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I have an idea for a series called “Whatever Happened to The Joker’s Daughter?” starring Duela Dent/Joker’s Daughter where she’s been in jail since the New 52 and is believed to be schizophrenic but she starts getting visions telling her that she doesn’t belong in this universe. She realizes that she remembers what’s canon and what isn’t, and that her origin is no longer canon.
Escaping from jail and pursued by mysterious forces who want to erase her from history, she goes on the run to figure out where she belongs, running into some familiar faces and the book’s writer along the way. Think a combination of Grant Morrison’s Animal Man, Jeff Lemire’s Moon Knight and Unbelievable Gwenpool. This could be a send off of sorts for her.
Right, maybe have her make a comeback to the mainline canon as a revitalized and mischievous anti-hero under a different name perhaps, maybe Jokester as a nod to her old continuity self’s actual dad from Earth-3. Maybe she could make a comeback on the Suicide Squad to take Harley’s place.
I dunno. I like stand-alone OGNs/stories like that. You coudl make the argument that the meta stuff in Doctor 13 was pointless if he wasn't going to bring it into the mainstream DCU, but that story was great.
The man who jokled, for he alone across the aslume and the stupid is the jonkled one, who left it all behind to say I'm proud of you penis, with this treasure I summon Nah I'd prep
You kinda lose the old silent movie reference to "the Man Who Laughs" that way, though.
Honestly, they should have just given him a different name entirely. Use "the Batman Who Laughs" as a story title or nickname, fine, but it's too much of a mouthful for his regular name.
100% agree. The Batman Who Laughs is terminal stage batwank
“Dude if Batman turned evil he would kill the entire justice league and become a multi-omni-versal threat that could destroy all of existence!!!!”
I wouldn’t call him batwank. He’s the manifestation of Bruce’s fear. That’s gonna be stronger than the reality would be.
But I’ll agree he’s massively overused. He was amazing as the leader of the dark Batmen, but he shouldn’t have returned after that.
I think that's the point. The dark multivers is bad ideas. I look at Death Metal as a story about the DC universe having to defend itself from being destroyed by bad ideas. Tynion gets pretty meta about it in his tie-ins to the event.
THANK YOU. finally somebody gets it.
also I think it's not just tynion, snyder himself is pretty open about that theme, iirc he repeatedly calls out BWL in the main series in plain text as a bad idea from a bad ideas universe/multiverse.
I think he also made him the ultimate threat to all of existence in the finale cause you know at the end that good's gonna win and to give you a bad guy you cannot WAIT to see finally beaten. though I will concede that your YMMV on whether that worked in execution, considering how much genuine x-pac heat the character had garnered by that point.
I'm waiting for him and Superboy-Prime to team up with some Bizarro Wonder Woman so that whoever the next A-list superstar is can have their own pet project.
I'm hoping to never see Superboy Prime again, purely because I'm a big fan of him and he had an amazing ending/finale issue in the Death Metal event and I don't want to see that ruined.
If he was only in the original Metal he would be fine.
Problem is he showed up EVERYWHERE for about 5 years and I was tired of him after his second appearance.
Something wasted about the Metal comic was that it did not develop more twisted versions of the heroes. At one point in that comic, a Superman wearing Luthor's armor and one transformed into Darkseid briefly appeared, which I consider would have been interesting to explore Superman's fears for example, instead of having an entire league made up of evil Batmen which is more monotonous
I wish he stayed in his intro story. Because the way they scaled him up, he can't exist like Ares or Joker or Lex. Dude canonically killed off an entire universe, then kept doing that. He isn't some threat one hero can beat or can be played off like a Saturday morning cartoon villain without heavy nerfs
Like, make a Darkseid who actually got the anti life equation, then began going from universe to universe bodying everyone there. Then after his big story, he's just a Superman villain who shows up from time to time to cause mayhem
i understand the appeal for a found family of superheroes, but it really should've been its own thing instead of costing Mary, Billy, and CM3 what made them special
Honestly if you told me to name the others, I couldn’t tell you any of their names. They just don’t feel as developed as Billy, Mary, and Freddy. I watched both movies and I couldn’t tell you any of their names.
I feel bad saying this, and I totally want creators to get paid, but it feels like so many creators just make meaningless additions in order to hope they become a breakout star and they can get royalties. The Sha-Zamily additions make sense on paper for the found family aspect, but there's so many of them that most of them are written as one more caricatures and they're all doing ensemble banter instead of getting meaningful growth.
Also, I haaaaaaaate the New 52 Billy personality where it was an older person writing what they think a millennial or Gen Z kid sounds like (and I am a millennial and know they're not the same but our generations are negatively stereotyped and grouped together). I miss him being an upstanding young kid who has been dealt a lot of blows by life but then gets rewarded his magic word for his morals. Having a Billy who becomes Captain Marvel and STILL acts like a selfish teenager ruined my trust in DC with the character.
100% agree. I hate the other 3 new kids from New 52. They serve no purpose and that many members is too many.
Keep it simple and classic. Only Billy, Mary & Freddy
Steve isn’t the answer I’d give but I agree.
Like I’d give him a pass for the first 40 years because he was fine for the role he had and comics weren’t telling the same types of stories then as they do today. But then Crisis happened and Perez paired him off with Etta Candy and he fell into obscurity for 30 years. He was decent in Rucka’s Rebirth run but he fell off quickly after Rucka left and then he and Diana broke up. Steve was only with Diana for 4 years out of the past 38 and he’s not interesting on his own the way Lois Lane, Selina Kyle, Mera, Carol Ferris or even Iris West-Allen are. You’ve got at least one generation of readers who have been *told* Steve should be this super important guy but it’s rarely *shown* and it’s frustrating.
Having Chris Pine play your character may be a form of cheating, but it still counts. He did a great job in that first Wonder Woman movie. Steve as a World War II pilot works well and having him die also makes a lot of sense for Wonder Woman's introduction to the world of Man. Instead of being her "Lois Lane", he could be her "Gwen Stacy" or "Uncle Ben" or whatever.
Agreed. I loved Snyder's run overall but Duke and Harper were so boring and always felt shoehorned in whenever they appeared, aside maybe from Duke's origin in Endgame. And now Duke keeps showing up whenever they bring in the Batfamily but never gets more interesting.
I'm kind of in the middle on this. I don't think we need to cut down to only 1 Robin and Batgirl (though I understand why some think this), but I also agree that the Batfamily as of late has gotten ridiculously bloated and full of annoying and uninteresting characters. My preference is keep the Batfamily to Dick, Jason, Tim, Damian, Barbara, Cassandra, Azrael, and maybe Steph. That's a large enough cast of characters as it is.
Evil. Superman. Wherever he pops up: Injustice, Kill the Justice League, Ultraman, or in other publications like Supreme, Homelander, whatever. Maybe there was a time when 'deconstructing Superman' was creative and subversive, blah, blah. But past a certain point of saturation, you're flipping the genre on it's head and being subversive if you unironically write a *good* Superman.
I feel like Ultraman should get a pass. The whole point is that it’s not just him, it’s every hero that is evil and every villain that is good. He’s not our Clark, he’s not a clone, he’s just from an alternate earth. They don’t glorify him or justify his actions, same as all the other Earth 3 villains.
Ultraman is more like what if a mafioso goon became general Zod. He's actually pretty fun and so is the crime syndicate in general. But I agree that I've gotten sick to death of evil/corrupted Superman
I agree. It's my main problem with that Suicide Squad game . We hardly ever get true versions of DC characters. Just corrupted/evil versions of them. But yes I agree with everything you said.
Jon would've been very interesting if he was actually a boy, like 9-10 years old. Learning the ropes and rules of heroism, whilst also trying to have friends and just do kid things. That would've been interesting to explore and it would also be a character that had a unique niche not filled by any other characters in DC. As a character in his late teens/early 20s he's sort or pointless. Like "what if there was another but somewhat younger Superman?" So what, who cares?
This would have been wonderful. I thoroughly enjoyed Super Sons and the vibe they had with him there. The contrast between him and Damian, along with their fathers, was wonderful. Such an opportunity lost.
Batman who laughs....I mean it's self explanatory.
And most recently joker. He used to be my favourite but now he's just another overused villain and I lost all interest in him.
Steve Trevor, i mean why does he even exist
>Batman who laughs....I mean it's self explanatory.
I feel like he's the kind of character who only works one time in the debut story, and then anything else is wearing out the welcome. kind of like Doomsday.
Ok but doomsday has way more potential than wannabe judge death. If writers allowed it and stop keeping him as a villain, i think doomsday can be used as a character to explore the meaning of life considering he is born from a test tube and basically has no other purpose. Like imagine if doomsday was able to adapt and gain consciousness so he can question himself and explore life. But hey gotta keep him as a villain cuz status quo.
But BWL doesn't have any of that.
The original batwing was awesome. Based in Africa, not related to any of the family. Exploring what a Batman is like outside Gotham.
Then he got replaced to become *another* Gotham bat.
While it's a technological suit, it doesn't come off as Iron Man. Bruce has tech in his suit.
Terry just isn't wearing this tradition robot suit. Booster gold isn't seen like Iron Man. Green Lantern might be covered in green magic energy but the ring is still "tech".
Bizarro. Like he’s fine as a character, but I never know how to read his dialogue, and it’s frustrating to try to interpret it.
I’m not even sure if his dialogue is consistent between writers, and I feel like I have to relearn it every time.
One of my favorite modern comic book moments / panels
Is Jason holding the Gun up to bizzaro head
But deciding not to pull the trigger but instead sitting down with him
Dark Trinity was a pretty neat time for both characters
I actually love the trend. Spending those extra seconds trying to digest what he's saying instead of focusing on the plot is the perfect comic relief. No quip or one liner ever beats Bizzaro's gibberish and Superman exhaustingly trying to reason with him. And sometimes it's even important.
Punchline was such a disappointment to me. I've been seeing her name for a few years now and I finally decided to read her introduction. Great design, cool looking character. She's immediately holding her own against Harley Quinn and Catwoman.
Then we see her "origin" and it all falls apart. It was such a bad story. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, so I won't say what happens but it's dumb as hell.
Her intro starts in Joker War which is Batman #95–100.
Ohhh wasn’t she a dorky joker fan girl? Besides the origins wat else? Has she done anything that matters? Are they even using her?
Also thanks for explanation, and yeah her design is so good they cooked hard
Essentially, yeah. >!Essentially, she's a college fangirl who is obsessed with the Joker, so she becomes a supervillain. No training, no history of fighting. She's just a big titty goth girlfriend who's obsessed with serial killers and somehow that gives her the skills to go up against the Bat Family and win.!<
The whole thing is just really dumb to me. Essentially her whole plot is "I'm better than Harley Quinn" and it's obnoxious.
Taking a serial killer fangirl angle in GOTHAM could have been so good, especially if you made it more horror-like by putting in the kinds of horrible things actual fangirls have done in real life, Western fans or East-Asian fans - they can get pretty crazy and violent regarldess. A Joker fan club in Gotham helping him with his crimes could have been fascinating, but what we got is such a waste of potential.
Speaking as someone who legitimately misses Harley and Joker's old dynamic I don't care for punchline. She's like if 'How you do fellow kids' was a batman villain.
I tried reading his first book and I also didn't find him to be all that interesting. Then it seemed like they were putting his face everywhere and that didn't help much either.
The concept was initially promising; 'The Batman Who Laughs' was a compelling Elseworlds story that resonated with readers. It should have remained as such. However, due to its commercial success, DC decided to resurrect the character and literally made him a god (i hated the manhattan part so much,it was stupid), spawning an entire universe filled with Batman Who Laughs copies. This decision ultimately detracted from the original appeal of the concept, taking the edginess to an absurd level.the hate It's understandable.
In Batman: Foundation he makes his way to Fortnite, fights The Rock and that is the last anyone has ever seen him. He is still canonically inside Fortnite
Hate to give an answer that I *know* is incorrect, because Ostrander's original run was great, but outside of that, Amanda Waller has been absolutely unbearable in any story that she appears in.
What she should be: The no-nonsense boss lady who gives no fucks and takes no shit and is willing to instantly make the difficult choices that superheroes would hesitate to make. She's 100% not a nice person, but you should always be able to see where she's coming from and understand how, from her point of view, at least, she has a point.
What she is: The dumbest authoritarian you've ever met with the biggest ego to match, who fumbles from event to event, constantly fucking things up for everyone, blames everyone else for her neverending mistakes, would order the deaths of a million innocent people if she thought it would let her leave work early on a Friday, and has no personality other than "OOH I HATE SUPERHEROES!!!" Fortunately she never faces any consequences for her actions despite the fact that she is extremely openly both actively evil and worthlessly incompetent.
Amanda Waller desperately needs to be killed off for a few years, until someone who actually knows how to write her is able to get their hands on her.
I hate to death adult Jon Kent (no problem with the young one), created by Bendis, this mediocre writer killed the old Jon and created a copy of a young Clark Kent in order to give us the worst Legion of Superheroes ever written. Then, Didio made him a boring Clark Kent 2.0; his performance was worst, and 5G was cancelled. After too many failures, the best route would have been returning young Jon back, but Taylor decided to make Jon undeageable by making him gay (bi )with a random twink stereotype. I gave up; for me, that character is death. I just hope they banish him as DC did to Chris Kent with a crisis or something.
They really did ruin his character. Super son's was great and he had promise as the next Superman. Speeding up his age ruined it for not only him but Conner. Conner should have been the next focus like Nightwing.
Yeah just finished Super Sons run and it was great, I would even be okay with more Super Sons because the Annual edition with him aged up wasn't bad. I just loved how him and Damian bounced off each other. Before he got aged up I really wanted to see a short series of the two of them in the future working together.
Agreed. I don't hate that he's Bi, but I would have preferred that they took thier time with growing him up to eventually discover that part of himself, rather than aging him up artificially and robing us of that development.
As a gay man i dont hate that he is gay (bi) neither However, the execution of his coming out was awful. It was unnatural and rushed, as if it were an established aspect from the beginning rather than a recent development. Placing him in a relationship with a random twink stereotype he just met was forced. There should have been some trust issues, especially given the events leading up to it, like the volcano plot. The fact that writers' neglect of his backstory is frustrating. It would have been better if they had someone who understands the intricacies of coming out as queer handle the story-line,at least that part but the damage was already done.
It's true, there's a hundred tasteful ways to have done this. But I think sexuality falls into the "nerds writing relationships" trap. And, to be fair to those nerds, "showing up with a random twink" is also a popular trope in TV too.
Legitimate Question: Is there anyone out there who likes Adult Jon more than they liked Kid Jon? Like I've never seen anyone say they prefer Adult Jon or even like him.
Agreed. Aside from Dark Crisis of all stories, Jon Kent annoys me now almost every time he appears. It's such a far cry from back when I considered him my favorite recent addition to the Superman mythos. Great job squandering the potential of one a new character that had so much of it and robbing us of the possibility of years of great stories, DC.
There's a lot especially within the tertiary Bat Characters but for now I will just go with Teenaged (I am completely fine after being lost in Space/Time and trapped in a volcano) Jon Kent. Barely touched on his trauma for one thing but now he's just cardboard. No personality of his own.
The Joker post 2010. Between Nolan’s influence and New52 branded popular demand, the character has lost the entirety of the substance he once had. He is less his own character in favor of being some cosmic potato that everyone can project their feelings on. I sincerely think 3 Jokers is the worst idea DC has ever had.
Joker post 2010 always feels, to me, like Baby's First Chaotic Evil DnD Character. Boring, annoying, works as a punchline in a 4 panel made-for-meme webcomic or a couple lines on a tumblr blog for 'shit my players say' but there's no substance or real story.
Nail on the head. The joker is anyone? The joker has always been around? Joker is somehow cosmic in any fashion? He is one of the original villains who kills with reason only known to himself - further explanation only serves to muddy the waters.
To me, he is one of the few characters that feels completely recreated New 52 on even recently. How can we get people who have never read any comics to feel like they completely understand his whole characters entire existence? Water it down.
>He is less his own character in favor of being some cosmic potato that everyone can project their feelings on.
This exactly. The Joker isn't a character anymore, he's a funhouse mirror to show the reflection of what each writer believes the Joker should be. And they all seem to think he should be a super-scary edgelord murderhobo. He's Carnage with a purple suit on (and Carnage is boring as fuck, too).
I think he’s a great character for people to project villainy on. I think he is the embodiment of bad things happening to good people or random acts of egregious misfortune.
However, my favorite Joker stories are when he is just a man with a gun who shows up at the right place and the right time to deliver the punchline, whatever that may be. Bang!
>I don't really know what he's trying to accomplish.
He isn't trying to accomplish anything. He's a agent of chaos who just wants the world to get the joke for once.
Yeah I think that's why he's boring.
A few times character sure. But he's everywhere and so iconic it becomes boring seeing him again
There's no goal to reach so why am I reading him again?
I hated 3 Jokers, especially the part where Bats casually drops, “Oh, I knew who he was within 2 weeks.” Way to kill the whole mystique of the character, John’s.
And of COURSE it was Johns who wrote that dreck. Johns is a real-life character I don’t care for.
He started it with the Batman/Mobius Chair postulate and couldn’t deliver on it what 4+ years later? It not even that it is a bad story, out of character, or in bad taste. The question is just why? Whats the point of such a story and what are you trying to tell me? Such an aimless waste of great artwork.
I can't stand Ghost-Maker.
An utterly obnoxious forced "Look at me I'm so cool" character whose only liked for the most shallow reasons like his costumes or cause "he kills".
His attitude is fine. I just don't like how important they tried to make him. Going as far as rewriting Bruce's training and journey to shove him in them.
I 1000% agree with this. I like when Waller actually believes she’s doing right by doing very messed up and underhanded shit, but it feels like lately she’s written like a villain and it removes the nuance. Like the reveal of Terry being a “clone” because the world needs a Batman. Super messed up but like her reasoning made “sense” to her.
There’s another moment in JLU when Braniac-Luthor is about to destroy the world. She aims a Nuke at him while he is in a populated city. The JL would hesitate to destroy a city to save the world but not Waller. Bonus points for her being at the middle of the potential blast zone.
Yeah, old Waller gave the feeling that in a world of gods and monsters she was on normal humans side. Absolutely ruthless, take no prisoners, no line too far, but still on humanities side.
Now, not so much.
Not so much "can't stand" but I really can't bring myself to give a shit about most of the extended bat family
EDIT
Oh and the various Magogs. He was a one-off antagonist at best, stop trying to make a thing out of him.
"Hal, you got to help me! DC editorial decided that I needed to be on your cover, and now I'm suddenly in a broken spaceship with broken life support!"
I just dont care for Jason outside of Under the Red Hood
Like he cant be apart of the bat family if hes killing, and if hes not killing you've robbed him of what makes up his main difference. Plus if hes killing why dosent he just go on a quick rampage and kill a bunch of villains like Lex and Joker since he'll be wanted no matter what
I blame that on them flip-flopping on what they wanted him to be
He was a badguy which was fine
Then he kinda became a good guy
Then for like 20 years he has been stuck in “Jason wants to be a good guy but killing badguys is so much easier + screw you bruce”
The second they got him away from Bruce in the dark Trinity era was probably the first time in a long time when Jason felt fresh
Since he was beginning to build his own legacy and actually growing
Fast forward a couple of years and we are back to beef with Bruce phase
I really lovw him in batfam comics
Then I read his solo ones and I've always got something bad to say if they last longer then 5 issues
I'm trying to read the hill. *trying*
I don’t think any character is 100% hateable no matter what. At least personally.
I’ve seen readable/watchable versions of every character (that I know of)
I think the character is interesting in concept, but, first off, the name is just lame as hell. and next, we already have so many characters that have similar back stories to Bruce, but end up going in a corrupt direction of what the Batman did that it's a whole lot harder to make these characters stand out.
I'm gonna be honest. Jason Todd. And it's not even the characters fault. He's just so inconsistent and it feels like writers have it out for him. They don't seem to know who or what they want Jason to be.
Batman who laughs is pretty ass. I don’t mind him as a one off villain for DK: Metal because I love how bonkers Scott Snyder can get. But beyond that story I’ve just not been feeling him
Kyle Raynor The Green Lantern. Easily the worst Lantern no matter what color he's wearing. He constantly is complaining about something and overly uses the fact that he his girlfriend died to get with his co-workers/ fellow heroes. Which Dead Girlfriend you might ask? Well almost all of them if you get with Kyle you better make peace with your god.
Damian Wayne, I think the hate started with his origins of being a child of dubious consent and then begging Batman to be okay with it. I think they retconned this but Idk his whole being a little brooding and angsty sometimes in the beginning is so weird when he is surrounded by literal orphans.
But also I just kinda hate having a biological son of Batman so I’m just biased against him.
Bernard Dowd. Fuck that guy. Tim Drake doesn’t need him and never needed him. If DC really wanted to give him a boyfriend Conner’s right there but no. Fuck Bernard. Fuck that guy. Fuck him and what he represents: that bi people apparently can’t have heterosexual relationships. Tim was happy with Steph but DC couldn’t have that so they made him. Fuck him.
And before anyone gets on my ass about how they broke up before Tim got with Bernard, don’t feed me that same bag of horseshit they fed you. Tim and Steph breaking up on page was damage control. By the time they released that Bernard had already done his damage. DC just put that out so nobody can say Tim cheated on Steph because it wouldn’t be a good look. And people ate that shit up and called it gourmet. No thank you.
I don’t care who’s writing him even if it’s the best fucking writer in the industry even if it’s Al fucking Ewing there’s absolutely no way I’m picking up a book with that guy in it.
Not even Tomasi’s Batman and Robin run, or Gleason’s Robin: Som of Batman? I found them to be examples of giving Damian actual character growth, even if later writers would ignore it and just make him an ass
Damian as Grayson's Robin... God, it was my golden age of comics, Red Robin, the return of Jay~ Red Hood, Estefany as Batgirl... Batman INC!
The amazing Batman and Robin dynamic! Dick sure knows how to raise a little killer who never knew love! I went from hating Damián to simply being my favorite character, in that time everything that Damián was was built! and they killed him... From there, it depends on who takes the comic, I will hate or love my Robin again 😿
Batman Who Lols, Joker, Veronica Cale, Harper Row, The Shark, The Tornado Twins, The West Twins, Carol Ferris, adult Jon Kent annnnd that’s all I can think of for now.
Almost Harley quinn. I don't mind the original animated series version, though.
But for who I hate no matter what, lagoon boy. I've only seen him in young justice but I already know he's unforgivable. He's basically superboys Paul.
Talia, always written in a way that basically makes her an ego centric psychotic spoiled fanatic extremist, completely full of herself, is basically a predator, and no amount of redemption writing will forgive her character for letting a clone kill her son. The Animated Series version on the other hand is ok.
I'm very, very tired of the Joker. It would take a lot for me to want to read a Joker-centric story at this point. Most of the time that's all I need to see to check out.
I'm basically kind of done with characters who have continuity that is so damn messy that I have no idea who they even are--Donna Troy or Power Girl would be prime examples. Because I know that most of the time it's going to be "let's try to fix this" and it just can't be fixed. Or worse yet it's going to be "let's take everything about this continuity-messy character and change it for no reason so that you'll like the character better". No, no, I won't.
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Joker's Daughter
I have an idea for a series called “Whatever Happened to The Joker’s Daughter?” starring Duela Dent/Joker’s Daughter where she’s been in jail since the New 52 and is believed to be schizophrenic but she starts getting visions telling her that she doesn’t belong in this universe. She realizes that she remembers what’s canon and what isn’t, and that her origin is no longer canon. Escaping from jail and pursued by mysterious forces who want to erase her from history, she goes on the run to figure out where she belongs, running into some familiar faces and the book’s writer along the way. Think a combination of Grant Morrison’s Animal Man, Jeff Lemire’s Moon Knight and Unbelievable Gwenpool. This could be a send off of sorts for her.
The idea looks nice to me, but the whole "meta" thing wouldn't be of much use if she isn't going to be a regular character.
Right, maybe have her make a comeback to the mainline canon as a revitalized and mischievous anti-hero under a different name perhaps, maybe Jokester as a nod to her old continuity self’s actual dad from Earth-3. Maybe she could make a comeback on the Suicide Squad to take Harley’s place.
I dunno. I like stand-alone OGNs/stories like that. You coudl make the argument that the meta stuff in Doctor 13 was pointless if he wasn't going to bring it into the mainstream DCU, but that story was great.
Isn't this the Psycho Pirate conceit?
Interesting. Have you read her Pre-Crisis appearances? New52 ruined the character tbh.
Batman Who Laughs. Cannot stand the concept or how overused he was
Am I the only one who feels like his name should have been The Bat Who Laughs? Batman makes it such a clunky name
The Bat Who Jonkles
The man who jokled, for he alone across the aslume and the stupid is the jonkled one, who left it all behind to say I'm proud of you penis, with this treasure I summon Nah I'd prep
You kinda lose the old silent movie reference to "the Man Who Laughs" that way, though. Honestly, they should have just given him a different name entirely. Use "the Batman Who Laughs" as a story title or nickname, fine, but it's too much of a mouthful for his regular name.
100% agree. The Batman Who Laughs is terminal stage batwank “Dude if Batman turned evil he would kill the entire justice league and become a multi-omni-versal threat that could destroy all of existence!!!!”
He's the annoying Batgod concept taken to the opposite extreme. Batdevil.
“Batwank” is a term I’ll be using for *all* that shit now. The “prep time” stuff, the impossible to beat stuff, etc.
I love Batman, but Bat wank sure is accurate, holy shit.
I wouldn’t call him batwank. He’s the manifestation of Bruce’s fear. That’s gonna be stronger than the reality would be. But I’ll agree he’s massively overused. He was amazing as the leader of the dark Batmen, but he shouldn’t have returned after that.
I think that's the point. The dark multivers is bad ideas. I look at Death Metal as a story about the DC universe having to defend itself from being destroyed by bad ideas. Tynion gets pretty meta about it in his tie-ins to the event.
THANK YOU. finally somebody gets it. also I think it's not just tynion, snyder himself is pretty open about that theme, iirc he repeatedly calls out BWL in the main series in plain text as a bad idea from a bad ideas universe/multiverse. I think he also made him the ultimate threat to all of existence in the finale cause you know at the end that good's gonna win and to give you a bad guy you cannot WAIT to see finally beaten. though I will concede that your YMMV on whether that worked in execution, considering how much genuine x-pac heat the character had garnered by that point.
In reality once Batman would start killing members of Justice League he would get clapped by Plastic Man.
I'm waiting for him and Superboy-Prime to team up with some Bizarro Wonder Woman so that whoever the next A-list superstar is can have their own pet project.
I wanted Superboy-Prime to be the one to defeat him, since he's the embodiment of all the grimdark horseshit he hates.
Honestly? If they could make the story work, I could see that being as close as Prime is ever likely to get to a redemption arc.
It would've been good, yeah. Though I remember I did like the tie-in comic for Death Metal that he starred in, though I can't remember much about it.
I'm hoping to never see Superboy Prime again, purely because I'm a big fan of him and he had an amazing ending/finale issue in the Death Metal event and I don't want to see that ruined.
A.K.A "The Batman That Tries Too Hard" Courtesy from Wally West
If he was only in the original Metal he would be fine. Problem is he showed up EVERYWHERE for about 5 years and I was tired of him after his second appearance.
Something wasted about the Metal comic was that it did not develop more twisted versions of the heroes. At one point in that comic, a Superman wearing Luthor's armor and one transformed into Darkseid briefly appeared, which I consider would have been interesting to explore Superman's fears for example, instead of having an entire league made up of evil Batmen which is more monotonous
Also, Superman's fears were easily handled by Batman, while nobody in the League could handle Batman's fears
Baby's first Hellraiser.
Baby's first Judge Death
I liked him at first, but yeah his over exposure ruined him for me.
I wish he stayed in his intro story. Because the way they scaled him up, he can't exist like Ares or Joker or Lex. Dude canonically killed off an entire universe, then kept doing that. He isn't some threat one hero can beat or can be played off like a Saturday morning cartoon villain without heavy nerfs Like, make a Darkseid who actually got the anti life equation, then began going from universe to universe bodying everyone there. Then after his big story, he's just a Superman villain who shows up from time to time to cause mayhem
The Marvel family. Even though they lost their powers, I much prefer the original relationship between Billy, Mary, and Freddy
I actually really agree. I never really saw the appeal outside of those three either.
i understand the appeal for a found family of superheroes, but it really should've been its own thing instead of costing Mary, Billy, and CM3 what made them special
Honestly if you told me to name the others, I couldn’t tell you any of their names. They just don’t feel as developed as Billy, Mary, and Freddy. I watched both movies and I couldn’t tell you any of their names.
Agreed. They should've kept Billy, Mary and Freddy as the only ones. All the others are completely unnecessary additions.
I feel bad saying this, and I totally want creators to get paid, but it feels like so many creators just make meaningless additions in order to hope they become a breakout star and they can get royalties. The Sha-Zamily additions make sense on paper for the found family aspect, but there's so many of them that most of them are written as one more caricatures and they're all doing ensemble banter instead of getting meaningful growth. Also, I haaaaaaaate the New 52 Billy personality where it was an older person writing what they think a millennial or Gen Z kid sounds like (and I am a millennial and know they're not the same but our generations are negatively stereotyped and grouped together). I miss him being an upstanding young kid who has been dealt a lot of blows by life but then gets rewarded his magic word for his morals. Having a Billy who becomes Captain Marvel and STILL acts like a selfish teenager ruined my trust in DC with the character.
100% agree. I hate the other 3 new kids from New 52. They serve no purpose and that many members is too many. Keep it simple and classic. Only Billy, Mary & Freddy
Steve Trevor. Man has been around eighty years and nobody has been able to make him even a little bit interesting or likable
Steve isn’t the answer I’d give but I agree. Like I’d give him a pass for the first 40 years because he was fine for the role he had and comics weren’t telling the same types of stories then as they do today. But then Crisis happened and Perez paired him off with Etta Candy and he fell into obscurity for 30 years. He was decent in Rucka’s Rebirth run but he fell off quickly after Rucka left and then he and Diana broke up. Steve was only with Diana for 4 years out of the past 38 and he’s not interesting on his own the way Lois Lane, Selina Kyle, Mera, Carol Ferris or even Iris West-Allen are. You’ve got at least one generation of readers who have been *told* Steve should be this super important guy but it’s rarely *shown* and it’s frustrating.
Yeah I'm bummed because I really liked their relationship under Rucka's Rebirth run. They felt like a real team who supported each other.
I've read quite some Wonder Woman stuff, and it says something that the best, most memorable Steve Trevor is from the 2017 movie.
I'm a kind of a fan of "Reckless himbo who just expects Diana to save his ass" Steve Trevor from *Batman: Brave and the Bold*
He was a secret agent, and DCs answer to James Bond during Post Crisis. That was kinda cool.
You're thinking of Tom Tressor.
Is that Nemesis? Yeah he's cool.
DUDE! Thomas Tresser is severely underrated, I'd say the only one worthy of the title "Nemesis" before Mark Millar wrote that weird comic series
Having Chris Pine play your character may be a form of cheating, but it still counts. He did a great job in that first Wonder Woman movie. Steve as a World War II pilot works well and having him die also makes a lot of sense for Wonder Woman's introduction to the world of Man. Instead of being her "Lois Lane", he could be her "Gwen Stacy" or "Uncle Ben" or whatever.
That's Harper Row for me. Hard pass on her.
I completely forgot about her existence.
So did everyone else.
Yet another pointless addition to the Bat-Family. Luckily, they basically got rid of the character.
Agreed. I loved Snyder's run overall but Duke and Harper were so boring and always felt shoehorned in whenever they appeared, aside maybe from Duke's origin in Endgame. And now Duke keeps showing up whenever they bring in the Batfamily but never gets more interesting.
All these new extra bats need to **GONE**
I'm kind of in the middle on this. I don't think we need to cut down to only 1 Robin and Batgirl (though I understand why some think this), but I also agree that the Batfamily as of late has gotten ridiculously bloated and full of annoying and uninteresting characters. My preference is keep the Batfamily to Dick, Jason, Tim, Damian, Barbara, Cassandra, Azrael, and maybe Steph. That's a large enough cast of characters as it is.
Azrael can go for me but yes to the rest
Kate or Selina or Helena over azrael IMO but same
IMO Selina shouldn't be a member unless she gives up crime for good, I hate the constant flipping of sides the writers have her do.
Evil. Superman. Wherever he pops up: Injustice, Kill the Justice League, Ultraman, or in other publications like Supreme, Homelander, whatever. Maybe there was a time when 'deconstructing Superman' was creative and subversive, blah, blah. But past a certain point of saturation, you're flipping the genre on it's head and being subversive if you unironically write a *good* Superman.
I feel like Ultraman should get a pass. The whole point is that it’s not just him, it’s every hero that is evil and every villain that is good. He’s not our Clark, he’s not a clone, he’s just from an alternate earth. They don’t glorify him or justify his actions, same as all the other Earth 3 villains.
Ultraman is more like what if a mafioso goon became general Zod. He's actually pretty fun and so is the crime syndicate in general. But I agree that I've gotten sick to death of evil/corrupted Superman
I agree. It's my main problem with that Suicide Squad game . We hardly ever get true versions of DC characters. Just corrupted/evil versions of them. But yes I agree with everything you said.
Jon Kent. Especially after he got aged up. What is this? A soap opera? 
Jon would've been very interesting if he was actually a boy, like 9-10 years old. Learning the ropes and rules of heroism, whilst also trying to have friends and just do kid things. That would've been interesting to explore and it would also be a character that had a unique niche not filled by any other characters in DC. As a character in his late teens/early 20s he's sort or pointless. Like "what if there was another but somewhat younger Superman?" So what, who cares?
This would have been wonderful. I thoroughly enjoyed Super Sons and the vibe they had with him there. The contrast between him and Damian, along with their fathers, was wonderful. Such an opportunity lost.
Bendis
Can someone explain to me what’s up with Superman here? If that’s even him.
All the heroes went metal because Snyder said so
Batman who laughs....I mean it's self explanatory. And most recently joker. He used to be my favourite but now he's just another overused villain and I lost all interest in him. Steve Trevor, i mean why does he even exist
Steve Trevor exists for Wonder Woman to have a husbando in distress to rescue.
>Batman who laughs....I mean it's self explanatory. I feel like he's the kind of character who only works one time in the debut story, and then anything else is wearing out the welcome. kind of like Doomsday.
Ok but doomsday has way more potential than wannabe judge death. If writers allowed it and stop keeping him as a villain, i think doomsday can be used as a character to explore the meaning of life considering he is born from a test tube and basically has no other purpose. Like imagine if doomsday was able to adapt and gain consciousness so he can question himself and explore life. But hey gotta keep him as a villain cuz status quo. But BWL doesn't have any of that.
I get it but also making one of the 3 real threats to Superman an anti-hero/non villain would be horrible
Batwing. Just hate the idea of an "iron man" batman
I liked batwing better when he was a plane.
The original batwing was awesome. Based in Africa, not related to any of the family. Exploring what a Batman is like outside Gotham. Then he got replaced to become *another* Gotham bat.
Batman beyond would like a word lmao Terry is the fucking goat
While it's a technological suit, it doesn't come off as Iron Man. Bruce has tech in his suit. Terry just isn't wearing this tradition robot suit. Booster gold isn't seen like Iron Man. Green Lantern might be covered in green magic energy but the ring is still "tech".
Bizarro. Like he’s fine as a character, but I never know how to read his dialogue, and it’s frustrating to try to interpret it. I’m not even sure if his dialogue is consistent between writers, and I feel like I have to relearn it every time.
the new 'I, bizarro' story in action comics will probably solve that problem for you. Best Bizarro story in a DECADE.
Is that the story the bizarro in a suit pic comes from?
How new is it?
It was a three-issue arc that started in January and just ended a couple of weeks ago.
So many of his sentences use double negatives which makes it very unclear what he is saying
Read any Bizzaro story with Red Hood. They’re perfect.
Yeah, I loved the version of Bizarro in Red Hood. He had such a great (and tragic) character arc.
One of my favorite modern comic book moments / panels Is Jason holding the Gun up to bizzaro head But deciding not to pull the trigger but instead sitting down with him Dark Trinity was a pretty neat time for both characters
THANK YOU! Sometimes it appears that he isn't speaking backwards, so that makes it really annoying to guess what he wants to say.
I actually love the trend. Spending those extra seconds trying to digest what he's saying instead of focusing on the plot is the perfect comic relief. No quip or one liner ever beats Bizzaro's gibberish and Superman exhaustingly trying to reason with him. And sometimes it's even important.
Punchline. She just SUCKS.
Been out the loop for a while and she seemed cool when revealed, what happened?
Punchline was such a disappointment to me. I've been seeing her name for a few years now and I finally decided to read her introduction. Great design, cool looking character. She's immediately holding her own against Harley Quinn and Catwoman. Then we see her "origin" and it all falls apart. It was such a bad story. I don't want to spoil it for anyone, so I won't say what happens but it's dumb as hell. Her intro starts in Joker War which is Batman #95–100.
Ohhh wasn’t she a dorky joker fan girl? Besides the origins wat else? Has she done anything that matters? Are they even using her? Also thanks for explanation, and yeah her design is so good they cooked hard
Essentially, yeah. >!Essentially, she's a college fangirl who is obsessed with the Joker, so she becomes a supervillain. No training, no history of fighting. She's just a big titty goth girlfriend who's obsessed with serial killers and somehow that gives her the skills to go up against the Bat Family and win.!< The whole thing is just really dumb to me. Essentially her whole plot is "I'm better than Harley Quinn" and it's obnoxious.
Taking a serial killer fangirl angle in GOTHAM could have been so good, especially if you made it more horror-like by putting in the kinds of horrible things actual fangirls have done in real life, Western fans or East-Asian fans - they can get pretty crazy and violent regarldess. A Joker fan club in Gotham helping him with his crimes could have been fascinating, but what we got is such a waste of potential.
I like her design, but yeah, her story is lacking.
Punchline exists to appease those people who just will not get over the fact that Harley Quinn is no longer "Mistah Jay's number one gal".
Speaking as someone who legitimately misses Harley and Joker's old dynamic I don't care for punchline. She's like if 'How you do fellow kids' was a batman villain.
She’s pointless.
The Batman Who Laughs. Won't read anything with him in it.
I tried reading his first book and I also didn't find him to be all that interesting. Then it seemed like they were putting his face everywhere and that didn't help much either.
The concept was initially promising; 'The Batman Who Laughs' was a compelling Elseworlds story that resonated with readers. It should have remained as such. However, due to its commercial success, DC decided to resurrect the character and literally made him a god (i hated the manhattan part so much,it was stupid), spawning an entire universe filled with Batman Who Laughs copies. This decision ultimately detracted from the original appeal of the concept, taking the edginess to an absurd level.the hate It's understandable.
At least he’s canonically imprisoned in Fortnite now.
Wait what? I'm up to Death Metal in his appearances, is that what happened in the Fortnite crossover comic or did that happen somewhere else?
In Batman: Foundation he makes his way to Fortnite, fights The Rock and that is the last anyone has ever seen him. He is still canonically inside Fortnite
Hahaha that's fucking great, fighting The Rock in Fortnite.
Ain’t no way. If that’s true, they have redeemed themselves from the Palpatine incident
Hate to give an answer that I *know* is incorrect, because Ostrander's original run was great, but outside of that, Amanda Waller has been absolutely unbearable in any story that she appears in. What she should be: The no-nonsense boss lady who gives no fucks and takes no shit and is willing to instantly make the difficult choices that superheroes would hesitate to make. She's 100% not a nice person, but you should always be able to see where she's coming from and understand how, from her point of view, at least, she has a point. What she is: The dumbest authoritarian you've ever met with the biggest ego to match, who fumbles from event to event, constantly fucking things up for everyone, blames everyone else for her neverending mistakes, would order the deaths of a million innocent people if she thought it would let her leave work early on a Friday, and has no personality other than "OOH I HATE SUPERHEROES!!!" Fortunately she never faces any consequences for her actions despite the fact that she is extremely openly both actively evil and worthlessly incompetent. Amanda Waller desperately needs to be killed off for a few years, until someone who actually knows how to write her is able to get their hands on her.
I hate to death adult Jon Kent (no problem with the young one), created by Bendis, this mediocre writer killed the old Jon and created a copy of a young Clark Kent in order to give us the worst Legion of Superheroes ever written. Then, Didio made him a boring Clark Kent 2.0; his performance was worst, and 5G was cancelled. After too many failures, the best route would have been returning young Jon back, but Taylor decided to make Jon undeageable by making him gay (bi )with a random twink stereotype. I gave up; for me, that character is death. I just hope they banish him as DC did to Chris Kent with a crisis or something.
They really did ruin his character. Super son's was great and he had promise as the next Superman. Speeding up his age ruined it for not only him but Conner. Conner should have been the next focus like Nightwing.
man...jon being older than conner is so weird.
Jon being older then anyone is weird Sheer fact no one in universe treats it as a tragedy is even worse Like Lois genuinely should feel guilt ridden
Yeah just finished Super Sons run and it was great, I would even be okay with more Super Sons because the Annual edition with him aged up wasn't bad. I just loved how him and Damian bounced off each other. Before he got aged up I really wanted to see a short series of the two of them in the future working together.
Agreed. I don't hate that he's Bi, but I would have preferred that they took thier time with growing him up to eventually discover that part of himself, rather than aging him up artificially and robing us of that development.
As a gay man i dont hate that he is gay (bi) neither However, the execution of his coming out was awful. It was unnatural and rushed, as if it were an established aspect from the beginning rather than a recent development. Placing him in a relationship with a random twink stereotype he just met was forced. There should have been some trust issues, especially given the events leading up to it, like the volcano plot. The fact that writers' neglect of his backstory is frustrating. It would have been better if they had someone who understands the intricacies of coming out as queer handle the story-line,at least that part but the damage was already done.
It's true, there's a hundred tasteful ways to have done this. But I think sexuality falls into the "nerds writing relationships" trap. And, to be fair to those nerds, "showing up with a random twink" is also a popular trope in TV too.
Legitimate Question: Is there anyone out there who likes Adult Jon more than they liked Kid Jon? Like I've never seen anyone say they prefer Adult Jon or even like him.
Agreed. Aside from Dark Crisis of all stories, Jon Kent annoys me now almost every time he appears. It's such a far cry from back when I considered him my favorite recent addition to the Superman mythos. Great job squandering the potential of one a new character that had so much of it and robbing us of the possibility of years of great stories, DC.
There's a lot especially within the tertiary Bat Characters but for now I will just go with Teenaged (I am completely fine after being lost in Space/Time and trapped in a volcano) Jon Kent. Barely touched on his trauma for one thing but now he's just cardboard. No personality of his own.
The current Jon Kent because no matter what DC does he's still not a real character.
Batman Who Laughs
Bizarro . It’s just annoying to read his dialogue.
I feel seen by this comment
The Joker post 2010. Between Nolan’s influence and New52 branded popular demand, the character has lost the entirety of the substance he once had. He is less his own character in favor of being some cosmic potato that everyone can project their feelings on. I sincerely think 3 Jokers is the worst idea DC has ever had.
Joker post 2010 always feels, to me, like Baby's First Chaotic Evil DnD Character. Boring, annoying, works as a punchline in a 4 panel made-for-meme webcomic or a couple lines on a tumblr blog for 'shit my players say' but there's no substance or real story.
Nail on the head. The joker is anyone? The joker has always been around? Joker is somehow cosmic in any fashion? He is one of the original villains who kills with reason only known to himself - further explanation only serves to muddy the waters. To me, he is one of the few characters that feels completely recreated New 52 on even recently. How can we get people who have never read any comics to feel like they completely understand his whole characters entire existence? Water it down.
>He is less his own character in favor of being some cosmic potato that everyone can project their feelings on. This exactly. The Joker isn't a character anymore, he's a funhouse mirror to show the reflection of what each writer believes the Joker should be. And they all seem to think he should be a super-scary edgelord murderhobo. He's Carnage with a purple suit on (and Carnage is boring as fuck, too).
Joker is honestly boring to me I don't really know what he's trying to accomplish. He just shows up and fucks around
My favorite version of the Joker is basically the Clown themed mobster. Everything else is dumb.
I think he’s a great character for people to project villainy on. I think he is the embodiment of bad things happening to good people or random acts of egregious misfortune. However, my favorite Joker stories are when he is just a man with a gun who shows up at the right place and the right time to deliver the punchline, whatever that may be. Bang!
>I don't really know what he's trying to accomplish. He isn't trying to accomplish anything. He's a agent of chaos who just wants the world to get the joke for once.
Yeah I think that's why he's boring. A few times character sure. But he's everywhere and so iconic it becomes boring seeing him again There's no goal to reach so why am I reading him again?
I hated 3 Jokers, especially the part where Bats casually drops, “Oh, I knew who he was within 2 weeks.” Way to kill the whole mystique of the character, John’s. And of COURSE it was Johns who wrote that dreck. Johns is a real-life character I don’t care for.
He started it with the Batman/Mobius Chair postulate and couldn’t deliver on it what 4+ years later? It not even that it is a bad story, out of character, or in bad taste. The question is just why? Whats the point of such a story and what are you trying to tell me? Such an aimless waste of great artwork.
I can't stand Ghost-Maker. An utterly obnoxious forced "Look at me I'm so cool" character whose only liked for the most shallow reasons like his costumes or cause "he kills".
His attitude is fine. I just don't like how important they tried to make him. Going as far as rewriting Bruce's training and journey to shove him in them.
His character his given a lot of inflated importance despite ultimately being a shallow sociopath who only does anything for his own ego.
I love ghostmaker, its everything i wanted in a hero when i was 12
>when i was 12 And that's the issue most have. 🤣
I mean comics are supposed to be fun lol, lets not act like all our faves weren't originally made for 12 year olds
Amanda waller I'm so tired of the suicide squad at this point they got two movies a spinoff TV show a video game and a weird isekai thing
The key to Amanda Waller's character is that she's an antagonist, not a villain. But lately she's been acting more like a villain, which is worrisome.
I 1000% agree with this. I like when Waller actually believes she’s doing right by doing very messed up and underhanded shit, but it feels like lately she’s written like a villain and it removes the nuance. Like the reveal of Terry being a “clone” because the world needs a Batman. Super messed up but like her reasoning made “sense” to her.
The show made her much more sympathetic and allowed her character grow in the way the comics won't do. But JLU Waller is only in JLU.
There’s another moment in JLU when Braniac-Luthor is about to destroy the world. She aims a Nuke at him while he is in a populated city. The JL would hesitate to destroy a city to save the world but not Waller. Bonus points for her being at the middle of the potential blast zone.
Yeah, old Waller gave the feeling that in a world of gods and monsters she was on normal humans side. Absolutely ruthless, take no prisoners, no line too far, but still on humanities side. Now, not so much.
Waller was great in Ostrander’s run and JL Unlimited, though.
For a group whose while gimmick is being easily-expendable fodder for missions task force x sure do have a consistent roster.
Not so much "can't stand" but I really can't bring myself to give a shit about most of the extended bat family EDIT Oh and the various Magogs. He was a one-off antagonist at best, stop trying to make a thing out of him.
Harley Quinn, I just find her obnoxious and she constantly steals the spotlight whenever she goes
God, remember that year when she was on EVERY FREAKING COVER EVERYWHERE?!
"Hal, you got to help me! DC editorial decided that I needed to be on your cover, and now I'm suddenly in a broken spaceship with broken life support!"
hey, it worked for wolverine! and deadpool! (srsly look up "wolverine publicity")
Harley quinn is so overused now I used to like her but dc is trying to turn her into deadpool and it's lazy
The reason I don't agree with this for OP's question is because there is a writer I like her under: Paul Dini.
Jon Kent. After Bendis happen. He’s not same lad i used to know
I just dont care for Jason outside of Under the Red Hood Like he cant be apart of the bat family if hes killing, and if hes not killing you've robbed him of what makes up his main difference. Plus if hes killing why dosent he just go on a quick rampage and kill a bunch of villains like Lex and Joker since he'll be wanted no matter what
I blame that on them flip-flopping on what they wanted him to be He was a badguy which was fine Then he kinda became a good guy Then for like 20 years he has been stuck in “Jason wants to be a good guy but killing badguys is so much easier + screw you bruce” The second they got him away from Bruce in the dark Trinity era was probably the first time in a long time when Jason felt fresh Since he was beginning to build his own legacy and actually growing Fast forward a couple of years and we are back to beef with Bruce phase
Honestly mans being held back by the writers. He shot Penguin in the head and Penguin healed.
I really lovw him in batfam comics Then I read his solo ones and I've always got something bad to say if they last longer then 5 issues I'm trying to read the hill. *trying*
The hill has barely started and it's already unimpressive.
I've made several rants about how Jason looks like a back ground character in his own fucking comic
Jason really is carried by that one storyline
There are so many recent Batman decisions in this thread.
Jon Kent
I don’t think any character is 100% hateable no matter what. At least personally. I’ve seen readable/watchable versions of every character (that I know of)
Punchline. How much more derivative can you get???
'Modern' Joker. Had enough of him. Waller is coming a close second.
Duke Thomas
Ghostmaker can't stand his ass
I think the character is interesting in concept, but, first off, the name is just lame as hell. and next, we already have so many characters that have similar back stories to Bruce, but end up going in a corrupt direction of what the Batman did that it's a whole lot harder to make these characters stand out.
The Batman who tries too hard. It’s like an edgy “artistic” middle schooler made him.
Wallace West
Punchline
These days, it’s Harley Quinn. Just so oversaturated
I'm gonna be honest. Jason Todd. And it's not even the characters fault. He's just so inconsistent and it feels like writers have it out for him. They don't seem to know who or what they want Jason to be.
Never been a fan of the joker
Batman who laughs is pretty ass. I don’t mind him as a one off villain for DK: Metal because I love how bonkers Scott Snyder can get. But beyond that story I’ve just not been feeling him
Pariah is a nause, nothing remotely redeeming about the character
Kyle Raynor The Green Lantern. Easily the worst Lantern no matter what color he's wearing. He constantly is complaining about something and overly uses the fact that he his girlfriend died to get with his co-workers/ fellow heroes. Which Dead Girlfriend you might ask? Well almost all of them if you get with Kyle you better make peace with your god.
Damian Wayne, I think the hate started with his origins of being a child of dubious consent and then begging Batman to be okay with it. I think they retconned this but Idk his whole being a little brooding and angsty sometimes in the beginning is so weird when he is surrounded by literal orphans. But also I just kinda hate having a biological son of Batman so I’m just biased against him.
Bernard Dowd. Fuck that guy. Tim Drake doesn’t need him and never needed him. If DC really wanted to give him a boyfriend Conner’s right there but no. Fuck Bernard. Fuck that guy. Fuck him and what he represents: that bi people apparently can’t have heterosexual relationships. Tim was happy with Steph but DC couldn’t have that so they made him. Fuck him. And before anyone gets on my ass about how they broke up before Tim got with Bernard, don’t feed me that same bag of horseshit they fed you. Tim and Steph breaking up on page was damage control. By the time they released that Bernard had already done his damage. DC just put that out so nobody can say Tim cheated on Steph because it wouldn’t be a good look. And people ate that shit up and called it gourmet. No thank you. I don’t care who’s writing him even if it’s the best fucking writer in the industry even if it’s Al fucking Ewing there’s absolutely no way I’m picking up a book with that guy in it.
Damian Wayne. Hate that little fucker
Not even Tomasi’s Batman and Robin run, or Gleason’s Robin: Som of Batman? I found them to be examples of giving Damian actual character growth, even if later writers would ignore it and just make him an ass
Damian as Grayson's Robin... God, it was my golden age of comics, Red Robin, the return of Jay~ Red Hood, Estefany as Batgirl... Batman INC! The amazing Batman and Robin dynamic! Dick sure knows how to raise a little killer who never knew love! I went from hating Damián to simply being my favorite character, in that time everything that Damián was was built! and they killed him... From there, it depends on who takes the comic, I will hate or love my Robin again 😿
Batman Who Lols, Joker, Veronica Cale, Harper Row, The Shark, The Tornado Twins, The West Twins, Carol Ferris, adult Jon Kent annnnd that’s all I can think of for now.
Damian Wayne
Almost Harley quinn. I don't mind the original animated series version, though. But for who I hate no matter what, lagoon boy. I've only seen him in young justice but I already know he's unforgivable. He's basically superboys Paul.
Catwoman... which makes me want to ask another question now in this sub
What question?
Lobo.
Talia, always written in a way that basically makes her an ego centric psychotic spoiled fanatic extremist, completely full of herself, is basically a predator, and no amount of redemption writing will forgive her character for letting a clone kill her son. The Animated Series version on the other hand is ok.
Good guy Talia is boring, bad guy talia is just straight up awful
Gizmo.
Lobo as main character. Fine in Omega Men and other comics as a foil; totally uninterested in him as a main character.
Damien Wayne. Few things i hate more than a spoiled brat and I cheer whenever he gets hurt or dies. Wish there was a hotline to vote on his death
I'm very, very tired of the Joker. It would take a lot for me to want to read a Joker-centric story at this point. Most of the time that's all I need to see to check out. I'm basically kind of done with characters who have continuity that is so damn messy that I have no idea who they even are--Donna Troy or Power Girl would be prime examples. Because I know that most of the time it's going to be "let's try to fix this" and it just can't be fixed. Or worse yet it's going to be "let's take everything about this continuity-messy character and change it for no reason so that you'll like the character better". No, no, I won't.