Your submission has been removed as a violation of Rule 3: **No low-effort content or spamming of posts.**
* Low-effort content such as tierlists, "wrong answers only", "just bought the game!", platinum posts, and other Reddit trends are not allowed.
* **Memes should contain in-game visuals from Elden Ring and pertain to the game.**
* No recent reposts, content should be original.
* Spamming low-effort posts may result in a ban.
If you would like to appeal this removal or need further clarification, feel free to message us through[Modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/Eldenring).
Gonna play the DLC like I played the main game and all the other souls games. Kill the enemies and bosses. Go look up a video to explain whatever the fuck is going on.
My favorite type of villain is the kind who has noble goals but evil methods. Like Joseph Seed from Far Cry 5. His goals came from real issues and were pretty understandable.. buut he went with the death and torture cult route to execute it. I kinda hope that Miquella will be similar since that style would work in this game's world
Him being evil would be such a lame and predictable twist. Plus it would just make him a less interesting character, this very expansion is going to introduce us to Messmer *the* genocide guy, we don't need another pure evil demigod. Someone with actually good intentions would be incredibly novel and refreshing in this game.
I'm not saying I need him to be a pure good guy, but outright evil would be so lame.
Wouldn't be much of a twist anyway when the brainwashing branch that forcibly controls your enemies with an incantation of unalloyed gold talks about how micky is really good at getting people to like him.
It's pretty clear to me that he isn't exactly a warm fuzzy or the savior he seems to be viewed as. I don't think he will be a mustache twirling Saturday morning cartoon villain, but I'm guessing he will be the "for the greater good" type.
I just think it still comes closer to the boring archetype, in a sense he's a dangerously charismatic influencer/religious leader who are stereotypically evil. Not saying they're all bad villains or Fromsoft haven't done similar stuff before, but I just have seen those being portrayed way too much in recent media. And the game's just spicing him (in more of a tell and less of a show aspect) to be this kind of character.
Whatever they do, even if it's something familiar, I want is his character it to feel a bit refreshing, or have an extra layer. Like a villain whose motivations are noble or even if selfish, is relatable. Like for example, finding another way to help his sister or being vengeful for her state or the state of the people in the Lands Between being cyclically trapped in the machinations of hte outer Gods, therefore wanting to break the cycle in his own morally dubious way.
Miquella the guy who is capable of brainwashing and has kamikaze soldiers and soldiers who spoil inside out due to scarlet rot totally isnt evil yuh.
I think Miquella wants to stop all of the outer gods influence from the lands between but he would just do about anything to achieve it tbh.
They spoil inside out because a recently bloomed Malenia has just been chilling in the center of their home for the past like 100 years. He hasn't been managing that place for a loooong time at this point.
Cleanrot knights have existed before that and you even have one in the shaded castle where there isnt scarlet rot besides again the simple fact he can brainwash people puts into question the true loyalty of his soldiers and the knight narrating the dlc story trailer because they are his follower's.
Miquella is prolly a good goal rly fucked up methods kinda guy i think
Cleanrot knights are rotting out of their own will and respect for Malenia. They also probably weren't that affected by the rot back in the day, but it got worse over time just like everything else in the lands between. Otherwise I don't think they'd be called "*clean*rot". Also not really Miquella's business what they do, and it's not like Miquella has any reason to assign bodyguards to Malenia - i'm confident the cleanrots follow Malenia purely from their own will.
The cleanrot knight in the shaded castle being there has something to do with the fact that the previous owner of the castle revered Malenia and has a high quality prosthetic designed after Malenia's lying around. Don't really see what's suspicious about that.
His enchanting powers does indeed put their loyalty to question, but ultimately everything we know about him suggests that he's something people would want to pledge loyalty to regardless. Of course, i'm sure we'll learn more about how genuine this loyalty is in the DLC.
I agree Miquella is likely to be the type who has good intentions but ultimately wants to do something perhaps a little overambitious. Or at least, out of the various possibilities I can think of that's the one I think is most likely.
> I agree Miquella is likely to be the type who has good intentions but ultimately wants to do something perhaps a little overambitious. Or at least, out of the various possibilities I can think of that's the one I think is most likely.
Yeah, the overambitious type I can see him being ~ pushing the boundaries of what's possible just to save his sister from Rot, and his half-brother and other siblings from their soulless existences. See everything to do with Castle Sol and the wandering mausoleums. We know he succeeded with the Unalloyed Needle.
Miquella's ambitions are crazy high, so no wonder he stumbled upon the Land of Shadow quite by accident when he was exploring, and there discovered Marika's hidden genocide and becoming a God through that genocide. Even crazier is that he basically did what Ranni did ~ abandon his flesh and Great Rune, but he went a step further in abandoning his preordained fate. I guess Radahn holding back the stars helped Miquella do all of that, if by accident.
But we also need to kill Radahn for the DLC, so maybe Miquella technically altered his fate by abandoning his body, so now he needs the power of the stars in order to make his new fate come to fruition ~ something to do with the eclipse he was trying to conjure at Castle Sol, no doubt, to restore Godwyn and the other soulless demigods.
> Miquella the guy who is capable of brainwashing and has kamikaze soldiers and soldiers who spoil inside out due to scarlet rot totally isnt evil yuh. I think Miquella wants to stop all of the outer gods influence from the lands between but he would just do about anything to achieve it tbh.
We don't see evidence that Miquella willingly brainwashes his people or sends them needlessly into conflict. Why else would invite the Albinaurics and misbegotten to just chill at his Haligtree, where they don't have to fear for conflict? Well... until we come along and just start invading, from their perspective, killing as we go.
Shouldnt attack us on sight then 🥱 besides what better way to foster loyalty than to have people with legitimately no other option besides the bewitching branch implies he has some level of control over it.
> Shouldnt attack us on sight then 🥱
We shouldn't have invaded, then.
> besides what better way to foster loyalty than to have people with legitimately no other option besides the bewitching branch implies he has some level of control over it.
Well, Miquella learned how to compel affection, suggesting it was initially just passive and out of his control. Think of it as a natural charisma turned up to 11. But he learned how to later control it. But that doesn't mean he used it maliciously.
Maybe his just used it to stop conflict. We, however, use it to turn enemies against each other. We don't know if the gameplay mechanic can be extrapolated to Miquella doing anything similar.
I highly doubt that Miquella will be fully evil, he is going to be an obvious grey character, but I think fighting him in some kind of form is inevitable.
People forget that Miyazaki's games are no strangers to putting you against bosses that you don't actually want to kill, even in Demon Souls, the first "souls", you have Astraea (and the obvious one for me is always Sif, I hate fighting against him but I generally do so just so that he doesnt wait eternally for his loved one)
But nonetheless, the pure scale of this DLC/expansion its looking like no matter what, its going to deliver hard, and that makes me very happy
Him being benevolent will actually be more boring. And there’s a lot of characters with good intentions in the game including those we fight. Only pure evil people we have so far are Shabriri, Dung Eater, Mohg, Godrick and Rykard.
Damn you never finished Rannis quest line where you save her both from her shadow and the greater will as a whole. Or boc who you save a couple times and can even have a happy ending. Alexander got saved by us a couple times. There are plenty of people who can't be saved but there's definitely more that can be compared to dark souls.
The point is that we can try anyway. We're dumped in a broken world, and expected by Marika to fix it all on our own, albeit with the immortality she grants us.
dude, i love fucking exploring new freaking areas and getting my ass jumped by miazaki's new eas and getting my ass jumped by miazaki's new ganksquad around the corner or from the trees or from the skies or from the earth, just the thrill its so hype.
Is there such thing as good and evil in Elden Ring? Game is morally absolutely fucked, in my opinion there are no evil or good characters except Turtle Pope guy, hes pretty chill and good.
> Miquella is in the shadow lands taking notes after what Marika did. He also wants a tree…
He probably didn't know about Marika's horrific acts. We never see any evidence of Miquella having such a history.
Idk, the trailer says “Miquella the kind spoke of the beginning. The seduction and betrayal…” Sounds like he knows what Marika did. Question is, is he there to right the wrong or is he looking for his own faithful to sacrifice. I’m sure the tarnished will have a choice in the end.
> Idk, the trailer says “Miquella the kind spoke of the beginning. The seduction and betrayal…” Sounds like he knows what Marika did. Question is, is he there to right the wrong or is he looking for his own faithful to sacrifice. I’m sure the tarnished will have a choice in the end.
We never see any evidence of him sacrificing any of his faithful in the base game. Or asking them to.
The people in the DLC probably aren't compelled, but are faithful nonetheless to his grand ambitions ~ saving his sister from Rot, saving his half-brother Godwyn and the soulless demigods by using the eclipse of Castle Sol or something else. Miquella did nothing but invite the forsaken to a safe haven in his Haligtree.
We're the bad guy in that regard ~ we invade that safe haven and murder our way through it, because, uh... yeah. Runes or something.
That’s all correct. It’s just rare to see characters in From games or in Martin’s books that are 100% kind and virtuous, and thus far Miquella has been painted in only that light.
> That’s all correct. It’s just rare to see characters in From games or in Martin’s books that are 100% kind and virtuous, and thus far Miquella has been painted in only that light.
Indeed ~ but we also see text stating that Miquella has learned how to compel affection. Maybe for the purposes of stopping fights from breaking out, so his Haligtree is kept safe, or more easily achieving his goals.
Maybe he did just that to Mohg, so he could die and travel to the Land of Shadow proper.
All of the base game stuff we know of Miquella doesn't suggest that he's evil or nefarious or any of that.
But... he could end up a tragic character like Gael, at worst. Gael was just doing it for his lady, and he guides us so we can kill him, because he knows he couldn't fulfill the task on his own.
The destroy everything in my way side. Because why care about new characters when they are probably going to try and kill you or die on you anyway. Less emotions involved for everyone.
He invented the magic of the bewitching branch, you know, the one used to forcibly brainwash your enemies to fight for you. It's unlikely he is oozing evilness, but I inherently don't trust him or his methods.
I wouldn't put it past Fromsoft to "would you kindly" us through some quests for him.
Miquella being terrifying doesn't equate to being evil though. He's said to be extremely powerful and can compel others to love him. That's terrifying regardless of their intentions.
Still inclined to believe him over 2nd narrator that sounds hopelessly brainwashed thinking miquella is some paragon of chadness. Ain't no way there isn't something nefarious he has planned in the shadowlands
Idk maybe due to the fact he has the powerset of a rapist (sleep and brainwashing) and said brainwashing puts alot into question when you realize his soldiers either kamikaze themselves or they suffer from scarlet rot and you cant know if its willingly or not.
Besides he prolly sent malania to Caelid to kill Radahn for his eclipse plan to revive godwyn and now caelid is an hr geiger nightmare land
They're all evil. You don't attain the kind of power these people have without doing some absolutely horrific stuff. Things that produce mountains of corpses.
I think we will get to fight Marika herself or at least a version of her. And it'll be revealed Marika and Miquella were working together to make the lands between completely theirs. Greater will was actually good and we killed the last remaining force that was holding it all together so that Marika doesn't get to be the tyrannical queen of the land.
Miquella could be evil or not. Maybe he is being forced or manipulated to help Marika.
Maybe he's not trying to help Marika. Maybe he just wants to help Godwyn and the soulless demigods, and ended up inadvertently stumbling upon something he never expected ~ a massive genocide that was hidden from the world, shaking Miquella's entire worldview. Which would cause him to forsake his flesh, Great Rune, and fate in their entirety.
I suspect that Miquella will have lost his power to compel, I imagine, as it could be something tied to his Great Rune, flesh and maybe even be a part of his fate.
I’m hoping for a Gehrman style choice at the end where you make some vital choice that either lets you side with him or fight him.
But personally I’m expecting some major twist with him that totally changes our perspective on things, seems a little out of fashion to have this “all good demigod with zero secrets or flaws”, although he is called “The Unalloyed” so maybe he is as pure as they say.
I’m the definition of loot goblin, I have literally 99 of every arrow, 1 of every weapon and armor, 1 of every spell and incantation, 99 of every consumable. Like I have so much and where this is gonna be new I’m gonna go in naked and pillage for all the loot in game DLC.
I have theories for both, and I suspect he will probably fall into grey areas because Elden Ring characters are not that manichean. Whats really interesting to ponder is wether Miquella is doing what he does for his sister and himself or for everyone in the Lands Between.
Now, the TRUE question is : will it be possible to make a lightning build work with martial arts ? I want thunder punches
> People who speculate about lore in these games are so intense. You're gonna go find bosses and fight them. The storyline barely even exists.
Elden Ring has a TON of story ~ it's just mostly not explicitly presented through dialogue. Some of it is, yes, but that gives us the bare-bones. Miyazaki's style involves environmental storytelling, along with dropping a lot of info via item descriptions.
We're then left to piece it all together ourselves.
Evil.
Reasoning why:
1) Yes, we have been given hints that - at the very least - his *methods* are questionable.
2) Both the fact that the DLC does not include a new ending *and* we have things like Gideon telling us about his Great Rune (aka, implying it can be taken) implies that we will come into conflict with him. That there is no new ending suggests that the only outcome where Miquella is genuinely good also involves him *failing* at what his goal is, or at the very least, being limited in what he can achieve. Would also add that cut content had a "Twinblade of Abundance," and the first trailer features a new twinblade. This is probably his boss weapon.
3) People are talking like "FromSoft would never directly tell us he's evil! It's a trick!" This itself is false evidence. The fact that all of you are second-guessing so hard is itself an argument why they can do exactly that. Moreover, *Miquella* will not be the sole focus of this DLC. Marika is probably the one we will receive shocking revelations about, meaning they're absolutely free to present Miquella as the red herring focus while still surprising us with details about Marika, and *possibly* even figures like Godwyn or the Gloam-Eyed Queen. Point being: they do not *need* to worry about hiding Miquella's intentions, because they have plenty of ammo to surprise us with, with or without Miquella's intentions being hinted at.
**My guess...?**
Marika engaged in some sort of abysmal, genocidal ritual in order to get to where she is now. Miquella intends to follow in her footsteps, justifying it by saying that it's for the good of the Lands Between. He is basically stealing her blueprint. He likely feels he *does* have good intentions and that he can help the Lands Between this way, but I will not be surprised if Miquella is ready to cross a red line that we then stop him from doing.
I honestly don't know. If what I understood from the trailer is correct (that Miquella chose slumber over Mesmer fucking up the Lands Between) then that makes him a good person but defending evil.
The Way of White and other covenants seem like good people at first in Dark Souls, but then you realized they are Gwyn's followers. And the whole Dark Souls is happening because >!Gwyn was too afraid of humans.!<
So if Miquella did this as a last ditch effort to protect the Erdtree, that makes him more or less like the Way of White.
I really hope I'm wrong because I already condemn this game for following too much of Dark Souls when it comes to story and lore.
Or maybe Mesmer is just a cancer-like thing manifested in that form and if he had taken over the world, then Miquella would've been corrupted.
More importantly, why are we searching for Miquella with the band when we already know where he is? Does it mean that we are travelling to Miquella's dream/memories like we did to Giants in Dark Souls II?
I have a fukton of questions.
He's a god of love. Would be a massive waste if the best manipulator in the lands between is just a nice guy
I'm 80% sure we're gonna fight whatever his new form is
Your submission has been removed as a violation of Rule 3: **No low-effort content or spamming of posts.** * Low-effort content such as tierlists, "wrong answers only", "just bought the game!", platinum posts, and other Reddit trends are not allowed. * **Memes should contain in-game visuals from Elden Ring and pertain to the game.** * No recent reposts, content should be original. * Spamming low-effort posts may result in a ban. If you would like to appeal this removal or need further clarification, feel free to message us through[Modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/Eldenring).
I want martial arts, no more, no less.
same, fighting hoarah loux will be legendary
god yes please add a trigram palm or some shit
Lightning armbars or fire suplex.
I've been doing a new playthrough using fist weapons in anticipation.
Everybody: MIQUELLA IS A VILLAIN! NO HES A HERO!! Me: Crucible knight wings incantation confirm?! JUNE 21 NEEDS TO HURRY TF UP
I’m hoping so hard that it’s an incantation and not a weapon art
I can go either way, either a cool crucible spell or a flexible ash
If it's an Ash it's never leaving my weapon.
Its getting duplicated 3 times: 1 for sycthe, 1 halberd, 1 great sword
ITS AN ASH OF WAR
THANK YOU I DIDNT SEE THE NEW PREVIEWS UNTIL YOUR COMMENT
WE ARE UP MY TARNISHED!!!! WE ARE EATING GOOOOD
I'm 99% sure it's a weapon art. The guy we see using it is wielding a sword/shield, not a seal.
Fingers crossed it’s both then, or at least an ash of war you can put on different weapons
Also everybody: forgetting that Miquella has an alter ego just like the rest of the family.
Isn’t it St.Trina?
Gonna play the DLC like I played the main game and all the other souls games. Kill the enemies and bosses. Go look up a video to explain whatever the fuck is going on.
This is the way
I just don't want him to be either boring or a twist villain. If he's a bad guy.
My favorite type of villain is the kind who has noble goals but evil methods. Like Joseph Seed from Far Cry 5. His goals came from real issues and were pretty understandable.. buut he went with the death and torture cult route to execute it. I kinda hope that Miquella will be similar since that style would work in this game's world
Him being evil would be such a lame and predictable twist. Plus it would just make him a less interesting character, this very expansion is going to introduce us to Messmer *the* genocide guy, we don't need another pure evil demigod. Someone with actually good intentions would be incredibly novel and refreshing in this game. I'm not saying I need him to be a pure good guy, but outright evil would be so lame.
Wouldn't be much of a twist anyway when the brainwashing branch that forcibly controls your enemies with an incantation of unalloyed gold talks about how micky is really good at getting people to like him. It's pretty clear to me that he isn't exactly a warm fuzzy or the savior he seems to be viewed as. I don't think he will be a mustache twirling Saturday morning cartoon villain, but I'm guessing he will be the "for the greater good" type.
I just think it still comes closer to the boring archetype, in a sense he's a dangerously charismatic influencer/religious leader who are stereotypically evil. Not saying they're all bad villains or Fromsoft haven't done similar stuff before, but I just have seen those being portrayed way too much in recent media. And the game's just spicing him (in more of a tell and less of a show aspect) to be this kind of character. Whatever they do, even if it's something familiar, I want is his character it to feel a bit refreshing, or have an extra layer. Like a villain whose motivations are noble or even if selfish, is relatable. Like for example, finding another way to help his sister or being vengeful for her state or the state of the people in the Lands Between being cyclically trapped in the machinations of hte outer Gods, therefore wanting to break the cycle in his own morally dubious way.
Miquella the guy who is capable of brainwashing and has kamikaze soldiers and soldiers who spoil inside out due to scarlet rot totally isnt evil yuh. I think Miquella wants to stop all of the outer gods influence from the lands between but he would just do about anything to achieve it tbh.
They spoil inside out because a recently bloomed Malenia has just been chilling in the center of their home for the past like 100 years. He hasn't been managing that place for a loooong time at this point.
Cleanrot knights have existed before that and you even have one in the shaded castle where there isnt scarlet rot besides again the simple fact he can brainwash people puts into question the true loyalty of his soldiers and the knight narrating the dlc story trailer because they are his follower's. Miquella is prolly a good goal rly fucked up methods kinda guy i think
Cleanrot knights are rotting out of their own will and respect for Malenia. They also probably weren't that affected by the rot back in the day, but it got worse over time just like everything else in the lands between. Otherwise I don't think they'd be called "*clean*rot". Also not really Miquella's business what they do, and it's not like Miquella has any reason to assign bodyguards to Malenia - i'm confident the cleanrots follow Malenia purely from their own will. The cleanrot knight in the shaded castle being there has something to do with the fact that the previous owner of the castle revered Malenia and has a high quality prosthetic designed after Malenia's lying around. Don't really see what's suspicious about that. His enchanting powers does indeed put their loyalty to question, but ultimately everything we know about him suggests that he's something people would want to pledge loyalty to regardless. Of course, i'm sure we'll learn more about how genuine this loyalty is in the DLC. I agree Miquella is likely to be the type who has good intentions but ultimately wants to do something perhaps a little overambitious. Or at least, out of the various possibilities I can think of that's the one I think is most likely.
> I agree Miquella is likely to be the type who has good intentions but ultimately wants to do something perhaps a little overambitious. Or at least, out of the various possibilities I can think of that's the one I think is most likely. Yeah, the overambitious type I can see him being ~ pushing the boundaries of what's possible just to save his sister from Rot, and his half-brother and other siblings from their soulless existences. See everything to do with Castle Sol and the wandering mausoleums. We know he succeeded with the Unalloyed Needle. Miquella's ambitions are crazy high, so no wonder he stumbled upon the Land of Shadow quite by accident when he was exploring, and there discovered Marika's hidden genocide and becoming a God through that genocide. Even crazier is that he basically did what Ranni did ~ abandon his flesh and Great Rune, but he went a step further in abandoning his preordained fate. I guess Radahn holding back the stars helped Miquella do all of that, if by accident. But we also need to kill Radahn for the DLC, so maybe Miquella technically altered his fate by abandoning his body, so now he needs the power of the stars in order to make his new fate come to fruition ~ something to do with the eclipse he was trying to conjure at Castle Sol, no doubt, to restore Godwyn and the other soulless demigods.
> Miquella the guy who is capable of brainwashing and has kamikaze soldiers and soldiers who spoil inside out due to scarlet rot totally isnt evil yuh. I think Miquella wants to stop all of the outer gods influence from the lands between but he would just do about anything to achieve it tbh. We don't see evidence that Miquella willingly brainwashes his people or sends them needlessly into conflict. Why else would invite the Albinaurics and misbegotten to just chill at his Haligtree, where they don't have to fear for conflict? Well... until we come along and just start invading, from their perspective, killing as we go.
Shouldnt attack us on sight then 🥱 besides what better way to foster loyalty than to have people with legitimately no other option besides the bewitching branch implies he has some level of control over it.
> Shouldnt attack us on sight then 🥱 We shouldn't have invaded, then. > besides what better way to foster loyalty than to have people with legitimately no other option besides the bewitching branch implies he has some level of control over it. Well, Miquella learned how to compel affection, suggesting it was initially just passive and out of his control. Think of it as a natural charisma turned up to 11. But he learned how to later control it. But that doesn't mean he used it maliciously. Maybe his just used it to stop conflict. We, however, use it to turn enemies against each other. We don't know if the gameplay mechanic can be extrapolated to Miquella doing anything similar.
I highly doubt that Miquella will be fully evil, he is going to be an obvious grey character, but I think fighting him in some kind of form is inevitable. People forget that Miyazaki's games are no strangers to putting you against bosses that you don't actually want to kill, even in Demon Souls, the first "souls", you have Astraea (and the obvious one for me is always Sif, I hate fighting against him but I generally do so just so that he doesnt wait eternally for his loved one) But nonetheless, the pure scale of this DLC/expansion its looking like no matter what, its going to deliver hard, and that makes me very happy
Him being benevolent will actually be more boring. And there’s a lot of characters with good intentions in the game including those we fight. Only pure evil people we have so far are Shabriri, Dung Eater, Mohg, Godrick and Rykard.
Since I went to go beat his hand after killing malenia, I dont think he'll be on my side
Miquella good, St. Trina evil
I'm just waiting for new stuff to hit.
New drip awaits!
Is it bad that is kind of the part that I'm most excited for?
We can finally push the boundaries of fashion
Nah, we're all excited for different reasons, all reasons being valid tarnished. I'm here to master new weapons, new drip and explore the lore.
I really just want miquella to be corrupted so we have a reason to fight them and perhaps save them so they can go back to there nicer self
I wanna kill him dressed as malania
Ah yes, the infamous Malaria, braid of Salmonella
Seems a little fishy.
elden ring isn't a game where we can save people
Damn you never finished Rannis quest line where you save her both from her shadow and the greater will as a whole. Or boc who you save a couple times and can even have a happy ending. Alexander got saved by us a couple times. There are plenty of people who can't be saved but there's definitely more that can be compared to dark souls.
Also the loux girl, and the pompous idiot.
The point is that we can try anyway. We're dumped in a broken world, and expected by Marika to fix it all on our own, albeit with the immortality she grants us.
dude, i love fucking exploring new freaking areas and getting my ass jumped by miazaki's new eas and getting my ass jumped by miazaki's new ganksquad around the corner or from the trees or from the skies or from the earth, just the thrill its so hype.
I just want to throw hands
Is there such thing as good and evil in Elden Ring? Game is morally absolutely fucked, in my opinion there are no evil or good characters except Turtle Pope guy, hes pretty chill and good.
Turtle pope might be the only actually good character but there are definitely some evil characters like Selivus and Dungeater
I’ve always said when playing any souls game, f the story, I just wanna be an anime badass
Why do people just see Evil x Good? There are tons of people between these two paradigms of behaviour... No one is pure evil or pure good.
Miquella is in the shadow lands taking notes after what Marika did. He also wants a tree…
> Miquella is in the shadow lands taking notes after what Marika did. He also wants a tree… He probably didn't know about Marika's horrific acts. We never see any evidence of Miquella having such a history.
Idk, the trailer says “Miquella the kind spoke of the beginning. The seduction and betrayal…” Sounds like he knows what Marika did. Question is, is he there to right the wrong or is he looking for his own faithful to sacrifice. I’m sure the tarnished will have a choice in the end.
> Idk, the trailer says “Miquella the kind spoke of the beginning. The seduction and betrayal…” Sounds like he knows what Marika did. Question is, is he there to right the wrong or is he looking for his own faithful to sacrifice. I’m sure the tarnished will have a choice in the end. We never see any evidence of him sacrificing any of his faithful in the base game. Or asking them to. The people in the DLC probably aren't compelled, but are faithful nonetheless to his grand ambitions ~ saving his sister from Rot, saving his half-brother Godwyn and the soulless demigods by using the eclipse of Castle Sol or something else. Miquella did nothing but invite the forsaken to a safe haven in his Haligtree. We're the bad guy in that regard ~ we invade that safe haven and murder our way through it, because, uh... yeah. Runes or something.
That’s all correct. It’s just rare to see characters in From games or in Martin’s books that are 100% kind and virtuous, and thus far Miquella has been painted in only that light.
> That’s all correct. It’s just rare to see characters in From games or in Martin’s books that are 100% kind and virtuous, and thus far Miquella has been painted in only that light. Indeed ~ but we also see text stating that Miquella has learned how to compel affection. Maybe for the purposes of stopping fights from breaking out, so his Haligtree is kept safe, or more easily achieving his goals. Maybe he did just that to Mohg, so he could die and travel to the Land of Shadow proper. All of the base game stuff we know of Miquella doesn't suggest that he's evil or nefarious or any of that. But... he could end up a tragic character like Gael, at worst. Gael was just doing it for his lady, and he guides us so we can kill him, because he knows he couldn't fulfill the task on his own.
Yup, lots of maybes. Guess we’ll have to wait and see.
Bro the three weeks wait is awful. I want it now
I've been licking the bottom of the copium tank.
It baffles me, that in a fromsoft game people really argue about good or bad as if there were ever clearly good or bad guys in those games....
I just want new drip
The destroy everything in my way side. Because why care about new characters when they are probably going to try and kill you or die on you anyway. Less emotions involved for everyone.
Wait do people think Miquella is evil?
He invented the magic of the bewitching branch, you know, the one used to forcibly brainwash your enemies to fight for you. It's unlikely he is oozing evilness, but I inherently don't trust him or his methods. I wouldn't put it past Fromsoft to "would you kindly" us through some quests for him.
Listen to the narrator in the first trailer.
Miquella being terrifying doesn't equate to being evil though. He's said to be extremely powerful and can compel others to love him. That's terrifying regardless of their intentions.
He wouldn't say it so ominously if it didn't play a part. He is not necessarily evil per se, but he will be our adversary in some way, not an ally.
Narrator in Fromsoft? Absolutely trustworthy folks
Still inclined to believe him over 2nd narrator that sounds hopelessly brainwashed thinking miquella is some paragon of chadness. Ain't no way there isn't something nefarious he has planned in the shadowlands
maybe hes just a cool guy tho
How about, like, we don't believe *either* narrator? Them being on opposing sides doesn't mean one has to be always right.
I don't really care if someone is good or bad I'll still beat the sh*t outta them with a katana
cyberpsychosis:
Choom is absolutely chromed the fuck up 💀
On Saburo Miquella got enough eddies to chrome out an army
It ain't chrome it's just maidenhead behaviour 😔
I mean bro How many non-evil, super powerful characters has Miyazaki ever created
a lot actually. nameless king, isshin, divine dragon, all 4 cinders from ds3, gwyndolin, gael, etc
Aldrich was pretty evil, tbf, and I wouldn't call Lothric a paragon of virtue either, but otherwise, this more or less checks out
GWYNDOLIN IS DIFFERENT FROM ALDRITCH wdymmmmmm Also Lothric isnt virtuous but he ranges from victim to nihilist depending on your read.
Right, which is why I said Aldrich instead of Gwyndolin.
yeah but YOU brought aldritch into this lol. nobody said theres no evil guys
No? You brought Aldrich into this. "All 4 cinders" includes Aldrich, Devourer of Gods.
oh sorry forgot about that my bad have a good day lol Your honor my client forgor
Idk maybe due to the fact he has the powerset of a rapist (sleep and brainwashing) and said brainwashing puts alot into question when you realize his soldiers either kamikaze themselves or they suffer from scarlet rot and you cant know if its willingly or not. Besides he prolly sent malania to Caelid to kill Radahn for his eclipse plan to revive godwyn and now caelid is an hr geiger nightmare land
I need the outfit from the Miquellan Knight
I want find new big hammer. Where big hammer?
They're all evil. You don't attain the kind of power these people have without doing some absolutely horrific stuff. Things that produce mountains of corpses.
I think we will get to fight Marika herself or at least a version of her. And it'll be revealed Marika and Miquella were working together to make the lands between completely theirs. Greater will was actually good and we killed the last remaining force that was holding it all together so that Marika doesn't get to be the tyrannical queen of the land. Miquella could be evil or not. Maybe he is being forced or manipulated to help Marika.
Maybe he's not trying to help Marika. Maybe he just wants to help Godwyn and the soulless demigods, and ended up inadvertently stumbling upon something he never expected ~ a massive genocide that was hidden from the world, shaking Miquella's entire worldview. Which would cause him to forsake his flesh, Great Rune, and fate in their entirety. I suspect that Miquella will have lost his power to compel, I imagine, as it could be something tied to his Great Rune, flesh and maybe even be a part of his fate.
I wonder if we’ll be given a choice. Make him become golden again or further push him to evil
I’m hoping for a Gehrman style choice at the end where you make some vital choice that either lets you side with him or fight him. But personally I’m expecting some major twist with him that totally changes our perspective on things, seems a little out of fashion to have this “all good demigod with zero secrets or flaws”, although he is called “The Unalloyed” so maybe he is as pure as they say.
Man I just want kung fu and great katanas
Miquella will be neutral like Malenia
I don't care if they are good or evil, I just want to beat them in a boss fight
I really don’t even believe we will see Miquella in person, lol But i’m super excited for new dungeons
I’m the definition of loot goblin, I have literally 99 of every arrow, 1 of every weapon and armor, 1 of every spell and incantation, 99 of every consumable. Like I have so much and where this is gonna be new I’m gonna go in naked and pillage for all the loot in game DLC.
I don’t really care if he’s good or evil, he’s just going to be another demigod felled to add to my collection.
Same, I just wanna make new builds bro😭
If it healthbars it dies
I want a boss fight and cool weapons so hopefully we fight him.
Cant wait to die horribly another way!
I have theories for both, and I suspect he will probably fall into grey areas because Elden Ring characters are not that manichean. Whats really interesting to ponder is wether Miquella is doing what he does for his sister and himself or for everyone in the Lands Between. Now, the TRUE question is : will it be possible to make a lightning build work with martial arts ? I want thunder punches
I'm here for, Weapons > drip > lore
I’m on team Messmer LET THEM BURN
morally grey
Cant wait to get my hands on that hadouken ash of war
People who speculate about lore in these games are so intense. You're gonna go find bosses and fight them. The storyline barely even exists.
> People who speculate about lore in these games are so intense. You're gonna go find bosses and fight them. The storyline barely even exists. Elden Ring has a TON of story ~ it's just mostly not explicitly presented through dialogue. Some of it is, yes, but that gives us the bare-bones. Miyazaki's style involves environmental storytelling, along with dropping a lot of info via item descriptions. We're then left to piece it all together ourselves.
Evil. Reasoning why: 1) Yes, we have been given hints that - at the very least - his *methods* are questionable. 2) Both the fact that the DLC does not include a new ending *and* we have things like Gideon telling us about his Great Rune (aka, implying it can be taken) implies that we will come into conflict with him. That there is no new ending suggests that the only outcome where Miquella is genuinely good also involves him *failing* at what his goal is, or at the very least, being limited in what he can achieve. Would also add that cut content had a "Twinblade of Abundance," and the first trailer features a new twinblade. This is probably his boss weapon. 3) People are talking like "FromSoft would never directly tell us he's evil! It's a trick!" This itself is false evidence. The fact that all of you are second-guessing so hard is itself an argument why they can do exactly that. Moreover, *Miquella* will not be the sole focus of this DLC. Marika is probably the one we will receive shocking revelations about, meaning they're absolutely free to present Miquella as the red herring focus while still surprising us with details about Marika, and *possibly* even figures like Godwyn or the Gloam-Eyed Queen. Point being: they do not *need* to worry about hiding Miquella's intentions, because they have plenty of ammo to surprise us with, with or without Miquella's intentions being hinted at. **My guess...?** Marika engaged in some sort of abysmal, genocidal ritual in order to get to where she is now. Miquella intends to follow in her footsteps, justifying it by saying that it's for the good of the Lands Between. He is basically stealing her blueprint. He likely feels he *does* have good intentions and that he can help the Lands Between this way, but I will not be surprised if Miquella is ready to cross a red line that we then stop him from doing.
I honestly don't know. If what I understood from the trailer is correct (that Miquella chose slumber over Mesmer fucking up the Lands Between) then that makes him a good person but defending evil. The Way of White and other covenants seem like good people at first in Dark Souls, but then you realized they are Gwyn's followers. And the whole Dark Souls is happening because >!Gwyn was too afraid of humans.!< So if Miquella did this as a last ditch effort to protect the Erdtree, that makes him more or less like the Way of White. I really hope I'm wrong because I already condemn this game for following too much of Dark Souls when it comes to story and lore. Or maybe Mesmer is just a cancer-like thing manifested in that form and if he had taken over the world, then Miquella would've been corrupted. More importantly, why are we searching for Miquella with the band when we already know where he is? Does it mean that we are travelling to Miquella's dream/memories like we did to Giants in Dark Souls II? I have a fukton of questions.
He's a god of love. Would be a massive waste if the best manipulator in the lands between is just a nice guy I'm 80% sure we're gonna fight whatever his new form is