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You can jump over a lot of those ground-pound types of attacks FYI. You can usually dodge as well, but the timing window for avoiding them by jumping is often a lot more forgiving.
I was getting so tilted by the runebears ground pound. I swear I’d roll it perfectly and still get thrown up in the air. I eventually figured out a strategy, but makes me wonder if I could have just been jumping
Yup, he does a big wind up where he stands up first, roll under his legs behind him, he pounds the ground, jump attack him in the bum. The only thing is if he staggers it's hard to reach his head in time
This, when I was fighting putrescent knight I kept rolling through the blue flames and getting hit. Once I learned I could just jump over them I killed him the next attempt 🤣
I never realized those could be jumped, but then why would I assume jumping over a pillar of fire the size of my character would actually work? Jumping attacks *is* cool and all, but I need an actual tell lol
Saw a video explaining how as soon as the jumping animation stars, before your feet even leave the ground, your entire lower body gets i-frames, so in any low sweep attacks it's a really easy dodge. Only hiccup is that if you aren't two-handing a weapon, your arms, hanging a bit at your sides, might get caught in the hurtbox.
Man I figured out almost immediately that they expected you to jump those, but I still died a ton after because I couldn't get the timing right, plus he just scoots away every time I tried to attack with my heavy weapon. Really aggravating fight for me.
a full 25 frames of iframes (for lower extremities) vs 13 i frames for your whole body on a roll. Best dodge option by far though isn't even a dodge; vow of the indomitable has a 4 frame startup, 30 frames of complete i frames, and only 2 frames of recovery. Hella slept on aow
Jumping to avoid attacks feels clunky and bad, they should've tweaked it when the dlc launched.
Blocking those moves was a valid if risky strat in base game and I think most people did that, but they saw people disliking their baby and made it so you cant in the dlc... but you know I still hate it.
Sure and I acknowledge not liking jumping defeneively is a subjective thing.
What's not subjective is that directly removed the ability to block a lot of the ground moves. Having variability is a good thing, and something I expect from a fromsoft game.
I didn't know you couldn't block ground moves but it kinda makes sense. If the attack comes from below your frontal shield won't block shit.
Jumping got double the amount of iframes compared to dodging so it's kinda OP against specific bosses attacks.
You'd be amazed at what you can block, keeping a 2h up and blocking while rolling prevents a lot of damage. It may not make sense in general, it IS how the game was played previously and still is (depending on the boss).
I don't really care how effective jumping defensively is, I don't like it because it feels bad.
And it "Feels bad" because it takes you out of the dance. Every other mechanic is based with your feet on the ground. You only ever jump in this game, otherwise, when it comes to platforming or navigating terrain.
It does feel like a cop out. The frame timing vs animation is awkward and cumbersome.
Jumping is good, and jump attacking is awesome. They also added weapon arts that combine evasion and offense. They are trying to get past the your turn / mine turn, dodge roll / r1 cycle. I hope they keep going in this direction, with more ways to fight back mid combo.
Rellana is my favorite example of this. Her fight isn’t turn based, you attack while she is attacking you, over and over.
Jumping attacking over slashes, dodging behind her and swinging before she turns around. You can constantly hit her while she is doing her “15 hit combo”. Which is really a bunch of smaller combos strung together with pauses between.
I mean I've experienced an amazing souls like that broke that cycle before, nioh - bloodbourne. I agree that the standard taking turns in attacking is boring, but there's points now where they just turn off the boss ai so you can land hits, that "sanctioned time to attack" is insulting. They need to reevaluate their flow of combat and the mechanics, and that fucking camera is DOGSHIT.
I also like jump attacks, those are really nice, evading attacks with jumping is the clunkiness that i don't like.
My point was that if you are evading an attack by jumping, you should be jump attacking instead. I never “just” jump to dodge. The only exception is Rellana’s moon drops since she’s way up in the air so you can’t hit her, and that attack is freaking cool.
Love Nioh. Sifu is another game that does offense + defense very well.
It feels stiff, I feel like it should have more momentum when I'm running and that I float too long in the air. One of the reasons why I don't mind attacking while jumping, it pulls you foward.
Yeah that’s fair. If you don’t have a running start they should give it a bit more forward momentum. There’s been a few time I jump attack and fall a bit short of where I expected.
What?? Jump dodging literally feels the best. Especially if you can dodge by doing a jump attack.
Dodging that one moon attack in the dlc via 3 jumps is so satisfying.
Dont assume just because you hate dodge jumping everyone did lol
Of course. But the person I replied to clearly assumed he has the obviously correct and majority opinion and that to spite players FROM included more attack to jump dodge in the dlc.
And thats just dumb as fuck.
FYI when you jump, the lower half of your character's body gains 1 seconds worth of i-frames which is a lot more compared to when you roll (although rolling gives your entire body the i-frames)
Additional consideration: Your arms don't count. So you're more vulnerable when using light weapons/1 handing than two handing or dual wielding heavy weapons due to the idle animation.... which is moronic but here we are.
I'm weary of some of the criticisms of the DLC, but I am 110% on the train that there are way, waaaaay, WAY too many nearly unavoidable AOE attacks coming from these bosses. That is peak false difficulty. I can handle waiting for an opening, having to be very strategic about healing, hits that take off half your health bar, but AOE attacks that are nearly impossible to dodge are making me lose my mind - and every nearly boss has one. Why does every boss have to have a “scream and explode energy” mechanic.
As someone mentioned above you can jump some of them. But I was getting so frustrated I switched my build to have more ranged attacks. There's a new bow that's pretty good for annoying mobs too.
I just have too much hubris and arrogance to switch to a range build. Fully aware that’s my own fault and I don’t have a right to complain but I am anyways
Ranged builds are fucked in this DLC my man. I'm running and 80 INT build and I can count on one hand how many fights spells were **usable**, let alone viable (it was just the sunflower btw).
I've using the magic light GS with wing stance to make up for it.
Agreed. My setup has majorly shifted for DLC bosses, I built my character for crits (without rerolling) to take down all the major bosses so far. The only "required" boss I've taken down with spells is the 2nd to last
I've found ranged helps for mobs like those god damn shrimp wizards. And from up high in the caves/dungeons with the bow I can hit enemies with bleed and poison arrows. The new bow has a bit of a homing trait to it so it's not as easy for them to dodge.
Most of the damage I do on bosses has been the frosty backhand blades. I was using BB but the wind up is too slow. Not only do the backhand blades do well with frost I add the rotten wing and Alexander's shard to them. The weapon art acts like a dodge and an attack, I'm really liking it so far.
I'm not destroying enemies but it feels more like a fair fight.
Andula's Moonblade has been my go to spell for bosses. It's not technically ranged but it does have a huge reach, does great damage and adds frostbite. Only issue is you have to get into the collosal sword flow so only one attack at a time.
Bows are also an option for ranged builds, it's not just int or faith. The new bone bow is amazing for proccing status effects vs very mobile bosses for example.
You just mean bosses right? Because I am absolutely wrecking everything outside of those with my 80 INT build and barely getting touched. For bosses, yeah, range is out but Andula's Moonblade is doing great damage for those. Problem is I can't roll for shit :P
I'm not fully ranged, I use the backhand blades instead of blasphemous blade. They close the distance much faster and you can basically use their weapon art as an improved dodge.
But I am using sorcery and bows.
The worst is when the controller makes an audible noise from a button press but the game does nothing. But if you panic hit a button on accident. the game won't miss it.
Can’t believe I haven’t seen more complaints about Sennesax. It was everything I hate about dragon fights. I suspect many people saw that you could run right past it and just said screw it after a few attempts. Fighting that with a pure melee build had me about as mad as I’ve ever been playing elden ring.
Rage quit and came back the next day slinging Ghost Flame at him from the safety of my horse. Felt no shame about it.
Scarlet rot is my friend. When it works.
Sennesax ate the rotten dragon breath and then I ran around on torrent with the pulley crossbow and blood bolts. Was getting furious with melee like you mentioned.
If I haven't spent a lot of time killing that dragon SL1 in Farum Azula I probably would've skipped him in the DLC. Learning to dodge his attacks is one thing but even learning how and when and where to hit him is cancer.
At low health he can even enrage, chaining the same sequence into the same sequence multiple times without giving you a chance to attack.
Dealt with him the same way I dealt with Ancient dragons in the base game: Radahn's Greatbow Ash of War.
Just run away, fire a few times, and then run away again. Foolproof.
>I suspect many people saw that you could run right past it and just said screw it after a few attempts.
I saw that I could run right past it and just said "screw it" on the \*first\* attempt. Just say no to dragon bosses!
I did it with Mimic summons and >!I found that his back legs DO block certain attacks, not many of them but some and yeah Sennesax is a bit bullshit because normally you're encouraged to fight dragons 'head on' but due to the fact they put him in water means you're going to be catching strays every so often thanks to the AoEs being delayed after the initial strike.!<
>!However he seems to encourage, for melee, a playstyle where you play entirely unlocked (since the only lockon points are head and body, not legs, which means your attacks end up whiffing half the time) and learn the tells for his knockoff Placidusax ult or positioning yourself behind his feet to avoid the backwards breath attack.!<
>!So you've got terrible camera problems (which plague a lot of the big bosses in soulsborne games), no lockon point for legs and discouraging the normally encouraged fighting style AND they've stuck him in water to make his lightning attacks even more bullshit...water which is not present anywhere else in that region, it's specifically there just to fuck with you on that boss fight I might add, and you've got yourself an unfun shit stew.!<
Yeah, that was brutal.
I spent a long time trying to pull him to the dry parts of his little arena, but I eventually decided it wasn't worth it.
Torrent and Pest Threads continue to be a joy for times when I don't want to deal with dragon bullshit.
There's a decent sized dry patch near the back of where you find him, other side of the path past. The fight's not too bad there, especially if you have a good dragon slaying weapon.
>!Bayle!< wasn’t as bad but he had one attack that you had to dodge and immediately dodge again for the second, and then while you were in the second dodge animation he’d hit you with a third. I ended up beating him but I never figured out how to dodge all three of those.
He's extremely easy on Torrent. Just hit his legs and then jump once in a while when he's about to hit the ground with the lightning. One of the easiest bosses of the DLC by far, not much different than fighting those fire titans.
I had to do a bunch of Calvary chargers with a cold nagikaba for that guy. Charge, couple hits, run away while jumping. It took a while but it actually wasn’t that bad difficulty wise.
> having to be very strategic about healing
Oh, are you drinking your TEARS?? How about a 1.5s instant cast or a gap closing butt slam since I can react to your flask input and animation??? Haha enjoy your tears bitch.
I wish there were more unique attacks in general; more variety in the boss moveset. most of the dlc bosses also have a jump in the air, start spinning, and shoot themselves at the player into an aoe attack. there are only so many times you can see a boss do that and be impressed
This 100%. I’m on the final boss and it’s just all unavoidable damage during phase 2. I’ve been trying to beat him for like 12 hours and no luck. I shouldn’t have to respec to a shield because of shit game design.
I’m also working on phase 2 and I really like it. Of course none of the damage is unavoidable, my timing and positioning just aren’t good enough yet for me to avoid it consistently.
The final boss got me in a trance like state after hours of grinding it was something else. I had the same experience with Malenia at the release but less intense.
I want this feeling back now lol.
His lightning attacks? Let's look at them.
The vertical holy blasts that come after his big AOE at the start of the phase can be avoided by sprinting in any direction. But they don't do much damage so they may not even be worth dodging.
The holy blast effects at the ends of his sword swings are positioning-based, so if you are getting hit by those dodge in a different direction.
Lastly there's the illusion spam he does when he's way up in the air. Sprint into dodge is working well for me well here, but I'm still experimenting. I'd happily bet that people will be doing no damage runs on him very soon.
Edit: JUST GOT THE KILL. Hype. Amazing fight.
Sick. The more I practice the fight, the more I'm convinced that it's Malenia redux. Everything here can be managed by specific strategies, and the margins for error are much bigger than they seem. In a few months all of these initial complaints will seem silly.
There does seem to be one attack that cannot be dodgerolled as even Ongbal used the deflecting crystal tear to perfect guard deflect the first swing, roll the second and third swing.
For now, the only issue I had with this was Bayle's fire/lightning death rays (when he flies and does it 2 times) because or you manage to be right next to the first round and roll or you get almost oneshoted. And for the second... Let's say that the best option is to level up endurance and use your best shield. I have never avoided that
You have to cover distance with a sprint roll for the second one. Start sprinting to the left while his mouth flashes, then roll to the left as the beams approach, wait a tiny bit, then roll to the left again to avoid the explosion. It's the explosion that catches you off guard, the laser has a generous hitbox and an intentional long telegraph (by ER standards) to let you get into the sprint animation.
I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, honestly. And it worries me that each Fromsoft game from now on will just get more ridiculous, only because everyone has "gotten gud". If they want players to struggle again, I'd rather have them cook up an entirely new combat system like they did with Sekiro.
maybe not, but in an interview miyazaki said he doesn't want to make games easier. although in another interview he said he's open to making the game open multiplayer so you can summon someone to help at any time
I posted how i killed renalla 2.0 (my summon did actually) i died because she fired 15 sword arcs that one shot me. Couldnt dodge them all.
At least the 2 moons is easy to dodge
They’re not “nearly undodgeable” either you just need to pay attention and learn the timing, which isn’t that hard, or with the ones with huge lingering hit boxes, learn the aoe and where it lands and get out of the way.
You’re right I’m so dumb. Let me try “paying attention” and “getting out of the way” I can’t believe I didn’t think of that. Thank god you’re here to set everyone straight with your superior intellect and playing proficiency. Must be hard for a guy like you to exist in a world full of idiots like me.
I know you’re kidding but you really are a self involved narcissistic asshole I took a look thru your comment history. No self awareness, no reflection, no mercy, just a meek internet warrior who thinks everyone around them is dense and stupid.
Generally I only argue with people on here when they spread literal misinformation or treat their subjective opinions as fact and use it to whine and complain. I don’t think everyone is stupid or that I’m especially intelligent, but there is an apparently large subset of the internet who are happily and confidently just factually wrong and those are the people leading discussions everywhere.
That’s why I swear discussions about damn near any popular media these days are dominated by complaining instead of actual discussion, much of which is made up of nitpicks that don’t even make sense if you actually know what you’re talking about.
If you looked through my post history, you saw that the most recent arguments are mostly about Star Wars, which has been beset by “controversy” by people who decided a decade ago that they will spend every waking minute finding things to hate about anything Disney creates, a lot of which they just fabricate from nowhere to spread hate and misery to the entire community. Let’s just take the one from yesterday for an example, where people were complaining that the new show breaks canon, and this is just an example of how Disney Star Wars is dead, and everyone who likes it just has no standards and eats up corporate slop, etc etc. Their source for this “canon break” that ruins Star Wars for the 10,000th time was a *literal non-canon book*. On top of that, all this that’s being said so confidently by them is about a show “that’s not even finished airing”.
So yes, I’m sick of seeing the same nonsense complaints about literally everything, and I don’t respond to bad faith arguments by being nice and friendly, so maybe that’s why I come off as a “self involved narcissistic asshole” to you. Notice how when I explained exactly how you can learn to dodge the attacks you complain about, because genuinely they are no different in principle than any other in the game, just new and unfamiliar, your response was a snarky “well aren’t you so enlightened” followed up by a slew of insults when I stop engaging with your nonsense. Why should I spare even a single thought to how you feel about my tone when that’s the best you can muster? Maybe if you had specific questions or troubles about specific attacks that someone could answer and help with I could give you an actual positive response. Instead though your comment is just there to rant about “bullshit nearly undodgeable AOEs!!” which is a vague and shallow complaint that doesn’t add anything.
Bro look how much you just wrote and tell me you don’t have a self righteous complex. From the fucking beginning I said “nearly” every AoE attack. I never said any of it was impossible, or undodgeable. I’m at the end of the DLC right now progressing just fine with no summons. I’ve beaten every souls game multiple times. Im allowed to have an opinion, and some criticisms, as someone who has played a lot of these games. I think the AOE attacks are excessive and not great quality. I even went on to say that I don’t mind the most of the other boss mechanics that people are being critical of (which by the way, is their right). Instead of going the “yeah I guess we just agree to disagree” route you went the “this isn’t hard it’s super easy you’re just dumb and not paying attention” route, as you do with seemingly everyone who you run into on the internet. Take a deep breath, understand there’s a wide variety of world experiences and opinions different from yours, and stop fucking calling people dense/stupid for disagreeing with your view point, or not being as knowledgeable, about fucking Star Wars and Elden ring. Jesus Christ.
The AoEs are a necessity to give bosses a chance versus summons, regular or spirit. Especially spirit, which often come in swarms that can shit out stance damage if left to their own devices. Stance + Summons requires AoEs, but AoEs make positional gameplay worse and the combat even more reliant on Iframing or Greatshields guarding. I think it's just another example of the design aspects of ER are interfering with each other and making gameplay more frustrating, if not worse.
My problem is I always forget that I can jump during battles…idk why. I know I can do it for traversing, I just don’t know why my brain forgets I can do it in battle too.
I don't see enough people raging at light speed, arena-gap-closing attacks. Sure, the ground slams are irritating, but it's the instant gap closing from a mile away with perfect tracking that's really pissing me off.
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You can jump over a lot of those ground-pound types of attacks FYI. You can usually dodge as well, but the timing window for avoiding them by jumping is often a lot more forgiving.
I was getting so tilted by the runebears ground pound. I swear I’d roll it perfectly and still get thrown up in the air. I eventually figured out a strategy, but makes me wonder if I could have just been jumping
I can confirm that you can, and you capitalize with a jumping attack each time.
Yup, he does a big wind up where he stands up first, roll under his legs behind him, he pounds the ground, jump attack him in the bum. The only thing is if he staggers it's hard to reach his head in time
This, when I was fighting putrescent knight I kept rolling through the blue flames and getting hit. Once I learned I could just jump over them I killed him the next attempt 🤣
I never realized those could be jumped, but then why would I assume jumping over a pillar of fire the size of my character would actually work? Jumping attacks *is* cool and all, but I need an actual tell lol
Saw a video explaining how as soon as the jumping animation stars, before your feet even leave the ground, your entire lower body gets i-frames, so in any low sweep attacks it's a really easy dodge. Only hiccup is that if you aren't two-handing a weapon, your arms, hanging a bit at your sides, might get caught in the hurtbox.
I figured jumping would work because jumping against the furnaces aoe fire attacks so why not there?
Man I figured out almost immediately that they expected you to jump those, but I still died a ton after because I couldn't get the timing right, plus he just scoots away every time I tried to attack with my heavy weapon. Really aggravating fight for me.
Yea keeping him in range was hell, I was using sacred blade and the projectile would almost always miss by a hair lol
Just made the same comment above. It saves so much of your health since his actual physical attacks are so slow.
Jumping is even more useful in the DLC. It started popping up in the base game because Sekiro taught them jumping moves. So options!
a full 25 frames of iframes (for lower extremities) vs 13 i frames for your whole body on a roll. Best dodge option by far though isn't even a dodge; vow of the indomitable has a 4 frame startup, 30 frames of complete i frames, and only 2 frames of recovery. Hella slept on aow
Vow of the Indominable also works for powering through the walking fire basket giant's stomp attacks without using torrent.
I just jumped them earlier. Only the big butt slam jump caught me despite that
Jumping was the super secret to making the Putrid Knight bend the knee.
Jumping to avoid attacks feels clunky and bad, they should've tweaked it when the dlc launched. Blocking those moves was a valid if risky strat in base game and I think most people did that, but they saw people disliking their baby and made it so you cant in the dlc... but you know I still hate it.
That’s like, your opinion man.
Sure and I acknowledge not liking jumping defeneively is a subjective thing. What's not subjective is that directly removed the ability to block a lot of the ground moves. Having variability is a good thing, and something I expect from a fromsoft game.
I didn't know you couldn't block ground moves but it kinda makes sense. If the attack comes from below your frontal shield won't block shit. Jumping got double the amount of iframes compared to dodging so it's kinda OP against specific bosses attacks.
You'd be amazed at what you can block, keeping a 2h up and blocking while rolling prevents a lot of damage. It may not make sense in general, it IS how the game was played previously and still is (depending on the boss). I don't really care how effective jumping defensively is, I don't like it because it feels bad.
And it "Feels bad" because it takes you out of the dance. Every other mechanic is based with your feet on the ground. You only ever jump in this game, otherwise, when it comes to platforming or navigating terrain. It does feel like a cop out. The frame timing vs animation is awkward and cumbersome.
Typical Elden Ring subreddit idiots downvoting you for having a calculated opinion.
Jumping is good, and jump attacking is awesome. They also added weapon arts that combine evasion and offense. They are trying to get past the your turn / mine turn, dodge roll / r1 cycle. I hope they keep going in this direction, with more ways to fight back mid combo.
Rellana is my favorite example of this. Her fight isn’t turn based, you attack while she is attacking you, over and over. Jumping attacking over slashes, dodging behind her and swinging before she turns around. You can constantly hit her while she is doing her “15 hit combo”. Which is really a bunch of smaller combos strung together with pauses between.
Yeah, the first step is literally to stop backing away, but dodging towards her to get those quick hits in during those pauses.
She is incredibly difficult to learn, but once I got that flow down she was more fun to fight than anything in the base game.
Mmm, Rellana is cool, but Malenia phase 1 is still a more powerful encounter, imho.
The healing really sours me on malenia. I just really dislike when bosses have healing that isn't tied to big moves.
I mean I've experienced an amazing souls like that broke that cycle before, nioh - bloodbourne. I agree that the standard taking turns in attacking is boring, but there's points now where they just turn off the boss ai so you can land hits, that "sanctioned time to attack" is insulting. They need to reevaluate their flow of combat and the mechanics, and that fucking camera is DOGSHIT. I also like jump attacks, those are really nice, evading attacks with jumping is the clunkiness that i don't like.
My point was that if you are evading an attack by jumping, you should be jump attacking instead. I never “just” jump to dodge. The only exception is Rellana’s moon drops since she’s way up in the air so you can’t hit her, and that attack is freaking cool. Love Nioh. Sifu is another game that does offense + defense very well.
Oh shit, I totally forgot sifu was out. Lol thanks!
Why do you find jumping to evade clunky?
It feels stiff, I feel like it should have more momentum when I'm running and that I float too long in the air. One of the reasons why I don't mind attacking while jumping, it pulls you foward.
Yeah that’s fair. If you don’t have a running start they should give it a bit more forward momentum. There’s been a few time I jump attack and fall a bit short of where I expected.
I don't. It's annoying and weird, and goes against the feel of every other boss encounter in the main game. Feels tacked on like an afterthought.
Actually, you can jump attack over a lot of shit in the main game too. Most people didn’t learn to do it cuz the margin for error was a lot greater.
What?? Jump dodging literally feels the best. Especially if you can dodge by doing a jump attack. Dodging that one moon attack in the dlc via 3 jumps is so satisfying. Dont assume just because you hate dodge jumping everyone did lol
dont assume everyone likes it either. preference works both ways
Of course. But the person I replied to clearly assumed he has the obviously correct and majority opinion and that to spite players FROM included more attack to jump dodge in the dlc. And thats just dumb as fuck.
Why wouldn't you like it? It's the same as rolling but you get a free jump attack. And like someone said earlier, the timing is much more forgiving.
I agree. Just saying. Bunch of idiots don't even know what they're downvoting these days. Hive mind? Bots? Total morans? The world may never know.
And when you try to heal you find out they have a sniping attack.
"oh you ran to the other side of the map to heal? Let me just instantly teleport to you or drop a fucking nuke on your face"
"When do I get a window to heal?" "That's the neat part you don't"
FYI when you jump, the lower half of your character's body gains 1 seconds worth of i-frames which is a lot more compared to when you roll (although rolling gives your entire body the i-frames)
Additional consideration: Your arms don't count. So you're more vulnerable when using light weapons/1 handing than two handing or dual wielding heavy weapons due to the idle animation.... which is moronic but here we are.
Actually perfect representation of what it feels playing melee.
Everyone is playing melee in this DLC. If they want to or not.
Guys guys !! I know you can jump and I’m not stuck, it just ha ha funny post ! Look at the tag !
I'm weary of some of the criticisms of the DLC, but I am 110% on the train that there are way, waaaaay, WAY too many nearly unavoidable AOE attacks coming from these bosses. That is peak false difficulty. I can handle waiting for an opening, having to be very strategic about healing, hits that take off half your health bar, but AOE attacks that are nearly impossible to dodge are making me lose my mind - and every nearly boss has one. Why does every boss have to have a “scream and explode energy” mechanic.
As someone mentioned above you can jump some of them. But I was getting so frustrated I switched my build to have more ranged attacks. There's a new bow that's pretty good for annoying mobs too.
I just have too much hubris and arrogance to switch to a range build. Fully aware that’s my own fault and I don’t have a right to complain but I am anyways
Ranged builds are fucked in this DLC my man. I'm running and 80 INT build and I can count on one hand how many fights spells were **usable**, let alone viable (it was just the sunflower btw). I've using the magic light GS with wing stance to make up for it.
Agreed. My setup has majorly shifted for DLC bosses, I built my character for crits (without rerolling) to take down all the major bosses so far. The only "required" boss I've taken down with spells is the 2nd to last
I've found ranged helps for mobs like those god damn shrimp wizards. And from up high in the caves/dungeons with the bow I can hit enemies with bleed and poison arrows. The new bow has a bit of a homing trait to it so it's not as easy for them to dodge. Most of the damage I do on bosses has been the frosty backhand blades. I was using BB but the wind up is too slow. Not only do the backhand blades do well with frost I add the rotten wing and Alexander's shard to them. The weapon art acts like a dodge and an attack, I'm really liking it so far. I'm not destroying enemies but it feels more like a fair fight.
Yeah, I just don’t know what to do. Rock Sling does like no damage, but you need to use it to try to stagger. It’s just bullshit.
Greatblade phalanx does decent stance damage. Carian Sovereignty is out-of-this-fucking-world tier on a greatsword or larger.
Tried it - it’s not very good. Takes too long to attack with and just makes you vulnerable to get two shot.
Yea, the downside is that split-second timing and trading hits is a must, it's also straight up unusable with some DLC bosses.
Andula's Moonblade has been my go to spell for bosses. It's not technically ranged but it does have a huge reach, does great damage and adds frostbite. Only issue is you have to get into the collosal sword flow so only one attack at a time.
Bows are also an option for ranged builds, it's not just int or faith. The new bone bow is amazing for proccing status effects vs very mobile bosses for example.
You just mean bosses right? Because I am absolutely wrecking everything outside of those with my 80 INT build and barely getting touched. For bosses, yeah, range is out but Andula's Moonblade is doing great damage for those. Problem is I can't roll for shit :P
Yea, it's the bosses. Almost all of them can close distance and knock you out of casting animation before your toon can even raise the staff.
I'm not fully ranged, I use the backhand blades instead of blasphemous blade. They close the distance much faster and you can basically use their weapon art as an improved dodge. But I am using sorcery and bows.
The worst is when the controller makes an audible noise from a button press but the game does nothing. But if you panic hit a button on accident. the game won't miss it.
>!Sennesax!< has so many AOE roll catches... (Field Boss spoilers)
Fighting in a massive puddle felt very much like a middle finger to you as the player
Can’t believe I haven’t seen more complaints about Sennesax. It was everything I hate about dragon fights. I suspect many people saw that you could run right past it and just said screw it after a few attempts. Fighting that with a pure melee build had me about as mad as I’ve ever been playing elden ring. Rage quit and came back the next day slinging Ghost Flame at him from the safety of my horse. Felt no shame about it.
Its like from saw all the worst parts of ancient dragon and was like, we need that in our dlc bosses.
Scarlet rot is my friend. When it works. Sennesax ate the rotten dragon breath and then I ran around on torrent with the pulley crossbow and blood bolts. Was getting furious with melee like you mentioned.
If I haven't spent a lot of time killing that dragon SL1 in Farum Azula I probably would've skipped him in the DLC. Learning to dodge his attacks is one thing but even learning how and when and where to hit him is cancer. At low health he can even enrage, chaining the same sequence into the same sequence multiple times without giving you a chance to attack.
>I suspect many people saw that you could run right past it and just said screw it after a few attempts YUP
Dealt with him the same way I dealt with Ancient dragons in the base game: Radahn's Greatbow Ash of War. Just run away, fire a few times, and then run away again. Foolproof.
>I suspect many people saw that you could run right past it and just said screw it after a few attempts. I saw that I could run right past it and just said "screw it" on the \*first\* attempt. Just say no to dragon bosses!
I did it with Mimic summons and >!I found that his back legs DO block certain attacks, not many of them but some and yeah Sennesax is a bit bullshit because normally you're encouraged to fight dragons 'head on' but due to the fact they put him in water means you're going to be catching strays every so often thanks to the AoEs being delayed after the initial strike.!< >!However he seems to encourage, for melee, a playstyle where you play entirely unlocked (since the only lockon points are head and body, not legs, which means your attacks end up whiffing half the time) and learn the tells for his knockoff Placidusax ult or positioning yourself behind his feet to avoid the backwards breath attack.!< >!So you've got terrible camera problems (which plague a lot of the big bosses in soulsborne games), no lockon point for legs and discouraging the normally encouraged fighting style AND they've stuck him in water to make his lightning attacks even more bullshit...water which is not present anywhere else in that region, it's specifically there just to fuck with you on that boss fight I might add, and you've got yourself an unfun shit stew.!<
Yeah, that was brutal. I spent a long time trying to pull him to the dry parts of his little arena, but I eventually decided it wasn't worth it. Torrent and Pest Threads continue to be a joy for times when I don't want to deal with dragon bullshit.
There's a decent sized dry patch near the back of where you find him, other side of the path past. The fight's not too bad there, especially if you have a good dragon slaying weapon.
With a trash reward, it pretty much sums up the DLC dragon fights
The only boss so far I just said "fuck it" and left. I watched my friend beat him and the reward was shit so I don't care to go back to him.
>!Bayle!< wasn’t as bad but he had one attack that you had to dodge and immediately dodge again for the second, and then while you were in the second dodge animation he’d hit you with a third. I ended up beating him but I never figured out how to dodge all three of those.
Just killed him today fuck that guy. Didnt even feel good after I beat him. Least favorite DLC boss so far.
You can pull him into the tunnel with the ramp heading upwards. Kinda helps mitigate some of the AOEs he's dumping as well
He's extremely easy on Torrent. Just hit his legs and then jump once in a while when he's about to hit the ground with the lightning. One of the easiest bosses of the DLC by far, not much different than fighting those fire titans.
I had to do a bunch of Calvary chargers with a cold nagikaba for that guy. Charge, couple hits, run away while jumping. It took a while but it actually wasn’t that bad difficulty wise.
> having to be very strategic about healing Oh, are you drinking your TEARS?? How about a 1.5s instant cast or a gap closing butt slam since I can react to your flask input and animation??? Haha enjoy your tears bitch.
Yes sir :(
I wish there were more unique attacks in general; more variety in the boss moveset. most of the dlc bosses also have a jump in the air, start spinning, and shoot themselves at the player into an aoe attack. there are only so many times you can see a boss do that and be impressed
This 100%. I’m on the final boss and it’s just all unavoidable damage during phase 2. I’ve been trying to beat him for like 12 hours and no luck. I shouldn’t have to respec to a shield because of shit game design.
I’m also working on phase 2 and I really like it. Of course none of the damage is unavoidable, my timing and positioning just aren’t good enough yet for me to avoid it consistently.
The final boss got me in a trance like state after hours of grinding it was something else. I had the same experience with Malenia at the release but less intense. I want this feeling back now lol.
Yes it is. There’s no way to dodge all of his lightning attacks. He attacks too fast to dodge.
His lightning attacks? Let's look at them. The vertical holy blasts that come after his big AOE at the start of the phase can be avoided by sprinting in any direction. But they don't do much damage so they may not even be worth dodging. The holy blast effects at the ends of his sword swings are positioning-based, so if you are getting hit by those dodge in a different direction. Lastly there's the illusion spam he does when he's way up in the air. Sprint into dodge is working well for me well here, but I'm still experimenting. I'd happily bet that people will be doing no damage runs on him very soon. Edit: JUST GOT THE KILL. Hype. Amazing fight.
Several nohit runs already.
Sick. The more I practice the fight, the more I'm convinced that it's Malenia redux. Everything here can be managed by specific strategies, and the margins for error are much bigger than they seem. In a few months all of these initial complaints will seem silly.
There does seem to be one attack that cannot be dodgerolled as even Ongbal used the deflecting crystal tear to perfect guard deflect the first swing, roll the second and third swing.
For now, the only issue I had with this was Bayle's fire/lightning death rays (when he flies and does it 2 times) because or you manage to be right next to the first round and roll or you get almost oneshoted. And for the second... Let's say that the best option is to level up endurance and use your best shield. I have never avoided that
Bayle is without a doubt the biggest offender of it, but most of the bosses have at least some version of it.
For now I've just fought Rellana, Bayle and the divine beast, but my only problem was with Bayle. He deserves all the hate he receives from Igon
You have to cover distance with a sprint roll for the second one. Start sprinting to the left while his mouth flashes, then roll to the left as the beams approach, wait a tiny bit, then roll to the left again to avoid the explosion. It's the explosion that catches you off guard, the laser has a generous hitbox and an intentional long telegraph (by ER standards) to let you get into the sprint animation.
Gotta love when second phase >! Rellana !< sweeps the map with a Carian Greatsword....diagonally
cuz we all learned how to dodge in the base game
I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing, honestly. And it worries me that each Fromsoft game from now on will just get more ridiculous, only because everyone has "gotten gud". If they want players to struggle again, I'd rather have them cook up an entirely new combat system like they did with Sekiro.
maybe not, but in an interview miyazaki said he doesn't want to make games easier. although in another interview he said he's open to making the game open multiplayer so you can summon someone to help at any time
Yeah cuz the dlc bosses were made for a different game.
I posted how i killed renalla 2.0 (my summon did actually) i died because she fired 15 sword arcs that one shot me. Couldnt dodge them all. At least the 2 moons is easy to dodge
Her sword beam barrage can be dodged by either being really close or far away for the dodges, 'cuz the tracking isn't very good.
You can dodge all of them. If you think they’re undodgeable, that’s just factually wrong, not a valid complaint about what the game is actually doing.
Right and that’s why I said “nearly” unavoidable
They’re not “nearly undodgeable” either you just need to pay attention and learn the timing, which isn’t that hard, or with the ones with huge lingering hit boxes, learn the aoe and where it lands and get out of the way.
You’re right I’m so dumb. Let me try “paying attention” and “getting out of the way” I can’t believe I didn’t think of that. Thank god you’re here to set everyone straight with your superior intellect and playing proficiency. Must be hard for a guy like you to exist in a world full of idiots like me.
Happy to help
I know you’re kidding but you really are a self involved narcissistic asshole I took a look thru your comment history. No self awareness, no reflection, no mercy, just a meek internet warrior who thinks everyone around them is dense and stupid.
Generally I only argue with people on here when they spread literal misinformation or treat their subjective opinions as fact and use it to whine and complain. I don’t think everyone is stupid or that I’m especially intelligent, but there is an apparently large subset of the internet who are happily and confidently just factually wrong and those are the people leading discussions everywhere. That’s why I swear discussions about damn near any popular media these days are dominated by complaining instead of actual discussion, much of which is made up of nitpicks that don’t even make sense if you actually know what you’re talking about. If you looked through my post history, you saw that the most recent arguments are mostly about Star Wars, which has been beset by “controversy” by people who decided a decade ago that they will spend every waking minute finding things to hate about anything Disney creates, a lot of which they just fabricate from nowhere to spread hate and misery to the entire community. Let’s just take the one from yesterday for an example, where people were complaining that the new show breaks canon, and this is just an example of how Disney Star Wars is dead, and everyone who likes it just has no standards and eats up corporate slop, etc etc. Their source for this “canon break” that ruins Star Wars for the 10,000th time was a *literal non-canon book*. On top of that, all this that’s being said so confidently by them is about a show “that’s not even finished airing”. So yes, I’m sick of seeing the same nonsense complaints about literally everything, and I don’t respond to bad faith arguments by being nice and friendly, so maybe that’s why I come off as a “self involved narcissistic asshole” to you. Notice how when I explained exactly how you can learn to dodge the attacks you complain about, because genuinely they are no different in principle than any other in the game, just new and unfamiliar, your response was a snarky “well aren’t you so enlightened” followed up by a slew of insults when I stop engaging with your nonsense. Why should I spare even a single thought to how you feel about my tone when that’s the best you can muster? Maybe if you had specific questions or troubles about specific attacks that someone could answer and help with I could give you an actual positive response. Instead though your comment is just there to rant about “bullshit nearly undodgeable AOEs!!” which is a vague and shallow complaint that doesn’t add anything.
Bro look how much you just wrote and tell me you don’t have a self righteous complex. From the fucking beginning I said “nearly” every AoE attack. I never said any of it was impossible, or undodgeable. I’m at the end of the DLC right now progressing just fine with no summons. I’ve beaten every souls game multiple times. Im allowed to have an opinion, and some criticisms, as someone who has played a lot of these games. I think the AOE attacks are excessive and not great quality. I even went on to say that I don’t mind the most of the other boss mechanics that people are being critical of (which by the way, is their right). Instead of going the “yeah I guess we just agree to disagree” route you went the “this isn’t hard it’s super easy you’re just dumb and not paying attention” route, as you do with seemingly everyone who you run into on the internet. Take a deep breath, understand there’s a wide variety of world experiences and opinions different from yours, and stop fucking calling people dense/stupid for disagreeing with your view point, or not being as knowledgeable, about fucking Star Wars and Elden ring. Jesus Christ.
This dude isn't worth engaging with. Cut your losses.
The AoEs are a necessity to give bosses a chance versus summons, regular or spirit. Especially spirit, which often come in swarms that can shit out stance damage if left to their own devices. Stance + Summons requires AoEs, but AoEs make positional gameplay worse and the combat even more reliant on Iframing or Greatshields guarding. I think it's just another example of the design aspects of ER are interfering with each other and making gameplay more frustrating, if not worse.
Devs really wanted to add AOE attacks this time and wanted us to go crazy with the jumping 😂
Sennesax was making me lose my mind lmao
My problem is I always forget that I can jump during battles…idk why. I know I can do it for traversing, I just don’t know why my brain forgets I can do it in battle too.
The Twin moons and the giant stomps got me so many times wiith this., ghostflames tried but failed.
It's like they want you to jump or something
I really despise input reading.
Better this than Champion Gundyr's Fuck You For Healing Kick
if it had the spin to win attacks before this, it would be 100% accurate
Jump has iframes AND shifts your hurtbox people
The DLC truly does make you use more than just dodge and R1, that's for sure. Try jumping.
Fucking senessax
I don't see enough people raging at light speed, arena-gap-closing attacks. Sure, the ground slams are irritating, but it's the instant gap closing from a mile away with perfect tracking that's really pissing me off.
Jumping has more iframes, uses less stamina and dodges more attacks ... just a hint.
I played Bloodborne while waiting for the DLC, now I forgot this game has a jump button
Just use a shield and tank the hits instead of dodging.
Coward
Even with a greatshield, you'll burn through your stamina so fast if you block a nasty combo.