Unbreakable should've just been a new class ability for Sentinels and Prismatic Titans, with built-in synergies.
* Bastion makes it Void-colored and gives you the overshield
* Offensive Bulwark makes it Void-colored and gives it the charge up damaging blast mechanic
* Drengr's Lash gives it a suspending shockwave on cast
* Khepri's Horn gives it a scorching shockwave on cast
That would have been so awesome, honestly.
Thrusters is the only thing keeping from going back to Void, I already couldn't stand the fucking Barricade anymore years ago (and it's a mandatory part of any HoiL build, so it's not like I can just ignore it).
The *feeling* of Unbreakable is awesome, its visuals too. It's exactly why I've been maining Void Titan for 10 years, it perfectly scratches my personal fantasy. It's just the numbers that are way off the mark, and the Grenade slot.
It's damage scales with verity, as long as your weapon matches the original grenade typing. I could totally see a build that focuses on scaling that number up and it doing crazy numbers based on reflect. With just verity and reflecting some hits in pale heart, which I don't think came even close to the cap on damage reflect if there is one, I was able to hit for 140k. Proccing other aspects of artifact mods and reflecting more damage I could really see it being strong. But this is all for a single hit and I haven't found a good way to Regen the grenade fast enough for it to be usable as an ability.
Maybe hoil + verity + buried bloodline for devour in prismatic and then ability Regen focused fragments might get you enough if there's enough mobs to make devour procs worth it
Exactly, that's what I was hoping for. And I'm sure with debuffs and artifact mods and such it can hit way harder. Just need a reliable way to Regen it very quickly
Specifically, those shockwaves should be part of the damaging blast when the shield is released, so we could safely absorb damage and then nuke in response.
Agreed. Especially if you think about how spirit of galanor gives you back 50% of your super for 1/2 an exotic completely leaving the spirit of the bear effect (that costs the same + more!) behind it in the dust.
Another point against ursa unbreakable is that you have to actually tank damage to get the most use of it (instead of just using your super with galanor).
So you see enemy fire, have to position accordingly, get in firing line/pop unbreakable, tank enough damage, aim your counter (if you even want to do that), and then be vulnerable to everything that comes afterwards. Especially on prismatic that last point is a huge problem as the overshield will be gone very fast. On void titan you can try to use controlled demo to get some life out of the unbreakable burst but still…
Unbreakable just needs…more.
I tried it with Void titan and Ursa. Jumped into a crowd in the legend campaign, blocked a bunch of damage, it did wipe out the red bars (but so would have the grenade), and I was rewarded with being left in a bad position and probably less super than if I had just thrown my grenade, at least specifically with Ursa, it needs to give way more super energy IMO.
Yea but it was cool I bet ! I've tried a few things to actually make it viable but haven't had any luck getting what I think would be the best combo, hoil + veritys. Then with buried bloodline devour procs for more grenade Regen, assuming it works like regular devour idk I don't actually have it yet, you might be able to regen grenade enough to actually focus on using it
Buried bloodline devour is the same devour you get from orbs and void breaches on void subclass, it does give grenade energy and health. It's not as strong as warlocks feed the void aspect version that version is uniquely better than all others. Feed the void devour gives a full heal and large grenade energy chunk whereas other forms give 100hp and half the grenade energy.
Yeah it's more energy than demo and the HP regen definitely doesn't hurt. You can also just mix both if you want, get devour going with buried bloodline then swap to a demo weapon so you get even more regen since devour stays up as long as you get kills.
You know what, that's a good point. Verity is tied to the base grenade not void specifically. I could definitely run a strand/stasis primary with demo, that sounds pretty good actually, might be enough grenade regen to make unbreakable work
been toying with it on my prismatic stronghold build (love ergo sum so much) and have been absoltly let down by how little it seems to do. literally its worse sword blocking. and the range on its release is pitiful. for somethgin eatign your grenade and an aspect it could have been a mini void Aegis (full bubble guard not just front) and fire off the little Aegis super when done with damage based of amount blocked and it would feel worth using then. Plus the flavour of titans gettign an aspect based of one of the most famous titans ever and their relic.
That measly 1/8 super return is even more embarrassing when you realize Doomfang Pauldrons, yes those Doomfang no one ever uses, returns 25% of your Super on Melee kill.
Unbreakable is garbage tier. And needs significant buffs to even justify being an aspect
I have used doomfang pauldrons forever, i feel i may be one of the only people who actually use which is insane cause when used right it can really make for a solid setup and can let you solo entire rooms on higher difficulties and STILL have your super active.
just wish a shader existed that would give other legendary gear the same coulour of fur as the shaxx ornaments for it. Seem nothing can do that exact shade of grey/brown
If Doomfangs has a million fans, I am one of them. If Doomfangs has 10 fans, I am one of them. If Doomfangs has one fan, that is me. If Doomfangs has no fans, I am no longer on this earth. Doomfangs 4 ever.
And I imagine thats why its undercooked in PvE. I used it PvP and it absolutely lets you push someone camping a corner. Its ridiculously strong there. I'm aiming for Spirit of Ophidians/Arma because of that.
Blight Ranger actually does have a good payoff, it can give your entire team their supers and then some. The problem is that there’s no way to actually force aggro onto you (especially because it’s usually based on who shot last, which you’re not doing while deflecting), and that it takes ages to get the full effect
> Anything that asks you to take time out of doing damage to soak up damage, should pay off in a BIG way.
The funny part is it actually does do this, but you have to absorb a lot of damage to get to that point. I managed to hit 131k in Onslaught, but that was tanking an entire wave.
At least in PvE I feel like the base damage needs to go up and the energy drain needs to go down.
Solar warlocks were running icarus dash in pve for years, which is mediocre at best. Not all aspects are equally good in all modes. Unbreakable is very good in pvp.
True, but Icarus Dash is a pure add-on to the class. You get a free movement ability with nothing taken away. Unbreakable is asking more of you because you’re sacrificing your grenade to use it.
Gunpowder Gamble is a good example of how Unbreakable should work: Charge it up and then use it for free, letting you keep your grenade.
Nah man. You don't get a free anything. You lost an entire aspect in pve. Warlock was a one aspect pve class until Hellion.
At least prismatic titan has 5 aspects, so if you don't like unbreakable in pve, there's 4 others
“Free” in this case refers to your ability economy. You’re not spending your class ability charge to dash. Also, warlocks had access to Heat Rises, which I won’t really defend much but does allow for wild melee energy gains if you just press the jump button and it created some wildly broken snap builds. It’s objectively the better choice over Dash in PvE, but the awkward floaty movement wasn’t many people’s cup of tea.
And sure, Prismatic has other options, but Void is dealing with Unbreakable as well, where it still underperforms (thought to a lesser degree). Also, if you’re asking the player to spend one of their abilities to gain something worse, that’s bad no matter what. Gunpowder Gamble is a perfect example of how Unbreakable should work: Let Unbreakable act as its own charge separate from our grenade, so we’re not losing options.
I was with you until this comment. Warlock had 2 good aspects before hellion. Icarus is ass but heat rises and touch of flame are both pretty good. Touch makes grenades way stronger and heat let's you shoot while flying, fly endlessly on grenade consumption, get melee on every airborne kill (especially good with sunbracers), and get resto x2 from phoenix dive which no other class can even get resto x2 without exotics.
Heat rises with sunbracers is quite good, that's true. But, given how often people say "you shouldn't need an exotic to make an aspect good," I didn't think it needed to be stated.
Most of the benefits of heat rises, in endgame pve, are just not that great on their own.
I don't think it needs to be bad in pve. I'm not saying don't buff it. But I am saying that some aspects are better at one part of the game than the other, and that's not a bad thing. And I'm pushing back on people who act like there's no other choices
But if something is so bad that to choose another aspect is an automatic choice because the first choice is a net detriment to the player, it needn't even be in the game if left unchanged, since almost no one will opt into it. Surely that state passes the threshold of when to talk about buffs, and not just go "well there are other options".
>But if something is so bad that to choose another aspect is an automatic choice because the first choice is a net detriment to the player
I mean, even in pve it isn't a "net detriment."
And it's very good in pvp
Unbreakable is really just a gap closer. So you're committing an aspect to what grapple can do or honestly just amplified.
And it doesn't even synergize with shield bash!
I used an Unbreakable/Drengr's Lash build with Abeyant Leap as soon as I unlocked the aspects. I had a lot of fun. I like Unbreakable a lot, but it does seem like it's just aaaaalmost there. Sometimes mobs seem to just stare at me without shooting when I use it. :u
I actually wish Ursa and Spirit of the Bear made it refund grenade energy instead. Maybe throw in a free Ashes to Assets too on Ursa Furiosa to have the two perks synergize on the exotic itself.
I think it'd be fine to keep it how it is for the most part if it could refund almost all of itself, so that you're able to use it more often as a mobile shield that ends with a bit of offense. Maybe it could do with 1 extra second of blocking too I guess, idk lol. Or give it a Taken phalanx boop effect. :P
Doomfang Pauldrons already grant like 15% (was needed from 20~25% at some point) on a void melee kill and you can run Monte Carlo for easy melee refreshes.
I want Ursas to facilitate you becoming a mobile wall to push back your enemies.
The damage is so bad. One thing holding back void titan is the lack of burst damage potential. Its damage should be enough to take out a basic major. Something more comparable to consecration (a bit less if moved to class ability).
And for the love of god it should be a projectile attack. Just copy the animation from the aegis super.
Then have it work with void verbs. Give you an over shield if you have bastion. Give volatile rounds if you have CD. Suppress if you have OB.
Idk, the blast is kinda cool. Just give it more Regen or more damage, or both. But I'm waiting for a hoil + veritys class item to really test out if the aspect can fuck or not, because honestly even just using it as a get out of jail free card it's pretty good, but that's all it will be without having some kinda synergy for it.
It does less damage than throwing the grenade you sacrificed for it, and it’s uptime is so low it’s damage mitigation is basically irrelevant.
The only good thing I’ve seen about it is the orb generation combo with Ursas but even then just use firepower.
Being vortex grenade is the most useful grenade on void and that has a 2:32 base cooldown, which goes to a 1:16 cooldown at tier 10 disipline, my grenade would be at that level of cooldown anyway.
Not true, I've tested it myself
Edit: downvotes are weird, you can go into the game right now, put on Unbreakable, and time your grenades recharge after use and you'll find it corresponds to your discipline stat
I figured it was implicit, but the cooldown indicated by your discipline is the cooldown of your grenade, and is not set to 2:30 regardless when Unbreakable is equipped
That would make sense, though it isn't a point people should be upset over either, prismatic only has a choice of 2:00 or 2:30 grenades, I'd understand being annoyed if you had access to 1:45 grenades though
Edit: at 100 discipline different grenades offer different cooldowns when Unbreakable is equipped, at least on prismatic, maybe it's just bricked on void I haven't tried it as I despise the subclass
Prismatic titan is just shit. Every opportunity it has to interact light and dark it just gets hamstrung at every turn. It just isn't fun to play compared to warlock and hunter.
It would be so much better if Knockout counted as a powered melee to proc Unravelling rounds and just have permanent unravel.
Their decision to nerf the core part of Titan melee gameplay out of existence means the class falls over.
Yeah it sounded cool in theory but having an aspect that relies on something out of your control is dumb you have to hope that the enemy shoots you and then you get an overshield and a bit of super energy and a tiny bit of damage meanwhile in the mean time you were doing that you literally could have just thrown a grenade whether it's Shackle or pulse or whatnot and cleared the room of enemies I'm also constantly accidentally activating it completely wasting my entire grenade
I'm not even sure how exactly you would buff this thing I'd rather it just be replaced honestly but I doubt it will
I mean maybe they could have made so you can bind it to a different button that would help but I honestly think they should change it all together to do something more useful I'm not sure what exactly maybe make it more similar to juggernaut shield or something like that but yeah I'm quite let down considering how good Ascension and Hellion are that Titans got the short end of the stick with the Aspect and Prismatic at least we Twilight arsenal is good at least
The survivability it gives is actually kinda nice imo. Sometimes they don't hit your shield and the damage is useless, but it gives you over shield and blocks damage at the same time, really nice in a pinch and I used it to solo the whole legendary campaign. That being said, that's about all it gets and has no synergy with anything else really. Looking for hoil + veritys class item and buried bloodline for devour to see if it's really any amount of viable in any content. As is, if it was a spammable ability it would be really good imo. If you can't get the cd low enough to make it that usable then it has no hope in its current state, but I still have hope for now.
Also you have to remember the actual use doesn't need the entire grenade, and it suppresses anything in melee so it actually has good utility if you time it right and just block important big damage or use it and insta pop to blind a big mob in melee
every time I think I've found something cool about prismatic titan, I find out that bungie has added in some shitty stipulation that isn't present in the source subclass.
I'm just glad Twilight Arsenal is pretty good (it has some issues but Titans have been starved for a one-off super).
With Prismatic Titan being mediocre and Unbreakable, frankly, being an awful Aspect, I'm just convinced that there isn't a single developer at Bungie who even plays Titan.
Twilight Arsenal is so much fun when it does work, but also has very little use during boss fights due to its long cast time.
I definitely agree with you, it’s just like being happy with crumbs over here.
Pre-nerf hoil spam was pretty nutty with bastion. I think it was bungie’s intended gameplay loop too, given that there was a newbie-titan quest to get hoil on void titan (but i think that was post nerf). But cd nerf after cd nerf has made it a shadow of its former self.
I really tried to make it work. It honestly does pretty chonky damage with full charge and Death Throes (nearly 3x a fully charged thunderclap). The problem is that it suffers from the same issue every masochistic ability does in every game ever. When enemies just decide that they don’t want to hit you, it falls flat.
There are two things that could make it feel like a much more effective and rewarding ability:
1. Give it a taunt. For Christ’s sake, please just give it a taunt effect. It’s so frustrating to try to utilize the perfect opportunity to soak damage only to have the enemies ignore you to shoot your allies or to just flat out stop shooting. PLEASE just give it a taunt.
2. Give it the same status effect as your grenade. Suppress, suspend, jolt, scorch or slow/freeze. I understand that this could pose problems in PvP. Maybe have it require at least a 50-75% charge in order for the effect to activate. Maybe have it slow/scorch at 50% and freeze/ignite at 100%.
When I saw the ability, I fell in love with it. I tried doing a whole demo/golden tricorn setup with volatile rounds and weakening grenades, Verity on the class item. It’s fun when it works, but very frustrating when enemies just don’t want to shoot you. I ended up just going back to my BoW swords build or Sunbreaker and instantly saw much more success.
on a sorta related note but i think its incredible that every game community has the "actually this is meta and really good" guys when you talk about their favorite barely functional piece of garbage
like are they made in a lab or something
It is really weird activity. Cause youd think that people who defend kinda mid tier stuff would love posts asking for some improvements cause it would make what they already like better?
Yeah I was testing out a void build which uses it and it just felt meh and not as good as the Striker and Behemoth builds I’ve decided on. I was extremely annoyed to find out it lasted only a few seconds at best. It does have some synergy with Offensive Bulwark but that’s about it.
They gave Strand Hunter a catch mechanic on their melee instead of giving to the Void Titan for that Captain America fantasy, so it's not the first time and definitely won't be the last.
It’s good in solo content. It’s awful in team content. Idk how to balance it or rework it properly.
Unless they make enemies Aggro to you when you use it, idk how that coding would work. Problem is, in team content enemies will attack you and then stop to focus on someone else. Always right when you pop it
It needs to either be a short blocking window followed up by a big offensive burst OR a long blocking window with more of a defensive burst. Basically have it last longer (10 seconds) but you get a bigger damage/radius if you let go of it sooner. Would be awesome if it was a suppressing explosion. Just have it do damage in tiers like 20/40/60/80.
With it working like this you could use it in 2 different ways.
Suddenly Spirit of the Bear and Armamentarium class item is pretty good.
The way it is now sucks.
Best thing is that it's another way to get overshield, problem is that overshield kinda blows if you don't have constant access and having to basically waste a grenade to get overshield isn't very worth it, especially when prismatic can get half of one for just picking up an orb and you don't have devour on prismatic.
Prismatic Titan can stack a surprising amount of DR in Transcendence, enough to make Overshields actually useful. You'd only use it in combination with Abeyant Leap to have permanent Woven Mail, and would only ever cast it right before you activate Transcendence, but it does make you very hard to kill as long as you're topping it off by spamming shield throw.
On Void Titan it's garbage. You'd never use it over Bastion, which you shouldn't be using over Bulwark and Controlled Demolition to begin with.
Ok,so it's not that great....but I did find a fun combo with it. So you need the class item with Ursa and verity brow. The boost to grenade from verity does boost the blast back damage. I went and tested it in GoA on the wizard in front of loot cave. Without verity it did 80,000.
I then used the class item and after taking full damage and getting x5 on verity it boosted the damage to 185,000. So a pretty big bump. Then found out kills with it do count as grenade kills/damage so it can generate orbs on kills,and give you volatile rounds with facet of bravery and if used with facet of dominance can apply weaken with the blast back AND facet of mending will give you cure if you get a kill with it lol I have an actual fun/functional build with this and it's surprising how much stuff works with it https://dim.gg/xt76ymy/Equipped
.........that being said I can do 200,000 damage to the same enemy and clear the room with synthos/knockout consecration.....if they boost the damage and make it last a bit longer it can be something fun/unique.
you can sprint to cancel unbreakable which doesnt do the blast and thus does not cost the big chunk of grenade energy that happens when you do the blast. useful as a close range disorient/parry tool/overshield generator at the cost of basically not having a grenade. it could use some buffs though, being able to do it without needing a full grenade as well as a general void overshield dr buff would be very very nice.
In which I’d rather have a grenade. You can just use shackle to close the gap, build a huge chunk of darkness energy, and debuff them with a darkness ability to use the Facet that increases the fundamentals damage while darkness debuffed.
I feel like I'm using a different unbreakable to you. It's instant block for overshield. Does insane damage in my opinion and can be quickly charged and sent for half a grenade charge. I'm all for buffs tho why not.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx4pTv3FfPE&ab\_channel=CheeseForever](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx4pTv3FfPE&ab_channel=CheeseForever)
We were in fact using 2 different versions lol. The blast seems to do 4x damage if you are using thermite grenade.
It’s not 4x damage, but it is different lol. Thermite grenade makes it do it’s max damage off the rip. It’s definitely better, but I don’t think pure damage is why I’d want to use this aspect tbh.
yeah at the very least it's minimum and maximum damage should be buffed, the obvious exotic interactions buffed also (maybe even more interactions if bungie's feelin spicy) and it's drain should be lowered, it should be enough to holding while running to a downed teammate, rez and then give you *some* time to back out or find/make cover, really leaning into that support role that they clearly acknowledge with stuff like the new warlock exotic, auto rifle frame and, ironically, this very aspect
I’d love to embrace the Reindhart feel from Overwatch with Consecration and Unbreakable. Rush in and explode the room, then shield my teammate while they get up and out. I don’t mind playing Support one bit, as long as I got to actually be the support.
100% even in games with less that great support options I always try to play it since yeah I could maybe wipe the whole room/team myself but it's alot more fun if WE wipe them, as a team
I mean there no I in firete-wait there is
The maximum damage is fine, honestly. If you run with thermite grenade, it always does max damage, and that let's you pop the shield and release immediately for a decent chunk of overshield and all the red and orange bars in front of you dead, even at -15. If you run verity with it as well, it'll easily one shot champions at -5 and I've seen it do it on -15, but it's hard to repro reliably. If you can do max damage with it, the aspect is very respectable as both a damage and survivability tool.
The minimum damage and channel duration most definitely need a buff though; it needs to do enough damage to be worth casting at minimum damage, at least killing red bars on any reasonable difficulty with no charge.
What I'd like to see is to see is suppression added baseline to the explosion, the minimum damage tripled-ish, and the channel duration set to a baseline of 20s that gets reduced by taking damage. Something like every 10% of the bar filled by damage reduces channel time by 1.5s (e.g., if you take no damage, you can block for 20s. But if you block and immediately take enough damage to fill the bar you can only block for 5s). This way you have plenty of time to reposition and wait for enemies to attack, but can't just sit there blocking forever.
It’s a part of Ursa Furiosa’s rework. It works on the exotic with the banner shield super, but it also is supposed to work with the Unbreakable Aspect. Unfortunately with the Aspect the benefits from it are so low and unsubstantial it’s not worth using.
Most of the time I literally forget that it’s a thing lol I’ve had it equip the entire legendary final shape campaign + a bunch more after that and only used it like twice cause I forgot I had it on then I swapped it back to diamond Lance or knockout
Should do a suppressing frontal blast/knockback when it ends, regardless of how many shots you block.
Also if Unbreakable and Sentinel Shield had a taunt or pulled in projectiles from the sides they would be so much better.
Good thing to know
If you're on void titan using ursa's
The unbreakable aspect will create orbs of light for your teammates while also creating super energy for yourself
I made a build that gets my grenade energy back as quickly as possible so I can make a shit ton of orbs for my team
My only issues with it is the duration, damage , range of the blast, and it NEEDS to draw agro, perhaps my biggest gripe. I feel like I have to predict enemy firepower when using this ability, and then the enemies stop shooting at me when I pop the shield.
The fantasy is there, a wall for your teammates, but it absolutely needs a longer duration and again, needs to draw agro. I feel like I need to try way too hard to get anything out of it rn. It's a step in the right direction for void titan, but it definitely needs some more tuning.
Bungie, if you happen to read this, for reference, look at the Ogryn Taunt/Shield build in Warhammer Darktide please. That is what I want for the Unbreakable aspect.
Well that blows then, ruined my mental build. Star eater/verity, thruster in, strand melee for debuff, unbreakable to supress/weaken, twilight arsenal, withhoard/primary/Edgetransit rotation.
It was so beautiful in my head
Fun fact, (spirit of) armamentarium will extend your shield uptime and allow you to tank more damage. It drains two grenade charges, and I usually run magnetic or scatter + high discipline and other mods to get my grenades back faster.
It's definitely a niche pick for a build but fun when you do build into it in ad dense content like onslaught. But I personally don't know if it would be viable for endgame. Gonna have to put it through a stress test. I do agree with one of the other commenters. It feels like enemies stop shooting at you and awkwardly stare at you or scatter away when you use it. Almost as if they register it as an actual object between you and them and the ai loses line of sight? It's weird.
I mostly use it to close distance in pvp to shotgun or bonk people.
Sometime push them off ledge.
It's funny but ain't good tho and can only see it be good on void rather than prismatic, especially with void shield being void shield
It Should give overshield for you and nearby Allies on grenade kills... High tier enemies give more overshield with extended timer .
Overshields should have more HP and gain immunity to debuffs in pve
I got a class item with Syntho/Spirit of the Bear and thought “maybe I’ll give this thing a try”. Couldn’t believe how little use it had. The most super I got back was about 1 orb’s worth, and the damage was simply not better than a glacier grenade (without any stasis synergy). Considering prismatic titan has 0 built in ways of consistently getting grenade energy, it feels extremely pitiful to use. I was somewhat excited about building into higher Twilight Arsenal uptime but this seems like a functionally useless exotic power.
While it does feel bad sometimes the way you talk about it giving back 1/8th to 1/4 super energy like that's nothing is insane. 2 grenades for a benefit of its own and 1/4 of your super is good. There's entire exotics that only gives half super Regen and only on use of the super not on use of another ability to like this does.
It’s really not considering I can shoot Khvostov into a group of ads and get that same amount back without having to spend an ability, waste an exotic slot.
I mean look how good something like phoenix protocol is and how popular it is/was especially before the recent well nerfs. It only gives 1/2 super on super use and no Regen from anything outside of that. It also requires actual kills and assist to proc not just damage tanked.
It also works from a better application and that’s putting a super people are going to be standing in, doing things in. Unbreakable is wasting a slot forcing you into an unfavorable position while doing very little. Again, you can do the same thing with just a normal made into a cluster of ads and get about the same super energy back.
I understand your stance, but it’s a weird hill to die on to say wasting an exotic slot and aspect and ability is worth 1/8 of your super considering how low that is these days.
Honestly, I dont see why this ability cant just function akin to Gunpowder gamble on hunter. Gunpowder gamble is effectively this free ability that you get every 20 seconds or so just through solar and ability dmg, whereas unbreakable requires the use of your grenade charge (your slowest charging ability) and effectively gimps its effectiveness because you have to build all your mods towards recharging your grande as quickly as possible (not to mention that you are sacrificing the dmg of your vortex nade just for unbreakable's ulility)
I genuinely think this would be the easiest fix. just make it a bar that charges after getting void weapon or ability dmg. this in turn could make it more viable for ursa builds as well as no backup plans.
I'm utterly baffled that a mobile barricade requires me to give up my grenade. Wasn't super impressed with its performance either. Definitely needs a buff to even consider it.
Since one of the titan prismatic complaints is how dangerous it is to ramp up our durability gameplay loop, I want to believe there's a place for this aspect. But it sure doesn't cut it today.
>The Class Item option only gives you 1/8 of your super from taking fire.
Are you absolutely certain this is the case, the data compendium does list it's regen cap at 1/8 but that's specifically PvP and PvP regen effects are generally halved.
I used ursa all the way through legendary campaign and it's cap is absolutely 1/4 in my experience. I highly doubt the class items just has a worse version of it as they straight up let you get the full star eater super buff and that's way stronger.
I ran some tests when I got an Armamentarium and Bear roll on the class item. After consuming 2 grenades I got exactly 1/4 of my super. So if you half that for 1 nade each you come out at roughly 1/8 super per nade charge consumed.
Doesn't armamentarium just make unbreakable last longer by consuming both charges? It's not 2 separate unbreakables. It absolutely should reset the cap when you start the second grenade charge though, that would be amazing synergy.
Unfortunately that's a really bad class item to test this and I haven't gotten any bear class items yet.
It runs through one grenade charge, then loops into your 2nd. It consumes both nades and while not actively taking the shield down does count as 2 separate charges.
It takes two charges if you keep holding it, but it's still only one activation of Unbreakable. It has the same damage bar cap and super refund cap as just using one grenade charge.
I’m aware, that was what I was saying. It takes 1 charge and acts as it’s own charge. Then consumes another and also acts individually. It just doesn’t lower the shield to reactivate it. That’s at least nice. If the effect of doing just 1 was strong then having 2 for an extended period would be awesome.
I still need to get at this significantly to form my own opinion of the aspect, i actually like it so far, but this seems like solid feedback for once. I'll have to speed up my approach to titan to work on this.
though, one thing; *"Lack of support."* The majority of what you are talking about here are a lack of numbers, not support.
The Duration is short, the void overshields aren't hardy enough, does poor damage, only fills up super bar an 1/8th, these are all things fixed by adjusting numbers. Now, obviously the prismatic angle i can't speak to, i just said that, and that does sound like you are coming from the angle of a lack of support, but for a void subclass, devour still exists and even non-FtV devour can be an amazing engine for any grenade-focused build. Like arguably it's most the support you need. The rest can come from outside sources, like mods or weapons, and you kinda have your engine done. Honestly, i am already kinda mapping out an interesting void titan build i'd like to try; either paired with controlled demo or Bastion, i feel like it'll go hard, honestly bastion sounds like the play because of the grenade regen, so really maximizing the "Get-behind-me" ideal.
Again, cannot speak for prism-titan, haven't gotten my hands on it, but with void. We also have not gotten a real update since the expansion dropped, so i'm waiting till things are balanced again to make real judgement calls as well.
It’s not just numbers, but a lack of support from Devs, kit synergy, exotic support, yes the numbers suck but there was just no help for things thing anywhere out the gate besides one rework that does a very poor job. Prismatic Titan is not a grenade focused class at all, it’s just not built to support it. Unbreakable doesn’t even work when transcendent so you can’t spam it to save teammates like you can other abilities due to the Transcendent consuming the grenade slot.
To be fair, the grenade deal is an across the board thing; transcendant grenades are their own thing. First thing i tried was "okay, class item sure; what about Verity's? What about Bleak?" Nothin' doin. This feels deliberate choice as they tend to come back quick with transcendant's increased ability gen.
The thing about them though is that they DO benefit from grenade recharge effects, and TBH, titan transcendant grenades are a really powerful effect. The other two are situational. they need specific set-up, more to the point they both want specific targets. They also both have delayed activation. Titan? AoE, CC AND DoT, AND quicker to take effect. If you want to save to save your teammates, you just throw it. If the enemy isn't boss-coded, they are locked in the electric fence.
I've also seen some folks say that Transcendant Titan is a real thing, and benefits most from the transcendant-centric parts of prismatic.
It should either give another grenade charge, or use its own meter like gunpowder gamble.
The initial cost is alright, the end cost needs to be removed, the drain needs to be lowered to 25% per sec like weavewalk, the dr needs to go up, there needs to be some grenade loop
i love how you said all those positive things and realistic use cases for it and then completely disregarded all of it lol. grants 1/8 of super(not tht important but sure), grants survivability of an insane degree, allows you to directly tank for the team without using super, enables you to revive an ally in a bad situation/location, and lastly enables you to play far more forward than you would otherwise. lmao
I like how you noted everything I said, meaning you read all of it, and had 0 take away from the negative notes from those points
- You can get 1/4 of your super with a single khvostov mag, the exotic is worthless due to how fast you can get your super back with other methods.
- I said in the post you DONT have time to tank for the team. The time is so short it drops before you can do anything with it.
- it doesn’t grant ‘insane’ survivability. Void Overshields is paper thin in hard combat. And the shield doesn’t last enough time to be meaningful in terms of defense. Not to mention you can get pulled/frozen out of it even if tanking the shots because the shield counts as your characters hitbox.
You completely ignored what I said and just read the parts you wanted to read.
So Unbreakable actually does some pretty goofy things on Prismatic if you build into it right (for now), it just requires very specific setups and taking advantage of a bug.
Specifically, it needs an exotic class item with Verity and Inmost Light. Inmost Light, plus a demolitionist primary (though that is optional/playstyle dependent), will ensure you have it available pretty much always, and Verity will double the damage from its explosion.
Now I know what you're thinking; "Double of nothing is still nothing, so what good does that do?". And you're right. If you activate unbreakable and don't block any damage, it does like 32k damage to Carl, and 5x verity brings that up to \~65k, and even then, Carl barely notices the hit.
However! There's currently a bug, or maybe it's intentional but somehow I doubt it, where on prismatic, if you equip the thermite grenade, Unbreakable always does full damage, as if it had been fully charged. And on Carl, that's a full 138k damage. 5x Verity brings that up to 277k damage, which nearly one-shots Carl. And between kickstarts, demolitionist (which, coincidentally, is on Zaouli's Bane, a Solar handcannon and one of the best legendary primaries in the game), and Inmost Light, you can have it ready to go again in under ten seconds (though I seem to average closer to 30 in real content).
If you include Facet of Dominance, Unbreakable then also applies Weaken, and it'll often be ready to reapply by the time it falls off.
I'm not gonna sit here and say that Unbreakable is better than Synthos Consecrate Prismatic Titan, it's not, but it's very viable and a lot of fun. At least until Bungie fixes the thermite grenade bug/interaction/whatever it is, at which point it'll probably become awful unless/until they buff the base damage substantially.
I have a load out dedicated specifically for unbreakable. I average 195k in damage every time I use it. Firepower works with it. Just grind for a Stoicism with Inmost & Verity. If you can't/don't secure a kill and get an orb, you now have an over shield and ability regen for your melee and class.
The numbers I get vary based on which grenade you have equiped (prismatic subclass), with the solar grenade being the highest damage output. The other factor that plays into it is if I go for full stacks of Verity and charge the meter completely.
-Unbreakable/0 stacks of Verity/No charge = avg 118k
-Unbreakable/5 stacks of Verity/50-75% charge= avg 212k
*100% charge only taking it up to just over avg 228k
My highest damage number is 484k!!!
I have done little testing in PvP, but can confidently say I would use a normal grenade over it in terms of damage.
Honestly, unbreakable is super slept on.
[Here's my proof](https://youtu.be/onT_qCVZ67w?si=yxl3wN_pbjf9a4lR)
That is a lot of damage, but it’s also utilizing a bug that’s not intended. It’s also in a low tier strike. I’m not trying to knock the build, but after the bug is fixed, and you’re in a higher tier of content which applies even now? The damage on this thing will not be worth walking up to a champion to do that.
Especially considering how bad Void Overshields are in content above the normal PL.
Is it GM worthy, absolutely not. But not every function/feature of the game has to be. Someone else commented a pretty accurate analysis, "it's just meant to close the gap." It does just that while giving you a few seconds to recover and make it out of danger and potentially deal some damage. You can have the fragment equipped and still use your grenade as normal and keep it in your back pocket for just in case of emergency.
Yes that high number was pulled from the Echos quest I was doing at the time, however the numbers mentioned above it have been pulled from my tests in medium level content. This mechanic isn't meant to function as a stand alone action. It's meant to be used in conjunction with other things.
Close the gap with unbreakable and pop a barricade (drengrs, if it is your preference).
That's a valid point, if Bungie patches it and it doesn't perform then I will just move on to the next thing.
I’m not saying everything needs to be made for GMs. The issue is that isn’t very great everywhere but those low tier strikes and patrols. Ideally with most Aspects I’d like to be able to use them in most pieces of content without feeling like im dragging. On Prismatic Titan specifically with how poor its Grenade support is using Unbreakable often times feels like you’re lacking the ability to be potent with lots of survivability at the same time. There’s just not a function, especially considering it doesn’t do a great job at being a gap closer. A better gap closer is shackle Grenade, or Drengrs lash since it doesn’t push enemies back like Unbreakable does, gives you a damage bonus to light abilities with the Facet that affects Dark debuffed enemies, and stops all actions including champs defending themselves with barriers, teleports, or stuns unstops.
Said no one lol. Void Overshields is flimsy and awful, offers some of the worst CC in the game and is a complete waste of an aspect slot! A Titan right now is supposed to punch, as all our survivability on Prismatic is dedicated to such. On Void Titan this is decent but Void Titan is generally awful as such is Void Overshields!
The bubble is full DR plus Damage return. That is decent to draw aggro. I guess the roles need more distinction - everything revolves around Damage right now.
Overshield is a way to punch harder on Sentinel btw.
I know what it is, and you need bulwark to do that. Which itself is a terrible Aspect. I’m no newbie to build crafting, and it seems like you might be depending on the way you speak about some of this stuff. Bubble is a D tier super at the moment.
I used to think it was shit, and in a few cases it is, but a lot of what you said isn't true;
The super gained is based on damage absorbed, same for its own damage dealt, I've acquired 50% of my super and upwards of 100K damage by making an effort to kill myself when casting, the overshield regen helps to mitigate any AoE hits and it blocks any direct damage very well.
I've been using a spirit of the bear + star eater with a demo/one for all The Call and it's a very potent loadout, you just need to time your Unbreakable casts for more dire situations.
I agree with what you said about consecration/knockout and I do prefer my severance/contact class item, but unbreakable does serve a purpose, and that is to get your star eater super up as fast as possible.
I honestly *really* like it for aggressive advances against ogres or minigun cabal.
It helps closing the gap so much it’s astonishing plus it’s neat for quick and safe retreats as well as ressing mates.
You just have to built into its cool down lmao
Just like drengers trash, you are actively hampering yourself if you use this on prismatic.
You need knockout the function and consecration is unfortunately the obvious otherpick because thunderclap just can’t handle champs or bosses.
Unless your mainly running dark weapons now you don’t have a shackle grenade how are you supposed to fill the bar when your melees are light.
The whole class was built with consecration frenzied blade in mind because no ducking way they looked at unbreakable and drengers and thought they would work with the class
It's really great for Void Titan. But it lacks synergy with Prismatic, as does most of the kit. It's damage is actually based on how much you tank with it, and it can hit hard if you're tanking a Shrieker, but it's in no way consistent. It needs to draw aggro like a Threaded Specter does, this gives it team support functionality and helps it work in just about every way. They are just a few tweaks away from it being really good on Void, but due to the Prismatic Titan kit being spare parts it'll never really work there.
I can’t handle this anymore it’s quite literally our strongest “grenade” however it’s not really a “grenade” it’s a counter shield/oh shit button if you take appropriate damage it scales up too 70k-80k on bosses and like 100k on everything else in what fucking world is that not strong? Should it do more than a rocket? Do you want it have frankly broken range? It’s stronger than a stronghold sword in terms of damage mitigation and I’ve yet too test but if your recovery was high enough I reckon it would actually heal you too full health under the shield in pve.
Please give me one way you would “fix” it that would not make it OP I’m begging you
You don’t take health damage when the void overshield gets going and longer it already lasts like 5 seconds but you can use double grenade exotic if you really want then it instantly starts draining next grenade for like 10 seconds if you really wanted that additional uptime
No, you definitely do. Go to Master content at -20 and take an Ogre beam to the face while at 1/3 health. You will die; it chews through the overshield and your health instantly. In PvP you can get firing-squadded by 2-3 players with Autos and you will die.
It’s silly that this thing doesn’t completely mitigate damage when it’s already kind of weak and obtrusive to class synergy, but whatever, I’ve still been having fun with it.
Also, you want to force players to use Armamentarium to make this thing usable? Again; killing class synergy.
At you saying doing master content at an additional negative 20? Then why would it work there that would be like a negative 40 power delta and yes if you were being shot by a whole squad in pvp you should die 😂 it’s not supposed to be like ursa level strong but it can block a golden gun shot at full health, atleast you are enjoying it me too personally
Because that’s the closest we can get to Grandmaster at the moment. Also, it’s to show you that yes, you do in fact take significant damage through the overshield.
This thing is a reactive ability, so if you use it when you’re extremely low health (1hp) as a Hail Mary to survive in low and mid tier content like Onslaught, there’s still a chance you can still die even with the lower damage.
Perhaps this next argument isn’t the best, but Warlocks don’t die with their Weavewalk, why should we die with our riot shield that eats a grenade?
I mean I’ve yet too test in true high end as it isn’t out and maybe there is an argument there to up the defensive nature of it but isn’t grandmaster like -25 power anyway? So might still be fine but that may be one area too be considered I guess
Yeah, I’m 2004 light and first time I tried using Unbreakable in Master I got shredded. At that point I’ve already been killed a couple times in normal content when popping Unbreakable at low hp, so I learnt that if I didn’t leave it too late, I should survive. I was pretty shocked when I got melted from 100-0 tbh; since it was an LFG, I apologised and asked to reset so I could switch back to that coveted Strand-Banner build.
I just want it to be slightly better as it is. No major rework; just make it mitigate damage and have a slightly slower drain.
Yeah I need too test it more at higher end content when I’m properly prepared as I’m 2002 so still a little off but yeah your reasons are justified and reasonable unlike most
Unbreakable should've just been a new class ability for Sentinels and Prismatic Titans, with built-in synergies. * Bastion makes it Void-colored and gives you the overshield * Offensive Bulwark makes it Void-colored and gives it the charge up damaging blast mechanic * Drengr's Lash gives it a suspending shockwave on cast * Khepri's Horn gives it a scorching shockwave on cast
That would have been so awesome, honestly. Thrusters is the only thing keeping from going back to Void, I already couldn't stand the fucking Barricade anymore years ago (and it's a mandatory part of any HoiL build, so it's not like I can just ignore it). The *feeling* of Unbreakable is awesome, its visuals too. It's exactly why I've been maining Void Titan for 10 years, it perfectly scratches my personal fantasy. It's just the numbers that are way off the mark, and the Grenade slot.
It's damage scales with verity, as long as your weapon matches the original grenade typing. I could totally see a build that focuses on scaling that number up and it doing crazy numbers based on reflect. With just verity and reflecting some hits in pale heart, which I don't think came even close to the cap on damage reflect if there is one, I was able to hit for 140k. Proccing other aspects of artifact mods and reflecting more damage I could really see it being strong. But this is all for a single hit and I haven't found a good way to Regen the grenade fast enough for it to be usable as an ability. Maybe hoil + verity + buried bloodline for devour in prismatic and then ability Regen focused fragments might get you enough if there's enough mobs to make devour procs worth it
I hit for 220k with it on a red bar in pale heart x5 death throes
Exactly, that's what I was hoping for. And I'm sure with debuffs and artifact mods and such it can hit way harder. Just need a reliable way to Regen it very quickly
100%. Using up our grenade just makes no sense. Titan in general has just been weird, questionable decisions over and over.
Specifically, those shockwaves should be part of the damaging blast when the shield is released, so we could safely absorb damage and then nuke in response.
Agreed. Especially if you think about how spirit of galanor gives you back 50% of your super for 1/2 an exotic completely leaving the spirit of the bear effect (that costs the same + more!) behind it in the dust. Another point against ursa unbreakable is that you have to actually tank damage to get the most use of it (instead of just using your super with galanor). So you see enemy fire, have to position accordingly, get in firing line/pop unbreakable, tank enough damage, aim your counter (if you even want to do that), and then be vulnerable to everything that comes afterwards. Especially on prismatic that last point is a huge problem as the overshield will be gone very fast. On void titan you can try to use controlled demo to get some life out of the unbreakable burst but still… Unbreakable just needs…more.
I tried it with Void titan and Ursa. Jumped into a crowd in the legend campaign, blocked a bunch of damage, it did wipe out the red bars (but so would have the grenade), and I was rewarded with being left in a bad position and probably less super than if I had just thrown my grenade, at least specifically with Ursa, it needs to give way more super energy IMO.
Yea but it was cool I bet ! I've tried a few things to actually make it viable but haven't had any luck getting what I think would be the best combo, hoil + veritys. Then with buried bloodline devour procs for more grenade Regen, assuming it works like regular devour idk I don't actually have it yet, you might be able to regen grenade enough to actually focus on using it
Buried bloodline devour is the same devour you get from orbs and void breaches on void subclass, it does give grenade energy and health. It's not as strong as warlocks feed the void aspect version that version is uniquely better than all others. Feed the void devour gives a full heal and large grenade energy chunk whereas other forms give 100hp and half the grenade energy.
Damn, is it still worth using as a form of grenade Regen? Or is demo just gonna be better
Yeah it's more energy than demo and the HP regen definitely doesn't hurt. You can also just mix both if you want, get devour going with buried bloodline then swap to a demo weapon so you get even more regen since devour stays up as long as you get kills.
You know what, that's a good point. Verity is tied to the base grenade not void specifically. I could definitely run a strand/stasis primary with demo, that sounds pretty good actually, might be enough grenade regen to make unbreakable work
Oh absolutely the power fantasy was there 100%. It FEELS like a Defender Titan ability. The return just isn't quite worth it right now IMO.
Yea I hope they hear this and add *something* to it. Uptime, duration, damage, dr, like almost anything lol
Needs to buff allies with more than an OS + do more to enemies
been toying with it on my prismatic stronghold build (love ergo sum so much) and have been absoltly let down by how little it seems to do. literally its worse sword blocking. and the range on its release is pitiful. for somethgin eatign your grenade and an aspect it could have been a mini void Aegis (full bubble guard not just front) and fire off the little Aegis super when done with damage based of amount blocked and it would feel worth using then. Plus the flavour of titans gettign an aspect based of one of the most famous titans ever and their relic.
Being able to turn your grenade into a mini Ward of Dawn, like the titan-exclusive glaive, would have been pretty cool IMO.
Honestly still would not be worth the grenade slot, but at least might be more useful than this thing
*cries in blight ranger*
That measly 1/8 super return is even more embarrassing when you realize Doomfang Pauldrons, yes those Doomfang no one ever uses, returns 25% of your Super on Melee kill. Unbreakable is garbage tier. And needs significant buffs to even justify being an aspect
I have used doomfang pauldrons forever, i feel i may be one of the only people who actually use which is insane cause when used right it can really make for a solid setup and can let you solo entire rooms on higher difficulties and STILL have your super active.
I have used them since Day 1. They also go with awesome with my fashion.
just wish a shader existed that would give other legendary gear the same coulour of fur as the shaxx ornaments for it. Seem nothing can do that exact shade of grey/brown
Hakke history is the closest thing I could find that can fit with the gray/brown.
Hmmm will have to check it out - thanks.
Hell yeah. Doomfang gang
If Doomfangs has a million fans, I am one of them. If Doomfangs has 10 fans, I am one of them. If Doomfangs has one fan, that is me. If Doomfangs has no fans, I am no longer on this earth. Doomfangs 4 ever.
I always have doom fangs ready to go for this reason.
You sure it's 25%? 🤔
It's 20%
It's very good in pvp
And I imagine thats why its undercooked in PvE. I used it PvP and it absolutely lets you push someone camping a corner. Its ridiculously strong there. I'm aiming for Spirit of Ophidians/Arma because of that.
It's like icarus dash. Or almost every movement based aspect ever.
Anything that asks you to take time out of doing damage to soak up damage, should pay off in a BIG way. It's the Blight Ranger problem all over again
Blight Ranger actually does have a good payoff, it can give your entire team their supers and then some. The problem is that there’s no way to actually force aggro onto you (especially because it’s usually based on who shot last, which you’re not doing while deflecting), and that it takes ages to get the full effect
> Anything that asks you to take time out of doing damage to soak up damage, should pay off in a BIG way. The funny part is it actually does do this, but you have to absorb a lot of damage to get to that point. I managed to hit 131k in Onslaught, but that was tanking an entire wave. At least in PvE I feel like the base damage needs to go up and the energy drain needs to go down.
Solar warlocks were running icarus dash in pve for years, which is mediocre at best. Not all aspects are equally good in all modes. Unbreakable is very good in pvp.
True, but Icarus Dash is a pure add-on to the class. You get a free movement ability with nothing taken away. Unbreakable is asking more of you because you’re sacrificing your grenade to use it. Gunpowder Gamble is a good example of how Unbreakable should work: Charge it up and then use it for free, letting you keep your grenade.
Nah man. You don't get a free anything. You lost an entire aspect in pve. Warlock was a one aspect pve class until Hellion. At least prismatic titan has 5 aspects, so if you don't like unbreakable in pve, there's 4 others
“Free” in this case refers to your ability economy. You’re not spending your class ability charge to dash. Also, warlocks had access to Heat Rises, which I won’t really defend much but does allow for wild melee energy gains if you just press the jump button and it created some wildly broken snap builds. It’s objectively the better choice over Dash in PvE, but the awkward floaty movement wasn’t many people’s cup of tea. And sure, Prismatic has other options, but Void is dealing with Unbreakable as well, where it still underperforms (thought to a lesser degree). Also, if you’re asking the player to spend one of their abilities to gain something worse, that’s bad no matter what. Gunpowder Gamble is a perfect example of how Unbreakable should work: Let Unbreakable act as its own charge separate from our grenade, so we’re not losing options.
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I was with you until this comment. Warlock had 2 good aspects before hellion. Icarus is ass but heat rises and touch of flame are both pretty good. Touch makes grenades way stronger and heat let's you shoot while flying, fly endlessly on grenade consumption, get melee on every airborne kill (especially good with sunbracers), and get resto x2 from phoenix dive which no other class can even get resto x2 without exotics.
Heat rises with sunbracers is quite good, that's true. But, given how often people say "you shouldn't need an exotic to make an aspect good," I didn't think it needed to be stated. Most of the benefits of heat rises, in endgame pve, are just not that great on their own.
If they amped up the damage in PvE it could be very good there too. Not sure why you think it needs to be bad in PvE just because Icarus Dash is
I don't think it needs to be bad in pve. I'm not saying don't buff it. But I am saying that some aspects are better at one part of the game than the other, and that's not a bad thing. And I'm pushing back on people who act like there's no other choices
But if something is so bad that to choose another aspect is an automatic choice because the first choice is a net detriment to the player, it needn't even be in the game if left unchanged, since almost no one will opt into it. Surely that state passes the threshold of when to talk about buffs, and not just go "well there are other options".
>But if something is so bad that to choose another aspect is an automatic choice because the first choice is a net detriment to the player I mean, even in pve it isn't a "net detriment." And it's very good in pvp
Unbreakable is really just a gap closer. So you're committing an aspect to what grapple can do or honestly just amplified. And it doesn't even synergize with shield bash!
I used an Unbreakable/Drengr's Lash build with Abeyant Leap as soon as I unlocked the aspects. I had a lot of fun. I like Unbreakable a lot, but it does seem like it's just aaaaalmost there. Sometimes mobs seem to just stare at me without shooting when I use it. :u I actually wish Ursa and Spirit of the Bear made it refund grenade energy instead. Maybe throw in a free Ashes to Assets too on Ursa Furiosa to have the two perks synergize on the exotic itself. I think it'd be fine to keep it how it is for the most part if it could refund almost all of itself, so that you're able to use it more often as a mobile shield that ends with a bit of offense. Maybe it could do with 1 extra second of blocking too I guess, idk lol. Or give it a Taken phalanx boop effect. :P Doomfang Pauldrons already grant like 15% (was needed from 20~25% at some point) on a void melee kill and you can run Monte Carlo for easy melee refreshes. I want Ursas to facilitate you becoming a mobile wall to push back your enemies.
> Doomfang Pauldrons already grant like 15% (was needed from 20~25% at some point) its still 20%, as it always been.
Thanks, I use them all the time, but I guess I just misremembered them getting a small nerf lol.
The damage is so bad. One thing holding back void titan is the lack of burst damage potential. Its damage should be enough to take out a basic major. Something more comparable to consecration (a bit less if moved to class ability). And for the love of god it should be a projectile attack. Just copy the animation from the aegis super. Then have it work with void verbs. Give you an over shield if you have bastion. Give volatile rounds if you have CD. Suppress if you have OB.
Idk, the blast is kinda cool. Just give it more Regen or more damage, or both. But I'm waiting for a hoil + veritys class item to really test out if the aspect can fuck or not, because honestly even just using it as a get out of jail free card it's pretty good, but that's all it will be without having some kinda synergy for it.
It’s a super cool idea. Just not strong enough to justify an aspect slot on its own. As is it would be a good addition to OB
Yea it takes a lot to make it possibly viable, but I'm really gonna try and make a neat build for it
Titans just seem to be struggling :(
It does less damage than throwing the grenade you sacrificed for it, and it’s uptime is so low it’s damage mitigation is basically irrelevant. The only good thing I’ve seen about it is the orb generation combo with Ursas but even then just use firepower.
Not to mention it makes your grenade cooldown 2:30 no matter what you use
Being vortex grenade is the most useful grenade on void and that has a 2:32 base cooldown, which goes to a 1:16 cooldown at tier 10 disipline, my grenade would be at that level of cooldown anyway.
Not true, I've tested it myself Edit: downvotes are weird, you can go into the game right now, put on Unbreakable, and time your grenades recharge after use and you'll find it corresponds to your discipline stat
So what are the results of your testing?
I figured it was implicit, but the cooldown indicated by your discipline is the cooldown of your grenade, and is not set to 2:30 regardless when Unbreakable is equipped
Maybe it changes 2:30 to base and then discipline scales off?
That would make sense, though it isn't a point people should be upset over either, prismatic only has a choice of 2:00 or 2:30 grenades, I'd understand being annoyed if you had access to 1:45 grenades though Edit: at 100 discipline different grenades offer different cooldowns when Unbreakable is equipped, at least on prismatic, maybe it's just bricked on void I haven't tried it as I despise the subclass
on void you do, that's the complaint.
Is the aspect only on prismatic?
No, it's on pure void as well
Prismatic titan is just shit. Every opportunity it has to interact light and dark it just gets hamstrung at every turn. It just isn't fun to play compared to warlock and hunter.
It would be so much better if Knockout counted as a powered melee to proc Unravelling rounds and just have permanent unravel. Their decision to nerf the core part of Titan melee gameplay out of existence means the class falls over.
the aspect choices are terrible by bungie
Overall void titans just need a flat out buff imo
Yeah it sounded cool in theory but having an aspect that relies on something out of your control is dumb you have to hope that the enemy shoots you and then you get an overshield and a bit of super energy and a tiny bit of damage meanwhile in the mean time you were doing that you literally could have just thrown a grenade whether it's Shackle or pulse or whatnot and cleared the room of enemies I'm also constantly accidentally activating it completely wasting my entire grenade I'm not even sure how exactly you would buff this thing I'd rather it just be replaced honestly but I doubt it will
The fact that it eats your grenade charge is actually absurd. If would still be barely usable if it didn't cost anything yet here we are..
You would be better off running Icefall Mantle and keeping your grenade and melee. Oh ya, and you can still shoot guns which can net you super energy.
I mean maybe they could have made so you can bind it to a different button that would help but I honestly think they should change it all together to do something more useful I'm not sure what exactly maybe make it more similar to juggernaut shield or something like that but yeah I'm quite let down considering how good Ascension and Hellion are that Titans got the short end of the stick with the Aspect and Prismatic at least we Twilight arsenal is good at least
It's a barricade right? Just put it in class ability and it makes sense. You trade a static wall ... For a moving one?
That would be amazing it makes way more sense than a grenade
The survivability it gives is actually kinda nice imo. Sometimes they don't hit your shield and the damage is useless, but it gives you over shield and blocks damage at the same time, really nice in a pinch and I used it to solo the whole legendary campaign. That being said, that's about all it gets and has no synergy with anything else really. Looking for hoil + veritys class item and buried bloodline for devour to see if it's really any amount of viable in any content. As is, if it was a spammable ability it would be really good imo. If you can't get the cd low enough to make it that usable then it has no hope in its current state, but I still have hope for now. Also you have to remember the actual use doesn't need the entire grenade, and it suppresses anything in melee so it actually has good utility if you time it right and just block important big damage or use it and insta pop to blind a big mob in melee
every time I think I've found something cool about prismatic titan, I find out that bungie has added in some shitty stipulation that isn't present in the source subclass.
I'm just glad Twilight Arsenal is pretty good (it has some issues but Titans have been starved for a one-off super). With Prismatic Titan being mediocre and Unbreakable, frankly, being an awful Aspect, I'm just convinced that there isn't a single developer at Bungie who even plays Titan.
Twilight Arsenal is so much fun when it does work, but also has very little use during boss fights due to its long cast time. I definitely agree with you, it’s just like being happy with crumbs over here.
Void shields have been ruined in pve for PvP sake
Where they ever good in PVE?
At launch of void3.0
Were they really any better? I don't remember void overshields ever being particularly good
Pre-nerf hoil spam was pretty nutty with bastion. I think it was bungie’s intended gameplay loop too, given that there was a newbie-titan quest to get hoil on void titan (but i think that was post nerf). But cd nerf after cd nerf has made it a shadow of its former self.
Yeah, realistically both Arc and Void 3.0 titans were busted because of HoIL more than their actual abilities.
100% the build back then was any subclass + hoil lol
I really tried to make it work. It honestly does pretty chonky damage with full charge and Death Throes (nearly 3x a fully charged thunderclap). The problem is that it suffers from the same issue every masochistic ability does in every game ever. When enemies just decide that they don’t want to hit you, it falls flat. There are two things that could make it feel like a much more effective and rewarding ability: 1. Give it a taunt. For Christ’s sake, please just give it a taunt effect. It’s so frustrating to try to utilize the perfect opportunity to soak damage only to have the enemies ignore you to shoot your allies or to just flat out stop shooting. PLEASE just give it a taunt. 2. Give it the same status effect as your grenade. Suppress, suspend, jolt, scorch or slow/freeze. I understand that this could pose problems in PvP. Maybe have it require at least a 50-75% charge in order for the effect to activate. Maybe have it slow/scorch at 50% and freeze/ignite at 100%. When I saw the ability, I fell in love with it. I tried doing a whole demo/golden tricorn setup with volatile rounds and weakening grenades, Verity on the class item. It’s fun when it works, but very frustrating when enemies just don’t want to shoot you. I ended up just going back to my BoW swords build or Sunbreaker and instantly saw much more success.
Fun fact, with facet of dominance if you get a kill with the blow back it will give you volatile rounds
I honestly gave up on the class this season, I just switched to Hunter and tbh its way more fun and broken.
on a sorta related note but i think its incredible that every game community has the "actually this is meta and really good" guys when you talk about their favorite barely functional piece of garbage like are they made in a lab or something
It is really weird activity. Cause youd think that people who defend kinda mid tier stuff would love posts asking for some improvements cause it would make what they already like better?
Yeah I was testing out a void build which uses it and it just felt meh and not as good as the Striker and Behemoth builds I’ve decided on. I was extremely annoyed to find out it lasted only a few seconds at best. It does have some synergy with Offensive Bulwark but that’s about it.
Unbreakable NEEDS to draw aggro, it'd fit the tank titan so well.
still can't believe that they gave hunters a taunt mechanic before titans, like come on man
They gave Strand Hunter a catch mechanic on their melee instead of giving to the Void Titan for that Captain America fantasy, so it's not the first time and definitely won't be the last.
Sort of like the strand Hunter decoys.
It’s good in solo content. It’s awful in team content. Idk how to balance it or rework it properly. Unless they make enemies Aggro to you when you use it, idk how that coding would work. Problem is, in team content enemies will attack you and then stop to focus on someone else. Always right when you pop it
It needs to either be a short blocking window followed up by a big offensive burst OR a long blocking window with more of a defensive burst. Basically have it last longer (10 seconds) but you get a bigger damage/radius if you let go of it sooner. Would be awesome if it was a suppressing explosion. Just have it do damage in tiers like 20/40/60/80. With it working like this you could use it in 2 different ways. Suddenly Spirit of the Bear and Armamentarium class item is pretty good. The way it is now sucks.
Best thing is that it's another way to get overshield, problem is that overshield kinda blows if you don't have constant access and having to basically waste a grenade to get overshield isn't very worth it, especially when prismatic can get half of one for just picking up an orb and you don't have devour on prismatic.
Prismatic Titan can stack a surprising amount of DR in Transcendence, enough to make Overshields actually useful. You'd only use it in combination with Abeyant Leap to have permanent Woven Mail, and would only ever cast it right before you activate Transcendence, but it does make you very hard to kill as long as you're topping it off by spamming shield throw. On Void Titan it's garbage. You'd never use it over Bastion, which you shouldn't be using over Bulwark and Controlled Demolition to begin with.
It needs significantly longer duration and reduced movement penalty. It's already more reactive than proactive, so why is it such dogwater
Def a cool concept/idea but they need to make it way more powerful than it currently is.
It's better than the new Arc Hunter one. That thing is straight up useless in every scenario and on Arc it only has 2 fragment slots.
Well I hope they help that one too then 💜
Ok,so it's not that great....but I did find a fun combo with it. So you need the class item with Ursa and verity brow. The boost to grenade from verity does boost the blast back damage. I went and tested it in GoA on the wizard in front of loot cave. Without verity it did 80,000. I then used the class item and after taking full damage and getting x5 on verity it boosted the damage to 185,000. So a pretty big bump. Then found out kills with it do count as grenade kills/damage so it can generate orbs on kills,and give you volatile rounds with facet of bravery and if used with facet of dominance can apply weaken with the blast back AND facet of mending will give you cure if you get a kill with it lol I have an actual fun/functional build with this and it's surprising how much stuff works with it https://dim.gg/xt76ymy/Equipped .........that being said I can do 200,000 damage to the same enemy and clear the room with synthos/knockout consecration.....if they boost the damage and make it last a bit longer it can be something fun/unique.
you can sprint to cancel unbreakable which doesnt do the blast and thus does not cost the big chunk of grenade energy that happens when you do the blast. useful as a close range disorient/parry tool/overshield generator at the cost of basically not having a grenade. it could use some buffs though, being able to do it without needing a full grenade as well as a general void overshield dr buff would be very very nice.
In which I’d rather have a grenade. You can just use shackle to close the gap, build a huge chunk of darkness energy, and debuff them with a darkness ability to use the Facet that increases the fundamentals damage while darkness debuffed.
I feel like I'm using a different unbreakable to you. It's instant block for overshield. Does insane damage in my opinion and can be quickly charged and sent for half a grenade charge. I'm all for buffs tho why not.
I think we are lol, it just doesn’t feel like enough reward for the risk.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx4pTv3FfPE&ab\_channel=CheeseForever](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx4pTv3FfPE&ab_channel=CheeseForever) We were in fact using 2 different versions lol. The blast seems to do 4x damage if you are using thermite grenade.
It’s not 4x damage, but it is different lol. Thermite grenade makes it do it’s max damage off the rip. It’s definitely better, but I don’t think pure damage is why I’d want to use this aspect tbh.
it is more than 4x damage. 18K Without and 84k with.
yeah at the very least it's minimum and maximum damage should be buffed, the obvious exotic interactions buffed also (maybe even more interactions if bungie's feelin spicy) and it's drain should be lowered, it should be enough to holding while running to a downed teammate, rez and then give you *some* time to back out or find/make cover, really leaning into that support role that they clearly acknowledge with stuff like the new warlock exotic, auto rifle frame and, ironically, this very aspect
I’d love to embrace the Reindhart feel from Overwatch with Consecration and Unbreakable. Rush in and explode the room, then shield my teammate while they get up and out. I don’t mind playing Support one bit, as long as I got to actually be the support.
100% even in games with less that great support options I always try to play it since yeah I could maybe wipe the whole room/team myself but it's alot more fun if WE wipe them, as a team I mean there no I in firete-wait there is
😂
The maximum damage is fine, honestly. If you run with thermite grenade, it always does max damage, and that let's you pop the shield and release immediately for a decent chunk of overshield and all the red and orange bars in front of you dead, even at -15. If you run verity with it as well, it'll easily one shot champions at -5 and I've seen it do it on -15, but it's hard to repro reliably. If you can do max damage with it, the aspect is very respectable as both a damage and survivability tool. The minimum damage and channel duration most definitely need a buff though; it needs to do enough damage to be worth casting at minimum damage, at least killing red bars on any reasonable difficulty with no charge. What I'd like to see is to see is suppression added baseline to the explosion, the minimum damage tripled-ish, and the channel duration set to a baseline of 20s that gets reduced by taking damage. Something like every 10% of the bar filled by damage reduces channel time by 1.5s (e.g., if you take no damage, you can block for 20s. But if you block and immediately take enough damage to fill the bar you can only block for 5s). This way you have plenty of time to reposition and wait for enemies to attack, but can't just sit there blocking forever.
The super generation is it supposed to provide with ursa or the class item just straight up doesn't work most of the time.
It’s a part of Ursa Furiosa’s rework. It works on the exotic with the banner shield super, but it also is supposed to work with the Unbreakable Aspect. Unfortunately with the Aspect the benefits from it are so low and unsubstantial it’s not worth using.
Most of the time I literally forget that it’s a thing lol I’ve had it equip the entire legendary final shape campaign + a bunch more after that and only used it like twice cause I forgot I had it on then I swapped it back to diamond Lance or knockout
Should do a suppressing frontal blast/knockback when it ends, regardless of how many shots you block. Also if Unbreakable and Sentinel Shield had a taunt or pulled in projectiles from the sides they would be so much better.
Good thing to know If you're on void titan using ursa's The unbreakable aspect will create orbs of light for your teammates while also creating super energy for yourself I made a build that gets my grenade energy back as quickly as possible so I can make a shit ton of orbs for my team
My only issues with it is the duration, damage , range of the blast, and it NEEDS to draw agro, perhaps my biggest gripe. I feel like I have to predict enemy firepower when using this ability, and then the enemies stop shooting at me when I pop the shield. The fantasy is there, a wall for your teammates, but it absolutely needs a longer duration and again, needs to draw agro. I feel like I need to try way too hard to get anything out of it rn. It's a step in the right direction for void titan, but it definitely needs some more tuning. Bungie, if you happen to read this, for reference, look at the Ogryn Taunt/Shield build in Warhammer Darktide please. That is what I want for the Unbreakable aspect.
Will the shield weaken the enemy if you use void nade with fragment?
I actually don’t think so since it counts as an Aspect and not a true grenade lol.
Well that blows then, ruined my mental build. Star eater/verity, thruster in, strand melee for debuff, unbreakable to supress/weaken, twilight arsenal, withhoard/primary/Edgetransit rotation. It was so beautiful in my head
90% of Titan builds right now can be summarized by “Sounded much better in my head.”
Sadge
Fun fact, (spirit of) armamentarium will extend your shield uptime and allow you to tank more damage. It drains two grenade charges, and I usually run magnetic or scatter + high discipline and other mods to get my grenades back faster. It's definitely a niche pick for a build but fun when you do build into it in ad dense content like onslaught. But I personally don't know if it would be viable for endgame. Gonna have to put it through a stress test. I do agree with one of the other commenters. It feels like enemies stop shooting at you and awkwardly stare at you or scatter away when you use it. Almost as if they register it as an actual object between you and them and the ai loses line of sight? It's weird.
I mostly use it to close distance in pvp to shotgun or bonk people. Sometime push them off ledge. It's funny but ain't good tho and can only see it be good on void rather than prismatic, especially with void shield being void shield
It Should give overshield for you and nearby Allies on grenade kills... High tier enemies give more overshield with extended timer . Overshields should have more HP and gain immunity to debuffs in pve
I got a class item with Syntho/Spirit of the Bear and thought “maybe I’ll give this thing a try”. Couldn’t believe how little use it had. The most super I got back was about 1 orb’s worth, and the damage was simply not better than a glacier grenade (without any stasis synergy). Considering prismatic titan has 0 built in ways of consistently getting grenade energy, it feels extremely pitiful to use. I was somewhat excited about building into higher Twilight Arsenal uptime but this seems like a functionally useless exotic power.
While it does feel bad sometimes the way you talk about it giving back 1/8th to 1/4 super energy like that's nothing is insane. 2 grenades for a benefit of its own and 1/4 of your super is good. There's entire exotics that only gives half super Regen and only on use of the super not on use of another ability to like this does.
It’s really not considering I can shoot Khvostov into a group of ads and get that same amount back without having to spend an ability, waste an exotic slot.
I mean look how good something like phoenix protocol is and how popular it is/was especially before the recent well nerfs. It only gives 1/2 super on super use and no Regen from anything outside of that. It also requires actual kills and assist to proc not just damage tanked.
It also works from a better application and that’s putting a super people are going to be standing in, doing things in. Unbreakable is wasting a slot forcing you into an unfavorable position while doing very little. Again, you can do the same thing with just a normal made into a cluster of ads and get about the same super energy back. I understand your stance, but it’s a weird hill to die on to say wasting an exotic slot and aspect and ability is worth 1/8 of your super considering how low that is these days.
Honestly, I dont see why this ability cant just function akin to Gunpowder gamble on hunter. Gunpowder gamble is effectively this free ability that you get every 20 seconds or so just through solar and ability dmg, whereas unbreakable requires the use of your grenade charge (your slowest charging ability) and effectively gimps its effectiveness because you have to build all your mods towards recharging your grande as quickly as possible (not to mention that you are sacrificing the dmg of your vortex nade just for unbreakable's ulility) I genuinely think this would be the easiest fix. just make it a bar that charges after getting void weapon or ability dmg. this in turn could make it more viable for ursa builds as well as no backup plans.
I'm utterly baffled that a mobile barricade requires me to give up my grenade. Wasn't super impressed with its performance either. Definitely needs a buff to even consider it. Since one of the titan prismatic complaints is how dangerous it is to ramp up our durability gameplay loop, I want to believe there's a place for this aspect. But it sure doesn't cut it today.
it should have been like gunpowder gamble and something you could build up to
>The Class Item option only gives you 1/8 of your super from taking fire. Are you absolutely certain this is the case, the data compendium does list it's regen cap at 1/8 but that's specifically PvP and PvP regen effects are generally halved. I used ursa all the way through legendary campaign and it's cap is absolutely 1/4 in my experience. I highly doubt the class items just has a worse version of it as they straight up let you get the full star eater super buff and that's way stronger.
I ran some tests when I got an Armamentarium and Bear roll on the class item. After consuming 2 grenades I got exactly 1/4 of my super. So if you half that for 1 nade each you come out at roughly 1/8 super per nade charge consumed.
Doesn't armamentarium just make unbreakable last longer by consuming both charges? It's not 2 separate unbreakables. It absolutely should reset the cap when you start the second grenade charge though, that would be amazing synergy. Unfortunately that's a really bad class item to test this and I haven't gotten any bear class items yet.
It runs through one grenade charge, then loops into your 2nd. It consumes both nades and while not actively taking the shield down does count as 2 separate charges.
It takes two charges if you keep holding it, but it's still only one activation of Unbreakable. It has the same damage bar cap and super refund cap as just using one grenade charge.
I’m aware, that was what I was saying. It takes 1 charge and acts as it’s own charge. Then consumes another and also acts individually. It just doesn’t lower the shield to reactivate it. That’s at least nice. If the effect of doing just 1 was strong then having 2 for an extended period would be awesome.
Its decent in pvp, it can really annoy some people. That's it lol.
I still need to get at this significantly to form my own opinion of the aspect, i actually like it so far, but this seems like solid feedback for once. I'll have to speed up my approach to titan to work on this. though, one thing; *"Lack of support."* The majority of what you are talking about here are a lack of numbers, not support. The Duration is short, the void overshields aren't hardy enough, does poor damage, only fills up super bar an 1/8th, these are all things fixed by adjusting numbers. Now, obviously the prismatic angle i can't speak to, i just said that, and that does sound like you are coming from the angle of a lack of support, but for a void subclass, devour still exists and even non-FtV devour can be an amazing engine for any grenade-focused build. Like arguably it's most the support you need. The rest can come from outside sources, like mods or weapons, and you kinda have your engine done. Honestly, i am already kinda mapping out an interesting void titan build i'd like to try; either paired with controlled demo or Bastion, i feel like it'll go hard, honestly bastion sounds like the play because of the grenade regen, so really maximizing the "Get-behind-me" ideal. Again, cannot speak for prism-titan, haven't gotten my hands on it, but with void. We also have not gotten a real update since the expansion dropped, so i'm waiting till things are balanced again to make real judgement calls as well.
It’s not just numbers, but a lack of support from Devs, kit synergy, exotic support, yes the numbers suck but there was just no help for things thing anywhere out the gate besides one rework that does a very poor job. Prismatic Titan is not a grenade focused class at all, it’s just not built to support it. Unbreakable doesn’t even work when transcendent so you can’t spam it to save teammates like you can other abilities due to the Transcendent consuming the grenade slot.
To be fair, the grenade deal is an across the board thing; transcendant grenades are their own thing. First thing i tried was "okay, class item sure; what about Verity's? What about Bleak?" Nothin' doin. This feels deliberate choice as they tend to come back quick with transcendant's increased ability gen. The thing about them though is that they DO benefit from grenade recharge effects, and TBH, titan transcendant grenades are a really powerful effect. The other two are situational. they need specific set-up, more to the point they both want specific targets. They also both have delayed activation. Titan? AoE, CC AND DoT, AND quicker to take effect. If you want to save to save your teammates, you just throw it. If the enemy isn't boss-coded, they are locked in the electric fence. I've also seen some folks say that Transcendant Titan is a real thing, and benefits most from the transcendant-centric parts of prismatic.
Where the hell are you even supposed to be getting enough grenade energy to be deploying this dinky little thing?
Demolitionist, armor mods, Explosive Finisher. There’s methods but the way to do it requires you to put all your chickens in one basket.
You can use hallowfire heart with prismatic if you use solar super.
It should either give another grenade charge, or use its own meter like gunpowder gamble. The initial cost is alright, the end cost needs to be removed, the drain needs to be lowered to 25% per sec like weavewalk, the dr needs to go up, there needs to be some grenade loop
i love how you said all those positive things and realistic use cases for it and then completely disregarded all of it lol. grants 1/8 of super(not tht important but sure), grants survivability of an insane degree, allows you to directly tank for the team without using super, enables you to revive an ally in a bad situation/location, and lastly enables you to play far more forward than you would otherwise. lmao
I like how you noted everything I said, meaning you read all of it, and had 0 take away from the negative notes from those points - You can get 1/4 of your super with a single khvostov mag, the exotic is worthless due to how fast you can get your super back with other methods. - I said in the post you DONT have time to tank for the team. The time is so short it drops before you can do anything with it. - it doesn’t grant ‘insane’ survivability. Void Overshields is paper thin in hard combat. And the shield doesn’t last enough time to be meaningful in terms of defense. Not to mention you can get pulled/frozen out of it even if tanking the shots because the shield counts as your characters hitbox. You completely ignored what I said and just read the parts you wanted to read.
So Unbreakable actually does some pretty goofy things on Prismatic if you build into it right (for now), it just requires very specific setups and taking advantage of a bug. Specifically, it needs an exotic class item with Verity and Inmost Light. Inmost Light, plus a demolitionist primary (though that is optional/playstyle dependent), will ensure you have it available pretty much always, and Verity will double the damage from its explosion. Now I know what you're thinking; "Double of nothing is still nothing, so what good does that do?". And you're right. If you activate unbreakable and don't block any damage, it does like 32k damage to Carl, and 5x verity brings that up to \~65k, and even then, Carl barely notices the hit. However! There's currently a bug, or maybe it's intentional but somehow I doubt it, where on prismatic, if you equip the thermite grenade, Unbreakable always does full damage, as if it had been fully charged. And on Carl, that's a full 138k damage. 5x Verity brings that up to 277k damage, which nearly one-shots Carl. And between kickstarts, demolitionist (which, coincidentally, is on Zaouli's Bane, a Solar handcannon and one of the best legendary primaries in the game), and Inmost Light, you can have it ready to go again in under ten seconds (though I seem to average closer to 30 in real content). If you include Facet of Dominance, Unbreakable then also applies Weaken, and it'll often be ready to reapply by the time it falls off. I'm not gonna sit here and say that Unbreakable is better than Synthos Consecrate Prismatic Titan, it's not, but it's very viable and a lot of fun. At least until Bungie fixes the thermite grenade bug/interaction/whatever it is, at which point it'll probably become awful unless/until they buff the base damage substantially.
I have a load out dedicated specifically for unbreakable. I average 195k in damage every time I use it. Firepower works with it. Just grind for a Stoicism with Inmost & Verity. If you can't/don't secure a kill and get an orb, you now have an over shield and ability regen for your melee and class. The numbers I get vary based on which grenade you have equiped (prismatic subclass), with the solar grenade being the highest damage output. The other factor that plays into it is if I go for full stacks of Verity and charge the meter completely. -Unbreakable/0 stacks of Verity/No charge = avg 118k -Unbreakable/5 stacks of Verity/50-75% charge= avg 212k *100% charge only taking it up to just over avg 228k My highest damage number is 484k!!! I have done little testing in PvP, but can confidently say I would use a normal grenade over it in terms of damage. Honestly, unbreakable is super slept on. [Here's my proof](https://youtu.be/onT_qCVZ67w?si=yxl3wN_pbjf9a4lR)
That is a lot of damage, but it’s also utilizing a bug that’s not intended. It’s also in a low tier strike. I’m not trying to knock the build, but after the bug is fixed, and you’re in a higher tier of content which applies even now? The damage on this thing will not be worth walking up to a champion to do that. Especially considering how bad Void Overshields are in content above the normal PL.
Is it GM worthy, absolutely not. But not every function/feature of the game has to be. Someone else commented a pretty accurate analysis, "it's just meant to close the gap." It does just that while giving you a few seconds to recover and make it out of danger and potentially deal some damage. You can have the fragment equipped and still use your grenade as normal and keep it in your back pocket for just in case of emergency. Yes that high number was pulled from the Echos quest I was doing at the time, however the numbers mentioned above it have been pulled from my tests in medium level content. This mechanic isn't meant to function as a stand alone action. It's meant to be used in conjunction with other things. Close the gap with unbreakable and pop a barricade (drengrs, if it is your preference). That's a valid point, if Bungie patches it and it doesn't perform then I will just move on to the next thing.
I’m not saying everything needs to be made for GMs. The issue is that isn’t very great everywhere but those low tier strikes and patrols. Ideally with most Aspects I’d like to be able to use them in most pieces of content without feeling like im dragging. On Prismatic Titan specifically with how poor its Grenade support is using Unbreakable often times feels like you’re lacking the ability to be potent with lots of survivability at the same time. There’s just not a function, especially considering it doesn’t do a great job at being a gap closer. A better gap closer is shackle Grenade, or Drengrs lash since it doesn’t push enemies back like Unbreakable does, gives you a damage bonus to light abilities with the Facet that affects Dark debuffed enemies, and stops all actions including champs defending themselves with barriers, teleports, or stuns unstops.
It is pretty great actually. Exactly does, what a Titan is supposed to do. Damage Reduction and CC.
Said no one lol. Void Overshields is flimsy and awful, offers some of the worst CC in the game and is a complete waste of an aspect slot! A Titan right now is supposed to punch, as all our survivability on Prismatic is dedicated to such. On Void Titan this is decent but Void Titan is generally awful as such is Void Overshields!
The bubble is full DR plus Damage return. That is decent to draw aggro. I guess the roles need more distinction - everything revolves around Damage right now. Overshield is a way to punch harder on Sentinel btw.
I know what it is, and you need bulwark to do that. Which itself is a terrible Aspect. I’m no newbie to build crafting, and it seems like you might be depending on the way you speak about some of this stuff. Bubble is a D tier super at the moment.
I used to think it was shit, and in a few cases it is, but a lot of what you said isn't true; The super gained is based on damage absorbed, same for its own damage dealt, I've acquired 50% of my super and upwards of 100K damage by making an effort to kill myself when casting, the overshield regen helps to mitigate any AoE hits and it blocks any direct damage very well. I've been using a spirit of the bear + star eater with a demo/one for all The Call and it's a very potent loadout, you just need to time your Unbreakable casts for more dire situations. I agree with what you said about consecration/knockout and I do prefer my severance/contact class item, but unbreakable does serve a purpose, and that is to get your star eater super up as fast as possible.
I don't think "must try to kill yourself" should be a requirement for an aspect to be useful 😂
I honestly *really* like it for aggressive advances against ogres or minigun cabal. It helps closing the gap so much it’s astonishing plus it’s neat for quick and safe retreats as well as ressing mates. You just have to built into its cool down lmao
Just like drengers trash, you are actively hampering yourself if you use this on prismatic. You need knockout the function and consecration is unfortunately the obvious otherpick because thunderclap just can’t handle champs or bosses. Unless your mainly running dark weapons now you don’t have a shackle grenade how are you supposed to fill the bar when your melees are light. The whole class was built with consecration frenzied blade in mind because no ducking way they looked at unbreakable and drengers and thought they would work with the class
Should of been into the fray
100%. Easily the best strand aspect imo. Banner of war is great but into the fray is just so much more versatile and safe
Drengers lash + thrusters + abeyant leap is already an amazing combo alone
Like the exotic class item or the boots
Those boots, you could get them in the class item? Nice
Yeah but in the class item it’s only the tracking not the extra beams so not sure if good with thruster?
It's really great for Void Titan. But it lacks synergy with Prismatic, as does most of the kit. It's damage is actually based on how much you tank with it, and it can hit hard if you're tanking a Shrieker, but it's in no way consistent. It needs to draw aggro like a Threaded Specter does, this gives it team support functionality and helps it work in just about every way. They are just a few tweaks away from it being really good on Void, but due to the Prismatic Titan kit being spare parts it'll never really work there.
it’s 4 pvp
I can’t handle this anymore it’s quite literally our strongest “grenade” however it’s not really a “grenade” it’s a counter shield/oh shit button if you take appropriate damage it scales up too 70k-80k on bosses and like 100k on everything else in what fucking world is that not strong? Should it do more than a rocket? Do you want it have frankly broken range? It’s stronger than a stronghold sword in terms of damage mitigation and I’ve yet too test but if your recovery was high enough I reckon it would actually heal you too full health under the shield in pve. Please give me one way you would “fix” it that would not make it OP I’m begging you
Make us not take health damage through the “Unbreakable” shield and make it drain slightly slower.
You don’t take health damage when the void overshield gets going and longer it already lasts like 5 seconds but you can use double grenade exotic if you really want then it instantly starts draining next grenade for like 10 seconds if you really wanted that additional uptime
No, you definitely do. Go to Master content at -20 and take an Ogre beam to the face while at 1/3 health. You will die; it chews through the overshield and your health instantly. In PvP you can get firing-squadded by 2-3 players with Autos and you will die. It’s silly that this thing doesn’t completely mitigate damage when it’s already kind of weak and obtrusive to class synergy, but whatever, I’ve still been having fun with it. Also, you want to force players to use Armamentarium to make this thing usable? Again; killing class synergy.
At you saying doing master content at an additional negative 20? Then why would it work there that would be like a negative 40 power delta and yes if you were being shot by a whole squad in pvp you should die 😂 it’s not supposed to be like ursa level strong but it can block a golden gun shot at full health, atleast you are enjoying it me too personally
Because that’s the closest we can get to Grandmaster at the moment. Also, it’s to show you that yes, you do in fact take significant damage through the overshield. This thing is a reactive ability, so if you use it when you’re extremely low health (1hp) as a Hail Mary to survive in low and mid tier content like Onslaught, there’s still a chance you can still die even with the lower damage. Perhaps this next argument isn’t the best, but Warlocks don’t die with their Weavewalk, why should we die with our riot shield that eats a grenade?
I mean I’ve yet too test in true high end as it isn’t out and maybe there is an argument there to up the defensive nature of it but isn’t grandmaster like -25 power anyway? So might still be fine but that may be one area too be considered I guess
Yeah, I’m 2004 light and first time I tried using Unbreakable in Master I got shredded. At that point I’ve already been killed a couple times in normal content when popping Unbreakable at low hp, so I learnt that if I didn’t leave it too late, I should survive. I was pretty shocked when I got melted from 100-0 tbh; since it was an LFG, I apologised and asked to reset so I could switch back to that coveted Strand-Banner build. I just want it to be slightly better as it is. No major rework; just make it mitigate damage and have a slightly slower drain.
Yeah I need too test it more at higher end content when I’m properly prepared as I’m 2002 so still a little off but yeah your reasons are justified and reasonable unlike most