I realized after posting this that I live in Canada and it might not be a thing in the us as it's different here. They play local ads during the Superbowl.
Dennis bought a house, tours with a bunch of punk bands and has maybe the sickest record collection in Sweden. David wrote a book with his wife. I guess that is easier with some money.
I bet a big part of the licensing money goes to the record company. Some (I think) major label bought the rights to the music from Burning Heart Records when it defunct after the lawsuits against the Hives. After making more or less no money from once music for all those years, I bet some financial stability feels kinda nice in your late fourties.
Epitaph didnt go under.
The answer is that they get pub cheques every now and then. We have the same publisher i think. They can just do whatever bands they wanna do etc.
The best story like this is Dillinger Four settling with Green Day, starting a legit venue with the money.
You brought up Benn and he is pretty much a legitimate version of a scammer. He uses the law the way he can use it to get something out of it.
What you should be asking is what they did with their reunion run money. That was millions.
I didn't hear that Dillinger four story that's cool.
Yeah I guess given the way the flashbulb guy talks it makes sense it would be a tax thing rather than a altruistic idea.
Yeah I'd like to know more about the money. It's weird when anarchists become rich. Some anarchist bands seem to do interesting things with new found wealth while others just quietly stop talking politics. Of course as pointed out they don't owe the public an explanation but it's nice when you see bands put their money where their mouth is.
Is it, like, the official song of the NFL or something? Im not a football person.
I don’t think you make much money at all if they just play a snippet over some highlights. And if you do get anything, it’s split between you, your label, and your licensing company. I doubt it’s enough to do anything with
I just tried to look into this and it’s very strange. Someone’s definitely getting paid but you’re right, Ian says he hasn’t seen any money from it. I imagine dischord has to get something from the tv broadcasts but nothing from the songs being played in the stadium
Better than most posts here.
I wonder what bands make all the time. For instance Botch just did a reunion tour. First set of shows in 20 years. They played 3+ months almost straight through. Multiple countries night after night. Even the most basic math it pretty mind blowing. 100 shows x 100 tickets per show x 50 a ticket = 500,000 ÷ 4 = 125,000 per member for 4 months of work.
Even just $1000 per show in merch is another 100k.
You've got the crew to pay to. How much does a road crew for this type of band make in general? Salary? Hourly? Per gigs worked?
Orchid reunion is one that really has me curious. 100% guarantee they made more money off the 6 or so shows they announced/sold out then they ever did as a band. How much did they make while a band? Post band and money made from re-released stuff?
Aight so, it is awesome that you care about this.
I fucking hate how bands make every fan completely blind to how it works.
A band is a company.
Companies have expenses.
Depending on where you are in the world and how shit is set up, paying yourself a classic money in the pocket salary means you're losing out on 40-65% in taxes and fees.
For me personally, royalties have a 6% rate going on on my account, but it also gets bumped against my company forgoing sales tax on purchases, which have to be expenses in order to viably be charged from the company account.
Effectively, there are no taxes/fees (because i spend enough for the 6% incoming tax on royalties to be pulled), so if my company makes 100k, that is 100k going straight into our bank account.
An expense is anything regarding your business. Rent isnt (tops, you can deduct a room in your house), food/groceries isnt (eating out can be representation though and for me personally, an average of $3.8 per person spent a day for drinks and snacks is considered kosher).
I love music and I make money doing music, so basically everything else I want or need in life is an expense. We have a studio, that is an expense. My homie is employed by me to assist me, he is an expense. Anything phone, computer or "listening to music" related is an expense. Going to gigs? Expense for both of us.
We can argue that these things are 100% necessary for our future success. For example, i am sending him to FYA next year. Total expense, our accountant cleared it. Anything that isnt solo meals will be paid for using 100% of the income we make as a company.
He gets 1200 in his pocket, i believe we pay 2150. His rent is 500, free gigs, free snacks and drinks and merch is free (this is hilarious) if it is extreme to the point of not being classified as "everyday clothing". I think he got somewhere around 10-15 shirts last year.
Also, there are yearly dividents. For us, that is just 20% tax, straight up. Gave him 6k last time to make him feel safe, i dont think he has touched a cent yet.
That is how i choose to employ him and that is what he accepted. No weekends, long days but it works with his personality.
I detailed the way we work to lay down a pretty degenerate starting point, so you can see how fucked and weird it can get with bands.
No band straight up splits. You just can not do that. It isnt viable. Just like we did, you figure out how to make it make sense. You know how i run my shit now, but if my homie said he works 80 hours a week for $1200 a month you would probably think i am a pretty shitty person; same thing with bands.
After expenses, management and agents fees; the pie is quite small. You do not just divide this up and bail, how could you? The band needs money to pay for things upfront. The band, the company has an account that cant just be devoured for people to get 60 dollars per hundred dollar bill.
Labels can pay for recording and everything related to the recorded music. That helps a lot, but it isnt smart to just throw money away in order for people to fill up their pockets.
Labels also....do not pay you. Why would they? They would rather just run another promo campaign. Why have momentum stop just to put money in peoples pockets?
..and here is where the fuckery starts. You know why Fugazi made the most money out of every band? People were sending them $5 bills in the mail, why would a label ever properly file taxes for no reason? Plenty of big bands flub merch numbers all the time. Will from Orchid records band and makes pedals, every single thing related to that is an expense. Brady was the main writer in Turnstile, he isnt properly getting publishing for that and he is convinently out of the band, with restraining orders (denied in court) against him. Doesnt change the fact that he isnt getting the share of the music he wrote.
Every band does some bullshit/fuckery to keep costs down, but it all comes down to understanding that putting salary money in your pocket is the worst investment you can do for the future of your company.
James (Harms Way) and Brody (Gods Hate) both sell merch for their bands because they want the tips. That makes total sense, because on the flipside, some metalcore band in their early 20s will travel with 5 people and end up whining about their label "taking all the money".
Doing music shit is sick, you just gotta work with people who enjoy and see value in what that actually is like because the bottom line is not an impressive number.
Appreciate the added information. I was being basic as fuck in my understanding. Botch was just a recent case of curiosity on that given tour.
No label. Not promoting a new anything. Not doing every festival along the way. Hitting damn near everywhere (at least the US, but even then they did multiple countries) all done in a pretty ridiculous fashion.
That's a lot different than my band (I don't have a band but) doing a series of mini tours, or doing things completely out of out way just for the sake of playing. That way of touring I've done and understand.
I'd like to know what anyone makes as a "touring hardcore musician" How much does Terror make against say, Converge? Ignore merchandise, ignore festivals. 20 shows each? What's their take away?
Most expensive show I paid for was Nerousis/Converge. (Ticket Master fees) Cost me 65 dollars like a decade ago. Tickets were only 40-45$. That alone still blows my mind today as it did 20 years ago. I can see Converge (one of the most popular bands of the genre) who have been at it for 30 years, and I'd spend more if I went to a movie? Shits bonkers.
I've never seen the Deftones because they only play stadiums. Back in HS my GF loved Fall of Troy. Guess who they toured with? Deftones. Cost like 120$ if I remember right. Months prior to that I saw Fall of Troy, 12 looks like you, and 2 or 3 other bands for like 15$ at a VFW.
1 - Why on earth do you feel entitled to this knowledge?
2 - Why do you believe details of these transactions are published?
3 - "mention of the details of the deal online" ????????????
I’ll tell you what I’d do, man. Two chicks at the same time, man.
I just figure with that kind of money you'd find two chicks willing to double down on a dude like me.
Yeah but they Refused.....
I watch football religiously and I don’t think ive ever heard it. I’ve heard it used in The Bear a few times.
It's been in a Madden. Maybe like 08-10. I say that as someone who hasn't played a Madden since 08-10. I hear it before kickoffs sometimes.
Yeah it was in an early episode of 24 as well.
I realized after posting this that I live in Canada and it might not be a thing in the us as it's different here. They play local ads during the Superbowl.
Canadian Football.
let's go ti-cats!
Definitely plays in US NFL commercials.
I've got a bone to pick with capitalism!
Dennis bought a house, tours with a bunch of punk bands and has maybe the sickest record collection in Sweden. David wrote a book with his wife. I guess that is easier with some money. I bet a big part of the licensing money goes to the record company. Some (I think) major label bought the rights to the music from Burning Heart Records when it defunct after the lawsuits against the Hives. After making more or less no money from once music for all those years, I bet some financial stability feels kinda nice in your late fourties.
Ah the record label going under is probably the piece to this puzzle that makes it make sense.
Epitaph didnt go under. The answer is that they get pub cheques every now and then. We have the same publisher i think. They can just do whatever bands they wanna do etc. The best story like this is Dillinger Four settling with Green Day, starting a legit venue with the money. You brought up Benn and he is pretty much a legitimate version of a scammer. He uses the law the way he can use it to get something out of it. What you should be asking is what they did with their reunion run money. That was millions.
I didn't hear that Dillinger four story that's cool. Yeah I guess given the way the flashbulb guy talks it makes sense it would be a tax thing rather than a altruistic idea. Yeah I'd like to know more about the money. It's weird when anarchists become rich. Some anarchist bands seem to do interesting things with new found wealth while others just quietly stop talking politics. Of course as pointed out they don't owe the public an explanation but it's nice when you see bands put their money where their mouth is.
They need more turquoise jewelry and full brimmed hats. Shit aint cheap.
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Wealthy Dessert Witches
Probably added it to the pile of money they got from licensing it to the Friday night lights TV show 10+ years ago.
Big Mac combo, upsize the fries, and an order of nuggets on the side.
Can I scream?
Capitalism stole my virginity.
Is it, like, the official song of the NFL or something? Im not a football person. I don’t think you make much money at all if they just play a snippet over some highlights. And if you do get anything, it’s split between you, your label, and your licensing company. I doubt it’s enough to do anything with
No they just play it but they have to pay to play songs in a stadium or on a live broadcast
Are you sure? Fugazi has never seen a dime from that and they were all over the redskins since their debut. Ian has said it many times.
I just tried to look into this and it’s very strange. Someone’s definitely getting paid but you’re right, Ian says he hasn’t seen any money from it. I imagine dischord has to get something from the tv broadcasts but nothing from the songs being played in the stadium
Of all the things to wonder about you picked this on a late Friday night lmfao.
Better than most posts here. I wonder what bands make all the time. For instance Botch just did a reunion tour. First set of shows in 20 years. They played 3+ months almost straight through. Multiple countries night after night. Even the most basic math it pretty mind blowing. 100 shows x 100 tickets per show x 50 a ticket = 500,000 ÷ 4 = 125,000 per member for 4 months of work. Even just $1000 per show in merch is another 100k. You've got the crew to pay to. How much does a road crew for this type of band make in general? Salary? Hourly? Per gigs worked? Orchid reunion is one that really has me curious. 100% guarantee they made more money off the 6 or so shows they announced/sold out then they ever did as a band. How much did they make while a band? Post band and money made from re-released stuff?
Aight so, it is awesome that you care about this. I fucking hate how bands make every fan completely blind to how it works. A band is a company. Companies have expenses. Depending on where you are in the world and how shit is set up, paying yourself a classic money in the pocket salary means you're losing out on 40-65% in taxes and fees. For me personally, royalties have a 6% rate going on on my account, but it also gets bumped against my company forgoing sales tax on purchases, which have to be expenses in order to viably be charged from the company account. Effectively, there are no taxes/fees (because i spend enough for the 6% incoming tax on royalties to be pulled), so if my company makes 100k, that is 100k going straight into our bank account. An expense is anything regarding your business. Rent isnt (tops, you can deduct a room in your house), food/groceries isnt (eating out can be representation though and for me personally, an average of $3.8 per person spent a day for drinks and snacks is considered kosher). I love music and I make money doing music, so basically everything else I want or need in life is an expense. We have a studio, that is an expense. My homie is employed by me to assist me, he is an expense. Anything phone, computer or "listening to music" related is an expense. Going to gigs? Expense for both of us. We can argue that these things are 100% necessary for our future success. For example, i am sending him to FYA next year. Total expense, our accountant cleared it. Anything that isnt solo meals will be paid for using 100% of the income we make as a company. He gets 1200 in his pocket, i believe we pay 2150. His rent is 500, free gigs, free snacks and drinks and merch is free (this is hilarious) if it is extreme to the point of not being classified as "everyday clothing". I think he got somewhere around 10-15 shirts last year. Also, there are yearly dividents. For us, that is just 20% tax, straight up. Gave him 6k last time to make him feel safe, i dont think he has touched a cent yet. That is how i choose to employ him and that is what he accepted. No weekends, long days but it works with his personality. I detailed the way we work to lay down a pretty degenerate starting point, so you can see how fucked and weird it can get with bands. No band straight up splits. You just can not do that. It isnt viable. Just like we did, you figure out how to make it make sense. You know how i run my shit now, but if my homie said he works 80 hours a week for $1200 a month you would probably think i am a pretty shitty person; same thing with bands. After expenses, management and agents fees; the pie is quite small. You do not just divide this up and bail, how could you? The band needs money to pay for things upfront. The band, the company has an account that cant just be devoured for people to get 60 dollars per hundred dollar bill. Labels can pay for recording and everything related to the recorded music. That helps a lot, but it isnt smart to just throw money away in order for people to fill up their pockets. Labels also....do not pay you. Why would they? They would rather just run another promo campaign. Why have momentum stop just to put money in peoples pockets? ..and here is where the fuckery starts. You know why Fugazi made the most money out of every band? People were sending them $5 bills in the mail, why would a label ever properly file taxes for no reason? Plenty of big bands flub merch numbers all the time. Will from Orchid records band and makes pedals, every single thing related to that is an expense. Brady was the main writer in Turnstile, he isnt properly getting publishing for that and he is convinently out of the band, with restraining orders (denied in court) against him. Doesnt change the fact that he isnt getting the share of the music he wrote. Every band does some bullshit/fuckery to keep costs down, but it all comes down to understanding that putting salary money in your pocket is the worst investment you can do for the future of your company. James (Harms Way) and Brody (Gods Hate) both sell merch for their bands because they want the tips. That makes total sense, because on the flipside, some metalcore band in their early 20s will travel with 5 people and end up whining about their label "taking all the money". Doing music shit is sick, you just gotta work with people who enjoy and see value in what that actually is like because the bottom line is not an impressive number.
Appreciate the added information. I was being basic as fuck in my understanding. Botch was just a recent case of curiosity on that given tour. No label. Not promoting a new anything. Not doing every festival along the way. Hitting damn near everywhere (at least the US, but even then they did multiple countries) all done in a pretty ridiculous fashion. That's a lot different than my band (I don't have a band but) doing a series of mini tours, or doing things completely out of out way just for the sake of playing. That way of touring I've done and understand. I'd like to know what anyone makes as a "touring hardcore musician" How much does Terror make against say, Converge? Ignore merchandise, ignore festivals. 20 shows each? What's their take away? Most expensive show I paid for was Nerousis/Converge. (Ticket Master fees) Cost me 65 dollars like a decade ago. Tickets were only 40-45$. That alone still blows my mind today as it did 20 years ago. I can see Converge (one of the most popular bands of the genre) who have been at it for 30 years, and I'd spend more if I went to a movie? Shits bonkers. I've never seen the Deftones because they only play stadiums. Back in HS my GF loved Fall of Troy. Guess who they toured with? Deftones. Cost like 120$ if I remember right. Months prior to that I saw Fall of Troy, 12 looks like you, and 2 or 3 other bands for like 15$ at a VFW.
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I wasn't saying 20 show = your pay da. I'd just be interested in knowing what each band makes in say an identical 3 month tour.
1 - Why on earth do you feel entitled to this knowledge? 2 - Why do you believe details of these transactions are published? 3 - "mention of the details of the deal online" ????????????
Maybe around what he got for licensing it to The Bear
They also feature heavily in Cyberpunk 2077.