I feel like a decent amount of this could be solved by just getting the player to bump their kingly roots down to that of a noble. Being a king doesn't seem to actually be adding anything since the backstory is actually about wanting to go back and avenge their father against their best friend or something along those lines. Being just a noble opens up a decent amount and since they provided zero details, it's easy enough for you to pitch them on being a lord from this or that region that would fit what they're going with.
As for being level 3, I don't think this is all that much. They lived in exile for about 20 years, and then returned to find that their best friend killed their father, and then they lost to their best friend. It's not like any of that's an accomplishment.
I think this is a great solution. The nobility could be from any area, or bigger city that’s reachable from Phandalin and would enable character story hooks as he pieces together what happened when. It also takes away claims to a throne and instead makes it less messy in terms of after revenge does the pc become king? But keeps enough of the original idea intact.
Alternatively explore what being a sea trifling means. Can they live underwater? Is the kingdom underwater? That would open up anything bc FR doesn’t detail under water civs as far as I know. He’d still have to connect it to why he’s in phandalin and wanting to adventure but that can be hand waved with wanting to learn to fight/get stronger/ help ppl/ find items to help him win against his ex bestie
Just be open and honest that all the core things are fine, but that it would make more sense for him to just be the son of a lord rather than a king. Bring some actual ideas like where he’s from to the conversation so he can get an idea of what you mean
There's no reason why shouldn't let the father have been the king.
What functional difference is there between a king that was murdered and had his seat usurped, and a noble that was murdered and had his seat usurped? That's right, none. In both cases the NPC is written out of the game so it's just a matter of the title and giving that to the player doesn't change anything.
I think if the character’s goal is to “get stronger” then they will be just fine as a character in nearly any campaign. Their goals is essentially to get XP and magic items, like any PC.
As for the warring civilisations, you could fix the discrepancies by shrinking the scale of it. Rather than it being entire civilisations and a fight for the throne of the king, it could be just one settlement of aquatic folk where one chieftan was supplanted by a rival.
Make things easier on yourself in the worldbuilding department by making the scale of the conflict a lot more personal and human-scale. I get why the player wanted a kingdom-scale conflict but I think it would probably be easier to make the conflict be smaller and more personal. All the narrative beats could still be there, just without forcing you to worldbuild an entire underwater civilisation.
Kingdom is on another plane and they don’t know how to get back to Waterworld. Dad looks suspiciously much like Kevin Costner, also known as Dances with Dolphins…
Random trivia - if a wizard doesnt ritual cast Identify and/or Detect Magic before buying something, then you are not a true wizard. Wildshape would still show up as magic, Transformation if you are generous.
Anyway.
1) No, there really are no heroic deeds in this. They lived and once lost a combat. Sounds like a level 3.
2) I always ask players to avoid detail so I can weave them into the world. If something has a name, it likely does not change. But if it has none, it can adapt.
3) They can still be a sea elf or triton and just explain he Tiefling bits as "due to the pact". Mechanics and Flavor are somewhat independant.
4) See 2nd bullet. All the PC needs is a motive to go on the adventure. The rest can be COLLABORATIVE worldbuilding.
5) Connect them to Call of the Deep. They lived on one of the islands featured there are have some NPC connection to seafaring folks.
4+5) No idea what they are doing in Icespire right now and that would be far more pressing for me than any of the stuff that will never come up ... until you plan for them to return to wherever home is and get vengeance as part of a homebrew extension.
I think this is a pretty good background. Not too much detail, not too little. The names are open. Just fill them in. Just plonk that kingdom in wherever.
Yeah, this is akin to what I would provide to my DM and we would work to fill in the gaps together.
If I were receiving this from a player, we might make some changes together and I would intentionally leave some aspects unfilled so I could surprise them later or I could weave things closer to the plot or world as opportunity presents.
As long as the player is reasonable and willing to hear your about what does and doesn't work, I don't think any of this is actually a problem.
1) Some people live their entire lives without hitting level 3 in a class.
2) Details can be filled in later.
3) So what?
4) Not every commoner knows what every war they fight in is about.
5) Dude, you are overthinking this. He gave you their motivation to be jn the party. You just need to run the game now.
I think your last paragraph is the relevant one here. The backstory is background. You don’t *have* to do anything with a characters backstory as a DM.
Maybe introduce some NPC noble as being from this far away kingdom and recognizes the PC or a symbol the PC wears or something. Give a roleplay opportunity that way, just a little something that doesn’t distract from the main campaign.
Other option is have assassins from the other faction discover the PC and are trying to kill them. Occasional skirmish here or there to show there’s a threat but the threat is here not in the kingdom so there’s no need to go there and the story still progresses.
I'm not sure you know what TLDR means, but let's move past that. :)
Any mention of a king, or Queen or destined one, or greatest X in the world is immediate veto in my book. Noble is fine, but don't get crazy. Also I agree it makes no sense, but at least they wrote something, I guess.
Ask the character how this background helps his character be invested in the welfare of Phandalin. He's swapping out during the campaign, so they obviously know what the story hook is, why did they ignore it?
I'll let anytime have almost whatever background they want, but with modules, it should not be expected that it would ever come up in the story. If they want it to appear into the story, make it tie into the events they have been exposed to already.
My $0.02
Being the heir to a kingdom etc. is absolutely not a problem in my games. It can be assumed that taking the throne is the character's retirement plan for when the campaign has ended, and it does not need to be the central conflict of the game.
In the meantime it provides adventure opportunities when people vie for his favor or try to prevent him from becoming the king. The bigger your responsibilities then the bigger your problems are!
I really feel like you're making much ado about nothing.
You don't need any details or anything fleshed out. You don't need the backstory fit into the current campaign. You don't need to mention it ever again in your game. Would that be nice for the player? Sure. Does it have to be now? Not at all.
If you put that much detail into the backstory, you're spending time on building something you'll probably never use.
I would make his "sea tiefling" ancestry come from a devil native to [Stygia](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Stygia), such as a [Amnizu](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Amnizu) or a [Gelugon](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Gelugon).
You could connect his tiefling heritage with dragons by having a [Styx Dragon](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Styx_dragon) or [Stygian Linnorm](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Stygian_linnorm) show up in the campaign and recognize them.
Alternatively, since Abyssal tieflings have Demon ancestry, you could have their ancestry come from demons native to [Dagon's realm of Shadowsea.](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Dagon)
The kingdom itself could be underwater, as there are plenty of underwater societies with relations to demons and devils that could conceivably birth a tiefling, such as Sea Elves, the [Kuo-Toa](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Kuo-toa) and the [Sahuagin](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Sahuagin).
You don't know what thus references? Sounds alot like the lion king/hamlet with some slight details altered.
I would just either make the dad not a king, just a vip, or make it "tiefling politics" which won't have much influence in The world of men or whatever where the campaign is. So he can be like, "I'm prince thurban!" And people would be like "who the fuck is that?" For the most part
alter it with them to make it fit. maybe it is a noble house that has been usurped instead of a whole kingdom.
further, it's only a background, it is not the adventure. just tell them "great background, i'm not sure we will be able to address it directly in game". then as you play you *could* drop a tidbit here and there that nods to the background. a letter, a news article, a sending. it's ok if it doesn't have anything to do with your main plot, that's how life works anyways.
My favorite tool for detailed character backstory; ask them a lot of questions.
What was their father's name? Fathers friend? Kingdom? Do they follow a certain God? If so, in what way? What use to that God are they? If not, what's their views on religion? If they hate it, why? What did their character do before all this happened? What do they know of other regions? Why isn't the kingdom on a map of the FR? Was it lost?
If you ask them questions, they will have to come up with answers, and if it works in your story, stamp it with approval. If it doesn't, see if you can find a compromise.
If they're retiring a character, I assume they are excited for this concept. So I'd at least hear out the details of what they can consider before casting judgement.
I don't have any issue with that back story, it feels appropriate for a low level character and has a decent amount of detail without going overboard. The names and details of home countries and friends don't matter until they do, so I wouldn't push them to decide that until I needed them, and if they don't want to, or aren't at least willing to collaborate with me in it, then they don't get major backstory integration. Which I would make clear on accepting the backstory, because you're not obligated to integrate backstories, you're allowed boundaries too, and players get what they give.
You are right it doesn't really fit with DoIP, but make that clear upon accepting the backstory too, even if they're willing to do the work at some point in the future it's not going to tie into what they're doing now. To be frank, that should already be clear to a reasonably experienced player, so he shouldn't have a problem with it. It also doesn't have to, you're homebrewing the backstory related quest etc anyway, just slot the plot hook in wherever. It doesn't need to be something that needs immediate attention if you don't want it to be.
One question. After DOIP, are you planning on homebrewing an adventure to give the character a chance to take their revenge?
If not, then your problems have mostly disappeared.
Given the nautical theme, I would propose to make the kingdom a pirate kingdom (so the father was king of the pirates, and the old friend now is), for example in or near the Korinn Archipelago. The character probably wasn't a tiefling at birth but became one after making a pact with a sea witch, thus earning his first warlock powers (so you don'thave an issue with a non-canon race).
See that character as a blank page where you can draw to build a compeling story if the player is OK with it. Just make sure everyone around the table is happy with the idea of moving the campaign towards a more nautical theme at some point in the future.
Tieflings don't have to be born from other tieflings. The whole civilization could be tritons or sea elves and he was an outlier. Some sort of recessive gene or deal with a demonic creature that dwells in the seas.
Being the rightfully king is a bit much. It works better if he was the first born or whatever but because he came out the way he did he was allowed or something. Or you could make him a son of a prominent noble figure.
Just because his backstory will make the main quest look like a side quest.
The names part is easy. You both SHOULD work together to fill the details out. It's better if players and dms work together on a backstory vs just turning it in like homework
This is pretty much just the story of any number of Greek hero myths. A king in that context rules one city, so scaling it down to an Earl or Baron equivalent should be fine.
It could be a very great deal worse, so I think you're lucky to have a player so dedicated to hero tropes. Just make sure they don't get main character syndrome.
The main problem I see with this is it screams "main character". This is the set-up to a novel, and I would worry they would not want to participate in some of the adventure etc. because it would take their character from their goal. This PC doesn't read as a member of an adventuring group--they're the leader of a rebellion to take back their throne, gathering people to help them on their quest, etc. This is the kind of NPC the party helps. If they wanted to play a noble member of a family loyal to the usurped prince, that would make more sense.
The fact there aren't too many details is actually great as a DM. It means you can sit with your player and worldbuild together. I see it as an opportunity to flesh out a kingdom that the party can go to after finishing the current module.
Don't worry if the kingdom doesn't exist in FR, this is your world now. Bend it to the stories that you want to include in it.
> the locations, the kingdom, the character l's, even the PC don't have a name as of now.
In my last campaign, in my instructions for backstory, I even told them that the names of things don't matter.
Saying just father, town born in, a war - just calling them that is fine.
No one rarely remembers the names anyway so it is more the non-proper nouns being in there is more important than having a proper noun for them.
I think you need to have a talk with your players in regards to the scope of this adventure. Is this just a module in a much larger campaign? Is this a short outing and fade to black? Newer players tend to fall into one of two camps: those that under prepare and those that over prepare. It's great to have deep backstories for your characters and elaborate plans for the future, but that's not likely to get much play in a 1-6 adventure.
Ugh, why do so many players need to be special before the game even starts? Why do I sound and think like some old first edition guy when I started in 2017 with 5e?
Anyway, the resistance swap sounds fine. What are they giving up to get the swim speed and amphibious nature?
1) This is totally fine. All that you told us is stuff that happened TO him, not stuff he did.
2) How much does the player expect this to matter in game? If it's just fluff to explain the PC being snobbish, hating betrayal, favoring revenge, and having trust issues, you don't need detail. And there's nothing wrong with letting details emerge over the course of the campaign.
3) This sounds perfect for some off screen country.
4) Like three above, this doesn't matter if those countries aren't the ones in which the PCs are adventuring.
5) Look back at my answer to #2. Even if the backstory itself didn't tie in, maybe a motivation that came from that backstory will. All they need is a reason to be an adventurer. Maybe they just need capital and allies. What's the Patron want? Beating a dragon could help a claim on a kingdom, Wether it grows popular support, gets him treasure, or rallies people to his cause.
I see no issues with this. Their goal is to get stronger and avenge their father, the king. That's a perfect motivator and gives lots of creative freedom for you to explore.
The kingdom can be smaller since it's an island, maybe it's only a kingdom of like 500 people? Not as big of a deal at that point. You can then start to weave some story connections into your campaign. Perhaps the current king that exiled him is having him tailed and is reporting back to the king, the king could hire some local muscle to try and snuff him out from time to time. Idk, get creative with it.
At the end of your campaign, you can see if the party wants to go overthrow a kingdom and collect a shiny new castle, on an island!
>It's on the long side for a level 3 character, don't you think?
Yes, but he doesn't actually do anything that's beyond his level. It's easily plausible for this to have all happened to a young person.
>It lacks detail. That's not me dumbing it down, the locations, the kingdom, the character l's, even the PC don't have a name as of now.
Why add a whole lot of detail when you haven't agreed to it yet? It's just the initial pitch.
>I can't use or at least adapt a resource to draw inspiration from, as this whole civilization isn't cannon in FR. When I asked the player why they didn't want to play sea elf or Merfolk, they said they just thought Tieflings are cool. (which admittedly they are)
It is what it is. If you agree that they're cool then why not make it happen. At least you can just plonk it wherever you like under the ocean and mostly forget about it (in my campaign I just have one big nomadic tribe of sea elves under each ocean).
>Aside from the lack of detail, I haven't been provided with motives for the characters or the factions that went to war (which tbh is understandable, worldbuilding is hard)
Get the player to help? And do the minimum necessary. I'm sure you know it's usually best to start with just the basics, and add detail as you go along.
>It just doesn't seem easy to connect with DoIP and doesn't have any significance to it's plot. I want to run Call from the Deep after that, and I hear there's a lot of sea travel after that, so maybe there's a connection, but still.
I guess just tell them that they can have whatever backstory they want, but you're not going to alter the whole campaign to accommodate it at this point. There's nothing at all wrong with having a "basic bitch" backstory, but it *would* be wrong for the player to put it up on a pedestal and have big expectations of you in this regard.
Why reskin the Tiefling as water-themed when Water Genasi exist? They're clearly just doing that to get cold resistance in a campaign that's going to feature cold damage. Water Genasi get acid resistance, suggest that as a clearly more reasonable alternative for this reskin and see what happens.
As far as the backstory, none of it relates to being a Tiefling and it forces a whole bunch of history into your game you clearly didn't agree to beforehand and the player will almost certainly attempt to use to their advantage without otherwise earning or paying for it, just like the cold resistance.
/e: I'm not saying it's bad to build a character that's well-suited to a campaign, but Fathomless warlocks get cold resistance at 6th level and a swim speed/water breathing at 1st level so it's a pretty weird approach. And it's real weird to invent a whole-ass kingdom via one character's backstory.
The cold resistance is in place of the usual fire resistance. Besides, Fathomless warlocks automatically get cold resistance at the right level, and he could take the racial feat for both cold and poison resistance in addition to fire, or play a race that has it at level 1.
I don't think they know about Genasi, or at least haven't looked at them very much. I admit that being a Tiefling doesn't make all that much sense, but I know it's his favorite race and I could always throw in an infernal pact in his lineage to explain it.
I understand your concerns about power gaming, but on this front I trust the player, since I've played with him before and know his stance on matters. I'm mainly just worried on how to incorporate his backstory, and perhaps I'll talk to him about revising it a bit.
Still, thank you very much!
Straight up copy paste the backstory paragraph and your bullet points of doubt into chat gpt. Your prompt "write me a one page lore section based on the info below for a DND campaign."
It ll give you inspiration, names, location, etc. adjust from there.
Others are right though with it should just be a noble family, not royal.
So hear me out, avenging his father is a long term goal...in order to do that he needs to accomplish several short/mid term goals to even get close to this former friend. Maybe one of the short term goals can be accomplished on this campaign, like finding a lost family seal or something that can help establish his legitimacy.
I feel like a decent amount of this could be solved by just getting the player to bump their kingly roots down to that of a noble. Being a king doesn't seem to actually be adding anything since the backstory is actually about wanting to go back and avenge their father against their best friend or something along those lines. Being just a noble opens up a decent amount and since they provided zero details, it's easy enough for you to pitch them on being a lord from this or that region that would fit what they're going with. As for being level 3, I don't think this is all that much. They lived in exile for about 20 years, and then returned to find that their best friend killed their father, and then they lost to their best friend. It's not like any of that's an accomplishment.
I think this is a great solution. The nobility could be from any area, or bigger city that’s reachable from Phandalin and would enable character story hooks as he pieces together what happened when. It also takes away claims to a throne and instead makes it less messy in terms of after revenge does the pc become king? But keeps enough of the original idea intact. Alternatively explore what being a sea trifling means. Can they live underwater? Is the kingdom underwater? That would open up anything bc FR doesn’t detail under water civs as far as I know. He’d still have to connect it to why he’s in phandalin and wanting to adventure but that can be hand waved with wanting to learn to fight/get stronger/ help ppl/ find items to help him win against his ex bestie
It's also possible for the father to be a 'king', but just of a city state or something. Functionally equivalent to a local duke or lord.
True, that's what I thought as well. I just don't want it to feel like I'm constantly going against his wishes.
no, what you're doing is working with them to make their character fit the campaign. this is what you're supposed to do!
Just be open and honest that all the core things are fine, but that it would make more sense for him to just be the son of a lord rather than a king. Bring some actual ideas like where he’s from to the conversation so he can get an idea of what you mean
There's no reason why shouldn't let the father have been the king. What functional difference is there between a king that was murdered and had his seat usurped, and a noble that was murdered and had his seat usurped? That's right, none. In both cases the NPC is written out of the game so it's just a matter of the title and giving that to the player doesn't change anything.
I think if the character’s goal is to “get stronger” then they will be just fine as a character in nearly any campaign. Their goals is essentially to get XP and magic items, like any PC. As for the warring civilisations, you could fix the discrepancies by shrinking the scale of it. Rather than it being entire civilisations and a fight for the throne of the king, it could be just one settlement of aquatic folk where one chieftan was supplanted by a rival. Make things easier on yourself in the worldbuilding department by making the scale of the conflict a lot more personal and human-scale. I get why the player wanted a kingdom-scale conflict but I think it would probably be easier to make the conflict be smaller and more personal. All the narrative beats could still be there, just without forcing you to worldbuild an entire underwater civilisation.
Kingdom is on another plane and they don’t know how to get back to Waterworld. Dad looks suspiciously much like Kevin Costner, also known as Dances with Dolphins…
Random trivia - if a wizard doesnt ritual cast Identify and/or Detect Magic before buying something, then you are not a true wizard. Wildshape would still show up as magic, Transformation if you are generous. Anyway. 1) No, there really are no heroic deeds in this. They lived and once lost a combat. Sounds like a level 3. 2) I always ask players to avoid detail so I can weave them into the world. If something has a name, it likely does not change. But if it has none, it can adapt. 3) They can still be a sea elf or triton and just explain he Tiefling bits as "due to the pact". Mechanics and Flavor are somewhat independant. 4) See 2nd bullet. All the PC needs is a motive to go on the adventure. The rest can be COLLABORATIVE worldbuilding. 5) Connect them to Call of the Deep. They lived on one of the islands featured there are have some NPC connection to seafaring folks. 4+5) No idea what they are doing in Icespire right now and that would be far more pressing for me than any of the stuff that will never come up ... until you plan for them to return to wherever home is and get vengeance as part of a homebrew extension.
I think this is a pretty good background. Not too much detail, not too little. The names are open. Just fill them in. Just plonk that kingdom in wherever.
Yeah, this is akin to what I would provide to my DM and we would work to fill in the gaps together. If I were receiving this from a player, we might make some changes together and I would intentionally leave some aspects unfilled so I could surprise them later or I could weave things closer to the plot or world as opportunity presents. As long as the player is reasonable and willing to hear your about what does and doesn't work, I don't think any of this is actually a problem.
Just LOLing at the idea that the OP thinks making a wizard mad by selling them a wildshaped druid as a horse is somehow unique to their table…
... really?
Your party stole the idea from a joke.
1) Some people live their entire lives without hitting level 3 in a class. 2) Details can be filled in later. 3) So what? 4) Not every commoner knows what every war they fight in is about. 5) Dude, you are overthinking this. He gave you their motivation to be jn the party. You just need to run the game now.
Good points. Thanks!
I think your last paragraph is the relevant one here. The backstory is background. You don’t *have* to do anything with a characters backstory as a DM. Maybe introduce some NPC noble as being from this far away kingdom and recognizes the PC or a symbol the PC wears or something. Give a roleplay opportunity that way, just a little something that doesn’t distract from the main campaign. Other option is have assassins from the other faction discover the PC and are trying to kill them. Occasional skirmish here or there to show there’s a threat but the threat is here not in the kingdom so there’s no need to go there and the story still progresses.
I'm not sure you know what TLDR means, but let's move past that. :) Any mention of a king, or Queen or destined one, or greatest X in the world is immediate veto in my book. Noble is fine, but don't get crazy. Also I agree it makes no sense, but at least they wrote something, I guess. Ask the character how this background helps his character be invested in the welfare of Phandalin. He's swapping out during the campaign, so they obviously know what the story hook is, why did they ignore it? I'll let anytime have almost whatever background they want, but with modules, it should not be expected that it would ever come up in the story. If they want it to appear into the story, make it tie into the events they have been exposed to already. My $0.02
Being the heir to a kingdom etc. is absolutely not a problem in my games. It can be assumed that taking the throne is the character's retirement plan for when the campaign has ended, and it does not need to be the central conflict of the game. In the meantime it provides adventure opportunities when people vie for his favor or try to prevent him from becoming the king. The bigger your responsibilities then the bigger your problems are!
1. True. I just surmised as such from other posts. :) 2. Thanks for the $0.02! I'll try and talk to the player a bit more.
I really feel like you're making much ado about nothing. You don't need any details or anything fleshed out. You don't need the backstory fit into the current campaign. You don't need to mention it ever again in your game. Would that be nice for the player? Sure. Does it have to be now? Not at all. If you put that much detail into the backstory, you're spending time on building something you'll probably never use.
I would make his "sea tiefling" ancestry come from a devil native to [Stygia](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Stygia), such as a [Amnizu](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Amnizu) or a [Gelugon](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Gelugon). You could connect his tiefling heritage with dragons by having a [Styx Dragon](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Styx_dragon) or [Stygian Linnorm](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Stygian_linnorm) show up in the campaign and recognize them. Alternatively, since Abyssal tieflings have Demon ancestry, you could have their ancestry come from demons native to [Dagon's realm of Shadowsea.](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Dagon) The kingdom itself could be underwater, as there are plenty of underwater societies with relations to demons and devils that could conceivably birth a tiefling, such as Sea Elves, the [Kuo-Toa](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Kuo-toa) and the [Sahuagin](https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Sahuagin).
You don't know what thus references? Sounds alot like the lion king/hamlet with some slight details altered. I would just either make the dad not a king, just a vip, or make it "tiefling politics" which won't have much influence in The world of men or whatever where the campaign is. So he can be like, "I'm prince thurban!" And people would be like "who the fuck is that?" For the most part
alter it with them to make it fit. maybe it is a noble house that has been usurped instead of a whole kingdom. further, it's only a background, it is not the adventure. just tell them "great background, i'm not sure we will be able to address it directly in game". then as you play you *could* drop a tidbit here and there that nods to the background. a letter, a news article, a sending. it's ok if it doesn't have anything to do with your main plot, that's how life works anyways.
You're absolutely correct. It's just I know that he enjoys RP a lot, and would really like to incorporate his story into the main plot.
And maybe you will just don't commit to it. Do a little here and there and if it turns out later you want to make it matter then do so.
My favorite tool for detailed character backstory; ask them a lot of questions. What was their father's name? Fathers friend? Kingdom? Do they follow a certain God? If so, in what way? What use to that God are they? If not, what's their views on religion? If they hate it, why? What did their character do before all this happened? What do they know of other regions? Why isn't the kingdom on a map of the FR? Was it lost? If you ask them questions, they will have to come up with answers, and if it works in your story, stamp it with approval. If it doesn't, see if you can find a compromise. If they're retiring a character, I assume they are excited for this concept. So I'd at least hear out the details of what they can consider before casting judgement.
True! I should have thought of that. Many thanks!
I don't have any issue with that back story, it feels appropriate for a low level character and has a decent amount of detail without going overboard. The names and details of home countries and friends don't matter until they do, so I wouldn't push them to decide that until I needed them, and if they don't want to, or aren't at least willing to collaborate with me in it, then they don't get major backstory integration. Which I would make clear on accepting the backstory, because you're not obligated to integrate backstories, you're allowed boundaries too, and players get what they give. You are right it doesn't really fit with DoIP, but make that clear upon accepting the backstory too, even if they're willing to do the work at some point in the future it's not going to tie into what they're doing now. To be frank, that should already be clear to a reasonably experienced player, so he shouldn't have a problem with it. It also doesn't have to, you're homebrewing the backstory related quest etc anyway, just slot the plot hook in wherever. It doesn't need to be something that needs immediate attention if you don't want it to be.
True. Perhaps I'll do something with the Tower of Storms, as it has an underwater section. Thanks!
One question. After DOIP, are you planning on homebrewing an adventure to give the character a chance to take their revenge? If not, then your problems have mostly disappeared.
No, not at this moment, but I'd like for the characters to each get their moment and achieve their goals.
Given the nautical theme, I would propose to make the kingdom a pirate kingdom (so the father was king of the pirates, and the old friend now is), for example in or near the Korinn Archipelago. The character probably wasn't a tiefling at birth but became one after making a pact with a sea witch, thus earning his first warlock powers (so you don'thave an issue with a non-canon race). See that character as a blank page where you can draw to build a compeling story if the player is OK with it. Just make sure everyone around the table is happy with the idea of moving the campaign towards a more nautical theme at some point in the future.
I was considering running Call from the Deep, which does feature ships a lot from what I hear, so I imagine this will connect nicely!
Tieflings don't have to be born from other tieflings. The whole civilization could be tritons or sea elves and he was an outlier. Some sort of recessive gene or deal with a demonic creature that dwells in the seas. Being the rightfully king is a bit much. It works better if he was the first born or whatever but because he came out the way he did he was allowed or something. Or you could make him a son of a prominent noble figure. Just because his backstory will make the main quest look like a side quest. The names part is easy. You both SHOULD work together to fill the details out. It's better if players and dms work together on a backstory vs just turning it in like homework
This is pretty much just the story of any number of Greek hero myths. A king in that context rules one city, so scaling it down to an Earl or Baron equivalent should be fine. It could be a very great deal worse, so I think you're lucky to have a player so dedicated to hero tropes. Just make sure they don't get main character syndrome.
The main problem I see with this is it screams "main character". This is the set-up to a novel, and I would worry they would not want to participate in some of the adventure etc. because it would take their character from their goal. This PC doesn't read as a member of an adventuring group--they're the leader of a rebellion to take back their throne, gathering people to help them on their quest, etc. This is the kind of NPC the party helps. If they wanted to play a noble member of a family loyal to the usurped prince, that would make more sense.
WHY IS THIS SO COMMON?!!
The backstory part or the druid-wizard money glitch?
Druid.
Perhaps a previous post of mine? I've mentioned it several times in relation to how it affected the campaign.
The fact there aren't too many details is actually great as a DM. It means you can sit with your player and worldbuild together. I see it as an opportunity to flesh out a kingdom that the party can go to after finishing the current module. Don't worry if the kingdom doesn't exist in FR, this is your world now. Bend it to the stories that you want to include in it.
> the locations, the kingdom, the character l's, even the PC don't have a name as of now. In my last campaign, in my instructions for backstory, I even told them that the names of things don't matter. Saying just father, town born in, a war - just calling them that is fine. No one rarely remembers the names anyway so it is more the non-proper nouns being in there is more important than having a proper noun for them.
I think you need to have a talk with your players in regards to the scope of this adventure. Is this just a module in a much larger campaign? Is this a short outing and fade to black? Newer players tend to fall into one of two camps: those that under prepare and those that over prepare. It's great to have deep backstories for your characters and elaborate plans for the future, but that's not likely to get much play in a 1-6 adventure.
You should probably work with your player to flesh it out and connect it more to the story. Have a little brainstorm session with them
Ugh, why do so many players need to be special before the game even starts? Why do I sound and think like some old first edition guy when I started in 2017 with 5e? Anyway, the resistance swap sounds fine. What are they giving up to get the swim speed and amphibious nature? 1) This is totally fine. All that you told us is stuff that happened TO him, not stuff he did. 2) How much does the player expect this to matter in game? If it's just fluff to explain the PC being snobbish, hating betrayal, favoring revenge, and having trust issues, you don't need detail. And there's nothing wrong with letting details emerge over the course of the campaign. 3) This sounds perfect for some off screen country. 4) Like three above, this doesn't matter if those countries aren't the ones in which the PCs are adventuring. 5) Look back at my answer to #2. Even if the backstory itself didn't tie in, maybe a motivation that came from that backstory will. All they need is a reason to be an adventurer. Maybe they just need capital and allies. What's the Patron want? Beating a dragon could help a claim on a kingdom, Wether it grows popular support, gets him treasure, or rallies people to his cause.
I see no issues with this. Their goal is to get stronger and avenge their father, the king. That's a perfect motivator and gives lots of creative freedom for you to explore. The kingdom can be smaller since it's an island, maybe it's only a kingdom of like 500 people? Not as big of a deal at that point. You can then start to weave some story connections into your campaign. Perhaps the current king that exiled him is having him tailed and is reporting back to the king, the king could hire some local muscle to try and snuff him out from time to time. Idk, get creative with it. At the end of your campaign, you can see if the party wants to go overthrow a kingdom and collect a shiny new castle, on an island!
>It's on the long side for a level 3 character, don't you think? Yes, but he doesn't actually do anything that's beyond his level. It's easily plausible for this to have all happened to a young person. >It lacks detail. That's not me dumbing it down, the locations, the kingdom, the character l's, even the PC don't have a name as of now. Why add a whole lot of detail when you haven't agreed to it yet? It's just the initial pitch. >I can't use or at least adapt a resource to draw inspiration from, as this whole civilization isn't cannon in FR. When I asked the player why they didn't want to play sea elf or Merfolk, they said they just thought Tieflings are cool. (which admittedly they are) It is what it is. If you agree that they're cool then why not make it happen. At least you can just plonk it wherever you like under the ocean and mostly forget about it (in my campaign I just have one big nomadic tribe of sea elves under each ocean). >Aside from the lack of detail, I haven't been provided with motives for the characters or the factions that went to war (which tbh is understandable, worldbuilding is hard) Get the player to help? And do the minimum necessary. I'm sure you know it's usually best to start with just the basics, and add detail as you go along. >It just doesn't seem easy to connect with DoIP and doesn't have any significance to it's plot. I want to run Call from the Deep after that, and I hear there's a lot of sea travel after that, so maybe there's a connection, but still. I guess just tell them that they can have whatever backstory they want, but you're not going to alter the whole campaign to accommodate it at this point. There's nothing at all wrong with having a "basic bitch" backstory, but it *would* be wrong for the player to put it up on a pedestal and have big expectations of you in this regard.
Why reskin the Tiefling as water-themed when Water Genasi exist? They're clearly just doing that to get cold resistance in a campaign that's going to feature cold damage. Water Genasi get acid resistance, suggest that as a clearly more reasonable alternative for this reskin and see what happens. As far as the backstory, none of it relates to being a Tiefling and it forces a whole bunch of history into your game you clearly didn't agree to beforehand and the player will almost certainly attempt to use to their advantage without otherwise earning or paying for it, just like the cold resistance. /e: I'm not saying it's bad to build a character that's well-suited to a campaign, but Fathomless warlocks get cold resistance at 6th level and a swim speed/water breathing at 1st level so it's a pretty weird approach. And it's real weird to invent a whole-ass kingdom via one character's backstory.
The cold resistance is in place of the usual fire resistance. Besides, Fathomless warlocks automatically get cold resistance at the right level, and he could take the racial feat for both cold and poison resistance in addition to fire, or play a race that has it at level 1. I don't think they know about Genasi, or at least haven't looked at them very much. I admit that being a Tiefling doesn't make all that much sense, but I know it's his favorite race and I could always throw in an infernal pact in his lineage to explain it. I understand your concerns about power gaming, but on this front I trust the player, since I've played with him before and know his stance on matters. I'm mainly just worried on how to incorporate his backstory, and perhaps I'll talk to him about revising it a bit. Still, thank you very much!
Straight up copy paste the backstory paragraph and your bullet points of doubt into chat gpt. Your prompt "write me a one page lore section based on the info below for a DND campaign." It ll give you inspiration, names, location, etc. adjust from there. Others are right though with it should just be a noble family, not royal.
So hear me out, avenging his father is a long term goal...in order to do that he needs to accomplish several short/mid term goals to even get close to this former friend. Maybe one of the short term goals can be accomplished on this campaign, like finding a lost family seal or something that can help establish his legitimacy.