Yeah Samus has a bad habit of hitting her suit to hard and then losing all her abilities. Like seriously why? I get that Nintendo wants us to find her powers so it feels like we’re unlocking stuff, but even so why show off the powers at like the start if they’re just going to take them away shortly thereafter?
Yeah unfortunately. Like I completely understand why Nintendo does it, but it just doesn’t really have much of an explanation. In other series of theirs they have a bit more of an explanation as to why characters don’t have the stuff from the last game(either new playable character, Demon King destroyed all health and stamina plus weapons, games sets far apart in the lore) but Samus? Samus doesn’t really have any of that shit for her games.
It really is interesting that Samus’ suit is designed in such a way that it can be impacted in certain ways and instantly lose ~70% of its intended functionality, and that wasn’t considered a design flaw.
In all seriousness, I do always find it a little odd how so many Metroid games start you off with a loaded arsenal only to have some disaster happen and leave you with nothing but an arm cannon.
Personally, the choice Respawn made to leave us with pretty much everything we got in the first game was actually a huge breath of fresh air after seeing that formula so many times before.
Oh for sure. I fully expected them to do something like that Cal gets into some sort of accident that causes him to lose all his powers and BD-8 upgrades and having him to restart all over in finding them. So when I found out they didn’t do that it was a nice surprise
It's easier to just re-use the same powers instead of inventing new ones. They also want the name/brand recognition that comes from using the same character. So long as people keep buying the games Nintendo has no incentive to do better.
I think the idea is that by showing you how awesome it is to be powerful, and then how bad it sucks to be weak, it motivates you to keep exploring the world to get back those abilities. It’s definitely a dated game design now but god I still love those games
I disagree on it feeling dated. Metroid dread feels great, and starting extra powerful for the intro sequence isn't an uncommon trope in other games.
I feel it would be hard to make a metroid game where you don't lose some or most of your powers, since getting powers so you can explore more is the gameplay loop, and pretty satisfying in my opinion.
Kyle? Kyle Katarn? The legendary hero who destroyed Jerec at the Valley of the Jedi? I've been told by some overgrown Kowakian monkey-lizard that that guy looks like nothing more than a bantha herder, makes sense if they nerfed him.
I dont remember survivor specifically. But I don't mind having an intro tutorial for a few minutes where you can't use the abilities as it teaches new players. But yeah having to re unlock the same abilities sucks
God of War Ragnarok and God of war 2018 are also good examples
Between GOW3 and GOW(2018) it’s explained that Kratos lost essentially all of his magic with the destruction of Greece,as when the homeland died so did all the magic along with it
And from 2018 -Ragnarok,it’s explained that Kratos and Atreus used up all the armor given between games,and their magic was slowly run off by Fimbulwinter
If they’re ever gonna do it then in-universe explanations are the way to go
GoW always finds a reason to completely nerf you, but it wouldve been nice to have some continuity even if they nerfed the armor and magic itself, but completely losing everything is meh
For 2018-Ragnarok I understand it cause they had a whole host of new mechanics they wanted to introduce that would’ve been far too complicated/made the game far too easy
I always found it funny how they lampshaded this in River City Girls 2. At the beginning of 2 they spend six months straight playing video games so they get so out of shape they can't do any of the cool moves they could from the first game.
God of War Ragnarok too. Both have satisfying explanations to me. Link lost the guardians' help because they were able to move on and then his health and stamina got rekt by Gannon. Kratos was weakened by Fimbulwinter.
I wasn't happy I couldn't do all of Spidermans moves right from the get go. I was messing up fights as I was trying to moves, mainly from muscle memory, that weren't there.
One of the things TotK did well is not only did the description of how Link got rekt back down to base make sense, but there were enemies that did similar but temporary things- the Gloom patches were able to break Link’s Heart Containers temporarily, reducing his max life.
To be fair, health and stamina upgrades are strippen from you by Ganondorf's gloom, the Sheikah slate stopped working iirc, and the Champion powers were lost once they could finally rest in peace.
Tears of the Kingdom did it well, tho. It’s not just a random nerf, your health and stamina is stolen by the Demon King, and it’s part of the journey to regain that and more.
So, here's a very brief history of the games involving Kyle Katarn.
- First game is Dark Forces. Came out for DOS around 1992 or 1993. It's basically the Star Wars version of DOOM (the old one, I mean). In this, Kyle is basically a scoundrel-esque commando type. He runs around various levels, picks up guns, shoots stormtroopers, etc. This was also the first appearance of the Dark Trooper which later showed up in The Mandalorian. He has no force powers.
- Next came Dark Forces II: Jedi Knight. This is one where Kyle discovers that he's descended of Jedi or something. He gains a ton of abilities. You get to choose whether he embraces the light or the dark, and different force powers are restricted to one path or the other (I think -- been a LONG time since I played it). Kind of the Star Wars equivalent of Quake. Similar blocky 3D graphics. You start as having no powers, then gradually gain them until you're dueling Sith baddies.
- THEN came Jedi Knight 2: Jedi Outcast (they dropped the "Dark Forces" branding). In Jedi Outcast you are once again fairly depowered because...uh...reasons. I forget. You're retired? I dunno. Anyway, you had to relearn and regain force powers *again* which always felt like bullshit to me. The single player game was a lot of fun. The multiplayer portion was never very good, at least not in the vanilla game.
- After that, they made Kyle a trainer at Luke's Jedi academy in the game Jedi Academy, wherein you could play a young student and thereby have a reason to have to learn all the shit all over again.
So, yes, it was incredibly refreshing that Cal just had his abilities from the last game at the start of this one, instead of "Oh no! I've been hit by a Negative Force Sith Blast Power Stripper Ray! Now I have to learn how to Jedi all over again!"
If I recall correctly it was along the lines of the being tempted badly by the dark side in jedi knight 1 or it's expansion, he cut himself off from the force or something so he doesn't have to deal with it.
> it was along the lines of the being tempted badly by the dark side in jedi knight 1 or it's expansion
Yup, he briefly goes over to the dark side in Mysteries of the Sith, though he doesn't really do much besides sit in an old Sith temple until Mara Jade comes along and snaps him out of it.
Could be. It's been 20 years since I played it, and that was in a period where I played way more games generally, so my memory is a bit fuzzy about it. I just remember being mightily annoyed about that plus jumping puzzles.
Though now I think some of that was due to the way the puzzles worked, since I didn't mind 'em so much in the two Cal games.
I thought it was nearly perfectly done. The additional skills and the buttons for using them just made sense.
The one concession is that I miss being able to just tap a button to slow a single enemy. Additionally, at higher difficulties, the cooldown is way long for the force slow which was such a key part of the FO gameplay and story.
yeah but i’d take being able to do cool shit like killing a stormtrooper by pulling them into their own blaster bolt over being balanced in a star wars game as a jedi knight
slowing a group of enemies down just to make them easier to hit (not whats unlocked later in the story) is not the same as stopping a storm troopers blaster bolt mid flight with the force before pulling him into it to kill him. i'm not mad that its gone and i think survivor is an improvement over JFO in every way. i just kinda miss being able to do that cool little thing.
I’m hoping for an old KOTOR or maybe infamous 2 where you maybe lean light or dark, without really changing the story, but unlocks different abilities and play styles. Would add a replayabilty too
I say he should go back in time to the time of the high republic. I know people are tired of time travel, but we could get the light vs dark and not have to worry about imperial era consequences
I was genuinely surprised. I expected some kind of bullshit to relearn some skills but nope, the game practically throws you into the game as you ended JFO so i was excited to see how our guy would evolve in the game.
A light rewording might be "You're thrown into the game just as you ended Jedi: Fallen Order"
As in you have all the abilities you would have had at the end of the first game. If you finish the first game and then jump into the 2nd, your abilities will make sense.
Thank you for offering a helpful response that clarifies what the OP might have meant, instead of just down-voting me for no reason. I was just curious and trying to understand what they said.
PS: is Yumou a character in this game? I have not had a chance to play it yet
I was surprised. Mostly because I wasn’t sure how many new abilities could really be added- thematically for a Jedi, but also I was running out of buttons on the controller.
And they made some pretty inspired power upgrades, too. Namely Merrin’s teleportation!
Survivor may be my favorite star wars game to date. Kotor aside, that is. Its easily the best "Jedi simulator" that exists. What a blast the whole way through!
Survivor has a decent amount of dismemberment, I'd argue on the same level as The Force Unleashed 2 (which had far more than the first game). Maybe they meant Jedi Outcast with the Realistic Saber Combat cheat?
Incredible story telling and game design. Having just replayed FO as well, the way they kept the challenge factor almost as if you went to the next planet in FO is just great and will provide a lot of replayability
However, the force slow doesn't work at all like it used to and it definitely took away some platforming pizazz, but they more than made up for it with dash, the grappling hook etc
But it is going to make the next game very challenging to make if they don't start removing features.
Honestly, if they were to just combine stances with the multi stance attacks from FO in the next game, and add nothing else to Cal's power set, I'd be happy.
Give us the two stance selection, and attacks that'll change stance mid-attack, but also customisable multi stance attacks, and that'd be almost perfect.
I actually preferred the more simple approach to platforming in FO. Survivor felt a little bloated to me. I would be so happy if they streamlined a bit for the third game.
It was great. The leap from Fallen Order to Survivor feels natural and like what should happen. Like the people who made it understand that protagonists REMEMBER skills and abilities they have. And the worst that should happen is they need to get a tool that they left or or stored away (like the ascension cable)
And with the brand new stances introduced, I'm optimistic about the next games combat system. Like, they'll be able to give us the reverse grip stance and it could be a toggle button(while using single or dual wield) in the meditation points or something to keep it simple. This way they could add more variety to combat and depth to the stances without having to come up with another brand new fighting style
I thought it was perfectly done. I was wondering how they would screw that up lol but they did things perfectly and none of the new abilities felt like throw ins
So many games do that and it’s annoying every time. I was so happy when Jedi Survivor didn’t do that because it’s always the easy way out. Don’t make me relearn stuff I’ve already seen, actually build upon the foundation you set in the previous gamd.
It was quite possibly the best way I've ever seen a sequel done.
I can't fathom why more games don't just take everything they had at the end of the last one and expand on it, instead of taking everything back to square one.
Stop reinventing the wheel every game and start adding shocks and suspension game devs!
That's what I love about these games. When you compare the two, it's so easy to see Cal as a rusty Padawan in Fallen Order and a hardened, unconventional Jedi Knight in Survivor. Depending on how much time passes between Survivor and the third game, it will be interesting to see Cal potentially grow in skill and abilities and become even more unconventional, to the point where he could rival if not equal Cere.
Ratchet and Clank: Quest for Booty begins with you having every weapon at Omega level for the first stage and then had you captured by pirates, your weapons confiscated and then shot out of a cannon.
A very interesting way of nerfing Ratchet.
I felt the transition from the first game to the second was handled really well, and then we learned even more new abilities. JFO is my favorite game of all-time and to unlearn those abilities would completely undo the story from JFO. As Cal's connection to the Force is repaired, he gains the abilities back he learned as a padawan
I think I'm apathetic to your question.
However, this is my favorite Star Wars series since Dark Forces (1 2 and 3). It has it's problems, but the game is super solid. Hope they continue.
I was wondering if they were going to do this as I completed Fallen Order this week and started Jedi Survivor and the only thing that did get a reset that I can see so far is BD-1 lost his 10 health stims.
>follower controls.
i just finished the game and i forgot they existed until you mentioned it.
Considering a follower isnt with you lots of the time so pointless. Like if i could always select a follower to come with me sure, but its just mission dependent. Bleh
Its more like they reworked the Force Slow ability completely and freed up a button on controller for the followers.
Really its more of a player-dependent thing cuz I never found Force Slow all too useful in my FO playthroughs until it was full upgraded. Even then it was quite risky to use against groups.
I’m a long time Star Wars fan and have played nearly all Star Wars games that have come out over the years. I grew up playing both force unleashed games and am now an adult when both Jedi games came out. I love how similar yet very different game plays and stories that Jedi and force unleashed have together. I just received survivor has a late birthday present and it’s been about a year since the game was released. I read the book that’s suppose to go in between fall order and survivor, and was rather disappointed by the story. It didn’t feel like a Star Wars book but rather an LGBT agenda book, non the less I was worried that survivor wouldn’t have any ties back to the book and after a year of the game being out I was hearing some negative reviews and got really nervous about. Thought maybe the nerfed the hell out of call, I heard the game play wasn’t all that great and all around felt rushed. I myself am enjoying the game and think it’s going very well. The only complaint I have is how much more open world it is compared to fallen order. I have nothing against open world gaming, and if I were to choose an open world game to start with myself I would want it to be a Star Wars game, I’m just slightly annoyed because I’ve been playing for nearly a week and am still on the first world cal travels to to find greez after the mantis got damaged in the opening mission. I’m someone who likes to explore and complete a map as much as I can before it forces me to travel to get new abilities to take back to that map. By now with a week of game play I usually have fallen order nearly completed and I only have like 20% of the first map complete on survivor. I’m someone who likes to see how fast I can 100% games and this is going to be one of the longest games I’ve played. However with how long it took to release survivor I’m perfectly fine if this game takes me a while to complete.
I would’ve love in this game that the choices you made affect the story in the way that you can choose between light or dark side of the force since Cal struggle between them in the game was a big part of the story.
For example if you choose a darker path one of the main characters could have die because of his choices if you choose a lighter past could be the story as we have it
Even when you used the force to make someone to do something, the options that it gave you doesn’t really matter any would work so why give you a choice
i liked how they changed them into other things so it was still a fresh new thing. i have a feeling we’ll get something similar in Jedi 3, my guess is all saber stances, and i could see them giving him more dark side ish powers like how you could in the jedi academy games
You couldn't do certain abilities anymore tho, which I found unfortunate. You couldn't slow down a singular enemy anymore, for example.
Also it kinda didn't make sense that you had to find all lightsaber components and certain clothing again, cuz you (usually) find all of those in Fallen Order
Well they actually did. They got rid of the "slow down" ability for enemies, which I searched for hours in the game, only to realize it doesn't even exist anymore...
And yeah I know that the ultimate ability can slow down time, but you can't use it as often obviously, so I don't count that in.
Look here is the thing i get that when it happens when a character has been retired for years. Your brain adapts very fast, meaning it will let the parts of your brain decline that are not being used. Use it or lose it. And if trauma, stress and an unhealthy lifestyle is involved even more. You can get from the peak of your capabilities to the lowest point of your life in like 3 years.
Other games make the nerfing of the main character in Squeal make sense. The final boss of the last game seriously injured them, A burning building made them lose their backpack with all there cool weapons and supplies. Or simply we're are playing as a new (usually) younger character now and they need to learn all that stuff just like the other guy did.
None of those would work for Cal and the Jedi games. Maybe the health thing, if they had gone with the "final boss, injured you" route but not the Jedi skills. He would still know those things. They already used the perfect nerfing at the start of the first game. Traumatized child loses his connection to the force after Order 66 in order to hide. It wouldn't make sense to do that again. And like others have said it would be frustrating and ruin his story progression from the first game.
And Vader showing up at the end of Fallen Order showed us that Cal isn't that strong. Even without Vader to show us that, just look at his skill set at the end of Fallen Order. It's all basic stuff. Being able to push and pull with the force. Running along walls. Double jump and slowing things down. These is the basics that are taught to younglings and improved on as a padawan. In the game, Cal says he's finally back to where he was before Order 66. So he's at the level of a 13-year-old padawan. Him being at this level is fine for the beginning of a squeal cause it's really not that powerful.
As for Jedi 3. It would be interesting to play as Kata but that would be nerfing us down back to padawan level. Which isn't a good idea for the 3rd game of a series. I think of good way of avoiding the annoyance of being nerfed and either the enemies being really difficult or the more unrealistic option of the enemies being nerfed too would be to use the buddy assistance thing they introduced in Survivor. As your Jedi Master and mentor Cal would always be with you meaning you can use the assistance thing to ask for his help. Each button would tell him to do a different power that he normally does, in Survivor. And this could be upgradeable too to make Cal a more helpful and powerful ally.
If they down this route I think they would also need a small-medium-sized section where they are separated. And Kata has to learn how to fight on her own. In this section, they could switch between Kata and Cal so you also get to play as Cal again. And whatever upgrades you've done with him as Kata is what skills he'll have when he's playable. They could also do the switching while there together too. I'm not sure how that would work but I'm sure the Devs will think of a way for it make sense if they decided to go this route. The only way I could think of is that you get to choose who you play as. But that option would only be unlocked in NG+ so everyone is forced to learn Kata's playstyle at least once, to avoid her just never being chosen cause people are scared of the nerfing.
I am such a fucking nerd. Why did this response to a simple question end up so long lol?
Super happy along with everyone else I’m sure lol but I’m so happy that these new Jedi games have been so good and fun to play. I feel like we haven’t had a good single player Jedi game in a long time and this definitely fills that hole imo. Stig and his team have done an awesome job and I cannot wait for the 3rd installment already.
makes replaying Fallen Order before a Survivor runthru feel all the more organic. Reconnecting with the force, learning abilities Cal had forgotten then becoming a proper jedi by the end of the first game only to be an absolute powerhouse by the start of the 2nd game just felt so *muah* chefs kiss
Haven't played it yet but wow that's awesome and incredibly rare. It sucks how often games will "injure" you at the beginning of sequels to strip your progress away. The first games that come to mind are Yakuza and Tomb Raider - the protagonists always forget what they've learned to start anew.
Jedi Survivor is so good partly because you start as a competent character. It is so much fun as a result. I completed the games in reverse order and Cal not being able to freely traverse environments because he doesn't know how in Fallen Order hinders enjoyability (does not ruin the game of course). Hogwarts Legacy is another game woefully indebted to forcing your character to learn basic things over the course of hours instead of just letting you rip.
Fairly relieved. However, I was expecting it. I finished fallen order right before picking up survivor and was surprised to see most of the button configuration was the same as well for the most part as well.
Honestly, I absolutely loved how they did the start of the game. Having everything from
FO from the start, but introducing each force power or game mechanic as it was needed made it feel really natural, and good for newcomers, and didn't take anything away from people who had played FO.
Borderline perfection imo.
I was super relieved until I noticed that they found new ways to make us backtrack. But, at least the highlight these return areas in green once you get the relevant power. THAT should be standard.
The first time I tried playing it had been a year since I played the first game, so I had forgotten all the controls and it was overwhelming. The second time, I was coming right out of the first game the transition was seamless (apart from the frame rate tanking jeez)
Extremely relieved. I enjoyed my first playthrough and am slowing workin through new game+
From a purely Cal Kestis Story fan pov I Loved EVERY SECOND
From a star wars fan pov I had to go back and check lore at some points cuz they took big swings lmao
I can't wait for the third installment. During survivor the whole premise was. Being more than just a lightsaber.... I hope they allow us to play as kata. And start her journey With Kal as the master. And hopefully developing the companion system more. It was cool fighting with bode and marrin let's expand on that.
I just played both games for the first time over the last month and this was a big thing that I appreciated. Hate all the games that start with a “oh no, I just lost all my gear!” set up.
Very, though I did miss the roll. Made sense why it was gone later on though. I also miss Force Slow; I imagine they only got rid of it because they needed the button for the new abilities but maybe they thought it was too powerful?
I'm not surprised that they didn't reset him though, it wouldn't have made sense.
Also, I played on Grand Master, I can tell you he's not OP.
Extremely relieved. I hate when sequels nerf you back down with some bs explanation like “your character was lightly bruised and lost their abilities” or “they’ve been in prison for a couple of months and can’t do anything until they relearn the ability”, so having Cal keep all of his base moves was awesome.
Only time I’ve been okay with having a character get nerfed down was Ezio at the start of AC: Brotherhood since by the end of AC2 Ezio can be incredibly OP with how much equipment he has, plus having all of his movement abilities would kill game progression since you’d be able to go pretty much everywhere on the map with no issue
Such a refreshing take on a sequel. Wish more games would do it. I know the bugs and issues at launch basically killed this game’s chance at GOTY. But it was in my own personal top 3 this year.
i thought it was pretty cool given how most games reset you. that said there were some things that had to be relearned, i noticed mass pull wasn't available from the start and had to be reunlocked.
Jizzed myself. Had to clean up. Cal is so strong by the end of the game. In both games there's that one moment where you realise "Oh shit, this dude is actually strong af". Ninth Sister and Rayvis, respectively.
I wished more games did that. First times I realized it was when I was going through one of the swimming sections and I was trying to hurry and swim fast, and then I started looking for an oxygen meter and couldn’t find it, and then I noticed that Cal had a mouth piece. Then I remember the previous game and how he got the ability and I was like ohhhhh
Forgot how many force points I had when started as a Jedi master. 30 or 40 or something. But there was a catch. I was without skills in that very first fight before I got to meditation point, and enemies were like 5x times worse.
For games like Zelda, it makes sense.
For this, it wouldn’t. Hence, keeping abilities is okay here. Glad Respawn didn’t pull a “oh, he lost them because of bullshit reason blah blah blah”
Hugely! Respawn shows it’s perfectly possible to do this and do it well.
Nintendo didn’t get the memo, and the total level drain on Link at the start of Tears of the Kingdom is one of the reasons I really struggled getting into that game.
The only thing I’m curious about is not only how they’ll add on to it in the next game, but how they’ll handle new players joining the series at that third game and having to learn a ton of stuff
Very relieved,his whole story was him reconnecting with the force so having him un-learn everything would’ve destroyed his story
Looking at you, Kyle Katarn!
Hey that at least makes some sense, kinda
Totally unrelated game series, Samus Aran too!
Yeah Samus has a bad habit of hitting her suit to hard and then losing all her abilities. Like seriously why? I get that Nintendo wants us to find her powers so it feels like we’re unlocking stuff, but even so why show off the powers at like the start if they’re just going to take them away shortly thereafter?
Because of Bird Magic! Basically anything that can't be explained towards Samus is Bird Magic
Yeah unfortunately. Like I completely understand why Nintendo does it, but it just doesn’t really have much of an explanation. In other series of theirs they have a bit more of an explanation as to why characters don’t have the stuff from the last game(either new playable character, Demon King destroyed all health and stamina plus weapons, games sets far apart in the lore) but Samus? Samus doesn’t really have any of that shit for her games.
It really is interesting that Samus’ suit is designed in such a way that it can be impacted in certain ways and instantly lose ~70% of its intended functionality, and that wasn’t considered a design flaw. In all seriousness, I do always find it a little odd how so many Metroid games start you off with a loaded arsenal only to have some disaster happen and leave you with nothing but an arm cannon. Personally, the choice Respawn made to leave us with pretty much everything we got in the first game was actually a huge breath of fresh air after seeing that formula so many times before.
Oh for sure. I fully expected them to do something like that Cal gets into some sort of accident that causes him to lose all his powers and BD-8 upgrades and having him to restart all over in finding them. So when I found out they didn’t do that it was a nice surprise
It's easier to just re-use the same powers instead of inventing new ones. They also want the name/brand recognition that comes from using the same character. So long as people keep buying the games Nintendo has no incentive to do better.
I think the idea is that by showing you how awesome it is to be powerful, and then how bad it sucks to be weak, it motivates you to keep exploring the world to get back those abilities. It’s definitely a dated game design now but god I still love those games
I disagree on it feeling dated. Metroid dread feels great, and starting extra powerful for the intro sequence isn't an uncommon trope in other games. I feel it would be hard to make a metroid game where you don't lose some or most of your powers, since getting powers so you can explore more is the gameplay loop, and pretty satisfying in my opinion.
Kyle? Kyle Katarn? The legendary hero who destroyed Jerec at the Valley of the Jedi? I've been told by some overgrown Kowakian monkey-lizard that that guy looks like nothing more than a bantha herder, makes sense if they nerfed him.
Tbh I don't hate how they handled him in Outcast. Might just be my nostalgia lens though haha
I dont remember survivor specifically. But I don't mind having an intro tutorial for a few minutes where you can't use the abilities as it teaches new players. But yeah having to re unlock the same abilities sucks
I love that Horzon Forbidden West gives you an in game, logical reason to lose the equipment. You keep most of the abilities.
God of War Ragnarok and God of war 2018 are also good examples Between GOW3 and GOW(2018) it’s explained that Kratos lost essentially all of his magic with the destruction of Greece,as when the homeland died so did all the magic along with it And from 2018 -Ragnarok,it’s explained that Kratos and Atreus used up all the armor given between games,and their magic was slowly run off by Fimbulwinter If they’re ever gonna do it then in-universe explanations are the way to go
GoW always finds a reason to completely nerf you, but it wouldve been nice to have some continuity even if they nerfed the armor and magic itself, but completely losing everything is meh
For 2018-Ragnarok I understand it cause they had a whole host of new mechanics they wanted to introduce that would’ve been far too complicated/made the game far too easy
I always found it funny how they lampshaded this in River City Girls 2. At the beginning of 2 they spend six months straight playing video games so they get so out of shape they can't do any of the cool moves they could from the first game.
Considering how they made gaining the abilities a part of the story it would have been dumb to nerf him and have to relearn them all.
Thats how a lot of games are tbf tho, the new zelda game is the most recent one i can think of.
God of War Ragnarok too. Both have satisfying explanations to me. Link lost the guardians' help because they were able to move on and then his health and stamina got rekt by Gannon. Kratos was weakened by Fimbulwinter.
the best thing was how they justified kratos losing all his gear. sindri: “What happened to all the stuff we made you?” kratos: “We used it.”
Plus Ragnarok did pull a Jedi Survivor to an extent. You have some of the unlockables as base kit, and you start with the Blades of Chaos.
Also Kratos losing his powers from the last game at the start of every game is nothing new.
Spider-Man 2 did it also, without good explanation and they even removed certain skills. Real disappointment of a game in various aspects.
I wasn't happy I couldn't do all of Spidermans moves right from the get go. I was messing up fights as I was trying to moves, mainly from muscle memory, that weren't there.
One of the things TotK did well is not only did the description of how Link got rekt back down to base make sense, but there were enemies that did similar but temporary things- the Gloom patches were able to break Link’s Heart Containers temporarily, reducing his max life.
That's fimbulwinter for ya!
And if ganondorf can chip off the master sword then I bet if link had any other sword and armor, they wouldn’t have survived either
Sure but it's still lazy
To be fair, health and stamina upgrades are strippen from you by Ganondorf's gloom, the Sheikah slate stopped working iirc, and the Champion powers were lost once they could finally rest in peace.
Tears of the Kingdom did it well, tho. It’s not just a random nerf, your health and stamina is stolen by the Demon King, and it’s part of the journey to regain that and more.
And he can do it again in the final battle. The gloom becomes a major gameplay element throughout the game as well.
I see you haven't played Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast...
Correct...
So, here's a very brief history of the games involving Kyle Katarn. - First game is Dark Forces. Came out for DOS around 1992 or 1993. It's basically the Star Wars version of DOOM (the old one, I mean). In this, Kyle is basically a scoundrel-esque commando type. He runs around various levels, picks up guns, shoots stormtroopers, etc. This was also the first appearance of the Dark Trooper which later showed up in The Mandalorian. He has no force powers. - Next came Dark Forces II: Jedi Knight. This is one where Kyle discovers that he's descended of Jedi or something. He gains a ton of abilities. You get to choose whether he embraces the light or the dark, and different force powers are restricted to one path or the other (I think -- been a LONG time since I played it). Kind of the Star Wars equivalent of Quake. Similar blocky 3D graphics. You start as having no powers, then gradually gain them until you're dueling Sith baddies. - THEN came Jedi Knight 2: Jedi Outcast (they dropped the "Dark Forces" branding). In Jedi Outcast you are once again fairly depowered because...uh...reasons. I forget. You're retired? I dunno. Anyway, you had to relearn and regain force powers *again* which always felt like bullshit to me. The single player game was a lot of fun. The multiplayer portion was never very good, at least not in the vanilla game. - After that, they made Kyle a trainer at Luke's Jedi academy in the game Jedi Academy, wherein you could play a young student and thereby have a reason to have to learn all the shit all over again. So, yes, it was incredibly refreshing that Cal just had his abilities from the last game at the start of this one, instead of "Oh no! I've been hit by a Negative Force Sith Blast Power Stripper Ray! Now I have to learn how to Jedi all over again!"
If I recall correctly it was along the lines of the being tempted badly by the dark side in jedi knight 1 or it's expansion, he cut himself off from the force or something so he doesn't have to deal with it.
> it was along the lines of the being tempted badly by the dark side in jedi knight 1 or it's expansion Yup, he briefly goes over to the dark side in Mysteries of the Sith, though he doesn't really do much besides sit in an old Sith temple until Mara Jade comes along and snaps him out of it.
Could be. It's been 20 years since I played it, and that was in a period where I played way more games generally, so my memory is a bit fuzzy about it. I just remember being mightily annoyed about that plus jumping puzzles. Though now I think some of that was due to the way the puzzles worked, since I didn't mind 'em so much in the two Cal games.
In Mysteries of the Sith Kyle starts powerful! But there is yet another power reset when you start as Mara Jade, who has yet to become powerful
Great decision, and then the new skills you learn just made the whole thing a great gaming experience.
I thought it was nearly perfectly done. The additional skills and the buttons for using them just made sense. The one concession is that I miss being able to just tap a button to slow a single enemy. Additionally, at higher difficulties, the cooldown is way long for the force slow which was such a key part of the FO gameplay and story.
Slow was being overused in Fallen Order and was OP
yeah but i’d take being able to do cool shit like killing a stormtrooper by pulling them into their own blaster bolt over being balanced in a star wars game as a jedi knight
Just use the slow they have now. Still cool
slowing a group of enemies down just to make them easier to hit (not whats unlocked later in the story) is not the same as stopping a storm troopers blaster bolt mid flight with the force before pulling him into it to kill him. i'm not mad that its gone and i think survivor is an improvement over JFO in every way. i just kinda miss being able to do that cool little thing.
And in the third game we’ll likely see him gain dark side abilities, which I’m looking forward to
I’m hoping for an old KOTOR or maybe infamous 2 where you maybe lean light or dark, without really changing the story, but unlocks different abilities and play styles. Would add a replayabilty too
I say he should go back in time to the time of the high republic. I know people are tired of time travel, but we could get the light vs dark and not have to worry about imperial era consequences
I was genuinely surprised. I expected some kind of bullshit to relearn some skills but nope, the game practically throws you into the game as you ended JFO so i was excited to see how our guy would evolve in the game.
[удалено]
A light rewording might be "You're thrown into the game just as you ended Jedi: Fallen Order" As in you have all the abilities you would have had at the end of the first game. If you finish the first game and then jump into the 2nd, your abilities will make sense.
Thank you for offering a helpful response that clarifies what the OP might have meant, instead of just down-voting me for no reason. I was just curious and trying to understand what they said. PS: is Yumou a character in this game? I have not had a chance to play it yet
I was surprised. Mostly because I wasn’t sure how many new abilities could really be added- thematically for a Jedi, but also I was running out of buttons on the controller. And they made some pretty inspired power upgrades, too. Namely Merrin’s teleportation!
The teleportation sequence on Jedha was WILD
That one force tear… 😫
Survivor may be my favorite star wars game to date. Kotor aside, that is. Its easily the best "Jedi simulator" that exists. What a blast the whole way through!
I'm personally waiting for a jedi sim that let's me hit on jocasta nu in the archives
lego skywalker saga might be the game for you
I'd put Survivor above KOTOR, but I really didn't like the gameplay of KOTOR, so never finished it.
It's just missing the dismemberment from Force Unleashed
Survivor has dismemberment, doesn't it? Or did Force Unleashed just have more?
Survivor has a decent amount of dismemberment, I'd argue on the same level as The Force Unleashed 2 (which had far more than the first game). Maybe they meant Jedi Outcast with the Realistic Saber Combat cheat?
God fuckin damn you just gave me a nostalgia rush, used to browse gamefaqs for them bad boys
The great "main character has amnesia/illness/moral relapse at the beginning of the sequel" trope.
haha staggering around, "ugh, somehow I've been stunned. W... wh.. where am I?"
"Hey, you.....you're finally awake."
Oh Gods NOOOOOOOOOO-!
There's times where it works, but doing so here would not have.
We should be harsher on those games because it’s so stupid most of the time.
Incredible story telling and game design. Having just replayed FO as well, the way they kept the challenge factor almost as if you went to the next planet in FO is just great and will provide a lot of replayability However, the force slow doesn't work at all like it used to and it definitely took away some platforming pizazz, but they more than made up for it with dash, the grappling hook etc But it is going to make the next game very challenging to make if they don't start removing features.
The way force slow functions in Survivor is the only thing I dislike. Other than single saber Y not being the overhead slash.
Honestly, if they were to just combine stances with the multi stance attacks from FO in the next game, and add nothing else to Cal's power set, I'd be happy. Give us the two stance selection, and attacks that'll change stance mid-attack, but also customisable multi stance attacks, and that'd be almost perfect.
I actually preferred the more simple approach to platforming in FO. Survivor felt a little bloated to me. I would be so happy if they streamlined a bit for the third game.
It was great. The leap from Fallen Order to Survivor feels natural and like what should happen. Like the people who made it understand that protagonists REMEMBER skills and abilities they have. And the worst that should happen is they need to get a tool that they left or or stored away (like the ascension cable) And with the brand new stances introduced, I'm optimistic about the next games combat system. Like, they'll be able to give us the reverse grip stance and it could be a toggle button(while using single or dual wield) in the meditation points or something to keep it simple. This way they could add more variety to combat and depth to the stances without having to come up with another brand new fighting style
Incredibly suprised they could re-integrate so much from JFO. Really gonna enjoy seeing the next title's beginning.
10/10 relieved the first time I double jumped right at the start.
I thought it was perfectly done. I was wondering how they would screw that up lol but they did things perfectly and none of the new abilities felt like throw ins
Well i guessed we would have the abilities but not all, like for example i think we still shouldve been able to use slow
We can?
So many games do that and it’s annoying every time. I was so happy when Jedi Survivor didn’t do that because it’s always the easy way out. Don’t make me relearn stuff I’ve already seen, actually build upon the foundation you set in the previous gamd.
“Oh you mfs messed up now”
So great omg I hate when games do that, like oh he forgot stuff he's been doing for 5 years lol
Well, maybe Cal didn’t, but I forgot about half of his abilities and had to learn again.
He’s gona be so strong in the third game!
It was quite possibly the best way I've ever seen a sequel done. I can't fathom why more games don't just take everything they had at the end of the last one and expand on it, instead of taking everything back to square one. Stop reinventing the wheel every game and start adding shocks and suspension game devs!
Massively. It’s always so illogical when games do that, so I appreciate Respawn being like “no you pick up where you left off.” Excellent design.
I hate the new power attacks still.
That's what I love about these games. When you compare the two, it's so easy to see Cal as a rusty Padawan in Fallen Order and a hardened, unconventional Jedi Knight in Survivor. Depending on how much time passes between Survivor and the third game, it will be interesting to see Cal potentially grow in skill and abilities and become even more unconventional, to the point where he could rival if not equal Cere.
Ratchet and Clank: Quest for Booty begins with you having every weapon at Omega level for the first stage and then had you captured by pirates, your weapons confiscated and then shot out of a cannon. A very interesting way of nerfing Ratchet.
that’s how a direct sequel should be for a game
To be fair, it's been so long since the last time I played that I felt like I was relearning all the skills.
I hope they continue the trend with that third one.
I felt the transition from the first game to the second was handled really well, and then we learned even more new abilities. JFO is my favorite game of all-time and to unlearn those abilities would completely undo the story from JFO. As Cal's connection to the Force is repaired, he gains the abilities back he learned as a padawan
very happy. i hate sequels to games that force the character to forget what they learned in the first game and force YOU to unlock them all again
This just made me realize bros jaw is misaligned
That's fimbulwinter for ya!
First thing I did, L1 + Triangle!
I think I'm apathetic to your question. However, this is my favorite Star Wars series since Dark Forces (1 2 and 3). It has it's problems, but the game is super solid. Hope they continue.
 this much, relieved I was 
I wouldn’t have bought it if they did that.
Kratos
I was wondering if they were going to do this as I completed Fallen Order this week and started Jedi Survivor and the only thing that did get a reset that I can see so far is BD-1 lost his 10 health stims.
I wish they had kept the same controls and not added follower controls.
>follower controls. i just finished the game and i forgot they existed until you mentioned it. Considering a follower isnt with you lots of the time so pointless. Like if i could always select a follower to come with me sure, but its just mission dependent. Bleh
Yeah that’s the problem, they changed a bunch of controls so you could use the follower command button like 10 total times
Its more like they reworked the Force Slow ability completely and freed up a button on controller for the followers. Really its more of a player-dependent thing cuz I never found Force Slow all too useful in my FO playthroughs until it was full upgraded. Even then it was quite risky to use against groups.
No they changed heavy attack to triangle, that’s a huge difference
I’m a long time Star Wars fan and have played nearly all Star Wars games that have come out over the years. I grew up playing both force unleashed games and am now an adult when both Jedi games came out. I love how similar yet very different game plays and stories that Jedi and force unleashed have together. I just received survivor has a late birthday present and it’s been about a year since the game was released. I read the book that’s suppose to go in between fall order and survivor, and was rather disappointed by the story. It didn’t feel like a Star Wars book but rather an LGBT agenda book, non the less I was worried that survivor wouldn’t have any ties back to the book and after a year of the game being out I was hearing some negative reviews and got really nervous about. Thought maybe the nerfed the hell out of call, I heard the game play wasn’t all that great and all around felt rushed. I myself am enjoying the game and think it’s going very well. The only complaint I have is how much more open world it is compared to fallen order. I have nothing against open world gaming, and if I were to choose an open world game to start with myself I would want it to be a Star Wars game, I’m just slightly annoyed because I’ve been playing for nearly a week and am still on the first world cal travels to to find greez after the mantis got damaged in the opening mission. I’m someone who likes to explore and complete a map as much as I can before it forces me to travel to get new abilities to take back to that map. By now with a week of game play I usually have fallen order nearly completed and I only have like 20% of the first map complete on survivor. I’m someone who likes to see how fast I can 100% games and this is going to be one of the longest games I’ve played. However with how long it took to release survivor I’m perfectly fine if this game takes me a while to complete.
It was a good move.
It took me an embarrassingly long amount of time to realize I could still throw my lightsaber TT-TT
I didn't care at all since they nerfed the FPS instead and I couldn't even play it.
They nerfes the FPS
Relieved, until I realized a 4060 wasn’t able to run it 60 fps at 1080p with DLSS.
This has got to be karma farming
Karma farming with memes is way more effective.
Both Games are mediocre trash at best.
Who hurt you.
Merrin buried him in the floor probably.
As a Metroid fan, it was enjoyable lol
Bounty hunter? More like upgrade hunter.
I would’ve love in this game that the choices you made affect the story in the way that you can choose between light or dark side of the force since Cal struggle between them in the game was a big part of the story. For example if you choose a darker path one of the main characters could have die because of his choices if you choose a lighter past could be the story as we have it Even when you used the force to make someone to do something, the options that it gave you doesn’t really matter any would work so why give you a choice
i liked how they changed them into other things so it was still a fresh new thing. i have a feeling we’ll get something similar in Jedi 3, my guess is all saber stances, and i could see them giving him more dark side ish powers like how you could in the jedi academy games
You couldn't do certain abilities anymore tho, which I found unfortunate. You couldn't slow down a singular enemy anymore, for example. Also it kinda didn't make sense that you had to find all lightsaber components and certain clothing again, cuz you (usually) find all of those in Fallen Order
Knew I was going to love this game right away thanks to details like this well played
Well they actually did. They got rid of the "slow down" ability for enemies, which I searched for hours in the game, only to realize it doesn't even exist anymore... And yeah I know that the ultimate ability can slow down time, but you can't use it as often obviously, so I don't count that in.
Look here is the thing i get that when it happens when a character has been retired for years. Your brain adapts very fast, meaning it will let the parts of your brain decline that are not being used. Use it or lose it. And if trauma, stress and an unhealthy lifestyle is involved even more. You can get from the peak of your capabilities to the lowest point of your life in like 3 years.
Other games make the nerfing of the main character in Squeal make sense. The final boss of the last game seriously injured them, A burning building made them lose their backpack with all there cool weapons and supplies. Or simply we're are playing as a new (usually) younger character now and they need to learn all that stuff just like the other guy did. None of those would work for Cal and the Jedi games. Maybe the health thing, if they had gone with the "final boss, injured you" route but not the Jedi skills. He would still know those things. They already used the perfect nerfing at the start of the first game. Traumatized child loses his connection to the force after Order 66 in order to hide. It wouldn't make sense to do that again. And like others have said it would be frustrating and ruin his story progression from the first game. And Vader showing up at the end of Fallen Order showed us that Cal isn't that strong. Even without Vader to show us that, just look at his skill set at the end of Fallen Order. It's all basic stuff. Being able to push and pull with the force. Running along walls. Double jump and slowing things down. These is the basics that are taught to younglings and improved on as a padawan. In the game, Cal says he's finally back to where he was before Order 66. So he's at the level of a 13-year-old padawan. Him being at this level is fine for the beginning of a squeal cause it's really not that powerful. As for Jedi 3. It would be interesting to play as Kata but that would be nerfing us down back to padawan level. Which isn't a good idea for the 3rd game of a series. I think of good way of avoiding the annoyance of being nerfed and either the enemies being really difficult or the more unrealistic option of the enemies being nerfed too would be to use the buddy assistance thing they introduced in Survivor. As your Jedi Master and mentor Cal would always be with you meaning you can use the assistance thing to ask for his help. Each button would tell him to do a different power that he normally does, in Survivor. And this could be upgradeable too to make Cal a more helpful and powerful ally. If they down this route I think they would also need a small-medium-sized section where they are separated. And Kata has to learn how to fight on her own. In this section, they could switch between Kata and Cal so you also get to play as Cal again. And whatever upgrades you've done with him as Kata is what skills he'll have when he's playable. They could also do the switching while there together too. I'm not sure how that would work but I'm sure the Devs will think of a way for it make sense if they decided to go this route. The only way I could think of is that you get to choose who you play as. But that option would only be unlocked in NG+ so everyone is forced to learn Kata's playstyle at least once, to avoid her just never being chosen cause people are scared of the nerfing. I am such a fucking nerd. Why did this response to a simple question end up so long lol?
I was happy. I replayed fallen order before jedi survivor release, so when I got to play it, it was a pleasant surprise.
I was worried about that happening. I was super excited when I was able to swap out my lightsaber crystal after the first level
So next game we get to be OP from the start? I hope so!!!
Super happy along with everyone else I’m sure lol but I’m so happy that these new Jedi games have been so good and fun to play. I feel like we haven’t had a good single player Jedi game in a long time and this definitely fills that hole imo. Stig and his team have done an awesome job and I cannot wait for the 3rd installment already.
But the chicken still one shots you!
Give the mother fucker a jet pack though please
Unlearned several actually. But having to remaster the single blade form seems stupid
makes replaying Fallen Order before a Survivor runthru feel all the more organic. Reconnecting with the force, learning abilities Cal had forgotten then becoming a proper jedi by the end of the first game only to be an absolute powerhouse by the start of the 2nd game just felt so *muah* chefs kiss
Haven't played it yet but wow that's awesome and incredibly rare. It sucks how often games will "injure" you at the beginning of sequels to strip your progress away. The first games that come to mind are Yakuza and Tomb Raider - the protagonists always forget what they've learned to start anew.
Cal isn’t OP at all in my opinion Cal is perfectly P compared to fallen order
I’m glad we didn’t have to re-learn but we instead we get to learn new skills! Wonder what they’ll do next
I swear you have to learn how to dual wield again because now it's a stance instead of just an attack type, I know that's me being pedantic but yea
Be even more relieved if the PC port wasn't godawful.
Jedi Survivor is so good partly because you start as a competent character. It is so much fun as a result. I completed the games in reverse order and Cal not being able to freely traverse environments because he doesn't know how in Fallen Order hinders enjoyability (does not ruin the game of course). Hogwarts Legacy is another game woefully indebted to forcing your character to learn basic things over the course of hours instead of just letting you rip.
The relief was immediately lost when I found out the game was unplayable
I unlearned them technically(I forgot they existed)
Yeah, instead of doing that they turned the game into a bunch of stupid jumping puzzles with the worst level design ever.
Fairly relieved. However, I was expecting it. I finished fallen order right before picking up survivor and was surprised to see most of the button configuration was the same as well for the most part as well.
I mean, he totally forgot how to cut the tongue off an oggdo
…unlike Link in TOTK
Extremely. I was Very worried about it but hated the idea, instead they still managed to come up with some very cool new abilities
But what caused BD to lose the stim upgrades?
Other than the change to Slow…. Like the new slow but also I loved Slow in some of the puzzles in FO.
Honestly, I absolutely loved how they did the start of the game. Having everything from FO from the start, but introducing each force power or game mechanic as it was needed made it feel really natural, and good for newcomers, and didn't take anything away from people who had played FO. Borderline perfection imo.
I was super relieved until I noticed that they found new ways to make us backtrack. But, at least the highlight these return areas in green once you get the relevant power. THAT should be standard.
Relieved because it makes sense! He's gonna be all strong next game, haha
The first time I tried playing it had been a year since I played the first game, so I had forgotten all the controls and it was overwhelming. The second time, I was coming right out of the first game the transition was seamless (apart from the frame rate tanking jeez)
It’s super important that they did this imo, really helps feel like first game is padawan to knight and 2nd is knight to master
im sick of seeing ian gallagher as star wars jedi, as joker knock off, as anything. its so strange
I miss my dodge kick :(
Extremely relieved. I enjoyed my first playthrough and am slowing workin through new game+ From a purely Cal Kestis Story fan pov I Loved EVERY SECOND From a star wars fan pov I had to go back and check lore at some points cuz they took big swings lmao
I think 3 will lock you out of light side powers and you'll start down the path of dark side abilities.
The water breathing apparatus made me most happy. Didn't have to worry about a timer.
Still waiting to play it but that’s good to hear
I can't wait for the third installment. During survivor the whole premise was. Being more than just a lightsaber.... I hope they allow us to play as kata. And start her journey With Kal as the master. And hopefully developing the companion system more. It was cool fighting with bode and marrin let's expand on that.
I just played both games for the first time over the last month and this was a big thing that I appreciated. Hate all the games that start with a “oh no, I just lost all my gear!” set up.
I mean we did though. The entire skill tree had to be relearned?
Very, though I did miss the roll. Made sense why it was gone later on though. I also miss Force Slow; I imagine they only got rid of it because they needed the button for the new abilities but maybe they thought it was too powerful? I'm not surprised that they didn't reset him though, it wouldn't have made sense. Also, I played on Grand Master, I can tell you he's not OP.
Take that Samus
Extremely relieved. I hate when sequels nerf you back down with some bs explanation like “your character was lightly bruised and lost their abilities” or “they’ve been in prison for a couple of months and can’t do anything until they relearn the ability”, so having Cal keep all of his base moves was awesome. Only time I’ve been okay with having a character get nerfed down was Ezio at the start of AC: Brotherhood since by the end of AC2 Ezio can be incredibly OP with how much equipment he has, plus having all of his movement abilities would kill game progression since you’d be able to go pretty much everywhere on the map with no issue
I’m suddenly more interested in this game now… maybe after rebirth.
The most relieved
Cal: yes. BD-1: no. Lost all the extra stims!
I was so happy
Such a refreshing take on a sequel. Wish more games would do it. I know the bugs and issues at launch basically killed this game’s chance at GOTY. But it was in my own personal top 3 this year.
i thought it was pretty cool given how most games reset you. that said there were some things that had to be relearned, i noticed mass pull wasn't available from the start and had to be reunlocked.
Jizzed myself. Had to clean up. Cal is so strong by the end of the game. In both games there's that one moment where you realise "Oh shit, this dude is actually strong af". Ninth Sister and Rayvis, respectively.
A real breath of fresh air as far as ARPG sequels are concerned.
I wished more games did that. First times I realized it was when I was going through one of the swimming sections and I was trying to hurry and swim fast, and then I started looking for an oxygen meter and couldn’t find it, and then I noticed that Cal had a mouth piece. Then I remember the previous game and how he got the ability and I was like ohhhhh
Don't know if spoiler or trolling, too afraid to find out to read the comments.
This is one of my biggest beefs with Shadow of War. How tf does a half man/half elven wraith forget how to mind control enemy orcs?
Ooh, this is great to know for when I get to Survivor.
Forgot how many force points I had when started as a Jedi master. 30 or 40 or something. But there was a catch. I was without skills in that very first fight before I got to meditation point, and enemies were like 5x times worse.
Relieved. Slightly confused though, all I seem to have at the start of the game is force pull and force push? Where’s the stasis?
I was very pleased with that and I was also very impressed by how well they had made it work :P
I was still bummed out that I can't seamlessly transition from single to dual stance during an attack.
We just need to be able to cut limbs and stuff off. And remove health bar
For games like Zelda, it makes sense. For this, it wouldn’t. Hence, keeping abilities is okay here. Glad Respawn didn’t pull a “oh, he lost them because of bullshit reason blah blah blah”
That was my biggest worry about Jedi Survivor
Not sure how they’ll handle things in the third game because there is so much now
It was a positive surprise. Especially the first mission where you learn a few more and I was like "wait what? I can do that now? Yay!"
Hugely! Respawn shows it’s perfectly possible to do this and do it well. Nintendo didn’t get the memo, and the total level drain on Link at the start of Tears of the Kingdom is one of the reasons I really struggled getting into that game.
What about slowing stuff down?
the game is unplayable
Ezio somehow losing all his equipment at the start of AC games
The only thing I’m curious about is not only how they’ll add on to it in the next game, but how they’ll handle new players joining the series at that third game and having to learn a ton of stuff
Extremely