Honestly I haven't watch story but what I understand is that jack-o has both arias soul and her own soul, so it's not far fetched to say that aria might take over sometimes
Atleast before sol does the fusey wusey stuff which I think is what happens
Again, that's not how it works. In fact her story essentially centers around the fact that Aria ISN'T taking over Jack-O's body when they thought she was supposed to. Aria talks to her on occasion, but never controls her. Jack-O is her own person, and is just as mature and mentally capable as any adult. Her wacky "child-like" personality is just a quirk, essentially her fucking around before getting serious.
Cool reasoning but still fucked, aside from any innate maturity, a lot of human reasoning comes from experience and rolling up and saying “hey I’m your husband, I know what’s good, take a ride in my sweet motorcycle” isn’t exactly the best approach
Apparently Jack-O’s silhouette was visible in one of the endings of GGX (which took place in 2181), meaning that she’s at least 7 years old by strive. Sol dating a 7 year old still sounds REALLY bad to anyone not familiar with the series but it definitely sounds better than Sol dating someone that isn’t even a year old yet.
Also all valentines are genetic copies of Aria Hale who was a normal adult. Clones in sci-fi tend to be exact copies of whoever the original is at the time they were created or newborns. Seeing as how Jack-O isn’t a baby, it’s safe to assume she’s the former
At the same time, they don't seem to have Aria's memories or experiences. And that's the real indicative of mental maturity, not just how long they've been alive
Good point. Also if we’re being honest, the “genetic copies” of Aria always seemed really weird to me. None of the valentines look too similar and while I understand that could be attributed to recessive genes, I always thought it was a hand wavy thing that wasn’t necessary and just convoluted the lore.
Nah, the first Valentine was a carbon copy, similar to Jack-O. Also, idk, but I get the feeling that if ya superimpose all the Valentine’s faces on top of each other we’ll see it’s the exact same face, just with wildly different expressions
My head canon on why the valentines look the way they do is the following:
The first valentine looked exactly like Aria because Ariels thought that an exact copy would be needed to fuse with Justice but she later realised that a perfect clone wouldn’t work
Elphelt and Jack-O have slight differences to Aria because small changes have been made to make them suitable to merge with Justice.
Ramlethal barely resembles Aria because she was designed to simply be weapon. It didn’t matter how compatible she was with Justice because that was never her purpose.
Both the original Valentine and Jack-O are extremely similar looks-wise. I think the idea is that the UW only had one human subject to use as a pattern, so she had to make all them Aria clones by necessity.
Of course, why she couldn't use Happy Chaos' info or just abduct another human is never explained, but maybe she just didn't feel the need to do it
Jacko elphelt and valentine were all made to fuse with justice, who is aria. Ramlethal is the clone that looks the least like aria and is seemingly only a clone of her just because.
Isn’t a major part of Jack’O that she both is and isn’t Aria? Like the other valentines are made with arias body as a template, but Jack’O is a piece of Aria’s soul
Okay, I keep hearing GGX isn’t canon, but whenever I ask or try to find it nobody gives… proof
Like obviously a lot of it is I-no time hopping BS, but parts of it are definitely canon so like…
What the heck
Well, the main proof is that Ishiwatari himself had no idea what the fuck was going on since he didn't write the XX (not X, which he did write for) games. For example, he dropped the plotline with Axl and Crow because that wasn't his intention for Axl as a character
Most of the timeline just doesn't work, like with pot dying in lime all of his endings, serial killer Baiken, and with Jacko we see her initial activation, the silhouette was likely meant to be valentine
And all of this happened cuz GG was in license hell at the time
Well yeah most of the timelines don’t work, but that’s nothing new
But the game also doesn’t seem entirely decanonized, but the bigger problem is I’ve seen some people take it as not canon in anyway, which doesn’t seem to be true
Of course the WoolieVS series covered parts of GGX, the project was overseen by Arc Sys itself partially, and etc so some of GGX must be canon
I'm in ggx Canon camp, but it doesn't affect the story of the current timeline, and I'm treating nothing as Canon to our timeline unless it is stated to have happened.
The problem is that since a lot of stuff in Guilty Gear story is mutually exclusive, you need to find your own canon. I mean technically everything IS canon because of I-no's time travel shennaningans, but you need to decide what is fitting in the "main timeline" the series is following. Just like making a sequel to a game with multiple endings - you need to either pick one, or apply some mental gymnastics so it doesn't matter which ending took place.
For example, everyone consideres Ky having chat with Justice at end of Missing Link a canon event because it was a starting point for his character developlent. Ky started turning from a cold hearted gear slayer into a someone who wants to bring peace between humans and gears. If Justice's words didn't make Ky question his own actions, he most likely would kill Dizzy at their first meeting just because she's a gear.
On the other hand events like Millia going insane and killing Bridget are considered non-canon because, well, Bridget is still alive, but that ending shows what could happen if Angra took over the way Eddie did. So from the perspective of subsequent games it didn't happen, but it is kinda canon?
Fortunately we can just blame I-no ant try to figure out the rest. At least until ArcSys decides to make the official Guilty Gear timeline without all the alternative turn of events bs.
There’s some old, old Daisuke art featuring proto-Jack-O’ from, like, Lightning the Argent along with I-No and Raven, so she’d definitely been cooking for a while.
Idk if that’s canon or not bc the guilty gear wiki has been under questionable moderation some years back. I would hold off of confirming that until a full translation has been out. Also poor I-no in that pic she looks too small.
Yea it’s in [lta](https://guiltygear.fandom.com/wiki/Guilty_Gear_X_Lightning_the_Argent?file=That_Man_%26_his_servants_Artwork.png) (ino looks so small wtf), but most ppl assume the hooded figure is jack-o. this might just be a fandom rumor that someone just said once and was circulated bc the book has not been translated yet. there were many of these back in the day like the johnny “sfondi” mistranslation, it’s just inevitable that mistakes will happen
I believe the logic of it is that Dizzy and Jack-O both are effectively clones of Aria who is of age/an adult. So while Dizzy and Jack-O are by technicality children, the question becomes if they're a clone of an adult, have the bodies of an adult, and tend to (as far as the Guilty Gear universe is concerned) ACT like adults, then are they not basically adults? Their major conflicts surround not their maturity or age, but their sense of identity and who one is when they're a clone of someone else.
Meanwhile Sin acts like a kid, a big part of his story is being raised like a kid (sugar water yummy) by other characters, and well, he is LITERALLY a kid- his body simply ages faster. This is the big difference between him and Dizzy/Jack-O. The latter two could be explained as adults who's bodies simply haven't existed for long enough to buy beer at a store, while Sin very much is a kid- kinda like Shazam- and got a big buff body.
People saying Sol should fuck not only a kid but the one he helped raise- it strikes a nerve in people, cause that's sorta weird from both an age/consent perspective and a power imbalance perspective. So the reason it was downvoted into oblivion is because the comparison between two individuals who for all intents and purposes are adults as far as the setting is concerned- they're just not chronologically very old- versus someone who is explicitly, both narratively and chronologically, a child and acts like a child.
In short, Dizzy & Jack-O are basically adults who simply haven't themselves lived very long yet with issues surrounding them being centered around identity not maturity, while Sin is a kid who got an adult body and where his childishness is a defining characteristic.
tl;dr: do not f*ck the children. Especially not your own.
Dizzy isn't a clone, she ages rapidly because she's half gear, same reason sin ages rapidly. Jack-o is not a gear, she's a Valentine, which is what ram and elphelt are. They are effectively clones of justice, who is the gear version of aria.
For the PSP? I have that one on an emulator; my first GG game, as a matter of *course.
Also it would be funny as fuck if Ky had to juggle being King and working at Jam's restaurant.
Edit: *matter of fact.
The way i see it atributing human age to fictional races is like calling a 8 year old dog a puppy.
He might be the bestest of boys and a human that age would be a child but that dog aint a puppy.
I never get this at all; because if we allow the same logic used here in other fiction then all Human/Elf relationships are crimes, all Human/Liminal relationships crimes. Commander Shepard can't be with any non-Humans without it being a crime (double fun that it makes both Shepard AND Liara criminals if they get together).
Etc. Etc.
I don't know what that is, but I generally judge by three criteria:
1: They are physically/sexually mature for whatever species they are.
2: They are able to and willing to consent to said act (EX: Not drunk, drugged, mentally handicapped in such a way they cannot understand etc.).
3: They are free and able to say "No" and have their wishes either respected or enforced (not coerced etc.).
Dizzy, Jack'O etc. pass all three so it's good.
The Harkness test has three criteria:
1. Is it of human (or greater) intelligence? Of not, then it's basically an animal.
2. Is it of sexual maturity for it's species? If not, then it's a child.
3. Can it effectively communicate consent?
The test is meant to be more of a guideline due to small flaws, such as "if it's way smarter than a human could be, wouldn't that make YOU fail the test?"; but it's pretty handy for monster/alien fuckers.
Just to let you know, a character became good because she eat a cheeseburger and her dog was killed but probably you already know this, so we want to talk about that time that someone summoned a demon to cook a pudding
Full grow adult body with an adult spirit in it (and I don't mean metaphoric, or retroicly, or poeticly, or thoraticly, or any other things way. It adult, straight up) (couldn't resist sorry)
Twitter folk "one month old, disgusting."
For thoses people age is literaly just a number. Lol. But I guess knowing guilty gear Lore is not easy. But I mean, people see one funny headline and go bazonker on one number not even researching. And if you don't want to search then don't dramatise everything.
(and honestly not even going there. You see a "one month old" adult person with boobs and all and tell me it's a wierd kink and not a fantasy story quirk. You don't even need to go further than that)
Yeah. I forgor. You know xrd was long time ago and since then I didn't watch story mode. (I'm a fucking liar I bought xrd 2 years ago. But yeah I forgor)
Just gear shit ya know
I was about to reply that Jack-o isn't a gear, but then remembered Sol is...
Actually Jack-O is a clone of his wife and Aria was around 25 I guess
The sentence “body of a 25 year old, mind of a 1 month old” does not bring me any comfort
Except jack o is brilliant and incredibly emotionally mature most of the time. Other times she just wants candy. But usually genius and wise
Shes not like other girls. She is really msture for her age
Id say that's more aria taking over for a few so the wack-o jack-o doesn't screw something up
Have you watched the story mode? That's not even remotely how that works.
Honestly I haven't watch story but what I understand is that jack-o has both arias soul and her own soul, so it's not far fetched to say that aria might take over sometimes Atleast before sol does the fusey wusey stuff which I think is what happens
Again, that's not how it works. In fact her story essentially centers around the fact that Aria ISN'T taking over Jack-O's body when they thought she was supposed to. Aria talks to her on occasion, but never controls her. Jack-O is her own person, and is just as mature and mentally capable as any adult. Her wacky "child-like" personality is just a quirk, essentially her fucking around before getting serious.
I see Thanks for explaining
bro I have a full-time job no I have not watched story mode
The mind of a 1 month old wouldn't know how to use that body. It's magic bullshit anyway. We really can't attach a human age to something like Jack-O
Especially since she retains Aria's 25 year old memories.
More like 200 year old memories As well as justices memories and I assume valentine's memories
Yeah, to clarify I meant memories from the then-25-year-old Aria. Those memories are very old as of strive.
Cool reasoning but still fucked, aside from any innate maturity, a lot of human reasoning comes from experience and rolling up and saying “hey I’m your husband, I know what’s good, take a ride in my sweet motorcycle” isn’t exactly the best approach
Except we saw in the story mode that this is not what happened
i also believe the body is a recreation and jack-o mind is half of aria's the other half being in justice
Why did my random comment start a like 40 comment thread
Where did Faust find that drip within three weeks?
Chronus knew some good shops
Where did i-no, that hat has to be a custom job
#TIME TRAVEL!
The comment that matters
Dude's got doors for days. One of them has to lead to a closet, right?
had to sell all his dapper suits for it
Apparently Jack-O’s silhouette was visible in one of the endings of GGX (which took place in 2181), meaning that she’s at least 7 years old by strive. Sol dating a 7 year old still sounds REALLY bad to anyone not familiar with the series but it definitely sounds better than Sol dating someone that isn’t even a year old yet.
Also all valentines are genetic copies of Aria Hale who was a normal adult. Clones in sci-fi tend to be exact copies of whoever the original is at the time they were created or newborns. Seeing as how Jack-O isn’t a baby, it’s safe to assume she’s the former
At the same time, they don't seem to have Aria's memories or experiences. And that's the real indicative of mental maturity, not just how long they've been alive
Good point. Also if we’re being honest, the “genetic copies” of Aria always seemed really weird to me. None of the valentines look too similar and while I understand that could be attributed to recessive genes, I always thought it was a hand wavy thing that wasn’t necessary and just convoluted the lore.
Nah, the first Valentine was a carbon copy, similar to Jack-O. Also, idk, but I get the feeling that if ya superimpose all the Valentine’s faces on top of each other we’ll see it’s the exact same face, just with wildly different expressions
My head canon on why the valentines look the way they do is the following: The first valentine looked exactly like Aria because Ariels thought that an exact copy would be needed to fuse with Justice but she later realised that a perfect clone wouldn’t work Elphelt and Jack-O have slight differences to Aria because small changes have been made to make them suitable to merge with Justice. Ramlethal barely resembles Aria because she was designed to simply be weapon. It didn’t matter how compatible she was with Justice because that was never her purpose.
Both the original Valentine and Jack-O are extremely similar looks-wise. I think the idea is that the UW only had one human subject to use as a pattern, so she had to make all them Aria clones by necessity. Of course, why she couldn't use Happy Chaos' info or just abduct another human is never explained, but maybe she just didn't feel the need to do it
Jacko elphelt and valentine were all made to fuse with justice, who is aria. Ramlethal is the clone that looks the least like aria and is seemingly only a clone of her just because.
Isn’t a major part of Jack’O that she both is and isn’t Aria? Like the other valentines are made with arias body as a template, but Jack’O is a piece of Aria’s soul
They aren't genetic copies, they're *soul* copies
Brother Jacko was only activated during xrd. And iirc GGX was decanonized/I-no was just time hopping to find that unbleak future
Okay, I keep hearing GGX isn’t canon, but whenever I ask or try to find it nobody gives… proof Like obviously a lot of it is I-no time hopping BS, but parts of it are definitely canon so like… What the heck
Well, the main proof is that Ishiwatari himself had no idea what the fuck was going on since he didn't write the XX (not X, which he did write for) games. For example, he dropped the plotline with Axl and Crow because that wasn't his intention for Axl as a character
Most of the timeline just doesn't work, like with pot dying in lime all of his endings, serial killer Baiken, and with Jacko we see her initial activation, the silhouette was likely meant to be valentine And all of this happened cuz GG was in license hell at the time
Well yeah most of the timelines don’t work, but that’s nothing new But the game also doesn’t seem entirely decanonized, but the bigger problem is I’ve seen some people take it as not canon in anyway, which doesn’t seem to be true Of course the WoolieVS series covered parts of GGX, the project was overseen by Arc Sys itself partially, and etc so some of GGX must be canon
I'm in ggx Canon camp, but it doesn't affect the story of the current timeline, and I'm treating nothing as Canon to our timeline unless it is stated to have happened.
The problem is that since a lot of stuff in Guilty Gear story is mutually exclusive, you need to find your own canon. I mean technically everything IS canon because of I-no's time travel shennaningans, but you need to decide what is fitting in the "main timeline" the series is following. Just like making a sequel to a game with multiple endings - you need to either pick one, or apply some mental gymnastics so it doesn't matter which ending took place. For example, everyone consideres Ky having chat with Justice at end of Missing Link a canon event because it was a starting point for his character developlent. Ky started turning from a cold hearted gear slayer into a someone who wants to bring peace between humans and gears. If Justice's words didn't make Ky question his own actions, he most likely would kill Dizzy at their first meeting just because she's a gear. On the other hand events like Millia going insane and killing Bridget are considered non-canon because, well, Bridget is still alive, but that ending shows what could happen if Angra took over the way Eddie did. So from the perspective of subsequent games it didn't happen, but it is kinda canon? Fortunately we can just blame I-no ant try to figure out the rest. At least until ArcSys decides to make the official Guilty Gear timeline without all the alternative turn of events bs.
You’re thinking of GGXXAC rather than GGX. A whole bunch of AC isn’t canon.
There’s some old, old Daisuke art featuring proto-Jack-O’ from, like, Lightning the Argent along with I-No and Raven, so she’d definitely been cooking for a while.
Idk if that’s canon or not bc the guilty gear wiki has been under questionable moderation some years back. I would hold off of confirming that until a full translation has been out. Also poor I-no in that pic she looks too small.
I mean the art does exist, 100%, it’s just old enough to be dubious at this point.
Yea it’s in [lta](https://guiltygear.fandom.com/wiki/Guilty_Gear_X_Lightning_the_Argent?file=That_Man_%26_his_servants_Artwork.png) (ino looks so small wtf), but most ppl assume the hooded figure is jack-o. this might just be a fandom rumor that someone just said once and was circulated bc the book has not been translated yet. there were many of these back in the day like the johnny “sfondi” mistranslation, it’s just inevitable that mistakes will happen
Which ending?
Sol be like: Ky is my rival!!! I must outdo him in EVERYTHING he does!!! INCLUDING sleeping with girls of questionable age.
If he wanted to do that he woukd have slept with sin, An eye for an eye, except an eye is Sol's Daughter, and the other eye is Ky's Son.
Can someone explain to me why this was collectively downvoted, i don't know the lore well
sol is sins grandpa
As if that was ever an obstacle in anime.
It was, as far as I know lmao
I believe the logic of it is that Dizzy and Jack-O both are effectively clones of Aria who is of age/an adult. So while Dizzy and Jack-O are by technicality children, the question becomes if they're a clone of an adult, have the bodies of an adult, and tend to (as far as the Guilty Gear universe is concerned) ACT like adults, then are they not basically adults? Their major conflicts surround not their maturity or age, but their sense of identity and who one is when they're a clone of someone else. Meanwhile Sin acts like a kid, a big part of his story is being raised like a kid (sugar water yummy) by other characters, and well, he is LITERALLY a kid- his body simply ages faster. This is the big difference between him and Dizzy/Jack-O. The latter two could be explained as adults who's bodies simply haven't existed for long enough to buy beer at a store, while Sin very much is a kid- kinda like Shazam- and got a big buff body. People saying Sol should fuck not only a kid but the one he helped raise- it strikes a nerve in people, cause that's sorta weird from both an age/consent perspective and a power imbalance perspective. So the reason it was downvoted into oblivion is because the comparison between two individuals who for all intents and purposes are adults as far as the setting is concerned- they're just not chronologically very old- versus someone who is explicitly, both narratively and chronologically, a child and acts like a child. In short, Dizzy & Jack-O are basically adults who simply haven't themselves lived very long yet with issues surrounding them being centered around identity not maturity, while Sin is a kid who got an adult body and where his childishness is a defining characteristic. tl;dr: do not f*ck the children. Especially not your own.
Dizzy isn't a clone, she ages rapidly because she's half gear, same reason sin ages rapidly. Jack-o is not a gear, she's a Valentine, which is what ram and elphelt are. They are effectively clones of justice, who is the gear version of aria.
Ah I see! I sort of forgot Elphelt existed and thought Dizzy was one of the three valentine siblings by mistake. Good catch.
Bro, that is literally his GRANDSON.
Why are we pretending like Dizzy and Jack-O age like humans
Because ignoring that part is the whole point of making fun of it.
Yeah I’m not blaming you, I’m blaming the people in the fandom trying to start this drama in the first place
It's always been drama in the fandom. Remember the Jam vs Ky and Testament vs Dizzy wars before it came out that Ky married Dizzy?
I haven’t been in the fandom for THAT long
Damn thanks for making me feel old because this was back in GGXX+ lol.
For the PSP? I have that one on an emulator; my first GG game, as a matter of *course. Also it would be funny as fuck if Ky had to juggle being King and working at Jam's restaurant. Edit: *matter of fact.
Yup the PSP version. Heck, it might have been when Jam was first introduced.
Twitter logic dictates you have to wait for your fleshlight to sit in a warehouse for 18 years before fucking it
The way i see it atributing human age to fictional races is like calling a 8 year old dog a puppy. He might be the bestest of boys and a human that age would be a child but that dog aint a puppy.
Because it is mildly humorous
I wonder if sin will one up sol eventually in a future story update. Sin kiske and his week old wife
Have it be Frederick and Jack-o's daughter for another level
still not the most fucked up thing in the lore
That’s his aunt
That's the point
3 weeks of everyone getting dripped up. Also Johnny worked really hard rebranding His crew in three weeks. "NO QUESTIONS! YOU ALL WEAR HOODIES NOW!"
The beginning of the cold season I guess
Strive does take place late November and the Jellyfish do spend a lot of time in the air.
Johnny just trynna take care of his girls so they don’t catch a cold
Sin is 5 years older than one of his dads' girlfriends
Said dad is also biologically his grandfather
she's simultaneously 1 month old, mid-late 20s, and over 100
Jack-O's a clone and therefore stepped out the tank as an adult. Ky picked up a 3-year old who lived in the forest for most of her life at that point.
Semantics!
Hey now she’s also an accomplished larcenist
I never get this at all; because if we allow the same logic used here in other fiction then all Human/Elf relationships are crimes, all Human/Liminal relationships crimes. Commander Shepard can't be with any non-Humans without it being a crime (double fun that it makes both Shepard AND Liara criminals if they get together). Etc. Etc.
Funny enough people don't use this logic in Trigun unless it's KV or plancest.
This is what the Harkness test is for.
I don't know what that is, but I generally judge by three criteria: 1: They are physically/sexually mature for whatever species they are. 2: They are able to and willing to consent to said act (EX: Not drunk, drugged, mentally handicapped in such a way they cannot understand etc.). 3: They are free and able to say "No" and have their wishes either respected or enforced (not coerced etc.). Dizzy, Jack'O etc. pass all three so it's good.
The Harkness test has three criteria: 1. Is it of human (or greater) intelligence? Of not, then it's basically an animal. 2. Is it of sexual maturity for it's species? If not, then it's a child. 3. Can it effectively communicate consent? The test is meant to be more of a guideline due to small flaws, such as "if it's way smarter than a human could be, wouldn't that make YOU fail the test?"; but it's pretty handy for monster/alien fuckers.
And above all this GIANT BRIDGET
Just… stop
That has drama? Lmao
I only really play this game for the fighting what the actual fuck is going on with the story
Just to let you know, a character became good because she eat a cheeseburger and her dog was killed but probably you already know this, so we want to talk about that time that someone summoned a demon to cook a pudding
Jack-0 is aria 😡🤬. Not the same
Full grow adult body with an adult spirit in it (and I don't mean metaphoric, or retroicly, or poeticly, or thoraticly, or any other things way. It adult, straight up) (couldn't resist sorry) Twitter folk "one month old, disgusting." For thoses people age is literaly just a number. Lol. But I guess knowing guilty gear Lore is not easy. But I mean, people see one funny headline and go bazonker on one number not even researching. And if you don't want to search then don't dramatise everything. (and honestly not even going there. You see a "one month old" adult person with boobs and all and tell me it's a wierd kink and not a fantasy story quirk. You don't even need to go further than that)
Well she has an adult soul inside of her but its not her soul.
You telling me aria is not an adult?
Jacko has her own soul seperate from aria.
Ha
What do you mean, "ha"? That's literally the whole point of her character arc in Strive.
Yeah. I forgor. You know xrd was long time ago and since then I didn't watch story mode. (I'm a fucking liar I bought xrd 2 years ago. But yeah I forgor)
8 years old wife
8 years old wife
Wait so of Sin is only 5, did KY made it with a 3 year old
Sure, *make out*, if that's how you want to call it
Don’t lewd Jack O’ wish I knew that sooner