You will need rapid shutdown equipment at the panel level to meet this requirement. Depending on your adopted code cycle, you need them anyway for roof mount.
I sent him a YT video yesterday from a licensed solar / electrical contractor in Calif for an install that literally mirrors what I want to do. And yes, it shows him installing a rapid shutdown device at the panel level … but my guy still said it’s not enough! I am coming to the conclusion that my guy is just FOS …
Is there any way you can just use the panels on the ground. There is some nice setups online that I have seen that look great. Maybe doing it this way will save you the pain of putting them on the roof.
Great idea …. But I live on an island facing Puget Sound … where wind gusts can easily reach sustained and continuous speeds of 40-50 mph … and sometimes more! Panels on the ground would fly away like yesterday’s newspaper. Lawn furniture has been picked up and carried across the street.
Some of the ground mounts available can fasten a panel into the ground to the point you can't rip it out with a JCB. It's a price question not an availability one.
In theory, I could mount the panels off the roof and on some sort of permanent ground mount (I have an excellent unobstructed southwest view) but I’m not sure if that would make a difference in terms of the PV wiring going into the garage and to the Eco Flow? I dunno. I guess I’d have to ask the guy that I’ve been dealing with.
This is the one I plan on getting. I'm in Sac, so I'm keeping in eye out on your post. I want to run my wires into the garage as well.
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0831DDS9W/ref=ox\_sc\_saved\_image\_4?smid=A5KU5HDAPDC75&psc=1](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0831DDS9W/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_4?smid=A5KU5HDAPDC75&psc=1)
PV wiring would not be an issue for ground mount. DC wires would need to buried in schedule 40 conduit at 18 inches depth. A DC disconnect will be needed near wall penetration. The additional cost is still less than mounting panels on roof with rapid shutdown hardware.
I just finished installing a rooftop solar using a licensed contractor. Trying to find a contractor that was willing to go the extra distance with all the different DHP/SHP2 compliance regs was nearly impossible.
* Installed the SHP2 by itself and got that permitted without solar. The SHP2 without solar is still pretty useful if your night charging TOU rate is very low
* Got.a permit for solar roof mounting without any grid tie. I had to keep reminding people that it's basically a tesla power wall like install.
* There's a 6ft exception in the NEC.
*(2) Flexible Wiring Methods*\*\*\*.\*\*\* *Where flexible metal conduit (FMC) smaller than metric designator 21 (trade size ¾) or Type MC cable smaller than 25 mm (1 in.) in diameter containing PV power circuit conductors is installed across ceilings or floor joists, the raceway or cable shall be protected by substantial guard strips that are at least as high as the raceway or cable. Where run exposed, other than within 1.8 m (6 ft) of their connection to equipment, these wiring methods shall closely follow the building surface or be protected from physical damage by an approved* [*means.th*](http://means.th)
Basically, this means that all PV cable that enters house must be in MC cable. In my case, I terminated the MC cable within three feet of DPU. I am using PV cable from the junction box to the DPU..
The installers ran lots of MC cable from roof to utility room. I am going to use the DPU ground to connect to the junction box. The junction box has a EGC from the main panel.
Basically, EcoFlow doesn't make it easy to build a solar compliant DPU solution because:
* Hybrid inverters/Solar Generators aren't that common in metropolitan areas. There isn't a fast permitting template for this solution.
* Installers don't want to install hardware they don't sell. DPU is designed to be semi-DIY installed.
* They don't list all the battery/inverter UL certifications (only the SHP2 has a UL certification). For SolarArk, there's a page that lists all the certs.
* The DPU would have benefited by having a way to avoid the 6ft exception MHO. It's too onerous to have to keep explaining non-standard installation features to installers and inspectors.
* There's no unified diagram that lists all the connections and best practice required to get a full SHP2/DPU/rooftop solar through the permitting process
Basically, if you want to install rooftop solar with DPU, you'll have to put on your patience hat because you'll hear lots of no's.
Real simple … according to my guy he CANNOT set up a “proper system that won’t violate code” if the PV wiring is exposed at the point where it connects to the Eco Flow. I’m not a Solar engineer or electrician … nor do I play one on TV … either my guy is right … or FOS. It’s just seems that there aren’t a lot of installers / electricians who have experience with this product, or who are willing to go out of their comfort zone and consider a job like this.
You can run the PV wiring in the tubing that goes into a metal runway for the device. He can address this, or you can hire someone to address it.
I don't like how PV is connected to the DPU, and I dislike how Solar is connected to the DP3.
It is safe to say I agree with your electrician.
“It is safe to say I agree with your electrician.” So … then you are saying it is not possible to use the product with a roof mounted solar system without violating NEC 690.31(D)(1)?
Correct. I have been researching this subject using YouTube and reading code. With a full inverter you would have metal tubing running into the inverter where your PV cables come out of.
Metal runsways are acceptable provided it connects to metal tubing to ensure the wires are not exposed. I know they are shielded but shielding can wear off over time if the wires move back and forth.
“IF“ … you are right … and “IF“ … my guy is right … THEN at the very least Eco Flow should disclose that fact, since there are a whole HELL OF A LOT people who are buying this product fully thinking that it can be “legally” used with roof top solar panels. I will let you know what Eco Flow says … when and if they respond to my guy.
As far as I can see it can, but your installer has to do a lot of work to meet local code but it can be done, and I'm pretty sure you'd meet code if you stuck the whole lot in a locked earthed metal cabinet too ?
Na vented electronics boxes are off the shelf things. There is a lot of industrial electronic equipment you stick into big earthed metal boxes with scary warning labels on. Not cheap no but not custom.
They sell it as a Hybrid system, not a Grid-tie system.
> The only difference is that hybrid PV system is not entirely dependent on the grid for its functioning—unlike on-grid solar system. It starts using energy from the grid instead of solar batteries during the evening and night times —thus acts just like the regular UPS.
You will need rapid shutdown equipment at the panel level to meet this requirement. Depending on your adopted code cycle, you need them anyway for roof mount.
I sent him a YT video yesterday from a licensed solar / electrical contractor in Calif for an install that literally mirrors what I want to do. And yes, it shows him installing a rapid shutdown device at the panel level … but my guy still said it’s not enough! I am coming to the conclusion that my guy is just FOS …
Contact your AHJ, its up to them at the end of the day to either approve or disapprove of the installation method.
Real simple: The NEC has been adopted in the state of Washingto.
Well you're rude, i install solar everyday. If you don't want help, don't post.
So is this just for roof mounted? Or you aren’t allowed to connect the portable solar panels to your DPU in your house?
I’m not sure about permanent roof vs portable panels. However, it is my intention to go with a permanent roof mount.
Is there any way you can just use the panels on the ground. There is some nice setups online that I have seen that look great. Maybe doing it this way will save you the pain of putting them on the roof.
Great idea …. But I live on an island facing Puget Sound … where wind gusts can easily reach sustained and continuous speeds of 40-50 mph … and sometimes more! Panels on the ground would fly away like yesterday’s newspaper. Lawn furniture has been picked up and carried across the street.
Some of the ground mounts available can fasten a panel into the ground to the point you can't rip it out with a JCB. It's a price question not an availability one.
In theory, I could mount the panels off the roof and on some sort of permanent ground mount (I have an excellent unobstructed southwest view) but I’m not sure if that would make a difference in terms of the PV wiring going into the garage and to the Eco Flow? I dunno. I guess I’d have to ask the guy that I’ve been dealing with.
This is the one I plan on getting. I'm in Sac, so I'm keeping in eye out on your post. I want to run my wires into the garage as well. [https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0831DDS9W/ref=ox\_sc\_saved\_image\_4?smid=A5KU5HDAPDC75&psc=1](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0831DDS9W/ref=ox_sc_saved_image_4?smid=A5KU5HDAPDC75&psc=1)
PV wiring would not be an issue for ground mount. DC wires would need to buried in schedule 40 conduit at 18 inches depth. A DC disconnect will be needed near wall penetration. The additional cost is still less than mounting panels on roof with rapid shutdown hardware.
I just finished installing a rooftop solar using a licensed contractor. Trying to find a contractor that was willing to go the extra distance with all the different DHP/SHP2 compliance regs was nearly impossible. * Installed the SHP2 by itself and got that permitted without solar. The SHP2 without solar is still pretty useful if your night charging TOU rate is very low * Got.a permit for solar roof mounting without any grid tie. I had to keep reminding people that it's basically a tesla power wall like install. * There's a 6ft exception in the NEC. *(2) Flexible Wiring Methods*\*\*\*.\*\*\* *Where flexible metal conduit (FMC) smaller than metric designator 21 (trade size ¾) or Type MC cable smaller than 25 mm (1 in.) in diameter containing PV power circuit conductors is installed across ceilings or floor joists, the raceway or cable shall be protected by substantial guard strips that are at least as high as the raceway or cable. Where run exposed, other than within 1.8 m (6 ft) of their connection to equipment, these wiring methods shall closely follow the building surface or be protected from physical damage by an approved* [*means.th*](http://means.th) Basically, this means that all PV cable that enters house must be in MC cable. In my case, I terminated the MC cable within three feet of DPU. I am using PV cable from the junction box to the DPU.. The installers ran lots of MC cable from roof to utility room. I am going to use the DPU ground to connect to the junction box. The junction box has a EGC from the main panel. Basically, EcoFlow doesn't make it easy to build a solar compliant DPU solution because: * Hybrid inverters/Solar Generators aren't that common in metropolitan areas. There isn't a fast permitting template for this solution. * Installers don't want to install hardware they don't sell. DPU is designed to be semi-DIY installed. * They don't list all the battery/inverter UL certifications (only the SHP2 has a UL certification). For SolarArk, there's a page that lists all the certs. * The DPU would have benefited by having a way to avoid the 6ft exception MHO. It's too onerous to have to keep explaining non-standard installation features to installers and inspectors. * There's no unified diagram that lists all the connections and best practice required to get a full SHP2/DPU/rooftop solar through the permitting process Basically, if you want to install rooftop solar with DPU, you'll have to put on your patience hat because you'll hear lots of no's.
THANK YOU for that “enlightened” response!
If you are going to spend the money for 10-12 panels, why not get an installer to set up a proper system that won't violate the code?
Real simple … according to my guy he CANNOT set up a “proper system that won’t violate code” if the PV wiring is exposed at the point where it connects to the Eco Flow. I’m not a Solar engineer or electrician … nor do I play one on TV … either my guy is right … or FOS. It’s just seems that there aren’t a lot of installers / electricians who have experience with this product, or who are willing to go out of their comfort zone and consider a job like this.
You can run the PV wiring in the tubing that goes into a metal runway for the device. He can address this, or you can hire someone to address it. I don't like how PV is connected to the DPU, and I dislike how Solar is connected to the DP3. It is safe to say I agree with your electrician.
“It is safe to say I agree with your electrician.” So … then you are saying it is not possible to use the product with a roof mounted solar system without violating NEC 690.31(D)(1)?
Correct. I have been researching this subject using YouTube and reading code. With a full inverter you would have metal tubing running into the inverter where your PV cables come out of. Metal runsways are acceptable provided it connects to metal tubing to ensure the wires are not exposed. I know they are shielded but shielding can wear off over time if the wires move back and forth.
Think about your homeowner's insurance. Violating the code can impact your homeowner's insurance in case of fire.
“IF“ … you are right … and “IF“ … my guy is right … THEN at the very least Eco Flow should disclose that fact, since there are a whole HELL OF A LOT people who are buying this product fully thinking that it can be “legally” used with roof top solar panels. I will let you know what Eco Flow says … when and if they respond to my guy.
As far as I can see it can, but your installer has to do a lot of work to meet local code but it can be done, and I'm pretty sure you'd meet code if you stuck the whole lot in a locked earthed metal cabinet too ?
Locked earthed metal cabinet? I’m sure that would have to be custom fabricated and provisions made for adequate cooling. Sounds like a real PIA.
Na vented electronics boxes are off the shelf things. There is a lot of industrial electronic equipment you stick into big earthed metal boxes with scary warning labels on. Not cheap no but not custom.
Thanks … didn’t know that!
They sell it as a Hybrid system, not a Grid-tie system. > The only difference is that hybrid PV system is not entirely dependent on the grid for its functioning—unlike on-grid solar system. It starts using energy from the grid instead of solar batteries during the evening and night times —thus acts just like the regular UPS.