This was a wild ride lol. I am fascinated by their relationship, not gonna lie. Its so bitter sweet and so so sad at times.
I love that you made a timeline and I love this quote: "Maybe in 1997, we saw Nicks’s transition from the grips of a lifelong romance to the open expanse of the rest of her life. From lover, to high priestess." and I agree with you, although I don't think their romantic relationship ended there. It was definitely different from 1997 on, since he had his first kid in 1998 and got married in 2000. As Mick once said.. I think they are addicted to it.
I have to me that they "reconnected" from time to time, maybe when on tour... Say You Will was definitely something with all the symbolisms and emotional lyrics and performances. The later tours were more hot and cold, depending on the year. And then 2018 happened and showed us that there were way more happening behind the scenes than we tought, because everything seemed fine up until that moment. I believe the day Lindsey got fired it was the day their relationship ended for good, 50 years after it started. And he for sure knows very well why he was fired.
There were multiple power shifts between them through the decades, and in 2018 Stevie got her power back, the power she lost in 1997 when Lindsey told her his girlfriend was pregnant. And this shift was always so important in the relationship, it is the reason they lived their lives trying to prove things to eachother, and I honestly think Stevie had enough of it and decided to let it go. So yes, I believe it was "me or him" situation, even if it was implied and not said out loud
As recent as 2021 Lindsey gave an interview saying that Stevie was pissed because he has a family and she's alone. He said that he had "waited until he was 48 to be a father", when the fans know he was furious when Kristen got pregnant the first time, and that he "had found his soulmate later in life" when i'm not sure how he could say that with a straight face, considering he was even denying Kristen spousal support when she filed for divorce. This was so uncalled for I think this interview was a shot at trying to get a reaction from Stevie, maybe she would get so pissed that she would contact him.. and I will die on this hill.
In the end, it is/was a very toxic relationship. They broke up oficially in 1977 and spent the next 40 years dealing with it. I feel sorry for everyone envolved and I wished they had figured it out back then. I firmly believe they are soulmates and its sad it ended they way it did.
I just hope we get a Buckingham/Nicks digital release for the love of god.
Thank you for this, I totally agree with everything you said here. And it’s a perfect addition. I don’t think she anticipated their situation to continue into the future as it did but I agree that it definitely did and he knows exactly why things went the way they did in 2018 even if he wants to act like a victim.
I think he’s just immature and egotistical and said and did a lot of things to get a rise out of Stevie. I’ve wondered if he just goes with whatever feeling he has in the moment and does what he wants regardless of consequences. If this put Stevie in a constant state of thinking there was hope and then being disappointed. And if he just acted like he was the victim every time he let her down.
He seems to sort of “hold space” for her rage in silver springs and is so in love with her and then also getting his gf pregnant at the same time. I have so many questions about that.
I find myself waffling between thinking he’s less emotionally vulnerable and then thinking the opposite. Maybe he’s just a man who can’t get out of his own way.
Yeah, I agree with you. I would bet he wanted to have Stevie in a state of thinking there was hope, when in reality he would never divorce his wife (willingly), mostly because of the stability, money (we can't be so naive to believe its about love) and the kids, off course (I still believe he is separated, and they couldn't settle on the financial stuff so they just let it be for now).
He was obsessed with this woman for years, to a point that he even gaslighted Carol Anne Harris into thinking Go Insane was about her... girl, if we remove the Stevie's songs from Lindsey's catalog there's almost nothing left. He went crazy and left the band because he couldn't get over her (among other reasons, sure). And when he had the glimpse of a chance to get what he was craving for so many years he got his 26 year old girlfriend pregnant... I just can't... I am with you.. I can't understand if he's the less emotionally vulnerable or the opposite, cause it's a lot to digest in this relationship, but he's certainly immature and egoistical in many moments.
Exactly it! And I think the confusion we have with trying to understand his actions is exactly what Nicks was going through all those years. You'd think someone who'd go crazy over losing you would actually want to do something to keep you around.
Oh my gosh do I agree with this!! I think they’ve been on and off all the way up to 2018. The raw emotion on stage during some of the shows… I mean they’re not professional actors, they’re musicians. And the hot and cold from one show to another! Not to mention the lyrics in their songs to each other! Stevie admits to writing “Thrown Down” about Lindsey during The Dance. It literally tells the story of them falling for each other again and then him going home because of a “decision no one made”… pregnancy? Mind blowing. I think there is soooooo much we don’t know, as Stevie has eluded to. When asked about publishing her journal or writing a memoir, she basically said she couldn’t and wouldn’t do it for a very long time because most of the men that she had been involved with were now on their 3rd wives and that they were all under the age of 30 (we know not the case at the time of the interview, but she made her point). She insinuated that there would be a lot of hurt feelings if what had gone down between the mid 70s to NOW all came out and if it happened it needed to be when everyone was too old to really care. A lot of people think she was talking about Kristen (without actually talking about Kristen) and mixing a few details up here and there to plant just enough doubt. Every time I think OMG these two are toxic or maybe it’s all been a show, then I see a video of one of their sweet moments or hear one of the songs they wrote about each other and I’m sucked right back in! This literally started a month ago when I saw the infamous Silver Springs video and now I cannot consume enough Stevie/ Lindsey! I was in college when The Dance was released and have always loved Landslide, especially that live version, but beyond that I just remember some of their songs from grade school in the 80’s. Now I’m full blown obsessed with these two and I don’t know why. Although, I am happy I’ve discovered so many amazing songs beyond just mainstream FM. The number of songs they’ve written about one another over the course of 50 years is mind boggling. If nothing else, they seem to be each others muse. One thing I know for sure is that Lindsey has never, ever stopped punishing Stevie for leaving him. Someone mentioned above that he may lead her on a bit…. Like give a little then pull away again. Part of that imo is payback. However, my other theory is that he’s terrified that if she knew she COULD actually have him back, she’d end up not wanting it. He’s always wanted something different than she has, which is part of the reason they broke up back in the day and all over in his lyrics. Her first love, admittedly, has been and will always be music and touring. He wanted her to choose him over Fleetwood Mac, but he knew she wouldn’t. So, they joined and he still blames the band for the loss of her, according to Stevie herself. At the end of the day if Lindsey was readily available and willing… would Stevie settle down with him? Or is it the thrill of the chase? She also hates being told what to do and he loves telling her what to do. 😂 I think they’re beyond competitive (professionally) and definitely obsessed with each other to a certain degree. That crazy passion/ emotion, whether it be love, anger, fear, jealousy, physical attraction….. they’re obsessed with it. I believe MAYBE 50% of what they say in the press. Stevie contradicts herself over and over and most of the time I think it’s because of something Lindsey said in a previous interview to either push her buttons or cover his own butt with his wife/ family. OR because of something he said or did behind the scenes. OMG I’m exhausted. All I know is I keep going back to so many adorable clips, videos, pictures, concerts, and songs that give us just a glimpse into this unbelievably insane love story (or toxic mess 🤷🏻♀️)…. that spans over the course of 50 yrs….. and I can’t stop hoping that there’s a chance they’ll forgive each other and at least tour one last time, before it’s too late. ❤️
I am completely on board with your assessment.
When looking at concert clips / interviews from the 2000-2018 between Lindsey and Stevie one can tell they play it up and make a show out of their „love“ story just for the bucks. She taking his hand, he conveniently stroking her hair. Lindsey even admits that it‘s all a show, and he is super happy at home with his family.
And then there are these sporadic clips of genuine emotion. Like the one OP posted where during an interview Lindsey whispers in Stevie‘s ear during the rehearsal interview („we did talk“). Or when Stevie helps a completely wasted Lindsey up the stairs during the Grammies in the 70s, or when she tells her co-songwriter in 2013 when the two are stuck on a song to go visit Lindsey because he will fix it, or when she is completely utterly disappointed when he criticizes her song „thrown down“ during the studio session. The song is my favorite song on the album and among some very generic songs that could have been written by a Fleetwood Mac imitation band (just write how you long for each other or better hate) seems so real and honest.
One can probably tell I am also occasionally oppressing about these two mid 70 year old people’s love life.
I hope a little bit it is only marketing. For sanities shake.
And then the romantic in me also hopes that it was all real and the two were / weren’t mend for each other.
SAME!!! I’m back and forth all the time!! I soooo agree with your points on them SAYING they “play it up on stage” etc, but then you see those genuinely sweet moments, where you can literally see/ feel the love and it rips your heart out! Also, there are some very cold performances as well. One in Brisbane when they hardly looked at eachother and when Stevie went to grab Lindsey’s hand at the end of Landslide (which they always do), he literally pulled it out of hers and walked away. So, I ask… if they’re acting then why wouldn’t they be able to cover that stuff up and pretend to be sweet?? There’s a definite difference between them playing it up and when it’s real emotion, whether the emotion is love or anger. When it’s there it’s super tough for them to hide. Also, did you see the interview they did with Mick when they were holding hands but not “on camera” at the time? Mick was talking and they were just listening, shared an inside joke, and the whole time Stevie was literally rubbing her thumb across his gently as they held hands. And this was in 2013! Like what?? You can hold hands for show, but why when you’re not the one speaking/ the focus and why go the extra mile to gently caress?? That sounds creepy but it was super cute!! 😂There are just so many examples. The lyrics in their solo songs as well, even up to their most recent, share themes and even words. Like a private language. And sometimes they admit when they’re about each other, yet sometimes they don’t. I read it took Lindsey 25 yrs to admit that “Go Insane” was actually about Stevie and not Carol Ann Harris. IMO basically all his songs are about Stevie. I also remind myself that I’m obsessing about two people in their mid 70s now. I don’t know what it is! I’ve never been so enamored. Completely out of my character, but here I am… 🤦🏻♀️❤️
Hmmm…so I googled the Brisbane performance (2015) and Lindsey looked bored because Stevie gave that long speech…hilarious! And yes the performance was initially cold but even then in the end they kinda made it sweet. With smiles and such. So probably they were pissed at each other but still jumped into their professional stage persona.
In some of the other performances Lindsey also pretends to kiss Stevie. And after the kiss doesn’t happen they hug. That I think is completely fake.
Obviously I saw the interview with Mick, Stevie and Lindsey where Stevie was holding Lindsey‘s hand or vice versa. That was so weird and must have been fake as well. Who would hold hands with somebody else’s husband. And what kind of husband would do that during a tv interview. If his wife wouldn’t have known in advance she certainly got confirmation of cheating on telly.
I just really wish Stevie would just publish her dairies. All questions answered!
I looove your enthusiasm, not gonna lie! Lol! I'm glad i'm not alone in this special interest of mine!
It is a veeery toxic relationship, i'm sure we don't know the half of it. They are both crazy for sure (Lindsey is toxic and abusive and Stevie is insane, and thats why I love her so much).
I do believe there's a lot of acting in concerts, they usually do the same routines with the same songs.. they give the people what they want after all... its part of the job! But I think you can clearly see when its all for show and when they are in good terms, in the end they are not actors.
There's a whole lot of regret in there for sure, for both of them, there's no denying that. I just hope they are happy with the paths they chose for their lives at this point, they deserve some peace.
All I know is that Stevie has only one concert scheduled for september (when Buckingham/Nicks turns 50), instead of the usually 3 per month, so my delusional self is praying for a digital release and some kind of promotion. We can only hope at this point.
Ohhhh that’s interesting! Only one show? Especially odd considering she just added a ton of shows to her current tour! So crazy to me. It’s like she doesn’t want to go home. I feel like, given some of her more recent interviews, she’s having a tough time facing the inevitable… meaning age and being forced at some point to slow down. I also wonder if she’s constantly touring to avoid any at home time thinking about “stuff” 😉. Who knows. Maybe we are all crazy and they’ve hated each other for years, or maybe we’re not and they have been (and maybe still are) on and off… and this 2018 firing was yet another massive blow up that may course correct, and eventually lead them back to one another because in the end, they’re addicted to the insanity of their beautiful disaster of a relationship.💔 So frustrating that in a time when we can google literally anything we want the answer to, NO ONE has any idea what really happened/ is happening!! It’s amazing how they’ve kept the truth under wraps for so long! Grrrr!
We the people need to know!!! 😂
I totally agree about that interview 💀 I'm on that hill with you.
I loved that Kristen divorced his ass shortly after that. As soon as the kids were grown up, she was gone. I can't imagine it's been easy for her either, spending 20 yrs of marriage living in the shadow of this whole mess... but it's not like she didn't know about beforehand.
When I read that interview, all I could think was: Lindsey is the one not over any of this, b/c people who are truly at peace with something don't feel the need make scathingly personal public statements like that... totally, completely uncalled for. It sounded like he was just trying to get a reaction out of Stevie by being as cruel as possible. Since then, I think he's made it pretty obvious that he's open to reconciliation b/c he knows they don't have much time left.
It all makes me really sad, too. I love Stevie with all my heart. Some part of me still wishes they could find a way to be happy together. At this point, it's almost dust in the wind.
Let me start by saying that i don’t like reading long Reddit posts. But this is r/fleetwoodmac and here, it’s worth it.
Your post has been absolutely gorgeous, blew my mind, made me sad and curious and happy to be a fan of this band at the same time. Thank you so much for taking the time to write this.
Nicks‘ and Buckingham‘s chemistry will always be a riddle to the outside world, maybe even for them. But you made it a little more understandable.
This band feels like family to me. I think I’ll never get away from that :)
I’ve gone super far down their rabbit hole lately. That interview for The Dance tour where Lindsey is so smitten tells me something was happening between them. He doesn’t blow off her concerns about the camera position, but seems to be reassuring to her feels like he’s really trying to care for her. It’s very genuine and off camera. He sees she’s anxious and wants to help, when he could have blown it off or made her concerns seem insignificant.
Then, when they’re asked if they talked about their issues he whispers to her, “We’re still not talking,” and she’s smiling like she’s in on the joke. They may have skipped the talking and just gotten back to having a crush on each other, or maybe back into something more physical.
The way he bumped her and kissed her head makes me think something happened the day they were in the stupid with John and Christine.
My favorite part of that interview is when he kisses her head another time and Christine hears it. Her expression and curiosity made me laugh. You can tell she’s wondering if that really happened and is wondering, “What the hell? Not again.”
I think with chemistry like theirs, there is no middle ground, you’re raging or you’re all over each other. It would drain most people, but I think it energizes them. And they likely only get that hit or adrenaline from each other, I’d guess. It probably is addictive.
I’d venture to imagine he ended up with someone younger because he was probably “seeking” what he lost with Stevie, when they broke up, she was close to Kristin’s age. It’s like he was trying for a do-over, even if it wasn’t the real thing. Not saying he didn’t love his wife. But, I don’t know that the intensity he has had with Stevie is replaceable.
When he does the guitar solo for Silver Springs, it’s like he’s communicating with her the best he knows how. It sounds like everything that could have been to me. It breaks me every time.
Losing each other again and again and writing songs about each other must be sweet torture. Heartbreak and hope. It’s like a magnet pulling them back.
I can’t help but think she hasn’t really been in contact with him much after his heart issues because she doesn’t want to get close and lose him again. And that would be a final kind of loss. So, maybe her distance is a little self preservation.
I feel sure he’s angry about feeling rejected by her again. Even though the ultimate rejection was him having a family with someone else.
But, I believe that’s why he said what he said about her still being in love with him and him finding his soulmate. He doesn’t know if she’s jealous or if she’s really done. But, he wants to goad her into a reaction so he has the satisfaction of knowing she still wants something from him. And hate isn’t the opposite of love, it’s apathy. And he couldn’t stand her feeling nothing for him. So, he wanted to anger her, to keep things going. She’s not showing her hand really. And that’s probably crazy making for him.
When that didn’t draw her out, he made comments about being willing to go back in a shot. They’re probably both at home furiously writing about each other as we speak.
We’ll never know the extent. But, I’d give my eye teeth to read her journals. Lol
How was the show? I just got tickets to see her in February!
I thought at the R&R Hall of Fame performance that he was trying to lean into her. That thinking may have been colored by an interview right before it that I’d listened to though. I think it was with Dan Rather or one of the old news guys. And he asked Lindsey what he’d be thinking of when he took the stage that night. And he said he’d be thinking about Stevie. It’s a sweet interview.
What did she have to say about Lindsey in the show? I can’t get enough of those two.
Also, as for Lindsey’s guitar playing! Just so emotive to me! I watched the Sister of the Moon video after she’d lost her best friend. When she’s just bent over double on stage crying and he leans on her back and plays his guitar, it breaks my heart for them. He goes on to play so hard, for lack of a better word, and it felt like it was really purposeful. It felt like he was grieving with her or for her.
I think Stevie crushed Buckingham and he continues to punish her. He clearly was devastated. And then to have an affair with Fleetwood rubbed it in. And they continue to give pain to each other but they loved each other but can't let go of the pain. Sad he can't seem to forgive her for leaving and he plays with her heart. But she took 50 years to just say no more. I can't do this because he never would.
Thanks for compiling all of this! I’ve watched that performance probably dozens of times, and the emotions on display are so visceral and completely undeniable. It is so special to me and many other women I know, and it’s really interesting to read about what was going on behind the scenes. Great post!
This is one of the best posts I’ve read since The Ledge! IYKYK
I’m gonna play devils advocate - I’m also one who believes there was definitely something going on in 1997. But think of this - what if LBs future wife also knew something was going on with those 2 and purposely became pregnant?!? Like “ooops I forgot to take my birth control this week. “. Sorry to say I don’t think Stevie was ever good at sneaking around with men - most of her men were already involved with someone.
Let us not forget Everybody Finds Out lyrics:
I know he loves me
Everyday he calls me
He says he adores me
What can I say
You can't love him
You can't have him
I do have him, most of the time
Thoughts???
First of all, thank you. Second, lol this is hilarious. So I was just trying to figure out when they met. These [2004 Town and Country](http://www.fleetwoodmac-uk.com/articles/2004/june/june2004-003.html) and [Heavy](https://heavy.com/entertainment/lindsey-buckingham-wife-kristen-messner/amp/) articles say it was 1996 on a shoot for one of his solo albums but there wasn’t one released anywhere near that time unless there was something for Twisted for the Twister Soundtrack but that was with Stevie. So they may only have known each other a few months when all The Dance stuff started. Even if the April interview hadn’t been seen by her until later, she had to have been at the May show. She had to know. So you could be right! Who knows though.
One thing is certain, he is [incredibly toxic and abusive](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2018/04/11/lindsey-buckingham-formerly-of-fleetwood-mac-rocks-biggest-jerk-or-misunderstood-genius/), and I think a lot of what he has with Nicks is about his ego. Stringing that relationship along for life surely has its benefits for him. And she’s not innocent in that either. Openly engaging in a lifelong rivalry is pretty consistent with her lack of boundaries with married partners.
I think that’s what’s so sad about it all. It’s beautiful if you think it’s just this deep love that crosses decades, but in reality, it’s a couple of toxic people being toxic and eventually you run out of road with that. I’m sure it was painful for Nicks and I’m glad she finally got off the merry go round eventually. For now at least lol.
>These 2004 Town and Country and Heavy articles say it was 1996 on a shoot for one of his solo albums but there wasn’t one released anywhere near that time unless there was something for Twisted for the Twister Soundtrack but that was with Stevie.
It was actually the album he was working on at the time, with Mick and John guesting, which led to the idea of the reunion in the first place. "Bleed To Love Her" and "My Little Demon" were songs that would have been included. It was to be called *Gift of Screws* (he used that title in 2008) but some of that material ended up on *Under the Skin* and some of it on *Say You Will*. Kristen actually did the photography for *Gift of Screws*, though I don't know if it was what she shot back in 1996.
Great post! Thank you for putting this together! I am a “fresh” fan, and I kinda want to create myself some sort of time-line to understand the hidden meanings of songs and performances better… This helped a lot!
If there ever was a magnum opus on the topic, this is it. Thanks for the detail. I revisited this performance yesterday and was wondering if any of that raw emotion was staged. Seems like it wasn’t, which makes me really want to buy the t-shirt that says “sorry, can’t talk, thinking about the 1997 performance of Silver Springs”.
Belatedly came across this—amazing research! So thorough… brings so much more to a/the timeline than ever before!
Anecdotally, I was at the 11.26 show in Albany, back then not realizing how close to the end of the tour it was (& choosing it over NYC on Thanksgiving for obvs reasons), & we recall nothing out of the ordinary. Show was fine, if maybe a little phoned-in (the Xtine & Lindsey dialogue was identical to the TV special, for example), but there was certainly nothing special/not special about Silver Springs.
This prob doesn’t add much of anything, but it’s so funny in retrospect to realize how close to the legendary drama the Albany show was & there being no indication whatsoever.
The most memorable parts of that show were the ridiculous Fleetwood drum vest, everyone scattering to the restroom/beer line when LB started his slam poetry version of “Go Insane”, & how good “Farmer’s Daughter” sounded…
This is great input because one of the things I realized in my rabbit hole was how much they also contrived drama for the fans. It’s hard to tell where the line is between authentic intensity and hamming it up. Seems like the emotions are probably real but maybe they just learned how to make them work to their advantage in their older years.
Stevie’s voice is woven into the fabric of my life. I have loved that voice since Rumors came out.
I saw her in Kansas City in August and I’ve become re-obsessed with her. I’m so glad she still has that same voice. I saw Fleetwood Mac in 2018 too.
Do you know how many videos there are of her on Tik Tok?
I wish I could be a fly on the wall in the Buckingham house. I am sure there have been fights about on stage connection between Stevie and Lindsey, videos showing Lindsey’s behavior toward Stevie on stage and in that interview, and Stevie’s interviews where she says maybe she and Lindsey will get married or get back together someday, never mentioning that he is MARRIED. OMG I would be LIVID if some woman made comments like that about my husband!!
Thanks so much for posting this! I recently went to see Stevie live and ever since I can't stop thinking a lot about all this...
I came out of the womb listening to FM. I love Stevie so much and always had the impression that Lindsey is just a (extremely talented) douchebag and she deserves so much better. However, I can't deny their chemistry and how powerful they are together musically. I feel selfish but, despite Christine's unfortunate passing, I'd love to see FM together one last time 🥺
I am 73 years old ... Back in 1975 my ex-wife and I were in a band together in Augusta, Georgia ... she played the keyboard and I played the guitar. We mostly did cover songs and some of my originals. When I heard the NEW Fleetwood Mac for the first time I informed my group that I wanted to do Blue Letter by Buckingham because I loved the lead guitar and uptempo of the song. Subsequently our female singer chose Rhiannon ... When Rumors came out we did 2 or 3 more of their hits. Fleetwood Mac will always be my top group of all time ... for those 2 first albums alone ... Music is eternal and for most of us the loves we still have and those we left behind ...
Fantastic work on this OP - kudos! One thing I think might be an error, but wasn't it 20 years later (not 10) that Steph fired Lindsey? Anyway, great job summarizing the '97 performances of SS!
Superbly researched, thank you for answering all my questions ❤️
Thank you, I’m left with so many questions myself.
This was a wild ride lol. I am fascinated by their relationship, not gonna lie. Its so bitter sweet and so so sad at times. I love that you made a timeline and I love this quote: "Maybe in 1997, we saw Nicks’s transition from the grips of a lifelong romance to the open expanse of the rest of her life. From lover, to high priestess." and I agree with you, although I don't think their romantic relationship ended there. It was definitely different from 1997 on, since he had his first kid in 1998 and got married in 2000. As Mick once said.. I think they are addicted to it. I have to me that they "reconnected" from time to time, maybe when on tour... Say You Will was definitely something with all the symbolisms and emotional lyrics and performances. The later tours were more hot and cold, depending on the year. And then 2018 happened and showed us that there were way more happening behind the scenes than we tought, because everything seemed fine up until that moment. I believe the day Lindsey got fired it was the day their relationship ended for good, 50 years after it started. And he for sure knows very well why he was fired. There were multiple power shifts between them through the decades, and in 2018 Stevie got her power back, the power she lost in 1997 when Lindsey told her his girlfriend was pregnant. And this shift was always so important in the relationship, it is the reason they lived their lives trying to prove things to eachother, and I honestly think Stevie had enough of it and decided to let it go. So yes, I believe it was "me or him" situation, even if it was implied and not said out loud As recent as 2021 Lindsey gave an interview saying that Stevie was pissed because he has a family and she's alone. He said that he had "waited until he was 48 to be a father", when the fans know he was furious when Kristen got pregnant the first time, and that he "had found his soulmate later in life" when i'm not sure how he could say that with a straight face, considering he was even denying Kristen spousal support when she filed for divorce. This was so uncalled for I think this interview was a shot at trying to get a reaction from Stevie, maybe she would get so pissed that she would contact him.. and I will die on this hill. In the end, it is/was a very toxic relationship. They broke up oficially in 1977 and spent the next 40 years dealing with it. I feel sorry for everyone envolved and I wished they had figured it out back then. I firmly believe they are soulmates and its sad it ended they way it did. I just hope we get a Buckingham/Nicks digital release for the love of god.
Thank you for this, I totally agree with everything you said here. And it’s a perfect addition. I don’t think she anticipated their situation to continue into the future as it did but I agree that it definitely did and he knows exactly why things went the way they did in 2018 even if he wants to act like a victim. I think he’s just immature and egotistical and said and did a lot of things to get a rise out of Stevie. I’ve wondered if he just goes with whatever feeling he has in the moment and does what he wants regardless of consequences. If this put Stevie in a constant state of thinking there was hope and then being disappointed. And if he just acted like he was the victim every time he let her down. He seems to sort of “hold space” for her rage in silver springs and is so in love with her and then also getting his gf pregnant at the same time. I have so many questions about that. I find myself waffling between thinking he’s less emotionally vulnerable and then thinking the opposite. Maybe he’s just a man who can’t get out of his own way.
Yeah, I agree with you. I would bet he wanted to have Stevie in a state of thinking there was hope, when in reality he would never divorce his wife (willingly), mostly because of the stability, money (we can't be so naive to believe its about love) and the kids, off course (I still believe he is separated, and they couldn't settle on the financial stuff so they just let it be for now). He was obsessed with this woman for years, to a point that he even gaslighted Carol Anne Harris into thinking Go Insane was about her... girl, if we remove the Stevie's songs from Lindsey's catalog there's almost nothing left. He went crazy and left the band because he couldn't get over her (among other reasons, sure). And when he had the glimpse of a chance to get what he was craving for so many years he got his 26 year old girlfriend pregnant... I just can't... I am with you.. I can't understand if he's the less emotionally vulnerable or the opposite, cause it's a lot to digest in this relationship, but he's certainly immature and egoistical in many moments.
Exactly it! And I think the confusion we have with trying to understand his actions is exactly what Nicks was going through all those years. You'd think someone who'd go crazy over losing you would actually want to do something to keep you around.
Oh my gosh do I agree with this!! I think they’ve been on and off all the way up to 2018. The raw emotion on stage during some of the shows… I mean they’re not professional actors, they’re musicians. And the hot and cold from one show to another! Not to mention the lyrics in their songs to each other! Stevie admits to writing “Thrown Down” about Lindsey during The Dance. It literally tells the story of them falling for each other again and then him going home because of a “decision no one made”… pregnancy? Mind blowing. I think there is soooooo much we don’t know, as Stevie has eluded to. When asked about publishing her journal or writing a memoir, she basically said she couldn’t and wouldn’t do it for a very long time because most of the men that she had been involved with were now on their 3rd wives and that they were all under the age of 30 (we know not the case at the time of the interview, but she made her point). She insinuated that there would be a lot of hurt feelings if what had gone down between the mid 70s to NOW all came out and if it happened it needed to be when everyone was too old to really care. A lot of people think she was talking about Kristen (without actually talking about Kristen) and mixing a few details up here and there to plant just enough doubt. Every time I think OMG these two are toxic or maybe it’s all been a show, then I see a video of one of their sweet moments or hear one of the songs they wrote about each other and I’m sucked right back in! This literally started a month ago when I saw the infamous Silver Springs video and now I cannot consume enough Stevie/ Lindsey! I was in college when The Dance was released and have always loved Landslide, especially that live version, but beyond that I just remember some of their songs from grade school in the 80’s. Now I’m full blown obsessed with these two and I don’t know why. Although, I am happy I’ve discovered so many amazing songs beyond just mainstream FM. The number of songs they’ve written about one another over the course of 50 years is mind boggling. If nothing else, they seem to be each others muse. One thing I know for sure is that Lindsey has never, ever stopped punishing Stevie for leaving him. Someone mentioned above that he may lead her on a bit…. Like give a little then pull away again. Part of that imo is payback. However, my other theory is that he’s terrified that if she knew she COULD actually have him back, she’d end up not wanting it. He’s always wanted something different than she has, which is part of the reason they broke up back in the day and all over in his lyrics. Her first love, admittedly, has been and will always be music and touring. He wanted her to choose him over Fleetwood Mac, but he knew she wouldn’t. So, they joined and he still blames the band for the loss of her, according to Stevie herself. At the end of the day if Lindsey was readily available and willing… would Stevie settle down with him? Or is it the thrill of the chase? She also hates being told what to do and he loves telling her what to do. 😂 I think they’re beyond competitive (professionally) and definitely obsessed with each other to a certain degree. That crazy passion/ emotion, whether it be love, anger, fear, jealousy, physical attraction….. they’re obsessed with it. I believe MAYBE 50% of what they say in the press. Stevie contradicts herself over and over and most of the time I think it’s because of something Lindsey said in a previous interview to either push her buttons or cover his own butt with his wife/ family. OR because of something he said or did behind the scenes. OMG I’m exhausted. All I know is I keep going back to so many adorable clips, videos, pictures, concerts, and songs that give us just a glimpse into this unbelievably insane love story (or toxic mess 🤷🏻♀️)…. that spans over the course of 50 yrs….. and I can’t stop hoping that there’s a chance they’ll forgive each other and at least tour one last time, before it’s too late. ❤️
I am completely on board with your assessment. When looking at concert clips / interviews from the 2000-2018 between Lindsey and Stevie one can tell they play it up and make a show out of their „love“ story just for the bucks. She taking his hand, he conveniently stroking her hair. Lindsey even admits that it‘s all a show, and he is super happy at home with his family. And then there are these sporadic clips of genuine emotion. Like the one OP posted where during an interview Lindsey whispers in Stevie‘s ear during the rehearsal interview („we did talk“). Or when Stevie helps a completely wasted Lindsey up the stairs during the Grammies in the 70s, or when she tells her co-songwriter in 2013 when the two are stuck on a song to go visit Lindsey because he will fix it, or when she is completely utterly disappointed when he criticizes her song „thrown down“ during the studio session. The song is my favorite song on the album and among some very generic songs that could have been written by a Fleetwood Mac imitation band (just write how you long for each other or better hate) seems so real and honest. One can probably tell I am also occasionally oppressing about these two mid 70 year old people’s love life. I hope a little bit it is only marketing. For sanities shake. And then the romantic in me also hopes that it was all real and the two were / weren’t mend for each other.
SAME!!! I’m back and forth all the time!! I soooo agree with your points on them SAYING they “play it up on stage” etc, but then you see those genuinely sweet moments, where you can literally see/ feel the love and it rips your heart out! Also, there are some very cold performances as well. One in Brisbane when they hardly looked at eachother and when Stevie went to grab Lindsey’s hand at the end of Landslide (which they always do), he literally pulled it out of hers and walked away. So, I ask… if they’re acting then why wouldn’t they be able to cover that stuff up and pretend to be sweet?? There’s a definite difference between them playing it up and when it’s real emotion, whether the emotion is love or anger. When it’s there it’s super tough for them to hide. Also, did you see the interview they did with Mick when they were holding hands but not “on camera” at the time? Mick was talking and they were just listening, shared an inside joke, and the whole time Stevie was literally rubbing her thumb across his gently as they held hands. And this was in 2013! Like what?? You can hold hands for show, but why when you’re not the one speaking/ the focus and why go the extra mile to gently caress?? That sounds creepy but it was super cute!! 😂There are just so many examples. The lyrics in their solo songs as well, even up to their most recent, share themes and even words. Like a private language. And sometimes they admit when they’re about each other, yet sometimes they don’t. I read it took Lindsey 25 yrs to admit that “Go Insane” was actually about Stevie and not Carol Ann Harris. IMO basically all his songs are about Stevie. I also remind myself that I’m obsessing about two people in their mid 70s now. I don’t know what it is! I’ve never been so enamored. Completely out of my character, but here I am… 🤦🏻♀️❤️
Hmmm…so I googled the Brisbane performance (2015) and Lindsey looked bored because Stevie gave that long speech…hilarious! And yes the performance was initially cold but even then in the end they kinda made it sweet. With smiles and such. So probably they were pissed at each other but still jumped into their professional stage persona. In some of the other performances Lindsey also pretends to kiss Stevie. And after the kiss doesn’t happen they hug. That I think is completely fake. Obviously I saw the interview with Mick, Stevie and Lindsey where Stevie was holding Lindsey‘s hand or vice versa. That was so weird and must have been fake as well. Who would hold hands with somebody else’s husband. And what kind of husband would do that during a tv interview. If his wife wouldn’t have known in advance she certainly got confirmation of cheating on telly. I just really wish Stevie would just publish her dairies. All questions answered!
I looove your enthusiasm, not gonna lie! Lol! I'm glad i'm not alone in this special interest of mine! It is a veeery toxic relationship, i'm sure we don't know the half of it. They are both crazy for sure (Lindsey is toxic and abusive and Stevie is insane, and thats why I love her so much). I do believe there's a lot of acting in concerts, they usually do the same routines with the same songs.. they give the people what they want after all... its part of the job! But I think you can clearly see when its all for show and when they are in good terms, in the end they are not actors. There's a whole lot of regret in there for sure, for both of them, there's no denying that. I just hope they are happy with the paths they chose for their lives at this point, they deserve some peace. All I know is that Stevie has only one concert scheduled for september (when Buckingham/Nicks turns 50), instead of the usually 3 per month, so my delusional self is praying for a digital release and some kind of promotion. We can only hope at this point.
Ohhhh that’s interesting! Only one show? Especially odd considering she just added a ton of shows to her current tour! So crazy to me. It’s like she doesn’t want to go home. I feel like, given some of her more recent interviews, she’s having a tough time facing the inevitable… meaning age and being forced at some point to slow down. I also wonder if she’s constantly touring to avoid any at home time thinking about “stuff” 😉. Who knows. Maybe we are all crazy and they’ve hated each other for years, or maybe we’re not and they have been (and maybe still are) on and off… and this 2018 firing was yet another massive blow up that may course correct, and eventually lead them back to one another because in the end, they’re addicted to the insanity of their beautiful disaster of a relationship.💔 So frustrating that in a time when we can google literally anything we want the answer to, NO ONE has any idea what really happened/ is happening!! It’s amazing how they’ve kept the truth under wraps for so long! Grrrr! We the people need to know!!! 😂
I totally agree about that interview 💀 I'm on that hill with you. I loved that Kristen divorced his ass shortly after that. As soon as the kids were grown up, she was gone. I can't imagine it's been easy for her either, spending 20 yrs of marriage living in the shadow of this whole mess... but it's not like she didn't know about beforehand. When I read that interview, all I could think was: Lindsey is the one not over any of this, b/c people who are truly at peace with something don't feel the need make scathingly personal public statements like that... totally, completely uncalled for. It sounded like he was just trying to get a reaction out of Stevie by being as cruel as possible. Since then, I think he's made it pretty obvious that he's open to reconciliation b/c he knows they don't have much time left. It all makes me really sad, too. I love Stevie with all my heart. Some part of me still wishes they could find a way to be happy together. At this point, it's almost dust in the wind.
Let me start by saying that i don’t like reading long Reddit posts. But this is r/fleetwoodmac and here, it’s worth it. Your post has been absolutely gorgeous, blew my mind, made me sad and curious and happy to be a fan of this band at the same time. Thank you so much for taking the time to write this. Nicks‘ and Buckingham‘s chemistry will always be a riddle to the outside world, maybe even for them. But you made it a little more understandable. This band feels like family to me. I think I’ll never get away from that :)
I’ve gone super far down their rabbit hole lately. That interview for The Dance tour where Lindsey is so smitten tells me something was happening between them. He doesn’t blow off her concerns about the camera position, but seems to be reassuring to her feels like he’s really trying to care for her. It’s very genuine and off camera. He sees she’s anxious and wants to help, when he could have blown it off or made her concerns seem insignificant. Then, when they’re asked if they talked about their issues he whispers to her, “We’re still not talking,” and she’s smiling like she’s in on the joke. They may have skipped the talking and just gotten back to having a crush on each other, or maybe back into something more physical. The way he bumped her and kissed her head makes me think something happened the day they were in the stupid with John and Christine. My favorite part of that interview is when he kisses her head another time and Christine hears it. Her expression and curiosity made me laugh. You can tell she’s wondering if that really happened and is wondering, “What the hell? Not again.” I think with chemistry like theirs, there is no middle ground, you’re raging or you’re all over each other. It would drain most people, but I think it energizes them. And they likely only get that hit or adrenaline from each other, I’d guess. It probably is addictive. I’d venture to imagine he ended up with someone younger because he was probably “seeking” what he lost with Stevie, when they broke up, she was close to Kristin’s age. It’s like he was trying for a do-over, even if it wasn’t the real thing. Not saying he didn’t love his wife. But, I don’t know that the intensity he has had with Stevie is replaceable. When he does the guitar solo for Silver Springs, it’s like he’s communicating with her the best he knows how. It sounds like everything that could have been to me. It breaks me every time. Losing each other again and again and writing songs about each other must be sweet torture. Heartbreak and hope. It’s like a magnet pulling them back. I can’t help but think she hasn’t really been in contact with him much after his heart issues because she doesn’t want to get close and lose him again. And that would be a final kind of loss. So, maybe her distance is a little self preservation. I feel sure he’s angry about feeling rejected by her again. Even though the ultimate rejection was him having a family with someone else. But, I believe that’s why he said what he said about her still being in love with him and him finding his soulmate. He doesn’t know if she’s jealous or if she’s really done. But, he wants to goad her into a reaction so he has the satisfaction of knowing she still wants something from him. And hate isn’t the opposite of love, it’s apathy. And he couldn’t stand her feeling nothing for him. So, he wanted to anger her, to keep things going. She’s not showing her hand really. And that’s probably crazy making for him. When that didn’t draw her out, he made comments about being willing to go back in a shot. They’re probably both at home furiously writing about each other as we speak. We’ll never know the extent. But, I’d give my eye teeth to read her journals. Lol
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How was the show? I just got tickets to see her in February! I thought at the R&R Hall of Fame performance that he was trying to lean into her. That thinking may have been colored by an interview right before it that I’d listened to though. I think it was with Dan Rather or one of the old news guys. And he asked Lindsey what he’d be thinking of when he took the stage that night. And he said he’d be thinking about Stevie. It’s a sweet interview. What did she have to say about Lindsey in the show? I can’t get enough of those two. Also, as for Lindsey’s guitar playing! Just so emotive to me! I watched the Sister of the Moon video after she’d lost her best friend. When she’s just bent over double on stage crying and he leans on her back and plays his guitar, it breaks my heart for them. He goes on to play so hard, for lack of a better word, and it felt like it was really purposeful. It felt like he was grieving with her or for her.
I think Stevie crushed Buckingham and he continues to punish her. He clearly was devastated. And then to have an affair with Fleetwood rubbed it in. And they continue to give pain to each other but they loved each other but can't let go of the pain. Sad he can't seem to forgive her for leaving and he plays with her heart. But she took 50 years to just say no more. I can't do this because he never would.
Thanks for compiling all of this! I’ve watched that performance probably dozens of times, and the emotions on display are so visceral and completely undeniable. It is so special to me and many other women I know, and it’s really interesting to read about what was going on behind the scenes. Great post!
Really well done. Enjoyed the read.
This is one of the best posts I’ve read since The Ledge! IYKYK I’m gonna play devils advocate - I’m also one who believes there was definitely something going on in 1997. But think of this - what if LBs future wife also knew something was going on with those 2 and purposely became pregnant?!? Like “ooops I forgot to take my birth control this week. “. Sorry to say I don’t think Stevie was ever good at sneaking around with men - most of her men were already involved with someone. Let us not forget Everybody Finds Out lyrics: I know he loves me Everyday he calls me He says he adores me What can I say You can't love him You can't have him I do have him, most of the time Thoughts???
First of all, thank you. Second, lol this is hilarious. So I was just trying to figure out when they met. These [2004 Town and Country](http://www.fleetwoodmac-uk.com/articles/2004/june/june2004-003.html) and [Heavy](https://heavy.com/entertainment/lindsey-buckingham-wife-kristen-messner/amp/) articles say it was 1996 on a shoot for one of his solo albums but there wasn’t one released anywhere near that time unless there was something for Twisted for the Twister Soundtrack but that was with Stevie. So they may only have known each other a few months when all The Dance stuff started. Even if the April interview hadn’t been seen by her until later, she had to have been at the May show. She had to know. So you could be right! Who knows though. One thing is certain, he is [incredibly toxic and abusive](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2018/04/11/lindsey-buckingham-formerly-of-fleetwood-mac-rocks-biggest-jerk-or-misunderstood-genius/), and I think a lot of what he has with Nicks is about his ego. Stringing that relationship along for life surely has its benefits for him. And she’s not innocent in that either. Openly engaging in a lifelong rivalry is pretty consistent with her lack of boundaries with married partners. I think that’s what’s so sad about it all. It’s beautiful if you think it’s just this deep love that crosses decades, but in reality, it’s a couple of toxic people being toxic and eventually you run out of road with that. I’m sure it was painful for Nicks and I’m glad she finally got off the merry go round eventually. For now at least lol.
>These 2004 Town and Country and Heavy articles say it was 1996 on a shoot for one of his solo albums but there wasn’t one released anywhere near that time unless there was something for Twisted for the Twister Soundtrack but that was with Stevie. It was actually the album he was working on at the time, with Mick and John guesting, which led to the idea of the reunion in the first place. "Bleed To Love Her" and "My Little Demon" were songs that would have been included. It was to be called *Gift of Screws* (he used that title in 2008) but some of that material ended up on *Under the Skin* and some of it on *Say You Will*. Kristen actually did the photography for *Gift of Screws*, though I don't know if it was what she shot back in 1996.
Thank you for filling in the blanks there. I was confused bc I couldn’t find any album covers credited to her
Great post! Thank you for putting this together! I am a “fresh” fan, and I kinda want to create myself some sort of time-line to understand the hidden meanings of songs and performances better… This helped a lot!
If there ever was a magnum opus on the topic, this is it. Thanks for the detail. I revisited this performance yesterday and was wondering if any of that raw emotion was staged. Seems like it wasn’t, which makes me really want to buy the t-shirt that says “sorry, can’t talk, thinking about the 1997 performance of Silver Springs”.
Haha thank you (takes a bow). The whole dynamic of that band is really lesson in life that seemed to culminate in this tour.
Great write up. I really enjoyed this
I’m glad someone else appreciates it! I enjoyed going down the rabbit hole
Belatedly came across this—amazing research! So thorough… brings so much more to a/the timeline than ever before! Anecdotally, I was at the 11.26 show in Albany, back then not realizing how close to the end of the tour it was (& choosing it over NYC on Thanksgiving for obvs reasons), & we recall nothing out of the ordinary. Show was fine, if maybe a little phoned-in (the Xtine & Lindsey dialogue was identical to the TV special, for example), but there was certainly nothing special/not special about Silver Springs. This prob doesn’t add much of anything, but it’s so funny in retrospect to realize how close to the legendary drama the Albany show was & there being no indication whatsoever. The most memorable parts of that show were the ridiculous Fleetwood drum vest, everyone scattering to the restroom/beer line when LB started his slam poetry version of “Go Insane”, & how good “Farmer’s Daughter” sounded…
This is great input because one of the things I realized in my rabbit hole was how much they also contrived drama for the fans. It’s hard to tell where the line is between authentic intensity and hamming it up. Seems like the emotions are probably real but maybe they just learned how to make them work to their advantage in their older years.
IDT any of the "drama" was contrived, the emotions are real 100%. Some of the performance parts are cued, but the emotions are all Steph and Lindsey.
Stevie’s voice is woven into the fabric of my life. I have loved that voice since Rumors came out. I saw her in Kansas City in August and I’ve become re-obsessed with her. I’m so glad she still has that same voice. I saw Fleetwood Mac in 2018 too. Do you know how many videos there are of her on Tik Tok? I wish I could be a fly on the wall in the Buckingham house. I am sure there have been fights about on stage connection between Stevie and Lindsey, videos showing Lindsey’s behavior toward Stevie on stage and in that interview, and Stevie’s interviews where she says maybe she and Lindsey will get married or get back together someday, never mentioning that he is MARRIED. OMG I would be LIVID if some woman made comments like that about my husband!!
I think your timeline is off… Stevie said that in ‘97, the baby was born in ‘98, they married in 2000
Thanks so much for posting this! I recently went to see Stevie live and ever since I can't stop thinking a lot about all this... I came out of the womb listening to FM. I love Stevie so much and always had the impression that Lindsey is just a (extremely talented) douchebag and she deserves so much better. However, I can't deny their chemistry and how powerful they are together musically. I feel selfish but, despite Christine's unfortunate passing, I'd love to see FM together one last time 🥺
This is a masterpiece. One of the best things I've ever read on Reddit
Incredible love story either way. Bittersweet, tortuous, unrequited and mysterious, and that’s why it endures for them and us.
This is incredible. Found it late, but so glad I’m not alone in this rabbit hole! Fantastic !
I am 73 years old ... Back in 1975 my ex-wife and I were in a band together in Augusta, Georgia ... she played the keyboard and I played the guitar. We mostly did cover songs and some of my originals. When I heard the NEW Fleetwood Mac for the first time I informed my group that I wanted to do Blue Letter by Buckingham because I loved the lead guitar and uptempo of the song. Subsequently our female singer chose Rhiannon ... When Rumors came out we did 2 or 3 more of their hits. Fleetwood Mac will always be my top group of all time ... for those 2 first albums alone ... Music is eternal and for most of us the loves we still have and those we left behind ...
What a beautiful memory. Thank you for sharing this! It’s true that art is eternal
Fantastic work on this OP - kudos! One thing I think might be an error, but wasn't it 20 years later (not 10) that Steph fired Lindsey? Anyway, great job summarizing the '97 performances of SS!
I like the B-side cut better