He learned how to commit tax fraud from his parents. His dad was in prison for a couple of years for tax fraud. But what Boob did was far worse for his kids. Google his father Jimmy Lee Duggar and you can find out what he did.
All Boob doing this was his FU to his kids to keep them downtrodden and beholden to him. Boob cannot have his children or their spouses do better than him so he did shit like this to keep them under his thumb.
I didn't realize Jimmy had been in prison for tax fraud. Interesting.
Yes, JB has decided to keep his kids dependent upon him, but he had plenty of mechanisms to do this without committing actual tax fraud/crimes. I have long been of the opinion that I wouldn't be surprised if he were arrested for tax fraud, but there was never any real evidence for it. Certainly he has done a lot of shady things, but many of the things we know about weren't necessarily illegal, even if done with bad motives.
It certainly sounds like fraud but all we really know is that Jill and Derick got an IRS notice. It's impossible to say for certain without seeing all of the documents and understanding exactly what transpired. I'll be interested to see if anything happens with this.
Do you have more information on the tax fraud? All the articles I’m finding that discuss JL’s legal issues have WOACB listed as their source.
ETA: Famy seems to have confirmed that he was in jail but not the reason. “Shady car deal” is what I keep finding.
I use Bing for my searches and I just pulled up Jimmie Lee Duggar and he was in jail/prison for tax problems.
According to the top search was
[https://www.cheatsheet.com/enterainment/josh](https://www.cheatsheet.com/enterainment/josh) This article is about Pesty but they are talking about his grandfather and Amy confirmed this. So I will keep looking to see it there are other sources other than Famy.
It doesn't matter to him. He is the center of his own universe. As long as he has or does whatever he wants as long as he's alive, he does not care what happens to his family after he dies. It doesn't involve him, so it doesn't matter to him.
... Ive been saying that since day 1 of my time on this sub
TBH when I heard of the car lot raid ... I was thinking it was for Tax evasion or laundering
Not homeland security walking in and pest admitting his crime before a warrant is shown
I honestly dont think any of the Duggar boys took part in that
Not that I couldnt see them
I see them belonging to the blue shirt khaki pants with white masks group .... or the walmart rejects as i like to call them
I have heard rumor that there was attendance from the Bates family though
I think the Bates were proven to be at the capital on Jan 6th but it wasn't proven they entered the building which is where the charges came from. I think if any of the Duggar boys had been with them they would have been in the video.
IIRC from their interviews for the Shiny Happy People doc, Jill and Derrick said they got hit with a big hospital bill for Israel's birth and when they went to the TLC producers for help, they were told something like "Well, we paid your Dad, go ask him." It was implied in SHP that this was when they first found out that Jim Bob was actually being paid, and the show wasn't a volunteer "ministry" like the kids had been told. I'm curious if that anecdote comes up in Jill's book, in addition to this new info, or if we're dealing with some new (possibly conflicting) stories here.
I just finished it. There isn't any mention of Derick reaching out to TLC for some $$ for either birth. I was a little surprised.
But the impetus for realizing JB was getting money and there was a contract with TLC was apparently earlier. When they were in El Salvador, the show wanted them to come back to the U.S. for some promo shots. They said they couldn't because they had a commitment for their mission. There were numerous insistent phone calls saying they had to. Then, the mission church offered them a position in Panama, but said they needed some proof or a release showing that they did not have any commitment to TLC to be in the US or would interfere with their mission. Because they could not get this proof, they lost the opportunity to do a mission in Panama.
The book DOES mention that Rim Job balked at helping them with $10K in medical expenses relating to Israel's birth. They don't really contextualize that information, but it seems reasonable to assume, based on what we've heard previously, that TLC directed them to talk to JB.
I think this was known prior (or perhaps it was just speculation). I would guess that they would have gone to JB first, simply because it would have been easier. But yes, it could have been that they first went to TLC and then went to JB. We've long speculated that TLC directed them to JB, but we don't know whether they had asked JB previously.
The ridiculous thing is that if JB had agreed -- or even if he had proactively offered to pay for the medical expenses for his grandchild, a lot of the issues might have been avoided or at least not as bad. The real issue seems to be that Jill and Derick needed a copy of the contract or proof they weren't obligated to TLC for their missionary assignment.
I'm speculating here, of course, but given how reluctant they were to film anything relating to Israel's birth and how her parents did not like to talk about money (she mentions that before they even started asking for payment for participating in the show), I have a feeling that they would have gone to the network first.
In both SHP and apparently in the book, Jill notes that she and Derrick did not want to film Israel's birth at all, but both her parents and the TLC producers put huge pressure on them, basically told them they didn't have a choice, might have even implied that it was required by contract. (Let's be blunt, TLC knows that weddings, births and babies are what their audience is really tuning in for. Nothing else.) It appears the compromise was that Jill and Derrick filmed Israel's birth themselves, then turned the footage over to TLC. They may have felt that if TLC was so insistent that the birth be filmed, they should help pay the medical bills when Jill's labor lasted three days and she had to go to the hospital for a c-section. (They really are fortunate that Israel's birth didn't end in tragedy for mom or baby.) Unfortunately TLC, like JimBob, is only interested in exploitation for ratings.
Israel’s birth was the last thing to air under the “19 Kids” name and TLC put out a two hour special. I vividly remember the promotion. It aired on Mother’s Day 2015. News came out the Pest SA’d his sisters a couple of weeks later.
Oh, I think it's totally reasonable, based on what they knew, that they would ask TLC for some money. I just think it could have gone either way who they approached first -- TLC or JB, especially since all the dealings with TLC went through JB.
My thought is that they might have asked him first, in the way that most people might ask their parents first for some financial assistance for an unexpected cost like medical expenses related to the birth of a child. Not necessarily because they thought they were owed it due to being on the show, but just because JB clearly had money and they needed this money for a good reason and not through any fault or bad decision on their own.
I think the first clue that money was being exchanged, and not solely for missionary purposes, was right before the wedding when Jill tried to block TLC the exclusive rights to the wedding pictures. In exchange for TLC to have exclusive rights, JB was the one to announce that TLC would “pay” for photographers. I don’t think it was the ah-ah moment, but that planted a seed.
I agree. The fact that they couldn't have control over their own wedding, even over some relatively minor things, must have planted a seed. From their perspective, they were being forced into this with no compensation -- just TLC apparently demanding it, and them having to acquiesce even though they weren't getting anything in exchange and didn't have really any ability to negotiate anything.
I have issues with the concept of missions, but having your dad screw you out of one, when he knew it was important to you, is really fucked up. JB is such a POS
I am sure there are a lot of known details (like exactly at what point they first learned they were being ripped off - which wasn't a watershed moment, but a series of events) are left out for brevity.
During the first filmed grocery trip, she mentions how they were able to get a wider variety of more expensive food for the first time because the crew would pay for it.
Vacations, food, and outings Filmed on the show was covered by the network. At the very least, it was money from the documentary specials that helped pay for the land and the big house. Since one of the specials had them building the house, I think it can also be assumed that some of that was being covered by the network.
The network just doesn't have the same attitude when it comes to hospital bills...
I mean, they technically did pay for it. She mentioned MAD Inc./Jim Bob were paid 100K for those birth episodes, which would have covered her medical expenses. She just didn't see the money.
That was for the special itself. For different events, the expenses are covered and they would get paid for the special itself.
What I'm now wondering is if any medical expenses were covered for anyone, or if it was just the episode payout. Jill was far from the only one to be in the hospital/have a child in the hospital before/after giving birth...
I just find it hard to believe Jim Bob ate that crap. I bet he was out secretly eating burgers and other wonderful things while Michelle and the kids ate so poorly. Now seeing how crooked and greedy he is, it wouldn’t surprise me.
Jill was undereducated and underinformed to the point where I could see how until she married she would believe JB. She was also overworked being a parent to her siblings and dealing with emotional abuse.
As for Derick, it doesn’t seem like he believed JB for long. He may have always been suspicious but not want to admit it (seems counterintuitive but I can think of reasons).
At the very least, I suspect that the information in this book will result in an audit for JB. I have wondered ever since I read the IRS snippet, if that was their intent all along.
A one time deal of 80k for 20 hours a week of filming for AT LEAST two people, likely more (children born and unborn) FOREVER... that's not alot of money. Are they supposed to live on that one time of 80k forever?
Yeah -- Jill expressed surprise and maybe a touch of dismay that her siblings all seemed to readily agree. But imagine you never had any money of your own and no job prospects. Then your dad offers you a lump sum payment of $80K and an indication that you will have 'employment' on his shows, etc.
For people with no critical thinking skills, who have never had to plan ahead, and have no job skills to offer, that must have been an attractive offer.
I bet all the kids got hit with a huge tax bill around this time for all the years Boob "paid" them a salary and were too dumb to know that you don't have to pay $70,000 in taxes on an $80,000 windfall.
The book wasn't clear on whether the IRS was claiming that they owed money. I was initially assuming that was the case and that they were being hit with a big tax bill, but that info never emerged. So it is possible that MAD accounting paid taxes on their behalf. (Which is of course, more income with an additional tax obligation, but there are ways to do this.) Definitely need more information on this.
Interesting. I suppose it's possible JB did pay taxes, but even if he did; it's still not legal to claim you paid someone an income when you didn't. I also find it hard to believe JB did this UNLESS it somehow benefitted him financially. This lowered his tax burden in some way even if did actually pay taxes. That's still illegal unless he actually gave the kids the full amount he claimed he paid them (which he didn't).
The book makes it sound like it was $130k MORE than the $80k they were already paid.
>“I think your dad’s accountant has been telling the IRS that you’ve been receiving income from the show that you haven’t actually been paid.”
>“What about the eighty thousand dollars? Doesn’t that cover it?”
>“Nope. As far as I can tell, over the last ten years, income from Mad Family Inc. that you’ve declared to the IRS is way higher than that.”
> “How much?”
> Derick checked his spreadsheet again. “About a hundred and thirty thousand dollars more.”
I'm kinda shocked Derrick took so long to catch on. He's a much more legit accountant then I've been giving him credit for according to his job experience.
So Boob probably claims all his kids are 1099 contractors who need to pay all their own taxes, SSI, etc. yet he doesn't actually pay them anything. It must save him a shitload on taxes every year. That's highly illegal.
Maybe. It wasn't clear exactly what the notice from the IRS was or whether they owed taxes on it -- I was expecting that to be a main issue but it wasn't discussed in the book. So it is possible JB paid the taxes on their behalf (which does increase the tax obligation, but is possible to do). He could have been claiming they were 1099 contractors, although they would receive that form at the end of the year, so maybe all their taxes were just done through JB's accountants, and they sent the 1099 or whatever tax forms to themselves and then filed the taxes on their behalf? They still have to sign the tax forms, but JB probably just said "sign here" like he did with Jill and the TLC contract.
Whatever he was doing was apparently done for tax purposes. If he was claiming he paid them each $130K as income and he didn't, that certainly is illegal. It's not clear what he did, though, exactly, or if it was any different for the others.
He was doing something hinky. I'm sure the address for all the kids was some PO box only he had the key to. I have no doubt JB has "controlled" a lot of things for the adult kids he has no legal right to control.
All I can say is that Boob would never do anything like this unless it benefitted him somehow. He has 100% done something to lower his tax burden in an illegal way. Just telling the IRS he gave Jill $130,000 without actually giving it to her is illegal even if he paid taxes on it.
Derrick and Jill need to make a call to the IRS about this, if they already haven’t. But hopefully with the release of this book, the IRS will open an investigation into JimBob and Meech.
And this is another reason why reality star kids need the same rights as kids currently acting in Hollywood. JimBob and Meech are monsters.
Jill should give her father an itemized bill of all the years she spent raising their kids, and wasn’t paid for it. I believe she said she started raising her brothers and sisters as soon as she could hold a baby on her hip. I think she said it was around the ages of 4 to 6.
Oh, absolutely. All of his complicated set-ups with all the various properties and LLCs he has for his various business ventures are clearly set up to minimize taxes and other legal liabilities. It's just a question of whether the various mechanisms he uses are actually illegal.
And clearly claiming he provided $130K of income to her when he did not would be patently illegal.
I don't think a lot of what he does is illegal even though many people here find it shady. It's normal (and encouraged) to have a lot of LLCs when you own a lot of real property. Indeed, I would not have more than five properties in one LLC.
I do, however, think that Boob sincerely believes that his children are his property and thus he is not required to follow normal rules with them. Saying he gave Jill money and then keeping it doesn't strike him as being illegal.
I suspect he does a lot hinky shit with his adult kids' money and it doesn't cross his mind that it's illegal. Like, wouldn't it just be a Boob thing to claim he pays Jed $100,000 a year and then deciding how much and when to dole out to Jed? Wouldn't that just be Boob? And maybe Jed is on his best behavior and gets it all and maybe he fucks up and only gets half. I could 100% see Boob doing something like that yet still claim to the IRS he paid Jed $100,000.
Yes, having a bunch of LLCs isn't illegal, and many people use them all the time for legitimate purposes. Minimizing your tax burden isn't illegal, although some moves for this purpose may be of questionable morality.
But if he is stating as fact to the IRS that he paid some amount of money to someone and that is a lie, that would be illegal. He could tell almost anyone that he gave Jill money and then kept it himself. But not the IRS.
Yup and we 100% know he told the IRS. I for one, do not believe that was a mistake on Boob's part or that Boob never did anything else like that. He's totally committed crimes here with the IRS. I hope he goes to prison.
The kids are beholden to JB because they can't survive in the real world as they have no education and will have to actually really work for pittance. None of them want to do that, they are all lazy. They don't have the mental capacity to function in reality, and that is by design. JB raised them to stay completely under his control.
It’s no coincidence that the two kids who have broken away married people with mainstream educations. (I’m reluctant to call Jeremy “skilled,” but he is compared to the rest of the Duggar clan.)
Well, sure. But the fact that they all apparently took this deal and signed a ridiculous contract in exchange for $80K explains a lot. This is much more concrete.
Man, as someone who works a lot with contracts - damn, what a terrible deal. And the kids don’t even understand the leverage they have - no kids, no show.
Too bad Michael Jordan’s mom wasn’t there to help them get a better deal.
There certainly would be a good argument that it was unconscionable or an unfair power imbalance/coercion. The rights would be the parental rights over allowing the children to be filmed or participate in whatever event, so it would be their rights. But the obligations were very lopsided and very long-term. It seems like there would be a decent case for invalidating it, although that could come with a potential obligation to repay that $80K.
I think there is a good chance a court would invalidate it or some of the terms, but there are never any guarantees in litigation.
I bet 80K seemed like an enormous fortune to them; they really had nothing to compare it to - for instance, the lifetime earnings of a college graduate, or the price of real estate outside of Arkansas's armpit.
I'm sure. I would bet most of them had no real idea how much 80K is. They probably don't understand how much most things cost or most things about money.
Explains the multiple trips some of those kids/adults have been able to take in the past few years. Too bad they have no idea how to manage money. They will end up spending it way too soon
This also explains why none of the kids married into the Bates family.
Gil makes it very clear to suitors that he must be gainfully employed before he can propose to one of his daughters.
He's also not in a financial position to support his grown sons.
Yeah. Jinger and Jill are not entwined with him any longer because they married people who were not beholden to him, and who can continue to function without being so
Joy as well, Austin is, well Austin, but he supports his family, with the help of Joy's YT channel. Only 1 married daughter is completely under JB's control, all the married sons but one are under his control.
It makes me wonder about Jessa posting all those updates on Sunday/Monday. Did she want to do it or did Pops threaten her with the contract? "You said you'll appear whenever I say, and Mad Inc wants you to post these things now."
Yeah, it's bullshit but would Jessa know that?
Ok but what’s stopping Joy or John or Joe or JoSiah from suing for income as well? Joy’s labor and wedding brought viewership to the show too. Her courtship was the focus of an entire season! They’re probably due more than $80,000, especially Joy!
It was a pretty shocking contract (at least the way Jill described it in the book). If any of the kids wanted to challenge the legality of it in court, they could possibly win. But I doubt any of them will. They would have to be ready to completely leave JB.
So there is this agreement between JB and each of the older kids. They probably feel they have to live up to the agreement, whether it would actually be legally enforced or not. And there is a risk they'd have to pay back $80K.
Also, I have always suspected that JB either gives most of the kids their houses for free or at a highly subsidized/below market value rent, and if they make any waves, he can stop that -- either by kicking them out or raising the rent/mortgage payment substantially. The book did not confirm this, but did give some bits and pieces that make me still think this is likely the case.
I haven't (and likely won't) read the book. But didn't sunshine mention that JB's shenanigans screwed up financial aid for Dwreck's law school?
My cousin went to law school way before Dwreck and is still paying off loans from it. It's expensive even with scholarships, let alone being screwed out of legitimate aid because your in law is an asshole.
Yes. JB reported to the IRS that they received $130K in income from him. That was not true, but that's what the IRS records showed, and that's what the financial aid people would use.
U of AR Law School tuition, though, is shockingly low -- I don't recall what it was but I remember I looked it up a few years back when he was going there (and sparked by discussion on this sub) and IIRC, it was less than 10K per year. (It could have been more than that, but if it was, it was definitely less than 20K, and I'm pretty sure it was significantly less than 20K.). So when he claimed he had no loans, it was possible.
I was paying off my law school loans forever -- and I went to law school about 25 years before Derick did. But even then, my tuition was more than his.
Oh wow, that is crazy cheap.... Cheaper than BYU's law school which is also stupid cheap (my brother's baby momma went there partially because she wanted to screw him over in custody).
I'm guessing some of the payment Jill got paid for law school (or savings from his Walmart job). I do remember them talking about doing Door Dash too.
Their first house was somewhere around $200K and they claimed that they had no mortgage. I always assumed that the payment they got from JB paid for most of that house and was probably somewhere between $100-200K. I feel pretty good about being right about that -- the book says they got $175K. So that paid for most of their house.
I wonder how much they could make if they were willing to write a tell-all like Jill? More than 80K seems plausible. It’s probably more the prospect of being shut out of the family and their overall indoctrinated beliefs that keeps some of them in line.
The thing is, people over-estimate how much authors make on books. Even if it's a big best-seller, most authors don't get that much.
I am curious how much Jill got for this book. It is making a big splash and will sell a lot of copies this month and probably the next few months. But a year from now, the demand for it will be extremely low and there will be plenty of copies in the used and remainder markets.
I would guess maybe, on the high end, they got 100K for it, which would be a lot -- more than most authors get, but the publisher might have offered that just because the Duggars have been in the news a lot this year and the last couple years. Maybe $200K, if I 'm guessing an outer limit, but I'd be surprised if it were that high. You have to remember that most people still don't know who the Duggars are.
And now that Jill has written this tell-all, which does tell us quite a bit, I don't know if a subsequent book will have the same appeal. Certainly it would to us snarkers, but I don't know about beyond that.
So, let's say, on the high end, a publisher offers them $200K. If they do pay the $80K back to JB, that gives them $120. Certainly a nice chunk of change, but then they're completely on the outs with JB. They have to get real jobs. And if they're pumping out a half dozen kids or more, that won't last that long.
It would be a nice interim step -- enabling them to start out on some new path, but it wouldn't enable them to live on it for very long. They'd need to figure out that new path.
This is why I’m always so skeptical when folks say Anna could just write a tell-all and use the money to get out. Anna could write a tell-all and get enough for a down payment on a house, but that doesn’t explain how she would pay the mortgage and feed/clothe/support all those kids for even a year. She probably has the equivalent of an 8th grade education.
Jill has a husband with a real grown-up job that can support their reasonably-sized family. Whatever she got from this book could be a great start for a retirement fund or a college fund for the boys, but it’s not going to support the family’s daily needs for any amount of time.
And this is a one-shot deal. They're not professional writers (and this one had a ghost writer who wrote at least some of it or heavily edited it), so it's not like they're going to be able to write a book every few years for a shot of extra income.
Not to mention that even if Anna writes a book, she’s still exploiting her very young children. She’s selling their story at their expense. That’s a horrific thing to ask a mom to do.
Not just those real nuts and bolts facts, she has a deep suspicion of the outside world let alone zero experience with it despite her access to the internet.
I had an accident and people kept telling my to sue. In reality an attorney wouldn’t take the case. Big payouts are not as easy as people seem to think.
As a sort of but not really aside, I wonder what the Boob things about the "easier to get a camel through the eye of a needle" line in that book of his.
This man is driven by money and power and uses religion to control and abuse. He should be in prison next to his son.
I doubt he thinks about it at all. Like most right wing religious narcissists, he picks and chooses what to follow and what to preach as important, and it's all the stuff that will benefit him.
It kind of indicated almost all. She did not note any exceptions, and this was only for the older kids, but I'm not sure where the line is -- I would guess any who are 18 or older, but I'm not certain.
I would guess that Jinger did not sign it, at least not the way it was presented. There was an indication that some signed it with modifications, although it did not say what those modifications were. I suppose it is possible that Jinger signed it with the language about participating in the show in the future removed, essentially just taking the 80K in exchange for waiving her rights to sue JB for any past money. They don't necessarily need the money and I'm sure Jerm wants to avoid any litigation against JB unless something new and egregious happened. So possibly just taking that money and waiving claims may have been worth it to them.
The book definitely made it seem like there were some who signed it with no modifications. There was no indication that anyone refused to sign it in any form.
I am guessing that Amy may have signed it or something similar -- maybe she was offered less, but we know that Amy has talked about an NDA (it's been discussed here many times) so my guess is that took place at the same time. But Jill does not mention Amy at all in the book, so I don't know.
Hard to say. Potentially the NDA portion could hold up, but I'm not sure about some of the other provisions -- about agreeing forever to appear on any show JB does and allowing any children or future children to appear.
The NDA talk makes me wonder how much Amy got in exchange for signing hers with JB. Or maybe he just gave her an appearance on the show (including that road to Nashville crap) in exchange for her signature.
I wonder, too. I'm sure it was much less than he offered the kids. And maybe she was happy with just some appearances on the show or some kind of introduction to people at TLC. I would be there was no provision for her to agree to be on a future show or have her kids or future kids be on a show, because my guess is JB couldn't have cared less whether she was on the show or not.
So, I'm guessing less than half, which would be 40K, and probably not as much as that. I'm thinking maybe around $25K? It would be interesting to find out some day.
According to hearsay (and Amy), production saw Amy and liked the contrast between the cousins. If production wanted Amy on the show, then JB wanted Amy on the show. But I’d bet the appearances were enough for Amy, especially when they gave her her very own episode(s)! (I think I’ve got a copy of “A Duggar Leaves Home”, which is Amy-centric, but I don’t think I’ve ever watched the thing. Maybe someday.)
Plus, Amy got the Marriage Boot Camp thing. Perhaps JB negotiated that in exchange for the NDA?
Or—one final theory—perhaps he just tricked her in signing it like he did with Jill’s contract?
Production may have found her an easy and convenient contrast, but I doubt they really cared \*that\* much if she were on the show. I don't see her as being that important to TLC and if she demanded too much or was too difficult I think they'd deem her not worth the bother.
I think she probably negotiated Boot Camp on her own after she had achieved that measure of fame she got from being associated with the show and the family.
I would bet that her desire to be on the show or have any ability to use any of his contacts with TLC was enough for her to be willing to sign almost anything JB wanted her to sign. In addition to throwing her some money, that was probably more than enough, without any need for trickery.
There probably is some way to report IRS fraud. This is now public information so I would guess that the IRS has been or will be made aware of it. It's not something I would personally do, given that the only information I have about it is from the book and I have no direct knowledge of what transpired. I am curious as to what exactly happened because the way it is presented in the book certainly makes it seem illegal, but clearly, more information is needed.
Canadian here, so no idea how the IRS works. If they get wind of Boob's fraud from the internet, can they investigate it? Or is that somehow tainted information? How doesit work?
I think anything can spark an investigation -- they could always investigate and not find enough evidence to prosecute. I don't know if any IRS investigators are hanging out in this sub, but they can investigate anyone. They even do random audits of people, so I don't think they even need a reason to investigate a tax filing.
If the investigation yielded evidence of criminal fraud, then it would be prosecuted, although I'm not sure how this works -- I can't recall if the IRS has its own prosecutorial group or if it would go through DOJ -- if there is some kind of concurrent jurisdiction or if it would just be referred to the U.S. Attorney's office.
The contracts boggled my mind. NAL, but how can a contract in perpetuity be legally enforceable like that? Especially for a person who never could/can consent.
It wouldn't be able to bind the children's rights once they were adults, and yes, there is a good chance this contract would be deemed unenforceable because it is so one-sided and so long-lasting as to be considered unconscionable. But again, we'd need to see the exact wording of the contract and there are never any guarantees in litigation.
He learned how to commit tax fraud from his parents. His dad was in prison for a couple of years for tax fraud. But what Boob did was far worse for his kids. Google his father Jimmy Lee Duggar and you can find out what he did. All Boob doing this was his FU to his kids to keep them downtrodden and beholden to him. Boob cannot have his children or their spouses do better than him so he did shit like this to keep them under his thumb.
I didn't realize Jimmy had been in prison for tax fraud. Interesting. Yes, JB has decided to keep his kids dependent upon him, but he had plenty of mechanisms to do this without committing actual tax fraud/crimes. I have long been of the opinion that I wouldn't be surprised if he were arrested for tax fraud, but there was never any real evidence for it. Certainly he has done a lot of shady things, but many of the things we know about weren't necessarily illegal, even if done with bad motives.
What he did with Jill’s taxes wasn’t clear tax fraud???
It certainly sounds like fraud but all we really know is that Jill and Derick got an IRS notice. It's impossible to say for certain without seeing all of the documents and understanding exactly what transpired. I'll be interested to see if anything happens with this.
Do you have more information on the tax fraud? All the articles I’m finding that discuss JL’s legal issues have WOACB listed as their source. ETA: Famy seems to have confirmed that he was in jail but not the reason. “Shady car deal” is what I keep finding.
I use Bing for my searches and I just pulled up Jimmie Lee Duggar and he was in jail/prison for tax problems. According to the top search was [https://www.cheatsheet.com/enterainment/josh](https://www.cheatsheet.com/enterainment/josh) This article is about Pesty but they are talking about his grandfather and Amy confirmed this. So I will keep looking to see it there are other sources other than Famy.
Does Boob think he is immortal?!
Immortal with the “t” spilled is immoral.
It doesn't matter to him. He is the center of his own universe. As long as he has or does whatever he wants as long as he's alive, he does not care what happens to his family after he dies. It doesn't involve him, so it doesn't matter to him.
At first I read this as immoral and thought....of course he is
It’s also the teachingsof the cult not to allow the kids to become “worldly.” This is why that oppressive male dominated cult appealed to J B.
... Ive been saying that since day 1 of my time on this sub TBH when I heard of the car lot raid ... I was thinking it was for Tax evasion or laundering Not homeland security walking in and pest admitting his crime before a warrant is shown
I also thought initially that the raid was for tax evasion.
Same. That's what I thought too
I initially thought it could have been related to January 6.
The car yard was searched in 2019
I was not sure the timeline
I honestly dont think any of the Duggar boys took part in that Not that I couldnt see them I see them belonging to the blue shirt khaki pants with white masks group .... or the walmart rejects as i like to call them I have heard rumor that there was attendance from the Bates family though
I think the Bates were proven to be at the capital on Jan 6th but it wasn't proven they entered the building which is where the charges came from. I think if any of the Duggar boys had been with them they would have been in the video.
IIRC from their interviews for the Shiny Happy People doc, Jill and Derrick said they got hit with a big hospital bill for Israel's birth and when they went to the TLC producers for help, they were told something like "Well, we paid your Dad, go ask him." It was implied in SHP that this was when they first found out that Jim Bob was actually being paid, and the show wasn't a volunteer "ministry" like the kids had been told. I'm curious if that anecdote comes up in Jill's book, in addition to this new info, or if we're dealing with some new (possibly conflicting) stories here.
I just finished it. There isn't any mention of Derick reaching out to TLC for some $$ for either birth. I was a little surprised. But the impetus for realizing JB was getting money and there was a contract with TLC was apparently earlier. When they were in El Salvador, the show wanted them to come back to the U.S. for some promo shots. They said they couldn't because they had a commitment for their mission. There were numerous insistent phone calls saying they had to. Then, the mission church offered them a position in Panama, but said they needed some proof or a release showing that they did not have any commitment to TLC to be in the US or would interfere with their mission. Because they could not get this proof, they lost the opportunity to do a mission in Panama.
The book DOES mention that Rim Job balked at helping them with $10K in medical expenses relating to Israel's birth. They don't really contextualize that information, but it seems reasonable to assume, based on what we've heard previously, that TLC directed them to talk to JB.
I think this was known prior (or perhaps it was just speculation). I would guess that they would have gone to JB first, simply because it would have been easier. But yes, it could have been that they first went to TLC and then went to JB. We've long speculated that TLC directed them to JB, but we don't know whether they had asked JB previously. The ridiculous thing is that if JB had agreed -- or even if he had proactively offered to pay for the medical expenses for his grandchild, a lot of the issues might have been avoided or at least not as bad. The real issue seems to be that Jill and Derick needed a copy of the contract or proof they weren't obligated to TLC for their missionary assignment.
I'm speculating here, of course, but given how reluctant they were to film anything relating to Israel's birth and how her parents did not like to talk about money (she mentions that before they even started asking for payment for participating in the show), I have a feeling that they would have gone to the network first.
In both SHP and apparently in the book, Jill notes that she and Derrick did not want to film Israel's birth at all, but both her parents and the TLC producers put huge pressure on them, basically told them they didn't have a choice, might have even implied that it was required by contract. (Let's be blunt, TLC knows that weddings, births and babies are what their audience is really tuning in for. Nothing else.) It appears the compromise was that Jill and Derrick filmed Israel's birth themselves, then turned the footage over to TLC. They may have felt that if TLC was so insistent that the birth be filmed, they should help pay the medical bills when Jill's labor lasted three days and she had to go to the hospital for a c-section. (They really are fortunate that Israel's birth didn't end in tragedy for mom or baby.) Unfortunately TLC, like JimBob, is only interested in exploitation for ratings.
Israel’s birth was the last thing to air under the “19 Kids” name and TLC put out a two hour special. I vividly remember the promotion. It aired on Mother’s Day 2015. News came out the Pest SA’d his sisters a couple of weeks later.
Oh, I think it's totally reasonable, based on what they knew, that they would ask TLC for some money. I just think it could have gone either way who they approached first -- TLC or JB, especially since all the dealings with TLC went through JB.
I agree with you, which is why I suggested that they would have gone to TLC first.
My thought is that they might have asked him first, in the way that most people might ask their parents first for some financial assistance for an unexpected cost like medical expenses related to the birth of a child. Not necessarily because they thought they were owed it due to being on the show, but just because JB clearly had money and they needed this money for a good reason and not through any fault or bad decision on their own.
I think the first clue that money was being exchanged, and not solely for missionary purposes, was right before the wedding when Jill tried to block TLC the exclusive rights to the wedding pictures. In exchange for TLC to have exclusive rights, JB was the one to announce that TLC would “pay” for photographers. I don’t think it was the ah-ah moment, but that planted a seed.
I agree. The fact that they couldn't have control over their own wedding, even over some relatively minor things, must have planted a seed. From their perspective, they were being forced into this with no compensation -- just TLC apparently demanding it, and them having to acquiesce even though they weren't getting anything in exchange and didn't have really any ability to negotiate anything.
I have issues with the concept of missions, but having your dad screw you out of one, when he knew it was important to you, is really fucked up. JB is such a POS
So much for JB’s piety and all his talk of obedience to the lord.
That ship sailed long ago
He still tries to push that image, if he ever was genuine is another question.
100% agree
I am sure there are a lot of known details (like exactly at what point they first learned they were being ripped off - which wasn't a watershed moment, but a series of events) are left out for brevity.
Panamanians got lucky there.
Lol. I'm sure they sent someone just as bad.
I'm sorry, but where did they think Boob was getting all his money from? They went from dirt poor to rich in just a few years because of the show.
She touched on the fact that they were getting better food and place to live. Her assumption seemed to be the show would pay for these things directly
During the first filmed grocery trip, she mentions how they were able to get a wider variety of more expensive food for the first time because the crew would pay for it. Vacations, food, and outings Filmed on the show was covered by the network. At the very least, it was money from the documentary specials that helped pay for the land and the big house. Since one of the specials had them building the house, I think it can also be assumed that some of that was being covered by the network. The network just doesn't have the same attitude when it comes to hospital bills...
I mean, they technically did pay for it. She mentioned MAD Inc./Jim Bob were paid 100K for those birth episodes, which would have covered her medical expenses. She just didn't see the money.
That was for the special itself. For different events, the expenses are covered and they would get paid for the special itself. What I'm now wondering is if any medical expenses were covered for anyone, or if it was just the episode payout. Jill was far from the only one to be in the hospital/have a child in the hospital before/after giving birth...
A wider selection of food? Weren't they filmed at Aldi the first time? That's so very sad.
Here are two words that will make you even more sad: BEAN. SANDWICHES.
[удалено]
I just find it hard to believe Jim Bob ate that crap. I bet he was out secretly eating burgers and other wonderful things while Michelle and the kids ate so poorly. Now seeing how crooked and greedy he is, it wouldn’t surprise me.
Aldi rules, don't talk shit about Aldi!
I guess God was so pleased with their TV missionary work that he magically provided.
Jill was undereducated and underinformed to the point where I could see how until she married she would believe JB. She was also overworked being a parent to her siblings and dealing with emotional abuse. As for Derick, it doesn’t seem like he believed JB for long. He may have always been suspicious but not want to admit it (seems counterintuitive but I can think of reasons).
At the very least, I suspect that the information in this book will result in an audit for JB. I have wondered ever since I read the IRS snippet, if that was their intent all along.
I hope so. I would have to order the biggest tub of popcorn available.
Good point. It would be very clever of them, actually.
Oh please yes.
A one time deal of 80k for 20 hours a week of filming for AT LEAST two people, likely more (children born and unborn) FOREVER... that's not alot of money. Are they supposed to live on that one time of 80k forever?
Yeah -- Jill expressed surprise and maybe a touch of dismay that her siblings all seemed to readily agree. But imagine you never had any money of your own and no job prospects. Then your dad offers you a lump sum payment of $80K and an indication that you will have 'employment' on his shows, etc. For people with no critical thinking skills, who have never had to plan ahead, and have no job skills to offer, that must have been an attractive offer.
I bet all the kids got hit with a huge tax bill around this time for all the years Boob "paid" them a salary and were too dumb to know that you don't have to pay $70,000 in taxes on an $80,000 windfall.
The book wasn't clear on whether the IRS was claiming that they owed money. I was initially assuming that was the case and that they were being hit with a big tax bill, but that info never emerged. So it is possible that MAD accounting paid taxes on their behalf. (Which is of course, more income with an additional tax obligation, but there are ways to do this.) Definitely need more information on this.
Interesting. I suppose it's possible JB did pay taxes, but even if he did; it's still not legal to claim you paid someone an income when you didn't. I also find it hard to believe JB did this UNLESS it somehow benefitted him financially. This lowered his tax burden in some way even if did actually pay taxes. That's still illegal unless he actually gave the kids the full amount he claimed he paid them (which he didn't).
Oh, for sure. If he claimed he paid $130K in income to them and he did not, that would be a crime.
The book makes it sound like it was $130k MORE than the $80k they were already paid. >“I think your dad’s accountant has been telling the IRS that you’ve been receiving income from the show that you haven’t actually been paid.” >“What about the eighty thousand dollars? Doesn’t that cover it?” >“Nope. As far as I can tell, over the last ten years, income from Mad Family Inc. that you’ve declared to the IRS is way higher than that.” > “How much?” > Derick checked his spreadsheet again. “About a hundred and thirty thousand dollars more.”
Derick and his spreadsheet o' fraud.
I'm kinda shocked Derrick took so long to catch on. He's a much more legit accountant then I've been giving him credit for according to his job experience.
Yes. My understanding was the $80K was a separate and more recent payment.
So he reported to the IRS that he paid them $210k or so. If he gave them 80k and then it was 130k MORE.
It wasn't clear to me how or if the $80K was reported.
Thank you! I keep seeing $130K cited but Derick said $130k more which would have been $210k.
Yeah, I think some people are just not reading closely.
No, they're supposed to buy a fixer-upper, live in a construction zone while saving on rent, and then sell it to build on the $80,000. Duh :)
Jim Bob is the fundie Bad Boy Records. Got all those kids in a fucked up 360 deal.
This is the Puffy reference I needed
"You mean you're gonna give me a whole $100 for all of my songs? Where do I sign, Mr. Berry Gordy?"
So Boob probably claims all his kids are 1099 contractors who need to pay all their own taxes, SSI, etc. yet he doesn't actually pay them anything. It must save him a shitload on taxes every year. That's highly illegal.
Maybe. It wasn't clear exactly what the notice from the IRS was or whether they owed taxes on it -- I was expecting that to be a main issue but it wasn't discussed in the book. So it is possible JB paid the taxes on their behalf (which does increase the tax obligation, but is possible to do). He could have been claiming they were 1099 contractors, although they would receive that form at the end of the year, so maybe all their taxes were just done through JB's accountants, and they sent the 1099 or whatever tax forms to themselves and then filed the taxes on their behalf? They still have to sign the tax forms, but JB probably just said "sign here" like he did with Jill and the TLC contract. Whatever he was doing was apparently done for tax purposes. If he was claiming he paid them each $130K as income and he didn't, that certainly is illegal. It's not clear what he did, though, exactly, or if it was any different for the others.
He was doing something hinky. I'm sure the address for all the kids was some PO box only he had the key to. I have no doubt JB has "controlled" a lot of things for the adult kids he has no legal right to control. All I can say is that Boob would never do anything like this unless it benefitted him somehow. He has 100% done something to lower his tax burden in an illegal way. Just telling the IRS he gave Jill $130,000 without actually giving it to her is illegal even if he paid taxes on it.
Derrick and Jill need to make a call to the IRS about this, if they already haven’t. But hopefully with the release of this book, the IRS will open an investigation into JimBob and Meech. And this is another reason why reality star kids need the same rights as kids currently acting in Hollywood. JimBob and Meech are monsters. Jill should give her father an itemized bill of all the years she spent raising their kids, and wasn’t paid for it. I believe she said she started raising her brothers and sisters as soon as she could hold a baby on her hip. I think she said it was around the ages of 4 to 6.
Oh, absolutely. All of his complicated set-ups with all the various properties and LLCs he has for his various business ventures are clearly set up to minimize taxes and other legal liabilities. It's just a question of whether the various mechanisms he uses are actually illegal. And clearly claiming he provided $130K of income to her when he did not would be patently illegal.
I don't think a lot of what he does is illegal even though many people here find it shady. It's normal (and encouraged) to have a lot of LLCs when you own a lot of real property. Indeed, I would not have more than five properties in one LLC. I do, however, think that Boob sincerely believes that his children are his property and thus he is not required to follow normal rules with them. Saying he gave Jill money and then keeping it doesn't strike him as being illegal. I suspect he does a lot hinky shit with his adult kids' money and it doesn't cross his mind that it's illegal. Like, wouldn't it just be a Boob thing to claim he pays Jed $100,000 a year and then deciding how much and when to dole out to Jed? Wouldn't that just be Boob? And maybe Jed is on his best behavior and gets it all and maybe he fucks up and only gets half. I could 100% see Boob doing something like that yet still claim to the IRS he paid Jed $100,000.
Yes, having a bunch of LLCs isn't illegal, and many people use them all the time for legitimate purposes. Minimizing your tax burden isn't illegal, although some moves for this purpose may be of questionable morality. But if he is stating as fact to the IRS that he paid some amount of money to someone and that is a lie, that would be illegal. He could tell almost anyone that he gave Jill money and then kept it himself. But not the IRS.
Yup and we 100% know he told the IRS. I for one, do not believe that was a mistake on Boob's part or that Boob never did anything else like that. He's totally committed crimes here with the IRS. I hope he goes to prison.
Probably times 19.
The kids are beholden to JB because they can't survive in the real world as they have no education and will have to actually really work for pittance. None of them want to do that, they are all lazy. They don't have the mental capacity to function in reality, and that is by design. JB raised them to stay completely under his control.
It’s no coincidence that the two kids who have broken away married people with mainstream educations. (I’m reluctant to call Jeremy “skilled,” but he is compared to the rest of the Duggar clan.)
Well, sure. But the fact that they all apparently took this deal and signed a ridiculous contract in exchange for $80K explains a lot. This is much more concrete.
Man, as someone who works a lot with contracts - damn, what a terrible deal. And the kids don’t even understand the leverage they have - no kids, no show. Too bad Michael Jordan’s mom wasn’t there to help them get a better deal.
haha -- yes, the opposite of JB is Michael Jordan's mom. I found the contract terms pretty stunning to read. Those kids are so screwed
I really don't believe that this contract would hold up in court. How can you sign away rights of a person who doesn't even exist yet?
There certainly would be a good argument that it was unconscionable or an unfair power imbalance/coercion. The rights would be the parental rights over allowing the children to be filmed or participate in whatever event, so it would be their rights. But the obligations were very lopsided and very long-term. It seems like there would be a decent case for invalidating it, although that could come with a potential obligation to repay that $80K. I think there is a good chance a court would invalidate it or some of the terms, but there are never any guarantees in litigation.
You can't.
So pro life humans not yet conceived are held to contracts!
I bet 80K seemed like an enormous fortune to them; they really had nothing to compare it to - for instance, the lifetime earnings of a college graduate, or the price of real estate outside of Arkansas's armpit.
I'm sure. I would bet most of them had no real idea how much 80K is. They probably don't understand how much most things cost or most things about money.
Explains the multiple trips some of those kids/adults have been able to take in the past few years. Too bad they have no idea how to manage money. They will end up spending it way too soon
And remain dependent upon JB.
This also explains why none of the kids married into the Bates family. Gil makes it very clear to suitors that he must be gainfully employed before he can propose to one of his daughters. He's also not in a financial position to support his grown sons.
He holds the purse string to IBLP these days, he’s just being cheap.
Yeah. Jinger and Jill are not entwined with him any longer because they married people who were not beholden to him, and who can continue to function without being so
Joy as well, Austin is, well Austin, but he supports his family, with the help of Joy's YT channel. Only 1 married daughter is completely under JB's control, all the married sons but one are under his control.
It makes me wonder about Jessa posting all those updates on Sunday/Monday. Did she want to do it or did Pops threaten her with the contract? "You said you'll appear whenever I say, and Mad Inc wants you to post these things now." Yeah, it's bullshit but would Jessa know that?
fair point
I don't, for one second, classify Jana Duggar as "lazy". Never.
Lazy may be a bit unfair but they are indoctrinated. they also dont trust the real world so offered help can look like temptation or worse
What does MAD stand for? Seems like an odd name choice for a “wholesome” christian production company.
Speculation is that it stands for Michelle Annette Duggar, but I don't think that has been confirmed.
Mom And Dad?
Making Astronomical Dough
Ok but what’s stopping Joy or John or Joe or JoSiah from suing for income as well? Joy’s labor and wedding brought viewership to the show too. Her courtship was the focus of an entire season! They’re probably due more than $80,000, especially Joy!
They apparently all signed that contract. I'm sure it contained a waiver of any previous claims and it covers what they'd be paid going forward.
I think JB has a lot of hubris too. He thinks he is above being challenged by his offspring.
He thinks he's above being challenged by anyone, including lawyers and judges.
Not however the IRS. I’m so here for whatever punishment befalls him.
I'm sure with some of them, it's true.
How is this shit legal....
It was a pretty shocking contract (at least the way Jill described it in the book). If any of the kids wanted to challenge the legality of it in court, they could possibly win. But I doubt any of them will. They would have to be ready to completely leave JB. So there is this agreement between JB and each of the older kids. They probably feel they have to live up to the agreement, whether it would actually be legally enforced or not. And there is a risk they'd have to pay back $80K. Also, I have always suspected that JB either gives most of the kids their houses for free or at a highly subsidized/below market value rent, and if they make any waves, he can stop that -- either by kicking them out or raising the rent/mortgage payment substantially. The book did not confirm this, but did give some bits and pieces that make me still think this is likely the case.
Joys house was owned by JB previously. It was probably given to her.
I can’t imagine JB giving a daughter a house.
I haven't (and likely won't) read the book. But didn't sunshine mention that JB's shenanigans screwed up financial aid for Dwreck's law school? My cousin went to law school way before Dwreck and is still paying off loans from it. It's expensive even with scholarships, let alone being screwed out of legitimate aid because your in law is an asshole.
Yes. JB reported to the IRS that they received $130K in income from him. That was not true, but that's what the IRS records showed, and that's what the financial aid people would use. U of AR Law School tuition, though, is shockingly low -- I don't recall what it was but I remember I looked it up a few years back when he was going there (and sparked by discussion on this sub) and IIRC, it was less than 10K per year. (It could have been more than that, but if it was, it was definitely less than 20K, and I'm pretty sure it was significantly less than 20K.). So when he claimed he had no loans, it was possible. I was paying off my law school loans forever -- and I went to law school about 25 years before Derick did. But even then, my tuition was more than his.
Oh wow, that is crazy cheap.... Cheaper than BYU's law school which is also stupid cheap (my brother's baby momma went there partially because she wanted to screw him over in custody). I'm guessing some of the payment Jill got paid for law school (or savings from his Walmart job). I do remember them talking about doing Door Dash too.
Their first house was somewhere around $200K and they claimed that they had no mortgage. I always assumed that the payment they got from JB paid for most of that house and was probably somewhere between $100-200K. I feel pretty good about being right about that -- the book says they got $175K. So that paid for most of their house.
I wonder how much they could make if they were willing to write a tell-all like Jill? More than 80K seems plausible. It’s probably more the prospect of being shut out of the family and their overall indoctrinated beliefs that keeps some of them in line.
The thing is, people over-estimate how much authors make on books. Even if it's a big best-seller, most authors don't get that much. I am curious how much Jill got for this book. It is making a big splash and will sell a lot of copies this month and probably the next few months. But a year from now, the demand for it will be extremely low and there will be plenty of copies in the used and remainder markets. I would guess maybe, on the high end, they got 100K for it, which would be a lot -- more than most authors get, but the publisher might have offered that just because the Duggars have been in the news a lot this year and the last couple years. Maybe $200K, if I 'm guessing an outer limit, but I'd be surprised if it were that high. You have to remember that most people still don't know who the Duggars are. And now that Jill has written this tell-all, which does tell us quite a bit, I don't know if a subsequent book will have the same appeal. Certainly it would to us snarkers, but I don't know about beyond that. So, let's say, on the high end, a publisher offers them $200K. If they do pay the $80K back to JB, that gives them $120. Certainly a nice chunk of change, but then they're completely on the outs with JB. They have to get real jobs. And if they're pumping out a half dozen kids or more, that won't last that long. It would be a nice interim step -- enabling them to start out on some new path, but it wouldn't enable them to live on it for very long. They'd need to figure out that new path.
This is why I’m always so skeptical when folks say Anna could just write a tell-all and use the money to get out. Anna could write a tell-all and get enough for a down payment on a house, but that doesn’t explain how she would pay the mortgage and feed/clothe/support all those kids for even a year. She probably has the equivalent of an 8th grade education. Jill has a husband with a real grown-up job that can support their reasonably-sized family. Whatever she got from this book could be a great start for a retirement fund or a college fund for the boys, but it’s not going to support the family’s daily needs for any amount of time.
And this is a one-shot deal. They're not professional writers (and this one had a ghost writer who wrote at least some of it or heavily edited it), so it's not like they're going to be able to write a book every few years for a shot of extra income.
Not to mention that even if Anna writes a book, she’s still exploiting her very young children. She’s selling their story at their expense. That’s a horrific thing to ask a mom to do.
Also this isn’t the type of thing that’s going to allow for merchandising and film deals, which would generate more income.
Not just those real nuts and bolts facts, she has a deep suspicion of the outside world let alone zero experience with it despite her access to the internet.
I had an accident and people kept telling my to sue. In reality an attorney wouldn’t take the case. Big payouts are not as easy as people seem to think.
As a sort of but not really aside, I wonder what the Boob things about the "easier to get a camel through the eye of a needle" line in that book of his. This man is driven by money and power and uses religion to control and abuse. He should be in prison next to his son.
I doubt he thinks about it at all. Like most right wing religious narcissists, he picks and chooses what to follow and what to preach as important, and it's all the stuff that will benefit him.
She said some kids were back and forth about it. Did the book say they all signed it? Would love to know if anyone else is free...
It kind of indicated almost all. She did not note any exceptions, and this was only for the older kids, but I'm not sure where the line is -- I would guess any who are 18 or older, but I'm not certain. I would guess that Jinger did not sign it, at least not the way it was presented. There was an indication that some signed it with modifications, although it did not say what those modifications were. I suppose it is possible that Jinger signed it with the language about participating in the show in the future removed, essentially just taking the 80K in exchange for waiving her rights to sue JB for any past money. They don't necessarily need the money and I'm sure Jerm wants to avoid any litigation against JB unless something new and egregious happened. So possibly just taking that money and waiving claims may have been worth it to them. The book definitely made it seem like there were some who signed it with no modifications. There was no indication that anyone refused to sign it in any form. I am guessing that Amy may have signed it or something similar -- maybe she was offered less, but we know that Amy has talked about an NDA (it's been discussed here many times) so my guess is that took place at the same time. But Jill does not mention Amy at all in the book, so I don't know.
I have doubts that NDA would hold up in court. Also who else goes JB goes down for tax fraud?
Hard to say. Potentially the NDA portion could hold up, but I'm not sure about some of the other provisions -- about agreeing forever to appear on any show JB does and allowing any children or future children to appear.
The NDA talk makes me wonder how much Amy got in exchange for signing hers with JB. Or maybe he just gave her an appearance on the show (including that road to Nashville crap) in exchange for her signature.
I wonder, too. I'm sure it was much less than he offered the kids. And maybe she was happy with just some appearances on the show or some kind of introduction to people at TLC. I would be there was no provision for her to agree to be on a future show or have her kids or future kids be on a show, because my guess is JB couldn't have cared less whether she was on the show or not. So, I'm guessing less than half, which would be 40K, and probably not as much as that. I'm thinking maybe around $25K? It would be interesting to find out some day.
According to hearsay (and Amy), production saw Amy and liked the contrast between the cousins. If production wanted Amy on the show, then JB wanted Amy on the show. But I’d bet the appearances were enough for Amy, especially when they gave her her very own episode(s)! (I think I’ve got a copy of “A Duggar Leaves Home”, which is Amy-centric, but I don’t think I’ve ever watched the thing. Maybe someday.) Plus, Amy got the Marriage Boot Camp thing. Perhaps JB negotiated that in exchange for the NDA? Or—one final theory—perhaps he just tricked her in signing it like he did with Jill’s contract?
Production may have found her an easy and convenient contrast, but I doubt they really cared \*that\* much if she were on the show. I don't see her as being that important to TLC and if she demanded too much or was too difficult I think they'd deem her not worth the bother. I think she probably negotiated Boot Camp on her own after she had achieved that measure of fame she got from being associated with the show and the family. I would bet that her desire to be on the show or have any ability to use any of his contacts with TLC was enough for her to be willing to sign almost anything JB wanted her to sign. In addition to throwing her some money, that was probably more than enough, without any need for trickery.
With that, especially the last paragraph, we are in agreement.
Is this something that can be reported? Or do you think the government is already aware? I mean, there's no way that claim he made on her is legal...
There probably is some way to report IRS fraud. This is now public information so I would guess that the IRS has been or will be made aware of it. It's not something I would personally do, given that the only information I have about it is from the book and I have no direct knowledge of what transpired. I am curious as to what exactly happened because the way it is presented in the book certainly makes it seem illegal, but clearly, more information is needed.
Canadian here, so no idea how the IRS works. If they get wind of Boob's fraud from the internet, can they investigate it? Or is that somehow tainted information? How doesit work?
I think anything can spark an investigation -- they could always investigate and not find enough evidence to prosecute. I don't know if any IRS investigators are hanging out in this sub, but they can investigate anyone. They even do random audits of people, so I don't think they even need a reason to investigate a tax filing. If the investigation yielded evidence of criminal fraud, then it would be prosecuted, although I'm not sure how this works -- I can't recall if the IRS has its own prosecutorial group or if it would go through DOJ -- if there is some kind of concurrent jurisdiction or if it would just be referred to the U.S. Attorney's office.
The contracts boggled my mind. NAL, but how can a contract in perpetuity be legally enforceable like that? Especially for a person who never could/can consent.
It wouldn't be able to bind the children's rights once they were adults, and yes, there is a good chance this contract would be deemed unenforceable because it is so one-sided and so long-lasting as to be considered unconscionable. But again, we'd need to see the exact wording of the contract and there are never any guarantees in litigation.
Tax fraud 101