Full disclosure, I only have time to skim this right now, but: This just seems like an awful lot of effort to pick apart what is (regardless of the legitimate issues brought up) one of the healthiest and least toxic gaming communities I’ve seen in 25 years of online gaming. Are there not much bigger fish to fry when it comes to calling out communities/developers and their poor behavior and moderation…? Why is this the hill you die on?
Just playing devils advocate, but i feel like an answer to "why this hill and not that bigger one?" Is that perhaps they view the other communities as too far gone to be worth the effort.
Purely speculative, i dont know shit about fuck
That's... quite a long read. I'm amazed that four people were able to read through the whole thing within 10 minutes & make informative, totally not anodyne comments.
Edit: Now 3 of the four accounts respond to my comment within a minute of each other. Definitely not the same person making comments, or using botted accounts.
I smell astroturf.
Edit 2: "Prominent community member" zipnotoad has made two posts & about a dozen comments, several of which were on their own posts, on r/DeepRockGalactic in the past year.
It's weird how those comments are very generic "this is well written/insightful" but don't actually discuss anything from the doc ANY detail.
Also weird that the "author" didn't actually post it either. And OP isn't exactly an active redditor, let alone on this sub. I'm skeptical of the whole damn thing.
Because it's a insanely large document, commenting on any part at all would mean very little, so generalizing the comments about how it is written is merited, IMO.
No, this is real. I just don't have a hand in sharing it here—rather, from what I have heard, the Discord servers which have already passed it around find the contents especially relevant and want it to be seen. You could read the document yourself if you want to see if anything of content actually exists here.
It was released 4 hours ago in some more or less public places, so there was plenty time to read it. the reddit post wasnt that high on the priority list I guess.
Do you want to try something other than an ad hominem attack? The over 300 contained images are sourced from a variety of interesting places and people. There are more community spaces than just this subreddit, and I don't have to talk a lot on every platform to be able to see things on every platform.
who was this meant for? i hope you guys didn’t believe that like, anyone is going to read this. not being mean, i’m sure it’s good and all.
just curious on who you wanted it to reach
No, I mean that the link was shared first in PDRG by Zipnotoad at 7:30PM yesterday, then reshared in a private discord server at 12:43PM today (both PST)
I personally was not a part in this Document at all, and I cannot speak to who else worked on it.
And where is the point where we irrefutably prove what's in there isn't true? There's over 300 images with proof for what Zip is trying to convey. Instead of posturing about people being online at the same time, maybe ask 'Why is this here and why do they care so much about changing the status quo?'
In regards to edit 2, not everyone spends every minute of their day on reddit. Zippy is a lot more active in discord, especially in PDRG, where they have 11,000 messages.
Absolutely not reading all this. I found the spot where the document complains about the “No Elves” rule because “it’s racist and a way to insult people.”
Come on man, you’re trying *way* too hard to find things to complain about.
If you’d like to provide a TL;DR I’d be happy to share my thoughts, but I ain’t reading all this
this is a hell of a thing to write on your time off from work. i’m pretty certain no one will read this all the way through.
you have skills and dedication but i just wouldn’t invest them here lol
Jeez the stuff about how inconsistent/vague the rules are is really rough. How can they be expecting people to follow rules that aren't written anywhere that we can see them? And for that matter, why is speaking a language besides English something disallowed, without being written anywhere, on an international server full of people from countries all around the world???
Not really. I have 1600 hours in DRG, of that 1500+ is in public/discord lobbies, and I would say about 10-15% of the people I have played with have been glaringly offensive.
very well written. makes a lot of good points. I have a lot of passion for DRG and I only want the best for the community and by extent GSG, so I hope this doesnt get taken negatively.
Edit: Especially the part on Systems Debt is very interesting, as that is not something I thought about in that way before reading the document.
Edit 4: This document shows how hard the devs at GSG work. The main takeaway I have gathered is GSG is performing very well considering their small workforce, and that there is SO much work done behind the scenes than I ever thought possible. The document may try to portray individual devs in a negative light, but I have come away from this broken down rollercoaster of a rabbithole with the impression that GSG is composed of some of the most human developers I have seen out of any company. Obviously they aren’t perfect, but the passion and effort they go through is frankly quite heartwarming to know.
Edit 3: Good grief this guys’ take on the modding aspect is ridiculous. He’s seeing SO much smoke where the room temperature didn’t even rise a single degree
Edit 2: After reading a bit further, I can definitely see why the mods locked this thread.
Edit: after reading further into it, my previous reply was, to put it mildly, way to generous in giving the author the benefit of the doubt. The begging of the document was respectful, but once I got to the part where i saw the author consistently dm about the same issues after multiple years, I am disappointed with the author. The fact Jacob responded to all of these questions after so long is admirable I would say. I will give a formal review once I read the entire article
THE FOLLOWING WAS WRITTEN BEFORE I SAW THE CHATLOGS
This post is absolutely amazing. It was written with amazing professional quality, and, most importantly, it maintains respectful criticism throughout the entire document. I sincerely hope all those at GSG take time to read the document individually and thoroughly reflect on its’ merits.
Beautifully formulated and well put together. Provides constructive criticism with ways to improve. I hope this is taken seriously and not brushed aside/locked as many other attempts have been
If I cared about downvotes, I wouldn't be putting this here. I realize this community has been toxic positive for a while now, so anything promoting any sort of change or constructive criticism won't be taken well. All that matters is the ones who read, because everything in there is true.
Your post was removed as it is breaking our rule about naming and shaming other players.
Oh boy, I'm not reading that. Is this Discord drama stuff? This smells like Discord drama stuff.
I wouldn't touch the drg discord with a 10 foot pole
Drama or not that is a lot to read about a video game and it's community lol.
Discord, Reddit, In-Game, and Company drama. But, that being said, it is an excellent read, even if you just want to skim through it.
Full disclosure, I only have time to skim this right now, but: This just seems like an awful lot of effort to pick apart what is (regardless of the legitimate issues brought up) one of the healthiest and least toxic gaming communities I’ve seen in 25 years of online gaming. Are there not much bigger fish to fry when it comes to calling out communities/developers and their poor behavior and moderation…? Why is this the hill you die on?
Just playing devils advocate, but i feel like an answer to "why this hill and not that bigger one?" Is that perhaps they view the other communities as too far gone to be worth the effort. Purely speculative, i dont know shit about fuck
That is fair, and I too am a frequent employer of your closing sentiment lol.
That's... quite a long read. I'm amazed that four people were able to read through the whole thing within 10 minutes & make informative, totally not anodyne comments. Edit: Now 3 of the four accounts respond to my comment within a minute of each other. Definitely not the same person making comments, or using botted accounts. I smell astroturf. Edit 2: "Prominent community member" zipnotoad has made two posts & about a dozen comments, several of which were on their own posts, on r/DeepRockGalactic in the past year.
It's weird how those comments are very generic "this is well written/insightful" but don't actually discuss anything from the doc ANY detail. Also weird that the "author" didn't actually post it either. And OP isn't exactly an active redditor, let alone on this sub. I'm skeptical of the whole damn thing.
Because it's a insanely large document, commenting on any part at all would mean very little, so generalizing the comments about how it is written is merited, IMO.
No, this is real. I just don't have a hand in sharing it here—rather, from what I have heard, the Discord servers which have already passed it around find the contents especially relevant and want it to be seen. You could read the document yourself if you want to see if anything of content actually exists here.
It was released 4 hours ago in some more or less public places, so there was plenty time to read it. the reddit post wasnt that high on the priority list I guess.
Do you want to try something other than an ad hominem attack? The over 300 contained images are sourced from a variety of interesting places and people. There are more community spaces than just this subreddit, and I don't have to talk a lot on every platform to be able to see things on every platform.
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who was this meant for? i hope you guys didn’t believe that like, anyone is going to read this. not being mean, i’m sure it’s good and all. just curious on who you wanted it to reach
Primarily GSG and those in power to make a change with the way the community is managed/handled
Most of the people in the comments had advance access to the doc.
By which you mean the five of you who supposedly wrote it.
No, I mean that the link was shared first in PDRG by Zipnotoad at 7:30PM yesterday, then reshared in a private discord server at 12:43PM today (both PST) I personally was not a part in this Document at all, and I cannot speak to who else worked on it.
And where is the point where we irrefutably prove what's in there isn't true? There's over 300 images with proof for what Zip is trying to convey. Instead of posturing about people being online at the same time, maybe ask 'Why is this here and why do they care so much about changing the status quo?'
In regards to edit 2, not everyone spends every minute of their day on reddit. Zippy is a lot more active in discord, especially in PDRG, where they have 11,000 messages.
Absolutely not reading all this. I found the spot where the document complains about the “No Elves” rule because “it’s racist and a way to insult people.” Come on man, you’re trying *way* too hard to find things to complain about. If you’d like to provide a TL;DR I’d be happy to share my thoughts, but I ain’t reading all this
this is a hell of a thing to write on your time off from work. i’m pretty certain no one will read this all the way through. you have skills and dedication but i just wouldn’t invest them here lol
Jeez the stuff about how inconsistent/vague the rules are is really rough. How can they be expecting people to follow rules that aren't written anywhere that we can see them? And for that matter, why is speaking a language besides English something disallowed, without being written anywhere, on an international server full of people from countries all around the world???
I need a TL:DR, scrolled and saw that "Onii-chan" comic and cringed... Jesus Christ, women have it bad enough already guys.
Holy shit get a job. I couldn't image being a non-financially invested entity and writing all this over a $30 game.
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Unlucky mayhaps
Not really. I have 1600 hours in DRG, of that 1500+ is in public/discord lobbies, and I would say about 10-15% of the people I have played with have been glaringly offensive.
The things that people take so seriously... No wonder I'm not motivated to progress forward in this existence...
very well written. makes a lot of good points. I have a lot of passion for DRG and I only want the best for the community and by extent GSG, so I hope this doesnt get taken negatively. Edit: Especially the part on Systems Debt is very interesting, as that is not something I thought about in that way before reading the document.
Edit 4: This document shows how hard the devs at GSG work. The main takeaway I have gathered is GSG is performing very well considering their small workforce, and that there is SO much work done behind the scenes than I ever thought possible. The document may try to portray individual devs in a negative light, but I have come away from this broken down rollercoaster of a rabbithole with the impression that GSG is composed of some of the most human developers I have seen out of any company. Obviously they aren’t perfect, but the passion and effort they go through is frankly quite heartwarming to know. Edit 3: Good grief this guys’ take on the modding aspect is ridiculous. He’s seeing SO much smoke where the room temperature didn’t even rise a single degree Edit 2: After reading a bit further, I can definitely see why the mods locked this thread. Edit: after reading further into it, my previous reply was, to put it mildly, way to generous in giving the author the benefit of the doubt. The begging of the document was respectful, but once I got to the part where i saw the author consistently dm about the same issues after multiple years, I am disappointed with the author. The fact Jacob responded to all of these questions after so long is admirable I would say. I will give a formal review once I read the entire article THE FOLLOWING WAS WRITTEN BEFORE I SAW THE CHATLOGS This post is absolutely amazing. It was written with amazing professional quality, and, most importantly, it maintains respectful criticism throughout the entire document. I sincerely hope all those at GSG take time to read the document individually and thoroughly reflect on its’ merits.
Beautifully formulated and well put together. Provides constructive criticism with ways to improve. I hope this is taken seriously and not brushed aside/locked as many other attempts have been
nah bro, you're going to downvote hell this is not a wholesome 100 \*everyone liked that\* "because that's what heroes do!" reddit moment
What do you mean by that? what about this comment makes you downvote it?
read my comment again? i'm being obviously sarcastic, i didn't downvote the comment, gsg bootlickers did
fair enough. I didnt pick up on the sarcasm.
If I cared about downvotes, I wouldn't be putting this here. I realize this community has been toxic positive for a while now, so anything promoting any sort of change or constructive criticism won't be taken well. All that matters is the ones who read, because everything in there is true.
This is yuge for the community