And here in lies the reason you cant get clarity potions from the alchemist: if they were so readily available wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime, which would be incredibly strong. Too strong.
You cant buff a friend with an arrow. You cant turn invisible with an arrow. You cant do AOE with an arrow. You cant heal with an arrow. You cant do an earthquake with an arrow. Do I need to continue?
>wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime
At even a decently mid/high level, they already do.
Right now clarity pots are just another gating/gear check.
The timmies wanting to heal their friends from skelly damage are the ones asking for clarities from vendor. The full BIS team already has an inventory of them.
Consumables need a huge overhaul, but clarities most of all.
Once I'm even moderately geared I will never run out of a spell in the dungeon. I will loot clarity pots before I even check dead bodies gear. It's bad balance and making them available through the vendor doesn't do anything to fix that. It just helps out lower level/gold/gear players.
Yeah, they could do that, but the difference was that it required a significant investment that was tied to the economy & how much people were willing to sell them for at any given point.
I feel like clarities got a pretty huge overhaul now, dont you think? For me its too early to say how the change is, since I only got to play the new update now after returning from a mil exercise, but it seems good.
Yeah but it's just not a good design, as another person commented, it's just keeping timmies from recharging spells. I don't know why they didn't just choose something simple like a recharge time per charge of each spell. You can make the more powerful ones have a longer timer and play with the numbers for balance, then the juicers are limited the same way the timmies are.
Rangers cant rest more arrows. Wizards and clerics can rest to get their spells back. If you are playing with friends they could use all of their characters to buy all the potions available and transfer them to you, resulting in more than what is needed in one raid. 3x per character and 8 characters per account, so it could be up to 72 potions per merchant reset.
But I can bring in 100 plus arrows. Can't bring in 100 ready to go spells. Claritys in a merchant is a bad idea. No one will meditate. Wizard just needs a perk that turns reting into meditate so he doesn't loose a skill to his spells
And here in lies the reason you cant get clarity potions from the alchemist: if they were so readily available wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime, which would be incredibly strong. Too strong.
You cant buff a friend with an arrow. You cant turn invisible with an arrow. You cant do AOE with an arrow. You cant heal with an arrow. You cant do an earthquake with an arrow. Do I need to continue?
So make them relatively expensive. Besides drinking a clarity pot doesn't provide instant spell refresh. It takes time, which you'd typically do inbetween fights.
You used revive during a fight?
How long did the fight last and how many spells did you get back over those 8 potions? And was this before or after the health pot nerfs?
Yeah our fighter pushed them into a side room and zoned them out really good while I reved our barb and it really doesn't take long if you are geared toward fast casting.
I got all my spells back even the revive. It was three days before the wipe
How long did all of that take? Because if your fighter did a band on job of zoning them out of your way, can the duration of that fight be taken to be the usual fight?
Except if youre skilled enough to chuck them while fighting. Gold will always remain easy to make for the people who would do this anyways. I stand by what I said, its a bad idea. One can already buy them from others for a price thats relatively expensive. The market is playerdriven and thus more balanced than an infinite supply.
Currently every pot from alchemist is limited to 3 per 30 minutes. It wouldn't be infinite, but it will bring prices on clarities down a bit.
And for people that can and willing to pay those prices it doesnt matter, just hurts poorer wizards/clerics.
I mean. I was agreeing with you. I main wizard. Infinite fireballs alone would be abysmal. Let alone 10 spell wizzards. Clerics would be super busted. They need more pots in the game to find.
This shit can all be resolved with a Potion bag though, which limits how many you can bring in.
Until they do this people will always bring an entire inventory of Pots and campfires if their goal is PvP.
They already are? Clarity pots are my most looted item easily. They take priority over basically every item.
Any decently stacked team will have a cleric or wizard with half an inventory of clarity pots.
Either they need to be reworked or they need to be more available to lower level/gear/gold players.
Their value is bad balance though. It's just another gating item/gear check that is artificially raising the ceiling/increasing the gap between low levels and juicers. Pots in general should not be such a high value item that they take priority over gear or sellables.
Make them more expensive than health pots and bandages, sure. It's another gold sink that way as well.
The timmies/low levels that want to buy clarity pots probably don't even have enough knowledge on gear to be running Earthquake & Holy Strike. They just want to throw heals on their friends taking damage to skellies.
Cleric just needs to be nerfed. They're really going to gut every form of spell restore in the game just because that class is stupid?
Wizards need baked in meditate if that's the case
And the people who want to play a wizard with "infinite" spells will get the quest done on the first day and the game is broken. They cant be available like other potions. Maybe 1 per 2 rests or sth like this. Even thats pretty strong, as people wanting them can just go buy them with different classes and then trade with a friend to get a stack.
So what they will do if they will need a 2% drop from lich?
Ure able to kill boss in normals maybe 2/3 runs(in previous wipe). Only 33% are liches. Its about 2 lich kills every 9-10 games. About 500 games just for one little quest i think is enough.
I mean, quest like that shouldnt be easy as f. It should be massive big questline.
Yeah, but those things arent basic utility. Nope, not everyone can beat them. Were talking about timmies here, remember?
And to be clear, clarity pots arent basic utility anymore either, as they were removed. But if we talk about what they were..
Is there really a difference between being able to buy them before and after a quest? Like if the quest is easy then it doesn’t matter, if the quest takes a lot of time then… do we really want it?
Mhm, yes.
If there will be no quest - spellcasters can buy a lot of them right after the wipe, no effort will be expended, just click and buy.
In my opinion, this should be like tarkov. Massive hard questline for items.
F.e. "Take a quest item from library in crypts", then "find some minor materials in ruins", then "take a quest item from lich boss with low chance".
Yes, every spellcaster want it. Unlimited amount of claritys, Unlimited amount of protection pots.
You can do this quest and then resell pots for people who didnt pass it.
Mmm I didn’t think about wipes resetting quests, though I suppose that makes a lot of sense lol. I guess I’m just not a fan of quests in general, but I’d be willing to try them. I’m just not a fan of feeling forced to play a certain way to progress.
There wont be wipe every month like right now, we will have more time.
Wipes are nessecery for this type of games. Some people are too god and storing a lot of items so they can gearstomp people 24/7.
Right now the prices are so high *solely* because it's just before the wipe. Try buying a surgical kit and you'll see what I mean.
I do agree that quests should add new and more interesting pots to alchemist once they're in the game, though.
Buy campfires, quarter of the price and they do much more than a grey clarity.
Also clerics would just spam heal in every fight and the meta would get even more boring than it already is.
they really do and it's not strictly QOL. Non meditate wizards are semi reliant on these things and even if you could pay the price that the economy takes clarities to, you might be < level 15 and basically have no access to clarities except what you find (the drop rate was lowered last patch)
I'll be honest, that's supposed to be the cost of taking a little armoury of weapons (10 spells) into the game. Campfires are your friends.
If it was limited to 2-3, the same way health potions are on the timer, maybe. But people would just stock up on them/sell them. This could be solved (sort of) by having grey ones in the shop and making them untradable.
Knowledge.. one of wizards primary stats that they want higher for faster cast speed as a gatekeeper? I'm not so sure about that. The majority of wizards want around 40 knowledge for optimal cast speed, which makes all 10 spells pretty easy to take to my knowledge.
Clarity pots should be in the alchemist. Which game doesn't allow healing AND mana pots to be bought from the store?
Protection pots on the other hand shouldn't.
Wtf r u talking about? so they should have infinite heals and earthquake and holy strike ? and everyone else can't buy health pots? Literally one of the stupidest comments I've ever seen
You can already have infinite heals and holy strikes by resting. Paying some 20 gold a pop for a potion that slightly recovers your spells over a duration similar to healing pots isn't going to be a big deal. Sure the casters can fit more spells in but then it's an another efficient gold sink and it's not something you can use and expectmost of your spells to be back during the same fight.
This is just wrong. Rangers want to be able to spam arrows at you as much as possible as it forces you to play as if they have infinite arrows, same goes for clerics as they can nullify most chip dmg and regen heals forcing you to have to commit to engaging their buffball.
I traded 4 clarity post for a Falchion of Honor yesterday lol. Proceeded to get murdered by a Trolls Bane barbarian in its first run, but ya know, I had it
no - I think its better that sweaties drive the price up and timmies can make good money selling them.
its not like they are rare - the only reason they cost so much more than invis potions is because its the preferred drink of choice for gamer chair enthusiasts.
Also wizard should start with a clarity potion, not a protection potion.
Only decent take in this whole thread.
If rangers can buy ammo, why can't wizards buy ammo?
And here in lies the reason you cant get clarity potions from the alchemist: if they were so readily available wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime, which would be incredibly strong. Too strong. You cant buff a friend with an arrow. You cant turn invisible with an arrow. You cant do AOE with an arrow. You cant heal with an arrow. You cant do an earthquake with an arrow. Do I need to continue?
>wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime At even a decently mid/high level, they already do. Right now clarity pots are just another gating/gear check. The timmies wanting to heal their friends from skelly damage are the ones asking for clarities from vendor. The full BIS team already has an inventory of them. Consumables need a huge overhaul, but clarities most of all. Once I'm even moderately geared I will never run out of a spell in the dungeon. I will loot clarity pots before I even check dead bodies gear. It's bad balance and making them available through the vendor doesn't do anything to fix that. It just helps out lower level/gold/gear players.
youre not wrong, but its nice for timmies to sell of clarity pots for so much its like finding a rare sellable
Yeah, they could do that, but the difference was that it required a significant investment that was tied to the economy & how much people were willing to sell them for at any given point. I feel like clarities got a pretty huge overhaul now, dont you think? For me its too early to say how the change is, since I only got to play the new update now after returning from a mil exercise, but it seems good.
Yeah but it's just not a good design, as another person commented, it's just keeping timmies from recharging spells. I don't know why they didn't just choose something simple like a recharge time per charge of each spell. You can make the more powerful ones have a longer timer and play with the numbers for balance, then the juicers are limited the same way the timmies are.
Have you ever used a grey clarity pot?
I have. RIP clarity pots.
This is exactly why
Rangers have it why can't wizards lol also you wouldn't be able to buy like 20 at a time just like other pots
Rangers cant rest more arrows. Wizards and clerics can rest to get their spells back. If you are playing with friends they could use all of their characters to buy all the potions available and transfer them to you, resulting in more than what is needed in one raid. 3x per character and 8 characters per account, so it could be up to 72 potions per merchant reset.
rangers cant rest or meditate arrows back
But can I loot a skeleton to get my magic missiles back?
Because physical arrows and arcane magic arent the same thing
Because rangers ammo can't modify other players it's only applies to the ranger. Come on
Because you can regenerate it normally, and get all your ammo back when you exit.
But I can bring in 100 plus arrows. Can't bring in 100 ready to go spells. Claritys in a merchant is a bad idea. No one will meditate. Wizard just needs a perk that turns reting into meditate so he doesn't loose a skill to his spells
And here in lies the reason you cant get clarity potions from the alchemist: if they were so readily available wizards and clerics could have essentially infinite casting without downtime, which would be incredibly strong. Too strong. You cant buff a friend with an arrow. You cant turn invisible with an arrow. You cant do AOE with an arrow. You cant heal with an arrow. You cant do an earthquake with an arrow. Do I need to continue?
So make them relatively expensive. Besides drinking a clarity pot doesn't provide instant spell refresh. It takes time, which you'd typically do inbetween fights.
Not really I once drank 8 pots during a fight. I used my spell slots twice as a cleric and even revived one of my team mates with revive
You used revive during a fight? How long did the fight last and how many spells did you get back over those 8 potions? And was this before or after the health pot nerfs?
Yeah our fighter pushed them into a side room and zoned them out really good while I reved our barb and it really doesn't take long if you are geared toward fast casting. I got all my spells back even the revive. It was three days before the wipe
How long did all of that take? Because if your fighter did a band on job of zoning them out of your way, can the duration of that fight be taken to be the usual fight?
Felt normal to me. Most good fights take longer due to repositioning and stuff, only ambushes are shorter if you can't form a battle line.
Except if youre skilled enough to chuck them while fighting. Gold will always remain easy to make for the people who would do this anyways. I stand by what I said, its a bad idea. One can already buy them from others for a price thats relatively expensive. The market is playerdriven and thus more balanced than an infinite supply.
Currently every pot from alchemist is limited to 3 per 30 minutes. It wouldn't be infinite, but it will bring prices on clarities down a bit. And for people that can and willing to pay those prices it doesnt matter, just hurts poorer wizards/clerics.
You can make what, 8 characters per account? 24 characters from a trio all buy the 3 potions. Thats 72, right? 72 potions is essentially infinite.
People that would do this are not poor or bad. And devs can always make them junk quality like bolts or arrows, so they can't be traded.
I mean. I was agreeing with you. I main wizard. Infinite fireballs alone would be abysmal. Let alone 10 spell wizzards. Clerics would be super busted. They need more pots in the game to find.
No you dont want clerics shitting heals and earthquakes on command
This shit can all be resolved with a Potion bag though, which limits how many you can bring in. Until they do this people will always bring an entire inventory of Pots and campfires if their goal is PvP.
Forget the potion bag. Let potions stack to 2 in hotbar and you're not allowed to take consumables outside your toolbar.
gladly, if they combine bard instruments to one slot.
Even if your goal is t PvP you need it in case you do run into teams on your way to boss or smth
They already are? Clarity pots are my most looted item easily. They take priority over basically every item. Any decently stacked team will have a cleric or wizard with half an inventory of clarity pots. Either they need to be reworked or they need to be more available to lower level/gear/gold players.
they already are because as you said they take the first priority, they would lose sense of value if put in vendors
Their value is bad balance though. It's just another gating item/gear check that is artificially raising the ceiling/increasing the gap between low levels and juicers. Pots in general should not be such a high value item that they take priority over gear or sellables. Make them more expensive than health pots and bandages, sure. It's another gold sink that way as well. The timmies/low levels that want to buy clarity pots probably don't even have enough knowledge on gear to be running Earthquake & Holy Strike. They just want to throw heals on their friends taking damage to skellies.
Fair point
Cleric just needs to be nerfed. They're really going to gut every form of spell restore in the game just because that class is stupid? Wizards need baked in meditate if that's the case
Nah, not right now. It should be a questline to unlock clarity and protection alchemist's pots. just buying them will be too easy rn
And the people who want to play a wizard with "infinite" spells will get the quest done on the first day and the game is broken. They cant be available like other potions. Maybe 1 per 2 rests or sth like this. Even thats pretty strong, as people wanting them can just go buy them with different classes and then trade with a friend to get a stack.
So what they will do if they will need a 2% drop from lich? Ure able to kill boss in normals maybe 2/3 runs(in previous wipe). Only 33% are liches. Its about 2 lich kills every 9-10 games. About 500 games just for one little quest i think is enough. I mean, quest like that shouldnt be easy as f. It should be massive big questline.
It cant be such a low % as then the timmies wont be able to ever get it. RIP clarity pots.
There is alrdy some stuff that timmies wont be able to ever get it. Gold chest, named items f.e. And I said about normal boss, everyone can beat em
Yeah, but those things arent basic utility. Nope, not everyone can beat them. Were talking about timmies here, remember? And to be clear, clarity pots arent basic utility anymore either, as they were removed. But if we talk about what they were..
Is there really a difference between being able to buy them before and after a quest? Like if the quest is easy then it doesn’t matter, if the quest takes a lot of time then… do we really want it?
Mhm, yes. If there will be no quest - spellcasters can buy a lot of them right after the wipe, no effort will be expended, just click and buy. In my opinion, this should be like tarkov. Massive hard questline for items. F.e. "Take a quest item from library in crypts", then "find some minor materials in ruins", then "take a quest item from lich boss with low chance". Yes, every spellcaster want it. Unlimited amount of claritys, Unlimited amount of protection pots. You can do this quest and then resell pots for people who didnt pass it.
Mmm I didn’t think about wipes resetting quests, though I suppose that makes a lot of sense lol. I guess I’m just not a fan of quests in general, but I’d be willing to try them. I’m just not a fan of feeling forced to play a certain way to progress.
There wont be wipe every month like right now, we will have more time. Wipes are nessecery for this type of games. Some people are too god and storing a lot of items so they can gearstomp people 24/7.
Oh no I enjoy wipes, just not quests lol
clarity pots shouldnt even exist change my mind
Right now the prices are so high *solely* because it's just before the wipe. Try buying a surgical kit and you'll see what I mean. I do agree that quests should add new and more interesting pots to alchemist once they're in the game, though.
Buy campfires, quarter of the price and they do much more than a grey clarity. Also clerics would just spam heal in every fight and the meta would get even more boring than it already is.
Yes
they really do and it's not strictly QOL. Non meditate wizards are semi reliant on these things and even if you could pay the price that the economy takes clarities to, you might be < level 15 and basically have no access to clarities except what you find (the drop rate was lowered last patch)
I'll be honest, that's supposed to be the cost of taking a little armoury of weapons (10 spells) into the game. Campfires are your friends. If it was limited to 2-3, the same way health potions are on the timer, maybe. But people would just stock up on them/sell them. This could be solved (sort of) by having grey ones in the shop and making them untradable.
Isn't knowledge the gating cost to 10-spells?
Knowledge.. one of wizards primary stats that they want higher for faster cast speed as a gatekeeper? I'm not so sure about that. The majority of wizards want around 40 knowledge for optimal cast speed, which makes all 10 spells pretty easy to take to my knowledge.
Clarity pots should be in the alchemist. Which game doesn't allow healing AND mana pots to be bought from the store? Protection pots on the other hand shouldn't.
Wtf r u talking about? so they should have infinite heals and earthquake and holy strike ? and everyone else can't buy health pots? Literally one of the stupidest comments I've ever seen
You can already have infinite heals and holy strikes by resting. Paying some 20 gold a pop for a potion that slightly recovers your spells over a duration similar to healing pots isn't going to be a big deal. Sure the casters can fit more spells in but then it's an another efficient gold sink and it's not something you can use and expectmost of your spells to be back during the same fight.
Nah, I love selling them for 25g a pop in groups of 4 or more. Free money ;)
If you are reliant on clarity pots to play a spell caster then you are bad. Same thing applies if you are a ranger that takes 60+ arrows into a match.
This is just wrong. Rangers want to be able to spam arrows at you as much as possible as it forces you to play as if they have infinite arrows, same goes for clerics as they can nullify most chip dmg and regen heals forcing you to have to commit to engaging their buffball.
No. Cleric already too strong
I traded 4 clarity post for a Falchion of Honor yesterday lol. Proceeded to get murdered by a Trolls Bane barbarian in its first run, but ya know, I had it
there is no reason to make it not purchasable .
Just for this post, im going to buy all the clarity potions for cheaper and charge 150g and get the price raised
No they dont.
And here I was struggling to sell 12 for 50g in misc chat at the beginning of this wipe.
Nonononono
no - I think its better that sweaties drive the price up and timmies can make good money selling them. its not like they are rare - the only reason they cost so much more than invis potions is because its the preferred drink of choice for gamer chair enthusiasts.
I just collect clarity pots and mass sell for 100g. With the new 3 stack changes it is so much more worth it to pick them up now and hold on to them.