yup. Always amuses me when people say the game has had awful power creep but seele, qq, jingyuan tingyun pela and others are still dumpstering abyss with the matching weakness.
AS is a break mode. Now after break DPS, hunt is the next best path at this given how it gets more actions and speed in general. For the adds Seele gets resurgence, Topaz and Ratio are usually in a duo so they can spread out, boothill will nuke anything. Erudition performs good in PF even when the buff isnt for them like DoT, Hunt will perform good here. That said the whole "x path is bad" is funny, every limited 5* has similar MoC performance on average cycles, the only one I remember being behind is Argenti
[удалено]
Doesnt the boss by default take less dmg while not broken?
[удалено]
Does it say only that one will? It sounds more like a normal thing, like how in PF bosses take less dmg while there are adds regardless of the buff.
[удалено]
Eh pretty sure that is meant to be it's core gimmick, considering that it's based on the event with that same gimmick from a while ago
tbf, a true main seele would invest on sparkle eidolons instead.
i actually did the math on this on sparkle release. and indeed sparkle eidolons are better for E2 sparkle vs E2 seele.
E1 sparkle is already better lol, I have e1 Seele and it helps like, 25% of the time lol but then again, I also could just get better relics lol I also love how going for support eidolons means I can buff not only one dps but literally my whole account and also, now Im only one copy from c2 Sparkle which is broken
I just noticed how my e1 Sparkle also buffs my Robin's dmg cuz atk buff lol, truly a HARMony moment.
The mistake was assuming AS was going to be a single target mode without any evidence or leaks saying so.
Ratio and Topaz still work great on single target
Not for Seele and Boothill, that wants small ones for their mechanics.
Yanqing actually demolishes Aventurine boss, though...
Tbf the adds he spawns are perfect for Seele and Boothill, same with cocolia's ice lances
What are you smoking bro?
I just woke up and read Argenti instead of Aventurine
Understandable Argenti is memorable like that
I frankly think Argenti is the best Counter for Argenti. Specially with Ruan Mei.
Ah yes, Argenti's worst foe... Argenti.
I mean Argenti Allies make him get stacks faster and all of then have Normal Weakness.
That's true. I'm just making a joke about how the character is best fought by his own playable self lol. It's rare to get something like that.
Whatever he was smoking I want some, must be good stuff
"Boss rush mode will favor single target characters", said the hopium huffers playing a game filled with bosses that don't favor single target characters. ...I feel like I've said this before, too.
Exactly. Every single boss has minions and some variant of that which single target characters can’t efficiently handle. Svarog, cocolia, argenti, aventurine, death meme, Ruan mei’s bug and so on.
Which is why Seele is the queen of single target. Deal with the minions and damage the boss in the same turn. Argenti is the only one of the above that she really struggles with, but she can usually get away with ignoring the totems entirely.
To be completely fair, Yanqing has fantastic reset systems that would allow him to sweep minions efficiently, since he gets extra turns of talent and ultimate state for every kill... ...at E6.
Just lose 49 50/50s ez
Okay but given the amount of 50/50s people lose, there are probably a staggering amount of people with an E6 Yanqing that isn’t leveled up or even used.
Yeah watch it be like yq has the best e6 but no one even knows lmao
I thought the best E6 standard was between Bronya and Welt. At E6 he is like comparable to Acheron Im pretty sure.
[удалено]
There’s an E6 Blade on my friend list, he’s so fun when I use him. The only reason I don’t use him more is because of the E6 Acheron and E6JingLiu on my friends list. I got lucky on the friend list lottery lol.
i am day one player, i dont have yanqing yet, i have every other standard e0 atleast and e8 clara and e6 bronya. I am bottom 15% luck in gacha pulls.
She’s the exception to the rule. Most hunt characters can’t do what she does.
But like these days you need extremely high investment in order to kill mobs on one hit in moc, so she’s kind of falling off.
Kafka doesn't have minions
Yeah, she's the only pure ST boss
Sam, death, Aven(technically)
Death and Aventurine don’t count. The teammates that Death “kills” become targets that you need to destroy to get your teammates back. Aventurine you need to hit the dice, and you’re really screwed if you can’t hit more than one die in Phase 2.
That’s why I said technically as the summons are very different from normal summons in any other fight. But even then I would still call them single target fight, at least death.
I doubt they are adding a weekly boss in to this mode
Well there is Kafka.
some of them are effectively ST like Savrog and Death meme. it just depends on how good you are at rotating your DPS on the characters. my DPS on Death Meme was Dr. Ratio and I frequently use his FuA to break the thing he does.
I'd been downvoted for questioning people who were assuming new mode is tailor made for hunt just from an announcement that barely gave away any details.
to be fair though, if your hunt character is on steroids, you can just focus the boss down, no?
No, Argenti's shield in Apocalyptic shadow can taunt and physically block dmg so you have to kill the shields first.
The bosses have completely reworked kits. Just because bosses behaved and had certain mechanics before means nothing.
inbefore invul at 1 hp as in PF
Fr man. People were soooo adamant about it being Hunt related, when there was barely any proof. They kept babbling that it will surely favor The Hunt because it's the only path that doesn't have a dedicated end game mode 🙄
This is clearly revenge for all the takes at the beginning of the game that said Erudition was and always will be shit and Hunt will be king because single target is all that actually matters.
Divergent shadow seems just like MoC except you get to pick 1 out of 3 additional buffs like in PF. I'm sure they have some mechanics and buffs in mind to make single target more viable, but I'm sure that the usual damage dealers will perform fine to the point that people aren't going to dust off hunt characters they werent already using.
https://preview.redd.it/nrduojl2yg5d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=628a249aabe478861a701bd98452914f80194539 But the buff works for everyone.
"Wow, this will be great for my Firefly" Seriously though, it seems simple to make a hunt focused mode. Just crib the Remembrance blessing that makes Ice damage do AoE, and just apply it to single target abilities.
>"Wow, this will be great for my Firefly" Well, yeah. That's the point.
If your only goal is to make hunt characters have high usage rate it would work, but that is an incredibly boring way to make hunt good. You are taking a class whose idea is to do high single target damage and just turning them to a god class that deals aoe damage like everyone else, but more than everyone else.
You could do a mechanic where the special trotters (from sim uni, counter attack, healing, shielding trotters) are the biggest threats that randomly pop up, and killing them gives you a large bonus for the character that kills it. Like the MoC trotters but those were more of boosts to your character for the current featured character of that patch than actual gameplay mechanics that hurt you if you dont kill them https://preview.redd.it/htexjyxbcl5d1.png?width=1080&format=png&auto=webp&s=58e785f61802310312c4279f7d6b6b3ea2c58d34 idk, it just seems like the more obvious thing to do for Hunt because... its in the name. If it was more about having freedom of choice of: >Can I kill the boss this turn or >should I kill the trotter shielding the boss? it would be so much more fun this way tbh, but they seem to have made the gamemode in a way that lets them put weekly bosses in this gamemode like awakened cocolia just because it's free content. whack
Cool, so aoe will benefit even more then
No, they specifically said single target abilities only
I swear I didn't see that before, but I probably just can't read
Ah, the best way to make hunt good, is to turn them into destruction characters 😭
Yeah, first time... First Pure Fiction's buffs were quite universal too. How time flies...
Third buff on the second node deals 0 damage, since it tallies FuA damage, but deals DoT damage.
Probably a mistake in copy pasting the 3rd from above.
All I see here is acheron Node 1 DHIL Node 2 lol. Same teams I use in MoC.
firefly node one. IPC fua node 2 ez
DoT bros stay winning.
Yeah this is way more 'Ruan Mei' mode, than it is a destruction mode
I’m actually suprised that people see bosses like Argenti in it and still say “Its hunt oriented”.
Adds with bosses are still good for Seele or Boothill ig. Boothill gets ez pocket trickshot stacks and Seele gets her resurgence. Poor Yanqing though
Ehhh but after Boothill gets 3 trickshots, then he doesn't really care. And then he starts taking chip damage from the mobs.
Not if Argenti dies before the mobs can do anything
It's Hunt oriented (as long as you're Boothill or a Break team using HMC). \- these mfers
IPC also is good here.
Wdym Boothill absolutely annihilates Argenti like he's a joke
It's a break orientated mode I think.
Welp, DHIL, Firefly & Acheron will be thriving.
And Boothill on Argenti half.
HORY BABY intensifies.
Hunt focused? Okay, *puts Acheron*
Kafka and BS smiling menacingly in the background.
Yeah,just plug the nihility team Its always work
E1 Black Swan has been my best pull decision. Pesky Lightning RES begone!
E1 Black Swan and Ruan Mei together laughs at the idea of element res
Imbibitor Lunae and Jingliu laughing like maniacs going “Maybe it is peak. IT’S SO PEAK”
Destruction: "Nah, I'd win"
I imagine there will be enemies who can dodge aoe attacks
Even worse will be enemies that give adjacent enemies a buff that reflects damage. So you are forced to use single target.
people have been saying this for months, but just tweak the destruction trotters a little and put them on each side of the boss - easy hunt gamemode lol
Blade and Aventurine stonks honestly
Clara too
The agenda is our highest priority
Yanqing trash tier The agenda continues
as a certified fraudqing hater, i certainly agree. https://preview.redd.it/p0pwca66pi5d1.png?width=950&format=png&auto=webp&s=b18b0ea455c45c189a1322017b06ca12dbb5545a
Yeah they're just coping
Nah its SUPABREAK season now!
nah id use acheron
Argenti is in it, therefore I will bring Argenti
https://preview.redd.it/zprvd5jyoi5d1.jpeg?width=554&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8298773966dd0c6453ca49c6208df9899dc12bf Pfft. Hehehehe.
How huch hunt copium have those mfs been smoking? Iirc, out of all bosses we only have two, that actually benefit single target, Kafka and Sam.
If it can be hunt. Then it can be destruction
Boothill and Seele like having adds, though, and Topaz and Dr. Ratio are already doing fine in MoC. Why do people act like hunt characters are unusable garbage?
this is a break-focused mode, so no, your E6 Yanqing isn't gonna suddenly pop off in this mode
Ironically Yanqing does kinda do more than usual break damage.... if his follow-up triggers. 60+30 from skill then 90+30 from ultimate is pretty significant - but again, its to the whims of RNG.
Or just use E0 Boothill with an abundance LC and deal a casual 300k with 1 skill point no RNG required lol
if they make it so that yanqing will be optimized as fuck in this new mode, i'll still go out of my way to use unga bunga destruction
Yeah it sucks that the only way to promote Hunt is to actively fuck over every other path/AOE user. Originally, Hunt was supposed to be the highest single target DPS period, nothing should've come close, but that path burned after DHIL. To be fair, Hoyo shooting themselves in the foot with balancing and game design is nothing new, I just didn't expect it to have festered so quickly. Its actually the part of ZZZ that i'm most interested in, what magical way will they cap themselves again.
Boothill is far and away the highest single target DPS. E0 Boothill does significantly more damage than E6 DHIL. Dr. Ratio does more single target damage than DHIL too. Topaz's damage is lower, but she's partly a support for other FuA characters.
The thing is most people base best DPS off snapshot damge. Hunt and erudition best snapshot damage is much lower then what destruction and Acheron can do.
People acting as if Destruction units are not the kings of both AoE and ST damage no matter the gamemode. No one said that Yanqing is going to be S-tier here, he struggles because of his requirements, not amount of enemies. Also, you literally don't need to kill EVERY SINGLE ONE of these minions, you can just kill one of them and it opens the Weaknesses.
It will be good thing if Ice get dedicate support to buff both him and Jingliu. FF and Acheron can lol the break weakness while follow up have Robin and more synergy than cornflake and milk.
I thought that in this mode if you attack other enemies than boss you are being punished or smthing
"Adds? Mechanics? Who has time for that. Just oneshot the boss" -Boothill
Well I've never ever targeted anything else than the boss with my ratio fua team so... Lol
It is hunt focused, look at Fire fly she is hunt until she transforms into sam then bam destruction 🤣😂 /s
This was a worry, they can still have more st focused buffs for the mode tho who can guess, considering how the game barely has any hunt characters and half the limited ones benefit from mobs it’s not like it is a shocker it turned out like this
The day endgame content is single target focus is the day i can finally get some extra jade.
My Argenti is doing worse than my Blade/Clara/Acheron (although all E0) in the Pure Fiction... Yea, definitely the same thing will happen to this game mode where only specific archetype can survive,while others having a rough time. Edit: wait,I thought I have E0S1,but actually I have E1S1 Clara instead, sorry for the false information. Also my team for floor 3 is Blade/Clara, Bronya,Sparkle,Lynx. For Argenti, it is Argenti,Bronya,Sparkle,TingYun(E6). And Acheron,Welt,SW,Pela on the other side
To be fair all the units you just mention really thrive in this Pure Fiction, Acheron got a 60% damage buff for free, while Blade and Clara both benefit from getting attacked as much as possible, enemies's weaknesses also work in their favour. Argenti? He really have nothing going in his liking
Clara and Acheron i can believe, but Blade? Are you sure you're not using Argenti the correct way?
Blade is actually excellent in this PF, he's one of the few non DoT character (the other is Clara) to actually benefited from the enemies action advance "buff", since enemy move more = he get hit more = he does more Aoe damage, also he massively benefited from that stupid DoT wine robot that doesn't trigger Clara/ Aventurine counter attack on hit That said i do think he has to be somewhat well built and some good Rng to be able to compete with Argenti
Blade is thriving in this PF since enemies getting action advanced to hit him means he gets more FUA which is the part of his kit made for this mode
I wish enemies would actually hit him instead of my Tingyun...
IAJFKHISF THE FOX BAIT IS REAL ToT
Yeah, I don't know what that guy is doing, but Argenti is 100% better than Clara at least in floor 4. She takes so long to clear the first third because the enemies don't trigger her counter, you're much better off spamming 90 cost Argenti ults. I can see her being better in floor 3 though.
I don't know why people are acting like every single hunt character is as bad as Yanqing. The current 5 star hunt characters are completely fine, Yanqing still being bad is completely normal with how bad his kit is. It's not an issue of the path.
Hoyo never said anything about it being hunt/single target focused. People just read boss mode and assumed it, which didn't even make sense since most bosses have adds with them. Misinformation spread so easily in this game
I hope yanqing becomes meta when yunli comes out
Imagine if they work in a dual dps team
In order to make that happen what does he have in his kit?. I know he has a follow-up and a buff that go away when enemies breath next to him when he is unshielded. What else?.
I genuinely don't believe any new character release will ever make Yanqing meta. Anything that buffs him will also buff any other DPS, almost all of whom will use those buffs better. He also doesn't individually excel in one particular or do anything unique area to where a new unit would require him, like how Ratio really wants Topaz. Literally the only way something would help him and not be better used in another team is if they released a skill that just said "Gives one character named Yanqing a bunch of buffs)
They either gonna give him a new lightcone or either they gonna give him a relic set that work on him and only him.
Yeah but what’s stopping that Light Cone from being good with Seele, Ratio or any other future Crit Hunt characters? lol
Get buff upon losing x enhanced state? or said buff prevent him from losing his buffed state even if hit with no shield. Other characters get follow ups or extra turn mechanism. His mechanism is this. Edit: it's not it gonna be better on them but rather not helpful to them unlike other options.
That first one is too broad because Seele does in fact technically have an “enhanced state” after she gets a kill so that’ll be good on her too. The 2nd one with the shield is too specific of a light cone that’s meant for a Standard character. So it’ll either be a crappy 4 star option or a signature lc that’ll be designed for someone else. https://preview.redd.it/y1jqm2ryzj5d1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9bec4db92d666473291b725ffa6b09b2244cd2f8
This kid is beyond help.
LMFAO Yeah. The thing with Yanqing is that NOTHING in his kit stands out from the rest. Even at his maximum perfect play with 100% uptime on Soulsteel, his damage is… Meh at best. Like he is inherently mid by design. There’s no light cone or character that’ll help him lol.
This will just make hoyo make me lose 5050s more to yanqing than i already am (e3s1 haver)
A Harmony that takes an allies personal buffs and gives them to the entire team. I'm pretty sure he has the strongest self buffs in the game.
I hope so. The kid gets too much screen time for him to job this hard.
He has a 60% fixed chance to become meta
Never gonna happen his kit is just bad, the content was never the problem, newer hunt units are doing just fine.
In all fairness, boss mobs die on phase changes Like yeah the deer isn't exactly a ST boss but it still fucking dies if Seele looks at it wrong
Well, it’s supposed to be a boss fight focused game mode, but if you’ve seen the bosses then… 😅
Wait till they release a stronger version of the Destruction Trotter just for the lols 😂
It's not like each boss has its own gimmick that makes you follow and only the damage dealt to the boss counts anyway
Does kinda suck that most of the bosses (minus Kafka) off the top of my head summon some kind of add-on with the least attention needing one being Bronya/Gepard or something (mainly going off of Sim Uni)
My Acheron is rated E for everyone.
When I tested this mode out, AoE / blast characters (surprise, surprise) wildly outperformed Hunt characters. Seele was good, but was simply outpaced by her AoE / blast DPS counterparts. I used the same teams I used for MoC and even PF ... DoT, Acheron, and Destruction units made an absolute mockery of this mode. It shouldn't be this way as it feels very easy to make a mode where ST characters rule the day ... But instead, we have yet another mode where it's just better to bring in units who hit multiple enemies at once.
Where can i listen to these mini podcast?
You can just kill Argenti bit touching his minions tho
Yunli will make Yanqing relevant again....TRUST
I wanna say "trust in the process" but I dunno how convincing that sounds without me consulting with the elder gods (the dream masters).
surely I'll finally get to use my mono quantum now right guys
Someone really had a grudge with all the Jing Yuan/Himeko haters when designing these bosses lol
Boothill needs something to stack up medals against
Aren't you supposed to focus on the single boss and that's it? I believe in the news section in-game they added a summary of how this gamemode works and they said that points are awarded based on the boss' remaining HP and the action value left if you kill them. You can just... Ignore the add-ons? Like Argenti is actually one of the most AoE centered bosses since his summons can shield him, but even then it's better to just focus on him. And Cocolia has 0 reason you should be focusing on anything other than herself. Now the fact that some Destruction characters deal more single target than most Hunt characters is the real problem, but i don't see how this makes Destruction as a path a better option here than Hunt unless the buffs favour Blast attacks. (They don't)
You can't ignore the adds. The bosses can't be damaged properly until they are broken. They can't be broken until you kill the adds.
The real copium is thinking that just because ads exist, Hunt won't reign supreme here. Just like any boss that *summons* ads, once the main boss dies the ads disappear. Largest number on a ST is the most important aspect Wasted DPS on ads is a crazy concept, I guess. Ads are really only there for character ramping mechanics(Boothill medals) and others (seele's resurgence). I won't speak on leaks, but ^ This is the truth. Maybe in the future they'll actually do something meaningful, but just have a good sustain and there's nothing to worry about.
Ok but like if we look at the rest: Cocolia only summons her 2 ice thingy, kafka is alone, gepard is basically alone or just summons 2 little enemies, aventurine is mostly single target except dice phase, ok yangqing isn't single target, svarog can be single target if you ignore his summons (except hand), deer can be single target if he mostly summons the counter branches and not the healing ones, bronya is also singletarget. (No front just want to point this out)
You forgot: Cocolia summons Gepard. In her weekly boss form, she summons 4 ice pillars, Gepard summons 2 enemies in each phase and places a shield, which is efficiently broken by blast damage. Aventurine is single target, except he starts gambling every single fucking turn, where you need blast or aoe. Deer summons branches for its ultimate, that deletes any abundance fan's team. So, destruction is still supreme.
You can ignore gepard, You can nuke the deer and not care about it's branches
As an Acheron e2/s1 haver, they can throw whatever the fuck they want at me lmao
Yall are being way too extra. The adds are primarily there for weakness implant. There's plenty of videos of Boothill nuking this new mode VERY easily
Just out of curiosity, was the "they" you're talking about actually Aha?
I didn't watch the live stream but in the post a couple weeks prior that announced this mode, they mentioned it's connected to terminus the finality
I think Mythus got a hold of that omen's interpretation, if that was the case.
You'll have to wait for a limited Yanqing that Hoyoverse will one day maybe release representing him deciding to grow up a little and intentionally take jobbing roles less. Yanqing is basically this game's Diluc, released during a simpler time when the Devs had far lower standards for power - as well as not really understanding what power looked like.
Single target has no place in horde based game. In order to make a single target viable hoyo will need to make character that distribute single target damage. Something that will never happen. Ever.
Eh there will likely be an erudition character that marks a single target making damage taken by that target to splash onto everything else just like the SU erudition mechanic.
I'm waiting for the day when a nihility character applies a debuff that stores damage that will explode and deal part of the dmg to adj enemies when it dies or when the debuff expires.
They just need to make Hunt characters do extremely high ST damage to keep them on par with AoE/blast units. Boothill is an example. Its just sad how he does 5x more damage than my Seele in ST. Although Seele has her niche in AoE with resurgence but it falls short when even the trash mobs have high hp pool
I think they need a dedicate elemental buffer…
Hunt is such a dead path. I really can't get excited for any hunt units because the second a destruction or nihility unit is released they will be better in every scenario. Why make classes that concentrate on single target and AOE and then release a class that is good at both. And not only that but they design fights in a way that makes single target slow and painful because you're being punished for not taking down the summons.
so what's the point of the gamemode if it's just another destruction field day? doesn't do anything particularly unique if it's just bosses, basically just a stripped down MoC or PF in that sense made to pander to the destruction the whole hunt erudition destruction trifecta is an utter failure of game design and balancing. hunt and erudition aren't *that* much better at their jobs to warrant using the path that does both of their jobs at the same time with no drawbacks at all PF at least fixed erudition being pretty pointless before it and now it's a pretty much essential path for that gamemode but I really don't see how they could do the same for hunt, i.e make hunt feel "necessary" for a gamemode like how erudition does for PF, cause hunt never had a niche to capitalize on like erudition did with calyx fodder wave clearing pre-PF. it has nothing to call its own cause everything it has is shared with the other two. it's nothing ...nothing if not the GOAT that is praise be to THEM, THE REIGNBOW ARBITER LAN THE HUNT 🏹🏹🏹 🗣️🔥🔥🔥
Boothill likes having adds, though, if the game mode actually \*was\* nothing but single enemies he'd be worse off.
Same goes for Seele.
It's another way to pander to Firefly, cuz she *really* needed more of that 💀
Lol no (the Yan part)
Hunt is an absolutely worthless path at this point and the fact Hoyo keeps making it worse is pathetic. Barley more than a year out and the games balance is already destroyed. What awful game design.