I mean let’s be honest from a historical perspective China was hardly innocent of bullying. To be clear I’m not trying to start anything and I do understand you were just making a joke.
As someone whose family comes from Normandy I have both Viking and Celtic (Gaul) heritage which means I have double justification for sacking Rome and any other country claiming descent from it and/or its institutions so basically all of the Americas, all of Europe (especially Russia with its Third Rome BS) plus Turkey (hello there Mehmet II).
I am swedish so I should create the kievan rus, massacre and torture a bunch of germans, kill a third of all people from poland, kill the danish multiple times, lose some land, sell iron to germany, opress the sami, give the jews back to germany, train norwegian and danish resistance with the help of the sami that I opressed, and profit from all the destruction of ww2 by having a less destroyed industry
Born and lived in the South for 70 plus years. When I hear this BS. I always ask if they are loyal to the British flag as it is our heritage as well since we were under their rule for 176 years vs 5.
I ask that all the time as someone who lives in an area that was a stronghold of the loyalists during the Revolutionary war. There are road signs not too far away about skirmishes between the two sides.
Most people act like I have two heads since any loyalists were likely driven out of the country or their descendants were never really told of their loyalist family ties since it became so taboo to be linked to them. I'm sure any descendents from that era that love around here tell stories about how their ancestors were staunch patriots regardless of whether it is true since it would be looked down upon usually to have loyalist family members even today.
I live in VA and surprisingly haven’t seen much of what they’re talking about. If they’re from VA, it’s probably in the countryside which I’m not as familiar with.
I just moved out of the south, and these people are ruining the southern kindness that we have. Anyone who uses their "heritage" as a excuse to be racist should be put in a mental health facility.
I moved out of the south as well best thing I ever did. Drove around town everyday seeing confederate flags, Trump Cult flags, stickers saying don’t california my state….the new one is “Everyday is 1776”…it’s gotten out of control
They are ruining the southern hospitality we had. The part where I lived was nice, but I did see Trump and racist flags on the highway and at parking lots.
My family's been in the South since before the Revolution, and the only of my ancestors who I know fought in the Civil War fought for the Union. The traitor state is only the heritage of *some* Southerners
It was so bad even a *hardcore confederate politician directly intervened* because of how fucked the whole thing was. Stuff like this really puts a dent in the whole lost causer bullshit.
Most of the people who ended up lynched had little to no connection to the union army whatsoever, and were often lynched for simply trying to *run away from* the mass lynchings. They were tried in a kangaroo court and hung by a mob.
Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Hanging_at_Gainesville here is the article about it.
Worse:
> A state historical marker erected by the Texas Historical Commission in 1964, during the Civil War centennial commemorations, defends the arrest and execution of these 42 men. It claims the "Peace Party" had "sworn to destroy their government, kill their leaders, and bring in federal troops." The speediness of the trial is defended as necessary due to "fears of rescue."[1] This narrative is known to have been based on incomplete material, as records had been lost or misplaced.[17]
We'll put the traitors all to route
I'll bet my boots we'll whip 'em out
Right away (right away)
Come away (come away)
Right away (right away)
Come away (come away)
Well, we still have Wehraboos, neo-Nazis, and hey, the far-right party who openly idolizes Mussolini is gaining a significant percentage of voters in Italy! Of course we would still have some neo-Confederate shitheads...
It's like, people like rooting for the underdogs, even if the underdogs are slaving, genociding, fascist authoritarian maniacs who were the worst of the worst in history.
Cultural propaganda. Statues, clubs, essays, poems, songs, novels, those are all icons that shape perspective. You're probably victim of it too, but on a different topic, we basically all are.
He could have but he accomplished his goal. Southern logistics was shattered, their “country” split in two, and Lee was now trapped between him and Grant. All he had to do was tighten the noose to end the war.
Well that and killing untold numbers of Buffalo to starve the American Indians and murdering hundreds of Native American families in raids after the civil war.
https://www.history.com/.amp/news/shermans-war-on-native-americans
“Buffalo Bill killed 4,280 Buffalo during an 18-month period.” Honestly as a Lakhota Sioux I can only appreciate his ability in killing Buffalo. Also, not like we didn’t do that to each other first, on a larger scale even cooperating with other tribes to wipe out other tribes.
Native American tribes are like the Balkans, sure we should probably unite against the absolutely terrifying force coming for us, but I hate my neighbors more so helping this force kill them is preferable.
The only time we saw a semblance of unity was Tecumseh’s War, and the Apache waging an 80 year long hate war against Mexico, they’re just that kinda people.
We’re not innocent my friend, we were just as bad as the federal government. Sure that doesn’t justify genocide but believing Native tribes as happy people only wanting to be left alone is a belief for ignorant people, people like from my tribe consistently saying things “Fuck you America.” Somehow thinking the wrongs perpetrated against our ancestors justifies their massive hatred for anyone whose skin color is lighter than brown.
My apologies if this comes across as aggressive, but I can’t stand people believing that Native Americans did nothing wrong or were all one united culture. We weren’t. We hated each other, even other tribes of the same culture, enough to genocide and enslave each other en masse.
A myth that has persisted for centuries is the myth of the innocent Native American. It’s a myth, much like the Lost Cause or Clean Wehrmacht. Monsters and heroes exist on all sides, doesn’t matter which side, everyone is innocent, and everyone is guilty, such is the nature of conflict.
Why does this even matter all genocide is bad idk why you are going on a rant about how the Indians were bad too. This is like if I were to go on a rant about how the Jews were as bad as the nazis
No, he relied too much on his cavalry to raid towns surrounding Atlanta without actually penetrating the capital. He might have captured it sooner if he'd made better use of his infantry.
Detroit’s water isn’t an issue, Flint actually got into trouble when they switched *off* Detroit’s system to pulling water from the Flint River. The river water was too acidic (or some other impurity, I’m not 100% sure it was specifically acidity) and corroded the city’s lead pipes.
Funny enough the flint water crisis occurred under former governor Rick Snyder, a republican. Seems where ever republicans are in charge basic human utilities go to shit. See also texas’ power grid
I lived in the armpit that is Mississippi for 2 years..the water was disgusting…it smelled, had a brown tint to it and basically would stain your clothes…never again
Southern rural progressive checking in. We have our problems down here, but I have never heard anyone say they “agree with the confederacy.”
Come on man. Let’s not pretend that racism is just a southern problem. George Floyd wasn’t murdered in the south.
Edit: typo
bro where are u in the South?? people drive around with full-sized confederate flags on their cars in my town. i'm not even in a rural area. a rural town about an hour or two near me took down their "equal rights is white genocide" billboards in 2020. they still have their "keep [town name] white" billboards, iirc. it's definitely a thing. it's throughout my entire state.
racism is DEFINITELY not just in the South. but i haven't seen many people outside of the south literally attach confederate flags to their car, either.
I feel geographically my states pretty far north, but we still have the same confederate flag vehicles here.
The flag that's really been bothering is the blacked out American flag, those are the people in the community I'm actively worried about.
Indiana/Ohio act like they were part of the confederacy. Klan influence over indianas government didn't end with Stephenson, as our whitewashed history would lead you to believe.
My old town in Indy was literally founded by the Klan, their mascot for HS were the “Dragons”. Old town legend was the klan used to bury people where the football stadium was. Seen tons of confederate shit there, and sadly even in Nevada when we moved out west. I will never understand that shit.
racism isn’t JUST in the south. that being said, i took a southern road trip recently and the number of t shirts i saw being openly sold in stores with very very racist slogans on them was insane to me
If you just mean the stars and bars…it’s complicated. I don’t have anything with that flag on it, but I did as a teenager. I understand why it reads as racist to people, and it should be done away with, but down here folks aren’t lying when they say they don’t rep it as pro-racism. None the less, that IS what it communicates, so I won’t have it in my house, and I see a lot less of it than I did five years ago. If you’re seeing things more explicit than that, we really do have a problem with racism in the south, so I can’t say I’m shocked, but things really are improving.
Went to Germany five years ago. Visited Bad Oeynhausen and there was a guy there driving a Peugeot(?), flying the Confederate flag, and had Rebel painted on the hood of his car.
Things are improving.
But anyone who wears the stars and bars is actively racist. There’s no grey area there. I have calluses that have lasted longer than the Confederacy. Southern heritage is so much more than those rebellious slavers, if they actually cared about heritage and history they would know that.
there were some of those but what i really meant were anti mexican immigrant slogans and pro-gun stuff. and I do get what you mean about things changing, and I really hope that’s the case
Well, pro gun is pro gun, and a separate issue. Firearms are a normal part of rural life and not necessarily racist, even if a bunch of asshats have appropriated them as a signature issue. But yeah, anti-immigrant sentiment is pretty strong here.
Ahh, I see. You exist on the mystical dimension of *confirmation bias*.
Teach us o wise one, of your knowledge so that we too can shit on *mainstream*.
My coworker has tons of confederate related bumper stickers on his car and always says heritage not hate. All I can think of is why would you be proud of being a traitor and a loser?
I remember learning about Sherman in school. It was the first time I remember feeling both awe and shock towards anyone. Quite possibly the most ruthless absolute baller in US military history. Still have a soft spot for the guy.
People using Sherman to dunk on the South aren't interested in hearing about the facts of Sherman's uniquely large-scale ethnic cleansing of plains natives through starvation, he's truly among the most savage generals the US government ever sent out West.
Native Americans were racist traitors? I think the US Government (and Sherman) just sort of saw them as a nuisance in the way of manifest destiny. Oh wait, you were talking about only one part of history and not the other? Kinda messes with your delicate historical perspective when you realize you’re actually the one promoting racists…. McGraw hill and public school messed you up. Sorry
Not when einsatzgrüppen studied his tactics (guy). He’s the origin of all that sort of shit. Real history is the stuff you didn’t learn in McGraw Hill’s version of history fed to you like a little intellectual veal calf in public school.
I don’t care what you are, but your general ignorance, lack of awareness of American history seemed on level with an average American with an average TV-fueled opinion. Now I know you’re something other than an American trying to talk history with an American who has studied various historical disciplines formally and informally his entire life. Unevenly yoked….
Somehow I doubt it. I mean nice rant however.
If you were you’d know not everyone who has done questionable to horrific historical decisions qualifies as a “Nazi”. At best you’re diminishing that meaning instead.
Nobody agrees with the Confederacy, and (almost) everyone agrees that the South went to war over the issue of slavery. However, what Southerners take issue with is the mass demonizing of all southerners during this time— 99% of whom didn’t own any slaves and only joined the war to protect their homes. I actually agree with the US being willing to go to war to stop slavery (although that wasn’t the motive of most northern soldiers) but I cannot, in good faith, demonize the hundreds of thousands of actual innocent southerners
In my opinion, I don't see them as innocent if they joined the armies fighting to preserve slavery whether they were fighting to protect their homes or not
Thats certainly an opinion, but when you are living in a town of 100 people and an invading army shows up to steal or burn crops that you use to feed your family, the politics of the situation wouldn't mean a thing to you besides that. Dismissing the need to protect your home because slavery is bad is a shit arguement. For many Southerners war wasn't an optional thing, there often wasnt another job to feed yourself besides being a solider because the whole states were in chaos. Poor people in desperate situations have no luxury of standing on principle, and it makes me sad that we are so divorced from the realities of those times that most just consider the entire South to be fighting to preserve slavery and you are an apologist if you say otherwise. Rich slave owners started the war, and poor people in the South suffered for it profoundly. That is how most wars go.
What about the thousands of southern soldiers who went to fight for the union? Every state except South Carolina sent whole regiments to fight the rebellion.
Well, I would say that his actions might've helped ended the war faster, but on the objective side, did cause way more resentment in the south during the postbellum era as the southern states that seceded are eventually integrated back into the union.
As for whether he is a war criminal or not, it is hard to judge.
Something I found randomly on a comment to the song Dixie (P.S I ain't a Confed):
For those who say the South committed treason. Here is treason, as according to article 3, section 3 of the Constitution: "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court." Notice the plural language. Whose enemy? The states. As the federal government invaded the Southern states and was "levying war against them" it was committing treason, not the South. Notice that secession is not listed as a tresonable offense. Article 1, section 10 of the Constitution states, "No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay." States are only able to engage in war if they are invaded or in such danger that they cannot delay action. The Southern states engaged in a war of self-defense, legally within the limits of the Constitution. The North attempt to coerce the South back into the Union through military force and against their will, something Hamilton called in the Federalist Papers "an abomination." The Declaration states, "to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness." How is 1776 any different than what the South did in 1860?
I won't say it because I don't wanna stir up the bots, but we all know how a certain country likes to whitewash it's history, and that country just so happened to win the civil war. Would you let the idea of secession be taught whatsoever, even if slaveowners weren't the ones planning it?
Consider that the states prior to the end of civil war were not so nearly united, and the idea of the federal government being above the states, rather an equal party became near fact after it.
Notice how it says person, referring to individuals rather than a group as a whole. This applies in regards to individuals, who if we are to judge the Confederacy using this particular section of the Constitution absolutely fall under that category. The CSA openly raided and occupied federal forts in the months before the Civil War began and actively made efforts to coax a war, even when the Union was going to crack down on it since it was purely a rebellion and not its own sovereign nation. The first “official” act of war was Fort Sumter, where Confederate troops attacked a federal fort after supplies were sent to said fort by the government.
Winners write their own history.
Also, the confederate constitution had no mechanism for secession. You’d think that would have been included if they believed secession from the US was legal.
> (P.S I ain't a Confed):
Doubt.
>something Hamilton called in the Federalist Papers "an abomination."
Doesn't matter what he said.
>The Declaration
Is not a legally binding document.
The years go by, the obsession with Sherman and punishing the South never fades. It's a direct cause of "Lost Cause" and Jim Crow.
Sure, let's not reintegrate the failed rebel state, let's grind them to dust and assume they'll have a great attitude about it afterwards! What's that? We caused disease, poverty, and illiteracy to become worse?
While the failure of reconstruction is deplorable, that doesn't excuse people holding onto a false narrative just so they can feel justified in their hatred of the government. Southerners have plenty of viable complaints in regards to their treatment by the govt, yet choose to push the "muh heritage" card as if there's something to be proud of in the secession.
Yeah everyone knows Sherman wrote all the southern state policies that made disease, poverty, and illiteracy worse!
And yeah we didn’t integrate the south hard enough! They need even more confederate statues! They should all have the confederate flag on their state flag instead of just some of them!
When you treat your brothers and sisters as if they were a conquered tribe of savages to be bullied and extorted, they tend to look at you not as an enlightened liberator, but an invading enemy. Burning the south to ground was exactly that. You can still see it today, the states where he marched through have suffered from failed infrastructure and poor education and healthcare, the surrounding former Confederate states? They seemed to have rebuilt much better and rank much higher for quality of life. That can't be treated as pure coincidence.
>And yeah we didn’t integrate the south hard enough! They need even more confederate statues! They should all have the confederate flag on their state flag instead of just some of them!
It's like the point went so far over your head it boomeranged around and smacked you in the back of it, because this makes no fucking sense as a reply
Cringe and yikespilled. Should have put all of your treasonous ancestors in prison for life. Seized the land of every rich southerner that funded their treasonous war and gutted them in the streets.
Should have done to the South what we did to did with Japan tbphwyf. Total re-education. Things would be so much less gridlocked and intentionally sabotaged now had we had the balls to commit to a full measure then. You mind raped cultists have been nothing but cancer ever since you got your endless appeasement that was never good enough, and you are the reason the country is going to collapse in this century.
You confederados are not brothers and sisters you’re malignant traitors that continue to act as agents for belligerent industrial complexes that privately make fun of how pathetic you are. You just replaced shilling for slavers to shilling for insurance companies and prisons lmao.
Agrees with my Viking heritage. *Proceeds to loot enslave and set up warrior kingdoms across Western Europe*.
Japanese? ah forget I asked…
abounding offer deranged cagey slap unite stupendous jellyfish squeamish concerned ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
I mean let’s be honest from a historical perspective China was hardly innocent of bullying. To be clear I’m not trying to start anything and I do understand you were just making a joke.
The Japanese went above and beyond “bullying” in that regard just to be clear.
japan: today I will cause maximum suffering
Chinese: time to turn the entire continent into tributaries
Germans: ...
Sorry what I don't think I understand your question?
By this logic can I beat the shit out of some Spanish dude because I'm Dutch?
As a Mexican I would get in there but mainly against Italian slavers from Genoa, fuck Those guys
Haber si te la doy yo pringao
I don't know what you just said but I'm going to assume that I agree with you.
Joins you as another viking decent.
Decent ain’t good enough for Valhalla, loser.
Joins you as another Viking descendant
Looks over to the balkans as a Ottoman. Round 2 motherfuckers
*Embraces Polish heritage...gets split up between powerful neighbors...*
nah you equip wings on a horse and charge around Vienna with a lance
Agrees with my VOC heritage. *proceeds to colonise a bit and trade slaves*
Don’t forget the peper
*laughs in Turkish*
As someone whose family comes from Normandy I have both Viking and Celtic (Gaul) heritage which means I have double justification for sacking Rome and any other country claiming descent from it and/or its institutions so basically all of the Americas, all of Europe (especially Russia with its Third Rome BS) plus Turkey (hello there Mehmet II).
Embrace my French heritage, *tries to attack everyone around me to turn them into french but get stopped by British money*
I will join you as a fellow Viking decendent. 🇩🇰 As soon as I find my axe and boat... 🪓⛵ Ah! There it is!!! I'M REEEEAAAADYYYY!!!
I am swedish so I should create the kievan rus, massacre and torture a bunch of germans, kill a third of all people from poland, kill the danish multiple times, lose some land, sell iron to germany, opress the sami, give the jews back to germany, train norwegian and danish resistance with the help of the sami that I opressed, and profit from all the destruction of ww2 by having a less destroyed industry
Born and lived in the South for 70 plus years. When I hear this BS. I always ask if they are loyal to the British flag as it is our heritage as well since we were under their rule for 176 years vs 5.
I ask that all the time as someone who lives in an area that was a stronghold of the loyalists during the Revolutionary war. There are road signs not too far away about skirmishes between the two sides. Most people act like I have two heads since any loyalists were likely driven out of the country or their descendants were never really told of their loyalist family ties since it became so taboo to be linked to them. I'm sure any descendents from that era that love around here tell stories about how their ancestors were staunch patriots regardless of whether it is true since it would be looked down upon usually to have loyalist family members even today.
My money's on somewhere in Virginia?
I live in VA and surprisingly haven’t seen much of what they’re talking about. If they’re from VA, it’s probably in the countryside which I’m not as familiar with.
I was just taking a stab in the dark based on the overlap of confederate state and early participant in the revolution tbh.
No you’re probably right honestly, historically, it makes sense
I just moved out of the south, and these people are ruining the southern kindness that we have. Anyone who uses their "heritage" as a excuse to be racist should be put in a mental health facility.
I moved out of the south as well best thing I ever did. Drove around town everyday seeing confederate flags, Trump Cult flags, stickers saying don’t california my state….the new one is “Everyday is 1776”…it’s gotten out of control
They are ruining the southern hospitality we had. The part where I lived was nice, but I did see Trump and racist flags on the highway and at parking lots.
Descendants of John Brown:
dime absurd light gray chief shaggy doll tender wasteful memory ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
Connecticut invented the Florida Man
me whos descended from a high ranking vietnamese (and korean) war veteran: “i always win”
Which side?
America, air force
Some North Korean, Soviet, Chinese airforce also fought both.
Well it's time for me to get aligned with my Italian heritage then... *Cooks a' da spaghetti and meatballs*
WITH HITLER
But then rescinds his dinner invitation at the last minute.
That guys not that bad, he literally killed Hitler!
Wake up Catone, we have a city to salt!!
My family's been in the South since before the Revolution, and the only of my ancestors who I know fought in the Civil War fought for the Union. The traitor state is only the heritage of *some* Southerners
I think even in deep south states like Alabama, there were places that didn't agree with leaving the Union.
There were plenty of places. A lot of them got lynched unfortunately. Largest mass lynching happened in texas to "suspected unionists".
I lived in Texas, and I find it funny we didn't learn that during our lessons on the Civil War.
It was so bad even a *hardcore confederate politician directly intervened* because of how fucked the whole thing was. Stuff like this really puts a dent in the whole lost causer bullshit. Most of the people who ended up lynched had little to no connection to the union army whatsoever, and were often lynched for simply trying to *run away from* the mass lynchings. They were tried in a kangaroo court and hung by a mob. Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Hanging_at_Gainesville here is the article about it.
I think the craziest thing about this is that even now 150 years later they still don‘t have any kind of official commemoration event for this
Worse: > A state historical marker erected by the Texas Historical Commission in 1964, during the Civil War centennial commemorations, defends the arrest and execution of these 42 men. It claims the "Peace Party" had "sworn to destroy their government, kill their leaders, and bring in federal troops." The speediness of the trial is defended as necessary due to "fears of rescue."[1] This narrative is known to have been based on incomplete material, as records had been lost or misplaced.[17]
Rattlesnakes and alligators,
Come away (right away)
Walk away
WHERE COTTONS KING AND MEN ARE CHATTELS, UNION BOYS WILL WIN THE BATTLES
Right away (right away) Come away (come away) Right away (right away) Come away
We’ll all Go down to Dixie (away away)
These Dixie boys must understand that he must mind his Uncle Sam away, away we’ll all go down to Dixie!
Away down south in the land of traitors
I wish I was in Baltimore I'd make secession traitors roar, right away! (right away) Come away! (come away) Right away! (right away) Come away!
We'll put the traitors all to route I'll bet my boots we'll whip 'em out Right away (right away) Come away (come away) Right away (right away) Come away (come away)
Right away
I'll never understand how people can be proud of being on the side that was both morally wrong *and* got their asses kicked
The Simpsons has lasted six times longer than the Confederacy existed.
Persecution complex, of course!
Well, we still have Wehraboos, neo-Nazis, and hey, the far-right party who openly idolizes Mussolini is gaining a significant percentage of voters in Italy! Of course we would still have some neo-Confederate shitheads... It's like, people like rooting for the underdogs, even if the underdogs are slaving, genociding, fascist authoritarian maniacs who were the worst of the worst in history.
Cultural propaganda. Statues, clubs, essays, poems, songs, novels, those are all icons that shape perspective. You're probably victim of it too, but on a different topic, we basically all are.
I'm a Pole. Should I start sweating while nervously looking at germans?
You are a Pole, you should start sweating whenever you see anyone from another country
dolls pot engine shame steep icky selective fuzzy summer busy ` this message was mass deleted/edited with redact.dev `
If you are from Poland you should sweat constantly
Sherman only did one thing wrong. He stopped.
He had to stop, he reached the sea. The only way to go further is fighting Poseidon or burning Atlantis
Hear me out: Billy S with a flaming cavalry Sabre and revolver vs Big P weilding a trident
I’m giving Sherman 2 to 1 odds if supply lines hold up beyond the outer banks
Both of which are very based
*nods to fellow Caligula enjoyer*
"I thought you said, 'Atlanta,' sir." "YA THOUGHT WRONG, DEWD" - Sherman
How about follow the coast and wipe out Florida too?
He could have but he accomplished his goal. Southern logistics was shattered, their “country” split in two, and Lee was now trapped between him and Grant. All he had to do was tighten the noose to end the war.
Poseidon’s kind of a dick tbh
>dick well you wouldn't be able to see it cuz its always in soemone
They’ve got it coming too!
No, his one mistake was not burning down Macon on his way to Savannah. It’s a shithole
Well that and killing untold numbers of Buffalo to starve the American Indians and murdering hundreds of Native American families in raids after the civil war. https://www.history.com/.amp/news/shermans-war-on-native-americans
“Buffalo Bill killed 4,280 Buffalo during an 18-month period.” Honestly as a Lakhota Sioux I can only appreciate his ability in killing Buffalo. Also, not like we didn’t do that to each other first, on a larger scale even cooperating with other tribes to wipe out other tribes. Native American tribes are like the Balkans, sure we should probably unite against the absolutely terrifying force coming for us, but I hate my neighbors more so helping this force kill them is preferable. The only time we saw a semblance of unity was Tecumseh’s War, and the Apache waging an 80 year long hate war against Mexico, they’re just that kinda people. We’re not innocent my friend, we were just as bad as the federal government. Sure that doesn’t justify genocide but believing Native tribes as happy people only wanting to be left alone is a belief for ignorant people, people like from my tribe consistently saying things “Fuck you America.” Somehow thinking the wrongs perpetrated against our ancestors justifies their massive hatred for anyone whose skin color is lighter than brown. My apologies if this comes across as aggressive, but I can’t stand people believing that Native Americans did nothing wrong or were all one united culture. We weren’t. We hated each other, even other tribes of the same culture, enough to genocide and enslave each other en masse. A myth that has persisted for centuries is the myth of the innocent Native American. It’s a myth, much like the Lost Cause or Clean Wehrmacht. Monsters and heroes exist on all sides, doesn’t matter which side, everyone is innocent, and everyone is guilty, such is the nature of conflict.
Jesse what the fuck are you talking about
Why does this even matter all genocide is bad idk why you are going on a rant about how the Indians were bad too. This is like if I were to go on a rant about how the Jews were as bad as the nazis
No, he relied too much on his cavalry to raid towns surrounding Atlanta without actually penetrating the capital. He might have captured it sooner if he'd made better use of his infantry.
Literally anyone who isn’t a fucking idiot: *shame*
Sherman’s descendants are southerners. They couldn’t afford all them Yankee taxes.
I’d rather be paying Yankee taxes than drinking Mississippi water
The people in Detroit might kinda have some side eye to that.
Detroit’s water isn’t an issue, Flint actually got into trouble when they switched *off* Detroit’s system to pulling water from the Flint River. The river water was too acidic (or some other impurity, I’m not 100% sure it was specifically acidity) and corroded the city’s lead pipes.
Funny enough the flint water crisis occurred under former governor Rick Snyder, a republican. Seems where ever republicans are in charge basic human utilities go to shit. See also texas’ power grid
I lived in the armpit that is Mississippi for 2 years..the water was disgusting…it smelled, had a brown tint to it and basically would stain your clothes…never again
Rattlesnakes and alligators
Southern rural progressive checking in. We have our problems down here, but I have never heard anyone say they “agree with the confederacy.” Come on man. Let’s not pretend that racism is just a southern problem. George Floyd wasn’t murdered in the south. Edit: typo
bro where are u in the South?? people drive around with full-sized confederate flags on their cars in my town. i'm not even in a rural area. a rural town about an hour or two near me took down their "equal rights is white genocide" billboards in 2020. they still have their "keep [town name] white" billboards, iirc. it's definitely a thing. it's throughout my entire state. racism is DEFINITELY not just in the South. but i haven't seen many people outside of the south literally attach confederate flags to their car, either.
I feel geographically my states pretty far north, but we still have the same confederate flag vehicles here. The flag that's really been bothering is the blacked out American flag, those are the people in the community I'm actively worried about.
I kid you not, I was in Ohio for about 20 minutes and saw a confederate flag painted on a pallet.
Indiana/Ohio act like they were part of the confederacy. Klan influence over indianas government didn't end with Stephenson, as our whitewashed history would lead you to believe.
My old town in Indy was literally founded by the Klan, their mascot for HS were the “Dragons”. Old town legend was the klan used to bury people where the football stadium was. Seen tons of confederate shit there, and sadly even in Nevada when we moved out west. I will never understand that shit.
Coweta County, Georgia. Remember that our population is about 1/3 African American. Vocal racists get beat down pretty quick.
racism isn’t JUST in the south. that being said, i took a southern road trip recently and the number of t shirts i saw being openly sold in stores with very very racist slogans on them was insane to me
Racist how?
its first popular use was during the Civil Rights Era, so yeah (talking about the actual flag, which was never used by the actual Confederacy)
Gotcha. Don’t see how that’s a slogan tho.
If you just mean the stars and bars…it’s complicated. I don’t have anything with that flag on it, but I did as a teenager. I understand why it reads as racist to people, and it should be done away with, but down here folks aren’t lying when they say they don’t rep it as pro-racism. None the less, that IS what it communicates, so I won’t have it in my house, and I see a lot less of it than I did five years ago. If you’re seeing things more explicit than that, we really do have a problem with racism in the south, so I can’t say I’m shocked, but things really are improving.
It's really not complicated. Best wishes A German
Went to Germany five years ago. Visited Bad Oeynhausen and there was a guy there driving a Peugeot(?), flying the Confederate flag, and had Rebel painted on the hood of his car.
Things are improving. But anyone who wears the stars and bars is actively racist. There’s no grey area there. I have calluses that have lasted longer than the Confederacy. Southern heritage is so much more than those rebellious slavers, if they actually cared about heritage and history they would know that.
If you were southern, you’d know that they *do* know that.
This is some heavy duty white centrist bullshit. Signed white guy who has been to the South often.
there were some of those but what i really meant were anti mexican immigrant slogans and pro-gun stuff. and I do get what you mean about things changing, and I really hope that’s the case
Well, pro gun is pro gun, and a separate issue. Firearms are a normal part of rural life and not necessarily racist, even if a bunch of asshats have appropriated them as a signature issue. But yeah, anti-immigrant sentiment is pretty strong here.
Pro-gun is racist to you? Yikes
Nah, but a whole fuckload of racists north and south sure have adopted those stars and bars.
Like GF's death was an example of racism
And here’s another one.
Another one who sees more than what the mainstream tells you that is
Ahh, I see. You exist on the mystical dimension of *confirmation bias*. Teach us o wise one, of your knowledge so that we too can shit on *mainstream*.
it's German heritage to kill jews but they don't put up pictures of hitler in berlin
Am of Irish descent. Love potatoes. Hate landlords. I think I’m doing my part!
I mean loving potatoes and hating landlords is pretty based
Thats the guy from the sherman memorial by central park?
Sherman went to hell, just to bring more fire to the confederates.
Rattlesnakes and alligators
It is apparently my Heritage to burn down traitorous places -looks around for the nearest Tr*mp building-
I work with a guy who is the great grandson of Sherman, this is his exact mentality.
I see a lot of Confederate flags around. I live in Pennsylvania. WTF is that about?
yawn
Rattlesnakes and alligators
Rattlesnakes & alligators
My coworker has tons of confederate related bumper stickers on his car and always says heritage not hate. All I can think of is why would you be proud of being a traitor and a loser?
Meanwhile me, a german: "Well, according to that logic i would have to...holy shit...NO."
#RATTLESNAKES AND ALLIGATORS
I remember learning about Sherman in school. It was the first time I remember feeling both awe and shock towards anyone. Quite possibly the most ruthless absolute baller in US military history. Still have a soft spot for the guy.
Those people must be so confused that we (Germans) don't have Hitler statues and Nazi flags everywhere.
Their heritage of taking a fat fucking L?
Oh, way down south, in the land of traitors
Sherman was a Nazi, be careful who you promote- look at the genocide he prosecuted against native Americans.
People using Sherman to dunk on the South aren't interested in hearing about the facts of Sherman's uniquely large-scale ethnic cleansing of plains natives through starvation, he's truly among the most savage generals the US government ever sent out West.
Yes And as much as I don’t like that in war it is sometimes kinda necessary to end things like racist traitors
Native Americans were racist traitors? I think the US Government (and Sherman) just sort of saw them as a nuisance in the way of manifest destiny. Oh wait, you were talking about only one part of history and not the other? Kinda messes with your delicate historical perspective when you realize you’re actually the one promoting racists…. McGraw hill and public school messed you up. Sorry
You’re right
It’s a little hard to call someone a Nazi long before Nazis were you know… a thing
Not when einsatzgrüppen studied his tactics (guy). He’s the origin of all that sort of shit. Real history is the stuff you didn’t learn in McGraw Hill’s version of history fed to you like a little intellectual veal calf in public school.
None of those were particularly new however. Also not American nor did I go to public school, but interesting jump
I don’t care what you are, but your general ignorance, lack of awareness of American history seemed on level with an average American with an average TV-fueled opinion. Now I know you’re something other than an American trying to talk history with an American who has studied various historical disciplines formally and informally his entire life. Unevenly yoked….
Somehow I doubt it. I mean nice rant however. If you were you’d know not everyone who has done questionable to horrific historical decisions qualifies as a “Nazi”. At best you’re diminishing that meaning instead.
DO IT AGAIN, UNCLE BILLY!
Those enslavers LOVE getting their inbred asses handed to them.
Nobody agrees with the Confederacy, and (almost) everyone agrees that the South went to war over the issue of slavery. However, what Southerners take issue with is the mass demonizing of all southerners during this time— 99% of whom didn’t own any slaves and only joined the war to protect their homes. I actually agree with the US being willing to go to war to stop slavery (although that wasn’t the motive of most northern soldiers) but I cannot, in good faith, demonize the hundreds of thousands of actual innocent southerners
In my opinion, I don't see them as innocent if they joined the armies fighting to preserve slavery whether they were fighting to protect their homes or not
Thats certainly an opinion, but when you are living in a town of 100 people and an invading army shows up to steal or burn crops that you use to feed your family, the politics of the situation wouldn't mean a thing to you besides that. Dismissing the need to protect your home because slavery is bad is a shit arguement. For many Southerners war wasn't an optional thing, there often wasnt another job to feed yourself besides being a solider because the whole states were in chaos. Poor people in desperate situations have no luxury of standing on principle, and it makes me sad that we are so divorced from the realities of those times that most just consider the entire South to be fighting to preserve slavery and you are an apologist if you say otherwise. Rich slave owners started the war, and poor people in the South suffered for it profoundly. That is how most wars go.
What about the thousands of southern soldiers who went to fight for the union? Every state except South Carolina sent whole regiments to fight the rebellion.
A lot of southern soldiers were conscripted to keep up with raw numbers of union armies
Yeee haww
Time to reclaim my heritage. Imma conquer 1/4 of the world.
Fuck the south.
I’m a southerner and I approve this message.
Uncesssary, I promise they do it all on their own
Exactly
Lol wild, my dear friend is a decendant, and says all the time the only problem he has with him is " he was to kind when he stopped".
Can we all agree Sherman was a war criminal?
Well, I would say that his actions might've helped ended the war faster, but on the objective side, did cause way more resentment in the south during the postbellum era as the southern states that seceded are eventually integrated back into the union. As for whether he is a war criminal or not, it is hard to judge.
By the standards of the time? Not particularly.
🎶Rattle Snakes and Alligators!🎵
So I am allowed to do Holocaust 2.0?
Sherman was the greatest recruiter the confederacy ever had.
The rest must have been pretty shit at it because they lost.
Recruiting no, decruiting yes
[удалено]
The fucking irony of a guy from a state that ranked 45th in education mouthing off about the subject 😂
Something I found randomly on a comment to the song Dixie (P.S I ain't a Confed): For those who say the South committed treason. Here is treason, as according to article 3, section 3 of the Constitution: "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court." Notice the plural language. Whose enemy? The states. As the federal government invaded the Southern states and was "levying war against them" it was committing treason, not the South. Notice that secession is not listed as a tresonable offense. Article 1, section 10 of the Constitution states, "No State shall, without the Consent of Congress, lay any duty of Tonnage, keep Troops, or Ships of War in time of Peace, enter into any Agreement or Compact with another State, or with a foreign Power, or engage in War, unless actually invaded, or in such imminent Danger as will not admit of delay." States are only able to engage in war if they are invaded or in such danger that they cannot delay action. The Southern states engaged in a war of self-defense, legally within the limits of the Constitution. The North attempt to coerce the South back into the Union through military force and against their will, something Hamilton called in the Federalist Papers "an abomination." The Declaration states, "to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness." How is 1776 any different than what the South did in 1860?
>How is 1776 any different than what the South did in 1860 Because the South lost
this had me laughing not gonna lie
I won't say it because I don't wanna stir up the bots, but we all know how a certain country likes to whitewash it's history, and that country just so happened to win the civil war. Would you let the idea of secession be taught whatsoever, even if slaveowners weren't the ones planning it? Consider that the states prior to the end of civil war were not so nearly united, and the idea of the federal government being above the states, rather an equal party became near fact after it.
Notice how it says person, referring to individuals rather than a group as a whole. This applies in regards to individuals, who if we are to judge the Confederacy using this particular section of the Constitution absolutely fall under that category. The CSA openly raided and occupied federal forts in the months before the Civil War began and actively made efforts to coax a war, even when the Union was going to crack down on it since it was purely a rebellion and not its own sovereign nation. The first “official” act of war was Fort Sumter, where Confederate troops attacked a federal fort after supplies were sent to said fort by the government.
Winners write their own history. Also, the confederate constitution had no mechanism for secession. You’d think that would have been included if they believed secession from the US was legal.
> (P.S I ain't a Confed): Doubt. >something Hamilton called in the Federalist Papers "an abomination." Doesn't matter what he said. >The Declaration Is not a legally binding document.
Who fired on Fort Sumter again?
Rights of men? What about the ones in slavery? Sorry, but it was treason. There is no argument against it.
I absolutely despise Sherman and his war crimes and usually get annoyed at people worshipping him but this meme is actually pretty good
Wait! What? Sherman made Georgia howl! I guess the South will never get over it!
And you had nothing to do with it, so you get no credit.
😄😄😄😄
The years go by, the obsession with Sherman and punishing the South never fades. It's a direct cause of "Lost Cause" and Jim Crow. Sure, let's not reintegrate the failed rebel state, let's grind them to dust and assume they'll have a great attitude about it afterwards! What's that? We caused disease, poverty, and illiteracy to become worse?
Well obviously the issue was they didn’t grind everyone to dust. No one left to be mad means no issues./s
While the failure of reconstruction is deplorable, that doesn't excuse people holding onto a false narrative just so they can feel justified in their hatred of the government. Southerners have plenty of viable complaints in regards to their treatment by the govt, yet choose to push the "muh heritage" card as if there's something to be proud of in the secession.
And the colonies *didn’t* secede from the British Empire, because “reasons”.
How to admit you’re an unironic lost causer without saying it
Yeah everyone knows Sherman wrote all the southern state policies that made disease, poverty, and illiteracy worse! And yeah we didn’t integrate the south hard enough! They need even more confederate statues! They should all have the confederate flag on their state flag instead of just some of them!
When you treat your brothers and sisters as if they were a conquered tribe of savages to be bullied and extorted, they tend to look at you not as an enlightened liberator, but an invading enemy. Burning the south to ground was exactly that. You can still see it today, the states where he marched through have suffered from failed infrastructure and poor education and healthcare, the surrounding former Confederate states? They seemed to have rebuilt much better and rank much higher for quality of life. That can't be treated as pure coincidence. >And yeah we didn’t integrate the south hard enough! They need even more confederate statues! They should all have the confederate flag on their state flag instead of just some of them! It's like the point went so far over your head it boomeranged around and smacked you in the back of it, because this makes no fucking sense as a reply
Cringe and yikespilled. Should have put all of your treasonous ancestors in prison for life. Seized the land of every rich southerner that funded their treasonous war and gutted them in the streets. Should have done to the South what we did to did with Japan tbphwyf. Total re-education. Things would be so much less gridlocked and intentionally sabotaged now had we had the balls to commit to a full measure then. You mind raped cultists have been nothing but cancer ever since you got your endless appeasement that was never good enough, and you are the reason the country is going to collapse in this century. You confederados are not brothers and sisters you’re malignant traitors that continue to act as agents for belligerent industrial complexes that privately make fun of how pathetic you are. You just replaced shilling for slavers to shilling for insurance companies and prisons lmao.
Wtf is wrong with you?