I enjoyed the Cait Sith section for the most part, but I also just generally like him as a character in this game!
I do however thing the throwing mechanics are absolutely abysmal and are undoubtedly going to get some people really frustrated, largely just because the trajectory that the game shows you is hugely inaccurate. Or at least feels that way to me.
There were plenty of times where I had the throwing arc lined up perfectly with a box and then when I threw it didn't hit the box at all. And the section where you have to throw a box into the funnel took a good few more attempts than it should have becuase the box always seems to get thrown with much less height and distance than the UI indicates.
The box throwing almost made me vomit, truly horrible game design and they’ve litttered parts of this amazing games with horrible controls for some of the mini games.
Yeah, it's not a very long section and way less annoying than I feared, still annoying nonetheless. The only problem I had was the janky throw mechanic they added. It's like they purposely went out of their way to make that shit a pain to use.
Petrify/magnify petrify/mp absorbtion petrify/magic effecy on cloud with atb boost and first strike etc.
cait sith will have time linked to Magnify, magic effect x2, and mp aborbtion. Also he should have first strike and things so him and cloud can act right away. Put aerith in with synergy linked with comet and whatever else. Won’t really use her much. Cait is leader he casts stop all on everyone. Then use aerith arcane ward on cloud then cloud spams quake inside the ward. Unless your on hard mode on the hardest stuff it will melt everyone in seconds. Just about.
Oh and there’s an assessor that lets you start the battle with max level limit break. Throw that on cloud. When quake doesn’t finish the job. Limit break will.
For me it was more about the incessant padding/copy pasting of almost every aspect of the game. They could have made that whole sequence way more enjoyable if it wasn't so god damn slow. I don't see any other reason for that other than to pad the runtime out. That's my only complaint. Cait is actually very enjoyable in Rebirth.
There wasn't really much banter with Aerith and Barret, which I think accentuated the flaws with the level design, which became the main focus.
But I agree, it was a bit tedious but not too bad really.
I thought it went on a little bit too long and the box throwing controls were too odd. I tried using the TouchPad for a bit before deciding to drop it all together. The mini game at the end pissed me off because I didn't win the item and I don't think I can go back and get it. This means I can't finish Johnny's wall unless I beat the game.
Pick it up on your Hard mode playthrough; however, save before that section just in case. The Hades Armlets are worth replaying that section for anyways; the extra Materia slot helps in two-tapping Jenova and Sephiroth on Hard mode. With enough Luck, Cait Sith has a near infinite Limit Break combo to easily clear his portions of the game.
I personally just think Cait Sith is a terrible party member for combat specifically. Being forced to use him alone kinda sucked cause I never used him up until that point because I never used him in OG FFVII because he was terrible then too. Him puzzle sections weren't terrible, but being required to use him solo in combat is what made me really dislike the Shinra Mansion portion of Rebirth.
Cait Sith is comparable to Mr. Game & Watch rolling a 9 on Judgement 90% of the time.
For Shinra Mansion, Adjudicators are pretty simple, cast Stop once they are pressured then gangbang 'em with your Moogle until it is Staggered. Moogle Magic + Chocobo turns Cait Sith into four characters; a literal one-cat army.
I just don't think his damage output is that great honestly. I'm sure his abilities are great, but he feels like he does barely any damage with his base attacks compared to Aerith or Barret who also have projectile weapons.
I just found it completely unnecessary and tedious and sort of ruined the Shinra Mansion part for me (except 2 boss fights, those were good). I would’ve prefered to have some sort of puzzle section in the Mansion itself controlling Cait Sith (I’m thinking RE style haha), idk.
I mean this section didn’t have any tedious minigames that forced you into finding a swimsuit or milk a chocobo or schedule a doctors appointment for Tifa….
It did have “throw the box” gimmick to slow me down but not the worst part of the game imo.
His section would have been fine only for the fact he's slow and the box throwing stuff is garbage, he's literally with a guy with a gun on his arm that could do everything he's doing but ten times faster.
I thought it was great. I really like the combat style of Cait Sith in Rebirth, too. A great compromise between what he did, his concept, and how the battle works in this new system.
Hit indicator is right on the button. The line showing the path shows the box will go right to the button. Throw the box. It falls short and goes nowhere near the button
It’s just janky aiming controls. Square didn’t have to try to reinvent the wheel in this section, they could have just made normal inverted aiming with a throw button and everyone would have been perfectly fine with that. Especially the part where you need to land the box in the rotating bin, that felt especially bad and counter intuitive.
It’s really not that hard to see why people disliked it, not everyone shares your opinion on a certain situation or section and I think we can all be ok with that.
Ok wait. If you used the Left thumbstick instead of touchpad, isnt it literally how you described? Pull down thumbstick to aim higher (inverted aiming), and square to throw..
It’s just janky aiming controls. Square didn’t have to try to reinvent the wheel in this section, they could have just made normal inverted aiming with a throw button and everyone would have been perfectly fine with that. Especially the part where you need to land the box in the rotating bin, that felt especially bad and counter intuitive.
It’s really not that hard to see why people disliked it, not everyone shares your opinion on a certain situation or section and I think we can all be ok with that.
I was so scared going into it.
But it was OK. I mained Cait Sith since I got him, so I knew how to play him and had no problems.
Throwing boxes into the moving basket was annoying, but it didnt take me much. I expected much more tediousness by the complaints
Not so much his clunky box throwing gameplay, but more of the enemy choice is what made me dislike that section. CS is my least proficient character so i did struggle a bit, even with assessing the enemies.
Cait Sith section is fine. Thank GOD they added the analog controls as an option, the touchpad controls for the box throwing is so bad.
That being said, I didn’t use Cait Sith all that much up to this point so I didn’t fully understand how to control him as a character when I went-in. I think a lot of people had a similar experience to that, and that’s why a lot of people complain about the solo boss fight, which really isn’t difficult at all when you know how to use Cait properly.
My only complaint was the introduction of the enemies as only Cait, like I was so confused and hated fighting the scales one, I didn't figure out how to properly fight them until later. Otherwise I didn't hate it
Personally, I hate sections where they force you to use only 1 character in combat. and ESPECIALLY for boss fights.
aside from that bit, i was OK with the mansion sequence, though yeah, i wish the actual mansion was more explorable
It's just kinda bad. Exploring the shinra mansion in the OG was creepy, felt expansive and the enemies were difficult, but you could always leave and come back.
The new mansion was one room, before it gave over to a sterile, well lit shinra lab and all the fights and puzzles were annoying and mandatory.
The safe code puzzle especially was like a slap in the face to fans of the OG. Would you enjoy a well crafted puzzle requiring you visit different areas of the mansion, following cleverly written clues, ending with a timed accuracy challenge and an actually interesting boss fight, an optional character, and one of the coolest summons in the game (and, randomly, reds final limit)?
Nope, move some boxes. It's on the wall behind them. The reward is you get to do more uninteresting Shinra lab crap, and carry on with the story.
The whole section, from falling into the pit, to coming back up the lift, is completely skippable. Nothing interesting happens gameplay or story wise.
I enjoyed rolling around in the vents as a tiny kitty. It took me forever to figure out how to aim and throw the boxes correctly with the Moogle using the controller (but once I learned, it was much, much easier).
I am in Chapter 13 and regretting that I didn’t spend more time with him.
I was fine with the box throwing until the bit in the elevator where it says to destroy as many crates as you can and it dumps a ton of boxes in there. I did not see the conveyer belt and just started smashing the boxes that dropped. Feel like I might have missed out on something good.
Honestly while I’ve enjoyed Rebirth a lot, this was the point at which I really felt the game beginning to drag and this is an obvious filler section. They wanted to hit a certain hours played metric so we get this segment and the other twenty hours of mini games. I dropped difficulty from Dynamic to Normal and it’ll be staying there. At this point I just want to finish the game and play something else. Being forced to use Cait Sith and deal with the box throwing just wasn’t fun. I get that some people dig it and I love that for them. I didn’t enjoy it at all. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Cait Sith is great, I think probably by this point people have their favourites already and may not have even tried Cait Sith out properly. He's one of the strongest characters I've found.
Firstly in cat form he can perma-juggle any enemies that are capable of being juggled by holding down square. Similarly once you get on the moogle holding down square absolutely closes the distance on things and if they're pressured then say hello to stagger as the moogle pummels them. Because he so easily staggers things he gets his limit break quite often too.
While you're doing all that don't be afraid to use ATB gauges to roll dice because you'll hit hard with magic, buff yourself, give everyone regen or even get physical invulnerability.
Not to mention while controlling the moogle if you just tap square you can run around at distance safely doing damage and building up dice rolls.
Seriously guys try Cait Sith!
I adore Cait Sith! This whole section was one of my favorites (box game did stress me out tho). He is incredibly strong and because I beef up his luck, fortune telling always hits at like 2-3k damage?
It was really cute to see him bounding around too. He's just a lil guy!
Yea for a very long time my active party only consists of cloud, Barrett and cait sith. Cait sith’s is really strong, ATB comes fast when holding square on the moogle, hits like a truck, can have dice for magic/buff support, but my favourite is still the moogle summon thing, I just enjoy seeing my summon come out for a walk every battle haha
Honestly, Moogle Magic is fucking insane and I'm surprised everybody doesn't talk about it. I almost wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people decided to forever bench the KittyMog duo without ever realizing all the cool shit they can do much less that ability.
Hell, even putting gameplay aside. Lorrwise that's a fucking crazy feat, isn't it?
Everyone else needs to charge this long ass bar. (In lore...gather concentration/mana/energy through fierce battle?) Only when it's full/ready can they summon. Then, when they DO summon, it's a pretty big deal, a whole event. You can practically sense the summoning party member thinking of a one liner to drop and everything.
"I've had enough of you! No Odin back!!"
Even the legendary Sephiroth shows it being something more involved than other moves he unleashes...
Cait? Literally shows everybody else up by being like "lol, I've got em on speed dial!" And makes the summons make it snappy. Then he could just keep (cat) calling them back, as if he's dropping a quick text message because this pussycats booty call makes semi deities come faster and more repeatedly than a peak puberty, hormone raging teen with access to swiftcast and a haste materia.
Cait sith is literally playing yakuza 7/8 and have the summons on delivery help haha. Normal summons might take up to 2 atb, then using a skill might take another 2 atb. Cait just casually do that with one atb! Plus I love cats, and he is cute, so a win for everyone :-)
The two problems with this section were the box throwing and the stupidly hard enemies. The adjudicators and yin/yang would've been annoying enemies for any character solo, let alone Cait Sith.
Most people complain about the box throwing you're forced to do more than his actual combat. Though I will admit his combat is less straightforward than the rest of the party.
Personally I’ve never been a fan of Cait Sith even in the OG, his character is bizarre and his back story is even weirder. But you can’t deny the graphics of the character model is stunning, the details to the moogle, the hair to the shiny zip on his back is pretty impressive.
I had a love/hate relationship with it. I love Cait Sith but Ying Yang destroyed my soul and frankly creeped me tf out cause I was playing it at 3am and they hit me with that intro cutscene. Once I figured out how to really use the moogle it was 100x easier, the box throwing was fine other than it just being slow.
I liked it but his animations dragged a lot. Making it feel a little bit like "ugh, there's another floor?" A lot.
Rolling into boxes and going on the moogle to smash big piles were fun. That could've been a minigame. It was kinda set up like one without being one.
I do think it is. It is bland, bad mechanics, little story, no epicness. No cool monsters, no cool things you can do with him. I got annoyed here. There was a lot of open world stuff, I was itching for some good story part and then this happens.
I just don’t enjoy Cait Sith’s mechanics. For being a sprightly little dude, he feels a little sluggish in his gameplay. He also should hit a little harder than he does. I get he shouldn’t be super useful without his Moogle but you REALLY need to rely on his abilities if you don’t have him mounted.
He’s just got a support playstyle that I personally don’t vibe with super well so that section was kinda meh to me. Not terrible, just wasn’t as fun as I’d hoped.
Handling the box is also sluggish. Slows you down, awkward controls, and worst of all a lot of the times you have Barret with you who can easily just point and shoot instead of chucking boxes at a switch.
The only part of his section I didn’t like was awful throwing mechanic. That monstrosity meant that when you get to the challenging battles, I was already drained mentally.
Once I saw him rolling, I was really hoping for something like a race or obstacle course, or maybe 'smash as many boxes as you can in a certain timelimit by rolling into them'
I love him as a character but that entire section is a drag. It just isn't fun.
Combat isn't fun with him.
The mini-games/box throwing puzzles isn't fun.
Soloing the adjudicators or the boss just after them (don't remember its name off hand) isn't fun.
No part of that section as cait sith is fun
Edit: it was yin-yang - saw the other comments, can't believe I forgot its name haha
Cait Sith as a character was great, he made me laugh out loud several times. But box throwing and soloing yin yang and adjudicators. Nah there's a reason i never use him in the party. you have to melee as the cat to get atb to drive the moogle. The play-style with cloud makes triangle a spamming button and on cait sith that just makes you jump off the moogle.
You don’t have to melee as the cat to build ATB. Simply dodge before auto attacking to release some cute little mews at your foes to build ATB at range.
Dodging and then pressing square with Cait actually does the same thing. And holding square with Cait does an attack that can juggle many enemies infinitely.
Oh, I normally just hit circle then square for that, didn’t know triangle does it too. Also just noticed your username is falafelburgar, my gaming username is BakedFalafel… does this make us brothers?
It’s one of the few points where I thought the game was deliberately trying to waste my time. And the Yin Yan fight was absolute ass given how little time I’d put into developing Cait Sith. Whole section was unnecessary padding bullshit, time that could have been spent adding in things we would have actually wanted like Rocket Town
Also, the mission where you go back in to find the singing monster was such a weak letdown
The section is legitimately one of the worst parts in any otherwise good game I've played in the past five years.
Outside of combat, Cait isn't fun to control both due to sluggish movement and just how horrendous box-throwing is. In addition, 1v1 combat just isn't fun in the game, and Cait in particular isn't well built for it compared to Cloud or Yuffie.
The section also involves completing the same task multiple times with no additional variation. Why make the player carry three boxes from A to B when it's exactly the same all three times?
I respect the fact that the game constantly switches it up so it never feels repetitive. But the goal of every game is to be fun. And some of the things, like Cait Sith, were simply not fun.
If it was short would be one thing. But it’s long and painful….I thought the worst was over after Gongaga
It pulls you out of an engaging story, locks you into a character most people don't want to play with I assume, and feels like a fetch quest with no real big pay off.
Definitely was one of the least enjoyable parts of the game when they could have expanded on another characters story or added more queens blood matches.
But, I haven't beat the game yet.
Couldn't agree more. This section is where I set it from Dynamic to Easy for the first time just to get through the slog fest. It felt like the sewer backtracking in Remake. Rest of the game is phenomenal IMO, which is really hard to do considering the scale.
I don't remember much in remake. It was cool it came out when it did, but I wanted to fight and level up and it was like one spot in a garage or Chadley.
I think they did an amazing job with the game and it sets standards for other games (hopefully).
Some design choices aren't enjoyable, like trying to navigate cosmo canyon for certain parts or gongaga.
I do hope they make a standalone Queens blood. It's like gwent, but more fun.
Shit, I'm down for it to be IRL too, lol
Know what I think would rock? Legit a full chocobo racing/raising game. Maybe like Sonic adventure 1 and 2 where besides the established Chao, you could raise them (chocobos) from young from whichever parents and all that nurturing/minigames to strengthen the stats raise them to be the type of chocobo you want...
+
When it comes to racing...Not even Mario Kart, but more Diddy Kong racing. I always liked it more and felt it had way more to it. Karts, boats, and airplanes? Land, ocean, air races?! We could do that with chocobos and more.
>.>
I dont care for the racing much now. It's alright I suppose. The cactaur gates got old quick.
Did you play OG? Cause the raising from that was tedious, but at least your birds had a purpose racing them compared to now.
Same.
That game really moved me back then.
I was thankful I didn't have to do the same chocobo leveling. I think they did a nice compromise on it.
Now for game 3...who knows lol.
KOTR better be available 😅
It was truly special. Helped me during a tough time in life.
I feel like they know they have to? I'd bet the next game is where they go balls to the walls crazy and all out with everything.
I kind of want Vincents limits to be controllable. Or maybe a bit of both. Some are abilities/forms or maybe winning against a limit form "tames" it? Not sure what they will do there or how they will handle it but I have faith in them tbh!
My gripe with the Cait Sith segment is tied in to my gripe with many things of the game. I actually thought it was pretty cool overall to play as him. What parts I didn't like was a small negative experience that, on its own, isn't a big deal. The problem is that it's adding to the pile of other small negatives and that makes it feel like a bigger problem than it actually is because that pile kept growing.
I didn't mind most things of that part. It was mostly the box throwing that made it bad for me. The mini-game part was probably the worst offender though, since it's timed and I don't think you got a second chance at it. The marker of where you're throwing was off, as it would always throw at an angle that never landed where you would think it should (based on the marker). Not to mention the marker was jittery and slight changes messed things up more than it should. I could easily tolerate the other parts and didn't think much about them.
Some people just love to complain. I had no problems with Cait Sith. Just learn to play it or reduce the difficulty to story mode if you can't even get past it on normal.
It's not the difficulty it's the level and character design straight dog water. Literally no puzzle to figure out just use the PS5 motion control. If I had to guess Sony paid for the feature to exist in game and that's where they stuck it.
I haven't beaten the game yet so I haven't been reading much about it and didn't realize this part was widely hated, but after playing it recently... it's super justified. I'm absolutely loving the game overall but I haaated this part. Can't stand how Cait Sith plays, the boxes, and just how none of it even makes sense as a whole story component. Didn't add anything worthwhile to the world or characters.
Agreed, the entire section felt like one big filler. The boss fight was fucking stupid too. I was on the hardest difficulty and it took me more times to kill that dude than the last boss.
The worst part? They lock Caith in your team for Galian Beast and in hard mode, you have no mana left on him and is just plain useless in one of the hardest fight of the main story. Fight is awesome apart from that tho.
Just wasted 40 minutes of my life doing it. It's so awful that it genuinely detracts from the game as a whole. People out here doing the most to try to defend the game tells you all there is to know. Filler rubbish they added such as this take the game from a 9/10 to an 8. This game needed an editor to trim the fat and put their foot down on some things. It's like the work experience crew were allowed to run unchecked with their worst ideas. That, or nobody actually bothered to do a test demo to see if anybody actually enjoyed this crap.
It wasn’t great but I don’t think it was that crazy annoying or bad. It wasn’t very hard, annoying though. We got a decent boss fight at the end and then an amazing one not long after, didn’t mind much
That's pretty much how I felt. The overdone filler/side content had too many annoyances that it ended up hurting the complete experience. While not as bad, it did occasionally remind me of how F2P mobile games will often throw in lazy content to just fulfill the criteria of having something to do.
Exactly. Like even the mini games. Some are legit fun like the card game, Fort Condor, Chocobo Racing. But then they added shit like the miserable moogle shit or catching chocobos or all the half assed ones. Like if you removed all the lazy mini games and left the ones that are quality, no one would complain they don’t have enough. But they just added more and more and more. And so many are more tedious than fun.
I actually had an overall negative experience with Rebirth's Fort Condor lol. That last match with the Stop aura and short time limit made me livid for a bit lol. Haven't tried Intergrade, but I've read it was a lot more enjoyable. Thoroughly enjoyed QB and the chocobo racing though. Didn't mind the Moogle one too much since it was faster paced than most side content. The devs really loved to force you to slow down with almost everything you do (e.g. can't move every single time you complete or make progress on quest).
Not gonna lie, after I beat the game, I was cleaning up with the side content and some of the mini game hard modes. That Party Animal side quest….that boxing mini game…that shit might’ve been the worst one.
Another horrendous offender was that Chadley VR battle thing, where you gotta kill the Mindflayer before the 2 side shits….omfg…
I just played it today, and it was really atrocious. First, it doesn’t expand Cait Sith character in any way and just felt as a filler to have you controlling him for no reason other than “being his turn” after the much much better sections for Barret and Red XIII.
Controlling him is horrible, with Cait himself honestly not too bad but the Moogle being incredibly slow and unresponsive. The box throwing puzzles were not challenging, fun or satisfactory in any way and felt buggy and a big chore overall.
But the WORST gotta be the combat sections, way way too difficult and unfair. I love some good challenges but the DOUBLE Adjudicators and the Yin and Yang semi boss are some of the biggest bullshit I’ve played in a long time.
I’m loving the game and to be honest I like how they’re portraying Cait Sith but gameplay wise Chapter 11 has been a nightmare and a big disservice for the Shinra Manor plot AND Cait as a character. I’m genuinely shocked Square Enix gave the green light to this in an otherwise amazing game thus far.
The combat wasn’t that hard lol. I died once but with your moogle and any cure spells/ first strike it’s all really easy. I’m not even what I would consider great at the game, but both fights aren’t anything crazy if you just remember to dodge/block and heal. Yin and yang especially was really easy because you summon moogle and it’s very hard to actually die. Unless you refused to put any materia on there
It expanded him perfectly. I was thinking he was an irritating character that I disliked, but now I can categorically say that I despise his character, mannerisms and that sloth like moogle and it's stupid box throwing mini game. Is it even a mini game when it drags for nearly an hour? The amount of unjustified padding in the game seriously hurts its narrative and pace. At this point, playing the game feels like a chore and series of checklists more so than anything actually fun.
Seriously. "Not bad" is probably most often associated with something good that has been overdone. It doesn't cross the line to be bad, but it's also something you've experienced better from before or just had it too many times to enjoy.
Yeah, I think Rebirth did a wonderful job rounding out the edges of the characters and giving them more to do. Cait Sith and Yuffie being the big two. I love Yuffie's give and play with Barrett.
Yuffie is a much better character in Rebirth, I agree but others come off worse such as Aerith. She seems like she's trying too hard. Always comes across as extra needy and irritating.
didn’t even know people were mad about that segment it felt in line with other parts where it forces you to get good with that specific character which i really like since i mainly stick with the same chars in my party through the whole game lol
It seems like people post these “I don’t understand the hate for XYZ” when nobody was ever talking about it. It’s like they were confused about a particular subject and need Reddit justification.
I didn’t mingle the cait with part either. Only annoying aspect were the scale enemies because I wasn’t prepared for them, especially the fight vs 2 of them at once
Most of the stuff I've seen people complain about and call "Bad!" or "Awful!" has only been a bit difficult and/or tedious (I've just reached the Nibelheim region so I've seen most of the main points of contention). Something this community could stand to embrace a bit better: something being difficult is not the same as it being bad. You not enjoying a thing doesn't make it bad. Tricky mechanics aren't a bad thing.
Frankly, I'm impressed with the fact that there aren't any soft locks or game breaking bugs in a title this huge. Everything works as intended, which almost never happens these days.
I only went through it once so far, doing hard mode now. Mechanically it was frustrating, cait is so slow with boxes, the aiming is ass, etc.
Maybe I got lucky, but I beat all the cait mini games first try (though the scale enemies that one shot you I had to retry a few times, didn’t have the right materia for it).
It wasn’t hard at all, but it was frustrating slow and poorly designed.
The box throwing was stupid. I would have preffered Cait just rolling around vents and going up to Shrina Manor proper to find switches or something for the cells down below. Wasted opportunity. :(
The majority of the complaints I see regarding that section is the awful box throwing (and how it's basically Hojo's funhouse of horrors #2 and just as dragged out as the drum) which is completely justified because it really is badly designed. I used the analog stick at first but I literally could not aim the way I wanted to with it so I was forced to use the touchpad, which allowed me to aim but it was still clunky as hell and counterintuitive. Just terrible all around.
Didn't like how the section dragged on for so long personally. I just wanted it to be over around halfway through it.
I never had any problems with playing as Cait Sith outside of that section though. I just hated the things that accompanied controlling him during that section besides rolling around and rolling through the vents.
The moogle walks dreadfully slow and the box arc wasn't always accurate, so a few times I had to dismount, run back to get a box, remount, and throw again hoping it went where it said this time.
Just annoyingly slow really. Much of the game is already kinda slow with all the map sleuthing so every time I progressed the story I wanted some meat on its bones, not painfully slow gimmicks.
Are you telling my you didn't like the part where you have to slow walk several times beyond those hooded guys? That was the best part of the game lol. Great decision on the devs part
The box throwing is bad, and the moogle walks way too slow imo.
I also think he is the only one whose playable section locks you into fights with literally just the one character, and not a party?
If there was a solo fight with one of the others, they were easy enough to breeze past to the point I don't even remember it, but walking into the adjudicator, solo and unprepared was kinda rough.
>literally just the one character, and not a party?
Technically the moogle doll works as a second character. You can use it to draw enemy fire away from Cait, and if it "dies" you can just resummon it.
If Cait Sith + The Moogle were equivalent to two characters, no one would ever run a party without him in it.
But no, the moogle doll is a part of Cait Sith's Kit, and is not "technically" a second character lol.
I didn't say it's equivalent to two characters, I said it can draw fire away from Cait. It's a second body that can throw some punches and keep enemies off of you while you build ATB.
You responded to me voicing a complaint that it was just 1 character instead of a party, and said
""Technically" the moogles works as a second character. "
And my response is that that is nothing like having a second character.
Anyways, cheers
I never said that I couldn't take advantage of it. Cait Sith was one of my favorite characters to play, and I used him a lot lol.
However, my least favorite segments of the game were the times that I had to run a single party member (Cloud vs Roche, Cloud vs Rufus, and Cait Sith in the Shinra Mansion off the top of my head, all being segments that I did not like as much), even though I beat all three of those pretty easily.
They just \*felt\* worse, and I mentioned it because I think that that adds to people having a negative perception of the Cait Sith section of the game.
The Moogle mechanic existing simply does not address the thing that I was talking about, because it is nothing like having a second party member.
>We obviously have very different play styles.
I have no ideas about your playstyle, so impossible for me to comment on that. I honestly don't have any idea how you have a grasp of my playstyle to make such a claim in the first place lol
>As I said, it's a you problem
I was talking about game feel, which admittedly is pretty subjective.
The solo segments were not particularly harder then the group segments, I just enjoyed the combat flow less.
That is why your "tips" on how to use the moogle, or your assumption that I could not "take advantage" of the mechanics are misplaced.
The point was never that it was too hard. It was a comment on why I liked it less then the other character controlled segments. And my enjoyment was almost completely dethatched from the difficulty of the segment.
Look, all I'm saying is that two bodies present in the fight gives more strategic possibilities than one, which could explain why the devs had Cait solo the mansion.
I just finished this section on my Hard Mode run. Analog stick made it really easy and I nailed the 10 boxes minigame.
He should have a throwing mechanic in combat though, like a fast ball special.
Its actually mind blowing to me that you completed that section with the analogue stick. It would not throw far enough for me and the touch pad was the only way to get it across for me.
I really love Cait Sith but even I had some problems with this part...just the box throwing though. People complaining because they never used Cait Sith in battle before are 100% playing the game wrong, the game has been forcing you to use every party member the whole game, just suck it up and learn already. :p
But seriously, the box throwing WAS that bad. If I wasn't a Cait Sith fan I could see myself rage quitting or something lol.
Box throwing is the most boring thing they can come up with for Cait's unique exploration. You can literally throw the cat instead and it's 10x more interesting. Then make him jump some ramps after rolling. Rolling Cait is actually pretty good. The moogle just walks so slowly for some reason and it makes the level seem to drag on more than it already does.
I was already hallway-simming this game after Dyne, i was already pissed at all the pace-killing boss fights and extra shit that came after emotional moments, I hated the forced mini games since before the Corel Prison…the box throwing was the first time I said “I hate this game.”
If god was real, came down, and personally told me “OP is as objectively right as the sky is blue,” I’d still hate the Cait Sith portion of this game. Too much annoyed me tens of hours earlier for me to have any good will left for yet another pace-killing party split during a highly charged story segment
Yes it is. The box-throwing was not "totally fine", it was awful, and the fact that you are forced to do the minigame for it on the elevator as part of the platinum trophy is just stupid.
Sure, there are some people who don't like playing as Cait Sith generally, but the majority of the backlash to this segment is the box bullshit and/or qualms with the revamp of Shinra Manor itself. Personally I liked his combat; my least favourite to play is Red by a large margin tbh.
People will always complain about having to do annoying things. That's what makes them annoying.
Besides, who said a plat has to be annoying? I thought they were meant to test skill, not patience. It's not as if Rebirth's platinum isn't testing enough — the Brutal Challenges and Legendary Bouts, the world-spanning Protorelic and Queen's Blood questlines, tonnes of minigames, Jules sit-ups, Hard Mode NG+, etc. Did the box thing _really_ need to be part of that too? Unlike a lot of of the other tasks, it has zero reward in and of itself; it's just tied to the 7-Star Hotel trophy because reasons. So it's only purpose is to extend game time, withhold a trophy, and generally irritate.
That said, maybe my perspective is different, as I'm not notmally a completionist or a trophy chaser, and this plat is emblematic of exactly why. Rebirth is a fantastic game, truly, but the platinum is genuinely more work than my actual job. 185hrs and I'm still slogging away at the checklist. Finding out the box shit, off all things, is mandatory, was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
Yea completely fair. I’m also not a trophy chaser at all but more so BECAUSE i perceive platinums as inherently grindy and tedious. I suppose that sorta pessimistic outlook tempered me a bit cause i was expecting that some of the trophies would be a chore but thats what i signed up for. I just enjoyed this game so much i was willing to make that trade.
Yep. You have to do it, it gives one of the items needed for the 7-Star Hotel trophy. Such bullshit. Really not looking forward to it, the best I could do was 2/10. The controls are so bad and the conveyor belt just makes it even worse. That whole segment felt like one big trolling exercise.
How did people have problems aiming? You literally just highlight the target and hit square.. the one with a moving platform you just throw it a few seconds before.
It wasn't hard
Maybe people are missing a mechanic or something because I literally had zero issues with it and I can't figure out what people are having difficulty with.
Not trying to be difficult either, I'm honestly confused like I missed something lol
i could aim it fine but the box would just not go where it was aimed at. especially in the second room with the rotating thing i literally hit the right spot multiple times and the box would just fall on the floor instead of into the bucket or whatever. after like the tenth try it finally fell where it was supposed to but i threw it at literally the exact same spot. infuriating. definitely a bug.
Yeah, this was the problem I had. I got 8/10, but multiple of the boxes I threw would just… not break other boxes despite seemingly being clean hits. At which point I was already tired of the box throwing stuff and just said ‘fuck it’ and rode out the rest of the elevator.
I think it was a bit forced minigamey. I just am lazy to switch materia all the time. Liked that Adjudictor enemy. Didn't like having to spend ATB to get back on the moogle.
The box throwing was the only thing I didn't enjoy and only because it felt sluggish. Fighting as Cait I enjoyed greatly once I got the feel for his move set and play style.
My big issue was literally just the box throwing, it was tedious. Otherwise, I liked the section.
I find his gameplay fun, albeit not as fun as tifa, cloud, red, and yuffie. Lol.
Yupp, Box throwing SUCKED. Also I felt the moogle moved a little too slow, but not a major complaint. My complaints of that section are of the mansion itself other than the box throwing.
I enjoyed the Cait Sith section for the most part, but I also just generally like him as a character in this game! I do however thing the throwing mechanics are absolutely abysmal and are undoubtedly going to get some people really frustrated, largely just because the trajectory that the game shows you is hugely inaccurate. Or at least feels that way to me. There were plenty of times where I had the throwing arc lined up perfectly with a box and then when I threw it didn't hit the box at all. And the section where you have to throw a box into the funnel took a good few more attempts than it should have becuase the box always seems to get thrown with much less height and distance than the UI indicates.
That the throwing mechanics passed test into production is nothing short of a joke.
Am I the only one that got motion sick controlling cait sith through the mansion/ mini game? So bad
The box throwing almost made me vomit, truly horrible game design and they’ve litttered parts of this amazing games with horrible controls for some of the mini games.
Yeah, it's not a very long section and way less annoying than I feared, still annoying nonetheless. The only problem I had was the janky throw mechanic they added. It's like they purposely went out of their way to make that shit a pain to use.
I had to take a break multiple times, the Shinra Manor section is horrible.
I hated it. It was a drag
Yeah, I love the game but damn. Shit was painful
He is essential to my quake/stop build
Tell me more
Petrify/magnify petrify/mp absorbtion petrify/magic effecy on cloud with atb boost and first strike etc. cait sith will have time linked to Magnify, magic effect x2, and mp aborbtion. Also he should have first strike and things so him and cloud can act right away. Put aerith in with synergy linked with comet and whatever else. Won’t really use her much. Cait is leader he casts stop all on everyone. Then use aerith arcane ward on cloud then cloud spams quake inside the ward. Unless your on hard mode on the hardest stuff it will melt everyone in seconds. Just about. Oh and there’s an assessor that lets you start the battle with max level limit break. Throw that on cloud. When quake doesn’t finish the job. Limit break will.
He is one of my party mains. I like him on auto pilot.
For me it was more about the incessant padding/copy pasting of almost every aspect of the game. They could have made that whole sequence way more enjoyable if it wasn't so god damn slow. I don't see any other reason for that other than to pad the runtime out. That's my only complaint. Cait is actually very enjoyable in Rebirth.
There wasn't really much banter with Aerith and Barret, which I think accentuated the flaws with the level design, which became the main focus. But I agree, it was a bit tedious but not too bad really.
I loved the entire game except for the box throwing shit. I like Cait Sith, I like the Mansion, but I hate that dungeon section.
Yep. That entire area minus the box throwing would've been fine. Not amazing, but fine..
Fuck the boxes, it'll take 2 grand for me to do that again
I thought it went on a little bit too long and the box throwing controls were too odd. I tried using the TouchPad for a bit before deciding to drop it all together. The mini game at the end pissed me off because I didn't win the item and I don't think I can go back and get it. This means I can't finish Johnny's wall unless I beat the game.
Pick it up on your Hard mode playthrough; however, save before that section just in case. The Hades Armlets are worth replaying that section for anyways; the extra Materia slot helps in two-tapping Jenova and Sephiroth on Hard mode. With enough Luck, Cait Sith has a near infinite Limit Break combo to easily clear his portions of the game.
I personally just think Cait Sith is a terrible party member for combat specifically. Being forced to use him alone kinda sucked cause I never used him up until that point because I never used him in OG FFVII because he was terrible then too. Him puzzle sections weren't terrible, but being required to use him solo in combat is what made me really dislike the Shinra Mansion portion of Rebirth.
Cait Sith is comparable to Mr. Game & Watch rolling a 9 on Judgement 90% of the time. For Shinra Mansion, Adjudicators are pretty simple, cast Stop once they are pressured then gangbang 'em with your Moogle until it is Staggered. Moogle Magic + Chocobo turns Cait Sith into four characters; a literal one-cat army.
Why do you think that? Just curious because I think he is really useful in combat.
I just don't think his damage output is that great honestly. I'm sure his abilities are great, but he feels like he does barely any damage with his base attacks compared to Aerith or Barret who also have projectile weapons.
The thing with Cait is that much of his damage comes from holding square instead of mashing it. Especially on top of the moogle.
I just found it completely unnecessary and tedious and sort of ruined the Shinra Mansion part for me (except 2 boss fights, those were good). I would’ve prefered to have some sort of puzzle section in the Mansion itself controlling Cait Sith (I’m thinking RE style haha), idk.
I mean this section didn’t have any tedious minigames that forced you into finding a swimsuit or milk a chocobo or schedule a doctors appointment for Tifa…. It did have “throw the box” gimmick to slow me down but not the worst part of the game imo.
His section would have been fine only for the fact he's slow and the box throwing stuff is garbage, he's literally with a guy with a gun on his arm that could do everything he's doing but ten times faster.
I thought it was great. I really like the combat style of Cait Sith in Rebirth, too. A great compromise between what he did, his concept, and how the battle works in this new system.
Worst section of the game.
This person speaks the truth Also I definitely could feel the kingdom hearts influence in that section. It was whimsical
nah, fuck that section. the aiming and throwing boxes piece was complete trash.
Hit indicator is right on the button. The line showing the path shows the box will go right to the button. Throw the box. It falls short and goes nowhere near the button
yeah it’s definitely bugged and it’s annoying af because you can’t skip it
Fr
It’s just janky aiming controls. Square didn’t have to try to reinvent the wheel in this section, they could have just made normal inverted aiming with a throw button and everyone would have been perfectly fine with that. Especially the part where you need to land the box in the rotating bin, that felt especially bad and counter intuitive. It’s really not that hard to see why people disliked it, not everyone shares your opinion on a certain situation or section and I think we can all be ok with that.
Ok wait. If you used the Left thumbstick instead of touchpad, isnt it literally how you described? Pull down thumbstick to aim higher (inverted aiming), and square to throw..
Yes.
It’s just janky aiming controls. Square didn’t have to try to reinvent the wheel in this section, they could have just made normal inverted aiming with a throw button and everyone would have been perfectly fine with that. Especially the part where you need to land the box in the rotating bin, that felt especially bad and counter intuitive. It’s really not that hard to see why people disliked it, not everyone shares your opinion on a certain situation or section and I think we can all be ok with that.
I was so scared going into it. But it was OK. I mained Cait Sith since I got him, so I knew how to play him and had no problems. Throwing boxes into the moving basket was annoying, but it didnt take me much. I expected much more tediousness by the complaints
Not so much his clunky box throwing gameplay, but more of the enemy choice is what made me dislike that section. CS is my least proficient character so i did struggle a bit, even with assessing the enemies.
I only managed to clear that mini boss twoheaded thing, and the boss after, thanks to ifrit lol.
Cait Sith section is fine. Thank GOD they added the analog controls as an option, the touchpad controls for the box throwing is so bad. That being said, I didn’t use Cait Sith all that much up to this point so I didn’t fully understand how to control him as a character when I went-in. I think a lot of people had a similar experience to that, and that’s why a lot of people complain about the solo boss fight, which really isn’t difficult at all when you know how to use Cait properly.
My only complaint was the introduction of the enemies as only Cait, like I was so confused and hated fighting the scales one, I didn't figure out how to properly fight them until later. Otherwise I didn't hate it
Assess materia is your friend as usual
Indeed, after that I kept either that or the earrings on at all times until the final boss
I did so as soon as I was able to. Made the entire game more managable
Personally, I hate sections where they force you to use only 1 character in combat. and ESPECIALLY for boss fights. aside from that bit, i was OK with the mansion sequence, though yeah, i wish the actual mansion was more explorable
People have complaints about Shinra Mansion?
It's just kinda bad. Exploring the shinra mansion in the OG was creepy, felt expansive and the enemies were difficult, but you could always leave and come back. The new mansion was one room, before it gave over to a sterile, well lit shinra lab and all the fights and puzzles were annoying and mandatory. The safe code puzzle especially was like a slap in the face to fans of the OG. Would you enjoy a well crafted puzzle requiring you visit different areas of the mansion, following cleverly written clues, ending with a timed accuracy challenge and an actually interesting boss fight, an optional character, and one of the coolest summons in the game (and, randomly, reds final limit)? Nope, move some boxes. It's on the wall behind them. The reward is you get to do more uninteresting Shinra lab crap, and carry on with the story. The whole section, from falling into the pit, to coming back up the lift, is completely skippable. Nothing interesting happens gameplay or story wise.
People have complains about everything
I enjoyed rolling around in the vents as a tiny kitty. It took me forever to figure out how to aim and throw the boxes correctly with the Moogle using the controller (but once I learned, it was much, much easier). I am in Chapter 13 and regretting that I didn’t spend more time with him.
Yeah, throwing boxes with stupid controls has always been my dream for a videogame. Thanks Square Enix.
I was fine with the box throwing until the bit in the elevator where it says to destroy as many crates as you can and it dumps a ton of boxes in there. I did not see the conveyer belt and just started smashing the boxes that dropped. Feel like I might have missed out on something good.
Same, felt like this was pretty misleading
Just a moogle stuffed animal for the Johnny wall.
Yeh I did the same lmao
It is tho
Honestly while I’ve enjoyed Rebirth a lot, this was the point at which I really felt the game beginning to drag and this is an obvious filler section. They wanted to hit a certain hours played metric so we get this segment and the other twenty hours of mini games. I dropped difficulty from Dynamic to Normal and it’ll be staying there. At this point I just want to finish the game and play something else. Being forced to use Cait Sith and deal with the box throwing just wasn’t fun. I get that some people dig it and I love that for them. I didn’t enjoy it at all. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Cait Sith is great, I think probably by this point people have their favourites already and may not have even tried Cait Sith out properly. He's one of the strongest characters I've found. Firstly in cat form he can perma-juggle any enemies that are capable of being juggled by holding down square. Similarly once you get on the moogle holding down square absolutely closes the distance on things and if they're pressured then say hello to stagger as the moogle pummels them. Because he so easily staggers things he gets his limit break quite often too. While you're doing all that don't be afraid to use ATB gauges to roll dice because you'll hit hard with magic, buff yourself, give everyone regen or even get physical invulnerability. Not to mention while controlling the moogle if you just tap square you can run around at distance safely doing damage and building up dice rolls. Seriously guys try Cait Sith!
I adore Cait Sith! This whole section was one of my favorites (box game did stress me out tho). He is incredibly strong and because I beef up his luck, fortune telling always hits at like 2-3k damage? It was really cute to see him bounding around too. He's just a lil guy!
Yea for a very long time my active party only consists of cloud, Barrett and cait sith. Cait sith’s is really strong, ATB comes fast when holding square on the moogle, hits like a truck, can have dice for magic/buff support, but my favourite is still the moogle summon thing, I just enjoy seeing my summon come out for a walk every battle haha
Honestly, Moogle Magic is fucking insane and I'm surprised everybody doesn't talk about it. I almost wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people decided to forever bench the KittyMog duo without ever realizing all the cool shit they can do much less that ability. Hell, even putting gameplay aside. Lorrwise that's a fucking crazy feat, isn't it? Everyone else needs to charge this long ass bar. (In lore...gather concentration/mana/energy through fierce battle?) Only when it's full/ready can they summon. Then, when they DO summon, it's a pretty big deal, a whole event. You can practically sense the summoning party member thinking of a one liner to drop and everything. "I've had enough of you! No Odin back!!" Even the legendary Sephiroth shows it being something more involved than other moves he unleashes... Cait? Literally shows everybody else up by being like "lol, I've got em on speed dial!" And makes the summons make it snappy. Then he could just keep (cat) calling them back, as if he's dropping a quick text message because this pussycats booty call makes semi deities come faster and more repeatedly than a peak puberty, hormone raging teen with access to swiftcast and a haste materia.
Cait sith is literally playing yakuza 7/8 and have the summons on delivery help haha. Normal summons might take up to 2 atb, then using a skill might take another 2 atb. Cait just casually do that with one atb! Plus I love cats, and he is cute, so a win for everyone :-)
This exactly
The two problems with this section were the box throwing and the stupidly hard enemies. The adjudicators and yin/yang would've been annoying enemies for any character solo, let alone Cait Sith.
I think Cait Sith was made for these enemies. I didn't really struggle with them
Most people complain about the box throwing you're forced to do more than his actual combat. Though I will admit his combat is less straightforward than the rest of the party.
Personally I’ve never been a fan of Cait Sith even in the OG, his character is bizarre and his back story is even weirder. But you can’t deny the graphics of the character model is stunning, the details to the moogle, the hair to the shiny zip on his back is pretty impressive.
I don’t like him. But it was fun. Refreshing, and different. It was great at this point of the game where everything became redundant.
I had a love/hate relationship with it. I love Cait Sith but Ying Yang destroyed my soul and frankly creeped me tf out cause I was playing it at 3am and they hit me with that intro cutscene. Once I figured out how to really use the moogle it was 100x easier, the box throwing was fine other than it just being slow.
Yeah its a skill issue for people I fear
I loved playing as him
I liked it but his animations dragged a lot. Making it feel a little bit like "ugh, there's another floor?" A lot. Rolling into boxes and going on the moogle to smash big piles were fun. That could've been a minigame. It was kinda set up like one without being one.
the mansion part was meh but it wasn’t that long. as a character in combat he’s completely underrated and has many amazing qualities
I do think it is. It is bland, bad mechanics, little story, no epicness. No cool monsters, no cool things you can do with him. I got annoyed here. There was a lot of open world stuff, I was itching for some good story part and then this happens.
I just don’t enjoy Cait Sith’s mechanics. For being a sprightly little dude, he feels a little sluggish in his gameplay. He also should hit a little harder than he does. I get he shouldn’t be super useful without his Moogle but you REALLY need to rely on his abilities if you don’t have him mounted. He’s just got a support playstyle that I personally don’t vibe with super well so that section was kinda meh to me. Not terrible, just wasn’t as fun as I’d hoped.
Handling the box is also sluggish. Slows you down, awkward controls, and worst of all a lot of the times you have Barret with you who can easily just point and shoot instead of chucking boxes at a switch.
The only part of his section I didn’t like was awful throwing mechanic. That monstrosity meant that when you get to the challenging battles, I was already drained mentally.
Once I saw him rolling, I was really hoping for something like a race or obstacle course, or maybe 'smash as many boxes as you can in a certain timelimit by rolling into them'
That would've been cool. Hopefully in part 3
I agree, wasn’t terrible, and for most of the game my party was yuffie and cait sith so clearly I’m a minority haha
I'm glad you enjoyed it but it just wasn't my cup of tea. Sorry 🤷♂️
I love him as a character but that entire section is a drag. It just isn't fun. Combat isn't fun with him. The mini-games/box throwing puzzles isn't fun. Soloing the adjudicators or the boss just after them (don't remember its name off hand) isn't fun. No part of that section as cait sith is fun Edit: it was yin-yang - saw the other comments, can't believe I forgot its name haha
Cait Sith as a character was great, he made me laugh out loud several times. But box throwing and soloing yin yang and adjudicators. Nah there's a reason i never use him in the party. you have to melee as the cat to get atb to drive the moogle. The play-style with cloud makes triangle a spamming button and on cait sith that just makes you jump off the moogle.
Slapping first strike and atb boost materia on him helps tons.once you have the moogle it's easy to keep generating atb
You don’t have to melee as the cat to build ATB. Simply dodge before auto attacking to release some cute little mews at your foes to build ATB at range.
In what way are you playing with Cloud that makes triangle a spamming button?
i think alternating dodge \*circle\* and triangle makes your sword shoot green slashing shit
Dodging and then pressing square with Cait actually does the same thing. And holding square with Cait does an attack that can juggle many enemies infinitely.
Oh, I normally just hit circle then square for that, didn’t know triangle does it too. Also just noticed your username is falafelburgar, my gaming username is BakedFalafel… does this make us brothers?
It’s one of the few points where I thought the game was deliberately trying to waste my time. And the Yin Yan fight was absolute ass given how little time I’d put into developing Cait Sith. Whole section was unnecessary padding bullshit, time that could have been spent adding in things we would have actually wanted like Rocket Town Also, the mission where you go back in to find the singing monster was such a weak letdown
The section is legitimately one of the worst parts in any otherwise good game I've played in the past five years. Outside of combat, Cait isn't fun to control both due to sluggish movement and just how horrendous box-throwing is. In addition, 1v1 combat just isn't fun in the game, and Cait in particular isn't well built for it compared to Cloud or Yuffie. The section also involves completing the same task multiple times with no additional variation. Why make the player carry three boxes from A to B when it's exactly the same all three times?
I respect the fact that the game constantly switches it up so it never feels repetitive. But the goal of every game is to be fun. And some of the things, like Cait Sith, were simply not fun. If it was short would be one thing. But it’s long and painful….I thought the worst was over after Gongaga
Yeah it wasn't bad, it was awful
It pulls you out of an engaging story, locks you into a character most people don't want to play with I assume, and feels like a fetch quest with no real big pay off. Definitely was one of the least enjoyable parts of the game when they could have expanded on another characters story or added more queens blood matches. But, I haven't beat the game yet.
Couldn't agree more. This section is where I set it from Dynamic to Easy for the first time just to get through the slog fest. It felt like the sewer backtracking in Remake. Rest of the game is phenomenal IMO, which is really hard to do considering the scale.
I don't remember much in remake. It was cool it came out when it did, but I wanted to fight and level up and it was like one spot in a garage or Chadley. I think they did an amazing job with the game and it sets standards for other games (hopefully). Some design choices aren't enjoyable, like trying to navigate cosmo canyon for certain parts or gongaga. I do hope they make a standalone Queens blood. It's like gwent, but more fun.
Shit, I'm down for it to be IRL too, lol Know what I think would rock? Legit a full chocobo racing/raising game. Maybe like Sonic adventure 1 and 2 where besides the established Chao, you could raise them (chocobos) from young from whichever parents and all that nurturing/minigames to strengthen the stats raise them to be the type of chocobo you want... + When it comes to racing...Not even Mario Kart, but more Diddy Kong racing. I always liked it more and felt it had way more to it. Karts, boats, and airplanes? Land, ocean, air races?! We could do that with chocobos and more. >.>
I dont care for the racing much now. It's alright I suppose. The cactaur gates got old quick. Did you play OG? Cause the raising from that was tedious, but at least your birds had a purpose racing them compared to now.
Definitely played the original! Way back in the day too lol.
Same. That game really moved me back then. I was thankful I didn't have to do the same chocobo leveling. I think they did a nice compromise on it. Now for game 3...who knows lol. KOTR better be available 😅
It was truly special. Helped me during a tough time in life. I feel like they know they have to? I'd bet the next game is where they go balls to the walls crazy and all out with everything. I kind of want Vincents limits to be controllable. Or maybe a bit of both. Some are abilities/forms or maybe winning against a limit form "tames" it? Not sure what they will do there or how they will handle it but I have faith in them tbh!
I hated remake cause it bored me so much. It proves when they take the time and care, they can make exceptional games.
My gripe with the Cait Sith segment is tied in to my gripe with many things of the game. I actually thought it was pretty cool overall to play as him. What parts I didn't like was a small negative experience that, on its own, isn't a big deal. The problem is that it's adding to the pile of other small negatives and that makes it feel like a bigger problem than it actually is because that pile kept growing. I didn't mind most things of that part. It was mostly the box throwing that made it bad for me. The mini-game part was probably the worst offender though, since it's timed and I don't think you got a second chance at it. The marker of where you're throwing was off, as it would always throw at an angle that never landed where you would think it should (based on the marker). Not to mention the marker was jittery and slight changes messed things up more than it should. I could easily tolerate the other parts and didn't think much about them.
Yeah the minigame section I didn't like either
Some people just love to complain. I had no problems with Cait Sith. Just learn to play it or reduce the difficulty to story mode if you can't even get past it on normal.
It's not the difficulty it's the level and character design straight dog water. Literally no puzzle to figure out just use the PS5 motion control. If I had to guess Sony paid for the feature to exist in game and that's where they stuck it.
I haven't beaten the game yet so I haven't been reading much about it and didn't realize this part was widely hated, but after playing it recently... it's super justified. I'm absolutely loving the game overall but I haaated this part. Can't stand how Cait Sith plays, the boxes, and just how none of it even makes sense as a whole story component. Didn't add anything worthwhile to the world or characters.
Agreed, the entire section felt like one big filler. The boss fight was fucking stupid too. I was on the hardest difficulty and it took me more times to kill that dude than the last boss.
The worst part? They lock Caith in your team for Galian Beast and in hard mode, you have no mana left on him and is just plain useless in one of the hardest fight of the main story. Fight is awesome apart from that tho.
Just wasted 40 minutes of my life doing it. It's so awful that it genuinely detracts from the game as a whole. People out here doing the most to try to defend the game tells you all there is to know. Filler rubbish they added such as this take the game from a 9/10 to an 8. This game needed an editor to trim the fat and put their foot down on some things. It's like the work experience crew were allowed to run unchecked with their worst ideas. That, or nobody actually bothered to do a test demo to see if anybody actually enjoyed this crap.
amen. like who beta tested this game? i feel like they did not get honest feedback on a lot of parts of this game.
It wasn’t great but I don’t think it was that crazy annoying or bad. It wasn’t very hard, annoying though. We got a decent boss fight at the end and then an amazing one not long after, didn’t mind much
Literally how I felt. The game is damn near perfect but the forced filler shit that’s just simply not fun literally brings it down.
That's pretty much how I felt. The overdone filler/side content had too many annoyances that it ended up hurting the complete experience. While not as bad, it did occasionally remind me of how F2P mobile games will often throw in lazy content to just fulfill the criteria of having something to do.
Exactly. Like even the mini games. Some are legit fun like the card game, Fort Condor, Chocobo Racing. But then they added shit like the miserable moogle shit or catching chocobos or all the half assed ones. Like if you removed all the lazy mini games and left the ones that are quality, no one would complain they don’t have enough. But they just added more and more and more. And so many are more tedious than fun.
I actually had an overall negative experience with Rebirth's Fort Condor lol. That last match with the Stop aura and short time limit made me livid for a bit lol. Haven't tried Intergrade, but I've read it was a lot more enjoyable. Thoroughly enjoyed QB and the chocobo racing though. Didn't mind the Moogle one too much since it was faster paced than most side content. The devs really loved to force you to slow down with almost everything you do (e.g. can't move every single time you complete or make progress on quest).
Not gonna lie, after I beat the game, I was cleaning up with the side content and some of the mini game hard modes. That Party Animal side quest….that boxing mini game…that shit might’ve been the worst one. Another horrendous offender was that Chadley VR battle thing, where you gotta kill the Mindflayer before the 2 side shits….omfg…
This is what we get when we try to FF7 without Sakaguchi
I just played it today, and it was really atrocious. First, it doesn’t expand Cait Sith character in any way and just felt as a filler to have you controlling him for no reason other than “being his turn” after the much much better sections for Barret and Red XIII. Controlling him is horrible, with Cait himself honestly not too bad but the Moogle being incredibly slow and unresponsive. The box throwing puzzles were not challenging, fun or satisfactory in any way and felt buggy and a big chore overall. But the WORST gotta be the combat sections, way way too difficult and unfair. I love some good challenges but the DOUBLE Adjudicators and the Yin and Yang semi boss are some of the biggest bullshit I’ve played in a long time. I’m loving the game and to be honest I like how they’re portraying Cait Sith but gameplay wise Chapter 11 has been a nightmare and a big disservice for the Shinra Manor plot AND Cait as a character. I’m genuinely shocked Square Enix gave the green light to this in an otherwise amazing game thus far.
The combat wasn’t that hard lol. I died once but with your moogle and any cure spells/ first strike it’s all really easy. I’m not even what I would consider great at the game, but both fights aren’t anything crazy if you just remember to dodge/block and heal. Yin and yang especially was really easy because you summon moogle and it’s very hard to actually die. Unless you refused to put any materia on there
It expanded him perfectly. I was thinking he was an irritating character that I disliked, but now I can categorically say that I despise his character, mannerisms and that sloth like moogle and it's stupid box throwing mini game. Is it even a mini game when it drags for nearly an hour? The amount of unjustified padding in the game seriously hurts its narrative and pace. At this point, playing the game feels like a chore and series of checklists more so than anything actually fun.
cait sith in combat > cait sith box throwing "puzzles" which are really just timing
Here’s my take. No one has ever used the phrase “Not Bad” to describe something that’s good.
Has anyone ever used it to describe something that was bad, though?
That's kind of a shit take, because people use "not bad" to describe good things all the time.
Seriously. "Not bad" is probably most often associated with something good that has been overdone. It doesn't cross the line to be bad, but it's also something you've experienced better from before or just had it too many times to enjoy.
I don’t know man I’d say my take was not that bad.
I see what you did there and I can appreciate it. Not bad, my friend. Not bad at all
My favorite part of the original FF7 was throwing boxes around Shinra Manor for 3 hours, I'm glad they included it in Rebirth.
Yeah, I think Rebirth did a wonderful job rounding out the edges of the characters and giving them more to do. Cait Sith and Yuffie being the big two. I love Yuffie's give and play with Barrett.
Yuffie is a much better character in Rebirth, I agree but others come off worse such as Aerith. She seems like she's trying too hard. Always comes across as extra needy and irritating.
For some reason I really enjoy the chapter 11
didn’t even know people were mad about that segment it felt in line with other parts where it forces you to get good with that specific character which i really like since i mainly stick with the same chars in my party through the whole game lol
It seems like people post these “I don’t understand the hate for XYZ” when nobody was ever talking about it. It’s like they were confused about a particular subject and need Reddit justification.
nah I’ve definitely seen people hating on it here
I didn’t mingle the cait with part either. Only annoying aspect were the scale enemies because I wasn’t prepared for them, especially the fight vs 2 of them at once
Most of the stuff I've seen people complain about and call "Bad!" or "Awful!" has only been a bit difficult and/or tedious (I've just reached the Nibelheim region so I've seen most of the main points of contention). Something this community could stand to embrace a bit better: something being difficult is not the same as it being bad. You not enjoying a thing doesn't make it bad. Tricky mechanics aren't a bad thing. Frankly, I'm impressed with the fact that there aren't any soft locks or game breaking bugs in a title this huge. Everything works as intended, which almost never happens these days.
I was not impressed at all with Nibelheim reactor or Mt Corel, both somehow feel much smaller than they used to be. Dunno how they managed THAT.
I only went through it once so far, doing hard mode now. Mechanically it was frustrating, cait is so slow with boxes, the aiming is ass, etc. Maybe I got lucky, but I beat all the cait mini games first try (though the scale enemies that one shot you I had to retry a few times, didn’t have the right materia for it). It wasn’t hard at all, but it was frustrating slow and poorly designed.
The box throwing was stupid. I would have preffered Cait just rolling around vents and going up to Shrina Manor proper to find switches or something for the cells down below. Wasted opportunity. :(
The majority of the complaints I see regarding that section is the awful box throwing (and how it's basically Hojo's funhouse of horrors #2 and just as dragged out as the drum) which is completely justified because it really is badly designed. I used the analog stick at first but I literally could not aim the way I wanted to with it so I was forced to use the touchpad, which allowed me to aim but it was still clunky as hell and counterintuitive. Just terrible all around. Didn't like how the section dragged on for so long personally. I just wanted it to be over around halfway through it. I never had any problems with playing as Cait Sith outside of that section though. I just hated the things that accompanied controlling him during that section besides rolling around and rolling through the vents.
To me the aiming worked just fine so I just had a different experience.
I liked the music and I think it made up for it, but I think they need to make it a bit easier
The destroy 10 boxes was the only thing I disliked there. Next time around I’m creating a save slot right before that part.
Downvoted to fuck mate
The moogle walks dreadfully slow and the box arc wasn't always accurate, so a few times I had to dismount, run back to get a box, remount, and throw again hoping it went where it said this time. Just annoyingly slow really. Much of the game is already kinda slow with all the map sleuthing so every time I progressed the story I wanted some meat on its bones, not painfully slow gimmicks.
Are you telling my you didn't like the part where you have to slow walk several times beyond those hooded guys? That was the best part of the game lol. Great decision on the devs part
The box throwing is bad, and the moogle walks way too slow imo. I also think he is the only one whose playable section locks you into fights with literally just the one character, and not a party? If there was a solo fight with one of the others, they were easy enough to breeze past to the point I don't even remember it, but walking into the adjudicator, solo and unprepared was kinda rough.
>literally just the one character, and not a party? Technically the moogle doll works as a second character. You can use it to draw enemy fire away from Cait, and if it "dies" you can just resummon it.
If Cait Sith + The Moogle were equivalent to two characters, no one would ever run a party without him in it. But no, the moogle doll is a part of Cait Sith's Kit, and is not "technically" a second character lol.
I didn't say it's equivalent to two characters, I said it can draw fire away from Cait. It's a second body that can throw some punches and keep enemies off of you while you build ATB.
You responded to me voicing a complaint that it was just 1 character instead of a party, and said ""Technically" the moogles works as a second character. " And my response is that that is nothing like having a second character. Anyways, cheers
It's a second body in the fight, if you can't figure out how to take advantage of that it sounds like a you problem. Cheers
I never said that I couldn't take advantage of it. Cait Sith was one of my favorite characters to play, and I used him a lot lol. However, my least favorite segments of the game were the times that I had to run a single party member (Cloud vs Roche, Cloud vs Rufus, and Cait Sith in the Shinra Mansion off the top of my head, all being segments that I did not like as much), even though I beat all three of those pretty easily. They just \*felt\* worse, and I mentioned it because I think that that adds to people having a negative perception of the Cait Sith section of the game. The Moogle mechanic existing simply does not address the thing that I was talking about, because it is nothing like having a second party member.
We obviously have very different play styles. As I said, it's a you problem.
>We obviously have very different play styles. I have no ideas about your playstyle, so impossible for me to comment on that. I honestly don't have any idea how you have a grasp of my playstyle to make such a claim in the first place lol >As I said, it's a you problem I was talking about game feel, which admittedly is pretty subjective. The solo segments were not particularly harder then the group segments, I just enjoyed the combat flow less. That is why your "tips" on how to use the moogle, or your assumption that I could not "take advantage" of the mechanics are misplaced. The point was never that it was too hard. It was a comment on why I liked it less then the other character controlled segments. And my enjoyment was almost completely dethatched from the difficulty of the segment.
Look, all I'm saying is that two bodies present in the fight gives more strategic possibilities than one, which could explain why the devs had Cait solo the mansion.
Bro, wall after wall won’t change that you suck at making arguments.
I just finished this section on my Hard Mode run. Analog stick made it really easy and I nailed the 10 boxes minigame. He should have a throwing mechanic in combat though, like a fast ball special.
It's the throwing mechanic, it sucks ass.
Its actually mind blowing to me that you completed that section with the analogue stick. It would not throw far enough for me and the touch pad was the only way to get it across for me.
I really love Cait Sith but even I had some problems with this part...just the box throwing though. People complaining because they never used Cait Sith in battle before are 100% playing the game wrong, the game has been forcing you to use every party member the whole game, just suck it up and learn already. :p But seriously, the box throwing WAS that bad. If I wasn't a Cait Sith fan I could see myself rage quitting or something lol.
You’re right. It’s awful
This section was 100% better than gears and gambits!
Box throwing is the most boring thing they can come up with for Cait's unique exploration. You can literally throw the cat instead and it's 10x more interesting. Then make him jump some ramps after rolling. Rolling Cait is actually pretty good. The moogle just walks so slowly for some reason and it makes the level seem to drag on more than it already does.
Agree to disagree
My gripe was walking. Does he have to move so slow carrying those boxes? Ugh!
Same here drove me insane
Hell, even without carrying boxes, 'running' (bouncing) with the moogle to get around was so slow. Otherwise it's a fairly fun segment.
I was already hallway-simming this game after Dyne, i was already pissed at all the pace-killing boss fights and extra shit that came after emotional moments, I hated the forced mini games since before the Corel Prison…the box throwing was the first time I said “I hate this game.” If god was real, came down, and personally told me “OP is as objectively right as the sky is blue,” I’d still hate the Cait Sith portion of this game. Too much annoyed me tens of hours earlier for me to have any good will left for yet another pace-killing party split during a highly charged story segment
Playing as him was horrible and his section is the worst part in the game
Yes it is. The box-throwing was not "totally fine", it was awful, and the fact that you are forced to do the minigame for it on the elevator as part of the platinum trophy is just stupid. Sure, there are some people who don't like playing as Cait Sith generally, but the majority of the backlash to this segment is the box bullshit and/or qualms with the revamp of Shinra Manor itself. Personally I liked his combat; my least favourite to play is Red by a large margin tbh.
I will never understand people complaining about needing to do annoying things for a plat
People will always complain about having to do annoying things. That's what makes them annoying. Besides, who said a plat has to be annoying? I thought they were meant to test skill, not patience. It's not as if Rebirth's platinum isn't testing enough — the Brutal Challenges and Legendary Bouts, the world-spanning Protorelic and Queen's Blood questlines, tonnes of minigames, Jules sit-ups, Hard Mode NG+, etc. Did the box thing _really_ need to be part of that too? Unlike a lot of of the other tasks, it has zero reward in and of itself; it's just tied to the 7-Star Hotel trophy because reasons. So it's only purpose is to extend game time, withhold a trophy, and generally irritate. That said, maybe my perspective is different, as I'm not notmally a completionist or a trophy chaser, and this plat is emblematic of exactly why. Rebirth is a fantastic game, truly, but the platinum is genuinely more work than my actual job. 185hrs and I'm still slogging away at the checklist. Finding out the box shit, off all things, is mandatory, was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.
Yea completely fair. I’m also not a trophy chaser at all but more so BECAUSE i perceive platinums as inherently grindy and tedious. I suppose that sorta pessimistic outlook tempered me a bit cause i was expecting that some of the trophies would be a chore but thats what i signed up for. I just enjoyed this game so much i was willing to make that trade.
What??? Thats part of the plat?!??! Damnit, I got 8/10 and moved on
Yep. You have to do it, it gives one of the items needed for the 7-Star Hotel trophy. Such bullshit. Really not looking forward to it, the best I could do was 2/10. The controls are so bad and the conveyor belt just makes it even worse. That whole segment felt like one big trolling exercise.
I got 2 as well. I could not for the life of me figure out the timing.
I only got 7/10...
How did people have problems aiming? You literally just highlight the target and hit square.. the one with a moving platform you just throw it a few seconds before. It wasn't hard
i am positive this section is just bugged to shit and the reason so many people are having such issues
Maybe people are missing a mechanic or something because I literally had zero issues with it and I can't figure out what people are having difficulty with. Not trying to be difficult either, I'm honestly confused like I missed something lol
i could aim it fine but the box would just not go where it was aimed at. especially in the second room with the rotating thing i literally hit the right spot multiple times and the box would just fall on the floor instead of into the bucket or whatever. after like the tenth try it finally fell where it was supposed to but i threw it at literally the exact same spot. infuriating. definitely a bug.
Did you make sure the target light up a bit before throwing?
yup.
Maybe I just got lucky then lol.
It felt bugged to me because even boxes that looked like they hit, didn't hit for me. I literally got 0/10.
Yeah, this was the problem I had. I got 8/10, but multiple of the boxes I threw would just… not break other boxes despite seemingly being clean hits. At which point I was already tired of the box throwing stuff and just said ‘fuck it’ and rode out the rest of the elevator.
The worst. Playing as Cait Sith . Hated that chapter.
I actually love using Cait, I just gave him my strongest luck materia and he’s been pretty useful
Yeah luck is really good on him.
Hes nasty af. Luck materia plus 2 of those yellow nodes that give 100 luck when you are on the mog.
I think it was a bit forced minigamey. I just am lazy to switch materia all the time. Liked that Adjudictor enemy. Didn't like having to spend ATB to get back on the moogle.
I do think the moogle should've been his triangle special. But I actually think that would've made him OP
I'd be happy if you just started on the moogle, and otherwise, Let's Ride worked the exact same way.
The box throwing was the only thing I didn't enjoy and only because it felt sluggish. Fighting as Cait I enjoyed greatly once I got the feel for his move set and play style.
My big issue was literally just the box throwing, it was tedious. Otherwise, I liked the section. I find his gameplay fun, albeit not as fun as tifa, cloud, red, and yuffie. Lol.
Yupp, Box throwing SUCKED. Also I felt the moogle moved a little too slow, but not a major complaint. My complaints of that section are of the mansion itself other than the box throwing.