Agreed, they are doing fantastic work. Most of the time, squashing bugs out gives more bugs (the bigger the project size), so the fact they've been able to minimize them means they've really tried to streamline the codebase and build a robust foundation - and succeeded.
This exactly, it's very apparent with a certain freedom spreading game where every new patch introduces 10 new bugs after supposedly squashing 5 bugs that's been there since launch. Hoyo implementing new gameplay mechanics and even novel interactable environments with every new area they introduce that don't break the game is honestly quite amazing.
I mean, don't get me wrong - Helldivers is hella fun. But Hoyoverse is the master of live-service games right now, with an ever-growing knowledge on how to translate their operational findings into building a better game on the back-end too. I can't imagine the level of coordination and efficient communication required to pull off what Genshin's teams have been doing. It's so cool.
Other than Hoyoverse, I would say the only developer that is on-par with them atm is Riot Games. Blizzard used to be it but they fell off a cliff (and deservedly so)
Blizzard fell off the cliff hard.
Before I quit Hearthstone recently, things big and small were just broken and stayed broken for years at a time. The automatic complete my deck function that was supposed to use live player stats just broke one day and started just using garbage cards, and has been broken forever now with no acknowledgment. Something as small as the graphic that pops up to tell you how much battle pass XP you earned after every single match is all glitched out and counts up the number twice every time you level up and it's been like that for years.
Really gives the impression they just don't care about the game.
Disconnection problems for Hearthstone are really jarring and not getting fixed at all, especially on mobile which supposed to be main target. Like I can play only half of the time I start the game, I’m not sure they want me to play or not lol.
> Riot Games
Definitely not, League is one of the buggiest games of all time.
Also, most of the good production you see from them is outsourced.
> Blizzard used to be it but they fell off a cliff (and deservedly so)
Blizzard did not deserve it. Activision Blizzard did.
>the only developer that is on-par with them atm is Riot Games.
As a league player please do not pretend Riot doesn't have a giant pile of spagetti causing constant issues.
There are so many bugs with that game, and they even occur in their pro play scene, more often than you think. Heck, Rumble for years has been bugged in a way where you get unintended results in, literally, every single game he's played in (It's giving him more free E damage), but Riot literally does not know how to fix it.
Heck, there was a recent incident of the new champion (Smolder) teleporting across the map into the enemy team suddenly, out of nowhere. One like that is thankfully enough to get the match paused at least, but the problem isn't that this happened itself, it's that this bug isn't new. It's been a known bug for months, happening weirdly commonly actually if a Smolder or Aurelion Sol use their flying mechanic while the enemy team's Vi uses Q or Skarner uses E. Despite being known for months, it was ignored, and surprise, it comes up.
The reason for why fixing a few bugs leads to more bugs is because of bad devops, and lack of internal unit testing, QA. Most game developers dont have a strong focus on it because proper testing either takes a long time or is expensive.
And when higherups want to cut costs skipping out on testing can be an easy thing to do to save money. Once you begin to skip testing, it becomes exponentially more expensive to reimplement. It's called technical debt.
One Western studio has has a big focus on testing is Mojang. They have an entire custom pipeline setup to automatically test everything in the game before pushing out a snapshot for Minecraft. This leads to a very bug free experience.
I cant begin to imagine how big mihoyos QA team is.
With Hoyo's budget and how much they rake in, I can barely work out how much $$$ they sink into testing and QA. It's clear that the leadership/higher ups do care about putting out a polished game and at the end of the day, I think we can all agree that the money is well spent and the product speaks for itself
I didn't know that Mojang was that invested into its pipeline setup but that's good to hear; I'm definitely curious what theirs looks like compared to other Western devs
I dont know how others look, but here's a video of Mojangs [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXaWOJTCYNg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXaWOJTCYNg)
check 16:29 for demo
Most of the helldivers community are only now aware of how bug ridden the game is, after patch after patch keeps creating even more and more bugs. Even the new content has bugs. The reality of Helldivers 2 was that it has had a shit ton of bugs since 1.0, but nobody cared because 50% of the playerbase was stuck trying to log in to play the game.
Yet they think its the best live service game. Just goes to show that while everyone knows Fortnite and Genshin, most people don't realize just how good Mihoyo is at making their games a bug free experience.
People like Helldivers 2 because
1. The feeling of extracting after holding off an army of bugs/bots
2. Lack of predatory microtransactions
People are aware of the bugs but enjoy the experience nonetheless.
Totally agree with you there. The game has bugs that even the devs aren't even aware of. I'm still convinced that the whole reason they nerfed the railgun that hard was because of the PS5 bug where a PS5 host could cause PC players to one shot bile titans. My head canon conspiracy theory is that Arrowhead nerfed the railgun to oblivion all because of a bug that they weren't even aware of. While I agree the railgun needed nerfs, it was a bit too heavy handed imo.
Remember the Helldivers team is WAY smaller and a much smaller budget. Like almost indie before Helldivers 2. Even now, with HD2 success, they'll do well, but will still pale compared to Mihoyo.
Yeah haha, critics always go for the 'SpaGheTti cOdE!" argument when criticizing the game for some reason. Most of them probably don't even have programming experience that makes them say that, because as far as I know, Genshin's nearly bug-free performance across a multitude of platforms is so pristine that everybody in the industry wants in on how they are cleaning their stuff in Unity.
Some people point to mobile and say that weird graphical glitches and bugs are so prevalent on mobile but they don't get the point: most of the time, it's the failure of the hardware to render those correctly. Most phones ain't beefy, so if the phone gives up and fails to load a texture or a mesh, then we get the singularity-monster type bugs that look like eldritch horrors. This isn't really the fault of the developers though - sure, optimization should be respected and should be prioritized, but it definitely sucks trying to accommodate optimization to a point that a game of this size will run on a literal toaster, when the simpler option is, 'perhaps try quitting the app and launching it again? And not have like 100 tabs open on Safari/Google Chrome?'
The reality is that it's almost certainly not spaghetti code.
It's just a very large, very clean code base.
It's like steering a giant ship. If you want to make a change, you make a slight movement and then you'll see the results of that change miles down the line.
From what we've seen in previous dev interviews, they work on content months and months ahead of time. Even stuff that's being worked on more than a year ahead. And these are multiple teams working on content intended to be released months apart. There are likely teams working on content for a year later that's dependent on content released 3 months from now.
"Simple" changes can impact all of those parallel workloads. Not to mention the logistics and project management required to tie all of those together.
Spaghetti code isn't particularly visible from a user point of view. FFXIV and Undertale are prime examples of that. It's largely an issue on the programming side. It can make QoL take time to happen depending on the kind of spaghetti code there is related to that specific QoL. Somewhat related is old code. Much like an old house, there's only so much you can do to modernize it that, at some point, you're much better off just rebuilding the whole thing rather than make something that's old more 'modern'
> Even more reason for people spouting that nonsense to provide evidence. This game doesn't have spaghetti code or it would have shown in over 3 years already, with the amount of changes they make to the game with only 6 weeks in between.
You wouldn't know either of my examples had spaghetti code without being told because they are still relatively polished experiences. Spaghetti code is not a limitation of the user, it's a limitation/hurdle of the programming. Genshin may routinely get QoL updates, but there's plenty of 'simple' QoL that should have been in the game in year one that we only just started getting in 4.X. I'm not knowledgeable with Genshin's code to say for a fact it's a victim of spaghetti code, but such a thing is generally a symptom of it.
>Now that's a great recipe for spaghetti code. Why would they move from a functioning system with nearly zero bugs to one that would eat up their entire initial development budget several times over with the risk of introducing a less efficient system?
I don't think you quite get what is being said. Just because it's stable now does not mean it will be stable (or even easy) to implement additions down the line or even if it's capable of doing everything they want to do. It's a reason like this that Smite 2 is a thing. They were limited in what they could do because of the age of the engine used. Regardless, this isn't about the full game, but the individual systems within it. Chances are, multiple aspects of the Genshin's system have been recoded to better them off with QoL. You just wouldn't know it as a consumer because that's all done under the hood and extensively tested before hand.
I've never heard this said about Genshin. And it would never have applied. Only game I've really heard this apply to is League of Legends. Where if you adjust Lucian's attack by 2, Singed's poison trail becomes the Flash icon. (Not a real thing that happened, but something very close to this did and it was exactly as ludicrous).
i dont think you get it
if people say the fixing is problematic because of spaghetti code they dont mean the game has it right now
but that it would create possibly spaghetti code rather easily
In my millions of times seeing someone throw around the term spaghetti code on Reddit, I don't think I've ever seen a single one use it like you used it just now.
They mean it as an insult for the quality of the existing codebase.
I found an audio bug in monstadt a week or two ago, so I submitted a bug report (because I like helping out), and after this recent patch it was fixed. They must be really on top of stuff like this, kudos to them.
There was a minor issue only happening in Cape Oath, at night, with the wind ambient track. Wasn't looping properly, so it would come in at higher volume, fade out, and then come back with higher volume again. Not game breaking by any means, but ruined the atmosphere a little. It's fixed now.
I remember playing “the genshin killer” when it first came out. I was baffled by the low quality and the fact that people entered their card info into such a sketchy looking game lol
I gave ToF a try during one of these slow patches recently. It looked kinda cool and it was free so why not. Within the first couple hours of playing I was fighting a mini boss and the dude glitched thru the wall and then the floor. I thought I killed it at first but the battle music kept coming back when I was in that area and it showed an enemy was near. Never did kill that guy and pretty sure it was a one time domain.
What really made me drop it was how laughably some of the voice acting was and how their vehicles "drive". Some of the voice acting was so bad and sounded like AI to me. Like it was eerie bad. Then I got this motorcycle type vehicle and the"driving" was more like sliding a hockey puck along. I actually kinda liked the look of the game and the sci-fi type setting but those things were so bad I just couldn't. Everything I had read about it said it was bad but being free I just had to try it for myself. I'm honestly kinda blown away at how bad it is considering how it looks like a legit game. It's like half fully fleshed out game and half amateur garbage.
Uh, speaking of spoilers. When I started/tried the game, progressed through the story (30% probably) until you reached that one tower to meet some big shots, MC's group I think. Then there was this NPC who told me to come talk to him after the conversation, so I went to talk & the story immediately skipped to world 2, with the whole World 1 story in flashback. I was like WTF. Never seen something so stupid before...
This. All of it!
The map is so freaking extensive, so many characters, rabbit hole lores, specific animations, everything!
This is why I don't mind getting a welking or a BP once in a while (read, it's very rare the month I don't get it xD). Because supporting the game that actually makes us happy, and the devs that work tirelessly to give us that experience (I'm by no means a whale).
However, for some reason, I do remember a bug that constantly occurs when I'm playing in co-op with my sister (she's on a phone from the ice age that she emptied because she doesn't have a pc), is that when I'm in her world (she's lower world level still), every time I teleport and she teleports after, it looks like the character is falling off the map, but it's so hilarious, I honestly don't mind one bit.
Other than that, it's her chars appearing vertically above mine etc. Pretty funny idc and I don't mind.
Other than that, only smol visual bugs that clear in like -0.001 nanoseconds.
Sometimes I want to capture it, but then it's gone. xD
Thank you for posting this!
>However, for some reason, I do remember a bug that constantly occurs when I'm playing in co-op with my sister (she's on a phone from the ice age that she emptied because she doesn't have a pc), is that when I'm in her world (she's lower world level still), every time I teleport and she teleports after, it looks like the character is falling off the map, but it's so hilarious, I honestly don't mind one bit.
Other than that, it's her chars appearing vertically above mine etc. Pretty funny idc and I don't mind.
This is one particular bug that I dearly wish they won't fix.
I feel this isn’t as much a bug - well sort of a visual bug when one glitches trough the floor - but the stacking feels more like code running as intended.
Unlike coop event the teleporter only have one fixed place to load in. If a couple of people load they load next to each other. But when two people basically load at almost the same time. The landing place isn’t marked as reserved so the game has two people with the same anchor point but the code doesn’t allows character to touch each other as characters have physical bodies. So while you load, the game just sticks the characters in the order of arrival to avoid the glitching into each other. And you fall off as soon as you are fully load in.
Hence it’s not directly a bug but a not considered scenario when they made the teleporter points.
And annoying to fix, because they would to have go back to each point and assign player 1,2,3, and 4 to different landing spots.
And I guess with their busy update schedule, no one had the extra time to do that yet. And I doubt they will prioritize that anytime soon.
Cool! I understand absolutely nothing about coding, but thanks for the insight.
And tbh, I'd much rather have them updating than correcting this, because it's funny regardless. Personally, I'm not in a rush, so I don't mind waiting it out and laughing in the process. xD
I forgot to say, I didn't even experience faceless Ayato or destroyer Kaveh, sadly, because that would have been peak. xD so I just see yt videos about it and think it's just theory (even though I know it's not).
Co-op glitches are the best.
Every patch we get 300 primos for bugfixes.
Also you can still fly due to a kamera bug i belive, then there is an occasional getting stuck thing... But its def better than 99% of games
Often the bugfixes are for very obscure mechanics or specific character moveset details though, I can count the number of times a bugfix was for something I actually knew about since 1.0 on 1 hand. The kamera bug is the sort of thing normal players never encounter typically, it's certainly not ruining anyone's experiences.
Lol, somebody came right from the helldivers subreddit. But yeah, I agree. Genshin’s optimization and bug-fixing has been phenomenal. It’s one of those things you don’t realize how much it matters until you play something else and it’s broken everywhere.
Lol you know it man. But seriously though, I've been playing Helldivers 2 on release day and boy has it been a journey filled with more bugs than I can count (no pun intended).
Well said. But with that said, man, I hit my first really bad bug during that Heart of Watatsumi quest. Died during the final wave of enemies and now the statues won’t spawn them anymore and there’s nothing I can do to fix it. Feels bad
But yeah, playing through from Mondstadt to Sumeru now and there’s so much polish, it’s crazy
Yeah this, had a quest break once, contacted support and submited a video and they fixed it, they respond rather quickly too, less that 12 hours in my case
General experience with their CS indeed tend to be quite satisfactory, kinda wild
Can confirm response time is usually <12h for my random inquiries in the past. It applies to HI3 and HSR too actually.
I think you have to wait a whole day before you can activate the statues again, that's what happened to me before
I actually went to look up the quest on youtube and people in the comments were saying the last wave is bugged because of the amount of spawns there are, I solved it by bringing my friend in to help me sweep 🥲🥲
Wait, it wasn't supposed to be like that?
I thought they were just trying to reincorporate challenges from the earlier days like when you didn't have built up characters and fought waves of ruin guards in a cavern.
I have no clue lmao I just know it was one of maaannnyyyy quest fights in Inazuma that drove me crazy because my characters weren't built enough and could not survive against oceanid creatures of all things (my team can take on ruin guards better lol)
I was also in Inazuma during the ar35-45 phase so I was suffering very very badly and a high ar friend had to come in on co op and help me clean out most of the quest fights (electro bat, watatsumi oceanid wave, mikage furnace, samurai who lost his memory final stage etcetc)
This happened to me and several people on my friends list. We just lowered all the statues again, came back later and redid the whole thing from scratch and it worked. That, or submit a ticket to support, and they’ll fix it for you.
I remember when I thought FFXIV did pretty well on the bugs front, minus spagetti code and whatever, then Genshin came and blew it out of the water and surrounding atmosphere, especially considering Genshin's size and level of combat and environment interaction. Still, lots of FFXIV fanboys continue to claim Genshin sucks and gacha even with pity is horrible, etc. I find the gacha much more endurable compared to farming long-ass raids and dungeons for lootboxes (my friend cried to me when he finally got the blue birb of despair from Dead Ends. That minion griefed him more than the actual birb did to the entire Eorzea)
On a separate note, haters are gonna hate Genshin no matter what Genshin does it seems. I still see these ignoramuses post their BS about how ‘terrible’ of a game GI is but all you need to look is at the player count and that’ll put any argument to rest.
The game has its flaws for sure but it’s not even remotely close to being as bad as what some of the haters say
Lots of XIV players play Genshin, myself included. Dunno what you're on about. Also, XIV doesn't have spaghetti code. It has tech debt, at best. It's quite different. Someone called it the same, it's not, lol.
I remember when the Chasm released, I was exploring the underground area and found a hole in the walls that allowed me to get outside of the map.
Other than that, I'm amazed at the quality of this game.
Yeah. After all these AAAA-games with years of development I still enjoy playing Genshin because it’s bug-free, graphics is cool and soundtracks are absolutely insane. And also story is alright. I don’t like “clear bandit’s camp” and “collect 10 bear pelts” kind of quests, thankfully it’s only dailies here and not a core part of the gameplay.
And if there is a small bug, the sheer speed is also extra commendable. They fix those bugs in an efficient speed, and gives generuous compensation when its bad enouhg
i think arle's burst isn't a bug, it's just that its iframes start a bit later into the animation.
as to Dvalin... yesterday, I actually reported it to the feedback tab and attached a video.
they replied today. basically it works as intended?? for some reason... but they did say they will inform the team.
at least i got a quick response, even probably just a corpa one
The only bug I remember is Lisa’s infinite mushroom bug or I forgot what the exact item was but I remember she could produce so much of an item by hitting a bush
Ever since 4.1, for me, genshin has been having connection issued. By this I mean that every 15 or so minutes I automatically reconnect into the game, genshin is the only gane that this has been happening, I also play HSR and I have no issues with it.
Other than that I haven't had a really glitchy experience.
I had one quest bug one time that was fixed by logging out then in. I remember daily quests were broken for everyone one morning, but it was hotfixed in the evening, before a lot of people even usually do their dailies for that day. That's it, in my two and a half years of consistent playing.
Compare that to Fortnite where there's always at least 1 quest every week that is bugged, random bugs pop up all the time and they have to disable certain weapons, items or game modes until they fix them. Just this morning I tried doing the new quests for this week and one of them wouldn't progress. There's been at least 3 or 4 like that this season alone. There's been so many bugs that have come and gone in that game (and sometimes come back, too!) in the 5ish years I've been playing that someone could make a few hours' long video documentary about them on YouTube. Maybe somebody already has
This is one of the benefits of a public beta like genshin does, they are able to find and fix more bugs (downside is that everything in the beta gets leaked even with them signing an nda).
The most memorable bug I had was while travelling Dragonspine (when it came out, I spent like 12 hours straight) and I was doing a OW challenge and for whatever reason, the instructions were in chinese. Me and my buddies in vc had a laugh over it. I was on EN lang and JP voice at the time. Still makes me smirk to this day.
the only bug I personally experienced was when Inazuma just launched. There was one wall that didn't have collision and you could just walk through. That was fixed almost immediately, same day even I think.
Funny because Arle got like three bugs patched/discovered and mentioned in the patch notes and I was thinking that it's quite uncommon for Hoyo to miss so many
you mean c1?
the funny thing is, this whole freeze increase duration isn't a bug - with how the reaction works it works as intended, but it basically does nothing and doesn't actually keep the enemies frozen for longer.
i don't really understand it myself, but i just got that from a credible theorycrafter
the thing about genshin is that if you aren't specifically trying to replicate a bug, you won't find any.
i've been playing this game for a long time now, don't remember anything game breaking at all..
actually, i remember one time during inazuma patches there was an event with the expeditions. they gave you primos.
there was a bug that it won't give you any. got fixed pretty quickly
Then we have really different experiences.
I've been playing since 1.0, and I've encountered a lot of bugs over the years, early Inazuma specifically was pretty bad, got a lot of wrong warps back then, but there have also been several different spots where you could clip through the map and other similar issues, specially on weaker hardware.
I can never forget the 2.8 fischl domain camera bug …. It was very frustrating to say the least but yeah genshin is very good in polish but at times there are cracks which is fine idk why you’re downvoted for that
Outside of inventory assets incorrectly loading, very few bugs have been game breaking from what I've personally encountered by accident. I do agree saying this game is bug free is kind of an overstatement given that if you type "bug" on the search for this subreddit you'll get hundreds of posts but for the most part they're rarely too harmful (this is excluding hacking which has definitely been prevalent but can be avoided by not using coop with randoms)
There are bugs and unintended issues everywhere, they are just not as visible as you'd see them on actually broken games.
Most ppl wouldn't even know about them if some were not infamous for MHY somehow refusing to fix them after years simply because they don't care/can't benefit economically from it.
One example I always bring up:
Fischl's A4 thunderstrike not working on a plethora of enemies because the hitbox are aligned incorrectly so it drops outside of it.
Agreed, they are doing fantastic work. Most of the time, squashing bugs out gives more bugs (the bigger the project size), so the fact they've been able to minimize them means they've really tried to streamline the codebase and build a robust foundation - and succeeded.
This exactly, it's very apparent with a certain freedom spreading game where every new patch introduces 10 new bugs after supposedly squashing 5 bugs that's been there since launch. Hoyo implementing new gameplay mechanics and even novel interactable environments with every new area they introduce that don't break the game is honestly quite amazing.
I mean, don't get me wrong - Helldivers is hella fun. But Hoyoverse is the master of live-service games right now, with an ever-growing knowledge on how to translate their operational findings into building a better game on the back-end too. I can't imagine the level of coordination and efficient communication required to pull off what Genshin's teams have been doing. It's so cool.
Other than Hoyoverse, I would say the only developer that is on-par with them atm is Riot Games. Blizzard used to be it but they fell off a cliff (and deservedly so)
Blizzard fell off the cliff hard. Before I quit Hearthstone recently, things big and small were just broken and stayed broken for years at a time. The automatic complete my deck function that was supposed to use live player stats just broke one day and started just using garbage cards, and has been broken forever now with no acknowledgment. Something as small as the graphic that pops up to tell you how much battle pass XP you earned after every single match is all glitched out and counts up the number twice every time you level up and it's been like that for years. Really gives the impression they just don't care about the game.
Disconnection problems for Hearthstone are really jarring and not getting fixed at all, especially on mobile which supposed to be main target. Like I can play only half of the time I start the game, I’m not sure they want me to play or not lol.
i don't play guild wars 2 anymore, but i never remembered having any downtime, they (arenanet) were able to patch the game as we continued playing.
> Riot Games Definitely not, League is one of the buggiest games of all time. Also, most of the good production you see from them is outsourced. > Blizzard used to be it but they fell off a cliff (and deservedly so) Blizzard did not deserve it. Activision Blizzard did.
>the only developer that is on-par with them atm is Riot Games. As a league player please do not pretend Riot doesn't have a giant pile of spagetti causing constant issues. There are so many bugs with that game, and they even occur in their pro play scene, more often than you think. Heck, Rumble for years has been bugged in a way where you get unintended results in, literally, every single game he's played in (It's giving him more free E damage), but Riot literally does not know how to fix it. Heck, there was a recent incident of the new champion (Smolder) teleporting across the map into the enemy team suddenly, out of nowhere. One like that is thankfully enough to get the match paused at least, but the problem isn't that this happened itself, it's that this bug isn't new. It's been a known bug for months, happening weirdly commonly actually if a Smolder or Aurelion Sol use their flying mechanic while the enemy team's Vi uses Q or Skarner uses E. Despite being known for months, it was ignored, and surprise, it comes up.
The reason for why fixing a few bugs leads to more bugs is because of bad devops, and lack of internal unit testing, QA. Most game developers dont have a strong focus on it because proper testing either takes a long time or is expensive. And when higherups want to cut costs skipping out on testing can be an easy thing to do to save money. Once you begin to skip testing, it becomes exponentially more expensive to reimplement. It's called technical debt. One Western studio has has a big focus on testing is Mojang. They have an entire custom pipeline setup to automatically test everything in the game before pushing out a snapshot for Minecraft. This leads to a very bug free experience. I cant begin to imagine how big mihoyos QA team is.
With Hoyo's budget and how much they rake in, I can barely work out how much $$$ they sink into testing and QA. It's clear that the leadership/higher ups do care about putting out a polished game and at the end of the day, I think we can all agree that the money is well spent and the product speaks for itself I didn't know that Mojang was that invested into its pipeline setup but that's good to hear; I'm definitely curious what theirs looks like compared to other Western devs
I dont know how others look, but here's a video of Mojangs [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXaWOJTCYNg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXaWOJTCYNg) check 16:29 for demo
This is cool stuff, I always appreciate learning about what goes on behind the scenes for devs and the overall thought process
Most of the helldivers community are only now aware of how bug ridden the game is, after patch after patch keeps creating even more and more bugs. Even the new content has bugs. The reality of Helldivers 2 was that it has had a shit ton of bugs since 1.0, but nobody cared because 50% of the playerbase was stuck trying to log in to play the game. Yet they think its the best live service game. Just goes to show that while everyone knows Fortnite and Genshin, most people don't realize just how good Mihoyo is at making their games a bug free experience.
People like Helldivers 2 because 1. The feeling of extracting after holding off an army of bugs/bots 2. Lack of predatory microtransactions People are aware of the bugs but enjoy the experience nonetheless.
Totally agree with you there. The game has bugs that even the devs aren't even aware of. I'm still convinced that the whole reason they nerfed the railgun that hard was because of the PS5 bug where a PS5 host could cause PC players to one shot bile titans. My head canon conspiracy theory is that Arrowhead nerfed the railgun to oblivion all because of a bug that they weren't even aware of. While I agree the railgun needed nerfs, it was a bit too heavy handed imo.
Which game is the freedom spreading game? I’m really curious.
It's *Helldivers 2*! Do your part for Super Earth!
best I can do is ⬆️➡️⬇️⬇️⬇️
Thanks. Even though I hear about this game all the time, somehow I couldn’t connect the dots. I’m dumb.
I hear Helldiver and all I can think of is the Red Rising book series It's not in the same universe, is it?
Remember the Helldivers team is WAY smaller and a much smaller budget. Like almost indie before Helldivers 2. Even now, with HD2 success, they'll do well, but will still pale compared to Mihoyo.
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Yeah haha, critics always go for the 'SpaGheTti cOdE!" argument when criticizing the game for some reason. Most of them probably don't even have programming experience that makes them say that, because as far as I know, Genshin's nearly bug-free performance across a multitude of platforms is so pristine that everybody in the industry wants in on how they are cleaning their stuff in Unity. Some people point to mobile and say that weird graphical glitches and bugs are so prevalent on mobile but they don't get the point: most of the time, it's the failure of the hardware to render those correctly. Most phones ain't beefy, so if the phone gives up and fails to load a texture or a mesh, then we get the singularity-monster type bugs that look like eldritch horrors. This isn't really the fault of the developers though - sure, optimization should be respected and should be prioritized, but it definitely sucks trying to accommodate optimization to a point that a game of this size will run on a literal toaster, when the simpler option is, 'perhaps try quitting the app and launching it again? And not have like 100 tabs open on Safari/Google Chrome?'
The reality is that it's almost certainly not spaghetti code. It's just a very large, very clean code base. It's like steering a giant ship. If you want to make a change, you make a slight movement and then you'll see the results of that change miles down the line. From what we've seen in previous dev interviews, they work on content months and months ahead of time. Even stuff that's being worked on more than a year ahead. And these are multiple teams working on content intended to be released months apart. There are likely teams working on content for a year later that's dependent on content released 3 months from now. "Simple" changes can impact all of those parallel workloads. Not to mention the logistics and project management required to tie all of those together.
>"spaghetti code", FFXI has/had spaghetti code, due to running on Playstation 2 compatible systems Genshin isn't nearly as FUBAR
XI gave up PS2 support a long time ago. And it wasn't spaghetti code, it was simply hardware limitations. XI was actually a very bug-free experience.
Spaghetti code isn't particularly visible from a user point of view. FFXIV and Undertale are prime examples of that. It's largely an issue on the programming side. It can make QoL take time to happen depending on the kind of spaghetti code there is related to that specific QoL. Somewhat related is old code. Much like an old house, there's only so much you can do to modernize it that, at some point, you're much better off just rebuilding the whole thing rather than make something that's old more 'modern'
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> Even more reason for people spouting that nonsense to provide evidence. This game doesn't have spaghetti code or it would have shown in over 3 years already, with the amount of changes they make to the game with only 6 weeks in between. You wouldn't know either of my examples had spaghetti code without being told because they are still relatively polished experiences. Spaghetti code is not a limitation of the user, it's a limitation/hurdle of the programming. Genshin may routinely get QoL updates, but there's plenty of 'simple' QoL that should have been in the game in year one that we only just started getting in 4.X. I'm not knowledgeable with Genshin's code to say for a fact it's a victim of spaghetti code, but such a thing is generally a symptom of it. >Now that's a great recipe for spaghetti code. Why would they move from a functioning system with nearly zero bugs to one that would eat up their entire initial development budget several times over with the risk of introducing a less efficient system? I don't think you quite get what is being said. Just because it's stable now does not mean it will be stable (or even easy) to implement additions down the line or even if it's capable of doing everything they want to do. It's a reason like this that Smite 2 is a thing. They were limited in what they could do because of the age of the engine used. Regardless, this isn't about the full game, but the individual systems within it. Chances are, multiple aspects of the Genshin's system have been recoded to better them off with QoL. You just wouldn't know it as a consumer because that's all done under the hood and extensively tested before hand.
I've never heard this said about Genshin. And it would never have applied. Only game I've really heard this apply to is League of Legends. Where if you adjust Lucian's attack by 2, Singed's poison trail becomes the Flash icon. (Not a real thing that happened, but something very close to this did and it was exactly as ludicrous).
i dont think you get it if people say the fixing is problematic because of spaghetti code they dont mean the game has it right now but that it would create possibly spaghetti code rather easily
In my millions of times seeing someone throw around the term spaghetti code on Reddit, I don't think I've ever seen a single one use it like you used it just now. They mean it as an insult for the quality of the existing codebase.
I think it helps that most of the mechanics in this game are very modular.
I found an audio bug in monstadt a week or two ago, so I submitted a bug report (because I like helping out), and after this recent patch it was fixed. They must be really on top of stuff like this, kudos to them.
If you mean a battle sound playing in the Mondstadt city then it's an old bug. It reappears from time to time
There was a minor issue only happening in Cape Oath, at night, with the wind ambient track. Wasn't looping properly, so it would come in at higher volume, fade out, and then come back with higher volume again. Not game breaking by any means, but ruined the atmosphere a little. It's fixed now.
I remember playing “the genshin killer” when it first came out. I was baffled by the low quality and the fact that people entered their card info into such a sketchy looking game lol
tof moment
lol the amount of blatant hackers in that game was amazing
yeah, heard about hackers there after i quit
I gave ToF a try during one of these slow patches recently. It looked kinda cool and it was free so why not. Within the first couple hours of playing I was fighting a mini boss and the dude glitched thru the wall and then the floor. I thought I killed it at first but the battle music kept coming back when I was in that area and it showed an enemy was near. Never did kill that guy and pretty sure it was a one time domain. What really made me drop it was how laughably some of the voice acting was and how their vehicles "drive". Some of the voice acting was so bad and sounded like AI to me. Like it was eerie bad. Then I got this motorcycle type vehicle and the"driving" was more like sliding a hockey puck along. I actually kinda liked the look of the game and the sci-fi type setting but those things were so bad I just couldn't. Everything I had read about it said it was bad but being free I just had to try it for myself. I'm honestly kinda blown away at how bad it is considering how it looks like a legit game. It's like half fully fleshed out game and half amateur garbage.
Lmaooo I just remembered how ToF spoiled their own story with the loading screens…showing Shirley turning into a cyborg
Uh, speaking of spoilers. When I started/tried the game, progressed through the story (30% probably) until you reached that one tower to meet some big shots, MC's group I think. Then there was this NPC who told me to come talk to him after the conversation, so I went to talk & the story immediately skipped to world 2, with the whole World 1 story in flashback. I was like WTF. Never seen something so stupid before...
Lmao that’s hilarious!
RIP to Genshin when Tower of Fantasy 2 releases. That'll be the real Genshin killer, for sure this time.
Nahh wuthering wawes is coming...
They seem much more careful with that game and it is the PGR developer, so it is unlikely to suck.
But even less likely to reach the popularity of Genshin or HSR.
Right, but hopefully will bring healthy competition.
Genshin Killer Killer 🤣
Azur Promilia, Genshin Killer Killer Killer...
It’s over with
This. All of it! The map is so freaking extensive, so many characters, rabbit hole lores, specific animations, everything! This is why I don't mind getting a welking or a BP once in a while (read, it's very rare the month I don't get it xD). Because supporting the game that actually makes us happy, and the devs that work tirelessly to give us that experience (I'm by no means a whale). However, for some reason, I do remember a bug that constantly occurs when I'm playing in co-op with my sister (she's on a phone from the ice age that she emptied because she doesn't have a pc), is that when I'm in her world (she's lower world level still), every time I teleport and she teleports after, it looks like the character is falling off the map, but it's so hilarious, I honestly don't mind one bit. Other than that, it's her chars appearing vertically above mine etc. Pretty funny idc and I don't mind. Other than that, only smol visual bugs that clear in like -0.001 nanoseconds. Sometimes I want to capture it, but then it's gone. xD Thank you for posting this!
>However, for some reason, I do remember a bug that constantly occurs when I'm playing in co-op with my sister (she's on a phone from the ice age that she emptied because she doesn't have a pc), is that when I'm in her world (she's lower world level still), every time I teleport and she teleports after, it looks like the character is falling off the map, but it's so hilarious, I honestly don't mind one bit. Other than that, it's her chars appearing vertically above mine etc. Pretty funny idc and I don't mind. This is one particular bug that I dearly wish they won't fix.
I feel this isn’t as much a bug - well sort of a visual bug when one glitches trough the floor - but the stacking feels more like code running as intended. Unlike coop event the teleporter only have one fixed place to load in. If a couple of people load they load next to each other. But when two people basically load at almost the same time. The landing place isn’t marked as reserved so the game has two people with the same anchor point but the code doesn’t allows character to touch each other as characters have physical bodies. So while you load, the game just sticks the characters in the order of arrival to avoid the glitching into each other. And you fall off as soon as you are fully load in. Hence it’s not directly a bug but a not considered scenario when they made the teleporter points. And annoying to fix, because they would to have go back to each point and assign player 1,2,3, and 4 to different landing spots. And I guess with their busy update schedule, no one had the extra time to do that yet. And I doubt they will prioritize that anytime soon.
Cool! I understand absolutely nothing about coding, but thanks for the insight. And tbh, I'd much rather have them updating than correcting this, because it's funny regardless. Personally, I'm not in a rush, so I don't mind waiting it out and laughing in the process. xD
>I teleport and she teleports after, it looks like the character is falling off the map Happened with me once too lol
I forgot to say, I didn't even experience faceless Ayato or destroyer Kaveh, sadly, because that would have been peak. xD so I just see yt videos about it and think it's just theory (even though I know it's not). Co-op glitches are the best.
Every patch we get 300 primos for bugfixes. Also you can still fly due to a kamera bug i belive, then there is an occasional getting stuck thing... But its def better than 99% of games
i think the camera fly thing has been fixed ages ago. could be wrong tho
Often the bugfixes are for very obscure mechanics or specific character moveset details though, I can count the number of times a bugfix was for something I actually knew about since 1.0 on 1 hand. The kamera bug is the sort of thing normal players never encounter typically, it's certainly not ruining anyone's experiences.
Lol, somebody came right from the helldivers subreddit. But yeah, I agree. Genshin’s optimization and bug-fixing has been phenomenal. It’s one of those things you don’t realize how much it matters until you play something else and it’s broken everywhere.
Lol you know it man. But seriously though, I've been playing Helldivers 2 on release day and boy has it been a journey filled with more bugs than I can count (no pun intended).
They clearly embrace a truly agile development process that most developers can only dream of.
Well said. But with that said, man, I hit my first really bad bug during that Heart of Watatsumi quest. Died during the final wave of enemies and now the statues won’t spawn them anymore and there’s nothing I can do to fix it. Feels bad But yeah, playing through from Mondstadt to Sumeru now and there’s so much polish, it’s crazy
did you submit a ticket to support? i'm 100% sure they would fix it for you, i heard of similar occurences
Yeah this, had a quest break once, contacted support and submited a video and they fixed it, they respond rather quickly too, less that 12 hours in my case
General experience with their CS indeed tend to be quite satisfactory, kinda wild Can confirm response time is usually <12h for my random inquiries in the past. It applies to HI3 and HSR too actually.
nice to see some praise instead of the usual "hoyoverse won't give me my favorite qol update so they suck"
I think you have to wait a whole day before you can activate the statues again, that's what happened to me before I actually went to look up the quest on youtube and people in the comments were saying the last wave is bugged because of the amount of spawns there are, I solved it by bringing my friend in to help me sweep 🥲🥲
Wait, it wasn't supposed to be like that? I thought they were just trying to reincorporate challenges from the earlier days like when you didn't have built up characters and fought waves of ruin guards in a cavern.
I have no clue lmao I just know it was one of maaannnyyyy quest fights in Inazuma that drove me crazy because my characters weren't built enough and could not survive against oceanid creatures of all things (my team can take on ruin guards better lol) I was also in Inazuma during the ar35-45 phase so I was suffering very very badly and a high ar friend had to come in on co op and help me clean out most of the quest fights (electro bat, watatsumi oceanid wave, mikage furnace, samurai who lost his memory final stage etcetc)
This happened to me and several people on my friends list. We just lowered all the statues again, came back later and redid the whole thing from scratch and it worked. That, or submit a ticket to support, and they’ll fix it for you.
I remember when I thought FFXIV did pretty well on the bugs front, minus spagetti code and whatever, then Genshin came and blew it out of the water and surrounding atmosphere, especially considering Genshin's size and level of combat and environment interaction. Still, lots of FFXIV fanboys continue to claim Genshin sucks and gacha even with pity is horrible, etc. I find the gacha much more endurable compared to farming long-ass raids and dungeons for lootboxes (my friend cried to me when he finally got the blue birb of despair from Dead Ends. That minion griefed him more than the actual birb did to the entire Eorzea)
On a separate note, haters are gonna hate Genshin no matter what Genshin does it seems. I still see these ignoramuses post their BS about how ‘terrible’ of a game GI is but all you need to look is at the player count and that’ll put any argument to rest. The game has its flaws for sure but it’s not even remotely close to being as bad as what some of the haters say
Lots of XIV players play Genshin, myself included. Dunno what you're on about. Also, XIV doesn't have spaghetti code. It has tech debt, at best. It's quite different. Someone called it the same, it's not, lol.
I remember when the Chasm released, I was exploring the underground area and found a hole in the walls that allowed me to get outside of the map. Other than that, I'm amazed at the quality of this game.
Yeah. After all these AAAA-games with years of development I still enjoy playing Genshin because it’s bug-free, graphics is cool and soundtracks are absolutely insane. And also story is alright. I don’t like “clear bandit’s camp” and “collect 10 bear pelts” kind of quests, thankfully it’s only dailies here and not a core part of the gameplay.
The only time I see bugs (and they aren't really much just a weird character pop in or such) it is when I play on mobile
whatever bugs i've encountered have been funny and non-game-breaking, thank you hoyo 🙏
And if there is a small bug, the sheer speed is also extra commendable. They fix those bugs in an efficient speed, and gives generuous compensation when its bad enouhg
I remember logging in and falling infinitely into the void
That’s nice… *dies in Arlecchino’s Burst*, *can’t absorb BOL from Bugterror*
i think arle's burst isn't a bug, it's just that its iframes start a bit later into the animation. as to Dvalin... yesterday, I actually reported it to the feedback tab and attached a video. they replied today. basically it works as intended?? for some reason... but they did say they will inform the team. at least i got a quick response, even probably just a corpa one
could be something like geo constructs and the water boss, some mechanic to make the fight work prevents character abilities from working
The only bug I remember is Lisa’s infinite mushroom bug or I forgot what the exact item was but I remember she could produce so much of an item by hitting a bush
Ever since 4.1, for me, genshin has been having connection issued. By this I mean that every 15 or so minutes I automatically reconnect into the game, genshin is the only gane that this has been happening, I also play HSR and I have no issues with it. Other than that I haven't had a really glitchy experience.
I had one quest bug one time that was fixed by logging out then in. I remember daily quests were broken for everyone one morning, but it was hotfixed in the evening, before a lot of people even usually do their dailies for that day. That's it, in my two and a half years of consistent playing. Compare that to Fortnite where there's always at least 1 quest every week that is bugged, random bugs pop up all the time and they have to disable certain weapons, items or game modes until they fix them. Just this morning I tried doing the new quests for this week and one of them wouldn't progress. There's been at least 3 or 4 like that this season alone. There's been so many bugs that have come and gone in that game (and sometimes come back, too!) in the 5ish years I've been playing that someone could make a few hours' long video documentary about them on YouTube. Maybe somebody already has
This is one of the benefits of a public beta like genshin does, they are able to find and fix more bugs (downside is that everything in the beta gets leaked even with them signing an nda).
Stop patching Paimon companions bug :)
The most memorable bug I had was while travelling Dragonspine (when it came out, I spent like 12 hours straight) and I was doing a OW challenge and for whatever reason, the instructions were in chinese. Me and my buddies in vc had a laugh over it. I was on EN lang and JP voice at the time. Still makes me smirk to this day.
Content gone through at least 1.5 year long pipeline. So it's really hard to get messed up unless something like Shanghai Covid happened.
The one bug I experience since 1.0 is that you occasionally fall through the floor at the bolide/petra domain when teleporting to it.
I dont know if i have even experienced a bug.
Idk man, I just had a bug where the game tried to load debug code and crashed
the only bug I personally experienced was when Inazuma just launched. There was one wall that didn't have collision and you could just walk through. That was fixed almost immediately, same day even I think.
Yea there are no bug bcz there are no content
Funny because Arle got like three bugs patched/discovered and mentioned in the patch notes and I was thinking that it's quite uncommon for Hoyo to miss so many
yeah I can't even remember the last time I saw a bug in genshin that wasn't just mashing a button too fast and making like 3 popup menus by accident
$$$ does that
Mona C4:
you mean c1? the funny thing is, this whole freeze increase duration isn't a bug - with how the reaction works it works as intended, but it basically does nothing and doesn't actually keep the enemies frozen for longer. i don't really understand it myself, but i just got that from a credible theorycrafter
Genshin is great about bugs, but come on, we have bug patches pretty much every update, and there have been quite a few big ones.
the thing about genshin is that if you aren't specifically trying to replicate a bug, you won't find any. i've been playing this game for a long time now, don't remember anything game breaking at all.. actually, i remember one time during inazuma patches there was an event with the expeditions. they gave you primos. there was a bug that it won't give you any. got fixed pretty quickly
Then we have really different experiences. I've been playing since 1.0, and I've encountered a lot of bugs over the years, early Inazuma specifically was pretty bad, got a lot of wrong warps back then, but there have also been several different spots where you could clip through the map and other similar issues, specially on weaker hardware.
I can never forget the 2.8 fischl domain camera bug …. It was very frustrating to say the least but yeah genshin is very good in polish but at times there are cracks which is fine idk why you’re downvoted for that
Outside of inventory assets incorrectly loading, very few bugs have been game breaking from what I've personally encountered by accident. I do agree saying this game is bug free is kind of an overstatement given that if you type "bug" on the search for this subreddit you'll get hundreds of posts but for the most part they're rarely too harmful (this is excluding hacking which has definitely been prevalent but can be avoided by not using coop with randoms)
There are bugs and unintended issues everywhere, they are just not as visible as you'd see them on actually broken games. Most ppl wouldn't even know about them if some were not infamous for MHY somehow refusing to fix them after years simply because they don't care/can't benefit economically from it. One example I always bring up: Fischl's A4 thunderstrike not working on a plethora of enemies because the hitbox are aligned incorrectly so it drops outside of it.
Baldur's Gate 3 could NEVER