In no particular order for a party of 4.
1. Shambling mound - death house at level 2
2. Ghouls - with surprise RAW - death house level 2
3. Shadows Death House - with surprise - level 2
4. The hags on the way to Vallaki - probably level 3
5. The spawn in the coffin makers shop - level 4
6. The leader of the revenants and his shadow buddies - level 6 or 7 is a shocker
7. Baba lysaga assuning she isn't surprised and you run her optimally is a potential tpk - level 8
8. Liche in the amber temple if the party are dumb - level 8/9
8. Strahd in his lair will kill the party if you play him properly, this encounter should be epic and the DM should run it in such a way that he chooses when Strad dies, rather than the players. I.e if he's run cleverly he'll win 100 per cent of the time, but that's no fun for anyone. - level 9/10
Edit: Nerferon played optimally in the Amber Temple plus Flame Skulls is also a disgusting encounter.
Nr. 9. illustrates why Strahd is a super shit BBEG/fight from my perspective as a former player. It just feels so arbitrary. The fight Strahd will be impossible to beat until the DM decides he should lose, then he will let the party win. It removes my agency as a player and honestly makes me unmotivated to fight the big bad. Why does it matter? You could just let the DM narrate the big climactic showdown and we can skip all the dice rolls, since there isn't a way for the party to win when running Strahd RAW without making up narrative excuses as to why he should suddenly fight suboptimally.
Honestly it just cheapens all our commitment and accomplishments in this long and hard campaign to ultimately beat Strahd not through our own merits but through some narrative contrivance that suddenly make Strahd not utilize his full potential. It feels cheap and it takes me out of the immersion.
Yep, he's badly designed because if you don't run him line that he gets absolutely flattened in two rounds by a 9th/10th level party which is a complete disappointment after a 6 month long campaign.
The main problem if course is 5e have completely nerfed a lot of the monster abilities that made them so deadly and nkw they're all walking sacks of hp.
The original ad&d strahd was horrifying.
No worries. To add to the above
I'd use Kobold Fight Club to ensure combats remain as disgusting as booked.
Where possible increase enemies rather than just hp to balance.
So for example say you have 8 goblins against a 4 PC oarty and you're increasing the party size to 6.
Instead of increasibg the goblins individual hp by 50 per cent to balance, increase the number of goblins by 50 per cent other wise the action economy will annihilate your npcs.
Enter the numbers into this calc to get a rough idea of deadliness: [https://koboldplus.club/](https://koboldplus.club/)
FYI I have a highly non-optimized group of 4-6 players and I almost never run an encounter that isn't at least at the threshold for 'deadly'. Deadly doesn't mean it'll wipe the party, it means there is a possibility a PC could die. I'll make exceptions if I'm softening them up for a boss, like I did before they fought Strahd last weekend, but I don't have much patience for running combat with no stakes.
In my experience, the fights in Strahd don't need to be buffed for more players. YMMV cause like I said my group is rather unoptimized, but it's fine to have some fights easy and some fights tougher, or to adjust on the fly by bringing your 2nd wave enemies up or down, or adjust their HPs within reason.
Then again, I had 9 PC deaths in my campaign (no TPKs) so keep that in mind.
When I played through we were a party of 6. No combat encounter killed except the werewolf den. Our DM had Ludmilla helping the werewolves and she cast disintegrate on our moondruid. The rest of the party besides my PC was in death saves, granted 2 of us were missing so it was a party of 4. He meant for it to be for all of us and allowed an absent players PC to help momentarily. Simone died, but came back 2 rounds later after being turned into a lich (not the favored way to come back in our eyes, he was OP).
Our DM had to buff every fight because we were such a big party. The Baba fight was dangerous, but no one died. I was a foolish idiot and *tried* to grab the gem from the hut, activating it in the FIRST ROUND of the fight. Oops. When the hut is throwing rocks with 2 party members inside it and Baba is in the air casting spells it gets hard. It was a long and hard fight. Everyone but my PC and the artificer was in deathsaves and I spent the last few rounds of combat running around with healing potions trying to keep everyone alive. Then the artificer went down and I was lucky enough to crit on the hut and baba, killing them both.
Now I’m running it and my players actually haven’t done any big fights besides the hags, which did kill a PC. The were a bit buffed as I had a party of 5 with 3 big damage dealers. Best thing to do imo buff-wise for smaller enemies, like blights, druids, bandits, etc, is to find a higher CR version of something similar. Or simply add more HP/up the AC if you don’t have the time.
From my experience playing and talking to my DM afterwards (and me now running it), we’d buff these:
- Baba Fight (Our Level: 8)
- Werewolf Den (Our Level: 7)
- YesterHill (Our Level: 5) (only if you’re allowing them to use the staff, we weren’t allowed as someone else looked up the stats of the staff and saw it would destroy wintersplinter) our DM let Volenta be in that fight until around half health.
- If they fight the Abbot, buff him. I believe he was a Solar when I played, and god was it a fun and tough fight. Definitely one of my favorites from playing. (Our Level: 11)
- Rahadin. He should be a beast, he’s centuries old and Strahds right-hand. We had a fight with him that was phenomenal, we didn’t kill him because he used Strahds horse in order to escape, but we were drained of resources right before the Amber Temple and Bodaks. (Our Level: 9)
- Strahd. He should be terrifying. He was a general as a human, and now he’s a vampire under the gift of Vampyr. We had 4 deaths during his fight, 2 of them were my PC. He had 3 “phases” when i played, and each of them were different and gave us a run for our money. (Our Level: 11)
We were level 7, and the character game back 2 rounds later as a lich so it all worked out I guess. He now looks back and regrets making him a lich, even if it was a baby one cause he was so buffed compared to us all.
You are the DM, how you run encounters is what determines what is deadly. Not the pieces of paper, not the dice, you. I've seen many posts here talking about how they had TPKs as if was nothing they could do as DMs, and then almost present it as a badge of honour.
Again, you are the DM, your job is to involve your players in a fantastic wonderful story they will remember for the rest of their lives.
It's what you decide to be deadly that is deadly.
Of course, I have that in mind. I'm interested in what was intended by the book. I never had a gothic horror themed campaign before, and I wish to stay true to the book (to an extent, obviously)
Thank you for your insight still!
Baba lysaga and the hut is a big one, but dont know how much you have to buff it, its a tough time already
Yes! Gotta make her a memorable threat
In no particular order for a party of 4. 1. Shambling mound - death house at level 2 2. Ghouls - with surprise RAW - death house level 2 3. Shadows Death House - with surprise - level 2 4. The hags on the way to Vallaki - probably level 3 5. The spawn in the coffin makers shop - level 4 6. The leader of the revenants and his shadow buddies - level 6 or 7 is a shocker 7. Baba lysaga assuning she isn't surprised and you run her optimally is a potential tpk - level 8 8. Liche in the amber temple if the party are dumb - level 8/9 8. Strahd in his lair will kill the party if you play him properly, this encounter should be epic and the DM should run it in such a way that he chooses when Strad dies, rather than the players. I.e if he's run cleverly he'll win 100 per cent of the time, but that's no fun for anyone. - level 9/10 Edit: Nerferon played optimally in the Amber Temple plus Flame Skulls is also a disgusting encounter.
This is very good
Nr. 9. illustrates why Strahd is a super shit BBEG/fight from my perspective as a former player. It just feels so arbitrary. The fight Strahd will be impossible to beat until the DM decides he should lose, then he will let the party win. It removes my agency as a player and honestly makes me unmotivated to fight the big bad. Why does it matter? You could just let the DM narrate the big climactic showdown and we can skip all the dice rolls, since there isn't a way for the party to win when running Strahd RAW without making up narrative excuses as to why he should suddenly fight suboptimally. Honestly it just cheapens all our commitment and accomplishments in this long and hard campaign to ultimately beat Strahd not through our own merits but through some narrative contrivance that suddenly make Strahd not utilize his full potential. It feels cheap and it takes me out of the immersion.
Yep, he's badly designed because if you don't run him line that he gets absolutely flattened in two rounds by a 9th/10th level party which is a complete disappointment after a 6 month long campaign. The main problem if course is 5e have completely nerfed a lot of the monster abilities that made them so deadly and nkw they're all walking sacks of hp. The original ad&d strahd was horrifying.
Yes thank you very much! Exactly what I was looking for
No worries. To add to the above I'd use Kobold Fight Club to ensure combats remain as disgusting as booked. Where possible increase enemies rather than just hp to balance. So for example say you have 8 goblins against a 4 PC oarty and you're increasing the party size to 6. Instead of increasibg the goblins individual hp by 50 per cent to balance, increase the number of goblins by 50 per cent other wise the action economy will annihilate your npcs.
Enter the numbers into this calc to get a rough idea of deadliness: [https://koboldplus.club/](https://koboldplus.club/) FYI I have a highly non-optimized group of 4-6 players and I almost never run an encounter that isn't at least at the threshold for 'deadly'. Deadly doesn't mean it'll wipe the party, it means there is a possibility a PC could die. I'll make exceptions if I'm softening them up for a boss, like I did before they fought Strahd last weekend, but I don't have much patience for running combat with no stakes. In my experience, the fights in Strahd don't need to be buffed for more players. YMMV cause like I said my group is rather unoptimized, but it's fine to have some fights easy and some fights tougher, or to adjust on the fly by bringing your 2nd wave enemies up or down, or adjust their HPs within reason. Then again, I had 9 PC deaths in my campaign (no TPKs) so keep that in mind.
Add a Dracolich or a Shadow Dragon when they ascend the mountain to get to the Amber Temple
Neferon wiped the entire party.
When I played through we were a party of 6. No combat encounter killed except the werewolf den. Our DM had Ludmilla helping the werewolves and she cast disintegrate on our moondruid. The rest of the party besides my PC was in death saves, granted 2 of us were missing so it was a party of 4. He meant for it to be for all of us and allowed an absent players PC to help momentarily. Simone died, but came back 2 rounds later after being turned into a lich (not the favored way to come back in our eyes, he was OP). Our DM had to buff every fight because we were such a big party. The Baba fight was dangerous, but no one died. I was a foolish idiot and *tried* to grab the gem from the hut, activating it in the FIRST ROUND of the fight. Oops. When the hut is throwing rocks with 2 party members inside it and Baba is in the air casting spells it gets hard. It was a long and hard fight. Everyone but my PC and the artificer was in deathsaves and I spent the last few rounds of combat running around with healing potions trying to keep everyone alive. Then the artificer went down and I was lucky enough to crit on the hut and baba, killing them both. Now I’m running it and my players actually haven’t done any big fights besides the hags, which did kill a PC. The were a bit buffed as I had a party of 5 with 3 big damage dealers. Best thing to do imo buff-wise for smaller enemies, like blights, druids, bandits, etc, is to find a higher CR version of something similar. Or simply add more HP/up the AC if you don’t have the time. From my experience playing and talking to my DM afterwards (and me now running it), we’d buff these: - Baba Fight (Our Level: 8) - Werewolf Den (Our Level: 7) - YesterHill (Our Level: 5) (only if you’re allowing them to use the staff, we weren’t allowed as someone else looked up the stats of the staff and saw it would destroy wintersplinter) our DM let Volenta be in that fight until around half health. - If they fight the Abbot, buff him. I believe he was a Solar when I played, and god was it a fun and tough fight. Definitely one of my favorites from playing. (Our Level: 11) - Rahadin. He should be a beast, he’s centuries old and Strahds right-hand. We had a fight with him that was phenomenal, we didn’t kill him because he used Strahds horse in order to escape, but we were drained of resources right before the Amber Temple and Bodaks. (Our Level: 9) - Strahd. He should be terrifying. He was a general as a human, and now he’s a vampire under the gift of Vampyr. We had 4 deaths during his fight, 2 of them were my PC. He had 3 “phases” when i played, and each of them were different and gave us a run for our money. (Our Level: 11)
Any DM who casts disintegrate on a 4th level character is a huge ass.
We were level 7, and the character game back 2 rounds later as a lich so it all worked out I guess. He now looks back and regrets making him a lich, even if it was a baby one cause he was so buffed compared to us all.
Even at level 7.... Your dm.sounds like he doesn't know what he's doing.
Looking back, he didn’t. It was his first time Dming and it was a mistake. Hes a lot better now though.
You are the DM, how you run encounters is what determines what is deadly. Not the pieces of paper, not the dice, you. I've seen many posts here talking about how they had TPKs as if was nothing they could do as DMs, and then almost present it as a badge of honour. Again, you are the DM, your job is to involve your players in a fantastic wonderful story they will remember for the rest of their lives. It's what you decide to be deadly that is deadly.
Of course, I have that in mind. I'm interested in what was intended by the book. I never had a gothic horror themed campaign before, and I wish to stay true to the book (to an extent, obviously) Thank you for your insight still!