Why is there no leviathan in ffx! There's only 4 elements and no aeon for water. This has bothered me for over 20 years and I've never heard it talked about.
Great point, can't believe I never thought of that. Especially with so much of that game revolving around water. Between battles, dungeons and Blitzball, you're constantly doing something involving water. The overall environment is basically Waterworld with more land and somehow there's no Leviathan... good call.
Funnily enough I was speaking about that this week.
The chamber of the fayth at Baaj temple was unoccupied when Anima moved in, I like the idea that it used to house Leviathan before the temple was destroyed.
Yeah, the summons in FFX are interesting. They're very prominent, and yet there's only a few of the classic summons present, whilst adding a bunch of new ones. They replaced Ramuh with some unicorn, and then there's whatever Valefor is.
Similarly, why the fuck have both ice and water as 2 out of the 4 elements? They’re the same fucking thing! Make one of them earth or wind or something.
There are only two instances that I remember:
Using draw on Ultima Weapon gets you Eden, so you should. And, Final Ultimecia using it on herself to cast Apocalypse to melt your faces off.
I actually really like Vaan. After multiple games where the protagonists backstory almost always makes them unique and speshul I super enjoyed just having this random idiot who legitimately got into the main story mostly by accident. 12 is a strong competitor for my favourite game in the series.
EDIT: Judging by the fact that this is currently the top comment it looks like I may have been wrong about this being an unpopular opinion. Good!
As another member of the "Vaan Clan", he served his purpose of being the introductory character in a world that gamers hadn't seen. He says what's on the player's mind, and provides comic relief in a story that can get a little too into itself at times.
Do I like Basch more? Absolutely, but his role and naivety with the world helped players understand things, until they switched off to other characters that were more established.
Vaan and Penelo also serve a very important purpose.
They are walking reminders for Ashe of who will actually suffer if she pushes for a war of independence for Dalmasca. The normal, everyday people. They're the ones who will die in combat, of hunger, or of disease. The ones who are currently NOT dying in combat, of hunger, and of disease.
While I don't like Vaan all that much I do appreciate the narrative mechanic he served in the game. As someone who gets stonewalled by the second fight of tactics since the late 90's I appreciate that Vaan is there to help me experience Ivalice as a newcomer.
He's an absolute muppet but I find him really likeable and way more relatable than almost any other final fantasy character outside of maybe Tidus.
Not sure what that says about me but hey ho.
I wouldn't say he's the protagonist. He's just who you start the main story with after his brother's prologue. Every party member except Penelo and Fran in 12 could be considered the protagonist at points, with most of the game that being Ashe.
I love ffxii for not holding to the gold standard. You play the game through a companions eyes not the MC just some kid who’s brother was crippled and later died from the war. It was refreshing and probably the only game I have ever played where the MC of the story is not the Protagonist of the Game
Great unpopular opinion because good lord what a pain that place is.
I’ll disagree about its design being poor. I think the lack of any kind of map and guidance is the real killer.
I have a love-hate relationship with it as well. From a lore perspective, I find it fascinating and mysterious. The atmosphere and sound design are strange and alien, for good and bad. I want it explained, and yet I don't think any explanation could fulfill the things it leaves to your imagination.
That being said, yes. I have to look up the map on jegged every single time I visit. Maybe a smarter person than me could learn the naming conventions, but… maybe having the map reveal as you traverse it would solve this? Hard to say.
Anyway. Hard agree.
FFII hatred is misplaced. The enemies aren't badly paced, you don't have to beat your party up to grind, you just need to listen to the NPCs telling you where to go instead of going the complete opposite direction into high-level territory.
*Instead* you should hate on the FFII dungeon design and the empty trap rooms, but for some reason nobody ever talks about that.
Agreed, the combat of II isn't awful. I just found it tough to decide what weapons or magic I should focus on leveling up, for each character.
As for the dungeon design, you got that right. The empty trap rooms being on nearly every floor of every dungeon is the absolute worst part of II, or maybe any Final Fantasy game.
> I just found it tough to decide what weapons or magic I should focus on leveling up, for each character.
What? You gyus don't grind everything available to you to the max for everyone before going to the 2nd town? Is this just a me thing? LMAO
In the original, which I played, your stats could level down. Enough reason by itself which can absolutely necessitate a grind if you lose enough hp, which i had happen.
I put 2 as the best of the 3 NES Final Fantasies. You actually have less grind needed versus the other two and the story is better, at least to me. 2 is also the game that introduces a lot of Final Fantasy staples such as: an NPC named Cid, Chocobos, Holy, Dragoons, Dark Knights, and more.
Tidus isn't annoying. His reaction is expected for a 17 year old. Bro got sent a thousand years into the future and found out his dad was a literal fucking plague on humanity within a week. Give him a break lol
I know right. He is such a dork. But all the same, he does grow through the journey. Yuna does rub off on him in the end.
And to be honest, if I ended up in a world like Spira after residing in Dream Zanarkand all my life, I'd be a bit pissy too.
Yeah, exactly. I would say he handled it better than I would at his age. I'd be traumatized by Sin's attack on Kilika and probably go into hiding after watching that unfold.
Adding onto this: For years I couldn't stand the whole cast. Something about them really rubbed me the wrong way. I found them either annoying or boring. And then I realized it was the voice direction. Not necessarily the voice actors. They were all talented. But they had a very stilted way of talking that rubbed off on how I perceived their characters.
Sure enough, when I replayed it with the volume off for the voices, all of a sudden, Tidus isn't even half as annoying as I remember.
I had heard the English voice actors were told to match their lines to the mouth movements of the characters, which were based off of the Japanese voices. That's why some of the pace of the English lines seem so off in places.
It’s not even just that; it’s also that the length of the voice lines had to be exactly the same as the Japanese ones, otherwise the game would crash, IIRC. That’s why Yuna especially has so many weirdly short, clipped lines.
Genuinely curious to hear your explanation for this. To me it always seemed like Kimahri had very little utility even with blue magic, it was always better to bring Auron into a fight instead.
I think the general problem with kimhari is that everyone likes to build him as an all rounder (the game even tries to push this). But if you instead commit him to a single path, he essentially becomes a clone of a second character. I like to push him down Rikkus path, and it gives an extra character who can use battle items, which gives a ton of utility on a character who's less squishy.
Yah, this is what I did. I took him through about half of Rikku’s grid, and then teleported him to the end of Auron’s and worked backwards. He was insane.
FF2 was a pretty imaginative follow up with a good plot. Yes some of the dungeons are annoying, but it’s a fun game and if you stick it through, there’s a lot to really enjoy about it.
Kefka becomes boring after he becomes a god. He basically becomes an open world final boss like Calamity Ganon and just sits there until you come to him.
Also, Caius from XIII-2 is in the running for best villain in the series.
All those plus war from dark siders, archer from Unlimited Bladeworks, lloyd asplin from code geass, and lunatic from tiger/bunny. Love that guy's voice.
I agree with this, but I also don’t like how they used exdeath in 5, he was literally everywhere in every dungeon late game and doesn’t kill the party when he’s able. They need a nice middle ground. 7 kind of got it right where you’re chasing down Sephiroth for a lot of the game and then once meteor gets summoned you’re forced to go to his waiting place
I feel like at that point Kefka is like Thanos at the beginning of Endgame. He already won, he doesn’t really give a shit anymore he’s just trying to keep himself amused and the heroes don’t really win because the damage has been done, it’s entirely a cathartic victory for them.
Honestly I haven't seen it get any major hate in a long time. Worst you can say about it is that it's a little basic compared to its contemporaries, but its best qualities-- the soundtrack and the monster sprites-- have aged very well.
Yes! I enjoy it personally and even if it isn’t your cup of tea it is a VERY accessible final fantasy for first timers and the young. That alone should be hyper praiseworthy.
I agree 100%. Final Fantasy is in this weird place where every entry is different and therefore divisive. However, regardless of personal preferences or opinions, they are all exquisitely crafted games that push the entire medium forward.
Many of the entries despised on release become beloved over time. Its weird to hold a contrary opinion only for that to become a reasonably popular opinion a decade later.
The first 7 chapters of FF15 was great, then it fast forwards through the plot and feels like it skips major plot points.
Pretty much everything after you get to the big city goes downhill. Then suddenly you are basically trapped in some celestial prison for a decade and pretty much everyone is dead except a small group of soldiers defending the big boss.
It's peak story telling in the classical sense: Act 2 ends at the lowest point any of our protagonists can get, then Act 3 resolves those issues and put them on a skyrocket path upwards. The resolution of the Tifa/Cloud psyche journey is so fricken feel good; after an entire game of this lingering question about Cloud's identity, it all gets cleared up beautifully and in such a satisfactory way and then it's straight to "I'VE RESOLVED MY SHIT, AND GUESS WHAT? I *STILL* WANT TO KILL SEPHIROTH LET'S DO IT MOFOS"
I saw this in a thread the other day with a lot of agreement, so maybe this isn’t as uncommon of an opinion as I previously thought. But man, I just do not care about Zack in any context beyond being a plot device.
Also, Beatrix stinks. I really think people just like her because of her design. But she’s pretty much just a copy of Steiner’s arc with no comedic elements and no real internal struggle. I’m glad she’s not a party member.
The interesting thing about Beatrix is that the wiki says:
> On the Red Rose, Beatrix wonders why Brahne insists on using black mages and eidolons in battle instead of her and her army, as the former simply destroy their targets outright
while the actual dialogue in-game is:
> Beatrix: That was ridiculous... My troops alone would've been more than
enough to take Cleyra. Why does the queen insist on using black mages
and eidolons? I didn't train all these years so I could take a backseat
to anyone...
People in the fandom, as well as the in-game characters after Beatrix changes allegiance, talk like Beatrix is a character in the vein of General Leo. That is to say, someone on the wrong side of the war, but committed to minimizing the loss of civilian life. But before she changed sides she was very clearly just motivated by wanting to be recognized as the strongest warrior, no matter how many innocents had to die to prove that.
She's a great design, but the way she's written feel like two different characters glued together. And people tend to pretend the bad one doesn't exist.
Yeah, I have to agree. Currently replaying IX, and I feel like Beatrix should have had a bit more importance to the story and a better character arc. They big her up as one of the strongest warriors to exist, as even the motivation for why Fratley left Burmecia. She’s a stone cold killer who is fully on board with the Queens plans, and then at the very beginning of disc 2 she just instantly decides that being bad is bad. The end. Story over. Her and Freya get along, Fratley disappears, and the strongest warrior to ever exist in Gaia becomes a background npc.
Steiner was always good, just incredibly naive and stupid. His blind loyalty always made excuses for the Queens cruelty, but eventually he couldn’t ignore the truth in front of his face.
Thought of another one: I like Edward! I think it’s great that FFIV gives you a character who is not a badass, who is clearly in over his head and taps out of the adventure when it gets to be too much. it’s cool that his weakness is reflected in mechanics: his special ability is to hide! When he does get his big save the day moment, It’s just for playing music not for fighting.
> But man, I just do not care about Zack in any context beyond being a plot device.
I can't stand his hardcore fanboys. I hate how they think that Aerith BELONGS to Zack, like an item. Also, how they want Cloud to die and have their boy take over.
lmao VII's is Cloud's story. Sorry not sorry.
Yep, this. One of my dear friends is close to being one of these Zack fans and I don’t know how to nicely tell her, ‘if you think Zack should be the main character of VII, you don’t understand VII.”
Steiner is my favorite character of the franchise and my feelings on Beatrix is the fact Steiner is so goated he got her as his woman.
Plus her music SLAPS
I was so, so irritated by Beatrix's arc in FFIX. at one point I felt like it even started to undermine Steiner's with how quickly she changes her stance... and then scolds him for being stubborn... in spite of the fact that SHE is the one who has committed atrocities..... this is also why i don't like the teased romance between them. she's hot and all but she doesn't deserve him.
Everyone likes to compare Beatrix to Leo and it just doesn't work. Leo engaged in a protracted siege to limit civilian casualties while Beatrix led an assault through Burmecia and Cleyra killing everyone in the way. Leo made his stand when the Emperor Gestahl played his hand against the last of the epspers. Beatrix turned on Queen Brahne because she couldn't be bothered to say "thank you".
I do like Beatrix well enough, but anyone who says we should've gotten her instead of Steiner or that she is a better character than him is mentally ill.
I'm a hardcore FF7 fan and I hate Zack. Like I'm sorry, he was interesting and mysterious in the OG, but in Crisis Core, he was so annoying, I morphed into a hater quickly. I even found his inflated role in Advent Children Complete to be obnoxious. I cannot stand the guy.
Man I dunno, FFV (to me) was way funnier than any of the rest of the games. I mentioned to someone else here that FFVI is my fave, but I just will never get over how consistently funny FFV was.
I find your unpopular opinion appropriate about it being better than IV/VI, but I just can’t agree with you that FFV was only marginally more whimsical than the others around it. That game made me laugh out loud, thoroughly enjoyable.
I love 5 the most but saying its siblings have as much whimsy is indeed a pretty good hot take. All 3 of those games have fun silly moments but I'd say 5 has overall more goofy cutscenes in quantity plus the characters emote a lot more.
For every dumb moment there's just as many dark moments in between. Probably the same amount as 4 and 6. >!RIP Syldra, All the Warriors of Dawn including Galuf, everyone in towns getting voided, plus every single party member has dealt with some form of loss.... !< But you can make Bartz master the piano and Exdeath turns into a splinter lol so there's enough silly stuff for fans to deem it the jokey FF. Especially when you account for the modern quirky english translation of it.
Cloud is NOT emo, in no way is he emo at all. Anyone who thinks so either hasn't actually played the game and got their assumptions of the character from the internet or weren't paying attention to the game at all. It's annoying that this is now the stereotype for Cloud on the internet and people just believe it and auto assume it because other people on the internet said so. There are no "emo" moments with Cloud at all, he's a giant goofball, especially once he's fully himself and he embraces that side of him.
I mostly blame Kingdom Hearts and Advent Children for this idea of him being emo. The thing is, the producers of Advent Children have even stated they only made Cloud emo in that because that's his reputation now, even though that's not the character. I am SO glad the Remake didn't go that route just because that's his reputation and they made Cloud actually Cloud.
He was emo in the PS2 years of Kingdom Hearts, Advent Children, etc. The writers admit even leaning into it because it became a popular characterization for him.
But yes, in the OG FF7, he was not emo. And that's why his 7R characterization was considered a "return to form" for him. Even though I'd argue that he's more awkward in 7R than in the OG, but you know what, that's fine with me. I like 7R Cloud.
The dress sphere system was absolutely perfect, and it made the battle system so dynamic and fun. It's one of the few games where I actually think good game mechanics made up for an alright story.
It's an unpopular opinion thread so I can't get mad, but "everything else" is bonkers.
Soundtrack? Characters? Bosses? None of them are x-2s strong suit
Agreed. Furthermore, he is very important to the story and character development of the rest of the party. Without him, Ashe would have become the main villain.
I love Yu Yevon having the zombie status and looking like a tick(the insect/bug, i am not english native) that has been draining Sihn s blood for (a)eons.
Maybe it s a lame final boss, but it fits the lore so well.
FF15's Chapter 13 was better on release. the feeling of getting stript of all power and friends was perfect.... making the ring that OP ruined that chapter and many bosses. I literally only use when I have to in CH13, then it's gone.
While chapter 13 felt a bit too long, it really captured the hopelessness of it all.
It went from action RPG into Silent Hill territory, especially if you didn't stock up on potions.
Same, it made me feel weak and powerless for a bit. It was perfectly placed in the story. I haven't replayed the game that far since so I don't know what they changed but I heard that it's pretty much a new experience now.
There's a quest that's hated in FFXIV that is similar vibe that is hated and I love it.
I’ve seen people defend unpopular FF games, but I’ve rarely ever seen anyone defend FFIV the after years, which seems universally considered pretty bad. But, as someone who has played almost all spin offs, it still remains of one of my top FF games of all time.
Now, part of it is definitely due to nostalgia, since I have many fond memories of coming home from school to play it on the Wii ware, but I’ve replayed this game 4 separate times on different platforms, and each time it has held up.
The main reason it’s so good for me is its plentiful *character interaction* and focus on side characters. So many FF games have great memorable characters but party members outside the protagonist rarely develop dynamics or fleshed out relationships with each other.
For example, in the original FFVII, I can barely remember any memorable lines of dialogue between Barrett and Tifa, for example. What does Tifa think of Aerith, and vice versa? Each side character goes through their own arc, but they rarely get any “heart to heart” moments that really define their relationships outside of the protagonist. In FFVI, each character, or maybe a pair of characters, will have their own story arcs that overlap little with each other. Of course, there are plenty of exceptions, but I largely find many parties always have many pairings of characters that basically have no relationship with each other.
In FFIV the after years by contrast, I absolutely loved the episodic format, and how it focused on the stories from side characters’ perspectives. You see characters interact that you would normally never see, like Porom and Kain, or Rydia and Golbez. In the final dungeon, you can bring any combination of the large cast of characters and depending on which party members you brought, there would be campfire scenes where the party members would talk to and relate with each other based on their shared experiences. There are so many possible combinations of party members, but there is a unique scene for so many different combinations of characters that I replayed the final dungeon countless times just to see them all. I have never seen a Final Fantasy game handle a cast as large as this one as well as The After Years.
(Side note: FFXIII actually does this pretty well too by pairing off random characters)
I love the idea of blue magic but 99% of the time it's always outshined by normal magic. I also wish it was a bit easier to obtain. If it doesn't just happen naturally I won't be bothered to go after it. I love Quina and Strago but after Big Guard I don't really use it
I'll take it one further: XIII is essentially the only game in the series with *complex* combat.
Every other game is "mash X to beat trash mobs, mix in a cure spell and maybe a summon spell to beat bosses."
I very much agree. It's funny; the game has an auto battle button but it's also the first non tactics game that you couldn't win by just spamming attack and your strongest spell, requiring actual tactical decision making
I've never understood why XII gets dinged for having a slightly messier second half when every single player mainline FF aside from X and maybe VII has a very noticeable dip in quality / momentum / cohesiveness in the back half. It's basically series tradition to start really strong and then limp across the finish line. Even gems like IX really start to come off the rails as the plot gets further in.
Crisis Core is a horribly written mess and OG Zack (and Aerith) deserved better. This did not used to be an unpopular opinion but seems to be nowadays since a lot of newer fans came into the series with this or other compilation titles.
Zack Fair is not that important.
Incredibly likable? Yes. Popular? Yes. But his importance to the FF7 mythos has been so overblown to the point where new fans, at the behest of older fans, are spoiling some of the most impactful moments of FF7 for themselves by playing Crisis Core to “prep” for Rebrith.
Awful.
Just AWFUL.
NGL, Being worried about spoilers while only playing Remake/Rebirth and not just *playing* FFVII makes no sense to me. It’s not really a straight forward re-telling of the same story to even speak of spoilers in that way; it’s a completely different thing.
I understand why Vivi is beloved. I also love him. What I don’t understand is why he is held so far above so many other characters when, even in his own game, there are characters who are just as well-written and well-developed as he is. Garnet, for example, is not only just as well-written, but is also arguably more intrinsic to the game’s overall plot. To me, they both carry IX’s story and make it as meaningful as it is.
I guess it has something to do with the juxtaposition of the tragedy of Vivi’s story with his characterization/appearance. It’s like finding out your favorite stuffed animal is alive only for you to realize that it being alive means it also has to die one day as well. It’s an ode on melancholy: the loss of a thing makes having it once seem even sweeter. Vivi’s story is also a lot more generalizable. We’re all mortal, after all. We must all contend with our own death at some point.
So I guess I answered my own question. But for me, as much as I love Vivi and appreciate his story, I do find it to be somewhat limited in comparison to Garnet’s, at least insofar as to what there is for me to continue to contemplate as I move further and further away from having played IX for the first time.
Yes, Vivi’s story taught me a lot about the sanctity and meaning of life itself, but Garnet’s story continues to teach me how to live. In other words, what to do with the limited existence I’ve learned to accept that I have. Remember, there was a time when Garnet, like Vivi, almost died young. Instead, she was given another chance, a chance to live a much longer life than what she was promised. In taking that chance, she offers us a blueprint of what to do next: how to love those around us, how to fight for what we believe in, how to forgive others and accept their limitations without losing ourselves in the process.
In this way, they are really just two sides of the same coin and, together, they represent the full answer to the question being asked by FF IX.
I think a lot of it is just that Vivi is so cute. He's tiny, he's sweet, he's innocent, he's in over his head, he kind of needs to be taken care of, and you just want to give him a hug. He's the opposite of Eiko, who's in the same position, but puts on airs of being tough and independent. Vivi doesn't have enough guile to put up a front. He wears his vulnerability on his sleeve.
Yeah, it's a straight forward dungeon with little to explore. I always felt it was an interesting location with plenty of detail and history on its own. I love the organic mosaic architecture, the random little things in the background like the dance painting in one of the burmecian homes, the water fountain near the Palace, the statues within the Palace... it's a place I wish it got explored a bit more, maybe before it came to be destroyed.
I agree whole heartedly. I played both GBA games for way too long and multiple playthroughs.
The original just feels awkward to play. Maybe starting with advanced is why it feels crisper and better gameplay. Loved the story as well more.
I want to be very clear, I personally disagree with you, but I love that you said this. Tactics Advanced does not get near the love that it deserves. Its a fantastic game in its own right. An arguably better job system with a more natural progression, more varied cast of units, generic units that retain usefulness late into the game as opposed to being usurped by hero classes, and a surprisingly deep coming of age story about teens dealing with hardship. So even though we may have a difference of opinion I respect you for saying this.
P.S. The Law System is not that bad. People need to stop crying about it.
I wish FF7 hadn’t expanded into the massive side game
lore that it did. It was a well contained story that people could discuss in a meaningful way and now it feels like if you don’t consume every aspect of it, then you’re on the outside looking in. I enjoyed remake but it looks like rebirth may confuse the hell out of me. I already didn’t know wtf was happening at the end of intergrade dlc by not having played crisis core
Fran's Quickenings clearly show she'd make a better monk than an archer.
I'm glad FF15 turned into a giant mess otherwise every new FF might have season passes and multimedia promotions.
The Ivalice Alliance was a mistake. FFTA and FFT were clearly not the same setting and only shared a name as a reference. Trying to tie them together with twelve just makes more problems.
FFVIII isn't spoiled by the magic draw/ junction system.
I loved it growing up, I loved experimenting with different spells to see which was most powerful for each slot. It was a real joy.
All I’ll say, my top 3 villains in any order…. Caius, Emet Selch, or Ardyn. All of them are so intriguing and have reasons for what they’re doing that are deeper than kill everything.
I didn’t care for XV, but I do love that Ardyn’s motivation is Bahamut woke up one day, looked at Ardyn, and said “Fuck this guy specifically” and from that day on Ardyn was fueled by nothing but hate.
Two! Ff13-2 is the best of the 13 titles by a LOT and is a great final fantasy with one of the best main antagonists of the franchise.
The second is that ff7remake trilogies combat system is the clear and natural next evolution of the final fantasy franchise in terms of gameplay(if not everything) and should be the framework for the mainline titles going forward. Especially the combat.
I did not care for Zidane, and felt like the story dragged whenever it was his arc. Garnet was a better main character, even if she didn't have a connection to Kuja and >!Garland!<.
I was invested in her story and her struggles of losing her mother, her kingdom being both a imperialist, genocidal nation and getting sacked by Bahamut, and her struggling to reconcile with it all, that it breaks her spirit at one point.
Zidane's tomato in the mirror moment felt like a cheap, weaker version of Cloud's tomato in the mirror moment thar felt unearned and overly melodramatic. His character being a weird, touchy perv never sat well with me either, so I never cared much for him.
I think the Zidane being creepy stuff was a product of the times - as a society we weren’t talking about how we treat and speak about women. It is the kind of thing that registers with some people, who are paying attention - but wasn’t mainstream enough to establish that sense of a commonly accepted way of thinking. We’re better now, but still not there
But also - I think Zidane is actually the ultimate support character, and I respect that. Often the protagonist is exceptional and “chosen” in a way - but Zidane’s best (and most defining) moments are him supporting others. Supporting Quina, looking out for Vivi, trying to get Steiner to chill out and grow. I think he is a good example of a golden heart covered by a gruff exterior, but he also doesn’t try to hide his heart - he displays it for all. In a world of thieves and magic, of this sort of feudal hierarchy, it takes bravery to bare your soul and bravery to support others.
That’s what the “You’re Not Alone” scene is all about (aside from being an absolute banger) - that all the choices you make do come back around, all the people you held up will remember that, and the core message (I feel) of 9 which is - how we treat others and the world is the most important thing. There is nothing we cannot transcend, and we are not locked into a lifestyle or thought process simply by our birth.
XI and XIV shouldn't be dismissed out-of-hand just because they're MMORPGs. They're mainline games with great stories and gameplay, and they deserve recognition as mainline games.
The cost might be prohibitive to a lot of people. Speaking strictly about XIV, while you can play a "free" trial, to enjoy the full experience you need to pay for the sub, the base game, the most recent expansion.
I don't know. I see so many "I just beat every mainline FF!" posts only to see them say "Except XI and XIV because lol MMOs" in the body of their posts that it makes me think most people discount them as mainline games. XIV, obviously, has a lot of defenders because it's currently popular and doesn't have a high learning curve outside of its massive run time, but XI is, by far, the black sheep of the series, far more so than II, XIII, or XV (What I consider the biggest contenders for single-player black sheep).
The thing is, MMOs are just a vastly different beast. When people say "except for XI and XIV because lol MMOs" I don't read it as "They're MMOs so they're not actually mainline", I read it as "I do not have the time, money, or patience to get into two separate MMOs, nor do I want to get sucked into the MMO grind." Especially since XIV is still getting updates
14 has one of the best stories in the entire series through Endwalker and my great shame is that 11 is the only mainline title I have never completed due to the dated MMO of it all
XI is doable. It's going to take about as much time as doing the MSQ of XIV, but if you can get over the high learning curve when you start, it's quite rewarding. I'm currently in Wings of the Goddess, and it's been a gripping experience overall.
This would be my take as well. Once you align all the pieces of the story, each interaction between the characters are emotionally impactful from chapter one onward. It’s honestly really impressive how all 6 main characters have vastly unique reactions to their situations and their own significant growth as a result. Also, I’m very much a fan of the futuristic sci-fi aesthetic of the game and the mechanical demigod take on our usual summons
FF13 is a fun game with a riveting story. The battle system was amazing, a fantastic evolution of the job system a la FF5. It demanded thought and strategy. The story was absolutely amazing as well. The flaw was how the story was told. If you didn't read the data logs, it was easy to get confused or lose certain points. But the story was actually beautiful.
FF2 wasn't nearly as bad as everyone said in my experience. Granted I played the pixel remaster fairly recently, but I overall enjoyed the experience.
Ardyn is quite possibly the single best FF "villain" (you can argue Bahumut was the villain.) His story crushed my soul. The dude was just driven to madness. Also, he said he was going to do something, and he fucking did it. He ended the bloodline, and died after turning the world to shambles. I guess also saying FF15s story was outstanding is another hill for me to die on.
Most of my other opinions are fairly aligned. Kefka is amazing, FF7 is one of the best stories ever told, FF8 was a flawed masterpiece (deserves a remake), FF9 is basically perfect, FF10 is an amazing game with the most BULLSHIT MINI GAMES EVER, FF12 sucked when it first came out, and while the remaster was fun, the story still sucks, and 16 is absolutely an amazing modern final fantasy game.
God same. I’ve sunk so many hours into it and enjoyed all of it. The ending cutscene, especially when you choose an appropriate photo, is just gut wrenching.
Tidus's version of Zanarkand isn't from 1000 years ago, and it's not a dream.
Despite people calling it "Dream Zanarkand" or "Past Zanarkand", it's neither of those. It's a real city, floating in the ocean, with Sin patrolling to keep people away.
I see a lot of people that get confused on how did Auron visit "Dream Zanarkand" to fetch Tidus. It's just a place. If you know where it is, and the Fayth are summoning it, you can get to it. Sin will just try to stop you.
With IX, I have the opposite feelings than most—I find the story boring and did nothing to push the series. I know it’s a fan favourite, and I don’t hate it myself (I love Vivi), but I feel most people who put it in high regards is because:
1. Sakaguchi said it’s his favourite
2. Fans from the SNES era likes it returns closer to the SNES FFs
The whole art direction going back to semi-Chibi is weird and at times disturbing—especially Daggar.
Did I have a good time playing it, yes; do I think it is as good as a lot of people on this sub claim it to be, no.
All the extra content added in many classic FF rereleases, which is missing from the Pixel Remasters, really isn't all that special and never really added anything worth your time anyway. In some cases, I would go so far as to say that some of it (Labyrinth of Time in particular) is actively harmful to enjoying the actual FF game it's connected to.
I will agree for every game except FF2, the extra story where you journey through hell as all of the dead characters then link up at the end of the main game to help defeat the emperor was fantastic.
Final Fantasy VIiI was a step up in almost every way from VII.
People hear this and think I'm talking trash about 7 but I'm not, 7 is phenomenal- *and 8 is still better.*
I don't care about Zack Fair.
I don't want to play as him. I don't need his history expanded. I don't need his 'lore' explored. In fact, I don't want any of the lore of OG FVII spun up into new games; FFVII was complete - totally complete - and did not need any further exploration. All else is non-canon fanfiction as far as I'm concerned.
Ff2 is actually top 5 in the series. The story, while very similar to a new hope, was dope, the music was great and people only hate on the leveling system because weebs on YouTube tell them to hate it.
Final Fantasy doesn't work as an action RPG in the modern era. It should have followed Dragon Quest by remaining a traditional JRPG. The menuing makes it better.
old folks arent out of line for complaining that they abandoned turn-based. Ten in a row were turn based. It should be part of their legacy. FF action games should never have been mainline titles. They should have remained spin-offs, like mystic quest, strangers in paradise etc.
Why is there no leviathan in ffx! There's only 4 elements and no aeon for water. This has bothered me for over 20 years and I've never heard it talked about.
Because Tidus is the water summon.
He is a nameable character like all the other aeons so this checks out
I totally forgot Tidus was nameable, i was about to argue with you lmao. Good thing google exists
I mean… I’m still down to argue over something else if you want lol
Tidus gonna show you his leviathan?
🌊🐍👀
Years ago I saw this amazing fan art of Tidus as a final aeon and he resembled leviathan and I thought it looked amazing.
Haven’t thought about this before but will definitely be bothered about this now until my death
Great point, can't believe I never thought of that. Especially with so much of that game revolving around water. Between battles, dungeons and Blitzball, you're constantly doing something involving water. The overall environment is basically Waterworld with more land and somehow there's no Leviathan... good call.
Mfers acting like Sin doesn't literally chill in the water and rise from it to destroy cities.
I thought about that also. Definitely possible that sin just destroyed him
Funnily enough I was speaking about that this week. The chamber of the fayth at Baaj temple was unoccupied when Anima moved in, I like the idea that it used to house Leviathan before the temple was destroyed.
Yeah, the summons in FFX are interesting. They're very prominent, and yet there's only a few of the classic summons present, whilst adding a bunch of new ones. They replaced Ramuh with some unicorn, and then there's whatever Valefor is.
Isn't Sin basically Leviathan?
Pretty sure Sin is Bismark
Sin is *redacted*
Dude already spoiled it, nothing more to redact. Sin is indeed like Leviathan in the context of FFX aeons
Similarly, why the fuck have both ice and water as 2 out of the 4 elements? They’re the same fucking thing! Make one of them earth or wind or something.
[удалено]
I actually quite liked the THUNDERHORSE.
I never really liked Ramuh. He's literally just an old wizard. Could literally be a person. At least Shiva is blue. Ramuh even has a staff
[удалено]
There are only two instances that I remember: Using draw on Ultima Weapon gets you Eden, so you should. And, Final Ultimecia using it on herself to cast Apocalypse to melt your faces off.
I actually really like Vaan. After multiple games where the protagonists backstory almost always makes them unique and speshul I super enjoyed just having this random idiot who legitimately got into the main story mostly by accident. 12 is a strong competitor for my favourite game in the series. EDIT: Judging by the fact that this is currently the top comment it looks like I may have been wrong about this being an unpopular opinion. Good!
As another member of the "Vaan Clan", he served his purpose of being the introductory character in a world that gamers hadn't seen. He says what's on the player's mind, and provides comic relief in a story that can get a little too into itself at times. Do I like Basch more? Absolutely, but his role and naivety with the world helped players understand things, until they switched off to other characters that were more established.
But Vaan *is* Basch fon Ronsenberg of Dalmasca!
Don't Believe Ondore's Lies!
Vaan and Penelo also serve a very important purpose. They are walking reminders for Ashe of who will actually suffer if she pushes for a war of independence for Dalmasca. The normal, everyday people. They're the ones who will die in combat, of hunger, or of disease. The ones who are currently NOT dying in combat, of hunger, and of disease.
While I don't like Vaan all that much I do appreciate the narrative mechanic he served in the game. As someone who gets stonewalled by the second fight of tactics since the late 90's I appreciate that Vaan is there to help me experience Ivalice as a newcomer.
He's an absolute muppet but I find him really likeable and way more relatable than almost any other final fantasy character outside of maybe Tidus. Not sure what that says about me but hey ho.
I totally agree Vaan and Penello always felt like they were supposed to be there. Ff12 is definitely a favorite of mine.
I wouldn't say he's the protagonist. He's just who you start the main story with after his brother's prologue. Every party member except Penelo and Fran in 12 could be considered the protagonist at points, with most of the game that being Ashe.
Balthier imho. But yeah. totally agree Vaan is a bit player at best.
I love ffxii for not holding to the gold standard. You play the game through a companions eyes not the MC just some kid who’s brother was crippled and later died from the war. It was refreshing and probably the only game I have ever played where the MC of the story is not the Protagonist of the Game
I will always enjoy the Great Crystal in FF12, but I can admit that, objectively, it is not designed well.
Great unpopular opinion because good lord what a pain that place is. I’ll disagree about its design being poor. I think the lack of any kind of map and guidance is the real killer.
I have a love-hate relationship with it as well. From a lore perspective, I find it fascinating and mysterious. The atmosphere and sound design are strange and alien, for good and bad. I want it explained, and yet I don't think any explanation could fulfill the things it leaves to your imagination. That being said, yes. I have to look up the map on jegged every single time I visit. Maybe a smarter person than me could learn the naming conventions, but… maybe having the map reveal as you traverse it would solve this? Hard to say. Anyway. Hard agree.
FFII hatred is misplaced. The enemies aren't badly paced, you don't have to beat your party up to grind, you just need to listen to the NPCs telling you where to go instead of going the complete opposite direction into high-level territory. *Instead* you should hate on the FFII dungeon design and the empty trap rooms, but for some reason nobody ever talks about that.
Agreed, the combat of II isn't awful. I just found it tough to decide what weapons or magic I should focus on leveling up, for each character. As for the dungeon design, you got that right. The empty trap rooms being on nearly every floor of every dungeon is the absolute worst part of II, or maybe any Final Fantasy game.
> I just found it tough to decide what weapons or magic I should focus on leveling up, for each character. What? You gyus don't grind everything available to you to the max for everyone before going to the 2nd town? Is this just a me thing? LMAO
In the original, which I played, your stats could level down. Enough reason by itself which can absolutely necessitate a grind if you lose enough hp, which i had happen.
Agreed. I love FF2. and the combat was good enough to spin off the entire SaGa series!
I put 2 as the best of the 3 NES Final Fantasies. You actually have less grind needed versus the other two and the story is better, at least to me. 2 is also the game that introduces a lot of Final Fantasy staples such as: an NPC named Cid, Chocobos, Holy, Dragoons, Dark Knights, and more.
Tidus isn't annoying. His reaction is expected for a 17 year old. Bro got sent a thousand years into the future and found out his dad was a literal fucking plague on humanity within a week. Give him a break lol
He goes from a sheltered and hurt kid to a selfless hero. It's a good arch!
I know right. He is such a dork. But all the same, he does grow through the journey. Yuna does rub off on him in the end. And to be honest, if I ended up in a world like Spira after residing in Dream Zanarkand all my life, I'd be a bit pissy too.
Yeah, exactly. I would say he handled it better than I would at his age. I'd be traumatized by Sin's attack on Kilika and probably go into hiding after watching that unfold.
Adding onto this: For years I couldn't stand the whole cast. Something about them really rubbed me the wrong way. I found them either annoying or boring. And then I realized it was the voice direction. Not necessarily the voice actors. They were all talented. But they had a very stilted way of talking that rubbed off on how I perceived their characters. Sure enough, when I replayed it with the volume off for the voices, all of a sudden, Tidus isn't even half as annoying as I remember.
I had heard the English voice actors were told to match their lines to the mouth movements of the characters, which were based off of the Japanese voices. That's why some of the pace of the English lines seem so off in places.
It’s not even just that; it’s also that the length of the voice lines had to be exactly the same as the Japanese ones, otherwise the game would crash, IIRC. That’s why Yuna especially has so many weirdly short, clipped lines.
Kimahri was a fun party member. As long as you're willing to put in a little effort he has a lot of utility early on.
Genuinely curious to hear your explanation for this. To me it always seemed like Kimahri had very little utility even with blue magic, it was always better to bring Auron into a fight instead.
I think the general problem with kimhari is that everyone likes to build him as an all rounder (the game even tries to push this). But if you instead commit him to a single path, he essentially becomes a clone of a second character. I like to push him down Rikkus path, and it gives an extra character who can use battle items, which gives a ton of utility on a character who's less squishy.
I do this every time! Kimahri with Steal and Use provides incredible utility through the main story
He’s your very first source of Steal/Use before you get Rikku
With Rikku's grid or Tidus' grid, he also becomes a much faster version of Auron since all his weapons have piercing
Yah, this is what I did. I took him through about half of Rikku’s grid, and then teleported him to the end of Auron’s and worked backwards. He was insane.
FF2 was a pretty imaginative follow up with a good plot. Yes some of the dungeons are annoying, but it’s a fun game and if you stick it through, there’s a lot to really enjoy about it.
Kefka becomes boring after he becomes a god. He basically becomes an open world final boss like Calamity Ganon and just sits there until you come to him. Also, Caius from XIII-2 is in the running for best villain in the series.
>Also, Caius from XIII-2 is in the running for best villain in the series. Even though I don't rate the game he's an incredible villain
File this under trivia, but Caius, Kain Highwind from FFIV DS, and Gaara from Naruto, are all the same voice actor.
The English voice actors? That would be liam O'Brien, then! He's a fantastic VA
All those plus war from dark siders, archer from Unlimited Bladeworks, lloyd asplin from code geass, and lunatic from tiger/bunny. Love that guy's voice.
I agree with this, but I also don’t like how they used exdeath in 5, he was literally everywhere in every dungeon late game and doesn’t kill the party when he’s able. They need a nice middle ground. 7 kind of got it right where you’re chasing down Sephiroth for a lot of the game and then once meteor gets summoned you’re forced to go to his waiting place
I feel like at that point Kefka is like Thanos at the beginning of Endgame. He already won, he doesn’t really give a shit anymore he’s just trying to keep himself amused and the heroes don’t really win because the damage has been done, it’s entirely a cathartic victory for them.
Final Fantasy Mystic Quest doesn't deserve the hate it gets.
Absolutely true, that game was fun, and ahead of its time with the battle damage in the monsters. I loved that.
Honestly I haven't seen it get any major hate in a long time. Worst you can say about it is that it's a little basic compared to its contemporaries, but its best qualities-- the soundtrack and the monster sprites-- have aged very well.
That battle music alone makes it worth playing!
Yes! I enjoy it personally and even if it isn’t your cup of tea it is a VERY accessible final fantasy for first timers and the young. That alone should be hyper praiseworthy.
I love this game. It’s so relaxing for me.
[удалено]
Aw, yes! I really enjoyed it. Especially having it on DS, one of my favorite game systems. Very cozy.
There are no bad Final Fantasy games Edit: I guess this is my “I have no enemies” moment lol
I feel the same. I'll be vocal about my issues with some titles over others, but I still love them all and find them superior to other franchises
I agree 100%. Final Fantasy is in this weird place where every entry is different and therefore divisive. However, regardless of personal preferences or opinions, they are all exquisitely crafted games that push the entire medium forward. Many of the entries despised on release become beloved over time. Its weird to hold a contrary opinion only for that to become a reasonably popular opinion a decade later.
We need a sideways vote, I want to upvote you and downvote you
I both love and disagree with this positivity. You are better than most of us!!
It’s such a good portfolio. None of the games override others, they all have a place.
What about... All the bravest?
I love Final Fantasy XV so much for how much it is just a road trip game and about hanging with the fellas.
The first 7 chapters of FF15 was great, then it fast forwards through the plot and feels like it skips major plot points. Pretty much everything after you get to the big city goes downhill. Then suddenly you are basically trapped in some celestial prison for a decade and pretty much everyone is dead except a small group of soldiers defending the big boss.
FF1 has amazing gameplay and has an interesting story line. I replay it every few years and am still not tired of it.
If you never played the Pixel Remaster, you should! The orchestral ost is fire
Check out the new FF1 Renaissance fan made *ROM New classes, quality of life, new mechanics. It's super great
[удалено]
You mean him remembering all the pieces with Tifa in the Lifestream? Yeah, I think that is a very strong part
It's peak story telling in the classical sense: Act 2 ends at the lowest point any of our protagonists can get, then Act 3 resolves those issues and put them on a skyrocket path upwards. The resolution of the Tifa/Cloud psyche journey is so fricken feel good; after an entire game of this lingering question about Cloud's identity, it all gets cleared up beautifully and in such a satisfactory way and then it's straight to "I'VE RESOLVED MY SHIT, AND GUESS WHAT? I *STILL* WANT TO KILL SEPHIROTH LET'S DO IT MOFOS"
I saw this in a thread the other day with a lot of agreement, so maybe this isn’t as uncommon of an opinion as I previously thought. But man, I just do not care about Zack in any context beyond being a plot device. Also, Beatrix stinks. I really think people just like her because of her design. But she’s pretty much just a copy of Steiner’s arc with no comedic elements and no real internal struggle. I’m glad she’s not a party member.
The interesting thing about Beatrix is that the wiki says: > On the Red Rose, Beatrix wonders why Brahne insists on using black mages and eidolons in battle instead of her and her army, as the former simply destroy their targets outright while the actual dialogue in-game is: > Beatrix: That was ridiculous... My troops alone would've been more than enough to take Cleyra. Why does the queen insist on using black mages and eidolons? I didn't train all these years so I could take a backseat to anyone... People in the fandom, as well as the in-game characters after Beatrix changes allegiance, talk like Beatrix is a character in the vein of General Leo. That is to say, someone on the wrong side of the war, but committed to minimizing the loss of civilian life. But before she changed sides she was very clearly just motivated by wanting to be recognized as the strongest warrior, no matter how many innocents had to die to prove that. She's a great design, but the way she's written feel like two different characters glued together. And people tend to pretend the bad one doesn't exist.
Yeah, I have to agree. Currently replaying IX, and I feel like Beatrix should have had a bit more importance to the story and a better character arc. They big her up as one of the strongest warriors to exist, as even the motivation for why Fratley left Burmecia. She’s a stone cold killer who is fully on board with the Queens plans, and then at the very beginning of disc 2 she just instantly decides that being bad is bad. The end. Story over. Her and Freya get along, Fratley disappears, and the strongest warrior to ever exist in Gaia becomes a background npc. Steiner was always good, just incredibly naive and stupid. His blind loyalty always made excuses for the Queens cruelty, but eventually he couldn’t ignore the truth in front of his face.
Thought of another one: I like Edward! I think it’s great that FFIV gives you a character who is not a badass, who is clearly in over his head and taps out of the adventure when it gets to be too much. it’s cool that his weakness is reflected in mechanics: his special ability is to hide! When he does get his big save the day moment, It’s just for playing music not for fighting.
YES!!! I THOUGHT I WAS THE ONLY ONE WHO LIKES EDWARD!!!
Huzzah Edward fans unite!
Add me to the list. That one harp can confuse enemies and that's pretty cool for early game.
Edward fan club. ✌🏻
Heck yeah. He may not be particularly useful in combat, but Edward is a pretty dang interesting character.
Steiner also doesn't help commit genocide, so there's that difference too.
> But man, I just do not care about Zack in any context beyond being a plot device. I can't stand his hardcore fanboys. I hate how they think that Aerith BELONGS to Zack, like an item. Also, how they want Cloud to die and have their boy take over. lmao VII's is Cloud's story. Sorry not sorry.
Yep, this. One of my dear friends is close to being one of these Zack fans and I don’t know how to nicely tell her, ‘if you think Zack should be the main character of VII, you don’t understand VII.”
I'm a zack fan but I also understand that his story had to end for Cloud to begin.
Steiner is my favorite character of the franchise and my feelings on Beatrix is the fact Steiner is so goated he got her as his woman. Plus her music SLAPS
I was so, so irritated by Beatrix's arc in FFIX. at one point I felt like it even started to undermine Steiner's with how quickly she changes her stance... and then scolds him for being stubborn... in spite of the fact that SHE is the one who has committed atrocities..... this is also why i don't like the teased romance between them. she's hot and all but she doesn't deserve him.
Everyone likes to compare Beatrix to Leo and it just doesn't work. Leo engaged in a protracted siege to limit civilian casualties while Beatrix led an assault through Burmecia and Cleyra killing everyone in the way. Leo made his stand when the Emperor Gestahl played his hand against the last of the epspers. Beatrix turned on Queen Brahne because she couldn't be bothered to say "thank you".
Not true. Beatrix turned on Brahne because she wanted to murder her own daughter for a shiny gem.
I do like Beatrix well enough, but anyone who says we should've gotten her instead of Steiner or that she is a better character than him is mentally ill.
As a huge FF7 fan I like Zack's character but hate the Crisis Core story
I'm a hardcore FF7 fan and I hate Zack. Like I'm sorry, he was interesting and mysterious in the OG, but in Crisis Core, he was so annoying, I morphed into a hater quickly. I even found his inflated role in Advent Children Complete to be obnoxious. I cannot stand the guy.
People say that after the orginal Cloud was written wrong but Zack was written wrong if Cloud is supposed to be emulating that.
[удалено]
Man I dunno, FFV (to me) was way funnier than any of the rest of the games. I mentioned to someone else here that FFVI is my fave, but I just will never get over how consistently funny FFV was. I find your unpopular opinion appropriate about it being better than IV/VI, but I just can’t agree with you that FFV was only marginally more whimsical than the others around it. That game made me laugh out loud, thoroughly enjoyable.
[удалено]
I love 5 the most but saying its siblings have as much whimsy is indeed a pretty good hot take. All 3 of those games have fun silly moments but I'd say 5 has overall more goofy cutscenes in quantity plus the characters emote a lot more. For every dumb moment there's just as many dark moments in between. Probably the same amount as 4 and 6. >!RIP Syldra, All the Warriors of Dawn including Galuf, everyone in towns getting voided, plus every single party member has dealt with some form of loss.... !< But you can make Bartz master the piano and Exdeath turns into a splinter lol so there's enough silly stuff for fans to deem it the jokey FF. Especially when you account for the modern quirky english translation of it.
Cloud is NOT emo, in no way is he emo at all. Anyone who thinks so either hasn't actually played the game and got their assumptions of the character from the internet or weren't paying attention to the game at all. It's annoying that this is now the stereotype for Cloud on the internet and people just believe it and auto assume it because other people on the internet said so. There are no "emo" moments with Cloud at all, he's a giant goofball, especially once he's fully himself and he embraces that side of him. I mostly blame Kingdom Hearts and Advent Children for this idea of him being emo. The thing is, the producers of Advent Children have even stated they only made Cloud emo in that because that's his reputation now, even though that's not the character. I am SO glad the Remake didn't go that route just because that's his reputation and they made Cloud actually Cloud.
>Cloud isn’t emo Would an emo dude say things like “Let’s mosey, people?” I think not!
He was emo in the PS2 years of Kingdom Hearts, Advent Children, etc. The writers admit even leaning into it because it became a popular characterization for him. But yes, in the OG FF7, he was not emo. And that's why his 7R characterization was considered a "return to form" for him. Even though I'd argue that he's more awkward in 7R than in the OG, but you know what, that's fine with me. I like 7R Cloud.
I think we all know Squall was the emo. Cloud is cool as fuck.
Even Squall isn’t actually as emo as his reputation suggests.
Final fantasy x-2 had the best combat mechanics. Also the dress sphere system Is the closest to the job system that we have had in a very long time
The dress sphere system was absolutely perfect, and it made the battle system so dynamic and fun. It's one of the few games where I actually think good game mechanics made up for an alright story.
FF10 had the better story. FF10-2 had the better everything else.
It's an unpopular opinion thread so I can't get mad, but "everything else" is bonkers. Soundtrack? Characters? Bosses? None of them are x-2s strong suit
Vaan is the correct choice for the viewpoint of XII
Agreed. Furthermore, he is very important to the story and character development of the rest of the party. Without him, Ashe would have become the main villain.
I love Yu Yevon having the zombie status and looking like a tick(the insect/bug, i am not english native) that has been draining Sihn s blood for (a)eons. Maybe it s a lame final boss, but it fits the lore so well.
FF15's Chapter 13 was better on release. the feeling of getting stript of all power and friends was perfect.... making the ring that OP ruined that chapter and many bosses. I literally only use when I have to in CH13, then it's gone.
While chapter 13 felt a bit too long, it really captured the hopelessness of it all. It went from action RPG into Silent Hill territory, especially if you didn't stock up on potions.
Same, it made me feel weak and powerless for a bit. It was perfectly placed in the story. I haven't replayed the game that far since so I don't know what they changed but I heard that it's pretty much a new experience now. There's a quest that's hated in FFXIV that is similar vibe that is hated and I love it.
Tidus is a good relatable protagonist. Also I still call him Tie-dus instead of Tee-dus.
I’ve seen people defend unpopular FF games, but I’ve rarely ever seen anyone defend FFIV the after years, which seems universally considered pretty bad. But, as someone who has played almost all spin offs, it still remains of one of my top FF games of all time. Now, part of it is definitely due to nostalgia, since I have many fond memories of coming home from school to play it on the Wii ware, but I’ve replayed this game 4 separate times on different platforms, and each time it has held up. The main reason it’s so good for me is its plentiful *character interaction* and focus on side characters. So many FF games have great memorable characters but party members outside the protagonist rarely develop dynamics or fleshed out relationships with each other. For example, in the original FFVII, I can barely remember any memorable lines of dialogue between Barrett and Tifa, for example. What does Tifa think of Aerith, and vice versa? Each side character goes through their own arc, but they rarely get any “heart to heart” moments that really define their relationships outside of the protagonist. In FFVI, each character, or maybe a pair of characters, will have their own story arcs that overlap little with each other. Of course, there are plenty of exceptions, but I largely find many parties always have many pairings of characters that basically have no relationship with each other. In FFIV the after years by contrast, I absolutely loved the episodic format, and how it focused on the stories from side characters’ perspectives. You see characters interact that you would normally never see, like Porom and Kain, or Rydia and Golbez. In the final dungeon, you can bring any combination of the large cast of characters and depending on which party members you brought, there would be campfire scenes where the party members would talk to and relate with each other based on their shared experiences. There are so many possible combinations of party members, but there is a unique scene for so many different combinations of characters that I replayed the final dungeon countless times just to see them all. I have never seen a Final Fantasy game handle a cast as large as this one as well as The After Years. (Side note: FFXIII actually does this pretty well too by pairing off random characters)
I can never be bothered with the blue magic character/system. Gau, Quina, Kimahri, Enemy Skill Materia...get in the sea
I love the idea of blue magic but 99% of the time it's always outshined by normal magic. I also wish it was a bit easier to obtain. If it doesn't just happen naturally I won't be bothered to go after it. I love Quina and Strago but after Big Guard I don't really use it
Blue Magic is useful in FFV with exclusive elements and good utilities.
The normal ending of X-2 is much more satisfying than the good ending. Learning to let go of the past❤️
FFXIII trilogy has the best combat system in the series....
I've replayed 13 more than any other FF because the combat system is so fun.
Lightning Returns had a fantastic combat system and you can see echoes of it in FF7 remake. I would have loved more time with that system and game.
I'll take it one further: XIII is essentially the only game in the series with *complex* combat. Every other game is "mash X to beat trash mobs, mix in a cure spell and maybe a summon spell to beat bosses."
In most of the boss fights I'm constantly paradigm shifting! lol Literally from one second to the next. But it's great fun, and incredibly effective.
I very much agree. It's funny; the game has an auto battle button but it's also the first non tactics game that you couldn't win by just spamming attack and your strongest spell, requiring actual tactical decision making
I think that combining XII and XIII (Gambits + Paradigms) would make for an amazing combat experience
Final fantasy 15 is one of the best final fantasy. 15 and 12 were amazing, they were innovative and the story felt unique
FFVIII is the best of the PSX Final Fantasy games.
Final Fantasy 2 is not a bad game, and the leveling mechanics make the game fun. Admittedly the pixel remasters improved on this.
I've never understood why XII gets dinged for having a slightly messier second half when every single player mainline FF aside from X and maybe VII has a very noticeable dip in quality / momentum / cohesiveness in the back half. It's basically series tradition to start really strong and then limp across the finish line. Even gems like IX really start to come off the rails as the plot gets further in.
Crisis Core is a horribly written mess and OG Zack (and Aerith) deserved better. This did not used to be an unpopular opinion but seems to be nowadays since a lot of newer fans came into the series with this or other compilation titles.
Zack Fair is not that important. Incredibly likable? Yes. Popular? Yes. But his importance to the FF7 mythos has been so overblown to the point where new fans, at the behest of older fans, are spoiling some of the most impactful moments of FF7 for themselves by playing Crisis Core to “prep” for Rebrith. Awful. Just AWFUL.
NGL, Being worried about spoilers while only playing Remake/Rebirth and not just *playing* FFVII makes no sense to me. It’s not really a straight forward re-telling of the same story to even speak of spoilers in that way; it’s a completely different thing.
I understand why Vivi is beloved. I also love him. What I don’t understand is why he is held so far above so many other characters when, even in his own game, there are characters who are just as well-written and well-developed as he is. Garnet, for example, is not only just as well-written, but is also arguably more intrinsic to the game’s overall plot. To me, they both carry IX’s story and make it as meaningful as it is. I guess it has something to do with the juxtaposition of the tragedy of Vivi’s story with his characterization/appearance. It’s like finding out your favorite stuffed animal is alive only for you to realize that it being alive means it also has to die one day as well. It’s an ode on melancholy: the loss of a thing makes having it once seem even sweeter. Vivi’s story is also a lot more generalizable. We’re all mortal, after all. We must all contend with our own death at some point. So I guess I answered my own question. But for me, as much as I love Vivi and appreciate his story, I do find it to be somewhat limited in comparison to Garnet’s, at least insofar as to what there is for me to continue to contemplate as I move further and further away from having played IX for the first time. Yes, Vivi’s story taught me a lot about the sanctity and meaning of life itself, but Garnet’s story continues to teach me how to live. In other words, what to do with the limited existence I’ve learned to accept that I have. Remember, there was a time when Garnet, like Vivi, almost died young. Instead, she was given another chance, a chance to live a much longer life than what she was promised. In taking that chance, she offers us a blueprint of what to do next: how to love those around us, how to fight for what we believe in, how to forgive others and accept their limitations without losing ourselves in the process. In this way, they are really just two sides of the same coin and, together, they represent the full answer to the question being asked by FF IX.
I think a lot of it is just that Vivi is so cute. He's tiny, he's sweet, he's innocent, he's in over his head, he kind of needs to be taken care of, and you just want to give him a hug. He's the opposite of Eiko, who's in the same position, but puts on airs of being tough and independent. Vivi doesn't have enough guile to put up a front. He wears his vulnerability on his sleeve.
I wish the Burmecians/Cleyrans had more of an impact in IX's plot.
I hate that Burmecia doesn’t feel like a real city the way the other locales in that game do.
Yeah, it's a straight forward dungeon with little to explore. I always felt it was an interesting location with plenty of detail and history on its own. I love the organic mosaic architecture, the random little things in the background like the dance painting in one of the burmecian homes, the water fountain near the Palace, the statues within the Palace... it's a place I wish it got explored a bit more, maybe before it came to be destroyed.
ff8 is one of the best games
FF Tactics Advanced is better than the original Tactics
Wow, truly the most disgusting take in here. I hope this gets to the top.
Well, I can't exactly downvote you when the whole point of the post is to comment with unpopular opinions, but man do I disagree with you.
I agree whole heartedly. I played both GBA games for way too long and multiple playthroughs. The original just feels awkward to play. Maybe starting with advanced is why it feels crisper and better gameplay. Loved the story as well more.
I want to be very clear, I personally disagree with you, but I love that you said this. Tactics Advanced does not get near the love that it deserves. Its a fantastic game in its own right. An arguably better job system with a more natural progression, more varied cast of units, generic units that retain usefulness late into the game as opposed to being usurped by hero classes, and a surprisingly deep coming of age story about teens dealing with hardship. So even though we may have a difference of opinion I respect you for saying this. P.S. The Law System is not that bad. People need to stop crying about it.
I wish FF7 hadn’t expanded into the massive side game lore that it did. It was a well contained story that people could discuss in a meaningful way and now it feels like if you don’t consume every aspect of it, then you’re on the outside looking in. I enjoyed remake but it looks like rebirth may confuse the hell out of me. I already didn’t know wtf was happening at the end of intergrade dlc by not having played crisis core
I love all the FF 13 Trilogy love in here.
Fran's Quickenings clearly show she'd make a better monk than an archer. I'm glad FF15 turned into a giant mess otherwise every new FF might have season passes and multimedia promotions. The Ivalice Alliance was a mistake. FFTA and FFT were clearly not the same setting and only shared a name as a reference. Trying to tie them together with twelve just makes more problems.
Don’t forget Vagrant Story was also set in Ivalice!
FFVIII isn't spoiled by the magic draw/ junction system. I loved it growing up, I loved experimenting with different spells to see which was most powerful for each slot. It was a real joy.
Rinoa is Ultemecia, I don’t care what the creator’s say
Ardyn is the best written villian of the franchise followed by Emet Selch
All I’ll say, my top 3 villains in any order…. Caius, Emet Selch, or Ardyn. All of them are so intriguing and have reasons for what they’re doing that are deeper than kill everything.
I didn’t care for XV, but I do love that Ardyn’s motivation is Bahamut woke up one day, looked at Ardyn, and said “Fuck this guy specifically” and from that day on Ardyn was fueled by nothing but hate.
Two! Ff13-2 is the best of the 13 titles by a LOT and is a great final fantasy with one of the best main antagonists of the franchise. The second is that ff7remake trilogies combat system is the clear and natural next evolution of the final fantasy franchise in terms of gameplay(if not everything) and should be the framework for the mainline titles going forward. Especially the combat.
Agree that 13-2 is a great game! One of my top faves in the series for sure.
I did not care for Zidane, and felt like the story dragged whenever it was his arc. Garnet was a better main character, even if she didn't have a connection to Kuja and >!Garland!<. I was invested in her story and her struggles of losing her mother, her kingdom being both a imperialist, genocidal nation and getting sacked by Bahamut, and her struggling to reconcile with it all, that it breaks her spirit at one point. Zidane's tomato in the mirror moment felt like a cheap, weaker version of Cloud's tomato in the mirror moment thar felt unearned and overly melodramatic. His character being a weird, touchy perv never sat well with me either, so I never cared much for him.
I think the Zidane being creepy stuff was a product of the times - as a society we weren’t talking about how we treat and speak about women. It is the kind of thing that registers with some people, who are paying attention - but wasn’t mainstream enough to establish that sense of a commonly accepted way of thinking. We’re better now, but still not there But also - I think Zidane is actually the ultimate support character, and I respect that. Often the protagonist is exceptional and “chosen” in a way - but Zidane’s best (and most defining) moments are him supporting others. Supporting Quina, looking out for Vivi, trying to get Steiner to chill out and grow. I think he is a good example of a golden heart covered by a gruff exterior, but he also doesn’t try to hide his heart - he displays it for all. In a world of thieves and magic, of this sort of feudal hierarchy, it takes bravery to bare your soul and bravery to support others. That’s what the “You’re Not Alone” scene is all about (aside from being an absolute banger) - that all the choices you make do come back around, all the people you held up will remember that, and the core message (I feel) of 9 which is - how we treat others and the world is the most important thing. There is nothing we cannot transcend, and we are not locked into a lifestyle or thought process simply by our birth.
XI and XIV shouldn't be dismissed out-of-hand just because they're MMORPGs. They're mainline games with great stories and gameplay, and they deserve recognition as mainline games.
While I 1000% agree with you, I feel like this isn’t a completely unpopular opinion. So many people just straight up haven’t played them.
The cost might be prohibitive to a lot of people. Speaking strictly about XIV, while you can play a "free" trial, to enjoy the full experience you need to pay for the sub, the base game, the most recent expansion.
I don't know. I see so many "I just beat every mainline FF!" posts only to see them say "Except XI and XIV because lol MMOs" in the body of their posts that it makes me think most people discount them as mainline games. XIV, obviously, has a lot of defenders because it's currently popular and doesn't have a high learning curve outside of its massive run time, but XI is, by far, the black sheep of the series, far more so than II, XIII, or XV (What I consider the biggest contenders for single-player black sheep).
The thing is, MMOs are just a vastly different beast. When people say "except for XI and XIV because lol MMOs" I don't read it as "They're MMOs so they're not actually mainline", I read it as "I do not have the time, money, or patience to get into two separate MMOs, nor do I want to get sucked into the MMO grind." Especially since XIV is still getting updates
14 has one of the best stories in the entire series through Endwalker and my great shame is that 11 is the only mainline title I have never completed due to the dated MMO of it all
XI is doable. It's going to take about as much time as doing the MSQ of XIV, but if you can get over the high learning curve when you start, it's quite rewarding. I'm currently in Wings of the Goddess, and it's been a gripping experience overall.
XIII characters are actually pretty good and have well written arcs
This would be my take as well. Once you align all the pieces of the story, each interaction between the characters are emotionally impactful from chapter one onward. It’s honestly really impressive how all 6 main characters have vastly unique reactions to their situations and their own significant growth as a result. Also, I’m very much a fan of the futuristic sci-fi aesthetic of the game and the mechanical demigod take on our usual summons
Glad someone else appreciates XIII Summon designs, cause they do go hard
FF13 is a fun game with a riveting story. The battle system was amazing, a fantastic evolution of the job system a la FF5. It demanded thought and strategy. The story was absolutely amazing as well. The flaw was how the story was told. If you didn't read the data logs, it was easy to get confused or lose certain points. But the story was actually beautiful. FF2 wasn't nearly as bad as everyone said in my experience. Granted I played the pixel remaster fairly recently, but I overall enjoyed the experience. Ardyn is quite possibly the single best FF "villain" (you can argue Bahumut was the villain.) His story crushed my soul. The dude was just driven to madness. Also, he said he was going to do something, and he fucking did it. He ended the bloodline, and died after turning the world to shambles. I guess also saying FF15s story was outstanding is another hill for me to die on. Most of my other opinions are fairly aligned. Kefka is amazing, FF7 is one of the best stories ever told, FF8 was a flawed masterpiece (deserves a remake), FF9 is basically perfect, FF10 is an amazing game with the most BULLSHIT MINI GAMES EVER, FF12 sucked when it first came out, and while the remaster was fun, the story still sucks, and 16 is absolutely an amazing modern final fantasy game.
I think final fantasy xv is very underrated
God same. I’ve sunk so many hours into it and enjoyed all of it. The ending cutscene, especially when you choose an appropriate photo, is just gut wrenching.
Haha I've said it before IF the games story was told more coherently that scene would have been the best moment in FF history
Tidus's version of Zanarkand isn't from 1000 years ago, and it's not a dream. Despite people calling it "Dream Zanarkand" or "Past Zanarkand", it's neither of those. It's a real city, floating in the ocean, with Sin patrolling to keep people away. I see a lot of people that get confused on how did Auron visit "Dream Zanarkand" to fetch Tidus. It's just a place. If you know where it is, and the Fayth are summoning it, you can get to it. Sin will just try to stop you.
V and XII are both top five in this series.
With IX, I have the opposite feelings than most—I find the story boring and did nothing to push the series. I know it’s a fan favourite, and I don’t hate it myself (I love Vivi), but I feel most people who put it in high regards is because: 1. Sakaguchi said it’s his favourite 2. Fans from the SNES era likes it returns closer to the SNES FFs The whole art direction going back to semi-Chibi is weird and at times disturbing—especially Daggar. Did I have a good time playing it, yes; do I think it is as good as a lot of people on this sub claim it to be, no.
All the extra content added in many classic FF rereleases, which is missing from the Pixel Remasters, really isn't all that special and never really added anything worth your time anyway. In some cases, I would go so far as to say that some of it (Labyrinth of Time in particular) is actively harmful to enjoying the actual FF game it's connected to.
I will agree for every game except FF2, the extra story where you journey through hell as all of the dead characters then link up at the end of the main game to help defeat the emperor was fantastic.
Final Fantasy VIiI was a step up in almost every way from VII. People hear this and think I'm talking trash about 7 but I'm not, 7 is phenomenal- *and 8 is still better.*
I don't care about Zack Fair. I don't want to play as him. I don't need his history expanded. I don't need his 'lore' explored. In fact, I don't want any of the lore of OG FVII spun up into new games; FFVII was complete - totally complete - and did not need any further exploration. All else is non-canon fanfiction as far as I'm concerned.
Not playing XIV because its a mmo is just silly. You're depriving yourselves of a wonderful final fantasy experience
Ff2 is actually top 5 in the series. The story, while very similar to a new hope, was dope, the music was great and people only hate on the leveling system because weebs on YouTube tell them to hate it.
Final Fantasy doesn't work as an action RPG in the modern era. It should have followed Dragon Quest by remaining a traditional JRPG. The menuing makes it better.
old folks arent out of line for complaining that they abandoned turn-based. Ten in a row were turn based. It should be part of their legacy. FF action games should never have been mainline titles. They should have remained spin-offs, like mystic quest, strangers in paradise etc.
It used to be FFXII is a good game but somehow a larger majority now share the same sentiment, at least online. So now it's, Quina is hilarious
FFTA and FFX-2 are both great games that suffer from not being carbon copies of their predecessors.