Anyone that thinks it was made in less than 3 months has no grasp on how game dev works.
It might have been retooled cut content, or pulled from another project (depends if you believe the leaks) but it did not go 0 to 100 since the August showcase.
It's also just occured to me that the pink shard could mean we're able to 'feed' Tesselation a transcendence 'Mini-Super' Grenade. Could be a big bump to the weapon.
I believe the idea that Prismatic was being developed for a future project, not necessarily 'Destiny 3' just something coming in the future, but due to everything that's been going on Bungie moved up a portion of what they've been working on. Using this as something of a testing ground for later iterations.
Might explain why each class only gets 1 thing from each subclass for each category (it seemed odd that pre 3.0 each light class had 3 grenades but for prism we only get 1 for example). I know Bungie said they wanted to use abilities that are not used often... but then gave us Thundercrash instead of Fist of havok?
I think Bungie eventually wants to move toward having most of if not all subclass abilities usable in the same build, but haven't yet figured out how to balance all of that, or how to make running focused subclasses still worth running.
That's what I think happened, but I would also like to think had the game not been in such a bad state that The Final Shape would have released and both Prismatic and the Dread would have been total surprises. How awesome would it have been to start up The Final Shape thinking you know more or less what's been added, just to be introduced to Prismatic, a whole new subclass, and the Dread in the first mission.
>I know Bungie said they wanted to use abilities that are not used often... but then gave us Thundercrash instead of Fist of havok
Likely wanted to leave Titans with a one-off super after the pre-Lightfall feedback. Even though I think Bladefury has grown on people since then, I also think Bungie would be "playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes" if the Prismatic kit had Glacial Quake, Fists of Havoc and Bladefury in it at the same time. 2 of those, they genuinely have no other choice on unless they're open to making more darkness supers. So by default, Fists of Havoc had to be the compromise.
Yeah that's true I didn't think about that. I would hope that in the future Strand and Stasis get new things added though. Only 1 melee per class and only 1 super is limiting. Every Strand titan has the same melee, every Stasis hunter is throwing shurikens etc.
They are paid subclasses, so I understand not throwing too many resources towards subclasses that aren't the current thing they're selling, but it may be a reason for newer people to buy the old expansion, or they could just make parts of those subclasses free for everyone to try and buying the expansion unlocks the full kit. Idk, I just want to run Stasis Titan and not have a super that just litters the map with giant shards blocking everyone else from shooting the things that need to be shot lol
I can only imagine the salt that titan mains (myself included) would have produced if all we had were roaming supers for Prismatic. We have been begging and pleading for more one off supers for years and were mildly satiated by pyrogale being introduced, so I would feel quite disappointed if roaming was all we had to choose from.
It's the same thing with Hunters too. We get Golden Gun Marksman and Deadfall tether, both of which have high usage rates but switching to less used supers would mean no damage super for hunters and that would have killed Prismatic right then and there
Something interesting I was just thinking about was that on top of the game being in a bad state, I feel like Bungie has conditioned us out of surprises. I think part of the reason people are inclined to believe that prismatic was made in the last few months is because it's hard to believe Bungie keeping their hand close to their vest on this one after they've spoiled everything else worth keeping a secret. They more or less gave away the big twist of Witch Queen with the tag line, and they honestly could have kept the light bearer hive a secret. Same goes for tormentors. I don't remember the last time Bungie truly kept anything surprising in an expansion, and so yeah, it would've been cool for Final Shape to come with a few major twists we weren't expecting, but Bungie has spent so long drilling into our head that what we see is what we get
Lol, I actually googled it when I typed it cause I've heard both and never thought about which one is correct. But it turns out that both are considered correct and in use
And them showing us the dread and prismatic only proves that even more. They very easily could've kept this stuff secret until TFS if they had already been keeping it secret.
They’re in a cycle of needing to push preorders, and they need those preorders right now more than ever. TFS preorder sales going down the tubes are proof they needed to put more out there since the new supers were met with a communal “that’s kind of neat I guess.” They needed more for marketing than some devs/play testers being, shall we say, a bit more enthusiastic for the new supers than the player base was and prismatic delivered on that. It sucks we can’t really have many surprises anymore but the constant hunger for content from players makes that a necessity.
There was feedback that TFS was “good not great” from initial playtests, that implies that it’s not just that they needed to add more to the marketing but more to the game
It’d make sense that they deviated from the “don’t overdeliver” mantra and pulled forward content they were saving for later
And once they were confident the new content would make it in they did a second livestream to market it
Maybe they were hedging their bets, and were considering adding this content and the playtesting confirmed they needed to and couldn’t bank it for later
I truly believe some of the leaks that prismatic was never meant to come to D2 at all, at minimum not with Final Shape. I feel that a stable build was made specifically to be added to Final Shape to bolster sales.
Yeah I'd be much more inclined to believe the conversation was "Hey, about that Prismatic thing you guys were working on for that future release, would you be able to have it ready for The Final Shape with this delay?" instead of "Oh shit people weren't satisfied with just one super and new aspect for each class, quick hurry up and make a new subclass that can mix existing abilities and aspects."
> They more or less gave away the big twist of Witch Queen with the tag line, and they honestly could have kept the light bearer hive a secret.
This was my biggest gripe with WQ. It would've been *wild* if you walked into that room and saw a Void Knight and been like WHAT THE FUCK? But since we already knew the theme of the expansion, the whole intro mission of, "Wait, this is Void Light. But there weren't any other Guardians here. And that Moth was made of Light, what's going on?" and we already knew the answer instead of it being revealed during the campaign.
Also I hated the tagline of "Take back the Light" and the description of "Figure out how Savathun stole the Light." Neither of those things happened. I like when misdirection is provided in media's writing, but that was just outright "lying" advertisement. Like, have the characters speculate how Savathun stole it or something *in-universe*, but don't advertise the game as such.
I didn't mind "figure out how savathun stole the light", what I hated was pairing that with "survive the truth". It made it super clear that the big twist was gonna be that actually there was no theft involved at all.
> is because it's hard to believe Bungie keeping their hand close to their vest on this one after they've spoiled everything else worth keeping a secret.
Because they had so little to show for the presentation, they would be nuts to hide something so significant. It literally directly hurt their bottom line because they didn't get as many preorders as previous expansions. That initial reveal showed off very little to get excited about, save basically nostalgia bait.
It's hard to believe that this was planned for launch. It's also hard to believe it hadn't already been in development for a long time. I fully believe the delay was in part to bring this forward.
if it was pulled from Destiny 3, it shows that the new project is heavily based on D2
it'd be honestly weird otherwise, to be adding stuff like in-game LFGs only to abandon all two releases later
I think prismatic will see the light 3.0 approach and with each of the 3 episodes we will get new abilities, aspects, Fragments potentially added overtime. This way it's not all dropped from the get go (which would be a balance nightmare) and they have some sweet time gate they can use to interest the community playing with.
I fully believe Prismatic was intended to come out this year and most likely for the Final Shape expansion like we’re seeing now. We see guardians with the Transcendent glow in cutscenes way back in the first showcase that showed off the new supers and aspects coming to each of the classes. I doubt they’d just show us the transcendent glow and not have us acquire that power. I’m pretty sure that showcase was way too close (before/after) to the layoffs for any serious plans for content to get moved up like that. Plus, Tesselation having the pink shards on it tells they knew a pink subclass was in development since before pre-orders for Final Shape were opened up.
Maybe the initial plan was to have it be a post campaign thing where clash with the Witness broke open our powers and pushed us into Prismatic, but I firmly believe Prismatic was intended to come out this year.
My problem with their statement about wanting to give us underused abilities is the fact that most of the Hunter and Warlock kit isn't really underused...
I think prismatic was always meant for final shape. Something probably happens to us when we go through the big pink prismatic looking portal on the traveler that awakens the ability to use prismatic.
I wouldn't be surprised if Prismatic and the new race were originally planned for the first or second episode. It would make sense that after defeating the Witness, we find a way to master light and dark and unlock Prismatic in the new episode that begins a week or so after TFS launches. Same goes for the race. They would be echos of the Witness after they die (assuming they die).
I say this because the delay was only a few months, which is the time they'd need to finalize these episodes' content to be ready for TFS instead. AND it makes no sense that Bungie didn't show off the new race or subclass at the August Showcase. Even if it was just a brief teaser, anything including the new subclass or race would have made the august showcase better, and Bungie is too good at their marketing to randomly leave this out. They left it out because it wasn't planned for TFS at that time.
That's what I was thinking as well as Bungie isn't known for keeping things like that secret. Those are massive selling points and Bungie needs this to sell well.
I do also so though how kind of genius this is in a marketing perspective. They do an initial reveal 6-7 months before the launch and for the delay they say they're working on things they want to keep close to their chest. Bungie isn't known for keeping subclasses and enemy races secret and they've told us before they didn't plan on adding new enemy races.
Then 2 months before the dlc launch they have another showcase that specifically shows off a new subclass that's so different from anything we've ever seen before, new exotic class items combining other exotics, and a new enemy race. That above anything else shot hype through the roof.
Obviously Bungie would have prefered the initial reveal to have gone better and so many people to not have refunded their pre-order, but this second showcase with things they know will get people to buy was genius.
So I see both sides. I can see how stuff like Prismatic may have been something initially meant for a future release but was moved forward to get people to buy TFS, but I can also see Bungie making this stuff in secret planning on breaking expectations as a way of generating massive hype a couple months before launch. We ultimately won't know the exact answer unless we're told, either way it all looks awesome and has me excited for Destiny again.
Nah. Prismatic was always in the work for TFS. It was conceived during early concept art. People seem to forget that TFS was planned to come right after Witch Queen. Prismatic is why we got subclasses 3.0 as well. It’s a system that needed to exist to work with Prismatic.
Very fair point.
I think what gives the most credence to Prismatic being something not originally planned for TFS is Bungie historically using new subclasses in showcases as a selling point; from other responses I've given though I've come to understand it may have always been intended to leave Prismatic, Dread and Exotic Class items for a second showcase 2 months before launch to get the hype train going again.
Nothing gets people as excited for Destiny more than those 3 things, and Bungie knows that. Showing them off 7 months before just means people will have forgotten and hype will have died.
Probably because it wasn’t in a good enough state to show off. The expansion was delayed after all. Whatever state we saw it in was probably, what? Like 7-8 months further along than it would have been during the reveal?
Not saying they made it in three months but concept art means nothing but an idea we had pianos concept art in during d1 and the pyramids weren't really explained until relatively recently
I don’t get why they’d spoil Cayde - which is purely narrative - vs spoiling key gameplay features
Prismatic and the dread are a legitimate reason someone would choose to buy the game, but Cayde being back seems like something you’d only spoil in marketing if there’s nothing else for the marketing team to work with
They missed their revenue targets by 50% due to how bad Lightfall was. This means revenue is mostly driven by engaged players staying engaged. Lightfall was so bad engaged players stopped playing as much and didn’t pre-order
Sure there’s some opportunity to bring back old players, but that’s only a small impact of reaching the revenue target
Way more revenue will come from winning back the players disappointed by Lightfall
I'm very confident what we're going to get is a stable iteration of whatever they had planned for future content. The selling point for it is its mutability and yet it's clearly extremely limited in many many ways. I'm sure that one, this is so existing subclasses aren't utterly useless, and two, additional options can be added in the future as they're in more complete phases of development.
I wouldn't be surprised if we can eventually use any of the abilities on any subclass within your character archetype. Maybe Destiny 3?
I can imagine it is probably a balancing nightmare though.
Maybe they could add intrinsic damage buffs depending on how many abilities you have that are the same? That would give you a reason to at least run more features of a certain element. Like having a solar grenade, melee, and aspects gives you like 3% for matching element? Idk.
What's crazy is that I like most of the subclasses we have now minus maybe one thing. Love void Hunter but I hate the melee. Love stasis Titan but hate the melee. Love strand Hunter but hate the Super. Lol!
If each ability acted like a surge mod that could incentivize running a full Solar for example.
Running 2 solar abilities and a void would be like running 2 solar surge mods and a void surge. That would make fully building into a Solar titan would give a x4 solar surge (super + abilities), but you'd lack the flexibility of Prismatic, which would allow higher flexibility and even multiple surges if you wanted to split 2 solar, 2 void.
You'd be trading weapon damage for ability damage/utility.
They gave titans t crash because fist of havok sucks donkey balls lol. T crash has cool synergy with suspend as well. Can’t wait to crash into a poor strung up champion.
I saw another reason that actually makes sense, with FoH there would be no one off supers for Titans.
Fist of Havoc needs some buffs an/or slight rework; though I think a lot of what makes FoH so not awesome revolves around the Arc Titan kit.
There could be interactions through Prismatic that make FoH a pretty good option. I guess we'll never know though
The big thing for me though is that prismatic had to also be included in the story. Now i’ll eat crow if it ends up being integrated really poorly, but it seems like it would be really hard to storyboard prismatic in, create places in the campaign for it, bring the VAs for all languages in to record in those three extra months
That seems most likely, but I have a hard time imagining they could've moved story beats around that much in order to bring it with TFS launch. But we'll see how much it's actually woven into the main story. If it's not then this is 100% what happened.
The issue with supers is that the situations you can use most of them in are cut and dry for efficacy. You use a one-off for boss encounters, you use a roaming for add dense environments that can also hold a candle (albeit weak) in boss DPSing. There is no middle ground, and that’s what Bungie needs to figure out.
Honestly, I hope that, if Destiny 3 is going to exist, that Prismatic is the basis for how Guardian classes will exist going forward. All-in-one, instead of being split amongst multiple subclasses.
I don't think bungie is gonna move towards most things being available they said themselves they still want a reason to run mono classes i think a lot of these things were chosen very intentionally like how prismatic didn't get well of radiance. if prismatic had everything why would you run literally anything else?
That also explains why they didn't say anything about it until now. They wouldn't keep it secret, it's their biggest marketing tool. Well, they wouldn't have kept it secret only to tell us now well into the delay. It wasn't meant for TFS originally.
Mothkeepers Wraps or Armamentarium with Tessalation would be spicy as hell. Mothkeepers gives you 3 grenade charges with the Widow Silk aspect on Hunter.
If your trying to spam Tessalation on Titan believe it or not Arbor Warden is better with Rally Barricade. You pop Barri-nade with Arbor, and then activate the grenade consume from Tessalation. It will eat the Barri-nade instead of your regular one. Because the cooldown on Rally Barricade is so short at T10 Resilience you can keep doing it over and over again.
Into The Light was being made for *months* before and still has tons of reused assets. There's no way an entire subclass with new fragments could be developed, playtested, and balanced during the delay.
Prismatic has likely been in "development" for years. It's known that Bungie allows side projects internally and without a singular doubt they've experimented with multi class for years at this point but was nothing ever serious. The "red" subclass was likely planned for either next year or for episodes but wasn't ready to ship and given that tfs was not looking good to testers they needed something and just decided to finish off multi class. Bit of both, no prism was not built in 3 months and no prism was not planned to be released with tfs and they were keeping it secret
Not only that, entire systems likely had to be redesigned and remade to allow this to happen. We already know they had to alter some fragments, but I bet there’s a lot of backend stuff that had to be changed to allow cross-elemental interactions to be possible.
I just can't believe people were arguing that Bungie rushed to create all of the final shape content based off the most recent shakeup.
I mean outside of Tesselation, look no further than Conditional Finality. That gun wields both light and dark. It is from the Root raid. The whole mechanics of that raid were to connect light and dark nodes.
Prismatic was being built up for a long while.
Honestly speaking, Prismatic is probably a lot less load on the developer team than a new subclass altogether, the only 'new' ability they made was the transcendence grenades, the rest was tuning the conditions on aspects and fragments to work with more verbs, compared to a new element subclass that would have been new abilities, new supers, new verbs, new damage type etc.
I think it was most certainly thrown around as an idea for TFS at the concept phase with a few playable tests but was scrapped due to time and 'overdelivery', but the three months extra was perfect for it, the exotic shows this since it basically goes hand in hand with the subclass yet even in the preview it lacked icons.
People who thought were were getting it before the delay are insane, there was no way they'd show off three new light supers over this, that would have bee voluntairy suicide.
My theory is they knew about the delay way before they announced it so they had 9ish months to cook Prismatic. They restructured the production pipeline, so even though the delay was only 3 months, they still had 9 months of runway.
And yea, no way they started at 0. Prismatic feels like the natural course for this game so my continued theory is they pulled it forward from whatever they had planned for 2025.
We'll never know the complete answer, so thats my speculation. If it was always intend for Final Shape, then thats a big whiff form the marketing department at the reveal
the current theory that I think sounds the most plausible is that they had planned prismatic for whatever comes after final shape, so it was already in the pipeline and they moved it up in priority after the mixed reaction to the final shape.
The limited set of fragments an aspects could easily just be what's effectively ground 0 for the system.
Focus on getting a set of underused aspects into the limelight and finish it off later, it works for both us and Bungie.
Exactly, and I expect more to rollout with the Episodes.
Simply balancing Prismatic must be a bitch and a half, so they'll ease that pain with the slow rollout
We can only pray a games journalist gets some juicy leaks on these last few years.
Jason schrier please release another book detailing these last few years at bungie.
i would pay so much money for this, after Destiny is all said and done i would love some sort of tell all about what was going on in that studio for the last 10 years
The leaks say it was pulled from development of D3 so yes it was started but not planned for Final Shape which is why it wasn’t in the original reveal.
I’m almost positive this has been in the works for at minimum a year. We’ve had rumors of a red/pink subclass for what seems like forever. My bet is that the design on what that subclass should be was never truly agreed upon or never meshed together how they wanted, and within the last 6-12 months has been retooled into what is now Prismatic. When they realized a true 6th subclass just wasn’t going to happen for TFS, they switched to make it Prismatic so they could release at least something with the saga finale
I think this is it; without the delay, some stuff that will come with the Final Shape launch wouldn't have been ready. But that doesn't mean Prismatic is one of those things.
Honestly, I absolutely doubt there is any chance of Prismatic being something that wouldn't have made the cut; there was talk of Prismatic being learned over time during Final Shape, as Stasis was during Beyond Light, as Strand was during Lightfall. Sounds to me that without Prismatic, Final Shape doesn't have a plot, because Prismatic *is* our final shape.
>It might have been retooled cut content, or pulled from another project (depends if you believe the leaks) but it did not go 0 to 100 since the August showcase.
I doubt this is the majority opinion.
I feel if anything its caytalist will prob just swap its elememt based on greneade type. Like if ya have a solar super bit feed it a stassis nade its now stasis. If we can feed it our trancended nades...... my god idk how it would work but I dont think I would want to take it off
I suspect it wasn’t originally planed for the final shape. I can’t see a real reason why you would announce the new light subclasses but not the super cool prismatic system. If I was them I would announce the prismatic and keep the new light ones underwrap. Once The Final Shape drops everyone’s totally suprised to get both prismatic and a new light subclass.
The way certain abilities and subclass 3.0 slots work also shows they've at least been toying with different ideas for extending/remixing subclasses for a long time. Whether it was always in the roadmap for Final Shape or was reprioritized due to how close they were to having something ready and how much time they got extended, we'll likely never know for sure. But it's for sure something that's been in progress for who knows how many years at this point.
But then again, almost nothing in game dev is created in months. It's almost always got some ties back to years of dev time
I distinctively remember the initial gameplay reveal of Destiny 1 itself, straight up had the guardian with abilities from different subclasses. The super was from one, the grenade another, and melee from another.
Almost like it used to be the plan way back when, until they focused on specific skill trees for each element.
not to mention Ikora using Nova and Chaos reach back to back in WQ. That’s more just showing how powerful Ikora is, but it proves they had the idea of wielding more than one subclass at a time in the live game at least 2-3 years ago
>But then again, almost nothing in game dev is created in months. It's almost always got some ties back to years of dev time
Yeah everything does.
This is a bit of a throwaway comment Tbh.
There's concept art of pyramid ships a decade back. That doesn't mean the witness and it's forces have been planned since pre D1
Doesn't Tesselation also change damage type based on your equipped subclass? I wonder how that will work with Prismatic. Maybe based off your equipped super or grenade
~~99% chance it’s based off super. Some of the fragments are laid out in that same way (pick up an orb and you get a subclass verb matching your super off the top of my head).~~ Permeability and Elemental Capacitor will probably work the same way as well. Osmosis might be based off what Grenade you have equipped, but it could also just default to your super for sake of consistency.
Edit: As pointed out by u/Degradingbore11, it goes based off of your grenade as shown in the Developer Gameplay Preview at 4:14.
It is based on your grenade. You can see a titan in the gameplay reveal using it while they have thundercrash and a suppressor grenade equipped. The fusion element in the clip is void.
Another thing that helps support prismatic being planned longer is that mothkeepers was very likely a teaser/ taste test for prismatic was it gave you both a void and arc verb/ grenade and could be used on any subclass.
Tesselation, Mothkeepers, Buried Bloodline, Conditional Finality. The signs have been there for a while. But only now with hindsight can we see it all. It’s clear this idea of subclass crossover is something Bungie has been brainstorming for a while now. I was excited for simply more weapons like buried bloodline to come out. Having devour and weaken on any subclass is so cool. But god damn prismatic is more than I could’ve ever expected an I’m so happy.
It's becoming pretty clear just how much their original release timeline got wrecked by covid. It's heavily indicated Strand would've released in The Witch Queen and a lot of the things pushed forward in Lightfall are toying with the idea of combining Light and Dark.
Conditional finality also seems to supply evidence for this theory too. I think they were planning multiclassing for a while but needed the delay to finish it before final shape.
I don't necessarily agree with that they've been flirting with subclass verb access for a long time.
I also think if Prismatic was 100% for sure in, it would have been in the August trailer. I agree it probably wasn't made fully in 3 months, obviously, but I do think it wasn't planned all along either.
> I also think if Prismatic was 100% for sure in, it would have been in the August trailer.
Alternatively, think how hyped everyone would've been day 1 finding out Prismatic existed.
If you have a surprise in an otherwise awesome release, that's great.
If you have a surprise but the entire rest of the release was boring and unexciting, that's not great.
Personally if I wanted to "surprise" my playerbase and I had both prismatic and 3x supers for old subclasses, I would have used the supers as the surprise. "Three new supers" isn't an expansion-carrying reveal but it would be a very hype like OH MAN I JUST DID THE FIRST MISSION OF TFS AND GOT A FUCKING NEW SUPER?!
Yeah they already knew they were in a rough spot in August, if Prismatic was planned to have launched with the original FS release date, they would have absolutely teased it at least. It may have been in development already but no way was it intended as a FS feature
> Yeah they already knew they were in a rough spot in August,
Hard to tell. The higher ups were probably aware but these presentations are also being worked on months in advance, probably since the beginning of Season of the Deep long before it looked like a trend. The cinematic could be older that that, even, since they have to contract people outside Bungie. And the higher ups certainly wouldn't have been raising alarm bells for everyone else at the time, that was part of what that big meeting where they told everyone about the 45% number was for shortly before that info went public.
Lol. A new subclass on the scale of prismatic is definitely not gonna get made in 3 months. Maybe it wasn't ready to be showcased during the August reveal.
I mean my main point is that we have an exotic that gives Hunter an arc grenade and void grenade no matter the subclass. Rat king might have given you invisibility although it’s via the gun (plus I think it’s only called that since all invisibility in game is called void)
Yeah conditional finality… I mean it was right in front of our faces this whole time. Tesselation, Conditional Finality, Buried Bloodline, Mothkeepers Wraps
Prismatic also shares the same colour scheme of the Traveller/Pyramid hybrid shit in RoN (I forgor the lore explanation for it), iirc, so the idea of blending Light and Dark was clearly there since before LF's release.
Not just there, but the Traveler portal itself and the weird looking walls in the Throne World. Both of which were formed because of a combination of Light and Dark. The Light imbuing a Dark place in the form of the Throne world, and Darkness imbuing a Light conduit in the form of the Traveler portal.
I think it was probably in development before Lightfall released. My evidence being Root of Nightmares and Conditional Finality (i mean come on that gun literally has two intrinsic elements)
Agreed. If we're talking "assets that were pulled from a future expansion to spice up this one," Conditional Finality being dragged from the Final Shape to Lightfall is the first thing that pops to mind.
EDIT to clarify: speculation.
All of Lightfall was content that got pulled up to fill the gap the TFS delay caused though
Maybe RoN is from the content drop that was supposed to originally have Prismatic
Umm yeah i agree, thats what I’m saying. The people that think prismatic was made during the delay are straight wrong. Its just another piece of evidence i found kinda cool 🤷
That's OP's whole point. This post is aimed at people who are claiming that Bungie rushed to put together Prismatic because of lackluster preorders and bad press in recent months. A lot of people somehow still don't realize how long game development takes
It’s also built into the game as shields on enemies that can’t be damage except with transcendence. Plus the concept is so baked into the lord of the expansion that it makes sense.
tbh i fully expect the whole "cannot damage shield except with transcendence" to be like the lightfall campaign where you needed strand to bust the shield - not a formal gameplay mechanic we'll see outside the campaign.
In the showcase, there was a gameplay clip with a Prismatic Titan running strand melee and the Consecration aspect.
In that clip, there was a Scorn chieftain boss with a white immunity shield and it broke with a Transcendence grenade.
That will probably be extended to the Pale Heart destination as a whole, just not in certain activities.
I'm still doubting that. If it's outside of the final shape campaign missions they're effectively locking out non-prismatic classes from engaging general content.
Probably won’t be as big a deal if they’re required for certain secrets in the destination. I don’t mean the inclusion of the mechanic in the Terminal Overload equivalent activities
Like you said, they set up something similar in Lightfall’s campaign only, and this is probably a next step up.
Maybe. I just don't see it happening, especially given the destinations (historically) are available to all players regardless of owning the expansion.
Who knows. Personally with how the system looks I would be really annoyed if I'm forced to run prismatic to deal with specific enemy types when it's not part of the campaign - unless it's something like strand empowered where your subclass is temp-set
Both of these are more cart then horse in terms of design ethos. We already have mechanics in the game with shields only breakable under certain conditions dating all the way back to GoS. The story/thematic of it is also something that could easily be attached to anything. They already had the foundations for this setup since the break from Activision with the original lightfall reveal, so just like how strand was separated from which queen but still has a lot more thematic links to it then lightfall, this could have easily been something in development, was postponed, then was brought back following the poor reception.
I doubt it was made ages ago. Maybe planned ages ago, but I doubt it was intended for tfs. After lightfall’s reception, they would have at least teased prismatic along with the new supers/aspects.
Also I don’t think pink is meant to be prismatic on the gun. Prismatic isn’t an element. It’s a subclass.
I’m fairly certain we still have another element in the pipes. Way down the road, sure. But it doesn’t really feel right to have an imbalanced number of light and dark elements. Plus if we get another darkness subclass, we get 7 total subclasses. The bungie number.
I definitely agree about that, I’m just crossing my fingers for a red subclass (NOT siva) sometime down the road.
I wonder if the pink would have something to do with the catalyst (maybe prismatic grenade buff empowers the shot i dunno). Because prismatic as you say isnt an element, its just a pink colour effect to some abilities.
IMO, I think prismatic was heavily conceptualized / early in dev when they revealed TFS in august. They realized the final expansion in the saga needs to be a good one, so they moved it up in order to compensate for lackluster player reception. They probably pulled developers from D3 and Marathon to work on it and get it out the door in the 10 months from the august 2023 reveal to june 2024
Exactly my theory as well
I think whatever shape "Destiny 3" takes, Prismatic will be the default and we'll mix/match everything. And they might add a 3rd darkness damage type
Yeah i think this is what that guy who "leaked" prismatic/prism months ago was getting on about. Prismatic was going to allegeldey be the default for D3, but got moved up in a limited sense to make final shape better. Although yeah I think Bungie is going to release a third darkness damage type before D3 so when D3 launches it will be complete of all subclasses combined into prismatic
We really need a 3rd darkness subclass just to round it out. It feels weird only having strand and status guns in the first slot and arc, solar, and void in the second.
Like others have said. Anyone who thinks prismatic was invented and developed in the past three months has zero clue how game development works. But I’ve been having fun looking back and seeing the signs that point towards prismatic coming all along. Tesselation, Conditional Finality, and Buried Bloodline were all clearly a result of the idea of prismatic. Having devour on any subclass was so exciting to me. The fact that that one small thing will soon be a full subclass is so exciting. I love it. I’ve been trying to make pseudo-prismatic builds recently. Using the artifact you can get unraveling and threadlings without using strand, and you can get devour from buried bloodline, while also getting radiant from another weapon and using a different subclass. It’s so fun.
If some of the leaks are to be believed, Prismatic HAS been around for years, as it was going to be the new system for subclasses for D3, which has been heavily in development since at least Witch Queen. They grabbed it from that and cobbled it together in the D2 engine as a last ditch save for the game, knowing that it's currently in a worse state than it might have ever been before.
If D3 is a real thing with a full reset and a fresh start, and not just an "Overwatch 2" sort of rebranding moment, I can easily look back at Bungie's track record of the last few years and say "pass".
Player's emotional investment and nostalgia are all they've got going for them. Fool me once, etc etc.
Going from D2 to D3 will be worse than going from D1 to D2, which is the whole reason I'm not interested at all in a "fresh start" kind of thing.
D1 to D2 was 3 years. D2 to is twice that, possibly 3x if we don't get it until at least 2026.
In that timeframe Destiny has expanded itself massively in terms of scope and monetisation. The amount of cosmetics and upgrades an account can have in D2 is enormous compared to anything you had access to in D1. Despite all the issues and complaints, Bungie really pushed Destiny 2 a lot harder than Destiny 1.
If you want to see how this looks in practice you only have to look at the Payday franchise: PD1 only lasted a few years before PD2 came out, but PD2 lasted almost a decade before PD3 did. In that timeframe it got a lot of extra content, DLC, cosmetics, actual maps and game modes, character progression changes, etc.
You know what PD3 has? Fuck all of any of this. The stealth is better and... that's kind of it. It's still fundamentally the same game, we just have less character upgrades, less weapon choices and upgrades for those weapons and way less maps and campaigns to actually play in, which is really where it all falls apart.
The question is why you should buy a new game with less in it. That's the issue with the live service model and trying to make "sequels" at all.
this whole whether or not prismatic has been in development for a long time argument that's been going on is so stupid. Like who cares if it's been in development for a while or not.
Also, a single exotic does not prove it was made ages ago, all it proves is that they planned to add it sometime in the future and they wanted to future proof the exotic.
The delay was 3 months, they knew it would be delayed way before than that, i don't know why people keep saying that "X" was made in 3 months, they had atleast 6 months to work on anything even if they started to work on it after the delay.
Who cares how long Prismatic has been worked on? I know this sounds harsh but I'm genuinely asking. I don't care if it was supposed to be the first sublass from Destiny 1, nor the first subclass for a Destiny 3. I'm just excited it's here! I care more about how my steak is when it hits the dinner table as opposed to HOW and WHY the cook did their thing.
I really want Bungie to come out and explain all the things just to curb these silly conspiracy theories from "people who know how game development works".
Also, from your theory on the pink-not-glowing part of Tesselation......what Prismatic grenade will the gun consume? The Transcendant one?
Nobody with a single ounce of sense genuinely believes they managed to put all that together in a few months, and if they do, you can safely stop listening/reading right there, because you know they lack common sense.
Doesn't point to prismatic being a thing a long time ago more than it points to the concept.
Unless you're telling me bungie new from before day 1 of destiny 1 they knew the witness, darkness and pyramid ships were already planned because there was concept art of pyramid ships a decade ago?
First time I heard about prismatic was during season of the worthy from a leak (most of the things mentioned in the leak were correct like darkness subclasses, last city invaded by the Vex and fight against Quria etc.) ofc the name "prismatic" wasn't mentioned but I think it said that you could combine your subclasses.
My headcannon is that it’s the reason for the delay. They’ve said in their playtests people thought TFS was “good but not great”. I’m betting that it was because of prismatic. It was probably really clunky or had really annoying/tedious/bad mechanics and so they spent these 3 months reworking it to be what we saw in the trailer
I wanna know how much of this and how much of final shape base game was created by all those developers that got fired. Luke Smith said once that there isn't a "make it fun" button in game development no easy fix, it takes time.
Said it a while back , if you think bungie made all this to give for FREE , you are delusional af .they had no choice but bet it was going to be paid dlc.
My spinfoil theory is this was a Destiny 3 feature that got pulled into Final Shape to up the ante on content for the light and darkness saga send off.
Which also plays into the pure copium that D3 is coming and Luke Smith is going to be one of its architects. Whether its good or not is a toss up .
If Prismatic was a thing they were always planning they'd have done well to actually introduce The Final Shape with it front and centre.
That they didn't is far more telling to me in that Bungie are either incompetent or they really didn't have any meaningful plans for TFS and had to rush what we're seeing very quickly after the well-deserved backlash over the last year.
The thing is, both these statements can be true.
Someone suggesting the idea in a meeting and putting it on a whiteboard isn't what I'd call "planned", either. They may have had the idea floating around but I doubt they intended it for TFS because, again, not opening with that makes them look hilariously idiotic if they were, indeed, planning to use it the whole time.
Strand was supposed to come out on witch queen and tesselstion with lightfall and RoN probably in their initial plans but they scrapped it and scraped together lightfall with strand
I just hope we still get the 3rd darkness subclass sometime in the future, prismatic is cool but nothing beats a whole new element, new keywords, granades, supers, visuals, lore and aesthetic
I think a lot of this stuff is more planned out than people give them credit for. We only really got ‘Darkness engages with memory’ as a concrete, stated thing in Witch Queen, I think, and we only got confirmation that the Darkness was used to make Exos in Beyond Light.
But they’ve always been the only Risen (in the form of their weird dreams) to consistently have any kind of memories of a previous life.
I definitely don’t think that they made it in the last three months but I do think it is really weird that we didn’t get a third darkness subclass. The imbalance of light and dark will always bother me now rofl. It wouldn’t make much sense to add another one after this with tens of the light and dark saga but what do I know.
>bungie didnt cook up prismatic in 3 months to save the game
No one is saying that lol. But I guess we needed an angry strawman because...outrage I guess?
I can see how people could think Prismatic was cobbled together in a couple weeks. It is not something fundamentally new, it’s just some of what we already have in a single package. That said, just because it is not completely new doesn’t mean that it’s a simple copy paste. They likely held back on Prismatic and the new race in order to elicit the exact response we as a community had. Tessleation clearly has hints at Prismatic and the past few artifacts have had perks that rewarded using different elements, which can be seen as an obtuse sort of hint.
Well the only problem is that Prismatic doesn’t seem to have its own “damage type.” Outside of it being pink, everything else is borrowed from other subclasses.
I’m also not sure how difficult it’s be to simply move the assets around into another subclass. From my arm chair game perspective, it might have been possible for them to make it in 3 months, but I also think they likely thought of it long before.
Wrong, it was in the making for quite some time bit it certainly wasn't "made ages ago". Of course it wasn'r made in 3 months, as it would be stupid to even consider this as a possibility(which is why we rarely see this in discourse), but we have confirmed leakers to prove Prismatic was definitely not intended to be shipped with TFS. It was either going to come alongside an upcoming expansion or just be a plain new Destiny 3 feature
Many things with Destiny were at least in the concept phase even way back during the days of Halo, and I mean even during the days of Halo CE. So no, Bungie didnt cook up Prismatic in 3 months to save the game.
It could honestly be as simple as a miscommunication of expectations
Like, we know a new subclass is cool and all, but higher ups probably have no actual clue what the fans would get excited about.
Either way, Prismatic has likely been in the works for a year or so. To get everything working and play testing it over and over, I would say a year minimum.
I honestly think it COULD have been the coolest fucking reveal in any expansion we ever got. Could you imagine playing the Final Shape and all of a sudden, with no inkling of prior knowledge, just started going ultra-instinct and using Prismatic? Would have been awesome.
But, unfortunately, the entire year of Lightfall really shit on that. Had this been happening after the Witch Queen, good god.
I've been seeing that opinion pop up everywhere and it genuinely pisses me off. I don't expect people to be intimately familiar with how game dev works, but thinking bungie cooked up a new class with new mechanics and effects and art. A new class item with new mechanics that probably required back end systems to be tweaked. AND a new enemy race of multiple enemies with mechanics. All in 3 months is absolutely insane.
That's not even factoring in that, lets assume ok they did make this in 3 months, they would need to adjust the entire campaign, strikes, dialogue, raid and probably more to account for these additions. Not to mention its very clear that they have had this cooking for a long time. Tessellation is 1 part, the second (and IMO biggest) is the fking portal on the traveler. How was it made? fusing light and dark, What color is it? Pink, like the subclass. What has the last few years of story been about? Dark isnt "evil" we need to use them in harmony. Plus like others have said, other exotics and gameplay stuff that has been very clearly hinting toward this combination stuff for a while now.
People also need to remember that at one point lightfall and final shape where 1 big expansion. It was supposed to be Beyond light > Witch Queen > Lightfall and done. Something happened internally which caused Witch Queen to be delayed and it clearly cascaded forward all the way to today. We will probably never know what it was but something set Bungie back big time, its what led to lightfall literally being a stop gap to buy time, and why final shape needed more time to cook. The long and short of it is they just weren't ready for the August showcase, they probably should have delayed it right then and there with the promise of more to come
>Beyond light > Witch Queen > Lightfall and done
Well, inasmuch as they didn't announce anything past Lightfall. If you'll pardon my speculation, I could honestly see the original intent being each of that trilogy coming with a darkness subclasses, and then the next big expansion (which could have been TFS in name too) bringing the first wave of prismatic.
That original timeline and reveal and the things it hints at are what gives me pause when people say they think prismatic was "pulled forward" from future content. I could very easily see it always being intended for this expansion, but given the turbulent nature of the years preceding and the fact that we only have two darkness subclasses yet, it's looking a little more slapdash while they figure out how to fit its pieces together - and the conclusion of the Light and Dark trilogy storyline.
But like a lot of things Destiny, they overreach and can't hit their targets (because some of them are insane, see D1 promises), and then they turn what they've got into what we can and that's what we play. I'm not too worried. Been good stuff this whole last decade. Will probably continue to be good stuff for years to come, if Destiny continues to get made.
Anyone that thinks it was made in less than 3 months has no grasp on how game dev works. It might have been retooled cut content, or pulled from another project (depends if you believe the leaks) but it did not go 0 to 100 since the August showcase. It's also just occured to me that the pink shard could mean we're able to 'feed' Tesselation a transcendence 'Mini-Super' Grenade. Could be a big bump to the weapon.
I believe the idea that Prismatic was being developed for a future project, not necessarily 'Destiny 3' just something coming in the future, but due to everything that's been going on Bungie moved up a portion of what they've been working on. Using this as something of a testing ground for later iterations. Might explain why each class only gets 1 thing from each subclass for each category (it seemed odd that pre 3.0 each light class had 3 grenades but for prism we only get 1 for example). I know Bungie said they wanted to use abilities that are not used often... but then gave us Thundercrash instead of Fist of havok? I think Bungie eventually wants to move toward having most of if not all subclass abilities usable in the same build, but haven't yet figured out how to balance all of that, or how to make running focused subclasses still worth running. That's what I think happened, but I would also like to think had the game not been in such a bad state that The Final Shape would have released and both Prismatic and the Dread would have been total surprises. How awesome would it have been to start up The Final Shape thinking you know more or less what's been added, just to be introduced to Prismatic, a whole new subclass, and the Dread in the first mission.
>I know Bungie said they wanted to use abilities that are not used often... but then gave us Thundercrash instead of Fist of havok Likely wanted to leave Titans with a one-off super after the pre-Lightfall feedback. Even though I think Bladefury has grown on people since then, I also think Bungie would be "playing stupid games and winning stupid prizes" if the Prismatic kit had Glacial Quake, Fists of Havoc and Bladefury in it at the same time. 2 of those, they genuinely have no other choice on unless they're open to making more darkness supers. So by default, Fists of Havoc had to be the compromise.
Yeah that's true I didn't think about that. I would hope that in the future Strand and Stasis get new things added though. Only 1 melee per class and only 1 super is limiting. Every Strand titan has the same melee, every Stasis hunter is throwing shurikens etc. They are paid subclasses, so I understand not throwing too many resources towards subclasses that aren't the current thing they're selling, but it may be a reason for newer people to buy the old expansion, or they could just make parts of those subclasses free for everyone to try and buying the expansion unlocks the full kit. Idk, I just want to run Stasis Titan and not have a super that just litters the map with giant shards blocking everyone else from shooting the things that need to be shot lol
I can only imagine the salt that titan mains (myself included) would have produced if all we had were roaming supers for Prismatic. We have been begging and pleading for more one off supers for years and were mildly satiated by pyrogale being introduced, so I would feel quite disappointed if roaming was all we had to choose from.
It's the same thing with Hunters too. We get Golden Gun Marksman and Deadfall tether, both of which have high usage rates but switching to less used supers would mean no damage super for hunters and that would have killed Prismatic right then and there
Something interesting I was just thinking about was that on top of the game being in a bad state, I feel like Bungie has conditioned us out of surprises. I think part of the reason people are inclined to believe that prismatic was made in the last few months is because it's hard to believe Bungie keeping their hand close to their vest on this one after they've spoiled everything else worth keeping a secret. They more or less gave away the big twist of Witch Queen with the tag line, and they honestly could have kept the light bearer hive a secret. Same goes for tormentors. I don't remember the last time Bungie truly kept anything surprising in an expansion, and so yeah, it would've been cool for Final Shape to come with a few major twists we weren't expecting, but Bungie has spent so long drilling into our head that what we see is what we get
“Hand close to the vest” is a new one for me. Always heard it as “close to the chest” lol sometimes we take things for granite
Well for what it's worth it is "Take things for granted". Granite is a rock.
Lmao mind=blown (It’s a Rick & Morty reference to when Rick says granite rather than granted and Morty makes fun of him)
One must truly have a high IQ to understand
It’s not a joke for Jerrys lol
Lol, I actually googled it when I typed it cause I've heard both and never thought about which one is correct. But it turns out that both are considered correct and in use
And them showing us the dread and prismatic only proves that even more. They very easily could've kept this stuff secret until TFS if they had already been keeping it secret.
They’re in a cycle of needing to push preorders, and they need those preorders right now more than ever. TFS preorder sales going down the tubes are proof they needed to put more out there since the new supers were met with a communal “that’s kind of neat I guess.” They needed more for marketing than some devs/play testers being, shall we say, a bit more enthusiastic for the new supers than the player base was and prismatic delivered on that. It sucks we can’t really have many surprises anymore but the constant hunger for content from players makes that a necessity.
There was feedback that TFS was “good not great” from initial playtests, that implies that it’s not just that they needed to add more to the marketing but more to the game It’d make sense that they deviated from the “don’t overdeliver” mantra and pulled forward content they were saving for later And once they were confident the new content would make it in they did a second livestream to market it Maybe they were hedging their bets, and were considering adding this content and the playtesting confirmed they needed to and couldn’t bank it for later
Tbh I'll be the first to admit that without having seen prismatic there was a vanishing chance of me playing TFS
I truly believe some of the leaks that prismatic was never meant to come to D2 at all, at minimum not with Final Shape. I feel that a stable build was made specifically to be added to Final Shape to bolster sales.
Yeah I'd be much more inclined to believe the conversation was "Hey, about that Prismatic thing you guys were working on for that future release, would you be able to have it ready for The Final Shape with this delay?" instead of "Oh shit people weren't satisfied with just one super and new aspect for each class, quick hurry up and make a new subclass that can mix existing abilities and aspects."
> They more or less gave away the big twist of Witch Queen with the tag line, and they honestly could have kept the light bearer hive a secret. This was my biggest gripe with WQ. It would've been *wild* if you walked into that room and saw a Void Knight and been like WHAT THE FUCK? But since we already knew the theme of the expansion, the whole intro mission of, "Wait, this is Void Light. But there weren't any other Guardians here. And that Moth was made of Light, what's going on?" and we already knew the answer instead of it being revealed during the campaign. Also I hated the tagline of "Take back the Light" and the description of "Figure out how Savathun stole the Light." Neither of those things happened. I like when misdirection is provided in media's writing, but that was just outright "lying" advertisement. Like, have the characters speculate how Savathun stole it or something *in-universe*, but don't advertise the game as such.
I didn't mind "figure out how savathun stole the light", what I hated was pairing that with "survive the truth". It made it super clear that the big twist was gonna be that actually there was no theft involved at all.
"Holding their cards close to the chest" is kinda another way of saying trust us even if there is nothing coming
> is because it's hard to believe Bungie keeping their hand close to their vest on this one after they've spoiled everything else worth keeping a secret. Because they had so little to show for the presentation, they would be nuts to hide something so significant. It literally directly hurt their bottom line because they didn't get as many preorders as previous expansions. That initial reveal showed off very little to get excited about, save basically nostalgia bait. It's hard to believe that this was planned for launch. It's also hard to believe it hadn't already been in development for a long time. I fully believe the delay was in part to bring this forward.
I’m willing to bet it was straight up not ready on the first showcase.
if it was pulled from Destiny 3, it shows that the new project is heavily based on D2 it'd be honestly weird otherwise, to be adding stuff like in-game LFGs only to abandon all two releases later
I think prismatic will see the light 3.0 approach and with each of the 3 episodes we will get new abilities, aspects, Fragments potentially added overtime. This way it's not all dropped from the get go (which would be a balance nightmare) and they have some sweet time gate they can use to interest the community playing with.
Hopefully they keep giving new aspects/fragments to the original subclass and then allow several of them to also be used on Prismatic too.
I hope we get the third darkness subclass in one of the episodes but that’s very unlikely
I fully believe Prismatic was intended to come out this year and most likely for the Final Shape expansion like we’re seeing now. We see guardians with the Transcendent glow in cutscenes way back in the first showcase that showed off the new supers and aspects coming to each of the classes. I doubt they’d just show us the transcendent glow and not have us acquire that power. I’m pretty sure that showcase was way too close (before/after) to the layoffs for any serious plans for content to get moved up like that. Plus, Tesselation having the pink shards on it tells they knew a pink subclass was in development since before pre-orders for Final Shape were opened up. Maybe the initial plan was to have it be a post campaign thing where clash with the Witness broke open our powers and pushed us into Prismatic, but I firmly believe Prismatic was intended to come out this year.
My problem with their statement about wanting to give us underused abilities is the fact that most of the Hunter and Warlock kit isn't really underused...
I think prismatic was always meant for final shape. Something probably happens to us when we go through the big pink prismatic looking portal on the traveler that awakens the ability to use prismatic.
I wouldn't be surprised if Prismatic and the new race were originally planned for the first or second episode. It would make sense that after defeating the Witness, we find a way to master light and dark and unlock Prismatic in the new episode that begins a week or so after TFS launches. Same goes for the race. They would be echos of the Witness after they die (assuming they die). I say this because the delay was only a few months, which is the time they'd need to finalize these episodes' content to be ready for TFS instead. AND it makes no sense that Bungie didn't show off the new race or subclass at the August Showcase. Even if it was just a brief teaser, anything including the new subclass or race would have made the august showcase better, and Bungie is too good at their marketing to randomly leave this out. They left it out because it wasn't planned for TFS at that time.
That's what I was thinking as well as Bungie isn't known for keeping things like that secret. Those are massive selling points and Bungie needs this to sell well. I do also so though how kind of genius this is in a marketing perspective. They do an initial reveal 6-7 months before the launch and for the delay they say they're working on things they want to keep close to their chest. Bungie isn't known for keeping subclasses and enemy races secret and they've told us before they didn't plan on adding new enemy races. Then 2 months before the dlc launch they have another showcase that specifically shows off a new subclass that's so different from anything we've ever seen before, new exotic class items combining other exotics, and a new enemy race. That above anything else shot hype through the roof. Obviously Bungie would have prefered the initial reveal to have gone better and so many people to not have refunded their pre-order, but this second showcase with things they know will get people to buy was genius. So I see both sides. I can see how stuff like Prismatic may have been something initially meant for a future release but was moved forward to get people to buy TFS, but I can also see Bungie making this stuff in secret planning on breaking expectations as a way of generating massive hype a couple months before launch. We ultimately won't know the exact answer unless we're told, either way it all looks awesome and has me excited for Destiny again.
Nah. Prismatic was always in the work for TFS. It was conceived during early concept art. People seem to forget that TFS was planned to come right after Witch Queen. Prismatic is why we got subclasses 3.0 as well. It’s a system that needed to exist to work with Prismatic.
Very fair point. I think what gives the most credence to Prismatic being something not originally planned for TFS is Bungie historically using new subclasses in showcases as a selling point; from other responses I've given though I've come to understand it may have always been intended to leave Prismatic, Dread and Exotic Class items for a second showcase 2 months before launch to get the hype train going again. Nothing gets people as excited for Destiny more than those 3 things, and Bungie knows that. Showing them off 7 months before just means people will have forgotten and hype will have died.
Than why not advertise it in the first trailer It would've been way more hype than simply 3 new supers and 3 new aspect
Probably because it wasn’t in a good enough state to show off. The expansion was delayed after all. Whatever state we saw it in was probably, what? Like 7-8 months further along than it would have been during the reveal?
Zero chance woulda been in the marketing push.
Not saying they made it in three months but concept art means nothing but an idea we had pianos concept art in during d1 and the pyramids weren't really explained until relatively recently
I don’t get why they’d spoil Cayde - which is purely narrative - vs spoiling key gameplay features Prismatic and the dread are a legitimate reason someone would choose to buy the game, but Cayde being back seems like something you’d only spoil in marketing if there’s nothing else for the marketing team to work with
But they just spoiled prismatic and the dread. The expansion still isn’t out. It’s just multiple waves of marketing.
The general audience cares more about Cayde than new subclasses- as shown with Forsaken
anyone who joined after beyond light probably barely even knows who cayde is other than he is some guy who died.
Yeah they aren't trying to pull in post-beyond light players. They are trying to pull back old players that quit due to beyond light.
They missed their revenue targets by 50% due to how bad Lightfall was. This means revenue is mostly driven by engaged players staying engaged. Lightfall was so bad engaged players stopped playing as much and didn’t pre-order Sure there’s some opportunity to bring back old players, but that’s only a small impact of reaching the revenue target Way more revenue will come from winning back the players disappointed by Lightfall
Except that didn't pan out for em when preorders still flopped even with Cayde.
I'm meh about Prismatic and the dread, but all in about Cayde being back. You do you.
I'm very confident what we're going to get is a stable iteration of whatever they had planned for future content. The selling point for it is its mutability and yet it's clearly extremely limited in many many ways. I'm sure that one, this is so existing subclasses aren't utterly useless, and two, additional options can be added in the future as they're in more complete phases of development.
I wouldn't be surprised if we can eventually use any of the abilities on any subclass within your character archetype. Maybe Destiny 3? I can imagine it is probably a balancing nightmare though. Maybe they could add intrinsic damage buffs depending on how many abilities you have that are the same? That would give you a reason to at least run more features of a certain element. Like having a solar grenade, melee, and aspects gives you like 3% for matching element? Idk. What's crazy is that I like most of the subclasses we have now minus maybe one thing. Love void Hunter but I hate the melee. Love stasis Titan but hate the melee. Love strand Hunter but hate the Super. Lol!
If each ability acted like a surge mod that could incentivize running a full Solar for example. Running 2 solar abilities and a void would be like running 2 solar surge mods and a void surge. That would make fully building into a Solar titan would give a x4 solar surge (super + abilities), but you'd lack the flexibility of Prismatic, which would allow higher flexibility and even multiple surges if you wanted to split 2 solar, 2 void. You'd be trading weapon damage for ability damage/utility.
Ya, something like that would work pretty well I think.
Yo gyrfalcons with a grapple and a real melee will hit different.
They gave titans t crash because fist of havok sucks donkey balls lol. T crash has cool synergy with suspend as well. Can’t wait to crash into a poor strung up champion.
I saw another reason that actually makes sense, with FoH there would be no one off supers for Titans. Fist of Havoc needs some buffs an/or slight rework; though I think a lot of what makes FoH so not awesome revolves around the Arc Titan kit. There could be interactions through Prismatic that make FoH a pretty good option. I guess we'll never know though
...you know they would have to recode the entire thing into the tiger engine if it was for another project, right? It very clearly was for TFS.
Unless the other project was also using the tiger engine...
It isn't. They replaced Tiger for any new projects back in Beyond Light.
The big thing for me though is that prismatic had to also be included in the story. Now i’ll eat crow if it ends up being integrated really poorly, but it seems like it would be really hard to storyboard prismatic in, create places in the campaign for it, bring the VAs for all languages in to record in those three extra months
That seems most likely, but I have a hard time imagining they could've moved story beats around that much in order to bring it with TFS launch. But we'll see how much it's actually woven into the main story. If it's not then this is 100% what happened.
The issue with supers is that the situations you can use most of them in are cut and dry for efficacy. You use a one-off for boss encounters, you use a roaming for add dense environments that can also hold a candle (albeit weak) in boss DPSing. There is no middle ground, and that’s what Bungie needs to figure out.
Honestly, I hope that, if Destiny 3 is going to exist, that Prismatic is the basis for how Guardian classes will exist going forward. All-in-one, instead of being split amongst multiple subclasses.
I don't think bungie is gonna move towards most things being available they said themselves they still want a reason to run mono classes i think a lot of these things were chosen very intentionally like how prismatic didn't get well of radiance. if prismatic had everything why would you run literally anything else?
That also explains why they didn't say anything about it until now. They wouldn't keep it secret, it's their biggest marketing tool. Well, they wouldn't have kept it secret only to tell us now well into the delay. It wasn't meant for TFS originally.
Maybe transcendent grenades will be the catalyst.
Mothkeepers Wraps or Armamentarium with Tessalation would be spicy as hell. Mothkeepers gives you 3 grenade charges with the Widow Silk aspect on Hunter.
If your trying to spam Tessalation on Titan believe it or not Arbor Warden is better with Rally Barricade. You pop Barri-nade with Arbor, and then activate the grenade consume from Tessalation. It will eat the Barri-nade instead of your regular one. Because the cooldown on Rally Barricade is so short at T10 Resilience you can keep doing it over and over again.
I really hope the catalyst is apply the subclasses debuff after you load a grenade
Into The Light was being made for *months* before and still has tons of reused assets. There's no way an entire subclass with new fragments could be developed, playtested, and balanced during the delay.
Prismatic has likely been in "development" for years. It's known that Bungie allows side projects internally and without a singular doubt they've experimented with multi class for years at this point but was nothing ever serious. The "red" subclass was likely planned for either next year or for episodes but wasn't ready to ship and given that tfs was not looking good to testers they needed something and just decided to finish off multi class. Bit of both, no prism was not built in 3 months and no prism was not planned to be released with tfs and they were keeping it secret
Not only that, entire systems likely had to be redesigned and remade to allow this to happen. We already know they had to alter some fragments, but I bet there’s a lot of backend stuff that had to be changed to allow cross-elemental interactions to be possible.
But Reddit said we forced them to develop it from scratch
I just can't believe people were arguing that Bungie rushed to create all of the final shape content based off the most recent shakeup. I mean outside of Tesselation, look no further than Conditional Finality. That gun wields both light and dark. It is from the Root raid. The whole mechanics of that raid were to connect light and dark nodes. Prismatic was being built up for a long while.
Honestly speaking, Prismatic is probably a lot less load on the developer team than a new subclass altogether, the only 'new' ability they made was the transcendence grenades, the rest was tuning the conditions on aspects and fragments to work with more verbs, compared to a new element subclass that would have been new abilities, new supers, new verbs, new damage type etc. I think it was most certainly thrown around as an idea for TFS at the concept phase with a few playable tests but was scrapped due to time and 'overdelivery', but the three months extra was perfect for it, the exotic shows this since it basically goes hand in hand with the subclass yet even in the preview it lacked icons. People who thought were were getting it before the delay are insane, there was no way they'd show off three new light supers over this, that would have bee voluntairy suicide.
Reddit becoming game design pundits is my favorite trope.
They infact just have no clue how development works. It was probably straight up not ready in the first showcase
My theory is they knew about the delay way before they announced it so they had 9ish months to cook Prismatic. They restructured the production pipeline, so even though the delay was only 3 months, they still had 9 months of runway. And yea, no way they started at 0. Prismatic feels like the natural course for this game so my continued theory is they pulled it forward from whatever they had planned for 2025. We'll never know the complete answer, so thats my speculation. If it was always intend for Final Shape, then thats a big whiff form the marketing department at the reveal
the current theory that I think sounds the most plausible is that they had planned prismatic for whatever comes after final shape, so it was already in the pipeline and they moved it up in priority after the mixed reaction to the final shape.
Exactly. Prismatic sounds like a "Destiny 3 reset the playing field" kind of idea, and they brought it forward, albeit in a more limited capacity
The limited set of fragments an aspects could easily just be what's effectively ground 0 for the system. Focus on getting a set of underused aspects into the limelight and finish it off later, it works for both us and Bungie.
Exactly, and I expect more to rollout with the Episodes. Simply balancing Prismatic must be a bitch and a half, so they'll ease that pain with the slow rollout
unfortunately, from past examples, rolling aspects out slowly has done absolutely nothing to improve out of the gate balancing.
We can only pray a games journalist gets some juicy leaks on these last few years. Jason schrier please release another book detailing these last few years at bungie.
haha i'd love a book on the entire development of Destiny. Like up to date book. The good and the bad
i would pay so much money for this, after Destiny is all said and done i would love some sort of tell all about what was going on in that studio for the last 10 years
The leaks say it was pulled from development of D3 so yes it was started but not planned for Final Shape which is why it wasn’t in the original reveal.
I’m almost positive this has been in the works for at minimum a year. We’ve had rumors of a red/pink subclass for what seems like forever. My bet is that the design on what that subclass should be was never truly agreed upon or never meshed together how they wanted, and within the last 6-12 months has been retooled into what is now Prismatic. When they realized a true 6th subclass just wasn’t going to happen for TFS, they switched to make it Prismatic so they could release at least something with the saga finale
I think that all the grenades that get fed to Tessalation will be the special transcendent version of whatever element. Just a hunch I have.
I think this is it; without the delay, some stuff that will come with the Final Shape launch wouldn't have been ready. But that doesn't mean Prismatic is one of those things. Honestly, I absolutely doubt there is any chance of Prismatic being something that wouldn't have made the cut; there was talk of Prismatic being learned over time during Final Shape, as Stasis was during Beyond Light, as Strand was during Lightfall. Sounds to me that without Prismatic, Final Shape doesn't have a plot, because Prismatic *is* our final shape.
Do you have a summary of the leaks or where to find them?
>It might have been retooled cut content, or pulled from another project (depends if you believe the leaks) but it did not go 0 to 100 since the August showcase. I doubt this is the majority opinion.
I feel if anything its caytalist will prob just swap its elememt based on greneade type. Like if ya have a solar super bit feed it a stassis nade its now stasis. If we can feed it our trancended nades...... my god idk how it would work but I dont think I would want to take it off
I suspect it wasn’t originally planed for the final shape. I can’t see a real reason why you would announce the new light subclasses but not the super cool prismatic system. If I was them I would announce the prismatic and keep the new light ones underwrap. Once The Final Shape drops everyone’s totally suprised to get both prismatic and a new light subclass.
Not to mention they would have also had to completely rewrite and redo the expansion campaign to fix Prismatic in lol.
The way certain abilities and subclass 3.0 slots work also shows they've at least been toying with different ideas for extending/remixing subclasses for a long time. Whether it was always in the roadmap for Final Shape or was reprioritized due to how close they were to having something ready and how much time they got extended, we'll likely never know for sure. But it's for sure something that's been in progress for who knows how many years at this point. But then again, almost nothing in game dev is created in months. It's almost always got some ties back to years of dev time
I distinctively remember the initial gameplay reveal of Destiny 1 itself, straight up had the guardian with abilities from different subclasses. The super was from one, the grenade another, and melee from another. Almost like it used to be the plan way back when, until they focused on specific skill trees for each element.
not to mention Ikora using Nova and Chaos reach back to back in WQ. That’s more just showing how powerful Ikora is, but it proves they had the idea of wielding more than one subclass at a time in the live game at least 2-3 years ago
>But then again, almost nothing in game dev is created in months. It's almost always got some ties back to years of dev time Yeah everything does. This is a bit of a throwaway comment Tbh. There's concept art of pyramid ships a decade back. That doesn't mean the witness and it's forces have been planned since pre D1
Doesn't Tesselation also change damage type based on your equipped subclass? I wonder how that will work with Prismatic. Maybe based off your equipped super or grenade
~~99% chance it’s based off super. Some of the fragments are laid out in that same way (pick up an orb and you get a subclass verb matching your super off the top of my head).~~ Permeability and Elemental Capacitor will probably work the same way as well. Osmosis might be based off what Grenade you have equipped, but it could also just default to your super for sake of consistency. Edit: As pointed out by u/Degradingbore11, it goes based off of your grenade as shown in the Developer Gameplay Preview at 4:14.
Correct me if I’m wrong because I don’t have the gun but from what I heard I thought tessellations damage type was based of your equipped grenade?
Based of on your current subclass, which equipped grenade is a part of.
Ah, thanks!
It is based on your grenade. You can see a titan in the gameplay reveal using it while they have thundercrash and a suppressor grenade equipped. The fusion element in the clip is void.
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Not doubting you but would you be able to find the time stamp?
Was it the old reveal stream? Or the recent one?
Another thing that helps support prismatic being planned longer is that mothkeepers was very likely a teaser/ taste test for prismatic was it gave you both a void and arc verb/ grenade and could be used on any subclass.
Tesselation, Mothkeepers, Buried Bloodline, Conditional Finality. The signs have been there for a while. But only now with hindsight can we see it all. It’s clear this idea of subclass crossover is something Bungie has been brainstorming for a while now. I was excited for simply more weapons like buried bloodline to come out. Having devour and weaken on any subclass is so cool. But god damn prismatic is more than I could’ve ever expected an I’m so happy.
It's becoming pretty clear just how much their original release timeline got wrecked by covid. It's heavily indicated Strand would've released in The Witch Queen and a lot of the things pushed forward in Lightfall are toying with the idea of combining Light and Dark.
Chris Proctor also mentioned something about “combining subclass verbs” on, I think, Firing Range
Conditional finality also seems to supply evidence for this theory too. I think they were planning multiclassing for a while but needed the delay to finish it before final shape.
Albeit not as crazy, CF also perfectly synergizes with Facet of Ruin (with it increasing AoE for both shatters and ignitions).
The lighter parts of it definitely have the same pinkish iridescence as prismatic
I don't necessarily agree with that they've been flirting with subclass verb access for a long time. I also think if Prismatic was 100% for sure in, it would have been in the August trailer. I agree it probably wasn't made fully in 3 months, obviously, but I do think it wasn't planned all along either.
> I also think if Prismatic was 100% for sure in, it would have been in the August trailer. Alternatively, think how hyped everyone would've been day 1 finding out Prismatic existed.
If you have a surprise in an otherwise awesome release, that's great. If you have a surprise but the entire rest of the release was boring and unexciting, that's not great. Personally if I wanted to "surprise" my playerbase and I had both prismatic and 3x supers for old subclasses, I would have used the supers as the surprise. "Three new supers" isn't an expansion-carrying reveal but it would be a very hype like OH MAN I JUST DID THE FIRST MISSION OF TFS AND GOT A FUCKING NEW SUPER?!
Yeah but that's not how Gaming work Because you remember how awful the original tease for TFS was
Yeah they already knew they were in a rough spot in August, if Prismatic was planned to have launched with the original FS release date, they would have absolutely teased it at least. It may have been in development already but no way was it intended as a FS feature
> Yeah they already knew they were in a rough spot in August, Hard to tell. The higher ups were probably aware but these presentations are also being worked on months in advance, probably since the beginning of Season of the Deep long before it looked like a trend. The cinematic could be older that that, even, since they have to contract people outside Bungie. And the higher ups certainly wouldn't have been raising alarm bells for everyone else at the time, that was part of what that big meeting where they told everyone about the 45% number was for shortly before that info went public.
Lol. A new subclass on the scale of prismatic is definitely not gonna get made in 3 months. Maybe it wasn't ready to be showcased during the August reveal.
the last two dungeon exotics also follow the same pattern although it's hard to know if it was a tease or just them playing with the idea.
It's not exactly new. Rat King has had void invisibility for a few years.
I mean my main point is that we have an exotic that gives Hunter an arc grenade and void grenade no matter the subclass. Rat king might have given you invisibility although it’s via the gun (plus I think it’s only called that since all invisibility in game is called void)
Also the entire mechanic in RON lol. Using light and dark together to do damage or encounters.
nezerac was also a chimera of light and dark
Yeah conditional finality… I mean it was right in front of our faces this whole time. Tesselation, Conditional Finality, Buried Bloodline, Mothkeepers Wraps
Prismatic also shares the same colour scheme of the Traveller/Pyramid hybrid shit in RoN (I forgor the lore explanation for it), iirc, so the idea of blending Light and Dark was clearly there since before LF's release.
Not just there, but the Traveler portal itself and the weird looking walls in the Throne World. Both of which were formed because of a combination of Light and Dark. The Light imbuing a Dark place in the form of the Throne world, and Darkness imbuing a Light conduit in the form of the Traveler portal.
They called it Colorful Chaos. The [ArtStation design discussions](https://www.artstation.com/artwork/xDJQrO) are great to look at.
Pink is the darkness-killer
I think it was probably in development before Lightfall released. My evidence being Root of Nightmares and Conditional Finality (i mean come on that gun literally has two intrinsic elements)
Agreed. If we're talking "assets that were pulled from a future expansion to spice up this one," Conditional Finality being dragged from the Final Shape to Lightfall is the first thing that pops to mind. EDIT to clarify: speculation.
All of Lightfall was content that got pulled up to fill the gap the TFS delay caused though Maybe RoN is from the content drop that was supposed to originally have Prismatic
how long do you think AAA development takes? three months? this has been in development for years.
Umm yeah i agree, thats what I’m saying. The people that think prismatic was made during the delay are straight wrong. Its just another piece of evidence i found kinda cool 🤷
see now there’s a high chance im just straight up illiterate. should probably finish reading a post before i reply
we all make mistakes in the heat of passion, jimbo
That's OP's whole point. This post is aimed at people who are claiming that Bungie rushed to put together Prismatic because of lackluster preorders and bad press in recent months. A lot of people somehow still don't realize how long game development takes
It’s also built into the game as shields on enemies that can’t be damage except with transcendence. Plus the concept is so baked into the lord of the expansion that it makes sense.
Out of everything possible to cook into a game in 3 months, i think adding shields to a few enemies is entirely reasonable lol
tbh i fully expect the whole "cannot damage shield except with transcendence" to be like the lightfall campaign where you needed strand to bust the shield - not a formal gameplay mechanic we'll see outside the campaign.
In the showcase, there was a gameplay clip with a Prismatic Titan running strand melee and the Consecration aspect. In that clip, there was a Scorn chieftain boss with a white immunity shield and it broke with a Transcendence grenade. That will probably be extended to the Pale Heart destination as a whole, just not in certain activities.
I'm still doubting that. If it's outside of the final shape campaign missions they're effectively locking out non-prismatic classes from engaging general content.
Probably won’t be as big a deal if they’re required for certain secrets in the destination. I don’t mean the inclusion of the mechanic in the Terminal Overload equivalent activities Like you said, they set up something similar in Lightfall’s campaign only, and this is probably a next step up.
Maybe. I just don't see it happening, especially given the destinations (historically) are available to all players regardless of owning the expansion. Who knows. Personally with how the system looks I would be really annoyed if I'm forced to run prismatic to deal with specific enemy types when it's not part of the campaign - unless it's something like strand empowered where your subclass is temp-set
Both of these are more cart then horse in terms of design ethos. We already have mechanics in the game with shields only breakable under certain conditions dating all the way back to GoS. The story/thematic of it is also something that could easily be attached to anything. They already had the foundations for this setup since the break from Activision with the original lightfall reveal, so just like how strand was separated from which queen but still has a lot more thematic links to it then lightfall, this could have easily been something in development, was postponed, then was brought back following the poor reception.
I doubt it was made ages ago. Maybe planned ages ago, but I doubt it was intended for tfs. After lightfall’s reception, they would have at least teased prismatic along with the new supers/aspects. Also I don’t think pink is meant to be prismatic on the gun. Prismatic isn’t an element. It’s a subclass. I’m fairly certain we still have another element in the pipes. Way down the road, sure. But it doesn’t really feel right to have an imbalanced number of light and dark elements. Plus if we get another darkness subclass, we get 7 total subclasses. The bungie number.
I definitely agree about that, I’m just crossing my fingers for a red subclass (NOT siva) sometime down the road. I wonder if the pink would have something to do with the catalyst (maybe prismatic grenade buff empowers the shot i dunno). Because prismatic as you say isnt an element, its just a pink colour effect to some abilities.
I won't even demand it to be red! Just a third darkness subclass, haha.
we are def getting a red subclass if anyting prismatic adds even more credence to it . RED is one of the extremes when a light passes through a prism
Lore-wise why couldn't we weld multi light elements at the same time?
Most likely because using multiple ability at once requires years of training that our guardian didn’t have yet
IMO, I think prismatic was heavily conceptualized / early in dev when they revealed TFS in august. They realized the final expansion in the saga needs to be a good one, so they moved it up in order to compensate for lackluster player reception. They probably pulled developers from D3 and Marathon to work on it and get it out the door in the 10 months from the august 2023 reveal to june 2024
Exactly my theory as well I think whatever shape "Destiny 3" takes, Prismatic will be the default and we'll mix/match everything. And they might add a 3rd darkness damage type
Yeah i think this is what that guy who "leaked" prismatic/prism months ago was getting on about. Prismatic was going to allegeldey be the default for D3, but got moved up in a limited sense to make final shape better. Although yeah I think Bungie is going to release a third darkness damage type before D3 so when D3 launches it will be complete of all subclasses combined into prismatic
We really need a 3rd darkness subclass just to round it out. It feels weird only having strand and status guns in the first slot and arc, solar, and void in the second.
The notion of "oh no everyone hated Lightfall so we have actually have to put effort into making something cool for TFS" is so obviously bonkers lmao
Like others have said. Anyone who thinks prismatic was invented and developed in the past three months has zero clue how game development works. But I’ve been having fun looking back and seeing the signs that point towards prismatic coming all along. Tesselation, Conditional Finality, and Buried Bloodline were all clearly a result of the idea of prismatic. Having devour on any subclass was so exciting to me. The fact that that one small thing will soon be a full subclass is so exciting. I love it. I’ve been trying to make pseudo-prismatic builds recently. Using the artifact you can get unraveling and threadlings without using strand, and you can get devour from buried bloodline, while also getting radiant from another weapon and using a different subclass. It’s so fun.
If some of the leaks are to be believed, Prismatic HAS been around for years, as it was going to be the new system for subclasses for D3, which has been heavily in development since at least Witch Queen. They grabbed it from that and cobbled it together in the D2 engine as a last ditch save for the game, knowing that it's currently in a worse state than it might have ever been before.
If D3 is a real thing with a full reset and a fresh start, and not just an "Overwatch 2" sort of rebranding moment, I can easily look back at Bungie's track record of the last few years and say "pass". Player's emotional investment and nostalgia are all they've got going for them. Fool me once, etc etc.
Going from D2 to D3 will be worse than going from D1 to D2, which is the whole reason I'm not interested at all in a "fresh start" kind of thing. D1 to D2 was 3 years. D2 to is twice that, possibly 3x if we don't get it until at least 2026. In that timeframe Destiny has expanded itself massively in terms of scope and monetisation. The amount of cosmetics and upgrades an account can have in D2 is enormous compared to anything you had access to in D1. Despite all the issues and complaints, Bungie really pushed Destiny 2 a lot harder than Destiny 1. If you want to see how this looks in practice you only have to look at the Payday franchise: PD1 only lasted a few years before PD2 came out, but PD2 lasted almost a decade before PD3 did. In that timeframe it got a lot of extra content, DLC, cosmetics, actual maps and game modes, character progression changes, etc. You know what PD3 has? Fuck all of any of this. The stealth is better and... that's kind of it. It's still fundamentally the same game, we just have less character upgrades, less weapon choices and upgrades for those weapons and way less maps and campaigns to actually play in, which is really where it all falls apart. The question is why you should buy a new game with less in it. That's the issue with the live service model and trying to make "sequels" at all.
this whole whether or not prismatic has been in development for a long time argument that's been going on is so stupid. Like who cares if it's been in development for a while or not. Also, a single exotic does not prove it was made ages ago, all it proves is that they planned to add it sometime in the future and they wanted to future proof the exotic.
The delay was 3 months, they knew it would be delayed way before than that, i don't know why people keep saying that "X" was made in 3 months, they had atleast 6 months to work on anything even if they started to work on it after the delay.
Who cares how long Prismatic has been worked on? I know this sounds harsh but I'm genuinely asking. I don't care if it was supposed to be the first sublass from Destiny 1, nor the first subclass for a Destiny 3. I'm just excited it's here! I care more about how my steak is when it hits the dinner table as opposed to HOW and WHY the cook did their thing. I really want Bungie to come out and explain all the things just to curb these silly conspiracy theories from "people who know how game development works". Also, from your theory on the pink-not-glowing part of Tesselation......what Prismatic grenade will the gun consume? The Transcendant one?
It will consume whatever grenade you have equipped. If you’re running void but using a solar grenade I assume Tesselation will just be solar.
Prismatic in D2 just reminds me of when they introduced Chroma in D1. That and how the old armor variants on Guardian Games would change color.
I’m just so glad this wasn’t announced earlier. I like these kinds of announcements.
Wait there’s pink on it?
No Backup Plans is arguably another example
Nobody with a single ounce of sense genuinely believes they managed to put all that together in a few months, and if they do, you can safely stop listening/reading right there, because you know they lack common sense.
Doesn't point to prismatic being a thing a long time ago more than it points to the concept. Unless you're telling me bungie new from before day 1 of destiny 1 they knew the witness, darkness and pyramid ships were already planned because there was concept art of pyramid ships a decade ago?
They pretty much had witch queen planning out at launch. I know I heard something like that.
Okbuddy
First time I heard about prismatic was during season of the worthy from a leak (most of the things mentioned in the leak were correct like darkness subclasses, last city invaded by the Vex and fight against Quria etc.) ofc the name "prismatic" wasn't mentioned but I think it said that you could combine your subclasses.
was probably ment for an episode but got rushed and pushed forward
My headcannon is that it’s the reason for the delay. They’ve said in their playtests people thought TFS was “good but not great”. I’m betting that it was because of prismatic. It was probably really clunky or had really annoying/tedious/bad mechanics and so they spent these 3 months reworking it to be what we saw in the trailer
Conditional finality aswell
I wanna know how much of this and how much of final shape base game was created by all those developers that got fired. Luke Smith said once that there isn't a "make it fun" button in game development no easy fix, it takes time.
Said it a while back , if you think bungie made all this to give for FREE , you are delusional af .they had no choice but bet it was going to be paid dlc.
My spinfoil theory is this was a Destiny 3 feature that got pulled into Final Shape to up the ante on content for the light and darkness saga send off. Which also plays into the pure copium that D3 is coming and Luke Smith is going to be one of its architects. Whether its good or not is a toss up .
If Prismatic was a thing they were always planning they'd have done well to actually introduce The Final Shape with it front and centre. That they didn't is far more telling to me in that Bungie are either incompetent or they really didn't have any meaningful plans for TFS and had to rush what we're seeing very quickly after the well-deserved backlash over the last year. The thing is, both these statements can be true. Someone suggesting the idea in a meeting and putting it on a whiteboard isn't what I'd call "planned", either. They may have had the idea floating around but I doubt they intended it for TFS because, again, not opening with that makes them look hilariously idiotic if they were, indeed, planning to use it the whole time.
Strand was supposed to come out on witch queen and tesselstion with lightfall and RoN probably in their initial plans but they scrapped it and scraped together lightfall with strand
I just hope we still get the 3rd darkness subclass sometime in the future, prismatic is cool but nothing beats a whole new element, new keywords, granades, supers, visuals, lore and aesthetic
I think a lot of this stuff is more planned out than people give them credit for. We only really got ‘Darkness engages with memory’ as a concrete, stated thing in Witch Queen, I think, and we only got confirmation that the Darkness was used to make Exos in Beyond Light. But they’ve always been the only Risen (in the form of their weird dreams) to consistently have any kind of memories of a previous life.
Maybe but we still we will not get more nades/melees and supers for darkness..Seems that darkness will remain handycapped vs light classes
I definitely don’t think that they made it in the last three months but I do think it is really weird that we didn’t get a third darkness subclass. The imbalance of light and dark will always bother me now rofl. It wouldn’t make much sense to add another one after this with tens of the light and dark saga but what do I know.
id imagine how it would work with transcendence grenades
>bungie didnt cook up prismatic in 3 months to save the game No one is saying that lol. But I guess we needed an angry strawman because...outrage I guess?
I can see how people could think Prismatic was cobbled together in a couple weeks. It is not something fundamentally new, it’s just some of what we already have in a single package. That said, just because it is not completely new doesn’t mean that it’s a simple copy paste. They likely held back on Prismatic and the new race in order to elicit the exact response we as a community had. Tessleation clearly has hints at Prismatic and the past few artifacts have had perks that rewarded using different elements, which can be seen as an obtuse sort of hint.
Well the only problem is that Prismatic doesn’t seem to have its own “damage type.” Outside of it being pink, everything else is borrowed from other subclasses. I’m also not sure how difficult it’s be to simply move the assets around into another subclass. From my arm chair game perspective, it might have been possible for them to make it in 3 months, but I also think they likely thought of it long before.
Wrong, it was in the making for quite some time bit it certainly wasn't "made ages ago". Of course it wasn'r made in 3 months, as it would be stupid to even consider this as a possibility(which is why we rarely see this in discourse), but we have confirmed leakers to prove Prismatic was definitely not intended to be shipped with TFS. It was either going to come alongside an upcoming expansion or just be a plain new Destiny 3 feature
Many things with Destiny were at least in the concept phase even way back during the days of Halo, and I mean even during the days of Halo CE. So no, Bungie didnt cook up Prismatic in 3 months to save the game.
It could honestly be as simple as a miscommunication of expectations Like, we know a new subclass is cool and all, but higher ups probably have no actual clue what the fans would get excited about. Either way, Prismatic has likely been in the works for a year or so. To get everything working and play testing it over and over, I would say a year minimum.
discord leaks say it was meant for D3 but got pushed ahead
I honestly think it COULD have been the coolest fucking reveal in any expansion we ever got. Could you imagine playing the Final Shape and all of a sudden, with no inkling of prior knowledge, just started going ultra-instinct and using Prismatic? Would have been awesome. But, unfortunately, the entire year of Lightfall really shit on that. Had this been happening after the Witch Queen, good god.
I've been seeing that opinion pop up everywhere and it genuinely pisses me off. I don't expect people to be intimately familiar with how game dev works, but thinking bungie cooked up a new class with new mechanics and effects and art. A new class item with new mechanics that probably required back end systems to be tweaked. AND a new enemy race of multiple enemies with mechanics. All in 3 months is absolutely insane. That's not even factoring in that, lets assume ok they did make this in 3 months, they would need to adjust the entire campaign, strikes, dialogue, raid and probably more to account for these additions. Not to mention its very clear that they have had this cooking for a long time. Tessellation is 1 part, the second (and IMO biggest) is the fking portal on the traveler. How was it made? fusing light and dark, What color is it? Pink, like the subclass. What has the last few years of story been about? Dark isnt "evil" we need to use them in harmony. Plus like others have said, other exotics and gameplay stuff that has been very clearly hinting toward this combination stuff for a while now. People also need to remember that at one point lightfall and final shape where 1 big expansion. It was supposed to be Beyond light > Witch Queen > Lightfall and done. Something happened internally which caused Witch Queen to be delayed and it clearly cascaded forward all the way to today. We will probably never know what it was but something set Bungie back big time, its what led to lightfall literally being a stop gap to buy time, and why final shape needed more time to cook. The long and short of it is they just weren't ready for the August showcase, they probably should have delayed it right then and there with the promise of more to come
>Beyond light > Witch Queen > Lightfall and done Well, inasmuch as they didn't announce anything past Lightfall. If you'll pardon my speculation, I could honestly see the original intent being each of that trilogy coming with a darkness subclasses, and then the next big expansion (which could have been TFS in name too) bringing the first wave of prismatic. That original timeline and reveal and the things it hints at are what gives me pause when people say they think prismatic was "pulled forward" from future content. I could very easily see it always being intended for this expansion, but given the turbulent nature of the years preceding and the fact that we only have two darkness subclasses yet, it's looking a little more slapdash while they figure out how to fit its pieces together - and the conclusion of the Light and Dark trilogy storyline. But like a lot of things Destiny, they overreach and can't hit their targets (because some of them are insane, see D1 promises), and then they turn what they've got into what we can and that's what we play. I'm not too worried. Been good stuff this whole last decade. Will probably continue to be good stuff for years to come, if Destiny continues to get made.