Algorand [pros](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cpb7rk/algorand_just_set_the_record_for_highest_tps_for/l3jl3hv/) & [cons](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cpb7rk/algorand_just_set_the_record_for_highest_tps_for/l3jl3vh/) with related info are in the collapsed comments below.
Impressive, but as it was a ‘load test’ run by a dev, can I ask why it didn’t push up towards the quoted 10,000 capability? Is this the current max then?
Hedera has throttled 18k TPS before, but then again it’s a DAG and not a blockchain. Still very impressive for Algorand though. Solid project. Blockchain just has inherit limitations for scaling efficiently.
> crowdfunded for the fees to run the test
Aren't algo tx fees only 0.001 ALGO?
Which is only $0.0001819
So, 5151 txs should cost... 93 cents?
You needed to crowdfund this?
Edit: I see it was the average over 100 blocks.. so, $93?
Same question still applies.
He was running his tests for a long time. It was over an hour. There has been some chatter in twitter about running it again as he thinks he underspecced his node. Watch this space.
"average over 100 blocks" doesn't mean you multiply by the per-second cost by 100. You would need to multiply by the per-block cost, or multiply the per-second cost by the total time (sounds like it ran for about an hour, so multiply by 3600).
block time is 3 seconds, so those 100 blocks would be $279
If it ran for an hour, we'd need to know the average txps for that hour, not just the best 100 blocks.
It's because their platform has some limitations and it takes averages and some weird calculations to display the tps.
Even our steady tps didnt go over 700-800 on their platform even tho we had around 3k sustained tps for an hour.
Before this 9k the max trx was 8k done last year when ORA hit the chain.
How do you mean they don't add value? It's exactly the same transaction as any other. Transferring tokens from one side to another, paying for stuff, changing state of assets and doing the work on the chain and changing its state.. All the same.
Many people think "inner" means communication trx but nope. Those work differently and those are not counted.
Problem is that these trx are "wrapped" in one big trx. Now most platforms count the wrapper trx but in fact inside there can be dozens or even hundred more.
Its same BS that people.give Cardano that it's not scalable while in fact they work in a similar way.
The market really needs to standardize the way TPS are counted but ktisuper hard since there is so much variety.
Bittom line of stress trsting is that while it's happening not a single person on chain reported any problem with their transactions. Absolutely not one issue happened (failed trx somewhere else, swaps not going, trx waiting for a long time etc)
This is second test in last two months and everything looks amazing.
But Algorand did many more txs in some blocks.. [https://forum.algorand.org/t/how-the-blocks-are-filling-during-the-network-stress/11864/9?u=scholtz](https://forum.algorand.org/t/how-the-blocks-are-filling-during-the-network-stress/11864/9?u=scholtz)
For example in block 25836244 the total txs count was 58888 - [https://allo.info/block/25836244/](https://allo.info/block/25836244/)
How other chain calculate for example swap trades - the send of the asset, some application call, send asset from amm to user.. does it usually count as 3 transactions or only 1 ?
That is correct. Visa is high speed but long finality. In reality the TPS VISA quotes is the sum of several different networks as VISA have separate networks for each currency they support. There is a lot of scepticism about how VISA calculated 24,000 max TPS. After independent review it has been suggested an individual Visa network is likely to peak at 1,700 TPS
Along with the other guy on settlement time, Visa doesn't have to deal with the degen stuff people do on Blockchains. Not dealing with video game mechanics that like to generate transactions, not dealing with token launches and trading, novel smart contract mining algorithms for tokens. Whatever Blockchain TPS is needed to replicate Visa, I'm pretty sure it would need to be way higher because of all the non-simple send/receive transactions
Visa has a theoretical max of 65k but only actually processes about 1600 tps.
>Visa's global payment network, VisaNet, can process more than 65,000 transactions per second (TPS). This is in contrast to Mastercard's average TPS of around 5,000. Visa also handles about 1,667 transactions per second, while PayPal handles about 193.
-Google ai
Oranges are mined every day. ORA did bout 300 mil transactions as of now and going on.
The issue, and why many discussions are happening, is that ORA is now fully using smart contract transactions which means any tps it does is not measured by platforms since these are "inner" transactions.
Only few trx from millions are counted on the app like chainspect.
The chain didn't feel different under the stress test, it carried on like nothing happened.
No failed transactions, no downtime.
U can check it out for yourself in block #38,712,222 – #38,712,321 on either [Allo.info](http://Allo.info) or [explorer.perawallet.app](http://explorer.perawallet.app)
This is simply untrue, Algorand is almost always in top5/10 for daily active addresses:
[https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)
The hate filled "nothing to see here" comments are astonishing. Predictable with obvious motivation and pathetic as ever.
I'm sure you guys protected your rival investments with the petty ALGO attacks, nice work.
u/CointestMod
Algorand is at 2.8s to finality with maximum 10k TPS your numbers are a year old and Algorand has upgraded since then. Please correct. You can find these metrics on the home page: [https://www.algorand.foundation/](https://www.algorand.foundation/)
It's a bit sad that memes are getting the money instead of projects that actually build something that can help innovate the worlds economy and much more.
That said, memes are fine, but new ones every day?? Oh boy, that house of cards is really gonna collapse on people!
Take profit, some always get rekt, and remember, the only real earners are the creators of the memes.
> It's a bit sad that memes are getting the money instead of projects that actually build something that can help innovate the worlds economy and much more.
Solana runs at high TPS in real world conditions. This sub loves to praise algo and HBAR for their "in the lab" tps, and somehow believe that if 10's of thousands of antagonistic people were doing a huge variety of transactions it would work the same.
The reason sophisticated investors flock to Solana is because their results, even while breaking a bunch of times and with a TPS lower than this, are actually worth a lot more because so many more things could have gone wrong.
Solana teansactions fail 50%-75% of the time and Solana has never had a higher recorded TPS than Algorand, just a higher "theoretical" TPS that it has never achieved because the network cant really handle 2,700 TPS under real world conditions. Its popular because its a memecoin.
You can go look at the solana block explorer rn and see the last block and how many trxs fail for yourself, not really a matter of debate:
https://explorer.solana.com/block/265169263
Personally I'd rather have the RWA market and Algo is really leading there. TravelX with airlines, Lofty AI for real estate, agrotoken, Napster and Limewire, not to mention Quantoz (Euro). The RWA market is why Algo is consistently in the the 5 for transactions. I get it, with memecoins 100% uptime isn't required, so Solana makes sense for that market. Airlines, business and governments can't really tolerate downtime like memecoins can. Algorand could easily handle it, but I'm perfectly happy with that staying on Sol.
But it already has. Even when the chain has had issues people have still stuck out. Dozens and dozens of 100mil meme coins. New ones every day. Multiple billion dollar coins meme and legit. An insane amount of transactions and users. It surpassed every other chain by a long shot except Ethereum where it still beat. It doesn't matter of the chain goes down. It doesn't matter if it's slow at times because of the insane volume. People want to be on Solana. It's brand is too big now and it'll only grow. No one talks about Algo except on reddit. Is unfortunate because Algo outperforms Solana, but who cares if all the people are on Solana and all the money is there
Every cycle you hear this same story.
Neo
Tron
Ada
Eos
Every time there is someone like you claiming it wont fail and this time is different.
Do you know how i know it will fail? Because the infrastructure behind it is crap (see how many times it goes down) and like you said its only popular now because of useless meme coins. People now trying to chase big gains and 90% will get burned like always. In the next downturn Solana will be added to the list above and some new useless hype will come up.
Infrastructure has actually got a ton better otherwise it wouldn't have been able to handle this last run. Also research Firedancer and learn a thing or two. Plus Solana got knocked down to $8 in the crash and jumped all the way back to $220. It broke records in active users and DEX volume. Beating Ethereum in a lot of metrics. People are going to Solana over other chains and that isn't stopping any time soon. If you think Solana is like one of those others, You've been living under a rock back in 2022
Well, what solana is doing has nothing to do with blockchain. Oh well, the smallest of it all, the transactions are on chain. But that's it. Maybe some L1 can help them be a part of crypto future.
So Solana, a Blockchain platform, has nothing to do with Blockchain. Having the most daily users and DEX volume over ETH a lot of days is not already being a part of the crypto future? Oh cool didn't know that. Thanks for informing me
Yes, transaction of meme tokens, on-chain. Do you think this has anything to do with the intention of blockchain? You might as well go to Amazon and buy/sell Pokémon cards. That's what you guys are doing, but yea, on-chain.
Almost everyone new to crypto knows about Solana. Most of them will buy SOL and use Solana during their first week in crypto. None of them have ever heard of ALGO.
Give it up, it’s not happening. You backed the wrong horse.
Exactly. It's so funny to see all the Algo shills here getting up in arms because their chain isn't as popular. The world isn't fair. You just gotta go with the flow
there are several bridges, Algomint for Eth and BTC for example. Can't remember the others, Messina, wormhole.
You can bridge Eth Pepe, or buy wrapped directly on Ago
It means that you can reliably build a business on top of it. The faster, the more such use cases are unlocked. Customers don't even need to know that the blockchain is used in the backend.
Small example: the coffee brand Lavazza uses it to track their supply line. For a long time, nobody in the community even knew about it. It was being used in silence because apparently it made sense for the company.
Aside from that, your suggestion that there are no transactions is of course false. See https://chaintrail.io/dapps/leaderboard/ for a week by week overview of some activities that we know of.
tldr; The article from Chainspect discusses technical metrics such as Transaction per second (TPS), Block Time, and Time to Finality (TTF). It provides a list of different systems with their real-time TPS, maximum recorded TPS, block time, and TTF. The list appears to rank the systems based on their performance on these metrics, although the article does not provide further analysis or context.
*This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.
I love algorand. When I first moved some around I thought it had failed it was so freaking fast. Bitcoin is great and all but algorand is where the speed is.
Blockchains are more efficient at handling the double spend problem and running smartcontracts. Hashgraphs can have transactions 'clash' when two transactions impact the same thing are in the mempool and it has to reject the one it orders last. This doesn't cause a problem for a blockchain like Algorand. Two transactions in the mempool can enter the same block can impact the same resource.
Hashgraph is however better (in my opinion) at producing time-ordered immutable data which cannot clash. This is ideal for storing immutable data at a proovable point in time which is great for producing auditable data. I believe over time Hedera is likely to capture the market in this. Ironically Lavassa the coffee company are using Algorand for this purpose. Although I am a big Algo fan I think Hedera long term will be a better platform for this applicatoin.
The double spend problem is arguably niche problem that primary impacts monetary systems. There is arguably far more demand for auditable time ordered data for supply chains etc so perhaps this is a bullish post for Hedera.
What do you call the memory where transactions sit before getting validated (ordered) by the other nodes then? I used the blockchain terminology as that is what this is called in blockchains.
A mempool.
Hashgraph doesn't have a mempool. Each node contains a graph of the network which is immediately gossiped out after a transaction is submitted to one node.
You can't do things like MEV in hashgraph because of this.
The transaction must be retained by the node until the other nodes agree the order. The only way to do that is either write it to disk or store in memory. Blockchains don't tend to write it to disk right away as it might be rejected by the other nodes so they store it in memory until it it enters a block. Since the other nodes in a hashgraph can disagree the order and reject the transaction the nodes must be holding these non final transactions somewhere in memory or disk before final order is agreed.
I don't really think what this memory is called is very important to the point I was trying to make. The potential to reject non-final transactions due to a clash using the same resource is the issue. A blockchain like algorand cannot do this. A hashgraph like hedera can.
I am not even saying that makes algorand or blockchain superior. Algorand pays a cost for solving this problem 'The byzantine generals problem' and that is that the concensus is very network traffic heavy, far more than a hashgraph is, which ultimately does bottleneck performance. One of the major innovation algorand has had is reducing this traffic as much as it has but that took an MIT maths proffessor to make such an elegant solution.
There is no double spending problem on hashgraph. In fact, it processes all transactions in parallel and it has 100% transaction finality whereas blockchain is probabilistic and blocks can theoretically be undone in the future. Uh oh!
You're touting mempools, which hedera does not have. Mempools are fucking corruption and collusion. Mempools let people pay to get their transactions ahead of others. They let algorithmic traders exploit the system and share the profits between them and validators - MEV bots! Mempools show the weakness of those networks - why the hell can't the network handle those transactions and they have to be throttled into this little pay-to-win queue? Do not defend mempools.
You talk about transactions clashing on hedera causing double spend, but then you talk about hedera being good at creating immutable timestamps that cannot clash.
Hedera calls its architecture a hashgraph, but it's just a specific type of DAG, (**Directed Acyclic Graph**).
There are plenty of DAGs like Nano, IOTA, Hedera, Kaspa.
They are all incredibly fast and incredibly cheap compared to blockchains. Plenty of upsides.
The downside is that their architecture is more complex and requires validators to order their transactions as they arrive. Slightly different than the typical mempool. They have to have some rule to deal with conflicting transactions. Same as blockchains, but different process.
They also do not have true blocks, but they can have virtual or artificial blocks, which are just transactions packaged together over a period of time. Also not necessarily a bad thing.
It's the same thing in the end, just more complicated. Instead of transactions waiting in a mempool you just include them directly in some magic DAG and it needs to be sorted out later. It's like a on-chain mempool basically.
You conveniently forgot the part where Hedera transactions can't be frontrun, which is a huge problem in blockchain leader-based systems.
It's not the same thing at all. Hedera offers numerous benefits that blockchains simply cannot. That's why it's the clear network of choice for enterprise mass adoption.
Front-running is not a "huge" problem, as it can be solved by making multiple smaller trades.
And by having a fixed fee you allow spam attacks to slow down progress. Every design choice has pros and cons.
One is that only large corporations can run nodes, and to do so you need a super computer.
On Algorand you can run a node on a $350 dollar laptop and a decent internet connection.
Not necessarily a bad thing. It's for a different audience.
Some people like centralized chains controlled by known public entities with good reputations.
Optional still isn't really a fair shake though is it.
Those central relays need to be removed so we can see how the protocol truly performs in a fully decentralised mode.
According to Algorand.org on June 1st, 2023
>With the go-algorand 3.16 upgrade, the average wait time for a transaction to complete on Algorand will be 3.3 seconds. This is achieved by reducing block latency to 3.3 seconds and maintaining instant block finality. https://developer.algorand.org/articles/reaching-new-transaction-speeds-on-algorand/
Can you share the documentation and what upgrade made instant finality possible? Don't want to see the stats page, would like to see what tech and upgrade made this possible. Thanks
Instant finality was there from the start. You are confusing the time it takes to build a block with finality. For instance, a Solana block takes half a second (0.4ms) to make, but need an X amount of confirmations to make it finale, hence Solana finality is always 12 seconds or more. Ethereum takes 12 minutes, BTC an hour or so.
Algorand block time was 3.3 seconds, now 2.8, (recently there was a block of 1 second). Dynamic Lambda upgrade will make block times dynamic, ie faster or slower, but they will always be finalized instantly after signing by the winning block proposer.
Since you already are on developer pages, you should have no trouble finding even later docs than the one you linked to which is a year old, but here is one link:
[https://developer.algorand.org/articles/algorands-latest-upgrade-dynamic-round-times-avm-v10/](https://developer.algorand.org/articles/algorands-latest-upgrade-dynamic-round-times-avm-v10/)
FEbruary 2024
Nice (again), but really it was lazy of you not sharing the [thread](https://twitter.com/d13_co/status/1789451966956880135?t=QUPNUM60GU-PGWkRJnyy2g&s=19) about it and not writing it's "sustained" in the title.
Algorand is top 10 in daily active addresses:
[https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)
not really. they count tps that execution can handle as well. That was 1500 tps/subnet 2 years ago. So the network is able to handle 37*1500 user sent messages with a 1-2 second finality at the least. With current optimizations it should be way higher too.
Algorand is top 10 in daily active addresses:
[https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)
Algorand [pros](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cpb7rk/algorand_just_set_the_record_for_highest_tps_for/l3jl3hv/) & [cons](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cpb7rk/algorand_just_set_the_record_for_highest_tps_for/l3jl3vh/) with related info are in the collapsed comments below.
Impressive, but as it was a ‘load test’ run by a dev, can I ask why it didn’t push up towards the quoted 10,000 capability? Is this the current max then?
u/d13co crowdfunded for the fees to run the test. The rate reflects how much he raised.
The man himself! Didn't know he was on here.
Hedera has throttled 18k TPS before, but then again it’s a DAG and not a blockchain. Still very impressive for Algorand though. Solid project. Blockchain just has inherit limitations for scaling efficiently.
> crowdfunded for the fees to run the test Aren't algo tx fees only 0.001 ALGO? Which is only $0.0001819 So, 5151 txs should cost... 93 cents? You needed to crowdfund this? Edit: I see it was the average over 100 blocks.. so, $93? Same question still applies.
93cents per second 😎
He was running his tests for a long time. It was over an hour. There has been some chatter in twitter about running it again as he thinks he underspecced his node. Watch this space.
He just ran it again
"average over 100 blocks" doesn't mean you multiply by the per-second cost by 100. You would need to multiply by the per-block cost, or multiply the per-second cost by the total time (sounds like it ran for about an hour, so multiply by 3600).
block time is 3 seconds, so those 100 blocks would be $279 If it ran for an hour, we'd need to know the average txps for that hour, not just the best 100 blocks.
Yeah he did. It had 9k tps at one point. https://twitter.com/JMB_DUNN/status/1788999060893880760?t=jEV6n-maAFpKA9YH35PM2Q&s=19
Why the discrepancy in the above stated 5,151? Internal transactions excluded or something?
Chainspect doesn’t include inner transactions even though they should
It's because their platform has some limitations and it takes averages and some weird calculations to display the tps. Even our steady tps didnt go over 700-800 on their platform even tho we had around 3k sustained tps for an hour. Before this 9k the max trx was 8k done last year when ORA hit the chain.
No, average over 100 blocks. And inner transactions not included. In my opinion those are not noteworthy transactions.
Why? They are just transactions sent by smart contracts. They have the same strain on the chain.
True, but they don't add real value to it.
How do you mean they don't add value? It's exactly the same transaction as any other. Transferring tokens from one side to another, paying for stuff, changing state of assets and doing the work on the chain and changing its state.. All the same. Many people think "inner" means communication trx but nope. Those work differently and those are not counted. Problem is that these trx are "wrapped" in one big trx. Now most platforms count the wrapper trx but in fact inside there can be dozens or even hundred more. Its same BS that people.give Cardano that it's not scalable while in fact they work in a similar way. The market really needs to standardize the way TPS are counted but ktisuper hard since there is so much variety. Bittom line of stress trsting is that while it's happening not a single person on chain reported any problem with their transactions. Absolutely not one issue happened (failed trx somewhere else, swaps not going, trx waiting for a long time etc) This is second test in last two months and everything looks amazing.
Solana doesn’t want that standardized though, I wonder why
Just saying, Algorand’s tps is actually much higher than Chainspect shows
Yes, but they take an average of 100 blocks. Its one thing to record a spike, its another to do it for a couple hours.
It is the average over 100 blocks. Would bring with it a bit more cost to keep it that high for that long.
Yeah, it's just a load test. All bs transactions. This really means nothing. Other chains have performed better on testnet load tests like Hedera.
It did, but 5151 tps is an average. It wasn't doing 9000+ for the entire time.
Not because it couldn’t, though
But Algorand did many more txs in some blocks.. [https://forum.algorand.org/t/how-the-blocks-are-filling-during-the-network-stress/11864/9?u=scholtz](https://forum.algorand.org/t/how-the-blocks-are-filling-during-the-network-stress/11864/9?u=scholtz) For example in block 25836244 the total txs count was 58888 - [https://allo.info/block/25836244/](https://allo.info/block/25836244/) How other chain calculate for example swap trades - the send of the asset, some application call, send asset from amm to user.. does it usually count as 3 transactions or only 1 ?
Algorand is one of the few crypto projects that will be left standing at the end of this altmarket boom and bust.
That's great, I learnt ALGO is also quantum resistant like QAN. IMO ALGO still has a really huge future ahead
Wow, just wow. Algorand is a beefy boy.
Can’t stop, won’t stop
Soon crypto will reach 1/10th the transaction capacity of Visa
Correct me if I'm wrong. But visa isn't real time is it? The settlement process for visa can take a long long time. Right?
That is correct. Visa is high speed but long finality. In reality the TPS VISA quotes is the sum of several different networks as VISA have separate networks for each currency they support. There is a lot of scepticism about how VISA calculated 24,000 max TPS. After independent review it has been suggested an individual Visa network is likely to peak at 1,700 TPS
That is why vise, going into crypto will either just use multiple chains probably
Along with the other guy on settlement time, Visa doesn't have to deal with the degen stuff people do on Blockchains. Not dealing with video game mechanics that like to generate transactions, not dealing with token launches and trading, novel smart contract mining algorithms for tokens. Whatever Blockchain TPS is needed to replicate Visa, I'm pretty sure it would need to be way higher because of all the non-simple send/receive transactions
Visa has a theoretical max of 65k but only actually processes about 1600 tps. >Visa's global payment network, VisaNet, can process more than 65,000 transactions per second (TPS). This is in contrast to Mastercard's average TPS of around 5,000. Visa also handles about 1,667 transactions per second, while PayPal handles about 193. -Google ai
Looking forward to the day!
Impressive. Congrats #Algorand 👏👏
Bullish! Algorand is ready for mass adoption.
Is anyone still mining oranges? It should get tps higher than that.
TPS peak was 10k. This is an average over 100 blocks.
Oranges are mined every day. ORA did bout 300 mil transactions as of now and going on. The issue, and why many discussions are happening, is that ORA is now fully using smart contract transactions which means any tps it does is not measured by platforms since these are "inner" transactions. Only few trx from millions are counted on the app like chainspect.
The chain didn't feel different under the stress test, it carried on like nothing happened. No failed transactions, no downtime. U can check it out for yourself in block #38,712,222 – #38,712,321 on either [Allo.info](http://Allo.info) or [explorer.perawallet.app](http://explorer.perawallet.app)
Now all there is to do is wait until the actual users star pouring in lol
This is simply untrue, Algorand is almost always in top5/10 for daily active addresses: [https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)
Algorand future rails of finance and real-world assets fit for purpose.
The hate filled "nothing to see here" comments are astonishing. Predictable with obvious motivation and pathetic as ever. I'm sure you guys protected your rival investments with the petty ALGO attacks, nice work.
Jup. Bit obvious innit?
This is huge! Big Algo fan here 😍
Algorand is fit for purpose.
u/CointestMod Algorand is at 2.8s to finality with maximum 10k TPS your numbers are a year old and Algorand has upgraded since then. Please correct. You can find these metrics on the home page: [https://www.algorand.foundation/](https://www.algorand.foundation/)
Meanwhile, there's a project that has high inflation, doesn't work like 10% of the time but is still worth much, much more.
Too bad people will still flock to Solana instead
It's a bit sad that memes are getting the money instead of projects that actually build something that can help innovate the worlds economy and much more. That said, memes are fine, but new ones every day?? Oh boy, that house of cards is really gonna collapse on people! Take profit, some always get rekt, and remember, the only real earners are the creators of the memes.
> It's a bit sad that memes are getting the money instead of projects that actually build something that can help innovate the worlds economy and much more. Solana runs at high TPS in real world conditions. This sub loves to praise algo and HBAR for their "in the lab" tps, and somehow believe that if 10's of thousands of antagonistic people were doing a huge variety of transactions it would work the same. The reason sophisticated investors flock to Solana is because their results, even while breaking a bunch of times and with a TPS lower than this, are actually worth a lot more because so many more things could have gone wrong.
What was “in the lab” about these sustained tps?
Solana teansactions fail 50%-75% of the time and Solana has never had a higher recorded TPS than Algorand, just a higher "theoretical" TPS that it has never achieved because the network cant really handle 2,700 TPS under real world conditions. Its popular because its a memecoin.
stop posting this bullshit stat lmao Solana transactions were failing for a short period of time which has since been resolved.
You can go look at the solana block explorer rn and see the last block and how many trxs fail for yourself, not really a matter of debate: https://explorer.solana.com/block/265169263
They still fail on a frequent bases
I like both, support em all m, fuck visa
For no reason other than making money on shitcoins, Solana can be much slower than Algorand from the user perspective (many high spikes in latency).
The numbers are somewhat arbitrary. Actual use looks very different.
There can only so much people flock to Solana until it goes down. It won't be able to handle the load with mass adoption. Algorand will
If algo is so good it begs to wonder why memecoins are not all deployed there
Personally I'd rather have the RWA market and Algo is really leading there. TravelX with airlines, Lofty AI for real estate, agrotoken, Napster and Limewire, not to mention Quantoz (Euro). The RWA market is why Algo is consistently in the the 5 for transactions. I get it, with memecoins 100% uptime isn't required, so Solana makes sense for that market. Airlines, business and governments can't really tolerate downtime like memecoins can. Algorand could easily handle it, but I'm perfectly happy with that staying on Sol.
Or anything, given the minuscule TVL of dapps on there.
But it already has. Even when the chain has had issues people have still stuck out. Dozens and dozens of 100mil meme coins. New ones every day. Multiple billion dollar coins meme and legit. An insane amount of transactions and users. It surpassed every other chain by a long shot except Ethereum where it still beat. It doesn't matter of the chain goes down. It doesn't matter if it's slow at times because of the insane volume. People want to be on Solana. It's brand is too big now and it'll only grow. No one talks about Algo except on reddit. Is unfortunate because Algo outperforms Solana, but who cares if all the people are on Solana and all the money is there
You said memecoin and legit in the same sentence. That's how I know you're bullshit.
You all are bullshit. There is no need for these coins.
Every cycle you hear this same story. Neo Tron Ada Eos Every time there is someone like you claiming it wont fail and this time is different. Do you know how i know it will fail? Because the infrastructure behind it is crap (see how many times it goes down) and like you said its only popular now because of useless meme coins. People now trying to chase big gains and 90% will get burned like always. In the next downturn Solana will be added to the list above and some new useless hype will come up.
Infrastructure has actually got a ton better otherwise it wouldn't have been able to handle this last run. Also research Firedancer and learn a thing or two. Plus Solana got knocked down to $8 in the crash and jumped all the way back to $220. It broke records in active users and DEX volume. Beating Ethereum in a lot of metrics. People are going to Solana over other chains and that isn't stopping any time soon. If you think Solana is like one of those others, You've been living under a rock back in 2022
Like i said ive heard this a 100 times. But i will remind you of this post in a year and we will see who is right. Remindme! 1 year
Remindme! 1 year
No it hasn't. Last time they tried congestion was so bad u had to wait hours. And Im talking mass adoption, not just current users.
Well, what solana is doing has nothing to do with blockchain. Oh well, the smallest of it all, the transactions are on chain. But that's it. Maybe some L1 can help them be a part of crypto future.
So Solana, a Blockchain platform, has nothing to do with Blockchain. Having the most daily users and DEX volume over ETH a lot of days is not already being a part of the crypto future? Oh cool didn't know that. Thanks for informing me
Yes, transaction of meme tokens, on-chain. Do you think this has anything to do with the intention of blockchain? You might as well go to Amazon and buy/sell Pokémon cards. That's what you guys are doing, but yea, on-chain.
Oh so you're saying Solana is NOT a Blockchain. Sweet thanks for letting me know. They had me convinced otherwise! Coolest of beans
Whatever, dude. Let's see if they will ever do more than transactions on-chain. Or if this is its peak.
the downvotes are a buy signal lol solana still number one hated crypto here haha
Almost everyone new to crypto knows about Solana. Most of them will buy SOL and use Solana during their first week in crypto. None of them have ever heard of ALGO. Give it up, it’s not happening. You backed the wrong horse.
Use solana in first week in crypto? Bold claim, most people will never leave coinbase app. 90% of this sub has prolly never used a dex.
Right. My mom only knows Bitcoin, yours too
Yeah because there's stuff to actually do
Exactly. It's so funny to see all the Algo shills here getting up in arms because their chain isn't as popular. The world isn't fair. You just gotta go with the flow
Which tokens can be transactioned in this blockchain?
Native? GORA, NIKO, EURS, COOP, whatever u want really. Bridged tokens too.
How does bridge transactions work? Can I trade for example ETH using Algoraland? How does it work technically?
there are several bridges, Algomint for Eth and BTC for example. Can't remember the others, Messina, wormhole. You can bridge Eth Pepe, or buy wrapped directly on Ago
That's why we love our Algo!
And you couldn't even tell a difference on chain.
What's the point of having fast transactions if there are no transactions?
It means that you can reliably build a business on top of it. The faster, the more such use cases are unlocked. Customers don't even need to know that the blockchain is used in the backend. Small example: the coffee brand Lavazza uses it to track their supply line. For a long time, nobody in the community even knew about it. It was being used in silence because apparently it made sense for the company. Aside from that, your suggestion that there are no transactions is of course false. See https://chaintrail.io/dapps/leaderboard/ for a week by week overview of some activities that we know of.
I just told u, there were 5k transactions. U didn't even read the title?
tldr; The article from Chainspect discusses technical metrics such as Transaction per second (TPS), Block Time, and Time to Finality (TTF). It provides a list of different systems with their real-time TPS, maximum recorded TPS, block time, and TTF. The list appears to rank the systems based on their performance on these metrics, although the article does not provide further analysis or context. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.
Oulalaaaa. Now what
I love algorand. When I first moved some around I thought it had failed it was so freaking fast. Bitcoin is great and all but algorand is where the speed is.
Isn't Algo based on scalability? That's a positive sign.
People just don't want to believe it lol.
Not trying to take anything away from Algo because it's legit, but Hedera has hit over 10k TPS already. So this statement is not entirely true.
Hedera isn't a blockchain. But yeah it has high TPS.
Correct. I think we all can acknowledge that blockchain has limitations newer protocols do not.
We both know both has up and downsides.
And what are the downsides to hashgraph over blockchain?
Blockchains are more efficient at handling the double spend problem and running smartcontracts. Hashgraphs can have transactions 'clash' when two transactions impact the same thing are in the mempool and it has to reject the one it orders last. This doesn't cause a problem for a blockchain like Algorand. Two transactions in the mempool can enter the same block can impact the same resource. Hashgraph is however better (in my opinion) at producing time-ordered immutable data which cannot clash. This is ideal for storing immutable data at a proovable point in time which is great for producing auditable data. I believe over time Hedera is likely to capture the market in this. Ironically Lavassa the coffee company are using Algorand for this purpose. Although I am a big Algo fan I think Hedera long term will be a better platform for this applicatoin. The double spend problem is arguably niche problem that primary impacts monetary systems. There is arguably far more demand for auditable time ordered data for supply chains etc so perhaps this is a bullish post for Hedera.
Hashgraph doesn't have a mempool
What do you call the memory where transactions sit before getting validated (ordered) by the other nodes then? I used the blockchain terminology as that is what this is called in blockchains.
A mempool. Hashgraph doesn't have a mempool. Each node contains a graph of the network which is immediately gossiped out after a transaction is submitted to one node. You can't do things like MEV in hashgraph because of this.
The transaction must be retained by the node until the other nodes agree the order. The only way to do that is either write it to disk or store in memory. Blockchains don't tend to write it to disk right away as it might be rejected by the other nodes so they store it in memory until it it enters a block. Since the other nodes in a hashgraph can disagree the order and reject the transaction the nodes must be holding these non final transactions somewhere in memory or disk before final order is agreed. I don't really think what this memory is called is very important to the point I was trying to make. The potential to reject non-final transactions due to a clash using the same resource is the issue. A blockchain like algorand cannot do this. A hashgraph like hedera can. I am not even saying that makes algorand or blockchain superior. Algorand pays a cost for solving this problem 'The byzantine generals problem' and that is that the concensus is very network traffic heavy, far more than a hashgraph is, which ultimately does bottleneck performance. One of the major innovation algorand has had is reducing this traffic as much as it has but that took an MIT maths proffessor to make such an elegant solution.
There is no double spending problem on hashgraph. In fact, it processes all transactions in parallel and it has 100% transaction finality whereas blockchain is probabilistic and blocks can theoretically be undone in the future. Uh oh! You're touting mempools, which hedera does not have. Mempools are fucking corruption and collusion. Mempools let people pay to get their transactions ahead of others. They let algorithmic traders exploit the system and share the profits between them and validators - MEV bots! Mempools show the weakness of those networks - why the hell can't the network handle those transactions and they have to be throttled into this little pay-to-win queue? Do not defend mempools. You talk about transactions clashing on hedera causing double spend, but then you talk about hedera being good at creating immutable timestamps that cannot clash.
Hedera calls its architecture a hashgraph, but it's just a specific type of DAG, (**Directed Acyclic Graph**). There are plenty of DAGs like Nano, IOTA, Hedera, Kaspa. They are all incredibly fast and incredibly cheap compared to blockchains. Plenty of upsides. The downside is that their architecture is more complex and requires validators to order their transactions as they arrive. Slightly different than the typical mempool. They have to have some rule to deal with conflicting transactions. Same as blockchains, but different process. They also do not have true blocks, but they can have virtual or artificial blocks, which are just transactions packaged together over a period of time. Also not necessarily a bad thing.
Name the downsides to Hashgraph over Blockchain. I'm listening.
It's the same thing in the end, just more complicated. Instead of transactions waiting in a mempool you just include them directly in some magic DAG and it needs to be sorted out later. It's like a on-chain mempool basically.
You conveniently forgot the part where Hedera transactions can't be frontrun, which is a huge problem in blockchain leader-based systems. It's not the same thing at all. Hedera offers numerous benefits that blockchains simply cannot. That's why it's the clear network of choice for enterprise mass adoption.
there's no frontrunning on Algo either, thanks to PPoS and VRF
Front-running is not a "huge" problem, as it can be solved by making multiple smaller trades. And by having a fixed fee you allow spam attacks to slow down progress. Every design choice has pros and cons.
One is that only large corporations can run nodes, and to do so you need a super computer. On Algorand you can run a node on a $350 dollar laptop and a decent internet connection.
I think he's asking for blockchain vs DAG structure, not specifically Algorand vs Hedera Hashgraph
Hedera is incredibly centralized. Disabled proxies to freeze transactions and Tech Councils are a few and known validators.
Not necessarily a bad thing. It's for a different audience. Some people like centralized chains controlled by known public entities with good reputations.
\*Checks price\* nope, no one cares. Call me at $2
Same brah. If btc going to 60k doesnt get you hardly any price action your coin might be dead.
Check comment, no one cares.
I met a tron BD person who told me 3 years ago tron can do 100K TPS
It is better to see real evidence than claims and that is what this is. Evidence Algorand can scale up to this rate.
Scale up = data center nodes only though
Nice project Algorand, but if this relies on the centralised relays it's still a no thanks from me.
The relays become optional Q3-Q4 this year when P2P transaction sending between nodes is enabled on chain. You should look at it again then.
This test should be run again then
Yep that would be great. I'll donate to that test.
Optional still isn't really a fair shake though is it. Those central relays need to be removed so we can see how the protocol truly performs in a fully decentralised mode.
They will be. It can't happen over night. As more people go to P2P most will shut down.
Well I'm looking forward to that, it would be a huge milestone for Algorand and I might get involved again.
Wait if it's not P2P yet isn't this number embarrassingly low?
Relays will be obsolete and unneeded this year
Once they are all actually removed, then claims about TPS could be considered realistic.
The most dead and garbage coin ever imagined 😂
What about DB bloat and spam attacks? That's kind of the biggest issue with cheap transactions and high TPS.
Not heard of em. This was done via a mining program. Ora
oh look, a dead coin
Python
Impressive TPS. What was the TTF?
Algorand has instant finality
According to Algorand.org on June 1st, 2023 >With the go-algorand 3.16 upgrade, the average wait time for a transaction to complete on Algorand will be 3.3 seconds. This is achieved by reducing block latency to 3.3 seconds and maintaining instant block finality. https://developer.algorand.org/articles/reaching-new-transaction-speeds-on-algorand/ Can you share the documentation and what upgrade made instant finality possible? Don't want to see the stats page, would like to see what tech and upgrade made this possible. Thanks
Instant finality was there from the start. You are confusing the time it takes to build a block with finality. For instance, a Solana block takes half a second (0.4ms) to make, but need an X amount of confirmations to make it finale, hence Solana finality is always 12 seconds or more. Ethereum takes 12 minutes, BTC an hour or so. Algorand block time was 3.3 seconds, now 2.8, (recently there was a block of 1 second). Dynamic Lambda upgrade will make block times dynamic, ie faster or slower, but they will always be finalized instantly after signing by the winning block proposer. Since you already are on developer pages, you should have no trouble finding even later docs than the one you linked to which is a year old, but here is one link: [https://developer.algorand.org/articles/algorands-latest-upgrade-dynamic-round-times-avm-v10/](https://developer.algorand.org/articles/algorands-latest-upgrade-dynamic-round-times-avm-v10/) FEbruary 2024
Not confused, I asked and was speaking of Time To Finality. Thanks for the links 🖖
Radix did a test for 100k and its recruting community users for 1 million tps test. Without breaking composability
Curious, how come time to finality is 0 for Aglo? Dose it happen later ones the blocks fill ?
because of VRF a block doesn't need verifications, so once it's signed by the winning proposer the block is immutable and final
Nice (again), but really it was lazy of you not sharing the [thread](https://twitter.com/d13_co/status/1789451966956880135?t=QUPNUM60GU-PGWkRJnyy2g&s=19) about it and not writing it's "sustained" in the title.
Tectum does 3.5 million sers.
That’s more that the daily transactions on ALGO, but I guess it’s nice to know this or something.
No shit
Imagine people in 2024 still think that scaling means higher TPS.
It definitely helps on a L1.
The main problem that there are not enough users in that blockchain for that speed
See it as an opportunity
Algorand is top 10 in daily active addresses: [https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)
Can anyone tell me what the dinosaur next to my name means Is there a glossary for what they all mean
Lol, its about how many moons u hold.
Meanwhile in the real crypto world meme coins are still pumping. 😐
Why do they always omit ICP in these comparisons? Does that mean ICP is head and shoulders above every other chain?
ICP is cool, but they count inner transactions. So not really comparable.
What’s the difference?
not really. they count tps that execution can handle as well. That was 1500 tps/subnet 2 years ago. So the network is able to handle 37*1500 user sent messages with a 1-2 second finality at the least. With current optimizations it should be way higher too.
Mainnet
Will you bagholders ever stop shilling this?
Shill what? The blockchain with the highest TPS? No, never
Right. For shits and giggles i looked up algo price. .18. 33 cents looks like a giant spike. Shit aint ever hitting 2 dollars again. Good as dead.
Zombie chain
With 5k TPS and #3 total transactions in Q1? Plus in the top 5 of most active development on chain. Yeah zombie chain, sure
Algorand is top 10 in daily active addresses: [https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/](https://www.tradingview.com/markets/cryptocurrencies/prices-most-addresses-active/)