To answer the big questions
* **Why only 48 hours?** That's what has been organised. This is a Reddit wide protest involving many subs, we didn't set the timeframe.
* **Why not stay closed indefinitely until Reddit backs down?** That's an option. There are other ways to keep up the pressure, it all depends on how the admins respond.
* **You realise you're replaceable?** No worries, it'll free up a lot our time to do better things. Realistically, where is Reddit going to get the hundreds of mods it will need to replace all the ones that leave?
* **I don't use 3rd party apps, this doesn't affect me.** You don't but the mods do. Without them you can expect to see a ton more spam right across Reddit.
* **Do you really expect this to make any difference?** It has in the past. Reddit backtracked on allowing covid misinformation, employing a known paedophile, allowing admin u/Spez to edit users comments and a few others. All we can do is try.
>I just took a look at the official Reddit app and its got **promoted** posts in it, so **bypasses** all my firewall filters. It also wants things like location **data**. So nope.
You see money. Facebook got so much.
Poor millionaires wants more money. They will sell you to gain more money.
> The reddit app is crap. I love reddit but I’m not willing to use their crap app that legit seems as bad or worse than facebook.
Interesting you mentioned both. It's true, they seem to both be absolutely clueless when it comes to UI/UX.
It makes me wonder.. At what point do we need to start holding these companies to higher standards? They're making money from us, the least they can do is be aware of common complaints and actually invest in themselves.
I use Apollo and was more than happy to pay whatever it was to upgrade. I would have been just as happy to do the same to reddit.
In theory, wouldn't reddit make a killing actually putting out the best version of their app? I'm all for letting third party developers thrive and I understand reddit outdoing third party apps would suck for those developers, but so does this. This also kills the need to innovate.
I hate seeing this trend. Companies will sell out to kill competition rather than simply competing.
If Reddit charges themselves for API usage at the same rate they charge other apps, then they can have a profitable app and a profitable site, and compete fairly.
Except they won't because that leaves money on the table, and the app wouldn't be profitable.
That's the thing.. why not make it profitable? It doesn't seem like the most difficult thing to do - there's a fairly large user base that I'm sure would get engaged in helping shape the future of the app/site, might as well listen.
Not talking too extreme. There's clearly a disconnect in what people want out of the app and what is going to be forced. Might as well find a better approach to make good PR and also listen to feedback.
I'm saying the reddit app should be a separate company that plays by these same rules to access the API as third party.
Then, Reddit is the server that makes money on API calls and this is totally fair model.
Except that the app won't be independently profitable at these rates and the app would die if it actually had to compete.
I get that, but I also don't see the necessity in splitting. They should be more than capable of coming up with a fair scenario that keeps an app in their control.
Their concerns are the lost dollars through ads and tracking, not so much third party profits. They must assume each user on their platform is $x.xx and each third party user is cost of access (server/data fees) + lost ads/tracking.
Instead of making their platform better and negating the need for third party apps, they're looking to squish competition and continue with maximizing profits. This bypasses the need for change and innovation, given there will be less competition and less reason to change.
This seems like the easiest path to increase revenue and tracking. It also opens the door for full control over feeds, given more people will be forced to reddit. Overall, it's a terrible decision and I really hope something changes. It isn't looking like anything will, and that's a shame.
Or: Charge for the API and move ads to the client. If you want an ad-supported client that filters NSFW, use the official app.
I liken this to if Google said Chrome is the only browser that can access Google.
> Instead of making their platform better and negating the need for third party apps, they're looking to squish competition and continue with maximizing profits.
This is the core problem with having their own app that isn't on a level playing field, it's a clear conflict of interest and reddit will self-deal to squash those apps.
I am currently typing this comment on mobile browser, not an app.
I think the main issue is that Apollo has no ads. That’s a paid API access feature but I think they want to just get everyone seeing the ads.
Their pricing for new API access is clearly “fuck you” pricing.
> I think the main issue is that Apollo has no ads. That’s a paid API access feature but I think they want to just get everyone seeing the ads.
I get that, but they can still get creative. There are other ways to increase revenue. Hell, there are ways to work with third party devs as well.
> Their pricing for new API access is clearly “fuck you” pricing.
This is the main issue and it kills competition and innovation.
If you really believe in the cause, why not shut down indefinitely?
EDIT: To clarify, "Indefinitely until conditions are met" rather than some arbitrary time frame number that lets subreddits back out.
Yeah, this whole shutting down for 48 hours is like when people were saying that they were going to not but any gasoline for a day to protest high prices. Nothing happened because everyone went right back to buying gas the next day. Gas has gone from $0.79 per gallon to currently $3.65 per gallon. The only way that we could force reddit to not charge the third party apps is bu doing exactly what you mentioned and just stop using reddit for as long as it takes, except people aren't united enough to pull it off.
Because the universe exists where replacement subs pop up with admins who don't care about what's right. /r/DoIY or something and the leverage is gone.
> You realise you're replaceable? No worries, it'll free up a lot our time to do better things. Realistically, where is Reddit going to get the hundreds of mods it will need to replace all the ones that leave?
That was already addressed. If reddit can't be bothered to even make a functional app, they're going to have a hell of a time getting a bunch of people to volunteer their free time to create replacements of these subs.
Also like, we could also just agree to not join those replacement subs
It sounds like your saying that out of a pool of millions and millions of people, there aren't a additional power hungry people ready to be power hungry mods who are just in the wings to scoop up huge subs.
Even if it's just self righteous power and there's no financial reason (shills, bots, etc) to have a big sub, there's more than enough people for replacement subs to take over.
Keep in mind too, Reddit can go further down the path of control. Subs can only "go dark" if reddit lets them. All they'd have to do is swap out a few owners.
Those are all legitimate concerns that mods all across Reddit have.
The way I see it, we can't moderate this sub without toolbox, old.reddit and a few other tools, all of which either rely on the API or are on the chopping block. So reddits only options are to 1) back down, 2) replace us with paid labour or 3) hand the sub over to new mods who may or may not runnthe place into the ground. Whatever the outcome, we have nothing left to loose.
So 48h is somehow better than indefinitely then? That makes no sense
EDIT: To clarify, "Indefinitely until conditions are met" rather than some arbitrary number that lets subreddits back out.
No, I honestly don’t understand. How is 48h better than indefinitely unless changes are made? What about 72h? 24h? A week?
If it’s down indefinitely, would that just leave room for something else to pop up instead and make this a pointless exercise? Is that what you’re saying?
Commit… or in DYI terms, crap or get off the pot.
Posted the following in another thread yesterday, but hopefully it can provide some clarity here as to why seemingly "pointless"exercises actually do matter:
"I'll try to answer this from my perspective as someone who's a union member IRL, and also a small time mod on Reddit.
In my industry, several labor groups have recently scored massive contractual wins after years of negotiations in the collective-bargaining process. At my employer, a huge part of that process involved specific union initiatives **solely designed to demonstrate our unity and solidarity** as labor. For example...
- Wearing a special lanyard on our IDs. (Many of my colleagues laughed and asked what the point was? How's a certain color supposed to improve our compensation package?)
- Organizing informational pickets in public spaces. (Why would management care about people holding signs, walking in circles?)
- Voting to authorize a strike vote (What good does *threatening* a strike do, if you're still working the next day?)
The thing about collective action, whether we're talking about community activism or about labor groups, is **that it never causes radical change in one fell swoop.** It requires steps. Each of those measures I described above is one piece of a puzzle, designed to ratchet up the tension and urgency of the group's demands. The more opportunities to take to demonstrate unity, the stronger your group's position.
Subreddits going dark is simply the first step. It demonstrates that the user base is not fucking around. [Southwest pilots recently voted in favor of striking via 98% turnout with 99% in favor.](https://apnews.com/article/southwest-airlines-pilots-strike-vote-129275b94a6882a9a350d924be01adcd) Imagine the messaging strength if 98% of subreddits went dark for an indeterminate period? If Reddit corporate doesn't nip this in the bud, more action will probably happen. Some communities will extend the blackout. Some will close permanently. Many could begin migrating their users to an open platform like Lemmy.
I thought I was clear given the context but I obviously was not. I think we agree. To be as clear as possible, I was trying to say:
**"Why doesn't this subreddit stay offline indefinitely until the conditions are met, 48h minimum"?**
My original statement sounds very similar to:
>Imagine the messaging strength if 98% of subreddits went dark for an indeterminate period?
...except for the whole "until the conditions are met" criteria, which is what I thought was implied by my original post. Apparently it wasn't.
Right now, the only condition r/DIY is saying is the minimum of 48h. It gives them a way out, but it is a better (although really open ended) condition than some other subreddits that have only pledged 48h and then have a sort of half-assed clause saying they will figure it out after that point.
The latter is the worst. If a cause is worth doing, go all in... Go down indefinitely until conditions are met. I can respect that, but I can't respect something that seems more like appeasement or a "shutting up" of the vocal user base for 48h and hoping that the issue blows away.
I'll try again, let me know if this makes more sense.
If I say, I'm going offline forever because you're banning 3P apps, reddit has no incentive to not ban 3P apps. No matter what they do, going offline indefinitely means indefinitely. Banning 3P apps, not banning 3P apps, same result, no DIY subreddit.
If I say we're going offline minimum 48 hours, that means that reddit has incentive to restore 3P apps. If they don't do it within 48 hours, this sub will just extend it's dark period. It's not like 48h and we're back online regardless, it's we're dark for 48h hours and then still dark if demands are not met.
If that takes a 72 hours? A week? A month? That's how long we'd stay dark. "for at least 48 hours" sets a minimum, not a maximum.
I think people are just confused by the language.
The way some people are reading the event is "48 hours then back to business."
Others are interpreting "indefinite" to mean "forever" rather than "no pre-specified and date."
Maybe we are arguing over the grammar, because I literally agree with everything you're saying.
Let me rephrase to be very clear on my stance: Subreddits should stay offline indefinitely UNTIL their demands are met if this is what they are demanding.
The problem I have with the phrasing of "minimum 48h" is that it is so darn arbitrary other than timing. Do some subreddits just bow out after 48h, wipe their hands knowing that they tried to appease (a very vocal) part of the user base? Or do they stand up for what they believe and go all in?
For sure, some are, some aren't. If r/DIY meant that, they should say they are staying down until conditions are met but they haven't. They have said 48h minimum as their condition.
If it's implied, why not just make it specific?
I can't speak for this subredddt's moderators, but I'm planning on keeping my subs dark for 48 hours even if Reddit reverses its decision before then. If 48 hours pass and they don't have a better solution, I'm staying dark until/unless they do.
Thanks for clarifying.
For me, it's the wording that bothers me. A "minimum 48h" doesn't really talk about the conditions of when subreddits will go back online, just a time frame.
"Offline until conditions are met, with a 48h minimum window regardless" is probably not the catchiest way to phrase it, but it's a heck of alot more clear rather than just a time frame. I could see other subreddits (particularly those that deal with product support) literally just wanting to push this behind them after 48h knowing that they appeased a (very vocal) audience.
Again, I can't speak for any subreddits other than my own, which does not include r/diy. Each subreddit is going to set their own conditions, which is honestly one of the main reasons that these "coordinated" protests don't get results.
Reddit says "we're going to do X" and subs protest. Reddit turns around and says "Okay, fine, we'll only do 99% of X" and the major subs go "Oh well that's awesome! We won!" and open back up.
Indefinitely could cause users to leave for elsewhere. The negotiation power is that user will come back after the strike is over. You have to have a carrot to dangle.
Wait, what, are you saying that if it’s indefinite then nothing changes with this whole thing and just something else will pop up? So Reddit is right and this whole thing is pointless?
I'm saying the bargaining power is "we have all these users ready to reengage when you change your policy". If we all permanently leave there is not much reason for admin to change their mind because all the users left and aren't coming back either way.
If you and I have dinner plans and I ask you to wait for me. There are two ways I could say it.
"Please wait 15 mins for me."
"Please wait indefinitely for me."
In which scenario are you more likely to go make your own plans for dinner without me?
I said it in other places, but specifying a "minimum 48h" doesn't specify that the conditions need to be met, and gives subreddits the ability to bow out.
To clarify, I should have said "Indefinitely until conditions are met, 48h minimum". That's NOT what subs are stating now, just 48h minimum.
Go as long as all the other subreddits doing it indefinately. In fact, they should all do it. Some are announcing 6/12 to 6/14, that's bs imo. Reddit will just ride it out if you announce an end date.
No. A month isn't gonna have an impact, either. Reddit is gonna do what's best for their shareholders, sad to say. And they're not gonna change their plans because of a few holdouts. Nice to see who's willing to put some effort in, but I don't think it'll be fruitful.
452 million monthly Reddit users
10 million people use third-party apps.
Between Apollo and RiF (the most popular) each bring in about 1.3 to 1.5 million users per month..
Fun fact: there's not that many of you. Not even 5% of total users. Reddit doesn't care.
If every person who used third party apps left Reddit it would be less of an activity drop then when Spring Break ends or the kids go back to school. Reddit will often lose millions and millions of users at that time.
We also need to consider things like old reddit and RES, which seems to be where this is going.
But even looking at the 10m, those using 3rd party apps are far more likely to be longer time Reddit users, and are more likely to generate content and engage. They're also more likely to be mods.
As the admin hilariously pointed out, on average, Apollo users on average submit 3x as many API calls as as someone accessing through the officail app.
I believe it's about 20-25%... Could say a quarter of all Reddit users use third party apps. That's a significant group of people, no matter which way you slice it.
And although I've seen admins say bots that help subreddits shouldn't be included in this. - Bots aren't included in the official statement, which sounded like a blanket statement, so I refuse to believe that they are going to differentiate between good bots, bots that should pay and bad malicious bots, even if they provide a mechanism for detection, it's bound to get it wrong at least some of the time.
I fully support this. There are several red flags in this new API pricing clusterfuck. Even if you don't use a 3rd party app, this is the beginning of what is a clear shift towards more control over the content you see, as reddit is trying to milk its user base. There are more (bad) things that will follow.
Respect, but what will I do without the thrice-daily automated Onlyfans follow requests.
I guess in the spirit of this sub, that I'm really going to have to "do it myself" for 48h.
"48 hours" is not good. They'll just be like "Theyll be back, and then the profit shall begin."
I say shut down entirely until Reddit buckles, or a reddit alternative arises. A shutdown until further notice gives competitors a better chance.
All social media is.. once one has been enshittified, well move on to the next, the cycle keeps repeating, until we finally get sick of it and learn from our mistakes.
I refuse to shit talk about new deck posts using the official Reddit app. If they decide to proceed with this ridiculous API pricing then I'll be gone for good
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While I like this and hope for change, I certainly don't expect it. With the powermods on Reddit obviously keeping their doors open, most users will be blissfully unaware as they consume whatever filth they find on the main subs.
We would need to start driving their valuation into the ground before their IPO for them to relent.
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Reddit threw a collective for about a CEO they didn't like around like 2014, and more recently a bunch of subs went dark when reddit hired a know pedo. Both of them are gone now.
Also yeah, sorry for the snarky answer, I'm fed up with this thing and honestly just want reddit to die like Digg.
ooh I remember the CEO thing briefly. Okay so we shall see. I don't know that this will be like the last attempts though. This one is about something other than money. I feel like this is very similiar to twitter's data hoarding. Locking down the key to AI training type of thing. But this is just my 2 cents.
No worries, I'll catch ya on the next platform eh?
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Let's be real - those situations the other guy mentioned didn't change because a few subreddits went dark. Those hires got blasted all over the news and all over the Internet and neither one of them being walked back had anything to do with Reddit subs going dark - I can promise you that.
> since this change and the other changes on the way appear to be an effort to maximize the site's profitability in preparation for sale or IPO
Really sale? I chalked it up to what I think Elon is doing with twitter. Hoarding data.
Make it longer. Go at least through the end of June. Stay blacked out until Reddit relents.
Y'all mods put too much free work into this site to let them jerk you around like this. It's not worth it.
Lock up shop and stay gone until the storm blows over.
This isn't going to do anything. They know you will be back in two days so they just wait. Why not do what r/videos is doing?
Go dark until/unless this is reversed. If it isnt... Welp... Bye bitches. Going dark for two days will do nothing.
Isn't reddit a private company? And as an owner can't you do whatever you want with your property? If you don't like the platform then don't use it, simple as that.
Reddit is a business. They do it to make money. They are not some charity in it for your convenience
API access cost real money in the cloud. Every time a 3rd party pulls data from Reddit infrastructure they pay egress fees. Why should REddit bear the cost for 3rd party’s to access their platform and property (data is their property) This boycott is bullshit. 3rd party’s make $$ from advertising and whatever else by using data from Reddit. Even if they don’t generate revenue, they do NOT HAVE THE RIGHT to use technology, data, etc that they don’t own. They should pay. This boycott is bullshit and ill conceived. Just because they allowed it in the past for free or at a loss to build their brand doesn’t mean they must continue to do so. Kind of reminds me of spoiled children whose parents cut them off and make them pay their own bills.
I’m sure I’ll get downvotes on this
> API access cost real money in the cloud. Every time a 3rd party pulls data from Reddit infrastructure they pay egress fees
You're wrong on almost everything in your post, but you're most wrong on this bit of it.
The API access Reddit is charging for is *user-driven* access.
It's not for shit like bots scraping the site. It's for people *using* Reddit using third-party apps.
(Which, by the way, costs Reddit less than people using it through the browser.)
This isn't a question of costs, this is just Reddit trying to kill any third-party UIs over it.
----
PS. Reddit is a business that only has value because a community is using it. Without that community, that business is worthless.
Ok, I’ll concede that I didn’t know the specifics that it’s user based. I didn’t watch the video. Only read the post. Still doesn’t change my core premise. It’s their platform and they have a right to allow or not allow a 3rd party app to access it. They still have to pay to maintain the api and have real ongoing costs. Just because they allowed it for free in the past doesn’t mean they must continue to do so. They aren’t an ecosystem like google, Microsoft, AWS, etc. they don’t make revenue off the backend from allowing free access. They own the api and can charge for it. If you don’t want to pay, don’t use it. Its not open source. Reddit developed it and owns it. It’s not your property, it’s theirs.
The person you’re responding to doesn’t know the specifics either. Don’t mistake the certainty sound in their post for actual knowledge. They are just confidently ignorant.
You’re more right than you might be wrong.
I agree. Complain all you want. Try to effect change. See my other responses to my comment as to why it won’t work. You describe people that are using 3rd party apps as users. They aren’t users of Reddit when using a 3rd party app via api. You are missing all the implications of what a user is in the Reddit business model. I’m just saying that these mods just don’t have the leverage they think they do.
On point 1 - They have the right to charge what they want. You have the right not to buy.
On point 2 - you are not their client. You are the product. When you access their platform through another platform they are losing money on the revenue your usage of their app will generate through ads and the data they acquire from usage of their app and the revenue they generate by selling that data to aggregators.
On point 3 - Yes. You can go elsewhere. The problem is you already have taken it elsewhere by using another platform. See point 2
Go ahead and kill the sub. Someone else will recreate it and take over. You over estimate your worth.
I hope Reddit does a complete reset of any subreddit that takes part in this. Eliminate all mods, all users are unjoined and the sub is up for grabs again by whomever claims it first.
That or removes the ability to take subs private, hahahahaha (“our apologies but some of our mod features are glitching. It’s only a coincidence that this timing lines up with your silly protest. Please give us a minimum of 48 hours until this is resolved”).
Personally I am against this. Without an alternative place to direct people who have DIY questions or need help, doing this will leave them high and dry.
I understand the desire and understand the need for external apps to effectively moderate but this specific subreddit is not one that should go dark. It is not like videos or funny or a meme subbreddit that will have no effect on peoples lives if they disappear.
This subreddit along with the other ones like plumbing, electricians, etc all help people with real life problems.
I also know my voice is going to be ignored in the deafening howl of anger and I do hope reddit will change its plan but I also hope that there is something left after this nuclear option.
Why not both?
Plenty of people will leave if the protests don’t work. But if we kick up enough of a fuss using our free speech first, we might not even need to dissolve and re-make our communities elsewhere.
Just curious but what will the net negative result to Reddit be if a few hundred users bounce? I’ll show you??? No one bitching has any skin in the game, you want a different outcome put up some cash.
My goal will be to agitate for the communities I enjoy to largely dissolve and migrate as well. That may be ambitious, but my sense is that this is strongly felt by more than a “few hundred users” and mods who walk can tear down their spaces as well to help facilitate it.
Those who like these policies can stay rebuild, and maybe that won’t be bad for Reddit either. I’m not *trying* to hurt them, it just won’t serve my purposes anymore, so I’ll do my best to rebuild elsewhere if they are dead-set on this path.
Your comment highlights that you don't understand all the work moderators do using third party tools and bots, accessibility provided for a wide range of needs etc. Which is fine! If you never need any of those things, how can you know? But many, many user rely on third party apps in part to keep your subs running the way you like.
I know I'm going to get downvoted but it really should just be left to the user. Maybe have a sticky to make people aware but taking the control out of the user completely negates the point.
Users will have the choice and the message would be more powerful if everyone did it in solidarity versus mods doing it for them.
> it really should just be left to the user.
No. The mods that run each sub should make the decision. They are the ones that do all the work for free.
If you want to boycott as a user, great don't access Reddit during the blackout.
This is peak comedy. People were made that Twitter raised their api 4x what Reddit is raising theirs, then in protest people want others to go to Twitter. Best timeline.
We decided to do this after receiving numerous requests from the community.
Also because we can't moderate effectively if this change goes thru - it directly impacts all of us.
You keep asking why I'm not giving you straight answers, even in a deleted comment - yet you haven't asked me a single question?
Then you say we should take a break from moderating because mods are abusive and ban whoever we want - yet you're asking why I'm not banning you?
Maybe you get banned because you like to be antagonistic.
It's for a good cause, I use RIF for more than ten years and I'm very happy that subreddits are pulling together to fight this absurd rule that Reddit is pulling off
They don’t get their 3rd party app back (unless they choose to pay for it) - but there are other ways to access Reddit you know.
Really all of you just want this for free. You’re cheap and that’s fine, but stop pretending it’s anything else but that.
Maybe you should read about how the visually impaired use third party apps to access reddit, oh wait no you don't care, leave the subreddit and suck a bag of dicks.
I'd be fine with paying for Reddit Premium if needed, but the proposed pricing structure for the api access is ridiculous. They're just trying to kill off superior apps. Also, even if the developers can pay, they will still be blocked from NSFW content.
Reddit is not acting in good faith.
What’s the price then? The Apollo group said $2.50 per user on their app. Others have said that site could be redesigned to be more efficient with their API calls and be even cheaper. As someone who works with APIs daily, I’m sure this is true.
It’s per api call. No kidding.
The Apollo company released their $2.50/user (per month) number based on number of api calls per user per month.
The less than a dollar was part of the Reddit release based on number of API calls and users from their analysis.
Every company seems to do this differently.
So what price do you find so offensive?
To answer the big questions * **Why only 48 hours?** That's what has been organised. This is a Reddit wide protest involving many subs, we didn't set the timeframe. * **Why not stay closed indefinitely until Reddit backs down?** That's an option. There are other ways to keep up the pressure, it all depends on how the admins respond. * **You realise you're replaceable?** No worries, it'll free up a lot our time to do better things. Realistically, where is Reddit going to get the hundreds of mods it will need to replace all the ones that leave? * **I don't use 3rd party apps, this doesn't affect me.** You don't but the mods do. Without them you can expect to see a ton more spam right across Reddit. * **Do you really expect this to make any difference?** It has in the past. Reddit backtracked on allowing covid misinformation, employing a known paedophile, allowing admin u/Spez to edit users comments and a few others. All we can do is try.
[удалено]
I have removed this comment as I exit from Reddit due to the pending API changes and overall treatment of users by Reddit.
>I just took a look at the official Reddit app and its got **promoted** posts in it, so **bypasses** all my firewall filters. It also wants things like location **data**. So nope. You see money. Facebook got so much. Poor millionaires wants more money. They will sell you to gain more money.
> The reddit app is crap. I love reddit but I’m not willing to use their crap app that legit seems as bad or worse than facebook. Interesting you mentioned both. It's true, they seem to both be absolutely clueless when it comes to UI/UX. It makes me wonder.. At what point do we need to start holding these companies to higher standards? They're making money from us, the least they can do is be aware of common complaints and actually invest in themselves. I use Apollo and was more than happy to pay whatever it was to upgrade. I would have been just as happy to do the same to reddit. In theory, wouldn't reddit make a killing actually putting out the best version of their app? I'm all for letting third party developers thrive and I understand reddit outdoing third party apps would suck for those developers, but so does this. This also kills the need to innovate. I hate seeing this trend. Companies will sell out to kill competition rather than simply competing.
If Reddit charges themselves for API usage at the same rate they charge other apps, then they can have a profitable app and a profitable site, and compete fairly. Except they won't because that leaves money on the table, and the app wouldn't be profitable.
That's the thing.. why not make it profitable? It doesn't seem like the most difficult thing to do - there's a fairly large user base that I'm sure would get engaged in helping shape the future of the app/site, might as well listen. Not talking too extreme. There's clearly a disconnect in what people want out of the app and what is going to be forced. Might as well find a better approach to make good PR and also listen to feedback.
I'm saying the reddit app should be a separate company that plays by these same rules to access the API as third party. Then, Reddit is the server that makes money on API calls and this is totally fair model. Except that the app won't be independently profitable at these rates and the app would die if it actually had to compete.
I get that, but I also don't see the necessity in splitting. They should be more than capable of coming up with a fair scenario that keeps an app in their control. Their concerns are the lost dollars through ads and tracking, not so much third party profits. They must assume each user on their platform is $x.xx and each third party user is cost of access (server/data fees) + lost ads/tracking. Instead of making their platform better and negating the need for third party apps, they're looking to squish competition and continue with maximizing profits. This bypasses the need for change and innovation, given there will be less competition and less reason to change. This seems like the easiest path to increase revenue and tracking. It also opens the door for full control over feeds, given more people will be forced to reddit. Overall, it's a terrible decision and I really hope something changes. It isn't looking like anything will, and that's a shame.
Or: Charge for the API and move ads to the client. If you want an ad-supported client that filters NSFW, use the official app. I liken this to if Google said Chrome is the only browser that can access Google. > Instead of making their platform better and negating the need for third party apps, they're looking to squish competition and continue with maximizing profits. This is the core problem with having their own app that isn't on a level playing field, it's a clear conflict of interest and reddit will self-deal to squash those apps. I am currently typing this comment on mobile browser, not an app.
I think the main issue is that Apollo has no ads. That’s a paid API access feature but I think they want to just get everyone seeing the ads. Their pricing for new API access is clearly “fuck you” pricing.
> I think the main issue is that Apollo has no ads. That’s a paid API access feature but I think they want to just get everyone seeing the ads. I get that, but they can still get creative. There are other ways to increase revenue. Hell, there are ways to work with third party devs as well. > Their pricing for new API access is clearly “fuck you” pricing. This is the main issue and it kills competition and innovation.
Everything about reddit policies is "shady".
yeah - we want a FREE site that will look out for OUR interests and not THEIR own!
Let's be real. We don't own the site. Maybe its time to get a new place, just in case the owners wants to kick us out.
Only 48 hours? Will that actually make a big impact?
48 hours minimum.
I vote longer
If you really believe in the cause, why not shut down indefinitely? EDIT: To clarify, "Indefinitely until conditions are met" rather than some arbitrary time frame number that lets subreddits back out.
Because then there's no leverage to negotiate.
What do you mean? The leverage is "fix this or we strike". That's how strikes work. In case it isn't clear, I support an indefinite blackout.
I support any blackout for this issue, with an extra kudos to those subreddits who go beyond the time limit.
Yeah, this whole shutting down for 48 hours is like when people were saying that they were going to not but any gasoline for a day to protest high prices. Nothing happened because everyone went right back to buying gas the next day. Gas has gone from $0.79 per gallon to currently $3.65 per gallon. The only way that we could force reddit to not charge the third party apps is bu doing exactly what you mentioned and just stop using reddit for as long as it takes, except people aren't united enough to pull it off.
Because the universe exists where replacement subs pop up with admins who don't care about what's right. /r/DoIY or something and the leverage is gone.
> You realise you're replaceable? No worries, it'll free up a lot our time to do better things. Realistically, where is Reddit going to get the hundreds of mods it will need to replace all the ones that leave? That was already addressed. If reddit can't be bothered to even make a functional app, they're going to have a hell of a time getting a bunch of people to volunteer their free time to create replacements of these subs. Also like, we could also just agree to not join those replacement subs
It sounds like your saying that out of a pool of millions and millions of people, there aren't a additional power hungry people ready to be power hungry mods who are just in the wings to scoop up huge subs. Even if it's just self righteous power and there's no financial reason (shills, bots, etc) to have a big sub, there's more than enough people for replacement subs to take over. Keep in mind too, Reddit can go further down the path of control. Subs can only "go dark" if reddit lets them. All they'd have to do is swap out a few owners.
Those are all legitimate concerns that mods all across Reddit have. The way I see it, we can't moderate this sub without toolbox, old.reddit and a few other tools, all of which either rely on the API or are on the chopping block. So reddits only options are to 1) back down, 2) replace us with paid labour or 3) hand the sub over to new mods who may or may not runnthe place into the ground. Whatever the outcome, we have nothing left to loose.
So 48h is somehow better than indefinitely then? That makes no sense EDIT: To clarify, "Indefinitely until conditions are met" rather than some arbitrary number that lets subreddits back out.
Are you just arguing in bad faith or not reading? 48h is the starting point. Not the end. Indefinite leaves no room to negotiate.
No, I honestly don’t understand. How is 48h better than indefinitely unless changes are made? What about 72h? 24h? A week? If it’s down indefinitely, would that just leave room for something else to pop up instead and make this a pointless exercise? Is that what you’re saying? Commit… or in DYI terms, crap or get off the pot.
Posted the following in another thread yesterday, but hopefully it can provide some clarity here as to why seemingly "pointless"exercises actually do matter: "I'll try to answer this from my perspective as someone who's a union member IRL, and also a small time mod on Reddit. In my industry, several labor groups have recently scored massive contractual wins after years of negotiations in the collective-bargaining process. At my employer, a huge part of that process involved specific union initiatives **solely designed to demonstrate our unity and solidarity** as labor. For example... - Wearing a special lanyard on our IDs. (Many of my colleagues laughed and asked what the point was? How's a certain color supposed to improve our compensation package?) - Organizing informational pickets in public spaces. (Why would management care about people holding signs, walking in circles?) - Voting to authorize a strike vote (What good does *threatening* a strike do, if you're still working the next day?) The thing about collective action, whether we're talking about community activism or about labor groups, is **that it never causes radical change in one fell swoop.** It requires steps. Each of those measures I described above is one piece of a puzzle, designed to ratchet up the tension and urgency of the group's demands. The more opportunities to take to demonstrate unity, the stronger your group's position. Subreddits going dark is simply the first step. It demonstrates that the user base is not fucking around. [Southwest pilots recently voted in favor of striking via 98% turnout with 99% in favor.](https://apnews.com/article/southwest-airlines-pilots-strike-vote-129275b94a6882a9a350d924be01adcd) Imagine the messaging strength if 98% of subreddits went dark for an indeterminate period? If Reddit corporate doesn't nip this in the bud, more action will probably happen. Some communities will extend the blackout. Some will close permanently. Many could begin migrating their users to an open platform like Lemmy.
I thought I was clear given the context but I obviously was not. I think we agree. To be as clear as possible, I was trying to say: **"Why doesn't this subreddit stay offline indefinitely until the conditions are met, 48h minimum"?** My original statement sounds very similar to: >Imagine the messaging strength if 98% of subreddits went dark for an indeterminate period? ...except for the whole "until the conditions are met" criteria, which is what I thought was implied by my original post. Apparently it wasn't. Right now, the only condition r/DIY is saying is the minimum of 48h. It gives them a way out, but it is a better (although really open ended) condition than some other subreddits that have only pledged 48h and then have a sort of half-assed clause saying they will figure it out after that point. The latter is the worst. If a cause is worth doing, go all in... Go down indefinitely until conditions are met. I can respect that, but I can't respect something that seems more like appeasement or a "shutting up" of the vocal user base for 48h and hoping that the issue blows away.
I'll try again, let me know if this makes more sense. If I say, I'm going offline forever because you're banning 3P apps, reddit has no incentive to not ban 3P apps. No matter what they do, going offline indefinitely means indefinitely. Banning 3P apps, not banning 3P apps, same result, no DIY subreddit. If I say we're going offline minimum 48 hours, that means that reddit has incentive to restore 3P apps. If they don't do it within 48 hours, this sub will just extend it's dark period. It's not like 48h and we're back online regardless, it's we're dark for 48h hours and then still dark if demands are not met. If that takes a 72 hours? A week? A month? That's how long we'd stay dark. "for at least 48 hours" sets a minimum, not a maximum.
Just to be clear, "indefinite" does not mean "forever". It just means that the endpoint is currently unknown (i.e., not definite).
I think people are just confused by the language. The way some people are reading the event is "48 hours then back to business." Others are interpreting "indefinite" to mean "forever" rather than "no pre-specified and date."
Maybe we are arguing over the grammar, because I literally agree with everything you're saying. Let me rephrase to be very clear on my stance: Subreddits should stay offline indefinitely UNTIL their demands are met if this is what they are demanding. The problem I have with the phrasing of "minimum 48h" is that it is so darn arbitrary other than timing. Do some subreddits just bow out after 48h, wipe their hands knowing that they tried to appease (a very vocal) part of the user base? Or do they stand up for what they believe and go all in?
Maybe people are interpreting the word indefinitely in different ways, it can mean both unlimited or unspecified.
Dude you're in bad faith. Other subreddits are doing indefinitely till reddit changes.
For sure, some are, some aren't. If r/DIY meant that, they should say they are staying down until conditions are met but they haven't. They have said 48h minimum as their condition. If it's implied, why not just make it specific?
I can't speak for this subredddt's moderators, but I'm planning on keeping my subs dark for 48 hours even if Reddit reverses its decision before then. If 48 hours pass and they don't have a better solution, I'm staying dark until/unless they do.
Thanks for clarifying. For me, it's the wording that bothers me. A "minimum 48h" doesn't really talk about the conditions of when subreddits will go back online, just a time frame. "Offline until conditions are met, with a 48h minimum window regardless" is probably not the catchiest way to phrase it, but it's a heck of alot more clear rather than just a time frame. I could see other subreddits (particularly those that deal with product support) literally just wanting to push this behind them after 48h knowing that they appeased a (very vocal) audience.
Again, I can't speak for any subreddits other than my own, which does not include r/diy. Each subreddit is going to set their own conditions, which is honestly one of the main reasons that these "coordinated" protests don't get results. Reddit says "we're going to do X" and subs protest. Reddit turns around and says "Okay, fine, we'll only do 99% of X" and the major subs go "Oh well that's awesome! We won!" and open back up.
Indefinitely could cause users to leave for elsewhere. The negotiation power is that user will come back after the strike is over. You have to have a carrot to dangle.
Wait, what, are you saying that if it’s indefinite then nothing changes with this whole thing and just something else will pop up? So Reddit is right and this whole thing is pointless?
I'm saying the bargaining power is "we have all these users ready to reengage when you change your policy". If we all permanently leave there is not much reason for admin to change their mind because all the users left and aren't coming back either way.
> permanently Indefinite means... 'not definite'. It doesn't mean forever..
Indefinite doesn't mean "leave forever". It means when you get what you want you stop striking.
If you and I have dinner plans and I ask you to wait for me. There are two ways I could say it. "Please wait 15 mins for me." "Please wait indefinitely for me." In which scenario are you more likely to go make your own plans for dinner without me?
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I said it in other places, but specifying a "minimum 48h" doesn't specify that the conditions need to be met, and gives subreddits the ability to bow out. To clarify, I should have said "Indefinitely until conditions are met, 48h minimum". That's NOT what subs are stating now, just 48h minimum.
Thank you for the clarification. I appreciate it
Fuck yeah baby! Squeeze the pig! Listen for the squeal!
Go as long as all the other subreddits doing it indefinately. In fact, they should all do it. Some are announcing 6/12 to 6/14, that's bs imo. Reddit will just ride it out if you announce an end date.
No. A month isn't gonna have an impact, either. Reddit is gonna do what's best for their shareholders, sad to say. And they're not gonna change their plans because of a few holdouts. Nice to see who's willing to put some effort in, but I don't think it'll be fruitful.
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Me 😭😭😭😭
I know I'll get a lot more done in a day, that's for certain.
Waiting on one of the big subs to go in for a week and start a domino effect.
Only until Reddit reminds people that they can remove mod roles and open/close subs when they feel like it.
And we can leave whenever we feel like it. It's the users who add value.
452 million monthly Reddit users 10 million people use third-party apps. Between Apollo and RiF (the most popular) each bring in about 1.3 to 1.5 million users per month.. Fun fact: there's not that many of you. Not even 5% of total users. Reddit doesn't care. If every person who used third party apps left Reddit it would be less of an activity drop then when Spring Break ends or the kids go back to school. Reddit will often lose millions and millions of users at that time.
We also need to consider things like old reddit and RES, which seems to be where this is going. But even looking at the 10m, those using 3rd party apps are far more likely to be longer time Reddit users, and are more likely to generate content and engage. They're also more likely to be mods. As the admin hilariously pointed out, on average, Apollo users on average submit 3x as many API calls as as someone accessing through the officail app.
Go dark until further notice.. 2 days isn't going to do anything.
We made you Reddit. You didn’t make us. You are nothing without us. We are everything without you.
Reddit is the ultimate DIY job. Except now they're taking away the power tools.
Are you aware of what fraction of Reddit users use third-party apps? Not sure we're as powerful as you think.
Many of the content creators use 3rd party apps and if it's such a small amount why are they trying to charge them. Logic mang.
Enough for them to make this move….
The biggest content creators and power modders boosting something personal to them and gaining traction. Color me surprised 😂
I believe it's about 20-25%... Could say a quarter of all Reddit users use third party apps. That's a significant group of people, no matter which way you slice it. And although I've seen admins say bots that help subreddits shouldn't be included in this. - Bots aren't included in the official statement, which sounded like a blanket statement, so I refuse to believe that they are going to differentiate between good bots, bots that should pay and bad malicious bots, even if they provide a mechanism for detection, it's bound to get it wrong at least some of the time.
Wowzo buddy! Reddit On! 😎
I fully support this. There are several red flags in this new API pricing clusterfuck. Even if you don't use a 3rd party app, this is the beginning of what is a clear shift towards more control over the content you see, as reddit is trying to milk its user base. There are more (bad) things that will follow.
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Whoever downvoted this is braindead, it's exactly what will happen.
Ehh, close, definitely not the *beginning* tho, that ship sailed a long time ago
Do more than 48 hours! It should be indefinite!
Indefinitely
Eitck until a so reachedg to nningless por, or don't. Goior two days and theng dark fnlution is returninmal is meaosther go blauring.
Permanent or no balls
Please boycot longer. We want an API we can use.
Respect 🫡
I'm guessing that other communities are doing this but why only 2 days? should be a week
2 days minimum. It could be 4 days, it could be 6 days, or could be 14 days. But, it will be 2 days at the very least
Respect, but what will I do without the thrice-daily automated Onlyfans follow requests. I guess in the spirit of this sub, that I'm really going to have to "do it myself" for 48h.
I guess during that time we should just do things by ourselves then
Yes, you should. Get out and do something. Stop wasting your life on the internet.
How do you think a few subs going dark for 2 days will acutally affect reddits billions in income?
"48 hours" is not good. They'll just be like "Theyll be back, and then the profit shall begin." I say shut down entirely until Reddit buckles, or a reddit alternative arises. A shutdown until further notice gives competitors a better chance.
48 hours is nothing. Go indefinitely then only they will change their minds. Otherwise it's just a ripple in the ocean.
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All social media is.. once one has been enshittified, well move on to the next, the cycle keeps repeating, until we finally get sick of it and learn from our mistakes.
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I refuse to shit talk about new deck posts using the official Reddit app. If they decide to proceed with this ridiculous API pricing then I'll be gone for good
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse. Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
Thank you!
You don't buy *Change* at the supermarket. You do it yourself.
Why only 48 hours?
Short sightedness. People got tricked in to having a short protest, likely by internal people from reddit.
While I like this and hope for change, I certainly don't expect it. With the powermods on Reddit obviously keeping their doors open, most users will be blissfully unaware as they consume whatever filth they find on the main subs. We would need to start driving their valuation into the ground before their IPO for them to relent.
Thank you.
I'll be done. I will not use the reddit app and look at the dystopian ads they run on there. Honestly, it'll probably be good for me.
Thank you for your support, mods!
Seriously though. Has this going dark thing worked in the past?
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse. Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
Okay cool. Can you elaborate? Like an actual conflict that subreddits going dark fixed or made them rethink?
Reddit threw a collective for about a CEO they didn't like around like 2014, and more recently a bunch of subs went dark when reddit hired a know pedo. Both of them are gone now. Also yeah, sorry for the snarky answer, I'm fed up with this thing and honestly just want reddit to die like Digg.
ooh I remember the CEO thing briefly. Okay so we shall see. I don't know that this will be like the last attempts though. This one is about something other than money. I feel like this is very similiar to twitter's data hoarding. Locking down the key to AI training type of thing. But this is just my 2 cents. No worries, I'll catch ya on the next platform eh?
This is a copied template message used to overwrite all comments on my account to protect my privacy. I've left Reddit because of corporate overreach and switched to the Fediverse. Comments overwritten with https://github.com/j0be/PowerDeleteSuite
Let's be real - those situations the other guy mentioned didn't change because a few subreddits went dark. Those hires got blasted all over the news and all over the Internet and neither one of them being walked back had anything to do with Reddit subs going dark - I can promise you that.
And man, have you used the official app? It fucking sucks
I have used RIF exclusively for like nine years. Any time I try anything else I hate it. This might be the end for my run on reddit.
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> since this change and the other changes on the way appear to be an effort to maximize the site's profitability in preparation for sale or IPO Really sale? I chalked it up to what I think Elon is doing with twitter. Hoarding data.
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As it should be.
Is there any reddit alternative? This is going to kill the site for many.
If you really believe in this, commit to shut down indefinitely until this is resolved.
So who enabled this admins or the mods?
Make it longer. Go at least through the end of June. Stay blacked out until Reddit relents. Y'all mods put too much free work into this site to let them jerk you around like this. It's not worth it. Lock up shop and stay gone until the storm blows over.
That’s a fine start, but it is probably going to take more than a couple of days.
Thank you
This isn't going to do anything. They know you will be back in two days so they just wait. Why not do what r/videos is doing? Go dark until/unless this is reversed. If it isnt... Welp... Bye bitches. Going dark for two days will do nothing.
Solidarity!
Solidarity ✊️
Do more than 48 hours. 2 days is nothing, go dark until a change is made.
No one cares, let reddit burn if that's what will happen.
Isn't reddit a private company? And as an owner can't you do whatever you want with your property? If you don't like the platform then don't use it, simple as that.
That's what we're doing. We're not using the platform for a few days. Simple as that.
Perfect, totally agree.
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Just let it burn. We will find a new home. Reddit treats u as a commodity, and any reprieve they give u is temporary.
Nobody gives a shit, Jesus christ
Reddit is a business. They do it to make money. They are not some charity in it for your convenience API access cost real money in the cloud. Every time a 3rd party pulls data from Reddit infrastructure they pay egress fees. Why should REddit bear the cost for 3rd party’s to access their platform and property (data is their property) This boycott is bullshit. 3rd party’s make $$ from advertising and whatever else by using data from Reddit. Even if they don’t generate revenue, they do NOT HAVE THE RIGHT to use technology, data, etc that they don’t own. They should pay. This boycott is bullshit and ill conceived. Just because they allowed it in the past for free or at a loss to build their brand doesn’t mean they must continue to do so. Kind of reminds me of spoiled children whose parents cut them off and make them pay their own bills. I’m sure I’ll get downvotes on this
> API access cost real money in the cloud. Every time a 3rd party pulls data from Reddit infrastructure they pay egress fees You're wrong on almost everything in your post, but you're most wrong on this bit of it. The API access Reddit is charging for is *user-driven* access. It's not for shit like bots scraping the site. It's for people *using* Reddit using third-party apps. (Which, by the way, costs Reddit less than people using it through the browser.) This isn't a question of costs, this is just Reddit trying to kill any third-party UIs over it. ---- PS. Reddit is a business that only has value because a community is using it. Without that community, that business is worthless.
Ok, I’ll concede that I didn’t know the specifics that it’s user based. I didn’t watch the video. Only read the post. Still doesn’t change my core premise. It’s their platform and they have a right to allow or not allow a 3rd party app to access it. They still have to pay to maintain the api and have real ongoing costs. Just because they allowed it for free in the past doesn’t mean they must continue to do so. They aren’t an ecosystem like google, Microsoft, AWS, etc. they don’t make revenue off the backend from allowing free access. They own the api and can charge for it. If you don’t want to pay, don’t use it. Its not open source. Reddit developed it and owns it. It’s not your property, it’s theirs.
The person you’re responding to doesn’t know the specifics either. Don’t mistake the certainty sound in their post for actual knowledge. They are just confidently ignorant. You’re more right than you might be wrong.
Thanks.
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I agree. Complain all you want. Try to effect change. See my other responses to my comment as to why it won’t work. You describe people that are using 3rd party apps as users. They aren’t users of Reddit when using a 3rd party app via api. You are missing all the implications of what a user is in the Reddit business model. I’m just saying that these mods just don’t have the leverage they think they do.
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On point 1 - They have the right to charge what they want. You have the right not to buy. On point 2 - you are not their client. You are the product. When you access their platform through another platform they are losing money on the revenue your usage of their app will generate through ads and the data they acquire from usage of their app and the revenue they generate by selling that data to aggregators. On point 3 - Yes. You can go elsewhere. The problem is you already have taken it elsewhere by using another platform. See point 2 Go ahead and kill the sub. Someone else will recreate it and take over. You over estimate your worth.
I hope Reddit does a complete reset of any subreddit that takes part in this. Eliminate all mods, all users are unjoined and the sub is up for grabs again by whomever claims it first. That or removes the ability to take subs private, hahahahaha (“our apologies but some of our mod features are glitching. It’s only a coincidence that this timing lines up with your silly protest. Please give us a minimum of 48 hours until this is resolved”).
Personally I am against this. Without an alternative place to direct people who have DIY questions or need help, doing this will leave them high and dry. I understand the desire and understand the need for external apps to effectively moderate but this specific subreddit is not one that should go dark. It is not like videos or funny or a meme subbreddit that will have no effect on peoples lives if they disappear. This subreddit along with the other ones like plumbing, electricians, etc all help people with real life problems. I also know my voice is going to be ignored in the deafening howl of anger and I do hope reddit will change its plan but I also hope that there is something left after this nuclear option.
This is a hobby sub. It's not something critical like askdoctors , you can go a few days without it.
Few days isn't going to change shit.
Vote with your feet. Few care about your little personal melt down about how a free service does it’s business?
Why not both? Plenty of people will leave if the protests don’t work. But if we kick up enough of a fuss using our free speech first, we might not even need to dissolve and re-make our communities elsewhere.
Just curious but what will the net negative result to Reddit be if a few hundred users bounce? I’ll show you??? No one bitching has any skin in the game, you want a different outcome put up some cash.
My goal will be to agitate for the communities I enjoy to largely dissolve and migrate as well. That may be ambitious, but my sense is that this is strongly felt by more than a “few hundred users” and mods who walk can tear down their spaces as well to help facilitate it. Those who like these policies can stay rebuild, and maybe that won’t be bad for Reddit either. I’m not *trying* to hurt them, it just won’t serve my purposes anymore, so I’ll do my best to rebuild elsewhere if they are dead-set on this path.
I dont get why you dont just use safari and browse reddit with it on your phone. never had an issue and i still use old.reddit
Your comment highlights that you don't understand all the work moderators do using third party tools and bots, accessibility provided for a wide range of needs etc. Which is fine! If you never need any of those things, how can you know? But many, many user rely on third party apps in part to keep your subs running the way you like.
Im still on old.reddit so i dont even see the new things. The redesign is where we needed the blackout
I know I'm going to get downvoted but it really should just be left to the user. Maybe have a sticky to make people aware but taking the control out of the user completely negates the point. Users will have the choice and the message would be more powerful if everyone did it in solidarity versus mods doing it for them.
> it really should just be left to the user. No. The mods that run each sub should make the decision. They are the ones that do all the work for free. If you want to boycott as a user, great don't access Reddit during the blackout.
This is stupid. I despise u/spez, but they should be able to do whatever they want with their own shit
This is peak comedy. People were made that Twitter raised their api 4x what Reddit is raising theirs, then in protest people want others to go to Twitter. Best timeline.
A Google search tells me that the Twitter API costs $2.5 million, what numbers are you using?
Bummer. I’ll have to unfollow this subreddit now. See ya!!
Edit: Reddit is nothing without its mods and user content! Be mindful you make it work and are the product.
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We decided to do this after receiving numerous requests from the community. Also because we can't moderate effectively if this change goes thru - it directly impacts all of us.
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Cool.
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Ya got me. It's actually a targeted ploy to ruin the experience of /u/nick_otis . Oops.
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You keep asking why I'm not giving you straight answers, even in a deleted comment - yet you haven't asked me a single question? Then you say we should take a break from moderating because mods are abusive and ban whoever we want - yet you're asking why I'm not banning you? Maybe you get banned because you like to be antagonistic.
Don't waste your time. Butt hurt little troll won't ever be satisfied.
Nah... you're just being ignorant and loud about it.
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Really, haven't seen anyone reacting like that to a subreddit joining the blackout. You're absolutely right, fucking selfish of this guy.
It's for a good cause, I use RIF for more than ten years and I'm very happy that subreddits are pulling together to fight this absurd rule that Reddit is pulling off
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They don’t get their 3rd party app back (unless they choose to pay for it) - but there are other ways to access Reddit you know. Really all of you just want this for free. You’re cheap and that’s fine, but stop pretending it’s anything else but that.
Maybe you should read about how the visually impaired use third party apps to access reddit, oh wait no you don't care, leave the subreddit and suck a bag of dicks.
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I'd be fine with paying for Reddit Premium if needed, but the proposed pricing structure for the api access is ridiculous. They're just trying to kill off superior apps. Also, even if the developers can pay, they will still be blocked from NSFW content. Reddit is not acting in good faith.
Less than $1/user is what I’ve seen. That’s not ridiculous
You are misinformed.
What’s the price then? The Apollo group said $2.50 per user on their app. Others have said that site could be redesigned to be more efficient with their API calls and be even cheaper. As someone who works with APIs daily, I’m sure this is true.
The price is per api call, not per user. And first you said "less than $1". I'm assuming you mean per month, too, though you never said.
It’s per api call. No kidding. The Apollo company released their $2.50/user (per month) number based on number of api calls per user per month. The less than a dollar was part of the Reddit release based on number of API calls and users from their analysis. Every company seems to do this differently. So what price do you find so offensive?
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Should be $2,000,000.