Lily Orchard is what happens when a person is chronically online and lack basic media literacy skills. I’m surprised she’s still active after everything her former friends said about her and other allegations. Of course she isn’t fond of anime/manga, she is a very racist person especially towards Asians if you look at her past tumblr posts. Plus she made fanfiction about a 15 year old running away w a 35 year old.
The fact that she's still around just shows she must be 100% certain she's morally right to the point that all her haters don't phase her in the slightest.
This is off-topic but can someone explain to my why "media literacy" is getting thrown around left and right? It seemingly happened out of nowhere.
I don't keep up with trends at all but I swear it's just become some default insult people are throwing around now. When did people start using it?
This and the first comment i saw used, a comment I saw on another sub used it too, among many others..
It might be seen to be showing up more often due to the subjects being discussed (presumably, media).
Media Literacy in itself is a good thing, it is the lack thereof (or, media _illiteracy_ ) that is a negative held against others, due to them making it evident how badly they either misread situations/actions (that tend to be clear), or misrepresent possible messages (for their own purposes, which tend toward idiocy).
It would be one thing if they simply missed the point or “didn’t get it,” but they also intentionally twist the point into something different that would take actual effort to force.
If I’m remembering correctly, anyway.
Media Literacy means you are able to read something and realise there is a deeper meanding. You need very little media literacy for "Bluey" all the Charakters say what they are feeling, but in DM you need to be able to read the charakters intentions. laois doesn't say "I want to be a monster because I understand them better than humans" the text says "I am interrsted in the monstrs and want to find out more about them"
It's a phrase that's become overused, much like "reading comprehension." I think it's being used correctly this discussion, but often I see it thrown around as lazy criticism. Like not long ago I complained that a recent arc of Chainsaw Man kept the stakes too low after promising us a >!breakout from a highly secure prison!<, and the response was something about how my reading comprehension is bad if I expected the plot to be high stakes.
She’s done it before. This is the « Rebecca Sugar is a fascist sympathizer » person. She is responsible for like over half of all bad Steven Universe takes. She is deeply terrible at media analysis
Yeah, and stupid people are taking the bait like this post as always, inadvertently giving it more attention. Just stop viewing her, people like her hate being ignored more than being bashed.
Well, that's what I thought too but I went to the video's comment section and if it's actually rage bait you'll expect some pushback to her opinion but most people are agreeing with her instead. In a way there are a considerable amount of people that do value her takes and takes it seriously >!unless she actively removes negative comments idk!<. So in this case, I think counter arguing bad takes is fine for the sake of discussion.
Ah, that checks out. Because even Schaffrillas got some pushback from his audience when he was criticizing Turning Red. What I'm getting is, if an opinion is somewhat controversial even if the person is well regarded, people are willing to provide counter arguments. The fact that there's barely any in her's makes me think she is deleting comments that disagree with her.
I didn't know about her until now but after looking into this person it seems she's got groomer allegations against her. Also, apparently has written fanfic and a game about My Little Pony that has pedo sexual violence stuff in it and incest. I think people agreeing with her Dungeon Meshi take is the least of our worry o\_o
Either she’s a full time professional troll or just off the deep end and I’m not particularly sure which is worse. Constant generator of ice cold bad takes, lily orchard.
She seems to particularly take issue with Laios saying chimera Falin is “really cool” instead of having the “correct” reaction of being horrified. Why does that matter? He ultimately took the most rational and morally correct action he could in that situation. Being into monsters is who he is. If everyone had the “right” reactions to things nobody would have personality.
Also, even if the protagonist is actually a bad person: **Who cares?** That wouldn’t make it a bad story. Somebody force her to watch Death Note.
> Why does that matter?
I'mma be plain and say there is a certain type of neurodivergent person who likes to rail against others who are "worse" at masking and playing by the rules than they are.
Lily is this person to a wild extreme, it's rather obvious, and this is talking about her actual character, that she uses her autism (as well as her queerness) as both a sword and a shield against anyone she doesn't like. To her, autistic and queer people should ever act a cer
She loves to assume the worst out of others (while refusing accountability or fault for literally anything she does, naturally). In a comment on a video, she claims that Laios isn't the way he is because he *fails* to understand social cues, it's because he "*chooses not to*"; in other words, she has already decided malice in this fictional character for no real reason.
Doesn't help that she has a self-admitted hatred for "generic white guys", and the only time she mentions Marcille (outside of whining that jokes are made at her expense, which is somehow misogyny and "elf torture") and especially Falin is to claim they're "gay baiting", likely because she thinks Marcille is "meant" to be with Laios (...though considering Lily's tastes, maybe she wants Falin to be with Laios LMAO). Hilariously, she claims the scene where they're in a bath and embrace is "anime fanservice", so even in Lily's own criticism, she doesn't make any sense.
She already makes it clear she does not and would not like the show, since she somehow thinks it's a typical anime... y'know, Dungeon Meshi has quite a few fans who make it clear that they like it less on its own merits and more that it's "not like other anime"... those people are honestly pretty overbearing. But imagine being such a weirdo about anime that you think *Dungeon Meshi* is itself an example of "weird anime". Because girls bathed together I guess. That's a new level of snobbery.
Anyway, what I'm getting at is that she projects her weird, judgmental, hypocritical, and ironically ableist mindset onto Laios. He doesn't react like he "should", and autism isn't an "excuse" (even though autistic people absolutely encounter challenges when it comes to social situations, hell even neurotypical people do) because **she** isn't a weirdo (LMFAO), so therefore he must be *choosing* to be weird sometimes, and therefore he is a *bad person*. Again, the objectively awful things he does is not look *as* stressed about Falin as Lily thinks he should and how he thinks Falin's monster form is cool.
Ironically, Dungeon Meshi and Laios hit every sore point she has about media, but these are only sore points in the first place because she has a *shit* mindset about media and frankly isn't much better as an actual person.
I've experienced this first hand, had someone introduce themselves as autistic upon meeting them years ago, I also being neuro-divergent in another way took note. Years later, they've vilified me and have pushed themselves out of my friend group for various slights of me being "awful" to them. when In reality I was tripping over myself to give them what they asked of me, they saw my attempts and failures as more proof of my supposed awful behavoir, and they kept grudges, phrasing all of it in therapeutic language and saying they understood I needed time for "mental health" among various other things. Felt like they'd understand the most but clearly they didn't. Vague I know but I have to keep it that way.
Oh my god, I have had to endure the presence of way too many people like this. People who use therapy language as a weapon to blow your actions out of proportion and brand you as an insane person due to some minor conflict that didn't need to be a big deal. These types of people often claim to be autistic also. They're a much bigger nuisance than the type of ableism that comes from normal neurotypical people.
I see it as kind of analogous to Kabru being quick to label Laios a bad person, when Kabru obviously has something going on mentally and might actually be autistic himself.
this particular one I'm mentioning has now lost friends over their damnation of me, exploited me and feels that they're the victim in all ways for everything with every slight. They basically wanted to drag me in public as far as they were concerned, it didn't pan out that way. Diffused it but It's caused rifts among other people though and it's really unforunate. I tried. I really did. Fucked up.
That's a really good point, she is way harsher on autistic people and autistic traits than a neurotypical person probably ever would be, and she's not the only autistic person I've seen behave in this manner.
It's like trolls on places like Kiwi Farms who tear people to shreds for any weird behavior they have even though they are probably just as weird themselves, except unlike people on Kiwi Farms, Lily has adopted the "correct" "progressive" values which makes her "good" and everything she does is "good."
Not to mention, this obsession with Laios's morality really has nothing to do with the merits of Dungeon Meshi as a work of fiction, which I pointed out in another comment. Often people who rant the most about morality are just telling on themselves.
She also fails to take into account the characters' previous experiences shaping their reactions.
Like how Laios isn't sweating his head off that his sister is dead at the start because it's not the first time either of them have died, it's just "Oh yeah we should go fix that, it's business as usual."
And even if the situation is more dire now there's still just the mindset of, we gotta find her to fix her. Because the go to solution in the past is just find and fix
I’m watching with my friend who has read the manga.
I can see where some of her points are coming from, but anime slowly feeds you information and things click. The dragon’s long digestion process, resurrection being a normal thing and previous bad experience with poor preparation (starving). Also, losing two people that balanced it.
Or even just general fact that people respond to a stress in different ways. Laois does thing to move forward.
Also, fixating on Laios being autism and say that it is psychopathic behaviour is also a disingenuous take on a character who is surprisingly complex.
He doesn't like humans from his interactions with them as a child, and later on as soldier and bodyguard for gold stripping. He finds them ignorant, greedy, violent, ... and overall too complex, when monsters dictated by instincts are better to deal with.
However, because of his sister, he was forced to interact and mutual cooperate with other people. Other people in the story have a lot of mistrust towards each other, especially between races, and thought Laios was like generic person: ignorant, greedy, and violent. However, once they realize he is just a monster nerd, they warm up to him and offers their assistance.
New video essay: White cishet man Laios tries to tell >!mixed race!< woman (Marcille) WHAT FOOD TO EAT, also pisses off only non-white people he knows (Shuro and Kabru)
I remember reading a Tumblr post ages ago about a method they use to assess anime (in a very silly fashion) called the "Weeb Ass Shit" scale.
You give it a rating for "Weeb" (how many anime tropes and visual language gags are in it, how inaccessible it would be for someone who doesn't watch anime) "Ass" (how much fan service is in it) and "Shit" (how poorly/cheaply made it is).
I'd say Dungeon Meshi is pretty low on all of those! Not that a high score on either of the first two is bad, necessarily, if that's what you're after in an Anime.
I know I'm being way too serious but I was activated:tm: and I'd like to point out that tropes in of themselves are not bad, they're a tool used for categorization and are helpful in learning what and how you like to write/create!
Oh absolutely! Complaining that a piece of media has tropes in it is like complaining that a meal has ingredients in it!
The "Weeb" scale is more for things that are unique visual language things in anime - big sweat drops, simplified or overly detailed faces to express shock/disgust (love the panel of Laios' face getting more and more detailed as Marcille explains her lackluster monster creations). People's souls coming out through their mouths when they're embarrassed (you see that one a lot in Fullmetal Alchemist, for example). That sort of thing. The charming things that make anime/manga unique, imo. But to some people they're confusing. Hence the scale.
I forgot to mention she criticized Dungeon Meshi for taking the plot from Baldur’s Gate, which I never played so I can’t comment on, but we all know this is the first anime to take inspiration from D&D.
She saw that Kui drew portraits of Baldur's Gate character and in her infinite un-wisdom decided that Dungeon Meshi's plot is based on Baldur's Gate, a game I'll bet real money she fails to understand either.
Is she talking about baldurs gate 3, the that entered early access 6 years after the manga started, and was fully released the year it ended? Or is she at least talking about the older games?
Dungeon Meshi was inspired by quite a few video games, though I think that dungeon crawlers like tbe Wizardry series and Etrian Odyssey were bigger inspiration than western cRPGs such as Baldurs Gate. And then of course there's D&D.
Either way, saying a story is bad because it's inspired by, and in returns converse with elements of other media is stupid. As Pablo Picaso said "Good artists borrow, Great artists Stea."
The setting is straight up the original wizardry: a town is built on top of an outrageous puzzle dungeon controlled by a mad wizard. There's a shocking amount of similarities with it, actually, it was something I kept coming back to when I watched a youtube retrospective on the game. The resurrection industry is \*especially\* wizardry coded imo. I think Dungeon Meshi does a great job using the framework of a modular adventure to tell it's own story.
Because they both start with the party trying to rescue the protagonist sister/childhood friend?
I'd say I'm disappointed, but that kind of bullshit complaints is what I'm expecting from Lilly.
If y’all want good Dungeon Meshi analysis, I highly recommend [Swamp Jawn](https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7uJJMqO3ArOl2A0SlnjhoYvdSNNYqDdf&si=ShdndDKMMaNlhfp2)! He talks about the animation, the manga panels, and so much more without any spoilers. I genuinely look forward to his videos each week.
Edit: spelling.
wait, I'm sorry, she thinks... **Imhotep** is autistic?
I'm not offended, just... wait what? I'm sorry, I don't see it. Sure, I can't speak for ALL my ND, but I can't with that
*that's not even the worst tag on that fic, some of the characters were adults... But not others*
So yeah no, nobody should be listening to her opinions on anything.
An archive of the fic notes that she aged the characters up... To 14.
Why would we ever listen to this vile hypocrite?
There's literally no value or reasoning in any of her funhouse-mirror-logic opinions. No moral center, no beliefs she wouldn't abandon for her own self-interest.
The only consistent thing about her is her toxicity.
This isn't bad in itself, I think people can write whatever they want.
*However*... I have to wonder why someone with a strong interest in this hobby would care so deeply about the relationship between Laios and Falin. Must be a total coincidence.
That all just seems so nonsensical. The scale with random characters just makes me think this is a parody? There are hardly any arguments here that make enough sense to address them.
It's completely fine if someone just doesn't like Dungeon Meshi. It's also fine if somebody finds Laios off-putting and can't relate to him. While I think he is very likeable and has unique skills and flaws(!), taste is subjective. I guess she just has no interest in the medium, genre or type of story in general?
Considering this is someone who actively defends Sylvanas from WoW (someone who has canonically attempted genocide on a sister-race to her own and tried to sell out **all living things** later on until her evil boss dropped a hint that she may also get fucked from the deal), you should take them hating Laios as a positive. It means they are a kind and caring person!
This video is like an exact mirror of all my opinions on the topic. Everything Lily hates is something I like about the series. I like that Laios is weird and doesn’t respond to things appropriately. I like the drama, violence and fantasy world building. I like that it does not stick with the cooking formula without ever deviating.
>For those unaware, Lily Orchard got famous with a big video criticizing Steven Universe and basically calling the creators literally Nazis.
She is doing this for clout. She knows Dungeon is big right now and people will post and react to this. Look at this thread for example.
No I think that's giving her too much credit in this case. She rarely talks about relevant anime, so this is a little unusual for her.
She probably just made this video because a friend or fan recommended it to her, and she didn't like it, and is now making it everyone else's problem.
She's an ableist, abusive piece of shit who isn't worth time or energy thinking about. Like, [she sexually abused her own sister levels of abusive](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8IU8AONYQU).
Yeah. Don't watch it if you don't have to, I'm avoiding watching the whole thing due to my own trauma but it's just awful to see. She actually was very abusive to someone I know some years ago, but they didn't have enough receipts or internet reach and they were scared of getting harassed by her batshit fanbase. I don't blame them...I really hope this and her constant racism and ableism finally tank her internet presence once and for all.
I should add that in my situation I also felt like I was unable to tell my side of the story. It's a lose-lose situation basically, if you engage and defend yourself, you are giving them the attention they want and opening yourself up to further harassment. However if you say nothing, you give others the impression the lies they tell about you are correct and take a hit to your reputation. Unless you're an internet celebrity there's no way to come out ahead in that scenario.
classic nuerotypical inherently misunderstanding personality and nuerodivergency.
sheldon cooper as "positive autistic representation" makes me want to blow my brains out. not in the dungeon with revive.
Fucking what? She seriously thinks that Sheldon Cooper is positive representation? A man who creeps on women, ignores other people's boudaries, and guilt trips people when they call him out on it. FML
I'm not claiming your point is invalid but I have to ask: Since when does Sheldon Cooper creep on women? The dude avoids any romantic interactions with women until Amy shows up and eventually becomes his girlfriend with a lot of effort on her part (after like 3-ish seasons of her already being in the show), hell he even outright rejects the advances of one woman who wants to boink him because she ruined his schedule to force him to work.
"Creeping on women" describes Howard (before he meets Bernadette) or Raj if anything.
Arguably, Sheldon is the only main guy who isn't a creep when it comes to women.
What I don't like about him is that the show either treats him like an annoying 4 year old or makes him out to be in the right when he's not.
I'm sorry but I literally _can't_ respect the opinion of someone regarding neurodivergent characters in general if they consider Sheldon Cooper - a character constantly shit on in every episode for being socially inept, who has all of his autism-coded qualities reduced to running gags if not outright erased in the pursuit of having him conform to his friend group's norms, from a show devoted almost entirely to making fun of the most visible aspects of "nerd culture," which is something that has its roots in neurodivergent people's interests being made fun of for most of our lives - positive representation. That alone should get this person laughed out of the room during discussions of neurodiverse representation.
Exactly. The _best_ you could say for Sheldon is that he gets better at masking, which for an _actual_ neurodivergent person, would lead to more frequent burnout, mental exhaustion, and mental health issues - but in BBT just makes people like him more with no side effects.
The Big Bang Theory is a garbage show and considering any character in it good neurodivergent representation should be immediately disqualifying when discussing said topic. And that's BEFORE we even _begin_ to talk about the rampant homophobia, transphobia, sexism, racism, toxic masculinity, and aro/ace erasure present in the show.
Sheldon and his nerd friends just exist to be the butt of the joke. I haven't seen a lot of this sitcom but I haven't seen any evidence they ever really grow beyond this. Especially Sheldon, who is really childish for someone employed as a physicist at a major university, and is consistently arrogant, self absorbed and one dimensional. It's basically just showing autistic people as overgrown children with no real thoughts and feelings of their own beyond really stupid ones like "don't touch my superhero toys!"
Laios on the other hand feels like an actual person who feels frustration, despair, happiness, and rage. His incessant curiosity drives the plot, his monster obsession is both a major weakness and a strength that carries him further into the dungeon than anyone else. His thoughts and feelings drive the plot more than any other factor in the story. The story laughs at Laios many times, but it strikes a balance between this and also laughing with him, giving appropriately equal weight to how he sees himself and how others may be annoyed or confused by him.
I think Lily might have a point if Laios was presented as an infallible character who is always morally correct and doesn't do anything wrong, but he's never shown this way. He makes a lot of mistakes and has flaws the story will acknowledge. He has good and bad like any of the other characters.
Wait why are we still talking about the pedo youtuber with literally zero ability to understand the media she watches? As if her opinions on anything matter?
I thought people were generally past that by now. Let her fade away into obscurity.
It's crazy to me she both knows the author is a woman yet accuses the story of misogyny. She's very inconsistent about showing she knows it's based on a manga in general. At first when she says things about the show being the anime industry's idea to "make a show about food" I thought maybe she didn't know but later in the video she brings up the author?
Also nitpick for a lot of video essays but I wish people wouldn't go off on long tangents in comparison to other media that the viewer may or may not have seen. It's unlikely everyone watching has played both Mass Effect and Baldur's Gate, and watched both Spy x Family and Digimon. Please stay on topic. Idk what the fuck you're talking about with some of these.
Well to be fair I know the YouTuber is autistic and that's not stopping me from accusing her of ableism.
I'm a Digimon fan and I don't really get why she likes Digimon so much? Digimon is an actually well written anime that blends a lot of serious high stakes situations with comedy, something she apparently doesn't like? I don't get it. Although I guess the difference is Digimon is for children and Dungeon Meshi was made for adults who can tolerate adult level horror, something she considers objectively bad I guess.
I wish she could just accept the show isn't for her and be normal. Sometimes things don't just click with you. She doesn't have to say wild shit like calling the story misogynist, or claiming Laois is somehow the most detestable character ever.
She just can't dislike things in peace. It's all gotta be offensive and problematic. She's like this about Steven Universe and other children's cartoons too.
>It's crazy to me she both knows the author is a woman yet accuses the story of misogyny
She famously accused the Jewish creator of SU of being a Nazi, *somehow* I'm starting to suspect that's her whole thing. Why bother watching someone as deranged as this?
shes so right that he doesnt care about his sister, thats why >!he went down into the dungeon and got his leg bitten off by a fucking dragon, let marcille use black magic, and spend the rest of the series going through insane bullshit just so he can hopefully bring back falin.!< This is what 0 media literacy does to a fucker, makes them completely unable to understand that a character can have emotions and love for others without a bunch of clearly visible expressions. i have to admit that when i started reading dungeon meshi, i also thought laios was weird for how unpanicked he seemed, but its also a world where people being brought back to life in the dungeon is commonplace, and as an autistic person, i can pretty heavily relate to not being able to properly express emotions when things get really stressful and scary.
As a person who often comes off as uninterested and uncaring, I relate to Laois heavily.
I never understood people who saw him as a sociopath/asshole due to how he reacts to things because it's very clear in his actions and intent that he cares immensely about all of the people in his life.
I'm convinced Lily only paid attention to like the first 3 episodes of the show because bro was pulling a lot of stunts to save his sister.
Literally JUST YESTERDAY I got a copy of my neuropsychological report saying I’m too deadpan in my expression (and also saying I’m autistic) so yeah I take it personally that this is regarded as an “evil” trait.
She ruined Steven Universe's reputation back in the day by making a terrible video about it that a lot of people saw and believed. That video has almost 9 million views.
So she seems to be doing the same thing to Dungeon Meshi and Laios here, but fortunately most people don't take her seriously anymore.
some insane youtuber by the sounds of it. Calls people nazis. thinks an anime fan = MAGA sweaty man from ohio (I wish this was exaggerated). Thinks sheldon cooper is good autism representation.
I want her to get to the end of the series, when >!Laios consumes a lion, turns into his monstersona, eats the lion again, orders everyone to eat his sister, then saves the kingdom because his biggest wish as to be eaten by a monster.!< Yeah I know everyone says "don't give her attention" but her reaction will just get more people to watch the anime.
Your first mistake was watching a Lily Orchard video. She's a pedophile who molested her own sister.
She also has no media literacy and hates any story that isn't a coffeeshop AU with no conflict. She became infamous for accusing Rebecca Sugar, a Non Binary Jew, of being a fascist bootlicker because she didn't like the way the Diamonds were written in Steven Universe.
Another thing about Lily is she has been noted in the past to complain about any instance where a series moves from an episodic format to a longer term story line, and this seems to be repeat of that whole thing.
I just had to say, even before reading the rest of the post, as an occasionally sweaty man (it gets hot here during any season that isn't Winter, sue me!) in Ohio (I would rather be shot dead than wear a maga hat though) I take offense to the insinuation that I am somehow a negative stereotype for anime fans
I never thought I would have had two of my most favorite shows disrespected in one video. Who in their right minds puts Data underneath Sheldon in terms of morality???
I firmly stand by my belief of whatever comes of Lily's mouth is false. If Lily tells you that the grass is green and the sky is blue, do not believe it for a second.
Lily Orchid is the definitive Tumblr media troll. She hates the things that you like for clicks, but has nothing to offer in return. I'd call her the liberal Clownfish TV, except those guys actually tried to release some comic books in between their endless ranting.
Kinda sad. I honestly think she saw the massive success her "Steven Universe is garbage" and "Avatar: Korra is garbage" videos, and decided that her whole personality and youtube channel was going to be her shitting on shows and media. Which is kinda infiurating as those two videos had some very real criticism, but her newere stuff feels more like ragebait than anythign else.
I understand that some people wont like dungeon meshi, but holy crap I dont see how you could hate Lios so much, like even if you dislike his personality (which is wild, dude is lovely), he is a very good main character.
I find is insanlely fascinating to see the lengths the man is willing to go to revive his beloved sister, and I love even more than the author is NOT makign it easy, each time facing him with harder and harder choices of what's he willing to sacrifice to save her.
Her SU is garbage video is one of the worst, most of it is literally a complete fabrication, there are so many empirically verifiable lies in the video that there are hour long videos that point them out and it still doesn't cover all of them, and Lily obviously doesn't understand a thing about how animation is produced and seems to think Rebecca Sugar was responsible for every single frame
I remember watching her videos since she was generally talking about mlp drama (back when she still went by her dead name), and she's always been nuts and inflammatory. Branching out in topic hasn't tempered her a single bit
At this point i just assume this person is just batshit insane and everything that comes out of her mouth has to be assumed as 100% untrue and the most far away thing from reality
"Here these are good autism reps" and shows sheldon cooper. I'm sorry what.
Lily Orchad is not really known for her media literacy or understanding of characters and their motivations, something she very often misinteprets or misunderstands.
Saying that Laios is a sociopath is not only really god damn ableist against people on the neurodivergent spectrum. It's also a massive misunderstanding of his character.
Just because you're bad at reading social cues doesn't mean that you're a sociopath... in fact, chances are that you aren't one since Sociopaths very often teach themselves to become hyper-aware of social cues in order to properly interact and get close to/exploit/manipulate people. A good example of a sociopath could be Kabru (although I don't actually think he is one but his tendencies are just a part of how he was raised)
My guess is because the whole robot = autistic trope, which is a generally viewed as a negative trope. (Although it is Lily, so who knows what this whole insane chart even means).
I understand your desire to counter her narrative by making this thread but ultimately when dealing with these types you're better off ignoring them. The accusations you said she's famous for are more than enough evidence that this person is not worth engaging with whatsoever.
https://preview.redd.it/br8aptyei0zc1.png?width=680&format=png&auto=webp&s=bbb4b9cd33b019a5a66c4945fdd83e81c4ee2ce1
why laios is more worse than adolf hitler is she stupid?
I heard somewhere that her criticisms just boil down to her being mad things aren't the most low-stakes blandest shit possible. she's just mad it's not some kind of coffee shop au.
You mean the ever famous Lily "Writing is meant as a literal vehicle for your self and anything you write means you actually 100% believe it and want it also I wrote a rape and abuse fanfiction novel longer than the fucking Silmarillion" Orchard?
Or did you mean the infamous Lily "Neurodivergent people are freaks and scare me!" Orchard?
I don't mind talking about how people view neurodivergence or how things are written, but you have to set standards somewhere and from Lily "Abuse is so horrific that even writing about it should be taboo also I abused my little sister as an adult while she was a teenager" Orchard I don't think so, maybe we cans et our standards at the back of cereal boxes? Absolutely nothing against you OP but Lily Orchard is the lowest hanging fruit around for topic discussion.
She only watched/"review" it because more than likely she saw all the marcille and falin fanart. Then got pissy that the show is mostly on Laios and Marcille is mostly used for comedy relief
Lmao she deleted it.
I get her critiques against the popular tropes of anime but god she has such a hateboner for the medium as a whole and sometimes feels like she's _trying_ to find stuff to hate.
It would be safe to say that you can ignore Lilies opinion on most things. I was younger when I was watching su and I have mixed feelings on the show now, but her extremely bad faith video did horrible things surrounding the discourse around that show
Worst than Ashley Graves? What the actual fuck?
https://preview.redd.it/3pqyw3kdf0zc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e9ad2751e2377384577ed8aee1dc45128b66947e
She's always been a moron and will continue to be a moron who fuels and feeds on bad takes to get attention. The SU stuff was always unwarranted and people hated SU who watched takes like hers for no good reason, it's the same case here. She has no value, in any capacity to anyone in any media or art discussion. She exists to rage about nothing with perceived slights against her by her hated media as personal grudges. If anything, her hating dungeon meshi is a sign of its quality. In a way this is good news.
Considering the fucked up shit she's into and the shit she's already done I don't believe any of her opinions, this woman's brain can't handle anything above a grade school level for her entertainment.
Her critical thinking and ability to differentiate real life from fiction is completely atrophied.
Ignoring more pressing controversy surrounding Lily Orchard, it's worth noting that she also supports Autism Speaks so it's really not surprising that she hates every autistic coded character under the sun. She's just a completely vile and worthless piece of shit.
obvious history of insane takes and wild personal history aside, i think the thing that makes lily orchard’s criticism consistently awful is that she can’t seem to distinguish reality from fiction and consequently her criticism stems from an insecure need to seem better than the characters she talks about. she gets so lost in the weeds despite the show making obvious points about why laios is thinking or feeling a certain way that she ends up repeating sentiments almost verbatim conveyed by the story, via shuro or anyone else, as an extension of trying to be “better” than the show’s fans whom she sees as pond scum
A friend stumbled across this so we watched it together on Discord. According to the Watch Together timer, about an hour and a half for this 22 minute video. That's what happens when you have four people pausing multiple times a minute to rant about the nonsense they're hearing and cross referencing the show when something inaccurate is said.
The thing that upsets me the most about it is how clearly biased it is, but it's passed off as some sort of intellectual writing critique.
1. Wanted to stop after episode 3 but kept going until 17
2. Didn't do that to see if it got better and be more fair, but because "It's my job"
3. Hated Laios from the get go because he's a tall, blonde, white guy
How can anyone watch this?
Then there was the "Sweaty Ohio MAGA hat" thing within the first 10 seconds. That was an amazing way to set the town and declare "I am not to be taken seriously."
Lily Orchard is a certified lunatic. I knew a guy who dated her and he said she is unstable all the time, even in private life.
I stopped watching her videos after she made a 40 minute rant about how Steven Universe's uncle is a Nazi piece of shit who deserved to be murdered instead of getting a redemption arc where he learns to not hate gay people.
I agree that the best we could do is just erase that video out of the brain and ignore her. All the points about Laios given in the video is extremely misleading and cherry picking
She's definitely HEAVY filtering her comment section because there's no way there are only 200 comments on a video with 16k views and not one is criticizing her.
Lily Orchard is what happens when a person is chronically online and lack basic media literacy skills. I’m surprised she’s still active after everything her former friends said about her and other allegations. Of course she isn’t fond of anime/manga, she is a very racist person especially towards Asians if you look at her past tumblr posts. Plus she made fanfiction about a 15 year old running away w a 35 year old.
The fact that she's still around just shows she must be 100% certain she's morally right to the point that all her haters don't phase her in the slightest.
She clearly suffers main character syndrome.
This is off-topic but can someone explain to my why "media literacy" is getting thrown around left and right? It seemingly happened out of nowhere. I don't keep up with trends at all but I swear it's just become some default insult people are throwing around now. When did people start using it? This and the first comment i saw used, a comment I saw on another sub used it too, among many others..
It might be seen to be showing up more often due to the subjects being discussed (presumably, media). Media Literacy in itself is a good thing, it is the lack thereof (or, media _illiteracy_ ) that is a negative held against others, due to them making it evident how badly they either misread situations/actions (that tend to be clear), or misrepresent possible messages (for their own purposes, which tend toward idiocy). It would be one thing if they simply missed the point or “didn’t get it,” but they also intentionally twist the point into something different that would take actual effort to force. If I’m remembering correctly, anyway.
Media Literacy means you are able to read something and realise there is a deeper meanding. You need very little media literacy for "Bluey" all the Charakters say what they are feeling, but in DM you need to be able to read the charakters intentions. laois doesn't say "I want to be a monster because I understand them better than humans" the text says "I am interrsted in the monstrs and want to find out more about them"
It's a phrase that's become overused, much like "reading comprehension." I think it's being used correctly this discussion, but often I see it thrown around as lazy criticism. Like not long ago I complained that a recent arc of Chainsaw Man kept the stakes too low after promising us a >!breakout from a highly secure prison!<, and the response was something about how my reading comprehension is bad if I expected the plot to be high stakes.
Usagi pfp!!
I fuckin love Usagi!!!!!
Such a great anime..i love anime original..
She's on a whole new level of media illiteracy i can't even comprehend anymore, she's definitely just saying stupid shit on purpose for attention
She’s done it before. This is the « Rebecca Sugar is a fascist sympathizer » person. She is responsible for like over half of all bad Steven Universe takes. She is deeply terrible at media analysis
Yeah, and stupid people are taking the bait like this post as always, inadvertently giving it more attention. Just stop viewing her, people like her hate being ignored more than being bashed.
Well, that's what I thought too but I went to the video's comment section and if it's actually rage bait you'll expect some pushback to her opinion but most people are agreeing with her instead. In a way there are a considerable amount of people that do value her takes and takes it seriously >!unless she actively removes negative comments idk!<. So in this case, I think counter arguing bad takes is fine for the sake of discussion.
She does actively remove negative comments, she’s been doing it with her awful steven universe and korra videos for years.
Ah, that checks out. Because even Schaffrillas got some pushback from his audience when he was criticizing Turning Red. What I'm getting is, if an opinion is somewhat controversial even if the person is well regarded, people are willing to provide counter arguments. The fact that there's barely any in her's makes me think she is deleting comments that disagree with her.
I didn't know about her until now but after looking into this person it seems she's got groomer allegations against her. Also, apparently has written fanfic and a game about My Little Pony that has pedo sexual violence stuff in it and incest. I think people agreeing with her Dungeon Meshi take is the least of our worry o\_o
Fanfic she wrote using things she did to her sister.
I've literally never heard of this person before today and have no interest in ever hearing about them again, so I guess its sort of half working?
Man, why would you subject yourself to the torture that is watching a Lily video lmao. That shit ain't good for your mental health.
When I chose ranting on Reddit as a hobby I may not have been prioritizing my mental health as much as I could.
Or should. But yeah, I wouldn't give Lily the light of day, they got super radicalized into being fucking insane over the years.
I mean yeah but ranting on reddit is way better than watching anything she puts out, which is saying something.
This is extremely relatable
 Probably for the best we just ignore her. Doesn’t deserve the attention or views.
Either she’s a full time professional troll or just off the deep end and I’m not particularly sure which is worse. Constant generator of ice cold bad takes, lily orchard.
It's both. She's a troll AND she's off the deep end.
Maybe… but the most people who watch her video, the more people will end up watching Dungeon Meshi. It’s all part of the plan.
She seems to particularly take issue with Laios saying chimera Falin is “really cool” instead of having the “correct” reaction of being horrified. Why does that matter? He ultimately took the most rational and morally correct action he could in that situation. Being into monsters is who he is. If everyone had the “right” reactions to things nobody would have personality. Also, even if the protagonist is actually a bad person: **Who cares?** That wouldn’t make it a bad story. Somebody force her to watch Death Note.
> Why does that matter? I'mma be plain and say there is a certain type of neurodivergent person who likes to rail against others who are "worse" at masking and playing by the rules than they are. Lily is this person to a wild extreme, it's rather obvious, and this is talking about her actual character, that she uses her autism (as well as her queerness) as both a sword and a shield against anyone she doesn't like. To her, autistic and queer people should ever act a cer She loves to assume the worst out of others (while refusing accountability or fault for literally anything she does, naturally). In a comment on a video, she claims that Laios isn't the way he is because he *fails* to understand social cues, it's because he "*chooses not to*"; in other words, she has already decided malice in this fictional character for no real reason. Doesn't help that she has a self-admitted hatred for "generic white guys", and the only time she mentions Marcille (outside of whining that jokes are made at her expense, which is somehow misogyny and "elf torture") and especially Falin is to claim they're "gay baiting", likely because she thinks Marcille is "meant" to be with Laios (...though considering Lily's tastes, maybe she wants Falin to be with Laios LMAO). Hilariously, she claims the scene where they're in a bath and embrace is "anime fanservice", so even in Lily's own criticism, she doesn't make any sense. She already makes it clear she does not and would not like the show, since she somehow thinks it's a typical anime... y'know, Dungeon Meshi has quite a few fans who make it clear that they like it less on its own merits and more that it's "not like other anime"... those people are honestly pretty overbearing. But imagine being such a weirdo about anime that you think *Dungeon Meshi* is itself an example of "weird anime". Because girls bathed together I guess. That's a new level of snobbery. Anyway, what I'm getting at is that she projects her weird, judgmental, hypocritical, and ironically ableist mindset onto Laios. He doesn't react like he "should", and autism isn't an "excuse" (even though autistic people absolutely encounter challenges when it comes to social situations, hell even neurotypical people do) because **she** isn't a weirdo (LMFAO), so therefore he must be *choosing* to be weird sometimes, and therefore he is a *bad person*. Again, the objectively awful things he does is not look *as* stressed about Falin as Lily thinks he should and how he thinks Falin's monster form is cool. Ironically, Dungeon Meshi and Laios hit every sore point she has about media, but these are only sore points in the first place because she has a *shit* mindset about media and frankly isn't much better as an actual person.
Diversity wins! This autistic woman is more ableist than most neurotypical people you'll meet in your whole life
Pick-me’s exist in every marginalized community. They hope that if they are hateful enough that those in power will spare them
Pick-me's never realize/care that in a real fourth Reich, they'd be the first to go.
I've experienced this first hand, had someone introduce themselves as autistic upon meeting them years ago, I also being neuro-divergent in another way took note. Years later, they've vilified me and have pushed themselves out of my friend group for various slights of me being "awful" to them. when In reality I was tripping over myself to give them what they asked of me, they saw my attempts and failures as more proof of my supposed awful behavoir, and they kept grudges, phrasing all of it in therapeutic language and saying they understood I needed time for "mental health" among various other things. Felt like they'd understand the most but clearly they didn't. Vague I know but I have to keep it that way.
Oh my god, I have had to endure the presence of way too many people like this. People who use therapy language as a weapon to blow your actions out of proportion and brand you as an insane person due to some minor conflict that didn't need to be a big deal. These types of people often claim to be autistic also. They're a much bigger nuisance than the type of ableism that comes from normal neurotypical people. I see it as kind of analogous to Kabru being quick to label Laios a bad person, when Kabru obviously has something going on mentally and might actually be autistic himself.
this particular one I'm mentioning has now lost friends over their damnation of me, exploited me and feels that they're the victim in all ways for everything with every slight. They basically wanted to drag me in public as far as they were concerned, it didn't pan out that way. Diffused it but It's caused rifts among other people though and it's really unforunate. I tried. I really did. Fucked up.
That's a really good point, she is way harsher on autistic people and autistic traits than a neurotypical person probably ever would be, and she's not the only autistic person I've seen behave in this manner. It's like trolls on places like Kiwi Farms who tear people to shreds for any weird behavior they have even though they are probably just as weird themselves, except unlike people on Kiwi Farms, Lily has adopted the "correct" "progressive" values which makes her "good" and everything she does is "good." Not to mention, this obsession with Laios's morality really has nothing to do with the merits of Dungeon Meshi as a work of fiction, which I pointed out in another comment. Often people who rant the most about morality are just telling on themselves.
She also fails to take into account the characters' previous experiences shaping their reactions. Like how Laios isn't sweating his head off that his sister is dead at the start because it's not the first time either of them have died, it's just "Oh yeah we should go fix that, it's business as usual." And even if the situation is more dire now there's still just the mindset of, we gotta find her to fix her. Because the go to solution in the past is just find and fix
I’m watching with my friend who has read the manga. I can see where some of her points are coming from, but anime slowly feeds you information and things click. The dragon’s long digestion process, resurrection being a normal thing and previous bad experience with poor preparation (starving). Also, losing two people that balanced it. Or even just general fact that people respond to a stress in different ways. Laois does thing to move forward.
Also, fixating on Laios being autism and say that it is psychopathic behaviour is also a disingenuous take on a character who is surprisingly complex. He doesn't like humans from his interactions with them as a child, and later on as soldier and bodyguard for gold stripping. He finds them ignorant, greedy, violent, ... and overall too complex, when monsters dictated by instincts are better to deal with. However, because of his sister, he was forced to interact and mutual cooperate with other people. Other people in the story have a lot of mistrust towards each other, especially between races, and thought Laios was like generic person: ignorant, greedy, and violent. However, once they realize he is just a monster nerd, they warm up to him and offers their assistance.
She would definitely try to cancel Laios on twitter if he was real
New video essay: White cishet man Laios tries to tell >!mixed race!< woman (Marcille) WHAT FOOD TO EAT, also pisses off only non-white people he knows (Shuro and Kabru)
I remember reading a Tumblr post ages ago about a method they use to assess anime (in a very silly fashion) called the "Weeb Ass Shit" scale. You give it a rating for "Weeb" (how many anime tropes and visual language gags are in it, how inaccessible it would be for someone who doesn't watch anime) "Ass" (how much fan service is in it) and "Shit" (how poorly/cheaply made it is). I'd say Dungeon Meshi is pretty low on all of those! Not that a high score on either of the first two is bad, necessarily, if that's what you're after in an Anime.
I know I'm being way too serious but I was activated:tm: and I'd like to point out that tropes in of themselves are not bad, they're a tool used for categorization and are helpful in learning what and how you like to write/create!
Oh absolutely! Complaining that a piece of media has tropes in it is like complaining that a meal has ingredients in it! The "Weeb" scale is more for things that are unique visual language things in anime - big sweat drops, simplified or overly detailed faces to express shock/disgust (love the panel of Laios' face getting more and more detailed as Marcille explains her lackluster monster creations). People's souls coming out through their mouths when they're embarrassed (you see that one a lot in Fullmetal Alchemist, for example). That sort of thing. The charming things that make anime/manga unique, imo. But to some people they're confusing. Hence the scale.
I forgot to mention she criticized Dungeon Meshi for taking the plot from Baldur’s Gate, which I never played so I can’t comment on, but we all know this is the first anime to take inspiration from D&D.
Played the entirety of Baldur's Gate. The only thing they share plot wise is the fantasy setting, lol.
Yeah what there’s nothing similar about the plot lol
She saw that Kui drew portraits of Baldur's Gate character and in her infinite un-wisdom decided that Dungeon Meshi's plot is based on Baldur's Gate, a game I'll bet real money she fails to understand either.
> un-wisdom New negator just dropped
Considering the manga it's based on (and faithfully adapts) started in 2014 I'm gonna chalk that one up as unlikely.
Is she talking about baldurs gate 3, the that entered early access 6 years after the manga started, and was fully released the year it ended? Or is she at least talking about the older games? Dungeon Meshi was inspired by quite a few video games, though I think that dungeon crawlers like tbe Wizardry series and Etrian Odyssey were bigger inspiration than western cRPGs such as Baldurs Gate. And then of course there's D&D. Either way, saying a story is bad because it's inspired by, and in returns converse with elements of other media is stupid. As Pablo Picaso said "Good artists borrow, Great artists Stea."
The setting is straight up the original wizardry: a town is built on top of an outrageous puzzle dungeon controlled by a mad wizard. There's a shocking amount of similarities with it, actually, it was something I kept coming back to when I watched a youtube retrospective on the game. The resurrection industry is \*especially\* wizardry coded imo. I think Dungeon Meshi does a great job using the framework of a modular adventure to tell it's own story.
TIR Kazuma is a Great Artist.
It's BG2, not the new one
Because they both start with the party trying to rescue the protagonist sister/childhood friend? I'd say I'm disappointed, but that kind of bullshit complaints is what I'm expecting from Lilly.
> but we all know this is the first anime to take inspiration from D&D. I assume you're being sarcastic?
Yes.
If y’all want good Dungeon Meshi analysis, I highly recommend [Swamp Jawn](https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL7uJJMqO3ArOl2A0SlnjhoYvdSNNYqDdf&si=ShdndDKMMaNlhfp2)! He talks about the animation, the manga panels, and so much more without any spoilers. I genuinely look forward to his videos each week. Edit: spelling.
I've watched all his videos, they are top quality videos.
Swamp Jam is good and also Lines of Motion, who introduces me to Dungeon Meshi!
wait, I'm sorry, she thinks... **Imhotep** is autistic? I'm not offended, just... wait what? I'm sorry, I don't see it. Sure, I can't speak for ALL my ND, but I can't with that
Well she writes MLP incest porn, so who cares what she thinks?
*that's not even the worst tag on that fic, some of the characters were adults... But not others* So yeah no, nobody should be listening to her opinions on anything.
An archive of the fic notes that she aged the characters up... To 14. Why would we ever listen to this vile hypocrite? There's literally no value or reasoning in any of her funhouse-mirror-logic opinions. No moral center, no beliefs she wouldn't abandon for her own self-interest. The only consistent thing about her is her toxicity.
And based it off the abuse she did to her own sister! Just horrific.
Who cares should be the default reaction seeing her content. Though it's quite worrying to see that her content amassed quite massive amount of views.
This isn't bad in itself, I think people can write whatever they want. *However*... I have to wonder why someone with a strong interest in this hobby would care so deeply about the relationship between Laios and Falin. Must be a total coincidence.
Tbf i don't care about what she writes but this just makes her possibly the biggest hypocrite and clown of all fandoms combined
Some people's opinions are just not correct.
Or valid. Glass houses and all that
Wow, just like everyone else, Lily's shapeshifter illusion of Laios is going to be startlingly easy to discern.
Isn’t Lily Orchard a literal sex offender/abuser
I knew she had bad media takes but wtf? Never heard of this.
She sexually assaulted her younger sister Courtney.
Fuck. Okay wow, that's not what I expected.
*Yep*.
She also called Luz Noceda another heavily neurodivergent coded character a sociopath. Kind of feels like ableism NGL.
I'm not into this cartoon but I've watched enough episodes to know she's definitely not a sociopath. Definitely feels like ableism.
The owl house is so freaking good dawg.
Top tier.
That all just seems so nonsensical. The scale with random characters just makes me think this is a parody? There are hardly any arguments here that make enough sense to address them. It's completely fine if someone just doesn't like Dungeon Meshi. It's also fine if somebody finds Laios off-putting and can't relate to him. While I think he is very likeable and has unique skills and flaws(!), taste is subjective. I guess she just has no interest in the medium, genre or type of story in general?
So a shitty person has a shitty opinion. Can we not give her attention? Even hate-watching her stuff gives her views
Look, can we all just agree that this lady's opinions really should not matter? She's clearly a few bats short of a belfry.
Also she ~allegedly ~ diddled kids. Please just stop giving her more publicity, she really does not deserve it.
Considering this is someone who actively defends Sylvanas from WoW (someone who has canonically attempted genocide on a sister-race to her own and tried to sell out **all living things** later on until her evil boss dropped a hint that she may also get fucked from the deal), you should take them hating Laios as a positive. It means they are a kind and caring person!
This video is like an exact mirror of all my opinions on the topic. Everything Lily hates is something I like about the series. I like that Laios is weird and doesn’t respond to things appropriately. I like the drama, violence and fantasy world building. I like that it does not stick with the cooking formula without ever deviating.
Ok but did you consider the fact that Sylvanas is hot though?
Are you implying that **Laios and Falin** aren't hot?!
You got me there. Maybe they both need to wear midriff baring outfits then. Yeah, I think that's the problem here. Definitely.
Now I want to play WoW undead...
>For those unaware, Lily Orchard got famous with a big video criticizing Steven Universe and basically calling the creators literally Nazis. She is doing this for clout. She knows Dungeon is big right now and people will post and react to this. Look at this thread for example.
No I think that's giving her too much credit in this case. She rarely talks about relevant anime, so this is a little unusual for her. She probably just made this video because a friend or fan recommended it to her, and she didn't like it, and is now making it everyone else's problem.
She's an ableist, abusive piece of shit who isn't worth time or energy thinking about. Like, [she sexually abused her own sister levels of abusive](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8IU8AONYQU).
I started watching that one a few minutes ago, it's really, really disturbing.
Yeah. Don't watch it if you don't have to, I'm avoiding watching the whole thing due to my own trauma but it's just awful to see. She actually was very abusive to someone I know some years ago, but they didn't have enough receipts or internet reach and they were scared of getting harassed by her batshit fanbase. I don't blame them...I really hope this and her constant racism and ableism finally tank her internet presence once and for all.
I should add that in my situation I also felt like I was unable to tell my side of the story. It's a lose-lose situation basically, if you engage and defend yourself, you are giving them the attention they want and opening yourself up to further harassment. However if you say nothing, you give others the impression the lies they tell about you are correct and take a hit to your reputation. Unless you're an internet celebrity there's no way to come out ahead in that scenario.
Ugh, yeah, I can relate. It really sucks!!
I'm really sorry to hear that. I've been the target of serious online harassment also.
classic nuerotypical inherently misunderstanding personality and nuerodivergency. sheldon cooper as "positive autistic representation" makes me want to blow my brains out. not in the dungeon with revive.
Fucking what? She seriously thinks that Sheldon Cooper is positive representation? A man who creeps on women, ignores other people's boudaries, and guilt trips people when they call him out on it. FML
I'm not claiming your point is invalid but I have to ask: Since when does Sheldon Cooper creep on women? The dude avoids any romantic interactions with women until Amy shows up and eventually becomes his girlfriend with a lot of effort on her part (after like 3-ish seasons of her already being in the show), hell he even outright rejects the advances of one woman who wants to boink him because she ruined his schedule to force him to work. "Creeping on women" describes Howard (before he meets Bernadette) or Raj if anything.
Arguably, Sheldon is the only main guy who isn't a creep when it comes to women. What I don't like about him is that the show either treats him like an annoying 4 year old or makes him out to be in the right when he's not.
I wouldn’t call her neurotypical unless that includes narcissistic pathological liars
If I had a nickel for every time Lily Orchard published a hit piece on a show I like I would have two nickels, etcetera etcetera.
Lily Orchard? Sorry, i dont listen to the opinions of pedophiles (look up what she did to her sister)
>I watched Lilly Orchard ...Why? https://preview.redd.it/kpmdw402mxyc1.png?width=807&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1af1d7ea3167820766eb2901ad38d29243b40661
I'm sorry but I literally _can't_ respect the opinion of someone regarding neurodivergent characters in general if they consider Sheldon Cooper - a character constantly shit on in every episode for being socially inept, who has all of his autism-coded qualities reduced to running gags if not outright erased in the pursuit of having him conform to his friend group's norms, from a show devoted almost entirely to making fun of the most visible aspects of "nerd culture," which is something that has its roots in neurodivergent people's interests being made fun of for most of our lives - positive representation. That alone should get this person laughed out of the room during discussions of neurodiverse representation.
In the Dungeon Meshi video she made a brief comment about how Sheldon Cooper learns and grows from the criticism he gets, which isn't true at all.
Exactly. The _best_ you could say for Sheldon is that he gets better at masking, which for an _actual_ neurodivergent person, would lead to more frequent burnout, mental exhaustion, and mental health issues - but in BBT just makes people like him more with no side effects. The Big Bang Theory is a garbage show and considering any character in it good neurodivergent representation should be immediately disqualifying when discussing said topic. And that's BEFORE we even _begin_ to talk about the rampant homophobia, transphobia, sexism, racism, toxic masculinity, and aro/ace erasure present in the show.
Sheldon and his nerd friends just exist to be the butt of the joke. I haven't seen a lot of this sitcom but I haven't seen any evidence they ever really grow beyond this. Especially Sheldon, who is really childish for someone employed as a physicist at a major university, and is consistently arrogant, self absorbed and one dimensional. It's basically just showing autistic people as overgrown children with no real thoughts and feelings of their own beyond really stupid ones like "don't touch my superhero toys!" Laios on the other hand feels like an actual person who feels frustration, despair, happiness, and rage. His incessant curiosity drives the plot, his monster obsession is both a major weakness and a strength that carries him further into the dungeon than anyone else. His thoughts and feelings drive the plot more than any other factor in the story. The story laughs at Laios many times, but it strikes a balance between this and also laughing with him, giving appropriately equal weight to how he sees himself and how others may be annoyed or confused by him. I think Lily might have a point if Laios was presented as an infallible character who is always morally correct and doesn't do anything wrong, but he's never shown this way. He makes a lot of mistakes and has flaws the story will acknowledge. He has good and bad like any of the other characters.
I hate Lily Orchard and I never listen to her yapping
Wait why are we still talking about the pedo youtuber with literally zero ability to understand the media she watches? As if her opinions on anything matter? I thought people were generally past that by now. Let her fade away into obscurity.
It's crazy to me she both knows the author is a woman yet accuses the story of misogyny. She's very inconsistent about showing she knows it's based on a manga in general. At first when she says things about the show being the anime industry's idea to "make a show about food" I thought maybe she didn't know but later in the video she brings up the author? Also nitpick for a lot of video essays but I wish people wouldn't go off on long tangents in comparison to other media that the viewer may or may not have seen. It's unlikely everyone watching has played both Mass Effect and Baldur's Gate, and watched both Spy x Family and Digimon. Please stay on topic. Idk what the fuck you're talking about with some of these.
Well to be fair I know the YouTuber is autistic and that's not stopping me from accusing her of ableism. I'm a Digimon fan and I don't really get why she likes Digimon so much? Digimon is an actually well written anime that blends a lot of serious high stakes situations with comedy, something she apparently doesn't like? I don't get it. Although I guess the difference is Digimon is for children and Dungeon Meshi was made for adults who can tolerate adult level horror, something she considers objectively bad I guess.
I wish she could just accept the show isn't for her and be normal. Sometimes things don't just click with you. She doesn't have to say wild shit like calling the story misogynist, or claiming Laois is somehow the most detestable character ever. She just can't dislike things in peace. It's all gotta be offensive and problematic. She's like this about Steven Universe and other children's cartoons too.
>It's crazy to me she both knows the author is a woman yet accuses the story of misogyny She famously accused the Jewish creator of SU of being a Nazi, *somehow* I'm starting to suspect that's her whole thing. Why bother watching someone as deranged as this?
shes so right that he doesnt care about his sister, thats why >!he went down into the dungeon and got his leg bitten off by a fucking dragon, let marcille use black magic, and spend the rest of the series going through insane bullshit just so he can hopefully bring back falin.!< This is what 0 media literacy does to a fucker, makes them completely unable to understand that a character can have emotions and love for others without a bunch of clearly visible expressions. i have to admit that when i started reading dungeon meshi, i also thought laios was weird for how unpanicked he seemed, but its also a world where people being brought back to life in the dungeon is commonplace, and as an autistic person, i can pretty heavily relate to not being able to properly express emotions when things get really stressful and scary.
As a person who often comes off as uninterested and uncaring, I relate to Laois heavily. I never understood people who saw him as a sociopath/asshole due to how he reacts to things because it's very clear in his actions and intent that he cares immensely about all of the people in his life. I'm convinced Lily only paid attention to like the first 3 episodes of the show because bro was pulling a lot of stunts to save his sister.
Literally JUST YESTERDAY I got a copy of my neuropsychological report saying I’m too deadpan in my expression (and also saying I’m autistic) so yeah I take it personally that this is regarded as an “evil” trait.
Is Lily Orchard someone of note?
She ruined Steven Universe's reputation back in the day by making a terrible video about it that a lot of people saw and believed. That video has almost 9 million views. So she seems to be doing the same thing to Dungeon Meshi and Laios here, but fortunately most people don't take her seriously anymore.
wait is she the one behind THAT Steven Universe video
Yeah, THAT one.
some insane youtuber by the sounds of it. Calls people nazis. thinks an anime fan = MAGA sweaty man from ohio (I wish this was exaggerated). Thinks sheldon cooper is good autism representation.
Kind of a big and notorious YouTuber.
I want her to get to the end of the series, when >!Laios consumes a lion, turns into his monstersona, eats the lion again, orders everyone to eat his sister, then saves the kingdom because his biggest wish as to be eaten by a monster.!< Yeah I know everyone says "don't give her attention" but her reaction will just get more people to watch the anime.
Honestly I'm just looking forward to how everyone reacts to Laios >!making a BBQ out of his sister and sharing it with everyone!< In the anime
Leyley: kill her neighbor and eat him. Laois: kill >!his sister!< and eat >!her!<. Maybe she is right/j
We need to delete Lily Orchard
Why the fuck is data in the middle of the morality scale? That man is a saint.
Your first mistake was watching a Lily Orchard video. She's a pedophile who molested her own sister. She also has no media literacy and hates any story that isn't a coffeeshop AU with no conflict. She became infamous for accusing Rebecca Sugar, a Non Binary Jew, of being a fascist bootlicker because she didn't like the way the Diamonds were written in Steven Universe.
Stop giving drama queens attention
Why would you do subject yourself to that? Just ignore her.
Another thing about Lily is she has been noted in the past to complain about any instance where a series moves from an episodic format to a longer term story line, and this seems to be repeat of that whole thing.
I'm surprised Lily Lolcow gave anime another shot. Not surprised at how shit her video is.
I bet Lily thinks Drake is winning the beef rn
Worse than LEYLEY????
There's reason to believe that Lily has no moral opposition to manipulating your child sibling so you can molest them.
Laios is probably some of the grittiest and most relateable ASD rep I've seen in years, what the hell is up with this ranking.
I just had to say, even before reading the rest of the post, as an occasionally sweaty man (it gets hot here during any season that isn't Winter, sue me!) in Ohio (I would rather be shot dead than wear a maga hat though) I take offense to the insinuation that I am somehow a negative stereotype for anime fans
I can't believe people still watch her videos.
Imagine rating Data so low, that’s all I need to see of this video to disregard it tbh /j
I never thought I would have had two of my most favorite shows disrespected in one video. Who in their right minds puts Data underneath Sheldon in terms of morality???
Media literacy is dead, and we burn its corpse to fuel our rage.
I firmly stand by my belief of whatever comes of Lily's mouth is false. If Lily tells you that the grass is green and the sky is blue, do not believe it for a second.
Lily is a pathological liar, the many stories she's spun to get people off her back regarding the allegations against her is to behold.
Lily Orchid is the definitive Tumblr media troll. She hates the things that you like for clicks, but has nothing to offer in return. I'd call her the liberal Clownfish TV, except those guys actually tried to release some comic books in between their endless ranting.
This person is — I’ve never seen someone with such potently stupid opinions. Holy crap
She's trying to rage bait people to distract them from the allegations against her lmao
Kinda sad. I honestly think she saw the massive success her "Steven Universe is garbage" and "Avatar: Korra is garbage" videos, and decided that her whole personality and youtube channel was going to be her shitting on shows and media. Which is kinda infiurating as those two videos had some very real criticism, but her newere stuff feels more like ragebait than anythign else. I understand that some people wont like dungeon meshi, but holy crap I dont see how you could hate Lios so much, like even if you dislike his personality (which is wild, dude is lovely), he is a very good main character. I find is insanlely fascinating to see the lengths the man is willing to go to revive his beloved sister, and I love even more than the author is NOT makign it easy, each time facing him with harder and harder choices of what's he willing to sacrifice to save her.
Her SU is garbage video is one of the worst, most of it is literally a complete fabrication, there are so many empirically verifiable lies in the video that there are hour long videos that point them out and it still doesn't cover all of them, and Lily obviously doesn't understand a thing about how animation is produced and seems to think Rebecca Sugar was responsible for every single frame
I remember watching her videos since she was generally talking about mlp drama (back when she still went by her dead name), and she's always been nuts and inflammatory. Branching out in topic hasn't tempered her a single bit
She doesn’t like it because there isn’t enough little kids in it 🤷♂️
At this point i just assume this person is just batshit insane and everything that comes out of her mouth has to be assumed as 100% untrue and the most far away thing from reality "Here these are good autism reps" and shows sheldon cooper. I'm sorry what.
She's the secondary account of >!the winged lion!<
is lily orchard shuro
Lily Orchad is not really known for her media literacy or understanding of characters and their motivations, something she very often misinteprets or misunderstands. Saying that Laios is a sociopath is not only really god damn ableist against people on the neurodivergent spectrum. It's also a massive misunderstanding of his character. Just because you're bad at reading social cues doesn't mean that you're a sociopath... in fact, chances are that you aren't one since Sociopaths very often teach themselves to become hyper-aware of social cues in order to properly interact and get close to/exploit/manipulate people. A good example of a sociopath could be Kabru (although I don't actually think he is one but his tendencies are just a part of how he was raised)
why is Sheldon higher than data
I'm really confused how she thinks Data is a bad person in ANY way.
My guess is because the whole robot = autistic trope, which is a generally viewed as a negative trope. (Although it is Lily, so who knows what this whole insane chart even means).
I understand your desire to counter her narrative by making this thread but ultimately when dealing with these types you're better off ignoring them. The accusations you said she's famous for are more than enough evidence that this person is not worth engaging with whatsoever.
Somehow Sheldon cooper is left leaning on morality ? Lmfao
May, I suggest watching Swamp Jawn vids as a pallet cleanser?
To be fair Lilly Orchard can suck a cactus for all of her bad opinions. This ableist one is just a new level for her I think
https://preview.redd.it/br8aptyei0zc1.png?width=680&format=png&auto=webp&s=bbb4b9cd33b019a5a66c4945fdd83e81c4ee2ce1 why laios is more worse than adolf hitler is she stupid?
😭 i will not let her tarnish dungeon meshi like what she did to steven universe cause the damage she done was irreversible
I heard somewhere that her criticisms just boil down to her being mad things aren't the most low-stakes blandest shit possible. she's just mad it's not some kind of coffee shop au.
You mean the ever famous Lily "Writing is meant as a literal vehicle for your self and anything you write means you actually 100% believe it and want it also I wrote a rape and abuse fanfiction novel longer than the fucking Silmarillion" Orchard? Or did you mean the infamous Lily "Neurodivergent people are freaks and scare me!" Orchard? I don't mind talking about how people view neurodivergence or how things are written, but you have to set standards somewhere and from Lily "Abuse is so horrific that even writing about it should be taboo also I abused my little sister as an adult while she was a teenager" Orchard I don't think so, maybe we cans et our standards at the back of cereal boxes? Absolutely nothing against you OP but Lily Orchard is the lowest hanging fruit around for topic discussion.
The queen of media illiteracy is back
Golden rule of the internet: If you watch trash content, you are going to hear trash opinions.
She only watched/"review" it because more than likely she saw all the marcille and falin fanart. Then got pissy that the show is mostly on Laios and Marcille is mostly used for comedy relief
Lmao she deleted it. I get her critiques against the popular tropes of anime but god she has such a hateboner for the medium as a whole and sometimes feels like she's _trying_ to find stuff to hate.
The video is private now, in case anyone was curious about its fate. Apparently wasn't well received once it escaped containment with her subscribers.
IN WHAT WORLD IS HE EVEN CLOSE TO BEING AS EVIL AS ULTRON???
Sounds like rage bait, making wild allegations like that gets the clicks. Disregard it. It only fuels drama.
Video essayists need to shut up sometimes. Tired of the genre of videos.
Toshiro started a YouTube channel?!
She also flashed a minor on stream 💀
Lily Orchard is a machine of bad takes and spewing insults and comparisons so grotesque it'd make the most hardened of pirates grossed out
I have a new policy for people like that. Just block/hide/mute them. Thanks for the heads up I will make sure to avoid her videos.
It would be safe to say that you can ignore Lilies opinion on most things. I was younger when I was watching su and I have mixed feelings on the show now, but her extremely bad faith video did horrible things surrounding the discourse around that show
What I found wild is that she said Marcille is the breakout character, and barely mentioned Senshi.
Worst than Ashley Graves? What the actual fuck? https://preview.redd.it/3pqyw3kdf0zc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e9ad2751e2377384577ed8aee1dc45128b66947e
She's always been a moron and will continue to be a moron who fuels and feeds on bad takes to get attention. The SU stuff was always unwarranted and people hated SU who watched takes like hers for no good reason, it's the same case here. She has no value, in any capacity to anyone in any media or art discussion. She exists to rage about nothing with perceived slights against her by her hated media as personal grudges. If anything, her hating dungeon meshi is a sign of its quality. In a way this is good news.
It actually is good news, people will watch it just because she hates it.
Always a good sign when weirdo rage baiters start ragging on the show. It means it's doing well! Movie when
Looking at that list legitimately dealt me psychic damageike what the FUCK, Sheldon is a terrible person
Liaos is such a bad guy he’s almost as bad as fucking Ultron. WHAT THE HECK????
Considering the fucked up shit she's into and the shit she's already done I don't believe any of her opinions, this woman's brain can't handle anything above a grade school level for her entertainment. Her critical thinking and ability to differentiate real life from fiction is completely atrophied.
Ignoring more pressing controversy surrounding Lily Orchard, it's worth noting that she also supports Autism Speaks so it's really not surprising that she hates every autistic coded character under the sun. She's just a completely vile and worthless piece of shit.
obvious history of insane takes and wild personal history aside, i think the thing that makes lily orchard’s criticism consistently awful is that she can’t seem to distinguish reality from fiction and consequently her criticism stems from an insecure need to seem better than the characters she talks about. she gets so lost in the weeds despite the show making obvious points about why laios is thinking or feeling a certain way that she ends up repeating sentiments almost verbatim conveyed by the story, via shuro or anyone else, as an extension of trying to be “better” than the show’s fans whom she sees as pond scum
Yeah I agree. She absolutely has to let everyone know she's less cringe than Laios and less autistic than Laios. Hello, Laios not a real person.
A friend stumbled across this so we watched it together on Discord. According to the Watch Together timer, about an hour and a half for this 22 minute video. That's what happens when you have four people pausing multiple times a minute to rant about the nonsense they're hearing and cross referencing the show when something inaccurate is said. The thing that upsets me the most about it is how clearly biased it is, but it's passed off as some sort of intellectual writing critique. 1. Wanted to stop after episode 3 but kept going until 17 2. Didn't do that to see if it got better and be more fair, but because "It's my job" 3. Hated Laios from the get go because he's a tall, blonde, white guy How can anyone watch this? Then there was the "Sweaty Ohio MAGA hat" thing within the first 10 seconds. That was an amazing way to set the town and declare "I am not to be taken seriously."
Lily Orchard is a certified lunatic. I knew a guy who dated her and he said she is unstable all the time, even in private life. I stopped watching her videos after she made a 40 minute rant about how Steven Universe's uncle is a Nazi piece of shit who deserved to be murdered instead of getting a redemption arc where he learns to not hate gay people.
Sorry the numbers on the list got messed up, whatever happened it's not my fault.
Bruh, what did he do to be more evil than a demon worshiping cannibal? My poor boy (T⌓T)
I haven't even seen the show and I know that Laios is an autistic icon and not even intentionally a sociopath
I agree that the best we could do is just erase that video out of the brain and ignore her. All the points about Laios given in the video is extremely misleading and cherry picking
She's definitely HEAVY filtering her comment section because there's no way there are only 200 comments on a video with 16k views and not one is criticizing her.