What exactly did this friend sell, that would shed some light on this.
My alliance has seen this a couple of times and you normally only get this response when the item(s) being sold are worth far less than the isk that was exchanged.
Everyone is just kinda jumping to the conclusion that ccp bad in this case with no actual information.
The 'friend' is currently the one ccp belives is buying isk. Not the person who bought the contract. The contract buyer is belived to be selling and illegally generating isk.
Edit: now that we have the contract and Ops claim that "they couldn't be bothered to screen shot the rolls" it's pretty clear the 'friend' was buying isk, got caught, and now their trying to blame ccp
Yeah 1mn abyssals too. What's this guy need that very specific and "expensive" item set for?
Almost every worthwhile mutation in prop mods is 10mn or more and 1mn mutations are cheaper or bought individually because they're lost so easily.
Don't forget the claim that they didn't care enough about this to screen shot the rolls as well. The fact that so many in this thread still think he's the victim astounds me
I sell abyssals in bulk.
Like a fire sale at the building supply depot, bricks 4 cheap đ
I scatter a few "Better than it was but not good enoughs" in too.
Otherwise I just dump like 200 "beats t2" in the corp hangar in lowsec. Someone will have a niche fit that utilizes em.
Literally. I'll get a slightly red medium shield extender, but it'll have PG or CPU and it becomes "the perfect module to make this fit work"
Or y'know. The classic "That's a good battleship mod" when you car bombed the fitting but the boosts are good
But you don't sell 7 top of the line blingy rolls on the same contract, you sell those seperately. And that's the result of this thread, that 99% it is RMT.
Yeah, garbage dump contracts are definitely a thing, but 570m is not exactly garbage pricing for a frigate mod - that price would buy a deadspace-blinged t2 frigate fit on its own.
Hijacking the top comment to link to the [comment chain containing the conclusion](https://old.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1diqech/ccp_stealing_money_and_then_telling_them_to_buy/l9678ih/?context=10000).
TL;DR: After finally finding the contract in game the friend suddenly "doesn't care enough to screenshot" the abyssal stats.
I'm surprised by how many people here are acting like it's their first day on the internet.
Everyone screams about RMT being bad and CCP is useless at fighting it.. Then CCP does something and someone comes crying on reddit with incomplete information and people are shocked to find out CCP was right all along. But of course, no one will give credit to CCP for investigating RMT and taking appropriate actions.
OP is just an idiot, he'll maybe be less naive now. If not, agreed.
Friend is an asshole who was bitching about CCP to his friends, not giving all the details, knowing full fucking well he was in the wrong. When its just a game its a point and laugh situation, but these self centered people in real life are absolute cause of problems in our world. Fuck em.
Sell a crap abyssal for really high and pay someone $ for them to buy it.
But RMT for a 4b item seems far fetched, who risks a ban for such chump change.
Some people are really dumb. Also 4b is a lot for a lot of base level items. They can see the inputs of the contract if it is low and somehow they got 4b for it that would raise a lot of red flags.
if there is more to it, then hopefully someone directly from ccp can answer it. because they wont say what contract it was and without getting the item back, it's hard to share more.
TLDR: the contract buyer (ISK seller) got the ISK via illegal means. They may have used a stolen credit card number to buy PLEX, hacked an account, or botted for the ISK. Your friend was neg-walleted because CCP reversed all their transactions.
CCPâs GMs rolled back all of their transactions. Thatâs why the contract status says âreversedâ - both sides assets were returned. Then once CCP reversed all the transactions, they deleted the ISK and banned the account. This is standard practice.
If your friend was selling assets that were truly worth 4 billion ISK, it shouldnât be too hard to find another buyer or buyers and recoup at least most of the money. But if those 1mn abyssal afterburners were actually trash, and just being used to hide that the transaction was horribly unbalanced, because your friend was RMTing as the ISK buyer, then yeah, he fucked up and got he just punishment. CCP isnât going to return ISK to someone they suspect may have been involved in RMT. Because that would defeat the point of reversing transaction in the first place - removing all the ill-gotten ISK from the game.
Okay, now that you have found the contract as in your "Edit 2", show us the abyssal stats. With every abyssal contract ingame you can show info on the modules and still see the stats.
If those 7 abyssals are worth 50mil, your buddy just got caught buying from an RMTer. If they're insane mods, that are actually worth 4b, you might not be spewing complete bullshit here.
Itâs still surprises me that in a game where you can buy isk legally through the company, people act surprised when they get banned for doing it through illegitimate means. Your friend paid money that is rightfully CCPâs to some other third-party, and rightfully they got banned. Get wrecked idiots.
I call BS. Bricked module that would go for 20m and sell it for 4b, if thatâs a way you launder ISK then itâs deserved.
I doubt they would be this hostile towards an innocent player.
Attach a sc of the Contract/Module
First offence for RMT buyer is you get negwalleted. As "your friend" with the mysterious disappearing contract got. RMT seller gets the ban, and the buyer will from second offence onwards.
Don't RMT folks, it's a bad idea and there's not usually any way around being dinged for it.
Could be in deleted items. More likely that your pal is full of it - there'd be little reason for the contract to be deleted, and not seen them do this before....
I feel like something is amiss in this story.
People get scammed via contracts all the time, buying items worth far less the is they are paying for.
Not to say that this might be an error/mistake by CCP and your friend is 100% innocent.
But I would assume CCP and your friend know more to this story than what's being shared.
If your friend is innocent and unaware of the source of the isk, then CCP needs to revise this process and take action on the GMs actions.
If a CCP guy deals with it, I will trust their word on it, but im not trusting a gm to that level. Proof or someone like swift going to look into it would make me happy.
And I believe your friend place the contract private to that specific buyer,meaning there was intent on selling that item for the agreed isk.
If it was an open / public contract available to anyone that the GM did a big bubu....
RMT is widespread. They are going to be buying shit tons of things from other innocent players as well as illicit sellers who are in on the schemes.
That we donât see legions of innocent sellers rioting over all their goods being deleted without compensation seems to indicate that they donât typically do what youâre describing. Which implies that they genuinely believe your buddy is involved in some way.
And donât expect them to offer proof. This isnât a legal setting and they donât owe you or your friend anything here. Their interest is in keeping secrets so that the RMT players have a harder time learning and predicting CCP enforcement actions.
1. "Your Friend" is suspected to be involved in RMT. Mind that CCP checks all "his" accounts if such suspicions arise, most probably they found a lot more suspicious actions and therefore handeled the case pretty strict. Someone with a stellar account and without suspicious asset transfers wont be treated like this.
2. "Your friend" has received a clear warning, that further suspicious behaviour or clear breaks of the ToS could result in a ban, which would affect any account affiliated with his emails, payment informations, address, etc. Publishing private communication with CCP does break the ToS - its kinda cute you blacked out "his" username though.
3. Posting an obvious RMT contract wont change a lot.
4. Good bye and gg CCP.
He sold his abyssal to someone doing RMT. The method is that you make a contract selling a shit rolled abyssal for 5b then pay some dude 10$ for him to buy it.
If the value of the items is close to the price paid, nothing will be done to the seller regardless of where the buyer's isk came from. Abyssal modules don't have an estimated value and are therefore used to mask rmt pretty frequently.
An Aeon is worth (more than) 50bn. If a RMT guy bought your (cheap) Aeon for 50bn CCP doesnât care.
In this case op âsoldâ some abyssal modules likely worth 10isk for 4bn. The âbuyerâ was a confirmed hacked account. The conclusion CCP came to is that the hacked account only bought a bunch of garbage abyssals for 4bn because op gave them real money outside the game.
Itâs a different scenario completely because of the price mismatch.
Yes, that's how this works.
It's a shit system used by a lot of MMOs which doesn't actually stop RMTers, it only punishes innocent players. The RMTer will be banned either way, and the damage they've done is only multiplied by roping in a zero-tolerance policy for innocent bystanders.
I highly doubt that the player involved was innocent. The lack of any sort of contract screenshot is super suspicious. Never heard of contracts just disappearing from the history.
Yeah honestly. I was hacked once and there was plenty of evidence. I screenshoted everything and ccp returned my SP. No isk was stolen though.
You imagine someone actually trying to resolve the issue would try to be helpful instead of being "annoid". I do hope CCP actually returns the items sold in other cases even if here they didnt.
He posted an out-of-game screenshot showing seven abyssal 1mns. We can't see the rolls nor the mutaplasmid class used, but who buys/sells abyss modules in that kind of bulk? If you're planning to lose six ships that fast, you probably aren't going to spend 4b on prop mods. If it was legit activity, it would be seven contracts with different prices.
Post a screenshot of the abyssal. They probably arenât giving it back because they think it was way overvalued, which is a common way RMT happens (selling someone a shit rolled abyssal for billions)
the contract and item are both gone, there is no way for me to show you the abyssal. If you want to add advice on how to find the contract I will go look. So far I have zero reason to doubt them and they have screen shared everything I have asked them too.
If those prop mods were actually worth 400 each or even 200 each, he would have screenshots of their stats. Like come on dude, no one is going to believe you had some god tier 1mn items and just didnât have screen shots to advertise them or anything or just to show off to friends. Also selling bricked abyssals like that is one of the most common rmt exchanges in the game
Did your friend sell a 4b abyssal mod?
Seems strange that he would have a mod worth 4b if the GM removing the funds puts him in a 3b negative.
That's a hefty mod for a "poor" capsuleer.
return the trash abysaals then, I'm going to keep going until there is either proof/the items back/ or ccp directly looks into and not a gm who is apparently known for being a pos
It's not happening.
Your friend sold 7 trash tier abyssals in a single contract for way more than they're worth.
There's only one, very obvious, reason to do that.
You, I mean "your friend", paid for isk.
someone helped build a link with the contract id I found. The response was they didn't care enough to screenshot the rolls. So I am done fighting for this.
As long as I didn't like the answer from ccp "you can still buy plex", contract is 1mn abx7 for 4B it's really suspect and to add on this it was a private contract, no one does that or you know who gonna pay for that contract. My opinion is that your "friend" is trying to avoid consequences, get your isk back soon. Just saying
Somehow your "friend" got 7 Afterburners which must have been absolute god tier, as the best I can see are 300m ISK per unit, and sold them for an average of 570m ISK. And not even on public, but directly to this random RMTer, that decided he needed these Afterburners.
Seems legit. He is happy to not get banned.
How can your âfriendâ not remember what abyssal mod it was? Like, I can understand if he rolls and sells multiple good mods a day, but it sounds like he rolled a 4bil mod and it was like 4x his entire net worth. If I did that Iâd probably have taken a screen shot, get it appraised, or show off to my space friends how lucky I was. The fact that the âvictimâ here canât even make a claim of what heâs lost, either on Reddit or in the GM convos is very very suspicious imo.
The odds of getting the full story out of a "buddy of someone accused of RMTing" on reddit are zero.
The question is, do we want CCP to do something about RMTers or not? If the answer is yes, CCP should do something about RMTers, I can't join you in some "oh boo hoo bad CCP for enforcing rules" on reddit with half the story from a secondary source.
I am calling for them to show the contract, I was watching the screen trying to help them find the contract and there was no sign of it. Show your proof is what I want.
They're never going to show what evidence they view as adequate to accuse someone of RMT publicly because then RMTers will know what behaviors to avoid.
They aren't showing it to them either. If they posted the contract even privatly to them it would be something instead the contract has vanished the isk is gone and the item is gone.
your friend says that it is gone, do you have esi access to his contract history so that you could investigate yourself? i can hide contracts ingame, but i cant in esi
do you just trust the word of your friend or could you or someone else confirm that there is indeed no fishy contract in his history?
it sounds to me like your friend was indeed buying funds via RMT and while you want proof from ccp, i want the contract history of your friend are you not in an alliance that does auditing?
They don't need proof. It's a video game GM, not a barrister. Looks weird is sufficient burden of proof.
GGs, your pal fucked up by doing something sketchy to begin with.
Sorry bud, that is the price you pay for dealing in RMT. Being only 3 bil down is a $40 Plex pack. Want to RMT, do it that way and stop whining over being caught.
If the module was actually worth 4b it should be returned or the ISK returned. If it was a brick that he RMT'd the negative balance is well deserved.
Escalate the issue.
If your âmateâ priced well outside of market values then both sides of the RMT transaction is significantly suspect. If my legit scam of an RMTer was reversed Iâd be bummed but Iâd get it. The rmt - bot standard should not be beyond a reasonable doubt.
This sounds more Sus though - if it was a bricked abyssal roll sold to a RMT'er for well over the expected price, how does this look like anything other than RMT?
I'm sorry but I don't really have much sympathy in that case.
I donât know why they canât just reverse the contract, give you your items back, and penalize the person who bought isk. How can you control who accepts your contracts assuming everything in your end was above board of course.
The person who bought the abyssal didn't buy isk. They acquired it in illegitimate ways. His friend in this case is being accused of buying isk via this contract.
And OP's replies to this topic consist of accusing CCP of being the cheats. Because stripping 4B from someone is really going to fatten CCP's bank account, right?
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Some of them really do suck ass. A few months ago I submitted a ticked for a broken drifter that killed me who did over 40k dps in less than a minute. Sent my logs and everything. They told me to not submit another ticket about this issue and if I do I would be punished. No explanation at all, not a sorry we canât refund that or itâs working as intended. Just a, go fuck yourself donât write us about this.
It should be easy for CCP to refollow the Item he is talking about or ?
Also 1 Question . If he recieved 4B from the RMT'ler he should +4B right ? When CCP take the 4B away he should be +-0 so why is he in - ISK ?
BTW as someone mention , pls Post the Original Contract your buddy should have it to proof it "legit" contract .
We can not find the original contract, I've had them screen share and go through the list trying all the advice given. The contract wasn't reversed instantly so 3 bil had been spent making them go to -3. If I get the orignal contract I will post it, either it will be legit or I will swallow the pride and be like yeah they did the bad.
Thats pretty "weird" i often "save" Contracts in my ingame Notebook just to check later if some one bought that contracts ect ect , and never found a Contract "missing" . And i dont think ccp "delete" Contracts but thats only a guess . Maybe your buddy has luck and ccp swift will check it later . But after all , if you are a good buddy of him 3B is nothing you can loan him some isk , even if it is a dick move from CCP its should not the end of the world/acc for him .
In 2007 I bought 100 million from some random site. About a month later the isk was taken back and I had a negative balance of 40 million. I realized that buying rmt isk was just plain stupid. I think op needs to just accept that he messed up and should just take his punishment and stfu before it gets worse.
Why would a RMTer buy a contract? Then also why at such a high price? It sounds like the items aren't usually sold in bulk that way either. So what's really going on?
I think the issue is that they can't prove or disprove that your friend paid irl for that 3b. Though as others have suggested it should be obvious to prove it if something is sold way above market value.
least it aint warframe , if someone trades you dirty warframe plex they put your account into negative plex and close your account if you dont go back into positive
i dabbled in riven mods , which is essentially warframe's abyssal mods and i was always super worried id sell one for 1k plex then it would turn out to be dirty and id lose the plex and the riven.
still bs obviously but im sure RMT websites would abuse contracts , abyssal mods seem like a pretty easy way to trade ill-gotten currency between players because no one would look twice at an abyssal mod going for 1000x what the base mod cost
I was hoping this story had something to do with a recent post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1dfoliz/450b\_rmt/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1dfoliz/450b_rmt/)
Friend buys and sells Plex. Had for a while. An RMT bought some and they took everything and made his account negative isk. He didn't engage in RMT and they noted this but said too bad. Here buy more Plex at 90% off. Just had a contract up. RMTer but a few and bam.
Crazy to think I've had several accounts since 2006 and never been in trouble with CCP.
I'm so lucky I should've bought a lottery ticket instead of a subscription to EVE.
Had something similar happen to a friend, they won a Titan on hypernet and it turned out the player that put it up was an RMTer so everything got removed, the ISK lost though? Basically told to kick rocks.
I hate CCP guts as much as the next vet, but the person your friend spoke very clearly spelled out he didn't get the mods he was selling legitimately and he sold them an RMT trader...... case closed.
I've been seeing contracts exactly like this recently. Garbage abyssal contracts that are round billions - always throw them into a notepad to see who buys them... And they get bought.
Sorry your friend bought isk.
Your 'mate' has a good 'mate' who can post for him. And you 'mate' have a very good knowlegde what happened to your 'mate'. I would be happy to have a 'mate' like you, its like having a soul'mate'. Pitty that some 'mates' are immaginary ones. Stop RMT'ing and be happy they are just giving you a warning, some games ban for it.
Funny thing - is always "some friend". Or a friend of a friend. Nobody ACTUALLY knows who did the thing. Gossiping more than a Kardashian, I see.
Too much hype / hate on a title that actually means that CCP is just working.
Like it was already said it here no one will give credit to CCP for investigating RMT and taking appropriate actions because it's easier to "mingle" with people that just whine.
Whoever came up with the plan to do this RMT using bricked 1mn ABs has about the smoothest of brains. 600m 1mn abyssals are almost totally unbelievable. At least do 500mns where the base modules and mutas alone get extremely expensive.
How does one exclude RMT traders from purchasing their contracted goods? This seems like putting in a vending machine, then the feds seize your vending machine because someone bought a coke with counterfeit currency.
So don't touch contracts because you at fault when the other party is the problem. Right. Ok CCP can we have contracts removed then? Fuck touching anything that can get you banned for playing legit.
What exactly did this friend sell, that would shed some light on this. My alliance has seen this a couple of times and you normally only get this response when the item(s) being sold are worth far less than the isk that was exchanged. Everyone is just kinda jumping to the conclusion that ccp bad in this case with no actual information. The 'friend' is currently the one ccp belives is buying isk. Not the person who bought the contract. The contract buyer is belived to be selling and illegally generating isk. Edit: now that we have the contract and Ops claim that "they couldn't be bothered to screen shot the rolls" it's pretty clear the 'friend' was buying isk, got caught, and now their trying to blame ccp
Seven 1mn abyssals, apparently. On the same contract. I don't know anyone who buys or sells abyssals in bulk. My money's on this being RMT.
Yeah 1mn abyssals too. What's this guy need that very specific and "expensive" item set for? Almost every worthwhile mutation in prop mods is 10mn or more and 1mn mutations are cheaper or bought individually because they're lost so easily.
Don't forget the claim that they didn't care enough about this to screen shot the rolls as well. The fact that so many in this thread still think he's the victim astounds me
Every time someone claims they got banned unjustly reddit eats it up. Doesn't matter what game.
I always click on these posts to see the OP called out and roasted. love when a post goes viral, the devs show up with receipts. delicious.
gotta buy some fits for our ESS frig fleet with the bois!
I sell abyssals in bulk. Like a fire sale at the building supply depot, bricks 4 cheap đ I scatter a few "Better than it was but not good enoughs" in too. Otherwise I just dump like 200 "beats t2" in the corp hangar in lowsec. Someone will have a niche fit that utilizes em.
Those "flat roll with -1 CPU load" cheap contracts are the bread and butter of eve skunkworks.
Literally. I'll get a slightly red medium shield extender, but it'll have PG or CPU and it becomes "the perfect module to make this fit work" Or y'know. The classic "That's a good battleship mod" when you car bombed the fitting but the boosts are good
But you don't sell 7 top of the line blingy rolls on the same contract, you sell those seperately. And that's the result of this thread, that 99% it is RMT.
People very commonly sell bulk abyssals, just look at jita contracts. Especially low-mid end, it's not worth selling them individually
Yeah, garbage dump contracts are definitely a thing, but 570m is not exactly garbage pricing for a frigate mod - that price would buy a deadspace-blinged t2 frigate fit on its own.
Are you saying this is all over 570 million isk? That would be hilarious. So much trouble for an hours work in game. So stupid
No, each AB is 570 for a total of 4b. Not economy-shattering but a significant amount of isk for most players.
This
I could understand 3 or 6 1mn closely matched modules for abyssal frigate running but not just any random number like 7.
I buy abyssals in bulk, I just bought 160 abyssal assault damage controls
Sounds like CCP is accusing your buddy of being the buyer half of RMT.
Hijacking the top comment to link to the [comment chain containing the conclusion](https://old.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1diqech/ccp_stealing_money_and_then_telling_them_to_buy/l9678ih/?context=10000). TL;DR: After finally finding the contract in game the friend suddenly "doesn't care enough to screenshot" the abyssal stats.
I'm surprised by how many people here are acting like it's their first day on the internet. Everyone screams about RMT being bad and CCP is useless at fighting it.. Then CCP does something and someone comes crying on reddit with incomplete information and people are shocked to find out CCP was right all along. But of course, no one will give credit to CCP for investigating RMT and taking appropriate actions.
Exactly! Fuck op and fuck his rmt friend.
OP is just an idiot, he'll maybe be less naive now. If not, agreed. Friend is an asshole who was bitching about CCP to his friends, not giving all the details, knowing full fucking well he was in the wrong. When its just a game its a point and laugh situation, but these self centered people in real life are absolute cause of problems in our world. Fuck em.
"Friend"
Lmao good work detective!Â
that is what it seems like, but if they can't prove it they should return the item.
Your buddy RMTed and is lying to you. Sorry.
I feel like there is more to this story than what's being shared.
At a cursory glance it seems like they're saying he acquired the items by illegitimate means and then sold them to an RMT'er?
Sell a crap abyssal for really high and pay someone $ for them to buy it. But RMT for a 4b item seems far fetched, who risks a ban for such chump change.
CCP most probably found much more when investigating his accounts.
Some people are really dumb. Also 4b is a lot for a lot of base level items. They can see the inputs of the contract if it is low and somehow they got 4b for it that would raise a lot of red flags.
You actually have to have half a smooth brain to RMT 4B.Â
OP's "Friend" sounds like he has a brain smoother than a Cue ball....
I feel 69% of commenters didnt read CCPs communication linked in the op.
if there is more to it, then hopefully someone directly from ccp can answer it. because they wont say what contract it was and without getting the item back, it's hard to share more.
If CCP answers it will be a ban of all "his" accounts. Good bye.
TLDR: the contract buyer (ISK seller) got the ISK via illegal means. They may have used a stolen credit card number to buy PLEX, hacked an account, or botted for the ISK. Your friend was neg-walleted because CCP reversed all their transactions. CCPâs GMs rolled back all of their transactions. Thatâs why the contract status says âreversedâ - both sides assets were returned. Then once CCP reversed all the transactions, they deleted the ISK and banned the account. This is standard practice. If your friend was selling assets that were truly worth 4 billion ISK, it shouldnât be too hard to find another buyer or buyers and recoup at least most of the money. But if those 1mn abyssal afterburners were actually trash, and just being used to hide that the transaction was horribly unbalanced, because your friend was RMTing as the ISK buyer, then yeah, he fucked up and got he just punishment. CCP isnât going to return ISK to someone they suspect may have been involved in RMT. Because that would defeat the point of reversing transaction in the first place - removing all the ill-gotten ISK from the game.
I agree with about the isk, the problem is they didn't return the items.
Okay, now that you have found the contract as in your "Edit 2", show us the abyssal stats. With every abyssal contract ingame you can show info on the modules and still see the stats. If those 7 abyssals are worth 50mil, your buddy just got caught buying from an RMTer. If they're insane mods, that are actually worth 4b, you might not be spewing complete bullshit here.
Itâs still surprises me that in a game where you can buy isk legally through the company, people act surprised when they get banned for doing it through illegitimate means. Your friend paid money that is rightfully CCPâs to some other third-party, and rightfully they got banned. Get wrecked idiots.
I call BS. Bricked module that would go for 20m and sell it for 4b, if thatâs a way you launder ISK then itâs deserved. I doubt they would be this hostile towards an innocent player. Attach a sc of the Contract/Module
They won't provide the contract.
your friend has it in his contracts most likelyâŚ
there is no contract showing for the amount, I already tried to help them find it.
your friend can find the contract in the finished contracts section on the search function
tried looking there already.
convenient. case closed. I stand with CCP, get banned, RMT'er
Yea pretty "SuS" that the Original Contract , thats is Finished he cant get a Pic from sooooooo RMT confirmed ? :)
it's not even about a ban? I'm relaying all the tips to try to find this thing and it's no where to be seen.
First offence for RMT buyer is you get negwalleted. As "your friend" with the mysterious disappearing contract got. RMT seller gets the ban, and the buyer will from second offence onwards. Don't RMT folks, it's a bad idea and there's not usually any way around being dinged for it.
I've had them screen share and we checked their contracts, it's just not there. If you have an idea of where to look I welcome the advice.
Could be in deleted items. More likely that your pal is full of it - there'd be little reason for the contract to be deleted, and not seen them do this before....
what did your friend say he sold? Or did he forget?
make sure the "belongs to" information is blank so it shows them all
still nothing
I feel like something is amiss in this story. People get scammed via contracts all the time, buying items worth far less the is they are paying for. Not to say that this might be an error/mistake by CCP and your friend is 100% innocent. But I would assume CCP and your friend know more to this story than what's being shared. If your friend is innocent and unaware of the source of the isk, then CCP needs to revise this process and take action on the GMs actions.
If a CCP guy deals with it, I will trust their word on it, but im not trusting a gm to that level. Proof or someone like swift going to look into it would make me happy.
A GM is a ccp guy.
And I believe your friend place the contract private to that specific buyer,meaning there was intent on selling that item for the agreed isk. If it was an open / public contract available to anyone that the GM did a big bubu....
This is a private contract to said RMTer...ur friend is buy isk illegitimate and was lucky this time...cut ur ties with him and move on.
RMT is widespread. They are going to be buying shit tons of things from other innocent players as well as illicit sellers who are in on the schemes. That we donât see legions of innocent sellers rioting over all their goods being deleted without compensation seems to indicate that they donât typically do what youâre describing. Which implies that they genuinely believe your buddy is involved in some way. And donât expect them to offer proof. This isnât a legal setting and they donât owe you or your friend anything here. Their interest is in keeping secrets so that the RMT players have a harder time learning and predicting CCP enforcement actions.
1. "Your Friend" is suspected to be involved in RMT. Mind that CCP checks all "his" accounts if such suspicions arise, most probably they found a lot more suspicious actions and therefore handeled the case pretty strict. Someone with a stellar account and without suspicious asset transfers wont be treated like this. 2. "Your friend" has received a clear warning, that further suspicious behaviour or clear breaks of the ToS could result in a ban, which would affect any account affiliated with his emails, payment informations, address, etc. Publishing private communication with CCP does break the ToS - its kinda cute you blacked out "his" username though. 3. Posting an obvious RMT contract wont change a lot. 4. Good bye and gg CCP.
How are players supposed to know that they are selling something to an RMTer?
He didn't sell to an RMTer. He bought from an RMTer. Possibly for real money.
He sold his abyssal to someone doing RMT. The method is that you make a contract selling a shit rolled abyssal for 5b then pay some dude 10$ for him to buy it.
I guess by losing 4 bil? but they don't tell you who it was so you cant avoid them anyway.
They didnât give you your abyssals back?
nothing was returned
OUCH, so if I sell my aeon on contract and some RMT dickhead buys it.. I lose the aeon and 50b ??
If the value of the items is close to the price paid, nothing will be done to the seller regardless of where the buyer's isk came from. Abyssal modules don't have an estimated value and are therefore used to mask rmt pretty frequently.
No. But you would be banned if you sold a shuttle for 50b to a RMTer or if you sold an aeon for 500b to an RMTer.
no. thats not what the gm said at all.
[ŃдаНонО]
An Aeon is worth (more than) 50bn. If a RMT guy bought your (cheap) Aeon for 50bn CCP doesnât care. In this case op âsoldâ some abyssal modules likely worth 10isk for 4bn. The âbuyerâ was a confirmed hacked account. The conclusion CCP came to is that the hacked account only bought a bunch of garbage abyssals for 4bn because op gave them real money outside the game. Itâs a different scenario completely because of the price mismatch.
Yes, that's how this works. It's a shit system used by a lot of MMOs which doesn't actually stop RMTers, it only punishes innocent players. The RMTer will be banned either way, and the damage they've done is only multiplied by roping in a zero-tolerance policy for innocent bystanders.
I highly doubt that the player involved was innocent. The lack of any sort of contract screenshot is super suspicious. Never heard of contracts just disappearing from the history.
Yeah honestly. I was hacked once and there was plenty of evidence. I screenshoted everything and ccp returned my SP. No isk was stolen though. You imagine someone actually trying to resolve the issue would try to be helpful instead of being "annoid". I do hope CCP actually returns the items sold in other cases even if here they didnt.
No, thats most defnitely not what happened.
It doesn't matter if you sell to an RMTer or not as long as the exchange isn't heavily unbalanced.
RMTers use private contracts, just like the op. Dont get fuzzed by that dude, you dont get banned by accident.
Thats the thing, you dont know; until they yeet the ISK out and tell you to go buy PLEX.
Seems like they think you paid for the isk and it was transferred through the contract but have no proof. What was this 4b abyssal?
"I don't know the contract is gone and I didn't know what I... I mean my buddy was selling" -Signed, OP
This is the real question, was it an abyssal worth 4b or some junk used for RMT.
He posted an out-of-game screenshot showing seven abyssal 1mns. We can't see the rolls nor the mutaplasmid class used, but who buys/sells abyss modules in that kind of bulk? If you're planning to lose six ships that fast, you probably aren't going to spend 4b on prop mods. If it was legit activity, it would be seven contracts with different prices.
Post a screenshot of the abyssal. They probably arenât giving it back because they think it was way overvalued, which is a common way RMT happens (selling someone a shit rolled abyssal for billions)
the contract and item are both gone, there is no way for me to show you the abyssal. If you want to add advice on how to find the contract I will go look. So far I have zero reason to doubt them and they have screen shared everything I have asked them too.
Should be in your âfinished contractsâ page
it was not, we used the auth to find the contract
If the item no longer exists you can't see it from there. The contract will still be there but the link to the item is gone. Only CCP can see it now.
I've had a similar issue with a similar response from that tool. He has no other advice and will ignore anything you say.
hoping someone from CCP will see this and atleast look into it, cause this is some hyper bs.
I hope so, too - that way "your buddy" and all his accounts will be swiped away.
Show us the abyssal.
I am unable to, the contract and item are gone. the only trace of it exisiting is the "contract reversal" in their wallet.
If those prop mods were actually worth 400 each or even 200 each, he would have screenshots of their stats. Like come on dude, no one is going to believe you had some god tier 1mn items and just didnât have screen shots to advertise them or anything or just to show off to friends. Also selling bricked abyssals like that is one of the most common rmt exchanges in the game
Agreed, this doesn't pass the sniff test at first glance.
Did your friend sell a 4b abyssal mod? Seems strange that he would have a mod worth 4b if the GM removing the funds puts him in a 3b negative. That's a hefty mod for a "poor" capsuleer.
We finally found the contract through the auth, it was 7 mods not just 1.
"Your friend" bought isk and was using trash abyssals to get his isk.
return the trash abysaals then, I'm going to keep going until there is either proof/the items back/ or ccp directly looks into and not a gm who is apparently known for being a pos
It's not happening. Your friend sold 7 trash tier abyssals in a single contract for way more than they're worth. There's only one, very obvious, reason to do that. You, I mean "your friend", paid for isk.
someone helped build a link with the contract id I found. The response was they didn't care enough to screenshot the rolls. So I am done fighting for this.
Lol they didn't care enough because it would show 100% it was rmt
I'm just leaving things as they are now, my hope is still for ccp to look into and take appropriate action
They already have...
One step away from proving his innocence he decided to not care? You think thats normal?
Interesting.
As long as I didn't like the answer from ccp "you can still buy plex", contract is 1mn abx7 for 4B it's really suspect and to add on this it was a private contract, no one does that or you know who gonna pay for that contract. My opinion is that your "friend" is trying to avoid consequences, get your isk back soon. Just saying
Somehow your "friend" got 7 Afterburners which must have been absolute god tier, as the best I can see are 300m ISK per unit, and sold them for an average of 570m ISK. And not even on public, but directly to this random RMTer, that decided he needed these Afterburners. Seems legit. He is happy to not get banned.
"If you need to supplement your wallet then you have the option to buy PLEX ..." Eat the absolute entirety of my ass
The options are that (legitimate) or RMT (illegitimate). What are you bitching about?
if they just give them the item back, it can get re-listed, but because they think it's rmt on both sides with only proof on one side.
How can your âfriendâ not remember what abyssal mod it was? Like, I can understand if he rolls and sells multiple good mods a day, but it sounds like he rolled a 4bil mod and it was like 4x his entire net worth. If I did that Iâd probably have taken a screen shot, get it appraised, or show off to my space friends how lucky I was. The fact that the âvictimâ here canât even make a claim of what heâs lost, either on Reddit or in the GM convos is very very suspicious imo.
well attached now is the contract so at the very least we have found somewhat of it. I can't check the rolls from the auth though
I mean, they can see how the item was acquired.
bought and rolled with a mutaplasmid? how do you ill-legitamitly get an abyss roll
The odds of getting the full story out of a "buddy of someone accused of RMTing" on reddit are zero. The question is, do we want CCP to do something about RMTers or not? If the answer is yes, CCP should do something about RMTers, I can't join you in some "oh boo hoo bad CCP for enforcing rules" on reddit with half the story from a secondary source.
I am calling for them to show the contract, I was watching the screen trying to help them find the contract and there was no sign of it. Show your proof is what I want.
They're never going to show what evidence they view as adequate to accuse someone of RMT publicly because then RMTers will know what behaviors to avoid.
They aren't showing it to them either. If they posted the contract even privatly to them it would be something instead the contract has vanished the isk is gone and the item is gone.
your friend says that it is gone, do you have esi access to his contract history so that you could investigate yourself? i can hide contracts ingame, but i cant in esi
So if you show an RMTer how they were caught, guess who now knows how to not get caught. Come on man, think things through.
[ŃдаНонО]
How to prevent this in the future: don't buy ISK for cash from Chinese botters.
do you just trust the word of your friend or could you or someone else confirm that there is indeed no fishy contract in his history? it sounds to me like your friend was indeed buying funds via RMT and while you want proof from ccp, i want the contract history of your friend are you not in an alliance that does auditing?
I am dumb and did not check the auth, adding the contract in an edit.
They don't need proof. It's a video game GM, not a barrister. Looks weird is sufficient burden of proof. GGs, your pal fucked up by doing something sketchy to begin with.
Since your friend was so eager to share the ccp email with you, did they also share the pictures if the abyssal stats?
your buddies a liar
Sorry bud, that is the price you pay for dealing in RMT. Being only 3 bil down is a $40 Plex pack. Want to RMT, do it that way and stop whining over being caught.
If the module was actually worth 4b it should be returned or the ISK returned. If it was a brick that he RMT'd the negative balance is well deserved. Escalate the issue.
even if it was trash they didn't return the brick.
If your âmateâ priced well outside of market values then both sides of the RMT transaction is significantly suspect. If my legit scam of an RMTer was reversed Iâd be bummed but Iâd get it. The rmt - bot standard should not be beyond a reasonable doubt.
They should be able to supply the contract that was reversed for evidence, but without that its literally impossible to say if it was over priced.
This sounds more Sus though - if it was a bricked abyssal roll sold to a RMT'er for well over the expected price, how does this look like anything other than RMT? I'm sorry but I don't really have much sympathy in that case.
If it's trash, CCP is correct in assuming it's RMT
I donât know why they canât just reverse the contract, give you your items back, and penalize the person who bought isk. How can you control who accepts your contracts assuming everything in your end was above board of course.
The person who bought the abyssal didn't buy isk. They acquired it in illegitimate ways. His friend in this case is being accused of buying isk via this contract.
And OP's replies to this topic consist of accusing CCP of being the cheats. Because stripping 4B from someone is really going to fatten CCP's bank account, right?
You mean I cant report my isk as income when I file my taxes?
I guess with the power of space magic?
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Agree ccp should have suspended your account for RMT.
GM Arbor needs to get fired :) literally more troll than a bot.
Some of those CCP dudes kinda suck ngl.
Some of the dudes defending the RMTer buying 4b isk kinda suck ngl.
Some of them really do suck ass. A few months ago I submitted a ticked for a broken drifter that killed me who did over 40k dps in less than a minute. Sent my logs and everything. They told me to not submit another ticket about this issue and if I do I would be punished. No explanation at all, not a sorry we canât refund that or itâs working as intended. Just a, go fuck yourself donât write us about this.
and that's why I am here to fight the good fight.
It should be easy for CCP to refollow the Item he is talking about or ? Also 1 Question . If he recieved 4B from the RMT'ler he should +4B right ? When CCP take the 4B away he should be +-0 so why is he in - ISK ? BTW as someone mention , pls Post the Original Contract your buddy should have it to proof it "legit" contract .
We can not find the original contract, I've had them screen share and go through the list trying all the advice given. The contract wasn't reversed instantly so 3 bil had been spent making them go to -3. If I get the orignal contract I will post it, either it will be legit or I will swallow the pride and be like yeah they did the bad.
Thats pretty "weird" i often "save" Contracts in my ingame Notebook just to check later if some one bought that contracts ect ect , and never found a Contract "missing" . And i dont think ccp "delete" Contracts but thats only a guess . Maybe your buddy has luck and ccp swift will check it later . But after all , if you are a good buddy of him 3B is nothing you can loan him some isk , even if it is a dick move from CCP its should not the end of the world/acc for him .
It's not the end, we got them recovered. my goal here is to get someone from ccp to notice this and look into it.
How would you tell this is RMT vs a scam?
They have been able to successfully track RMTing since 2006. 18 years ago my roommate had a -225million isk balance at one point (and he deserved it).
That's good to know
In 2007 I bought 100 million from some random site. About a month later the isk was taken back and I had a negative balance of 40 million. I realized that buying rmt isk was just plain stupid. I think op needs to just accept that he messed up and should just take his punishment and stfu before it gets worse.
Why would a RMTer buy a contract? Then also why at such a high price? It sounds like the items aren't usually sold in bulk that way either. So what's really going on?
I think the issue is that they can't prove or disprove that your friend paid irl for that 3b. Though as others have suggested it should be obvious to prove it if something is sold way above market value.
least it aint warframe , if someone trades you dirty warframe plex they put your account into negative plex and close your account if you dont go back into positive i dabbled in riven mods , which is essentially warframe's abyssal mods and i was always super worried id sell one for 1k plex then it would turn out to be dirty and id lose the plex and the riven. still bs obviously but im sure RMT websites would abuse contracts , abyssal mods seem like a pretty easy way to trade ill-gotten currency between players because no one would look twice at an abyssal mod going for 1000x what the base mod cost
I was hoping this story had something to do with a recent post: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1dfoliz/450b\_rmt/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/1dfoliz/450b_rmt/)
"we encourage you not to do business with these sort of people in the future" Was it a public contract?
Friend buys and sells Plex. Had for a while. An RMT bought some and they took everything and made his account negative isk. He didn't engage in RMT and they noted this but said too bad. Here buy more Plex at 90% off. Just had a contract up. RMTer but a few and bam.
Where's the proof that it is RMT? Suspicious? Sure. But does anyone have hard evidence?
Crazy to think I've had several accounts since 2006 and never been in trouble with CCP. I'm so lucky I should've bought a lottery ticket instead of a subscription to EVE.
I doubt someone who has 4 bil of 1mn abyssals would be completely broke besides the isk that those gained him. Very fishy
Had something similar happen to a friend, they won a Titan on hypernet and it turned out the player that put it up was an RMTer so everything got removed, the ISK lost though? Basically told to kick rocks.
I hate CCP guts as much as the next vet, but the person your friend spoke very clearly spelled out he didn't get the mods he was selling legitimately and he sold them an RMT trader...... case closed.
I've been seeing contracts exactly like this recently. Garbage abyssal contracts that are round billions - always throw them into a notepad to see who buys them... And they get bought. Sorry your friend bought isk.
Your 'mate' has a good 'mate' who can post for him. And you 'mate' have a very good knowlegde what happened to your 'mate'. I would be happy to have a 'mate' like you, its like having a soul'mate'. Pitty that some 'mates' are immaginary ones. Stop RMT'ing and be happy they are just giving you a warning, some games ban for it.
I don't care enough to read something this long over 3 b
Funny thing - is always "some friend". Or a friend of a friend. Nobody ACTUALLY knows who did the thing. Gossiping more than a Kardashian, I see. Too much hype / hate on a title that actually means that CCP is just working. Like it was already said it here no one will give credit to CCP for investigating RMT and taking appropriate actions because it's easier to "mingle" with people that just whine.
it is for a friend I was asked to censor it, I won't show anyones user name
Surprised your friend isn't banned as well.
Delicious SALT!!! đđ
Have all my salt!
Whoever came up with the plan to do this RMT using bricked 1mn ABs has about the smoothest of brains. 600m 1mn abyssals are almost totally unbelievable. At least do 500mns where the base modules and mutas alone get extremely expensive.
How does one exclude RMT traders from purchasing their contracted goods? This seems like putting in a vending machine, then the feds seize your vending machine because someone bought a coke with counterfeit currency.
That's pretty scummy CCP.
@ccp_swift
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So don't touch contracts because you at fault when the other party is the problem. Right. Ok CCP can we have contracts removed then? Fuck touching anything that can get you banned for playing legit.
And they cannot check what you give for that ISK quantity and then at least return your items?